Montaigne

0:00James Acaster: I'm on tour. I'm on tour until August. And there are still tickets available at jamesacaster.com. I'm looking at you, Glasgow, Belfast. Oh, there was somewhere else. Just please go on the website and buy tickets, please. Jamesacaster.com. Howdy, folks. This episode of Off Menu is brought to you by Boar's Head, the friar's turkey breast. Imagine a backyard tradition. OK. A sun-drenched afternoon, a massive vat of bubbling oil, and a man named Big Dave wearing goggles. It's a lot of effort for a bird. It's a lot of effort for a lunch, isn't it? Well, what if I told you that Boar's Head has brought that exact backyard tradition right to the deli counter?

0:41Well, I'd say, James, you finally lost it, and I think you lost it a while ago, but this is beyond the pale.

0:46James Acaster: Boar's Head brings to the deli the taste of deep-fried turkey. It's all the seasoning and that golden fried glory of the Friars Turkey Breast, but without Big Dave having to set up a perimeter in your garden. Oh man, that sounds genuinely incredible. Only from Boar's Head, Ed. It's basically craftsmanship you can eat. Speaking of which, you lot listening need to get down to your local deli counter and experience the difference Boar's Head makes. The Friars Turkey Breast in stores now. It's delicious. It's golden. It's the taste of deep fried. Boar's Head, committed to craft since 1905.

1:33Welcome to the Off Menu podcast. Peeling the tab of conversation off the Toblerone of friendship and really trying to break off a chunk of humour is the Toblerone podcast, James. I was just thinking about Tobler I'm so tired That is it Gabble

1:53James Acaster: My name is James Acaster Together we own a dream restaurant And every single week We invite in a guest To ask them their favourite ever Start a Maycourse dessert Side dish and drink Not in that order And this week our guest is Montane Montane James is a musician of course Fantastic musician One of my faves I discovered their music As part of my 2016 project And I went absolutely nuts Oh no way Hang on Now we've interviewed everyone from Strictly are we going through everyone you discovered in 2016 yes and it's going to be a long road my friend that's a lot of people that is a lot of people and every one of their albums I'd say has got better and better but with that in mind started well I loved the debut album yeah each album I've loved more and more loved the direction that their music has gone in and I absolutely love their new album It's Hard To Be A Fish I listened to it on the way over I loved it as well it's fantastic very excited to talk to Jess yes Montane's actual name yes about the album and also I don't know what kind of food they like even though we've worked together we've made food we've made food together no we've made music together yeah but that's not food food of life food of love is it the food of love if music be the food of love play on James one of us went to Durham the other of us doesn't know the difference between love and life actually didn't learn that in Durham did you not that's school that's basic Shakespeare that's nursery That's nursery-level Shakespeare.

3:19James Acaster: Yeah, it's nursery-level Shakespeare. That was on our blocks at nursery, on our letter blocks. We spelt it out. In Ketman, you get told it when you get a job. Yeah. When you eventually leave school and graduate, then they tell you your first bit of Shakespeare. Okay. I couldn't remember if it was love or life. Yeah. Music is a food of love, play on. Yeah. Well, there you go. And if food is the music of love, make me dinner. that's a new tagline for the podcast benito you got you got to put that out there so the world can hear it because that's a good tagline tell you what now and again i really tickle myself yeah yeah yeah well when we're trying to come up with uh there's a there's a secret ingredient in this podcast by the way where if the guest says it then we kick him out and we're trying to come up with what uh the monta what montaigne's one could be and ed was like it's montaigne uh is it Is it like a mountain in some language?

4:14It's not.

4:15James Acaster: But it was like, oh, Montaigne is like in French. It's like, oh, we could pick a Toblerone if it's that. And then we decided against it. And then immediately Ed starts talking. And it's pulling the tab off the Toblerone of his eyes. It's on the brain. He's still thinking about Toblerone. Bleep, it was in the queue. Got to get it out there. But the secret ingredient is not Toblerone. The secret ingredient is? Fish. Fish. It's fish. Because the album's got the word fish in it. it's there it's on the plate although I don't know Jess's eating habits I think that Jess doesn't eat meat but I'm not sure okay so there might be a vegan so there might be no way we can get them out there might be this might be yeah just like pointless yes we might as well have just said a chair you know but like vegans could eat a chair to be fair depends what the chair is not a leather chair no good point yeah so if there are only vegans in who have just tucked a napkin in their collar and about to eat a leather chair.

