Jacqueline Novak

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3:17Welcome to the Off Menu Podcast, taking the slightly inflated bag of plain snacks, bursting it open and inhaling the flavour dust of content.

3:28James Acaster: That's it, Gamble! My name is James Acaster. Together we own a dream restaurant. Every single week we invite a guest as they pay for ever start a mango's dessert, side dish and drink. Not in that order. And this week our guest is... Jacqueline Novak! Brilliant comedian James, Jacqueline Novak, over from the US of A. ooh exciting and you can watch Jacqueline's comedy special Get On Your Knees on Netflix yes you can Jacqueline is very funny indeed but if she says an ingredient that we have pre-agreed upon a secret ingredient no less we will remove her from the restaurant it won't be Get On Your Knees it'll be Get Out Of Town yeah that's how we'll have to say it so she understands and this week the secret ingredient is knees get on your knees so if she picks like chicken knees or something yeah chicken knees pork knees anything like that yeah then out yeah I guess if she chooses some legs we've got to just inquire are there knees what bit that's the whole leg yeah yeah are there knees on it if yes out out you want knees do you see you later see you later but hopefully that won't happen get out of here as fast as your knees can carry you the old English saying Jacqueline won't be familiar with that yeah she won't be familiar with it we'll just have to remove her but yeah we will say that if it needs to be I'm on tour edgamble.co.uk.

4:43Fresh Hell is the name of the show. We'd love you to come. But enough of all that. Let's get on with this episode with the brilliant Jacqueline Novak.

4:58Welcome, Jacqueline, to the Dream Restaurant. Welcome, Jacqueline Novak, to the Dream Restaurant.

5:05James Acaster: Been expecting you for some time. Thank you. Thank you. I'm so glad to be here. How are you enjoying our country? Let's see. I'm jet lagged. I've been on a weird schedule. So I'm only, I haven't been to a proper restaurant. I've only been ordering past midnight. Oh, wow. And it's not, you know, I mean, everywhere stuff is less, even like New York. I feel like it's less, stuff's not as. It's not the good stuff past midnight. It's not what it once was. It's not the fantasy of all night. No. So I've been getting a lot of falafel. Okay, that's not a bad option for past midnight. Yeah. Falafel, hummus.

5:44Now I'm just doing my meal from the other night, but sort of relevant, I think, right? A new section to the podcast. Midnight snack. Midnight snack. Do you believe in the midnight snack? I always feel like midnight meal. Oh, yeah. Right? Like, what are we doing, kind of? Like, let's get into it and do it proper.

6:01James Acaster: Do it properly. If we're going to eat. Midnight feast. That was the thing, wasn't it? I was obsessed when I was a kid. Oh, man, I was obsessed with midnight feast. I wanted to have a midnight feast so much. Wait, is that a term? That was a thing. Now, here? Yeah. I didn't realise it was specifically... I didn't know it was just here. It really sounds like a medieval British thing, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah, medieval feast. Yeah. Medieval midnight feast. Yeah. Candles. Yeah. I guess they would have to eat by candlelight anyway at night. Yeah. Chicken leg, that sort of stuff. And here you guys eat by candlelight always.

6:33We do. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Wet stony walls. Yeah. Ghosts.

6:38James Acaster: You chuck the bones on a big pile in the corner. Yeah, there's a skinny dog that licks the bones. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's what you should be doing. Okay, that's, yeah. I do get a lot of things when I don't know if it's, which I'm planning on utilizing the lamp for options even. I mean, if I'm allowed, I guess that's the question. You're allowed. I like a lot, a lot of, I like to over-order massively. Like that's really, that's probably my core, particularly with dining with other people. That's your one requirement is. Yeah. You don't care what it is, just too much of it. Yes, bare minimum.

7:14Quantity, if nothing else. And if you're dining with other people, you just don't. Well, it depends on who you feel safe to dine with. People that don't order enough are a huge problem for me, even for themselves, because then they come for your food. Or they are sort of prim about, I don't know. I'm just like, I'm a hungry, I'm a voracious woman. spiritually, physically. Yeah, safety with the people you're eating with is important, I think. Yeah. Like we have a lot of meals together, me and James. Yeah. And we know that we're over-ordering. Yes. And that's going to happen. And there's like the judging eyes of maybe the waiter or something being like you're ordering too much.

7:57But you've got each other. You're like. I don't think we do over-order because we eat it all. No, right.

8:02James Acaster: Yeah, yeah, yeah. But it's too much food. Yeah, it's too much food. It's too much food for other people. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I went to Italy once. And so I say that because it's like adds an extra level. Like I'm there for, well, actually I stayed quite a while. It doesn't matter. Point is, I remember just like doing the ordering and looking at the waiter and trying to get a sense and whatever. He was like, got to a point where I was like, do you think I should order something else? He was like, it's enough. Like he just, he came through, he slapped his hand, you know. And I was like, because I also feel like you can't always trust them.

8:33like a lot of times they'll do this thing to me where it's like you know that's a lot of food and I'm like I should hope so for one you know they're like you better be hungry it's like that's why I came here I'm at a restaurant obviously I'm hungry and like even if I wasn't you know I like to take something home yeah yeah sure and also I'm paying I'm paying for the food I'm not gonna give you back one of the dishes and say I was too hungry I wasn't hungry enough for that here's give me my money back Has anyone been like, that was too big. Why did you let me order that? I mean, I bet they have, but that's crazy.

9:09James Acaster: Yeah, there will be people who have done that. There's always, right. They were just like, you shouldn't have let me order all that food. You knew how big it all was. Why did you do that? Why did you let me order all that? I'm not going to pay for all that food. That's unreasonable. You can't make me pay for that. And it's like, well, you can take it home and feed people. Yeah. Do you? Okay, wait. when people go out with you guys like what is it like you know like them knowing like are they just like what do they expect kind of i don't know do you feel comfortable like or i guess it depends on the person yeah are they trying to show off like no i mean no one's showing off for us no no one's showing off for us everyone feels comfortable there's no intimidation right i mean it's either we're going out for meals with people who've known us for ages anyway and if they haven't they either I don't know the people who do know more about food than us will probably go right I'm going to take you to this place I'll order for us this stuff you know because they enjoy showing the boys who love food you know do you have any restrictions that just no it's so frustrating that like I have a nut allergy since childhood and it's like it's not who I am to have a restriction, you know what I mean, on the food.

10:27And so it's like, I feel like people think you're doing it on purpose. It's very weird. And then I've recently gone plant-based, which I thought about the genie lamp today. I was like, well, I'm going to assume, I'm going to be free, right? I'm going to assume that somehow if I'm saying a pizza, it's some vegan cheese that's not made of nuts that is somehow miraculous. I don't know. I've got to make it all work in my fantasy. In the dream restaurant, all your restrictions are either catered for or they don't exist for the course of this meal. Wouldn't it be sick if I was just like, because like there's no joy in a pistachio for me because anytime I've ever accidentally tasted even that, it's immediate like living hell, right?

11:06So there's no like I would love. Although I do like when there would be like pistachio ice cream and it was green.

