The Extraordinary Rise of Victor Ray

0:00Mo Gilligan: Hey, what's happening people? My name is Mo Gilligan and this is the Beginning, Middle and End podcast. Now this is where I'm going to be asking some of my favourite people about how they started, where they are now and the legacy they want to leave. Now my guest this week has an amazing story. He went from busking on the streets of Newcastle to becoming a viral sensation and performing all across the world on international stages, people. Here we talk about his days in a wedding band, how posting songs on TikTok and Instagram during the pandemic amassed him a following of millions and his plans for an exciting career ahead.

0:41Mo Gilligan: Please welcome to the podcast, Victor Ray. How you been otherwise in yourself though? I've been good brother, I've been good. It's been busy 12 months. That's good though man. It is good. That's great to see bro. Yeah. I've seen your story, I think it was yesterday or? And I think it's like, maybe it was a dump. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you were speaking about some of the things that you're doing and touring and stuff. I just felt so proud, man. It was so good to see you, bro. That's so sweet. No, I appreciate that, man. It's been a grind. It's been a journey. So you're beginning, right? Like, you're from Uganda, right?

1:16I'm Ugandan and Kenyan. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. You grew up in Uganda. I was born in Kampala, but we moved to Newcastle when I was one.

1:25Mo Gilligan: Ah, okay, okay. It's one of those ones. One of them ones. The technicality ones. Technicality. I know. People will hear you. You got born in Uganda. It's like, you must know what it's all about. And I'm thinking, I don't know too much. You know, my dad is also the Ugandan side and he wasn't really too big in my life. But yeah, I'm Ugandan. And you're from, so Newcastle is where your family went. Yeah. What was it like for young Victor in Newcastle? Because I've been to Newcastle. Yeah. And Newcastle is, it's one of my favourite places to gig first and foremost but what I realised about going to New Castle was I think when I first got there I was like right this is like its own place yeah like the accents different they got their own vibes and that you know if you when you travel and I know you've traveled a lot around the UK and stuff you see that there are these little pockets and you're like, this is its own place.

2:23Mo Gilligan: Do you know what I mean? What was early life like for Victor in Newcastle? Yeah, Newcastle, it's a bit of a bubble. It was great in so many ways because, you know, from as far back as I can remember, it's like people are very kind, very welcome. It feels like you're a Geordie, then everyone's kind of on the same kind of team. You've got Newcastle United and everything. Is that your team? Yeah. Yeah. My dad used to support Manchester United, so there was a bit of conflict there. I'm from Newcastle, so it has to be. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But, yeah, Newcastle was interesting. Like, going to high school, you know, once you get a bit older, it was very clear that I was a black kid in this city where there's not many black people.

3:04My mum was quite smart in the sense that she found, like, I think once we moved to Newcastle, she kind of found her community in terms of, like, other Kenyan, Ugandan families and stuff, which was really good to kind of have, like, that kind of relationship growing up and going back and forth. But once you got to high school, like I found my people. But then I'm also a singer. So I'm like, OK, I'm now this like little bold black kid who likes to sing in all boys Catholic high school. So it was a bit funny. But I think I was always just kind of like confident in myself. I was not that cool. I was very average.

3:41So it was cool in my teenage years. it wasn't really till I turned like 18 or maybe 17 when I started like doing the gigging thing and busking yeah and everything like that and that was great because it felt like the city really had my back because it's quite small so I'd be on like the high street and I'd see the same faces when I was singing on the street because I'd spend like three four five hours sometimes just there singing until I was just I couldn't sing no more and so I'd see the same face to kind of walk by and be like, go on, XFAC, do something. And I was like, yes, I'm going to. I spent years doing that.

4:16So it felt nice. I feel like my memories of Newcastle was like, it was great. But that kind of bubble also means like the ceiling felt too low for me. Of course. And I was like, okay, where do I go? I need to go somewhere. I can't make this thing happen if I stay here kind of thing.

4:30Mo Gilligan: And you started singing at like a really young age as well. Yeah. Was that you in your school Christmas concert? Yes. Singing at like six years old. Damn, I've done your research, fam. I have to do, bro. Come on, man. Come on. Yeah, man. That's my first performance. I must have been in like year two or three. Had this cowboy outfit on. All the parents were there and I got on this little pedestal and I sang this song by myself. And I just remember hearing them like, yes, that was great. And I was like, this is the most comfortable I ever felt. Like, I feel so happy here. Not that I was unhappy as a kid, but it's like, I was just a shy kid.

5:05You know what I mean? So being on that stage and having that happen and felt like, oh, this is weird. Like, why do I love, why do I feel like the most of myself here, even at that young age? So, yeah, I was singing from early and knowing my mum and my family. I didn't really clock that, you know, it was a pipe dream for a while, especially growing up. Even though I was singing all the time, I was trying to sing at school, anywhere I could, but then I was really set on like, okay, well, I need to go to uni now. I need to get a job. Yeah, yeah. You know, we didn't grow up with money, obviously, like, so it was like what am I actually going to do with my life yeah yeah it was my brother that was like you're singing more than you're speaking do you know what I mean like why would you not try and do this thing um and so that kind of pushed me and then it was it was that gap year that I took out when I started to do my own thing and I was like cool this is this is it yeah yeah I kind of felt like I could the bare minimum of the busking and that like little money that I was bringing in

6:02Mo Gilligan: I was like I could just do this forever and that's fine how much money would you make in busking out of interest. It would vary. On a good day, I could make maybe like 150, 200 pounds. Really? Yeah. I feel like it's funny though. This is back when people really had change. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? And I'd spend time out on the streets. So people would just chuck me stuff. You know what I mean? And I was really, I wasn't playing about. Like I was going for it. Like there'd be veins popping out my neck. Like I was really trying to sing. Would you sing better when you see like a note thrown in?