5:14Yeah.

5:15James Acaster: You might want to Google what's in that. You might want to have a look, you fucking idiot. Yeah. Montaigne is touring Australia in August for the 10th anniversary of their glorious Heights album, 2016. For dates and tickets, go to montaignmusic.com.au. This is the off-menu menu of Montaigne.

5:42Welcome, Montaigne, to the Dream Restaurant. Ah, thank you for having me.

5:46James Acaster: Welcome, Montaigne, to the Dream Restaurant. We've been expecting you for some time. Whoa. Yeah, thank you. Those are getting louder. Yeah, it has to get louder. Because if people have listened to the podcast before, they're going to expect it to be like, I've got to surprise them. Yeah. So you've got to go up in volume every time. Did you feel surprised, Jess? I was surprised. I was scared. Yeah. That's how we like our guests, right at the beginning. Yeah. To be very on edge. Really scared. like it's a horror film. And I love feeling this way, I've got to say. It feels good. Australians do very good horror films at the minute.

6:18James Acaster: Everyone's scared of that film. I can't really report on any of them because I don't watch horror films, but I do hear that they're quite good. Yeah. This new one, everyone's saying it's so scary. Which one? Together or the other one? Bring Her Back. Bring Her Back, yeah, yeah. It's the Philippou Twins. Yeah, that's right. I've heard interviewed and seem like really lovely just sort of puppy dog energy Australian boys. They seem cool. And then they make the most horrible films I've ever seen in my life. It's like that sometimes, isn't it? Sometimes people with the greatest levity produce the darkest things.

6:51It's like Hayao Miyazaki. He's like the most depressed man, but he makes these beautiful Ghibli films, you know? Yeah.

6:58James Acaster: Maybe that's why Ed makes very happy comedy. Yeah. Makes everyone feel good, but he's a dark star. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And Junji Ito, are you aware of Junji Ito's work? Yeah. Really happy man loves his cats and then writes absolutely horrific horror manga. It's crazy. Oh, really? Yeah, yeah. Why is it that Australian films, so it's either very funny character-led comedy or horrible, depressing, like gritty dramas where everyone gets hurt and it's just like so dark and everyone's in the bush and it's all horrible? That's a good question. I think, I don't know, we're a pretty isolated country, right?

7:35Like I feel like there's a lot of isolated sort of desolate parts of the land, right? Like we only populate the coastline and then when you get a bit more inland, it gets very sparse, gets very small populations. I feel like that's good fodder for that sort of like what's going to happen kind of situation. Like the roads at night, pretty scary out back that way because it's not very bright, like not a lot of lights and stuff. So it's a lot of, it's rich, there's rich, fertile soil, literally and figuratively for that kind of fiction, I think.

8:13James Acaster: Who's that? What's that? Was it Wolf Creek? Yeah. Again, not one I've seen, but yeah. Not seen it? That's one of those. Yeah. Just horrible country. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Disgusting. It's terrible. Yeah, those scary countries. Yeah, yeah. I hope I never go. Scary to live there as well, yeah. we also with our guests we like to immediately say that their their home is horrible yeah and scary that's what I'd say we do that with everyone it never makes the edit let's see if this does you're beautiful hosts beautiful yeah and the minute you're on tour in the UK how are you finding that you can say anything you like at this point yeah you can go for it yeah no it's been good I've enjoyed it audiences are good they're excited for live music which is like something that Australia is struggling with a little bit at the moment so it's nice to come to a place where people are like, they're buying tickets and they're loving it.

9:04James Acaster: They can't relax the Australian audience just thinking about all the horror. All of the Wolf Creek type stuff, yeah. Some backwards man from the bush is going to come in with a big axe. Exactly. No, none of that. It's always great, like, coming to a place that just, like, it looks totally different. I mean, actually, they're totally different. It's interesting because, like, obviously the British colonised Australia. So we've got some architectural similarities. and stuff. Thank you. I appreciate it. I don't know. I've been here before, so some of it feels more novel and some less. I went to Bristol yesterday.

9:41I really liked Bristol. Bristol's cool. Did also find out that that was like the hub of slavery. Yeah. And so there is, you know.