11:13James Acaster: Yeah. And like, or I'd think it was mint. And you want to get, should we talk about ice cream? I want to talk about all the foods. I'm going meta because I just have questions. We can talk about ice cream. But we shouldn't... I'm just trying to think. What are your favorites? Favorite ice cream? Yeah, yeah, let's see. I mean, this is so many. I've talked about ice cream so much on the podcast and I still haven't covered all the ice creams that I like. Yeah. If you had to have one right now, and I mean like in this situation, any flavors coming in and playing your own game on YouTube in psychotic ways I've shouted it out before but I haven't had it in a very long time and it was so good is the marmalade on toast ice cream that I had this is probably in like 2015 now or something are there ribbons of marmalade in it?

12:07James Acaster: I think so but mainly it's like the so I've had it twice and one was at a friend's house and they made it and they had toasted breadcrumbs and then stirred that into the ice cream. So that's kind of in there, the toast flavor. And marmalade, obviously. Oh my God. And was just insane. And then is the ice cream itself, is that flavor, what's the flavor of the ice cream itself? Do you know what I mean? Oh yeah, I guess it's like a vanilla or milk. You know, it's like a pretty plain ice cream. Okay, so I can recreate this is my point. Yeah, I think. Because I can even go, I can do a vegan vanilla or something.

12:41James Acaster: Yeah, you could do it. I'll stop talking about the plant-based. I know it's joyless. I'll leave it out now you just know no it's good there's a lot of listeners who listen to this who have a plant based diet and they don't feel represented on this podcast most episodes when we're just talking about you know eating things raw and killing things and whatever well I was I was this is fairly recent so I still identify with all eaters yeah get on your knees yes shall we talk about it please yeah I'm very excited it's come to Netflix it's a show that heard loads about before it came to Netflix which is always irritating right aren't you just like but like when you hear like when you hear something i don't know hype is like the worst oh but yeah i bet i'm happy i'm not gonna like it i like it with uh weirdly i thought hype i like with stand-up comedians and comedy shows because it because it's more word of mouth and the people that i can believe it because it's more of a comedian saying you got to see jacqueline nobuck show yeah and like and so like it that is usually quite an exciting thing and i I like when someone, a show has a moment, you know, in the comedy, and becomes, and is part of that, you know, history of comedy.

13:52James Acaster: That was when everyone was talking about that show, and that was important. And when you hear it from other comics as well, you're like, and you know that the comic has done loads of stuff before, and they've been working at it for ages, and then there's this one moment where it's all come together perfectly. It's nice. It's nice for people. It's not like, no, it's good. You're like, oh, she's been out a while. That really does help. Yeah, yeah, yeah. She's been ignored for years. Were you ignored for years? Well, I mean, yeah. I mean, you know, you're always scraping little bits at a time. You know what I mean?

14:22But, yeah, it was kind of just like everyone, I don't know, New York. I mean, the industry is like such a vague concept. But the vague feeling of like they've seen me around forever. There's no new excitement. So it felt like I had to just do something like really intense and hardcore. and like big and i don't know just to try to be like i'm doing it and so you know that was i like there's something i do i do enjoy a kind of um like triumph like i like kind of being you know like i like kind of bringing it's classic like comedian stuff right but it's like i can't like kind of love being like digging yourself out of a hole you can't like help but pull yourself into one and then like try to get out and it's kind of like more satisfying than yeah going out there like they're gonna love this and then doing that like i can't the second thing like no it's gonna

15:17James Acaster: work i'm like bored of it so yeah you know did you have those with those early shows when you knew like i mean for the listener this one won't know what the show's about yeah do you want to explain it quick before we go to questions i think it's better you explain it yeah yeah yeah yeah it's like kind of a blowjob in three acts kind of thing like or like three blowjobs across I don't know. It's basically my evolving thinking about, and I say like the blowjob versus like blowjobs because it's kind of abstract and it's very, like I would try to sell it. I like put these billboards up, like these digital billboards I buy online at like 2 a.m.

15:59for Minneapolis or something. I was just like, you know, like I was the same gearhead, like do it all myself, whatever. But I was like, it's a highbrow, you know, the most highbrow show about blowjobs, you know, you'll see or whatever, like stuff like that. But it's kind of like cerebral. And I did a version of it at Edinburgh and they were like, I say it in the show, but someone from, I don't know, the Times or something while praising someone else's show managed to like sneak in a dig at mine. and they were like versus Jacqueline Novak who talks about blowjobs to the point of tedium and like so I mentioned it at the top of my show such a good quote though I know I know I'm like thank you and I like it and I like telling people about it because it is kind of the vibe like it is kind of like I'm gonna talk about this and I'm gonna I'm gonna keep talking about it to a point where it is absolutely not like there's almost nothing sexy about the show you know like it's just yeah because like not salacious anymore because you know once you're 40 minutes in yeah exactly people are yeah they're over the fact it's about blowjobs or whatever i was like tell him it's 85 and it's like 92 you know and no interval at what point in the writing process were you like this whole show is going to be about blowjobs no it's interesting it i i sort of knew that was sort of the idea was because i had this essay i wrote in college like in a creative non-fiction class you know similar vibe almost like almost like i don't know like young kind of writer like yeah like yeah i'm gonna talk about it you know like but i'm gonna be sort of poetic about it and like i don't know it's just a vibe it was a really college vibe and so in which i sort of traced this like oh the first time i heard about the blowjob when i was like 13 and my initial thoughts of like what you know what are you talking about and then later you know this like anxiety about how i would as this overthinker approach, something like that.

17:53And kind of like this quest to triumph over the fear of it and then triumphing and then like suddenly going the other way and being like, oh God, like, you know, like feeling like I then try to argue back for my, like basically being ashamed of having triumphed for it, you know, and then whatever. It's like just long mental quest. And so, yeah, it was kind of, it was the blowjob from the beginning. I was just like, that's what this is. all in yeah that's what this is and then there's other things that come along the way then it's just like i was like it's a good organizing principle for me it's uh it's like a rich enough concept it's like it's almost like it bothers me it's like it's like this kind of thing i would stew on like it's like so weird like what the fuck is the blowjob you know like it's just a weird thing it like you can analyze it forever kind of so is is that a sort of framework that you're carrying through to your because you're here doing work in progress right for your for your next show.

18:47And very work in progress. Like, it's not like, you know, here's a bumpy script that I'm kind of like working my way through and tweaking, which is a fantasy that I imagine like, I don't know, other acts do or something. I'm just like, it's so much more chaotic and I'm doing different things each night. I am kind of trying to figure out, you know, if there is something. Because it's like, at the same time, it almost feels weird for there to be like this topic that's like, okay, so this one, like if there's too narrow a topic, it almost feels like, okay, so last time was the blowjob. This time is the blah blah blah right it can't be like it almost i don't want it to be something you can like slot in as this time you're approaching so i don't know i might have to not sure what form exactly it's going to take there's a lot of ghost stuff right now like of course yeah yeah which is that's good i planted a little bit of ghost material in the last show in part to make it so no one will be shocked when i started talking about ghosts like a lot later they wouldn't be like this is

19:45James Acaster: departure i'd be like actually see minute five yeah i talk about a ghost getting a ghost giving a yeah not even no in that first ghostbusters film dan akward gets a blowjob of course of course floats up right yeah and then yeah that is how that goes right it's like i think so he's in bed he's lying there that you see the covers go yeah incredible movie i mean right like there's just nothing oh it's good yeah yeah there's nothing like that yeah but that bit yeah first name park we always start with still a sparkling water I know I was thinking about it I think it is it's still but when I want to kind of feel special I get sparkling so I'm going let's start with a still okay so you don't want to feel special yet no because here's the thing if a big meal is coming I'm like I don't want those bubbles mostly filling me yeah you feel more full after the bubbles so let's start with a still later I'll bother you for sparkling.