6:34Of course. Hit the high notes. I do everything I can. I see someone put in a note. I'm like, yeah, okay, cool. We'll go for Adele now. Yeah, but on the slow days,

6:44Mo Gilligan: it could be like 20, 25 pounds. Do you know what I mean? And then if it starts raining in the middle of the day, what am I going to do? If it's snowing, if it's too cold for me to play guitar, like if it's too windy and the mic's getting... So it would really vary. Yeah. Yeah. So I kind of had to just force my way through it because I said to myself, you know, in that year when I was doing it and I started, I was like, okay, if this is really who I am and what I want to do, then I can't be making money outside of this thing. Like, otherwise, that's given me an excuse to just, like, give up or, like, find a plan B.

7:16And, like, bless my mum. She always supported me so much. And my family did. But obviously, my mum is my mum. And now she sees her son is on the street singing, trying to earn, like, pennies. She's going to be concerned and asking, so what? What are you going to do now? Like, what happens if this doesn't work?

7:34Mo Gilligan: And so it was like, I can't afford to think like that because I know that this thing that I'm trying to do is like, it's mad. And I'm just a kid in Newcastle. So yeah, it was a funny journey. But the busking thing really helped more than I thought it would. It really became the thing that kind of started my career. I thought it was just the kind of vessel. When you do busking and you said your mum was concerned, what did your parents want you to do? my mum just wanted me to do something that felt stable yeah do you know I mean she wasn't really forcing me down anywhere like there was one point I did really well in physics GCSE so she was like keep doing physics then maybe you could be a scientist you know I mean I feel like she went everywhere except music she even wanted me to be a footballer at one point oh wow music is right there can you kick bull nah like I was I was not great I played basketball as well because I was tall okay also not yeah not the best um but yeah man I was probably going to study sociology um And then I would have just gone down that route.

8:33Mo Gilligan: You know what I mean? What was it that made you busk? Because I think as any performer, you want to perform. And I only know it from a standpoint of me doing stand-up. I had two arcs, venues, if I could, can I come and perform? Right. Whether it's talent shows and stuff. what what made you go into the route of of of busking as a performer busking was the thing that i could just always go out and do no matter what it was like on my terms so really the the gain was like all based on my drive and i had so much drive so it was the it was the thing that i could do always that could kind of like at least i'm doing this at least i'm practicing at least i'm trying to make a little bit of money like that was my that was my access yeah but it's funny i I think it's quite interesting parallel to like you do in the circuit of like stand up.

9:28It must have been a grind.

9:30Mo Gilligan: Yeah, no, I think that the grind makes you really appreciate the successes in life. Because I always say that the grind is the most important part of the success. Do you know what I mean? Going to a comedy club and there's only 10 people there. It's such a humbling experience because you're like, I just want to perform. I don't even care about the money. I just want them to laugh at my material and the reason why I ask because as a stand up you can't really busk do you know what I mean but you do have to find places where I just want to go here make people laugh go there and stuff but I'm so intrigued to ask because I think the level of vulnerability that you put yourself in front of to go and sit in front of people not necessarily sit in front of people but like performing a place where people haven't come to see it.

10:24Mo Gilligan: I think that's why I had to ask because in stand-up, even at a young age where I was like, I'm just going to go to this thing, but they're expecting some kind of performance. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. But like on the high street when you're busking, they're not expecting it. So it's almost like, I don't know, the level of vulnerability must be so much higher. Do you know what I mean? It is. And I don't think I really realised, you know, more recently I started, or last year I started doing it with other artists. and like some of us were really down and others were like nah yeah yeah yeah and like and i was like oh i see i get it it's like it's like when you do gigs you can really control everything you can control the sound you can control how people will feel when they come in and stuff and people know what they're expecting whereas on the street nah it's like you are there in your little corner and you're interrupting all these people's days hopefully they'll enjoy it yeah um but sometimes they won't which also means the chaos can ensue people can be doing whatever they can be drunk you know i've had people try to steal my money and run really um yeah yeah yeah and people like coming up to me all sorts of racism and stuff like that as well um and then people just saying that i'm not good which is also not very nice to hear um but i think the reward so outweighed that like any cons um and every time i would go out without fail like there'd be at least one person like there's hundreds of people walking these streets right there'd always be at least one person that like stops looks even like smiles put something in or says something to me about how that like was like i needed that or something towards of that nature and like that part was so rewarding that's so 100 100 and it kind of turned you know i was talking to my friend about recently it was like obviously i went out when i moved to london by the way like this was all i was doing like for money so i needed i needed to do it and i need people to give me stuff like something put something in my case but like there was a point early on when i started doing it that i realized you know i was i was confused like why are people not stopping like this is so hard and then i was like well i'm here to sing let me just put on my favorite song i don't even think can hit these notes but let me just try it close my eyes get so into the song i open my eyes and like oh there's like 10 people watching me so i was like okay if i'm just loving what i'm doing then someone's gonna enjoy it too you know it's infectious that kind of thing and so that's the kind of thing that just kept me kept me doing it and i grew to love that interaction that's why a live performance is my favorite part of my job so even though it's so uncontrollable the variables like I'm still here and I'm still doing putting my energy into this music and it's affecting someone's life and then it's kind of like that's a cyclical nature of it so that's why I love to do it.

13:19Mo Gilligan: Yeah man.

13:22Mo Gilligan: Your sister played a massive part in your musical journey because she introduced you to a lot of artists you know like Beyonce, Usher and Sharon and stuff. How important was that for your journey of music? because the reason why my sister introduced me to a lot of music. Did she? Yeah, like my sister used to go to HMV and buy the records. Right. And I'd be like, oh, who's this? I'd put it on and I'm showing my age now, but we had a desktop computer and I'd get the tracks and I'd burn them onto the hard drive and stuff. But some of them would have music videos. Right. So I remember one of the music videos you would get on a CD was Pharrell and Jay-Z Fronting.