9:49James Acaster: But they push him in the drink. Swings and roundabouts. No, no, exactly. You know about that? I went to the M Shed yesterday, which is like the Bristol Museum kind of thing. It's all about Bristol. Yeah. And they have the statue lying on its side with the graffiti on it in a glass case. And they tell you all about it. I was cheering. I was like, this is great. Trying to push that in the river again. Yeah, exactly. Just trying to smash in the glass, trying to lift it on my own. Rolling it again down the hill. Yeah, yeah. Anyway, this is probably quite controversial for me to say, but I'm not afraid.

10:22I'm sure there's some Colston heads out there who are like, I love the guys. There was at the time. It was crazy. Oh, yeah.

10:28James Acaster: They pushed him in the drink. Actually, no one said, I don't think anyone dared say at the time that they loved him, but they tried to make the arguments about, well, it's history. Yeah, exactly. And what are we doing? And it's like, well, we'll put like, there's the same bit of history, but the good guys will make a statue of them. And then they had no answer for that. They were like, don't push him in the drink. Yeah, yeah. Stop pushing him in the drink. Yeah. No one used the phrase the drink around that time. No, no one? No, no one. It's James. Everyone would say that it got pushed in the drink.

11:01James Acaster: From what I remember. Well, that's good. I didn't know that they had it in the glass case. Yeah, it's funny. Can you remember any of the graffiti? No, I was just red. It was just like, I think maybe, I don't know if there was a placard saying what the red symbolized. I feel like maybe just like blood or just like, I don't like this guy's face, so I'm going to cover it with red. Well, that's the only paint they could find on the day. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, you could just be rushing down to the drink. grab some graffiti paint on the way no it was genuinely a very good exhibit well not just exhibit it was a whole thing there was lots of information there and I thought it was quite informative I'm in Bristol in a couple of weeks I'm going to go to that I've got to go and see Stu Goldsmith and get all the gossip about Edinburgh from him and then I'm going to go and see the Edinburgh gossip I have a lot of friends who went to Edinburgh and I can't wait to go back to Australia and get the gossip from them Who are your friends who went to Edinburgh and what gossip do you think they're going to have?

11:57I have a friend named Robin Reynolds who's a really amazing new stand-up. She's like a Brit, but she's based in Melbourne, in Australia, and I made friends with her. I just moved to Melbourne. Great city, loving it, and she's great. Do you know Zach Zucker? Yes. Yeah, I mean, I don't live near him, but he's a friend and I should probably probe him. So Zach Zucker and Robin Reynolds so far? Yeah. Okay. James is very excited about the fact they both have illustrative names. Oh, that's so true. I didn't even think about that. I know his brain works. That's funny. He can't wait. Let me see if I can rustle up another one.

12:32You try and rustle up some and James will definitely make up some. What? No, no, no, no. I wasn't making up anyway.

12:40James Acaster: Did you drink? Did you drink? Drink for everything. This is a drink-themed episode. I can't wait till we get to dream drink. It'll be so exciting. Yeah. those are my friends I got two friends two friends is good that's all you need I got two friends yeah Ed yeah and did you drink oh did you drink yeah cool not myself oh okay myself you can be friends with yourself yeah James can't famously friend of self not my cup of tea no okay he'd never write any shows if he was friends with himself oh so true yeah just sit around at home being happy no I get that yeah all my material this is from I hate this guy yeah yeah sometimes it's me that I'm talking about sometimes it's Benito and I make out like it's me but it's really something Benito's done tell us about your album it's called It's Hard to Be a Fish this is perfect yeah why is it perfect?

13:35James Acaster: because we've been talking about the drink oh yeah and now we're talking about another thing and now we're going to talk about the fish which is in the water and before we even start recording we're talking about My Octopus Teacher and you go to the Bristol Aquarium I love all things marine yeah Yeah. No, I, uh, the reason why it's called The Sound to Be a Fish, many reasons, but partly because when I started making the album, I lived by the sea in Coogee in Australia. And my partner at the time was like a full ocean swimmer, did like the two Ks out into the ocean and like would also go stalking and stuff a lot.