20:44You're not bothering us. It's no bother. It's no bother. Yeah, I like to... We'll stay still.

20:52James Acaster: Build your way up to the sparkling. Do you live in New York? Is that where you live? Los Angeles now. I was going to ask a question about the tap water. Well, that's the thing. There is a little bit of luxury to ordering still, flat, whatever, in a bottle when you know that the tap is sufficient that's where it's almost like in new york you're like oh bottled still what like it's just i feel like there's a point of pride in new york just being like taps fine like these people are fools like they don't realize the tap is primo it's funny to me that the new york tap water is supposed to be so good yeah because you didn't find it that way no no not not necessarily but it's just like you go to new york and my first thought wouldn't be but the tap water's good here my first thought would be I'm not fucking drinking the tap water in this dirty city yeah like is it so obvious but like do you experience New York as dirty when you're walking around are you like no just like big metropolis like cities like yeah it doesn't it doesn't feel like the sort of squeaky clean tap water city do you know what I mean I think it's depends what time of year as well does it in the summer walk around New York you smell the hot the hot trash I was like I thought well yeah I used to be like let's let's refrigerate it like the worst the least eco thing ever yeah We need refrigerators on the street keeping our trash from spoiling.

22:11I was like, I'd run for mayor on that. That's a great idea.

22:15James Acaster: Because that is hot trash. Tough. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But you want still water bottled tap? Oh, right. Sorry, I got all over the place. Bottled. Let's do bottled, but it depends. What kind are you offering? What kind do you want? What's your dream? You know what I've been into recently? I've been enjoying Aquapana. The color of the bottle I find very pleasing. The peach, I mean, it's clear, but you know then the peach and the it's like the bottle is such a huge part of it when you're it feels very fancy that one doesn't it it feels like you're like in a white lotus property or something like Voss or something is a little like too modern that feels too LA to me as well yeah exactly yeah yeah you want something with a bit of history to it yeah the shape yeah yeah like the old days where they're trying to get us to drink the water because it was like shaped like a woman's hips or whatever yeah the Coca-Cola Anderson yeah who's back and better than ever we've talked about that on this podcast before The Pammy bottle.

23:08Was it Pepsi? It was Pepsi, I think. Was it literally based on her? Yeah, they released a version of it called the Pammy. Yeah. Well, you've seen, like, because recently she's been making a lot of headlines because she's been just going very natural and it's stunning and we're all just, like, very excited about it. I don't know how you'd put the new Pammy in a bottle formation. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. But they should try.

23:28James Acaster: Yeah, they should try. Yeah. Yeah, they should try. Shout out. I mean, we should all really, I mean, maybe one day in the future, who knows what technology what will happen but we'll all be given bottles in the shape of our own bodies I know they want it they want it it's like you know like everything because don't you feel like there's so much where they're like don't worry like it's about you now and it's like you're like I don't want that you know like they're like you can make it could be your face on the doll you know and it's like I mean like the American Girl dolls you know like I don't I'm like are they global I don't know but they have a it was a catalog in like you know the 90s and then now it's like huge store in Times Square but it was like they had these like historical dolls and they had characters and books that went along with them and then suddenly it was like you know factory of choose the hair and you know and it was like sort of like options again option fatigue I don't want my face on a doll I'd like your face on a doll yeah yeah but no but we're saying that the companies want your own yeah friends faces yeah body is pretty disturbing because yeah I once did this thing.

24:33I don't know if you've ever had the pleasure of doing this, but I sent it. It was like, whatever, it doesn't matter. But it's a suit you put on. And it uses your camera to basically like create a model of your body. Right. And I guess the idea was like sizing. Like you could send this to someone and they could create your perfect jeans. Okay. But then the fitness community took it up and they're like, you know, they're like, oh, centimeters come off my waist. Right. And, you know, oh, my ass, I've grown it. And like whatever, you know, it's lifted. But there's something about seeing faceless, like you just as a prism of a shape.

25:08Yeah. It's pretty haunting. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like almost no matter what, you know what I mean? But you're just like, there's a lot of. Yeah. Yeah. Because there's like bits of your body that you don't ever see from an angle. And then when you, for some reason, there's a mirror in a weird place, you're like, the fuck? That's what people have been seeing the whole time? It's shocking. Yeah. It's shocking. And then just like, there's no clothes. There's no expression. like you almost feel like i feel like in life you're sort of constantly contextual or believe you're contextualizing yourself right like you know you're you're leaning in with a certain you've got an idea of you're doing something with your body yeah just stock still i mean how do you find that when you're like watching uh stuff back to edit because i've just i've literally just had to watch my special back to no no no no and i'm like do is that how i walk around do i walk around I mean, the posture stuff like right now, the posture stuff is insane.

26:01Yeah. Like, it's like creating a serious crisis. I was like, wow. Like, I was just like, okay, so that's interesting. Also, you know, you kind of think, you kind of know internally, like you have a model of what faces you're making. Just like faces you make all the time. You kind of just assume, look a certain way. And then I feel like if you're watching back footage, you're like, whoa, like did not know that that was that face. I know what it feels like to make that face because I know that moment in the show or whatever and that is not what I think I'm doing I've had that so much especially like I'll be on stage doing something I must have done the show like a hundred times and there's like a bit where I think I'm really selling something and I'm doing a great face to sell the bit and then I watch it back and I'm doing nothing this is why like okay photo shoots like not that I've done a million okay but there's this like purest idea it seems like where you're really not supposed to have a mirror around okay they're like it's very much like the photographer and you are engaged in a conversation right you know and they're capturing you but i go i'm so afraid of making like some ridiculous face that i almost go so neutral that i'm doing literally nothing and it's like the same photo over and over again if i actually have a mirror i do more because i'm like i could see that i'm doing nothing so then i adjust so i'm starting to just be like if i'm if i get photographed like i need a huge mirror right in front of me, like a teenage girl, like, posing.

27:27It's the only way. Pobloms or bread! Pobloms or bread, Jacqueline Neuvann! Pobloms or bread! Wait, what's the first thing you're saying? Pobloms or bread! What is that? Pobloms or bread! Pablo's? Pobloms or bread! Okay, well, the second thing is bread. Yeah, the second thing is bread. And I almost always choose bread over almost anything else. But truly, what is this word you're saying? Pobloms. And what is that? Pizza? No. you understand why I think that right because Papa John's and Domino's Pizza so I was like Papa John's Papa Dom's is clearly the British I mean has that not come up I genuinely don't think that has even from an American

28:14James Acaster: they all knew all the Americans get confused but in different ways and that's the first time we've had is it a pizza I can't believe it's not a pizza Papa Dom's Papa Dom's But will you Do you tell us ever The Americans or no Yeah yeah yeah It's okay if you don't If you're having An Indian meal They'll bring out These round Very crispy things Which are Papa Dom's Oh wait But it's not naan It's not naan It's very like thin Is it Does it have air in the center No Because they're so thin They're just like big crisps It's single How embarrassing But wait I mean for me But are they called that in an Indian restaurant in America even.