14:08Mo Gilligan: And you get the video on it. Like, it would be like, oh, you get the music video and three tracks. You get the clean, you get the, I don't want to say the dirty version, but the one with the uncensored version and the instrumental. Sometimes you might get a remix, but then if you put it in the computer, you could get the music video. But my sister was the person who introduced me to, I'd probably say 70, maybe 50 % of the music I listen to today um so how important was that for you and your and your sister and your relationship yeah it was big um yeah man when i was when i was in high school she gave me her phone and it had like two albums on it it had born sinner by j cole and it had um i am sasha fierce by beyonce um she also got obsessed with ed sheeran as well like you were saying and so all of these kind of things it was like you know that was a time as well before social media got so huge that you could just hear every song so often all the time and so i was just listening to whatever my sister was listening to same with tv like honestly this is what it is with older siblings it's like you just it's just hand-me-downs even with music so it was so important because like she got obsessed with r &b um 2000 r &b when it was happening and then i grew to love usher do you know i mean and neo and all of these guys and um you know when she was playing these kind of tracks like the beyonce one and j cole it was like oh it was opening doors for me because it helped me realized it's not just singers that i love hearing you know i love hip-hop i love uk rap grime like and that was like the window into it um and now that i'm older i see i see that way more clearly like how big of a role that played but like yeah man without without that like it wouldn't have helped me develop the tools that I need as well because everything that I do in terms of creating music comes from my influences and so it was so diverse because it would be that's what my sister was listening to um so like when I started writing yeah I loved what Ed Sheeran was doing and that was the time when I started you know he was dropping like songs like A-Team and I was like how is he writing like this like skin crumbling like pastries what does that even mean I was like this is so good but then I was listening to J.

16:20Cole and he was like talking about like all sorts of stuff like forbidden fruit and all of these tracks. And it was like, I was hearing music differently with every new artist that was coming in. So yeah, man. Big up my sister. She actually did bits and we've never actually talked about that. So she's going to be happy when she hears that.

16:37Mo Gilligan: No, man, listen, man. I think it's interesting. I always say that the music you normally love is nine times out of 10 the music that like your brothers and sisters had played growing up. So it just gets, it's like it gets passed down. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, 100%. Like, of course, like the music that like you know there is like music within the culture that we all listen to and we're like i remember hearing this at a wedding yeah or you hear this at like a christening but like yeah i i i'm i'm massively in influenced by my sister's music choice you know um it was is did usher inspire your your stage name as well yeah yeah he did and it's a bit embarrassing it's not even embarrassing Usher was huge like when I was growing up I think there's still videos on YouTube because I forgot the password of me just covering them when I was like nine and ten like singing but yeah I started to call myself Victor Raymond in high school because he's called Usher Raymond and I was thinking of course like that makes sense it has a nice ring to it and then I shortened it down to Ray also like when I'd write my name on like like notebooks and stuff I put like Victor my last name starts with Y so it was like Victor.y and I was like sounds like victory Victor Ray Victor Raymond I was connecting the dots and I was also watching Bear X Factor as well at that age and I was like that presenter saying Victor Ray would be banging so it sucked that's quite cool because you're essentially you didn't know but you're visualising your yeah that's what it is you're visualising like okay cool I see myself you know what I mean like in this light yeah I guess so Did you ever do that thing in school?

18:18Mo Gilligan: You practice your signature for autographs? Did you do that, bro? I've done that. I'm doing it today still. What do you still do that? Yeah, bro. I used to practice autographs in my book. That is too funny. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I definitely had to. I definitely had to. I was thinking, OK, when the time comes, it needs to be a quick thing. Yeah. Yeah. I was trying all of them things there. It's so funny. Yeah, man. To this day, bro, sometimes when I get a notebook, I'm like, that's the same. Because I've got my signature for my signature signature, you know what I mean? You know, when you get the online form and you must sign it, you got to read the contracts.

18:51Mo Gilligan: And you're like, cool, that's the real thing. But then once you start like, you get a bit successful, you're like, boy, can't really give out the real thing, you know? I mean, get a bit of fancy. Bit of feng shui with the thing. But you know what I see some people's signatures and it's just like a squiggle in it. And you're like, no, I got to put a little artistry so you know it's me a little bit. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I thought that was just me, man. No, no, no, definitely not. Was you in a band as well at one point? I've been in a lot of different scenarios with singing.

19:21I was touring one time with this African group, this guy called Tunde that was heading it up. But no, I wasn't really in my own band. That would have been fun, to be fair. I have a band now, and I have for the last year and a half, and it completely just changed everything about live performance. And I love it so much. So I kind of wish I was earlier.

19:41Mo Gilligan: Didn't you do wedding covers and stuff like that as well? Oh, yes, I see what you mean. I guess that is kind of a band. Yeah, I was in like a wedding band, to be fair. And that was like, that was a good gig. That was like, cool, I can do this gig and it can be 250, 300 pounds, boom. You know what I mean? And that's when I needed it. That was like during uni, student loan was running thin. Listen, man. You know what I mean? I'm away from home. I'm not trying to ask my mum for money every month because I'm low on rent. And so, and busking was getting long as well. So yeah, I was doing the wedding grind for a minute.

20:13Yeah, man. and my band was pretty cold as well. There'd be like corporate gigs or weddings and that's when I actually, I got into like, what was it? Like Garage and stuff like that because we did like medleys. So we'd go from like 21 seconds into like an R &B like Justin Timberlake. What are you talking about

20:31Mo Gilligan: with the guitars and that? Yeah, yeah, yeah. The drum kits. But even like the vocals, it was all, like it would go straight into it bro. Sweat. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I learned and that was my first introduction to it. I was like, bro, Garage is banging. Yeah. Yeah, so solid crew and everything and I didn't realise everyone that gets married like they love that kind of stuff oh no no it's lots at a wedding especially if it's live i i'm i'm a big fan of live music like but especially like with the instruments you know i'm saying like once you hear the drum kits and you got the bass guitar and everything it's like like the sound of live music in a confined space is like one of the best sounds i think do you know i mean so true and i find it so interesting as well as well with what you do because I've seen like in a lot of your gigs you have a band yeah man yeah yeah yeah yeah did you always like have that kind of it was interesting because what why I asked you about the band because you're saying about how you done like we're like weddings I've done weddings as well right and I met I do a lot of weddings or I do I'd host like talent shows at universities and at the talent shows there's always there was always a band there so with the band there I would be like I I want to do something with a band, man.