14:07So that was very much part of like my world at the time of making or starting to make the album and was like truly trying to tap into that when I was producing it as well with the sounds and stuff with just like lots of ocean and water samples and seagull samples and stuff like that. And then broke up with that person and moved out and my whole life changed completely. And then I had this like reckoning with like, I guess my family life. I don't talk to my parents anymore. Love them. god bless them that it's it's very complex uh and i do not wish any ill upon my parents whatsoever i love them but they just i can't have a relationship with them anymore and the album is kind of about that is about how just like my feelings swirling around that the grief of sort of having to like uh disconnect yourself from your parents while you're like they're still alive the sort of like resentment as well which like I have to acknowledge like there's a lot of anger there a lot of resentment but then also sort of the feeling of I guess relief as well I guess after the fact there's a lot of analogies in there about like being on a shipwreck and then floating in the ocean deciding where you're gonna go next like are you gonna swim back to that person are you gonna like find some new island and see what happens even though it's unknown and scary so that's sort of it's all it's all trying to incorporate this notion of like fish ocean ships like drifting in and out the oscillation of things um and and i guess like family life and just encompassing all these like experiences of my life so yeah crazy that's how you can start to

15:49James Acaster: like i think we get this with shows and stuff as well as comedy shows where you start to do it about one thing and then it becomes about something else but the initial thing still kind of bleeds into it still still carries on yeah even though they're not necessarily connected it's about to say that that's never happened to him i have no subtext something happens in my life and i directly talk about that thing and then it's the end of the show yeah yeah and then it's the next thing that happened yeah yeah chronologically jess yeah yeah i'm not fucking around by going back in time Yeah, no, like memories, you just leave them behind.

16:25No place in your life.

16:27James Acaster: If Ed was doing it, your album, it would be a very stark talking about being next to the sea and his partner swimming out in the sea. And then it would be, I'm not talking to my parents anymore. And then it would be, I saw a fish and I thought, it's hard to be a fish. Yeah. But they wouldn't be connected. Yeah, I see. Well, yeah, the extra layer for me with that is like, part of the way I started conceiving of like my relationship with my mom initially this is me when I'm like at my most like petchum like I'm a victim is like she's a cat and I'm a fisher I'm getting hunted man I'm getting hunted but then like when I started to think about it some more I was like no we're like all fish man yeah we're like all being hunted by someone or something we've all got our own thing we have to remember that and we have to try and you know be a bit more compassionate towards each other.

17:20And I'm, again, try to be that with my mum on the album. Try not to be just like, you're a bitch. You know, like try to also be like, no, you're a human being. A lot of stuff has happened to you. And you're a fish. You're a bigger fish than me. Yeah, exactly. You know, like, yeah. And also like, as a metaphor for queerness, like I am queer, I'm non-binary and I'm bisexual as well. And like fish is a term that's like slang that gets used among trans people sometimes as well. And I just thought it was like a, I liked it as an idea, like as a representation for Queerness as well, because there's also a lot of like interesting stuff happening in the ocean,

17:57James Acaster: like seahorses, the males get pregnant. That's cool. I like that. You know, I think the ocean, there's a lot of things in there that reveal to us that the world is not very clear cut, right? Like these ideas of like gender and biology and stuff are not just like, male and female and the genitals happen this way and the mind happens this way it's like there's a lot of different stuff that happens down there and also within human beings but i think human beings find it harder to accept difference among themselves sometimes you know what i mean yeah so i thought you know the fish metaphor and analogy yeah let's get into your dream menu we'll start with still a sparkling water i was talking to my partner about this i I was like, in the dream restaurant, can it be both like high-end and lowbrow?

18:47You know, like what kind of experience am I going for? And I think I'm going to go for both. And in this, but on this course, it's highbrow, so it's going to be sparkling.

18:56James Acaster: So you see the sparkling as the fancy? I think so. It's like when you go to like a fine dining restaurant, like, I mean, they offer you both, but you go for sparkling. You've got to go for sparkling. You've got to do it, I think. Yeah. Even if you don't like it. I think it's that's just you gotta get the full experience yeah oh you think that's immediately you're like on the train to like highfalutin yeah on the train to highfalutin if you're paying if you're paying that much money you're getting the sparkling water and I don't know this is something I don't know about these restaurants is like how do they source the sparkling are they doing it themselves are they getting just like a San Pellegrino are they like what is it I don't know but I have to assume that it's like the good stuff, whatever the good, it's like the best carbonated water, you know?