28:54Yeah, surely. Are you sure?

28:57James Acaster: Well, I don't know. Or papad as well. Papad, yeah. So like, it depends. Okay, I'm going to check on this. Are you worried that the Americans would be confused because of the pizza thing? No, I'm worried. I'm going, this is embarrassing. This is like, I've never been in, what have I never eaten Indian food? Although I actually had to like seriously pull back because so many of the dishes begin with nuts. Like it's like, you know, almost like olive oil in Italian food or something. Yeah. Where even if they're like, Yeah, it was like I would go and be like, this dish doesn't have nuts. And then instant allergic reaction.

29:27Yeah. It's devastating. What sort of reaction do you get? Is it? Oh, it's like mouth and throat. It's never closed where I can't breathe, but you're always like right on the edge of that. Like wondering, is this the time? Yes. And then, so it's just like the itchy, you know, unpleasant sensation. And then just like, you know, violent vomiting. Cool. It sucks. It's the worst. and I love to go out to eat and these dramatic exits, you know, from the restaurant. One place, it was amazing, one place in Los Angeles, basically, not just for me, but they basically pulled cashews off the menu because I was going there like nightly.

30:04I mean, I was spending a lot of money at this place and I had like two reactions and I don't know, less people have, whatever. They started subbing in other ways to make cheese. So you're going nightly? I get hooked on something, right? So you had an allergic reaction once and then you were back the next night? Oh, absolutely. We need to make a change around here. I did try to investigate what was going on, you know, figure it out. Me and the manager, I was like, I had my ideas about what it was. I was like, well, both times. You had a meeting with the manager. Yeah, yeah, we talked. Well, then she was, I mean, this was customer service.

30:41She was like, okay, when I order in, because I also order in from them, it's like, you have to call also. I will do a double kind of roam through the kitchen. Really make sure we're not messing around. I was starting to think, I should just get them a set of my own pots. Because that was an issue. It should be my own pots. I mean, I'm there enough. I don't know if you have any spots that you like. I just get on something. And if I liked it yesterday, I want to repeat it. I'm just like, hey, remember how great yesterday was? Should we do it again? and then that goes until I don't know I become absolutely sick of it or something yeah but I don't always I mean I like the idea of you having your own pots in a restaurant I know there's loads of bars in Japan where the regulars have their own bottle of whiskey with their name on a label attached to it behind the bar and it's only their whiskey oh my god so if you had a kitchen in a restaurant where it was just your pans Jacqueline's pans but I love a restaurant kept going I want to be in a restaurant yeah I risk it again and again.

31:44Do you want to shout that place out? Because you go there so often. Crossroads. It's vegan. It's vegan. So that's how I am. So there's going to be loads of nuts flying around there. Exactly. But because that's part of it and then there's so many people with nut allergies, they're kind of like expanding or doing some of the nuts that have less people I guess less people are allergic to almonds. I'm not allergic to almonds. So like the almond feta they got to expand, right? They can't keep knocking things off the menu. So they're already vegan and now they're taking caches off. every time someone gets allergic to something, otherwise it's just going to be an imaginary restaurant.

32:17What are they? Yeah. Well, I have, of course, fantasized about the truly nut-free restaurant. Yeah. And it's like, I know that other people have other allergies, but we should get a restaurant for them too. Yeah. LA is very, in theory, food restriction conscious between the diets and the, you know what I mean, between it all. But people still want a restaurant experience. They still want to be in community. Here's my fear, though. like let's just say we did it right nut free restaurant okay all those people we go there I feel like like someone would sort of like bomb the place with nuts you know like there's that thing in people that just well it's so easy you're all so vulnerable in there because everyone knows your weakness right yeah yeah sneaking a nut bomb you just need to yeah or just throw a cashew in like a grenade yes it's like the terrorism would be so easy yeah

33:11James Acaster: so you just yeah what do you do so you're saying bread bread yeah yeah last night i i'm staying in this apartment where like kind of like a service department thing connected to hotel but then so they put a few like snacks in there for you and i just like like ate them all like it was like she's like a plain bread like lying on my back watching tv watching adolescence for the second time oh you're second i was like trying to watch it again what what a laugh you had yesterday. How much fun eating plain bread watching the saddest TV show available. I know, I know. It's phenomenal. It's so good. Oh, good.

33:47So you've seen it. Yeah. Oh, God. It's familiar with Stephen Graham. Yeah. So I was eating the bread and I was like, you know, because this is another pleasure I get when the food is sort of not good or not right. Like, in theory, plain bread, unless it were fragrant, hot, whatever, it's not ideal, right? In theory, I'd want something with it. but the limitation of like all I had is late. All I have is this bread. I'm just going to eat it. It makes it like you're, you're starving and you just found a loaf of bread. And so, you know, like the toughing it version, that's actually might be like, I talk about this sometimes.

34:24I talk about food a lot when I'm not like, not in my last show, but maybe in this one, we'll see hungry ghost or something. I don't know. There's some theme about that, but there's a lot about like these food fantasies that are kind of like roughing it fantasies. there's something that kind of restaurant okay where you're like brought in you're like put in a room and you never know like sometimes they hold you for three hours like and then you like drop a loaf in the center but not quite enough and everyone has to fight over it like I don't know like just like where they hide it well I'm fantasizing like to keep things interesting like not fighting just the people you're with okay like you're in a room a loaf of bread comes in there's like sounds of a rainstorm and you're like sometimes I the little food fantasy for me is like it's medieval times and I'm like and I get given I'm working in like a field and I get given a roll, a lump of cheese and then like a jug of ale this is exactly it and it's like nothing's ever tasted so good and you're so thankful and my hands are dirty but I don't care this is it's precisely that and it's like kind of this well do you get any pleasure from like secret eating like yeah sure you know like kind of like I don't even know my favorite restaurant is like is like hiding in a shed you know stealing stolen food yeah yeah stolen food so this is your dream meal we can put you in a shed by yourself I know I'm realizing I know it's like it's so much easier it's like it doesn't matter bread but dropped in maybe a little ruined but half of it got like rained on it's been on the floor you had to fight for it yeah have you killed anyone for it or is anyone dead no no you know I don't think I want to fight anyone for it that's too stressful because I already I experienced that no exactly yeah exactly you're in charge of splitting it you give everyone a bit well Le Mii's food is yeah that's I'd love to go to Tenardier's

36:26James Acaster: pub yeah where the food is where it's like stews are made of something questionable but yeah times are tough yeah

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40:34James Acaster: Your dream starter? Only one. Because to me, like, a salad is its own thing that I do like, right? But then I am lured by a soup. Okay. Like, it's hard to resist. It's hard to resist a soup. because also it goes down easy. So I feel like you're not too full for whatever's coming next. I'm trying to think. I like it personal. It's very on like what you've been talking about so far. Soup is very much in that kind of world, isn't it? You're freezing, you're wearing fingerless gloves. Yeah, it's very Oliver like, please sir, can I have some more? It's like my restaurant, you know, it's like begging.