21:39Mo Gilligan: I've seen everyone singing. So I'd have these little jokes and I'm like, it's so funny, man, because a lot of the bands that I work with now are bands that, for example, like the composers, I used to see them at uni events. So when they'd see me coming, they're like, oh, I'm going to ask us to do something, bro. I like, it's different because now I understand that the performers where they're like, bro, we've got to change the keys and stuff. And I'm like, I hear that. and I'll be like, I'll get the mic. I'll be like, yeah, what's going on, people, man? It's good to be here. Who likes grime? You know what I like about grime, yeah?

22:16Mo Gilligan: It's got a fast tempo. Drum kit, man. Give me a 140 BPM. You got the man who like the drum. I love it, bruv. And then give me something with the keys. And then, nah, bruv, make it darker. And then I'll start spitting and everyone would get excited. And I'd say, oh, yeah, the MC would do this. So I would really enjoy that moment of doing comedy. but the bands oh my god especially because at this time these bands don't know me as me innit they're not like oh like no it's different oh we know Mo man yeah man I see him on TV or I see him at a show but back then they was like who is this guy bro like fuck this guy just making us play whatever he wants at any second but I think that was for me the inspiration of like I love music innit right I wouldn't I've never I've never looked at myself as a music there was never a time in my life where I was like, I want to do rapping or singing or anything, but I just loved the way that I could bring what I love about music into comedy somehow.

23:18Mo Gilligan: Do you know what I mean? And like with you saying about the weddings, I didn't used to do any weddings. Right. So I used to get asked to do a lot of weddings. He'd say, hey, would you want to do a wedding? I was like, I don't know, man. It's quite a personal thing to do, but the bag is all right, you know? Bread from weddings, always. man it's when you need it the most as well you're like yeah of course you're like what wedding yeah bro yeah yeah yeah man congratulations man yeah yeah one two three no there's a funny like crossover i feel like always with like music and comedy because even with me in my live sets it's like there's always the moments in between the songs when i'm singing and in those moments i'm telling my stories and going into you know the meaning behind the songs and there's always like a joke I'm trying to crack here and there and I kind of feel like musicians want to be comedians a lot of the time I know musicians are funny when they've got their space they can be yeah musicians are quite funny like there's a lot of times I've done live shows and you know when they bring okay guys when we get down man now I was going to do this song today but guess what I'm here I'm like alright shit up we love it I'm the comic here don't take my job it's jokes i feel like um yeah there's such a funny crossover there but um was it dave chapelle that like did a set with like john mayer one time and he like they just did like back and forth jokes and a performance i was like how does that even work it's such a funny thing um yeah i'd love to explore that further one day you're in your middle now in some ways where like you know the the last like five to ten years of your career with social media, it's just like skyrocketed for you in some ways.

25:01Mo Gilligan: How influential has social media been for your journey? Because starting off from someone who performed at their school and was going to go to university and then started busking and essentially used that but also the platform of social media. How has that helped your career? it's been invaluable. Like, I did not see it coming at all because like I said, I was busking. So I started in what, 2017? And it was in 2021 that like, TikTok became a big thing. I went out busking because it was after lockdown, one of the lockdowns, and I went out with my friend and we recorded myself singing one of these songs.

25:46We put it up and it just blows up out of nowhere. And I had been posting on there before. It was the first time I had posted any busking things. And so once that happened, it just opened the floodgates. And it was like people... And it was something that I was doing all the time. So it was authentic. So I felt very happy about that. But I did not know, like, that was also my window and my door into the music industry. Like, so many people started reaching out, labels and all of these kind of things. And the music industry is so mysterious until you're in it. Because it's like, everyone talks about it.

26:17And you know it's there. But no one actually... Because I went to... I ended up going to a music uni. and like they were trying to tell me about it as well but like it's almost like you only know if you know if you're involved so it's facade it is what yeah what is that and you're like brother