19:44James Acaster: Because they're not bringing out San Pellegrino at that place, they're bringing out a plain bottle. Unmarked bottle. No, exactly. Unmarked bottle that is sparkling. And I've never actually thought about that. No. I've like, where's that? Yeah. What have you decanted into there? Yeah, what are the origins? Or have you made it yourself? Yeah, exactly. But usually those places, they'll describe every course in detail. So you'd think while they were pouring the water, they'd be like, and we made this ourselves. I don't know. Well, maybe that's the thing. is like maybe the lack of mention means it's actually quite cheaply sourced.

20:11Would that disappoint you if you sort of, the door to the kitchen swung open and you saw it was like the cheapest sparkling water available? Yeah, it would. Yeah. I'd feel like annoyed at myself as well that I'd been convinced by the surroundings that everything was fancy. Yeah. Yeah.

20:24James Acaster: There was a TV show ages ago that Penn and Teller did. So Benito will know about this. Yeah, yeah. Called Bullshit. Remember Benito? It's called Bullshit. Okay. And one episode they opened a fake restaurant that was like fancy fine dining restaurant. But in the kitchen they were just making everything with like cheese whiz and cheap things from the supermarket. Going out explaining to the customers how fancy it was and how they're made. And the customers were like, oh yes, this is incredible. And they're obviously filming with secret cameras and being like, these people are morons. And I think about that a lot when I'm in those.

21:03James Acaster: whenever I've gone to a fancy restaurant and they've explained how great it is to me, I might be on Penn & Teller's bullshit. And I've got to not. They might have recommissioned Penn & Teller's bullshit. They might have recommissioned Penn & Teller's bullshit and said, only if you make it episode for episode the same as the first time you made bullshit. And I'm here eating cheese with on a Ritz cracker. Your ego is wild sometimes. Huh? You're just out in public going, they might be filming. They might be. Truman Show. Yeah. Truman Show and Bullshit. I think I might be on both at the same time.

21:37James Acaster: Yeah. This is like, I'm on the Truman Show. It's Bullshit's a show within the Truman Show. Yeah. They're doing, yeah. Yeah. They've done a hidden camera show. How many shows are in the Truman Show, do you reckon? Yeah, good. Well, because it's supposed to be like a sort of squeaky clean 1950s style America, really, isn't it? It's like the idyllic American dream. So how many channels do you reckon it has? So it's probably not many channels. Yeah. Yeah. It can't be watched it. How much extra TV were they making for this one man? If maybe he hadn't got out, maybe they would have done a Truman Show within the Truman Show.

22:07Yeah. So he was like watching someone else have the Truman Show done to them. Jesus Christ. That's crazy. That's a good sequel. That's a good sequel.

22:15James Acaster: It might have been a good way to convince him that he wasn't in the Truman Show. What about a Truman Show sequel? It's kind of like Squid Game. Have you guys seen Squid Game? Yes. You know how he goes back to the Squid Game? What if there's a sequel to the Truman Show where he made another Truman show. He was the director. He did the Truman show. But then when he's the director up in the moon, he finds out they're making a Truman show of him. Or. You're going to have to delete this, Benito. Yeah, Benito, they're going to try and get this from us. Oh my God. They're going to try and get this from us.

22:45James Acaster: Hollywood. It would be good. I mean, he would at least be, even if they weren't making a Truman show of him, surely he's always going to be paranoid. So surely when he escapes the Truman show, it's a happy end in that film. but surely the rest of his life he's like I actually don't see it as a happy ending how do I know this what you don't see it as a happy ending no I find it really depressing he's just like looking at the door yeah you're like what's his life going to be like now yeah yeah well I guess yeah I didn't think of it like that yeah does he get like a pension for the rest of his life or something like some sort of compensation like does he good point is he put up for the rest of his life surely because he doesn't have a real job I mean he's writing I guess he's got qualifications though he's writing a book though isn't he yeah oh yeah Yeah, no, totally.

23:28That book is... He's an influencer now. That's a bestseller. Yeah. You're right. He's just doing the talk shows for the rest of his life. The circuit.