41:14Wooden spoon. Or like even like the spoon is too small. Like too small or too big. Right. You are the first person on the podcast who's themed their menu around lack of availability or comfort. I know. It's like, yeah, suddenly it's all coming alive for me. I was trying to imagine this perfect meal or something. And then it was too, like, stressful. But a beautiful soup with a drizzle of something, you know, still. I want a soup. I kind of want some kind of salad. And then I'm just thinking, like, but I also like something that's a dip experience. Like, very happy to get a, I mean, a guacamole.

41:46I'm very happy to get some warm chips. I know we are very bread on the table but we don't have to worry about appetite we'll assume I'm endlessly hungry yeah yeah you're endlessly hungry it's fine I mean judging by the way you're talking you're endlessly hungry because you've been in the wilderness for a week yeah yeah yes exactly you've bought I've been in the a long way should I go more specific like I think I want the soup to be a sort of creamy soup you can go even more specific oh you know what I love an oyster cracker is that what they call them here still now are they the little they come in little bags yes yeah but they're they're like a little circle kind of but they puff out like what I thought the other thing was but isn't okay and it's like it's as if they hold cracker cracker style air inside them see what I'm saying it's like they hold special they serve them with chowder quite a lot yes yes okay I think I know the ones you mean and so it's like you bite into them and there's a little pop of air that has been living inside of a cracker

42:44James Acaster: yeah in my mind it's completely impenetrable like yeah flavored air and then yeah that's good yeah so you'd like some oyster crackers yeah what sort of soup what's like the finest thing but also I'm letting go of I mean because it's like it would be easier if it were like okay we're at Italian what are you doing or at whatever right it's like to put together this meal of all these different things it's not how I'd want it it's like I wouldn't want the guacamole and the chowder yeah but you're giving me everything so it's too hard but you can put restrictions on yourself if you want you can say it's Italian it's an Italian meal oh I'd have to come back next we can do Mexican then yeah sure and the next we can do this is an issue yeah yeah yeah should we do Italian no no I want to fly free I want to fly free fly free fly free oh something tomato based but a minute ago you were complaining about having to fly free Jacqueline I know I'm a contradiction yeah so what you're leading towards I think I'll stick with some kind of like bisque maybe it's because I'm here that I'm craving for a bisque it's the first time we've heard the word bisque I don't it's really about what I'm feeling today right right now a bisque maybe it's because I had all that plain bread last night and yearning to dip dip it in something I'm craving a bisque I'm craving a it's like almost a little rainy I don't know I think London's doing it to me I'm not like screaming about bisques at home I don't know like are they a thing here like a chowder yeah like a chowder or like a lobster a lobster bisque yeah I mean which is a notably heavy famously not vegan as well I know I know but what flavor would you like they'll find our way I don't mind a lobster bisque I guess now I'm kind of putting together like like a steak this is like a steak meal setting aside the steak but like oh you know what I love so I was saying tomato based basically anything tomato I'm interested right salsa you know any tomato sauce in an Italian setting when they have an incredible like tomato and they would thickly sliced I feel like I haven't had a good tomato in a long time but like this is like a fantasy from childhood like at a steak restaurant it'd be like the big the big slice tomato and just the salt and pepper on the tomato oh yeah good tomatoes hard to find got some heritage tomatoes at home in the fridge I wanna really?

44:59James Acaster: go and get home and eat them tonight chop them up in a some olive oil and some salt you're crazy man you're crazy I'm crazy yeah so something bread something tomato I like a wedge salad again this is very rich this is a very rich meal how do you feel out of wedge I don't think it's a rich meal well if I do bisque yeah but you haven't decided you're doing you haven't decided you're doing bisque I was trying to move on to the next phase without the true decision you know what I mean do you want to do do you want to do a bisque lobster bisque this is getting really rich I don't know well it's not we haven't even started we haven't so far you've had still water I've got my still water you've got still water plain bread plain bread that you have to find over here's the idea here's the idea it's not rich at all I need an appetizer okay or starter yeah okay i need a starter i need a salad and i need a soup that'll help me i'm getting all those things okay right yeah okay so i'm thinking like the salad i want something i think i want something light and sort of like arugula kind of do you even call it that here's rocket yeah rocket that's so cool yeah i love that it's like shocking i think arugula sounds cool really rocket hello i mean rocket that's way cooler i forgot you were five i'll just go to space on this arugula again i'm always like what's rocket you know i'm like and then you're here for a couple weeks and you're like i'll have the rocket but anyway yeah so something like tangy kind of vinegary kind of that kind of thing going and like a soup it can be small you're even holding your hands out like i know yeah yeah i know i know because i'm traveling yeah i feel like there's also that you know I'm roaming I'm a nomad I have that feeling very much of like like please yeah yeah like I'm ready for Tenardier to welcome me and like and rip me off and then okay so we've got soup in the salads yeah I know lovely so what have we settled on the soup it's the lobster bisque sounds weird to me now every time you hear lobster bisque okay how about a cream of like how about a pureed kind of pumpkin-y, that kind of soup.

47:07Pumpkin soup.

47:07James Acaster: Yeah. That sounds ridiculous when you say it. Tomato? What about an ever so slightly creamy tomato? Okay, lovely. That'll do. Yeah. Maybe I'm imagining like kind of like a giant crouton that's like not crassly square, like not crassly a cube. Kind of rough, you know, like that style. Almost pulled apart. A hand-torn, hand-torn crouton. A hand-torn. Yeah, exactly. A little olive oil drizzle. Yeah, yeah. I think you want rustic I think you're in a rustic mood yeah this is not the time for like you know a tower of tower of tuna you know what I'm talking about where it's like a totem pole of tuna yeah yeah it's not tower of tuna time I don't mind those but yeah rustic full plates not a bunch of porcelain staring at me coldly maybe almost like tin plates oh I don't know if I've really experienced that there's metal plates yeah metal plates yeah I kind of see it it's made in a tavern I'm thinking tavern I'm thinking I'm thinking by a woman with one with one tooth are you well that's fantastic yeah yeah the wench kind of experience yeah yeah yeah but do you not include a cocktail for any reason are you sober well we do no we do the dream drink later on okay it's just coming later yeah yeah I like it on an empty stomach what can I say yeah yeah if you want to kick off with a cocktail yeah you can have it whenever you want I think just like a maybe like a spicy sort of tequila type of drink a spicy margarita I mean yeah but I want it to be your restaurant to be your own take on that you know like a fruit I'm not expecting okay you know like oh we've got these very strange peaches this is getting a little precious I know but very strange peaches they're very small and they're very tart to be something we've stolen from an orchard or something yeah we got yes they're in a sack yeah yeah they're in a little sack you pull them out and we're only because of like glory like you see like my excitement about the cocktail you're like she's got something special we're gonna tell her about the tiny peaches yeah do you this i wonder if they're out there like didn't there's a tiny tart peach in the world probably and then imagining it's like a margarita kind of thing yeah yeah but with a tiny tart shaving it into there yeah there's little threads of the actual skin.