26:34Mo Gilligan: this is an office in another office but once you go in there you realize it gets real you see these plaques and you're like oh this is the place yeah these guys are in charge of all of that so yeah social media and it's continued to be because i started out just singing the covers obviously and then like a year after that is when i released my first single and that was like 2022 end of 2022 so like start 2023 and i was really worried but like a lot of you know people that found me through the busking thing were supporting me and my music as well and since then to now it's like it's just been a vessel for me to use and that's not to say that it doesn't get jarring at times or draining because i don't know any time that you spend thinking about yourself and your numbers and everything about your career for too long it's just it's going to get to you and so in the beginning my success was literally dictated by how many people were watching the video and liking it and everything so that was like it also creates a precedent in your head where it's like oh now this video is not doing well or like this period of time where i've released these songs it's great and now this period where it's a bit slower oh no one cares and so it's kind of like getting over those hills really realizing that it's like you're building a fan base it's real people you know doing doing live shows and building the community um but yeah man it's been it's been crazy and i think it continues to just like be more and more uh important but um yeah i'm still trying to find my way around it and and really use it as an extension of like the medium because it's easy to just like do what everyone does and like do stuff that's inauthentic to you and i'm just like i'm not trying to do like listen if you're doing tiktok dances and everything and that's you and like i meet you and it makes sense then i'm do that you meet me i don't i'm not a person that you think would do like these my tiktok dances so i'm not going to do that so it's like trying to find a way to like use it and be consistent but then also stay in me and that's been the biggest task of it all but um yeah what's what's it like going viral as a musician because i think that currency now has become so high for you know creatives you know at a point in their career where you're like oh the the thing that i wanted to happen is now happening um what was that experience like for you it's it's so good like that first time i was talking about when it first happened was amazing because it was like cool i've been doing this thing for four years i've been singing on the street now people are finally caring like it's that but when it's your own music because that happened like the next year or like the year after that and um all these people suddenly like they're invested and also now they're looking at your catalog everything's up your spirits are up your happiness your numbers are up and now it means like the team's excited the label's excited so it's great in the moment it's it's it's the best but um it's it's interesting because you kind of need to figure out how to like capitalize on that as well because all these new faces and eyes on your ting on your work or a specific song and um now it's like they're there but they're there because of that song or that moment or that video or you sang a note and like it went viral or anything like that so you have to take it with a pinch of salt but you also have to like okay cool now you're here you have to recognize that and be like cool there's new people here let me introduce myself to you and like let me like bring you into like this community there's like gang that i have going um but yeah it's it's like it's like the biggest high and then it it can really drop quickly as well because viral moment no one's viral forever until you get to a certain threshold and like your your actual established name household name you're not going to be viral forever so it's like and the music industry because everything people are forgetting still how recently it it changed into social media dictating everything so industry-wise as well when you get into like the the intricacies of it it's like the whole everyone's actually waiting for another viral moment so it doesn't just affect you and like you're not it's not just you looking at this video being like oh this is great yeah it's now everyone's looking at this video thinking this is amazing and now when that doesn't happen again for like 10 video however many times then everyone's thinking why are we not viral again yeah yeah so it's always the fingers pointed back at you so it's like a double-edged sword is it hard once you get signed because there is a part of it that's like you know you you you get which i guess look when if you're a musician and you get signed it must feel like okay cool like now the work really starts because now i get to showcase what i'm able to do and you know connect with people that i wouldn't have maybe able to do if i if maybe if i wasn't signed i'm not too sure how works with the music but is it also hard because you because you have your journey through busking and social media that you also still want to please those fans too do you know i mean how do you find that balance that's such a good question because especially with my the way that my thing is like played out you know it started at the start ground up i'm on the street people are watching me because they like hearing my voice yeah do you know what i mean and at that point behind the scenes i was writing songs every day i was writing and writing and writing and when the industry started opening up because the videos were doing well then i was getting in rooms with other writers creatives producers so i was writing different kind of songs than i was doing by myself and it was changing and so a lot of people before i signed my deal a lot of people were talking about how everyone has a big idea and to them it's the best idea so i'm when i'm talking to different people industry wise it's like no you should put out these songs these songs these songs because you know this is like what's big right now and everything like that but like you know me and my team we made a conscious effort to like start at the start like let's start with the songs i wrote on my guitar because i've started singing on the street um and it's kind of like a constant kind of battle i have to have in my head you know because the goal is to be one of the biggest artists in the world if not the biggest and the goal has to be that big because otherwise it's like you know i have to believe that i can do anything really with what i'm doing um but i also have to stay true to myself and i'm also like someone that just loves what he does and i would still go sing on this street tomorrow so once it becomes like you know a cog you're a cog in a machine in a way and now i have to be i'm trying to be very intentional with every move i make i make sure i'm moving in a way that's like really meaningful to me and it's like i'm getting there my way um but yeah the label being with the label can like it can make you think well who who do i like trust because like you say these people and these industries they've been around forever and so of course they know what they're talking about but i know what i'm talking about as well so it's like you have to really have like a lot of and there's a reason why you know you that you're in that position where you are where you're like i'm like cool i built you built the thing exactly you know i mean you built the thing you have the audience you have the following so yes it's you have to also go into it with like okay cool like what do i want to get out of this because it's collaborative effort oh yeah so you're like cool what's going to be the best for both of us to get the best out of this situation 100 but also feel like i need i need to feed the audience that i started with and still make sure i do those videos but i don't want to feel like i've got to dumb it down and do a tiktok dance yeah because my audience are like bro like we just want to see the busking stuff exactly you know i mean but we need to support the news stuff as well you know i mean it's it's it's interesting because the similarities of when I started doing, for example, like television.

34:48Mo Gilligan: Yeah. I still do the small videos, but then it's the fine balance where it's just like, I also want you to watch this new thing that took me like six months to make. Right. And I know it's not the video that was 60 seconds that you might felt like, oh, he's in his house and do, do, do. Right. But you're like, it's bridging the gap. Do you know what I mean? Where you're like, I don't know. It's like, I've got to feed this section, but also I've got to feed that section, but I can only grow bigger with this but I also do need this at the same time. It's so interesting the similarities and stuff.

35:23Mo Gilligan: You're on tour as well recently as well. You had some gigs in the States. I did. Yeah, that was funny. How was that going? Because now you're in a place where you're going across another side of the world and you're doing your own shows now. Yeah. How has this started to change your life? Yeah, it's mad. you know i don't often step out of the moment like the moment to look like wow look at where we've come so you know even when you say it i'm like i hear it a bit differently because i'm like oh i really went to the states and played shows um but yeah a few months ago i was there i was in new york i was in la i see it bro yeah yeah yeah man yeah it's actually crazy to be fair um it was my first time there and that's always the thing in your head i don't know as an artist it's always like when am I going to go to America and do like or as an entertainer I feel like that's the thing you know that's the it's the home of entertainment that's the home of entertainment yeah man so it's like when am I going to get there so it was a real moment for me and just realising because a month before that I was in Australia doing shows you know what I'm saying it was like rah there's people here that care and also when I got there to America and Australia it was like in the room it was like what took you so long kind of vibe and I was like rah I did not know you guys were here like I didn't know I've been waiting for you, man.

36:39Where have you been, Victor, man? So it was incredible. And it just means, it just gave me like, it was just like, wow, okay. So my music has got me this far. Like these kinds of things are real. It's a real like wake up call as well to like, oh no, me being in my room and just spending all that time putting these words and being like, that word doesn't make sense. Let me change it. All those hours actually have meant something. And these people over here, they care. And so it was, it was amazing. it was amazing because the the year before that so last year I was on tour with Teddy Swims

37:12Mo Gilligan: yeah I see this yeah which was amazing as well because he that was my first real tour experience proper like in a bus and everything and Teddy's like a legend nice guy I met him quite briefly when I was over there we done this thing called The Shop and yeah I'd heard his music but I'd not met him and nicest so sweet nicest guy honestly yeah He's literally a teddy bear. He's so nice. And him and his band just really welcomed me in. And we were just going everywhere, just chatting. And so it was such a good introduction to this life. But also I realized you do it however you want to run it. So that tour party was so great because Teddy's curated it to be warm, welcoming.