23:34James Acaster: Yeah, yeah. He's got to be talking. But he'd always be thinking I'm still in it. He'd always... He'd hate it. He'd be thinking, how do I know this is real life? Yeah, exactly. He could remake Dumb and Dumber. What? Because he looks exactly like that guy. He comes out, sees Dumb and Dumber and goes, hey, I could be Lloyd Christmas. Yeah, yeah. Remake all those films. Yeah. Schmunking. the mask the mask yeah yeah but what if he was a bad actor that would be very annoying for him to be a bad actor yeah do people say smoking in Australia Australia I don't know I've probably heard it once or twice but it's not common yeah it's a shame pop-lums or bread pop-lums or bread Montane pop-lums or bread what do you say pop-lums or bread oh yeah this is funny I was talking with my partners I was doing I was doing my homework with my partner.

24:27I was floating all this in. That's good. We like to do that. And we were saying, this is not a question you would ask in Australia. Or here, to be fair. Oh, yeah, I can't see. Only on the podcast. Oh, only on the podcast. Oh, I see. I thought maybe because Indian food is quite common here, that it was a good British thing. Yeah, definitely. Papadums are very popular here, but you wouldn't ever ask the question of papadums or bread. Yeah. For me, bread. For me, bread. I eat papadums very rarely. I like them when I have them, but when I go to India, I don't get them every time. it's a sometimes thing for me but bread is as a vegan especially an all the time thing what sort of bread are you eating all the time and then what's your dream bread for the dream restaurant sort of bread I'm eating all the time is a sourdough we've got access to quite good just like supermarket sourdough it's quite good, a brand called Sonoma I don't know if you've heard about this but it's like quite good stuff it's not like the best at the supermarket but it's amazing when you get it at the market or something, it's really good But anyway, I'll get that a bunch because I do a lot of like heavy toasts, you know, like quite liquid heavy toast and then you pop it on and like just the simple white bread is not going to carry all that.

25:37Talk me through the concept of a heavy toast. So like... Liquid heavy toast. Never call an album that. Disgusting toast. Hey, you can call an album anything and I stand by that. You can come up with an analogy for liquid heavy toast, I reckon. Yeah. Actually, the more we say it, the more I would buy an album I make a lot of bean type things that I plop onto toast. So like kind of a baked beans kind of situation, but there'll be cherry tomatoes in there, maybe some kale. And then on top will be like some pickled red onions and like a lot of herbs and like some lemon juice, salt, pepper, chili flakes, and maybe like some avocado or hummus or garlic sauce or something on the toast.

26:20Sounds good. All of that on the toast is very heavy.

26:22James Acaster: Yeah, it is. That's a liquid heavy toast. Yeah, yeah. I don't put it on the side. I put it on the toast and then you just go, just try to fit it all in. And this is a thick slice of toast. Well, relatively. You can, because I'm slicing it myself at home. Like it's got the loaf. So sometimes it's thin-ish. But sourdough, you can never get it that thin. You know? Sure. Have you ever tried like a really thin slice of sourdough? Really thin slice of sourdough. Well, because it has holes in it as well, right? So if you get a holey bit and then you try to cut it thin, there's no bread. No, exactly. Yeah.

26:52James Acaster: I had some well what was it last week went to a restaurant and their bread was they'd crossed cross pollinated sourdough and a croissant so it was like the outside was crispy like sourdough but the inside was this like croissant kind of thing so it wasn't any holes but it was like very fluffy and stuff on the inside and that was that sounds good that's interesting do you want to shout out where that was yeah I can't remember what it was called it was in Valencia in Spain shout out to all my Spanish friends. Huge ups to Spain. Yeah. But Benito's trying to Google it now and see where. He's probably quite good at this.

27:31James Acaster: I could have just looked at my phone and been like, oh, it was called this because it'd be in my calendar because we reserved. But I've left it in the other room. So I'm trying to do that more now. But then you realise there's never any time in your life you don't need your phone. And I should have, I'm just going to have to surrender myself to it forever and just accept that I'm addicted to it. that'd be that sucks I hate it you know if Ben can figure it out we'll all be quite impressed with him I think the name Ricardo was in there somewhere Ricardo well I'm guessing you sure that wasn't the name of the waiter could have been the waiter I've gone with the waiter quite a lot bar Ricardo could have been it wasn't a bar I do think they should list the waiter's names on the websites of restaurants with a little picture like a cast for a play yeah that would be good don't you think you can look forward to seeing them on your way yeah it's true know all the big names yeah can go in get there Ricardo's not gonna be here today for fuck's sake it's the reason we came yeah oh man do you have a favourite waiter that you've ever had that's a good question anyone who sticks in the head favourite waiter I had a pretty good one last night I went to just like a ramen place in Bristol and the guy was he was really friendly he was just really nice a lot of energy and good service you know one of us went to the bathroom right at the beginning and he sort of came up and he was like, does anyone have allergies?