49:32Yeah. We have a little piles of skin on the top. This little kid who nicks them for us and comes around the back of the restaurant. Yes, yes, yes. And you give him an urchin. Yeah, a little urchin. I love a street urchin. Oh, the peach boy's here.

49:44James Acaster: Yeah. I love the peach boy. And then you give him a little, you give him like some scraps. Yeah, he loves scraps. He gets scraps. He eats shit loads of the peaches as well. He's so small. He got on his scran. What is scran? Some food. He got his scrum for our peaches. It's not a specific one. No. We give him one coin as well. Flip it to him. He loves it. I would love to be that little boy. That would be so great. But they make good margaritas, those tiny little peaches. Oh, yeah, yeah. You have that. But I think I want it in a, this is different. I want it in a coupe glass, not in a rocks glass.

50:19You know what I'm talking about, right?

50:20James Acaster: Mm-hmm. I love to drink a cocktail out of that. You want a glass that is, what, the triangle shape? I like the rounder one I get what you mean Like you might have a gimlet in One of those kind of glasses Or champagne in revolutionary France Where Apparently The glass was Modelled on the shape of Marie Antoinette's Breast Wait, are you serious? Yes I thought you were just making a gag about No, apparently the glass was modelled on the shape of Marie Antoinette's breast Listen Listen, if you want to be on a podcast where the hosts know what glasses and bottles were modeled on different women's breasts, you came to the right one.

51:06James Acaster: The original Pappy Buffle. I'm going to start saying if I go to a fancy place where I feel like they know that kind of stuff, I'm going to go like, I'm going to be like, I hear that that's Tommy Lee Jones's shoulder. I said Tommy Lee, which sounds like I'm sorry, I didn't. I literally meant Tommy Lee Jones. Tommy Lee Jones's shoulder. Also, if I want value for money and it's a Tommy Lee Jones body part Tommy Lee Jones, sorry Tommy Lee But I meant Tommy Lee Jones He's a Tommy Lee Jones

51:34He visually came to mind It wasn't the name that got me there Anyway, but I'm going to be wrong That would be a really different tape, wouldn't it? If it was Tommy Lee Jones and Pamela Anderson That's Washington's That's Ben Franklin's ear

51:48James Acaster: And then I won't let them tell me otherwise Yeah, exactly. Yeah, you should use this. Okay, so wait. We've got a simple tomato kind of thing going. Yeah, cream of tomato soup with a big hand-pulled crouton in it. We've got a rocket salad. And we've got the small tart peach margarita spicy. It doesn't have to all come together. People understand, right? Sure. No, I mean like, you know, I wouldn't put this on someone else. This would be my first. Okay, I come to the dream restaurant, right? I make all these mistakes. Yeah. like I'm in right now where I go like and a peach margarita oh but I love Mexican food oh but da da da right yeah and then I go okay I go I need to come back and I need to come back several times and I mean I'm just pitching myself for the podcast again sure I guess but what do you do the second time you come to this restaurant serious question what would you mean like I would probably come in I would probably force myself to choose a pathway I mean currently I would say best way to play it force yourself to choose a pathway the first time no hell no it would be inauthentic it'd be deeply inauthentic so all i'm saying is i know that this meal doesn't come together for someone else and i wouldn't serve it that way but i want to go through each moment on its own almost like that's the only thing i'm getting to eat so i'm just explaining that i know that it you know i'm not standing by the menu for anyone else but it's just what i want right now if i'm calling for things so i go yeah let's get um yeah i'll have rocket salad actually i'm over that now i want the wedge again i think now then if that's what what's going to happen and that's how we're working it I think the moment you order something you call it it's on the menu and we can't go back no great great yeah hey you guys this is your restaurant yeah so it's on you it's on you so what have you got so far okay we don't need to recap every time we've recapped about four or five times genius okay I think we move we move on now you guys are looking at each other like like this has never happened this is hannah burner from giggly squad opil is the first over-the-counter daily birth control pill available in the u.s let's be real getting a birth control prescription is not always easy and it's so much admin in fact about a third of women face barriers to access prescription birth control between scheduling appointments missing work class or just trying to exist it's a lot But now Opill is putting birth control in our control.

54:13Opill is a daily birth control that's FDA approved, full prescription strength and estrogen free and 98 % effective when used as directed. Grab it online or at most major retailers, no prescription or doctor's appointment needed. So if you're thinking about birth control, check out Opill to see if it's right for you. Use code Giggly for 25 % off your first month of Opill at O-P-I-L-L dot com. That's code Giggly at O-P-I-L-L dot com. Birth control in your control. We love to see it. Hi, it's Brooke DeVard, host of Naked Beauty, and I want to talk about how I upgrade my hosting experience. There's a moment just before guests arrive when my home stops feeling like a series of rooms and it becomes an atmosphere.

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55:18James Acaster: Well, I guess three main course then. Yeah. Impossible. All right. Why don't we do, I'll have a pasta tonight. That comforts me. This is what I have to do in a regular restaurant. I stare at the menu, I'm having anxiety and I go, I can come back. This isn't my last meal. Yeah, that's important to remember. And so, all right, all right. I'm letting go of everything. We're doing a rocket salad just to get things going. Yeah, we don't need to recap. We're doing a little soup. No, I'm changing it up a little bit. I'm trying to give it some order. No, no soup. Now it's become Italian. All right, we've got the bread.

55:47The soup's in the kitchen. The soup's coming out. All right, the soup's out of the way, but I think I still want a pasta. I want something, I want a tangy pasta. A lot of tomato sauce. This is my classic. Yeah, yeah. Extra sauce. I don't want it, you know, even if the chef thinks it's crass, load me up. do you want an extra jug of sauce on the side that you can keep I'll take it if they're offering you know when they I would order in and I'd have to be like I would get these zucchini sticks these fried whatever and they come with a little marinara but it was never enough and I would have to be like how many will you give me?

56:22how many are you comfortable giving me? you'd get like two dips

56:26James Acaster: and then they started giving me so let's say like a pasta I'm thinking almost like a bucatini like a Amatriciana kind of thing like that's what the capers and the right the olives that kind of pasta puttanesca oh no maybe I am thinking of puttanesca wait what's Amatriciana oh Amatriciana similar I think similar but it's got the meat maybe in it yeah like it's got puttanesca's the anchovies and olives and capers oh I love that I love all that yeah yeah salty vegan anchovy vegan anchovy somebody's working on it they just did vegan caviar I'll make it I'm a genie I can make for all these things that like they never were alive yes it's just food yes straight away my stomach growled like your hands are moving saying you know anchovies feel like the sort of thing a vegan should be able to eat right I mean it's just because it's really some vegans eat oysters right absolutely not anchovies they're so small and they're not they're thick well it's not necessarily for the for the moral IQ I mean like it's more a health thing related to whatever it's a whole thing but like going down this path by reading these books, deciding this is the way.