37:56And it's like someone else's might be a bit different. So when it was my turn to do mine, I was like, cool. I've got my band and my people. We're going to have fun. we're going to make sure that the show slaps and every now and then we're going to have a nice you know a nice time after the show but from it was like it was good to kind of in this kind of industry and being a musician there's not many people that can relate to that it's such an interesting you know lifestyle and like the challenges that you go through in your head so to have someone like teddy to bounce off of even in that short period and any time that we've like met up afterwards it's like it was really important and like it meant so much to me because i was like wow you know exactly i don't have to explain myself to you i feel like in my life i'm explaining myself and my decisions to everybody that i meet because it's like such a it's a weird thing really to be an entertainer to be a musician or an artist or trying to do like crazy things you're like no yeah i'm like i have to back myself all the time but you know someone like him gets it you I got a couple of friends that are artists as well, like Miles Smith, who's doing great right now as well.

39:01So it's just good to bounce off of these guys and just have someone to go off of and see how they perform on tour. I was taking notes when I was with Teddy because I was like, you've got these guys in the palm of your hand. So I'm just watching and admiring.

39:17Mo Gilligan: When you're touring, how is touring for you as an artist? Because I know touring for me is like, when I first started touring it was a vibe I was partying with my friends every other night because it's new it's new to me but now touring after a big show bro I go home I watch my TV series I have a green tea my audience would never expect that after a show I'm like cool let's pack up I want to be out the building as soon as possible if we can get out and yeah if I know we're staying somewhere I bring my tea bags I've got my TV sales and my iPad and I'm like cool I have my my schedule of how I can look after myself how was touring for you as a musician because I've got some friends that are musicians and you know everyone I don't know a lot of people say oh you know touring is is great but you don't see anywhere you don't sleep you're staying on the bus and like how how was how was touring for you when you you know you go from supporting someone to now doing your own tours are you enjoying it to the max because i feel like you should you know it's not every time you're going to get to be in in la and get to perform you have to enjoy but are you also like a place where you're like i i also just sometimes i i can't sleep and i just have to do you know what i mean de-stress you know i mean how how is it for you yeah it's interesting man because off the back of the teddy one the teddy tour when i was touring with teddy swims i got vocal nodules like i was out of the game it's like i had a growth on my vocal cord so it fucked up my voice for a minute and so that kind of scared me and shook me because i couldn't really sing for a couple months after that i had to like do speech therapy and shit really yeah so it was like when it was time to do my tour months later i was like cool let me you know i've had i literally had like a bag just full of like worst case medicine and all of these kind of things because i was worried so i didn't want to go too hard.

41:18And then like, you know, I realized about a week, two weeks into it, I was like, oh, you know, let me just have a good time. But then you kind of like, you kind of figure out your routine, what's good for you, because the way I sing as well is big. It's not like singing. Oh, you go in, bro. I go in. You go in.

41:34Mo Gilligan: I don't take it easy. That video you and Teddy, I was like, these men are slightly clashing a little bit. No, it's too funny because like it really, really is like that because especially when I knew someone like Teddy was there, I was like, no, I'm going to have to really go for it right now. Yeah, yeah, of course, man. So like, I have to be careful after a show. Like I'd love to, I've got such adrenaline afterwards, so I'd love to go out for a drink with my band, but sometimes it's like, yo, you know, I need to chill. We have what we call roadie Fridays where it's like, you know, there's a day off the next day.

42:08Cool. That's when you have your fun.

42:09Mo Gilligan: Oh, nice. Sometimes, it doesn't always work like that. But I found my happy medium. Do you know what I mean? But it is funny what you say about finishing a tour and just going home and just like, no, you're just watching TV, watching Friends or something, just chilling. Because it's like, I feel like for a lot of artists, it's either that or it's the opposite. Do you know what I mean? And both of them can get you through it. I'm sure. Like, you can keep going. but for me I'm more inclined to be like like you because I don't know it's such a it's such a crazy thing being on stage like the energy that's thrown in your face is like unlike anything do you know what I mean and so it's like if you it's it's actually a similar thing to socials and being viral it's like if you're just like chasing that feeling then you can keep chasing it and then you can keep staying out and you can like live that lifestyle get on stage and keep it going or you can like crash and find your moments and then and then go back at it and i feel like i'm more inclined to do that because that's just how much i can take of it you know i mean i feel like if i the crash is always coming i feel like after after such a high yeah um so like sometimes i just need complete peace after after that what do you do for peace bro i play video games i'm watching anime or I see my friends and we'll link up you know I got some friends some really good friends back in Newcastle so I'll try to see them as much as I can family and stuff like this um honestly mostly video games to be fair or like hanging out like with my girlfriend or something um best people you know I mean I've my circle's always been quite small um for a reason because like these are the guys that know me I always talk to people about this I'm like my best friends I love them, but it's like, rah, imagine having to try to make another best friend.

44:03Mo Gilligan: You know, the amount of stuff I've gone through with these guys. I'm not, I'm too old to like go through all the drama that it took for me to build this friendship group up. So I like my little circle and it's nice. Cause they just get it. Yeah. I know what you mean. You're like, it's tiring boy. I got to start knowing who your family members are, what your vibe is. Fully. Yeah. Fully. so I like to see them I stick with those guys man you know it's interesting you say that because like you get to a point with your friends where you're like don't get me wrong like I can make friends but adding new ones at this stage and bringing them into the group or I don't know I don't know nah nah you can I can really take in my a few years ago I could really take anything like the drama or like dealing with these situations now it's like rah I know you so well I know you so well and now I'm gonna try and bring someone else into this like this little this little unit that we've got that's too long for me man I'm good like I like making new friends and stuff of course but like yeah I'm very I'm very tactful I think who I who I keep letting to my little bubble I think it's always been like that because early on as well I've met other people that were trying to be artists and stuff and like you know they were doing all sorts of shit like when I was 18 and like they were having like little shows because they'd have little moments of like virality even back then and then they'd be going back doing like coke and stuff and all of these kind of things and this was before I even like was old enough to even know what was going on like or what happens at parties and stuff like this and so it's like from there I was always like okay well let me just like who's actually bringing value to my life and who can I bring value to and let me stick there listen when their friends start doing real stuff you're like you know what I'm alright you know bro yeah I'm good You might do some real stuff over there.

45:55Mo Gilligan: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I just like green tea, bro. Fully, bro. Fully. But speaking of peace, you've got a new piece of work coming out, which is your mixtape as well. Yes, I do. How does this feel? Because I feel like now you're at a point where, you know, you are really starting to enjoy the fruits of your labour. but you're going to Fashion Week and performing on television. Is it VE Day? Yeah. Performing to millions of people. So how is it now bringing this piece of music out where now you are a household name? No one gets on television without being a household name in some ways or going to things like Fashion Week, but also touring.

46:43Mo Gilligan: and you know. So yeah, how are you feeling about this new piece of work that can now get you out there to a wider audience? Man, I'm so excited about it. You know what I mean? Like I feel like I've been, since I started releasing music, this part of the journey has felt like the start. Like when I get, the point that I'm about to go into is like, okay, now I've shown you guys, you know, what I like. I've shown you different influences, genres and everything but the music that now i'm about to put out is what i've been wanting to put out for the longest you know i started off singing big songs because i love it and that's what i want to do but i wanted to get there in my own way so now it just feels like cool i'm in and i actually feel ready for it which is good because i didn't actually know that i was not ready for it like some months back but it's like even in terms of just like being confident in myself how i dress being able to like chat to you or anyone it's like this lifestyle and like wanting to be an artist and like a big artist it's like there's so many things that you don't think about when you start it's like how do i really feel about stuff and and how do i like how do i want to come across and you know all of these like how do i want to treat my fans i don't want to tour um being on tv it's like okay all these eyes are looking at me you don't think about all of that so now I feel very ready and confident and I also just know the music is slapping so I'm just like I'm ready to get it going to be fair yeah so it feels like the journey is starting now yeah do you know what I mean and in talk of the journey starting now with the mixtape coming out I assume we'll have the Victor Ray album yeah now I know it's always hard for artists to speak about this when they're like yeah it's coming out but not yet but listen when this really is Do you know what I mean?

48:34Mo Gilligan: So, and I know as well, like an album is like, for you it will be essentially like a piece of work where you're like, I'm putting like my life into this work. And I only use the comparisons of comedy in a way where it was the same with my special. It was like all the work is going into this thing because everyone is waiting for this thing. Like, you'll watch some of the videos, which is probably my version of like my mixtapes and my EPs or the appearance on a show where you're like, oh, that 50 minute clip is all right. But they're like, cool, I've been to the tour, but what's the special say of that?

49:09Mo Gilligan: Do you know what I mean? So when you look at like, you getting like prepared for the album, how do you envision it? And I'm not asking when it's coming out or who's on it, but how do you envision that first like piece of work? It's such a, I love albums, bro. I love albums. and I love ones that like really tell a story. So like even just the creation of it, it's like it's such a big thing. I've wrote hundreds and hundreds of songs, but what I've like learned in this last year is like cool. I'm only, I'm going to love what I make, the songs that I make in this year right now, like I'm going to love it right now.

49:53And I used to think about this album, like I've been thinking about this album for the last, since I started making music, so like three years. and the songs that I wrote a while ago that I was thinking, that'll probably go on the album. I'm a different person now. I've had to learn like, the value in my opinion. Like I have good taste. That's what I've had to actually understand. So it's like, cool. What am I really messing with? And what kind of, what's really happening in my life right now that I can just, I can really use and make into something amazing and like have this body of work that I can be proud of and really be like, no, this was me.

50:28this is me right now and like also this is my statement to like the world albums are like you know that's like the thing for an artist you know the like it's like a special i guess for for you um i'd actually be curious how you like when when you started writing the material for your special

50:46Mo Gilligan: because it is a similar oh yeah yeah so similar yeah yeah for most comedians it's you know you the tour, when I think of my first tour to the special, very different, but also quite similar. So when I first start writing that special, I'm like, okay, cool. Like I've got this idea for this bit in the tour. And then when it comes to recording it, I was like, okay, this isn't a tour show that I'm going to record. This is, for me at my first special, was 10 years worth of material that I had that I'm like, if you ever see me once ever, whether you like it or not this is going to be your go-to this is going to be like I don't know this person but I'll check it out and that was always my route in if you've never heard me before never seen me this is the 10 years of work I have that I'm going to show to you and I think for me at that point I was like I might not make another one of these ever again but at least this is the one that is like oh I absolutely love that I remember where I was when I first seen it.

51:52Mo Gilligan: Or someone might even say, yeah, not really for me. But you know what? I was like, you watched it. That's all I need. Do you know what I mean? And I think that's how I kind of always started to, when I started to, you know, the minute I was, I'm going to make a special, I was like, okay, I'm going to perform this as if you've never seen me before. This is my route in. If anything, my second one, that's when it was like, And it's a similar analogy of like music of, they say, oh, your second album's always the hardest. Because now it's like, ah, cool. I've got, I can judge you on that. So now, this is the second one.

52:29Mo Gilligan: So now I'm like, oh, bro, man, this is, I've got to do this in two years. Like, I had 10 years of stuff that no one ever seen. Do you know what I mean? So now I've got to do it in two years. That's got to be bigger. You're talking about, yeah, man, we're going to use, we're going to use a jib shot get a crane in I said yo ref is this it I don't know and they usually don't hit the same that's why I think the parallels of music and comedy is so interesting because I seen my special as the thing where I was like okay cool this is the one that I'm going to showcase to the world so that's why I kind of had to ask the question of albums because I know it was always contentious with any artists where they're like, yeah, I'm working on it.

53:19Mo Gilligan: But it's just seeing how you envision it. Is it your piece of work that this is my lifetime's work? This is the sound I've always wanted to make, but now with a backing of an audience and a record label, you do get a better budget. Do you know what I mean? You can get much better engineers where you're like, I want to make this stuff. You know what I mean? it's always interesting to pick an artist's brain about stuff like that you know your end in some ways right your journey is really like in it's forefront in some ways do you know what I mean where you're having major success whether that is touring around the world or having an audience on social media and with that journey just starting you want people to get on board onto this train in some ways but as any artist how do you start to envision the end goal so the end of the journey because you know some people see it as you know I'm looking to take this as far as I can go as far as that train can go or some people see it as that I'm looking to catch this train to the end of this station.