57:32But then ultimately, very happy. It's nice to be able to be like, you know, not have the animal thing, haunting the meal. But I know what you mean about the thick anchovy. Yeah. I was wondering, I was thinking about vegetables earlier, like, you know, what's going on in there? Like their heads. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Exactly. Don't go down that path, Jacqueline, because next time you come into the dream restaurant, all I can have is a rock. Yeah. I eat tiny stones. but then you think oh they're so tiny those little those little guys so helpless they're the saddest ones of all because no one even thinks they have

58:09James Acaster: consciousness so your main course is the pasta dish it's a pasta let's just you know it's a delicious pasta there's still bread on the table that I'm dipping of course at the end yeah yeah

58:26James Acaster: so your dream side dish then to go with that yeah what's going with it do you want to recap on what you've had so far i mean it's boring but i it's boring you're all over the place well my favorite side dish in life arguably is a french fry but that's not happening here i know it wouldn't be good with the pasta and i know that okay no but so i when i'm having pasta i kind of like just a cruel vegetable on the side you know like yeah like just like a spinach you know like just like yeah like not even greased up like i kind of just like kind of want almost like a punishment vegetable yeah yeah yeah just kind of offsetting yeah yeah yeah bring back the rustic nature yeah we still have you know there's something to move between like okay the pasta's like it's like so tasty and then you go over and you have kind of like a punch of that like a little punch in the mouth of the spinach is it wilted?

59:17oh yeah yeah

59:19James Acaster: creamed? no not when I've got the other creams going on it's too nice it's got to be like clear the palate almost to come back to the warm comfort. You just want iron. You want to feel like you're eating vitamins. Yes. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Pasta, pasta. I mean, come on. At the end of the day, you got to admit a bowl of pasta. I mean, does it? It's good stuff. It is. Yeah. But I'm also so off of my protein world. You don't have to get us to admit that you... That my meal is perfect. But we're having a reassurance. I know that our job here is to make you go, yeah, that's the right decision.

59:52James Acaster: Don't worry about it. Yeah. You've realized what I crave because when we move on to the next next one you always roll back to the previous one and go hold on a second I do I said pasta yeah so when we went on main course you were like so hold on the soup and the salad and maybe I shouldn't have the soup and then we had to move you on to the pasta no you always have to move me on I'll never move on and then we moved on to the side dish and you went pasta yes no no right right right because it's a narrative yes yes wait I have to break in with one idea which is I don't know if this has ever come up for you okay I'm gonna say almost certainly not okay so so my friend who who like this is a million years ago but she told me she would dine all over the world all these amazing places and she was like go to a really nice place what you wanna do and she and you gotta make it's gotta be a nice place or it's irritating okay you go they ask you what you want you go build me a meal Build me a meal.

1:00:54James Acaster: Build me a meal. Basically, you let them, because they know. If you don't have any restrictions or if there's anything, you know, they know the best stuff. It's like, and it's not like, tell me what you like. And then you sit there and decide and go, oh, is it like this? It's just like, I trust you. Yeah. I'm hungry. I trust you. Can you imagine the freedom, the relief? And then knowing you've chosen, right? This is how Robert De Niro lives his life. Right. Robert De Niro just goes from restaurant to restaurant and just says, I have what's good. Wait, are you serious? I never heard this about him.

1:01:21James Acaster: He just says, I'll have what's good. Have what's good. And then they just bring in what's good. Oh my God, I bet they do. And I bet they over-serve. Well, it depends. Unfortunately, he did take that approach when he was on this podcast and it sort of ruined the format. So I did less than that. I mean, I did more than that. You did more than that. You've gone the other way. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I've gone, right. I've over-ordered some would say. You're anti-De Niro. You're the anti-De Niro right now. I mean.

1:01:52your dream drink then so we've had a cocktail you've had the small yes oh you mean like pairing with a meal yeah I'm a pig I never yearn for like wine during the meal I'm always just like I'm always like bring me back to cocktail menu like because I want to try more things

1:02:07James Acaster: I'm like you cocktails all the way cocktails all the way we had a New Year's Eve together once where it was an absolute disaster oh my god because a lot of us were doing the wine pairing and every time we got a new little glass of wine brought to us by the way so James would have a new cocktail. Of course. Absolutely. What do you love? Fucked. Do you love a martini? What do you love? Yeah, I love a martini. Yeah. A vodka martini. Yeah. Yeah. And like, at the minute, I used to have them very clean, but now very dirty martinis. Have you ever gotten it too dirty? I thought you couldn't. And then once I did, and I was like...

1:02:42James Acaster: You can get it too dirty. And you're like, yeah. Yeah, I still want to, I don't want to just taste brine and that's it. Yeah. Yeah. But I haven't had one that's too dirty yet. they've been pretty good what's the most exciting cocktail right now is there anything on the streets I had a cocktail recently which I really loved a restaurant called Cornice it was a clarified coffee Negroni which I thought was absolutely phenomenal oh my god this is fresh and it was a lunch as well it was an early lunch so we were meeting at noon and that's the first thing I had clarified coffee Negroni so you feel like you're kicking off your day in style.

1:03:21It was really, really good. Classy. So that's the, for me, that's the hot cocktail news on the streets. Okay, thank you. That's good. That's good. Do you think that's something you could, no, you can't just order that anyway. They don't all have the clarified coffee, right? You got to go to Corners? Corners. C-O-R-N-U-S. If you went, I'm sure if you went there, you could just say, have you got a seat at the bar or something maybe? No, I mean, you couldn't simply order it at any restaurant. It's not like on the streets in that way. No, I don't think so. I think it's specifically.

1:03:50For a little while, espresso martini was like really everywhere. Negroni, but that's been a couple of years, I think. Sort of a classic. Yeah. Same with spicy margaritas everywhere. I don't know if there's a new one sneaking up. No, I know. That's why I had to bring in the peach. Yeah. Because there's something a little boring about the spicy margarita, but I can't deny it. I want it. I feel like it always starts in the States as well. So I feel like you'd know better than us. It's probably some protein thing. So I guess I'm ordering. Protein cocktails. Oh, right, right, right. Horrifying. Yeah, yeah.

1:04:21the protein stuff is too much it's like every internet recipe is like whey protein like look at it it'll do amazing things you put this in the microwave and it'll grow to the size of the microwave in minutes and then it's like I don't know they're trying stuff over there so I guess I'm getting another cocktail and for that cocktail I'm trying something else maybe I'll stick with the same spirit did you pick a tequila tequila tequila tequila tequila originally I did fuck it I'm getting a martini no this meal is chaos I'm going to allow it let's try your martini let's try a straight up dirty vodka vodka martini how many olives bare minimum two yeah and then three I respect

1:05:06James Acaster: anchovy you know I've never done it chuck it in there I've never done it I've never even I don't think I've even seen it I've never seen an anchovy martini I've seen an oyster oyster martini a whole oyster in there with the shell with the shell because that's where it's at yeah yeah yeah like I mean I feel like Ursula you know in Little Mermaid like that's what I really enjoyed about oysters like you know you just really feel like you're down there yeah you feel like you're the way that Ursula in Little Mermaid eats oysters yeah yeah and then doesn't she use something as a lipstick it's very it's like I can't remember what she uses as a lipstick she was great Ursula I was very scared of her when I was a kid incredible I used to pretend I used to do her numbers yeah alone in the basement Ariel's as well but you know poor unfortunate souls yeah

1:05:59James Acaster: so we arrive at the dream dessert this is where the ice cream chat I have two in mind okay this is where the ice cream chat comes back around oh wait I have three in mind okay I thought two seemed ambitious okay I'm thinking back to this dessert that one summer I got at this place I really like in New York, Ultra Paradiso, that I went like a lot. And it was, don't recall its name, okay? But there were strawberries. There was some kind of creamy ice cream type thing. I bet I could find it out. And then this other layer of sort of lighter cream and this sort of drizzle. It was just, maybe there was a little spongy something on the bottom.

1:06:38Okay, it was like, I'm going to find out its name. I'm going to find it out. It was incredible. But then I was just thinking, last night, someone was talking about, what is it called? Affogato? Is that what it is? Yes. Where the espresso is cutting through the ice cream. So what I like about that is it's an experience because it's not like a unified thing you're eating, right? It's sort of like something that's unfolding in time. Because you pour it and then it's starting to cut through the ice cream. Where do you put your spoon, right? like are you just going for a spot of ice cream that's been perfectly sort of cut by by a hot bit of you know what i mean like where do you where do you go where do you run where do you start and it's constantly developing yes and yeah i'd say personally yeah spoonful of the ice cream with the coffee on it maybe it's a bit of the coffee pooled at the bottom of the spoon that's my first bite the pooling is important the pooling is important then maybe I'm going for just a spoonful of coffee which has just had some ice cream start to permeate it so that's mainly coffee I'm trying to get all the different combinations eventually you're going to get to the point where half the ice cream's gone and then I'm leaving that for a little bit oh I thought you meant forever no not forever I'm letting it develop and then I'm spooning?

1:08:03I'm drinking I'm drinking like a creamy coffee oh my god I'm going to have to have that tonight I think some version

1:08:12James Acaster: there's a place called Brat and they do you have to go there they do an excellent espresso affogato with salted caramel ice cream and the espresso over the top is amazing and they do an oyster shell martini as well which is very delicious I mean you can't have any of those things Well, I'll figure it out. I'll make something happen. Do you not have any of that? Well, I mean, I can have anything because it's not, it's all just a choice. You know what I mean? That's why I'm not like, I'll say in a restaurant, like vegan because it is helpful to them. But like veganism is its own full on like kind of like moral stance.

1:08:53And I'm not trying, like newly plant based. So I can't like claim any. What do you feel like you, are you looking to upgrade to being able to call yourself vegan? and what steps do you think you'll have to take? I don't know because I don't trust that I don't read another book in a year and decide that something else is the way. You know what I mean? I'm like, I'm nothing. I'm a woman, you know, barely. Well, we'll see, you know, like I need to make any claims. Yeah, I was vegan for like nine months because I read a book that I thought was cool. Yeah. So right now, yeah, I get very... Meters for pussies.

1:09:26I used to be... Then you decided what? It was called Meters for Pussies, the book. Oh, genius. Yeah, yeah. Genius. I mean, they need to get, they got to break down the toxic ideals to get in there. That's very.

1:09:40James Acaster: So we're having that strawberry dessert. I'm still, I know because I can't remember its name is falling apart on me. But then I suddenly remembered it's very hard not to order a tart or a pie. It's on a menu. So just thinking about those again, but I'm going to stick with the affogato. Yesterday I had the best lemon meringue pie I've ever had in my entire life. My sister made it. My sister made this lemon meringue pie. It was from the Hummingbird Bakery cookbook. But it's the first time she had made it. And she was like, oh, it's a bit, there's some like syrupy, sugary, syrupy things happened.

1:10:12James Acaster: I don't know what. I'm sure when I make it in the future, that won't happen again. But there's a bit of that swimming at the bottom. I was like, never change it. Because it is soaked up in the pastry. So the pastry now is basically lemon meringue pie flavor. So the pastry on its own, if you had that on its own, it tastes like a lemon meringue pie. It's got all that syrup soaked up in it. It was absolutely delicious. It was the creamiest lemon tart. It was incredible. I love a lemon-based dessert. Well, first of all, key lime pie. Yeah. I mean, similar, right? Great. Like, you know what I love?

1:10:45And I always think of it like, in my mind, it's like a British. It's ginger lemon creams, these cookies. Oh, yeah. They're like, they're almost like a rogue interest. I feel like as a statesman. like oh like it's always like oh like i don't know like no one wants that you know what i mean but then i secretly want the ginger lemon cream like anything tart lemon a lemon bar when i see that that lemon you know that part of it like you if there's a bunch of like cookies or something with like a fruit center don't you just grab it and like like one by one like lick the delicious Just fruit part out.

1:11:21Not that I don't want the cookie there. I do. But like in a pinch. Yeah. But we can do that for you in the dream restaurant. As you're leaving, there can just be a line of those cookies lined up to the door, like a little trail of them. You can just eat the fruit out the middle. Yeah. Just thinking if I've missed anything. I mean, you know, it's an experience. It's like I was roaming down a street, popping into nine dream restaurants and trying things, I think.

1:11:46James Acaster: Okay. Well, I'll read your menu back to you. Oh, no. This is where it all falls apart. You can see how you feel about it. And this is locked in now, right? Yeah. You're trying to give me an out and I appreciate it. Well, I just, I feel like... This is locked in. I think it's locked in. I'll accept. Because I think we're about to watch you go through absolute turmoil when you get this back. Yeah, look at me, I'm bracing. Aquapanna, water. Yeah. Bread that you've had to fight over that's been fun on the floor. Yes, yes, yes. Oh yeah, that was a good part. You want a small tart, peach spicy margarita arugula salad slightly creamy tomato soup with a hand-torn crouton in it you want tangy tomato sauce pasta with anchovies and olives and capers you want a cruel vegetable on the side like a wilted spinach plain spinach you want a dirty vodka martini and avogato and like a lemon tart oh yeah and my berry memory that I can't quite access and the strawberry and the vague strawberry dessert did you call it a berry memory and you would like the berry memory your berry memory you could serve me yeah just like a puff of the memory like we'll serve you a puff of memory of course we can that's way more coherent than I've I know given how we got there I know I was expecting insanity when it came back it was like yeah it sounded fantastic I know it seemed a little tomato heavy perhaps but I can't I mean I'm not upset about that yeah yeah I'd eat all of that yeah apart from right and the puff of the berry memory yeah yeah yeah a vape someone brings a vape in so hungry and excited now thank you very much for coming to the dream restaurant Jacqueline thank you Jacqueline so fun to be here thank you

1:13:36thank you so much to Jacqueline for coming on the pod don't forget to watch Jacqueline's special get on your knees on Netflix keep an eye out for future gigs jokesnovac.com is where you'll find out details about when Jacqueline is next in the UK if you're UK based but if you're US based I'm sure she'll be near you soon

1:13:54James Acaster: and Jacqueline didn't say knees no so we didn't kick her out at the dream restaurant which is a relief yes a real relief which means you get to come and see my show freshhell edgamble.co.uk you're talking to Jacqueline when you say that yeah congratulations Jacqueline you get to buy a ticket for my show that's very exciting for you yeah big news yeah huge news yeah but thank you for listening or watching as some of you insist on doing yeah we'll see you again soon goodbye goodbye

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