54:38Mo Gilligan: And after that, I plan to just do maybe acting. I plan to, I'm not getting on a train. I'm getting on a car. I'm getting on a plane. Do you know what I mean? How do you start to, because I feel like your journey is so, so inspiring where you go from living in Newcastle and busking to, you know, social media success, which is not easy. Like, it's, bro. It's not. Listen, social media success is not an easy thing to get in this day and age. To then being signed and then touring and supporting artists, to being on television and now enjoying the fruits of your labour. Do you know what I mean? Going fashion week, it's a vibe.

55:18Mo Gilligan: Do you know what I mean, bruv? Where you're like, bro, that's my man. Oh, shit, bro. Brilliant. Yeah. Hey, picture, picture, picture. You're like, oh, yeah, I'm here, man. And it's only right. But how do you start to look at some of those endpoints of your journey to see where you can take it to a different level or a different part of your journey in some ways. It's interesting, like thinking about the end is funny because I feel like I've always thought about it and it's changed every time I've thought about it throughout the years. When I first started busking, it was, I'd probably think I'm at the end because I'm like, if I can tour the world and perform these songs, then I've made it.

55:59And now it's like, oh no, like I can go all the way. I can go to wherever this train is going to take me. But I think now, you know, having made music and having started and being at what I feel like is the real start of this journey and thinking about the end. I love, you know, I'm so in love with music and I love the contributions people have made to music like Ed Sheeran and how he changed pop, do you know what I mean, with the way he wrote. Or like Stevie Wonder and how he sang and how like, you know, these are people that I look back on. and everyone can look back on them being like, this person was so important to music.

56:37And now me thinking about my end, it's like, how can I give the world something that everyone is going to remember? And how can I make a kind of journey and legacy for myself that's like, no, this person, like, you know, no one can make something like me because I'm the only one that's lived my life. No one can see through my eyes. And so even if someone's going to write a song like I've written one, no one's gonna it's not gonna hit the same because it's my story so it's like how can i really work on my craft and make this like it's undeniable and that's kind of how i think about the end i feel like a destination i can't see it because the only time i'm gonna get there and when i probably will feel like this at the end is when i feel like there's nothing else i can contribute to like music there's nothing else i can do or there's nothing that i can say in a way that is valuable so my end kind of looks like cool I have given everything that I could possibly give and I've proven to myself and the world that you know I'm good at what I do I can make music and I can tell my story my story as this kid grew up like from Uganda grew up in Newcastle and like took over the world like my story matters and it's and I've put that in paper and I'm putting in music that's probably what my end looks like I don't know what it's going to sound like I don't know when the album's coming.

58:01But yeah, I think it's more like what I can leave behind. And what like, man, I know I'm an incredible songwriter. And I know I've got an incredible voice. And that's not ego of me saying it. It's me like believing that, you know, as like a child believes like, you know, I wanted the young me to believe that. It's fact. Do you know what I mean? It's not even like it's fiction.

58:22Mo Gilligan: you have an amazing voice and you've written your own songs that have led you to tour and enjoy going back to enjoy the fruits of your labour. That's a fact. Do you know what I mean? No one can take that away. So yeah, man, 100%, man. Victor, man, I think your journey is so inspiring, but the way that you have used social media but also putting yourself in a vulnerable place of like i'm gonna go and perform yes i can you know i can put a song here and there and whatnot and then hopefully someone hears it but taking your artistry to the people and like i'm gonna i'm gonna go on the street and i'm gonna sing if you like it cool if not that's all right too you just enjoy your day if you heard a couple of riffs you were like oh that guy was all right yeah and like i massively rate that like because i can't imagine how hard it is like sometimes we have to do filming and we've got to do in the street and i'm like oh everyone's looking at me man i love that bro i could have done this in the studio but like to see you where you are in your journey now which and i think that's why i was really excited to have you on the podcast today because you know when i look at you really are like in the beginning of your journey so now having you on the podcast is like once you know you're selling out a wemberly stadium and you know you're winning brit awards or whatever it is it just means that like i can be like hey man you want to come back soon soon it'll be like oh no He's too big, bro.

1:00:08He's too big, man. Oh, brother, that's funny.

1:00:10Mo Gilligan: But no, I really do see that happening for you, man. Thank you, bro. I really appreciate that. And that's not to just gas you up for no reason. I really do. I feel like, you know, you're someone when it comes to music and what you're doing, you're... One is there's so many people that are going to see the blueprint that you've kind of laid out and they're like, oh, wow, like, there's me singing in my room, but also, you know, I'm putting up these songs and like I'm not getting or I'm performing at maybe like a pub somewhere but raw like you know if he's put himself out there to go and bask and write music and see success it's really that DIY do it yourself part of someone's journey that I'm just ignoring I'm just like bro that's how you do it you know I mean like and everyone look everyone's journey is is is different but you know in this in the short space of time that you've done it well you know you you could have gone and been on the television show and like you're saying people have said to you, mate, you want to get on the X Factor, mate.

1:01:09Mo Gilligan: Have you had that one? Of course. Listen mate, you want to get an X Factor, bruv. Britain's got talent. I'm telling you, get on the voice. Get on the voice. Will.i.am, it'll turn for you. Yeah, he's black, let's be honest. I'm not racist, but he's going to turn. You know what I mean? You know that's what they're saying. I got all of them ones, bro. But you just say, yeah, man, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm thinking about it to be fair. But no, man, I wish you a main success with the full company mixtape as well and yeah thank you so much my friend this has been your beginning middle and end thank you very much thank you bro it's been a pleasure thank you so much thank you hey what's up thank you so much for listening to the podcast today now a lot goes in to making each episode i know you hear my voice but there's a team behind the scenes who helped make it and if you did enjoy it i'd really really appreciate if you could show the love to them by giving us five stars and if you also have the time please leave us a review it's always appreciated and we love reading the comments and And of course, we want to keep making it better.

1:02:05Mo Gilligan: Thank you for listening and have a great day. Peace.