28:51And we were like, oh, we don't, but we don't know if the other guy is. And he's like, I'll ask when he comes back. And then he came back and he asked and he remembered and did his due diligence. Yeah. And I was like, that's good waiting. That's good waitstaffing.

29:02James Acaster: I thought you were going to say you went in after. To the bathroom and followed him in. But then about the other guy, well. Anyone have any allergies in here? Yeah. You're in the cubicle, your friends say. I don't know you're well enough. Smells like you've got allergies, buddy. If you don't mind me saying. my wife is allergic to pineapple oh yeah so whenever we go to a restaurant and they say does anyone have any allergies she always says I'm allergic to pineapple and I'd say every other time the waiter would be like okay well that'll be alright we don't have pineapple she's like yeah but I don't know you don't have pineapple no exactly if I don't say it then it's gonna come up literally if the pineapple comes out they're like well why didn't you say because most of the time people roll their eyes and say yeah exactly We've got to write Spongebob.

29:46James Acaster: That's it. Spongebob's not allergic to pineapple. I know, the last person you want to be allergic to pineapple. The absolute idiot. If he's allergic to pineapple, Spongebob. Built his house out of pineapple, fucking idiot. Yeah, especially under the sea. Yeah. Could have avoided it. Do you want your liquid-heavy toast, like, as your bread course, do you want it to be with all the stuff you usually put on it? No, well, again, if it was a fine dining place, I would just want the really good focaccia with the sea salt and the oil and maybe the balsamic vinegar. I think that's the best. I think that's the best part of the fine dining.

30:22It's the fresh, warm, made bread.

30:26James Acaster: That's really good. Well, yeah, we'll absolutely hook you up with that. But I'm a bit sad to see the liquid heavy toast go. I do. Well, I can have that at home. I'll have that at home, you know. I mean, yeah, I guess for the dream restaurant menu, it is sad. Yeah. But we'll always remember it in our hearts, you know, at home. Maybe another guest will pick it. We've had guests pick things that they've heard other guests say that they've not had before. Oh, interesting. So maybe there'll be a guest in the future who will have listened to this. Like a heavy toast. That might happen. Like a heavy toast could be coming back.

30:57James Acaster: It's out there in the world now. Yeah, yeah. Your dream starter, your menu proper. No, I love vegetables. I really love vegetables. like a really well done vegetable is like the best thing ever, I think. So I think for me, my like starter, and again, this is like kind of a lot of, a lot of my menu is in the fine dining sort of realm, it seems, but like leek, like a really nice leek, a really nice fennel and a really nice celeriac, just like a threefer of those, like just done really well with like a little sauce and a jus. I reckon fennel I've had how do they do it like a roasted fennel that's good and then the celeriac sometimes they do celeriac like it's a kebab kind of thing have you ever seen that yeah and a lot of purees as well yeah a lot of purees oh yeah that gets pureed to fuck yeah that poor guy the celeriac must be like fucking hell how did we get here I'm going is that again yeah every night that is to me lovely You're like the kebab version.

32:06Yeah. Just really freshly done nice vegetables with the jus. Yeah. I think that's...

32:11James Acaster: How are the leeks being done? The leeks, I never know with leeks, really. Just like whatever's the tastiest and the most lemony. I like it when a leek is lemony. Okay. How do you feel about it being charred to fuck? Oh, yeah, I like that. A leek charrs very well. I like that. I like that. I like that. I like that. Did it even mean to say it? No. I leak it a lot I leak it a lot there he is again I leak it that's true that's the Truman Truman it is Moose play in Lloyd Christmas no Truman listen we said you've got to say I like it a lot I leak it a lot I leak it a lot you're fine Truman you're so bad at this you're the worst actor ever you look exactly like him but this is not you can't keep saying I leak it a lot these are three things that I think we haven't had shouted out in the podcast very often no true They don't get shouted out.

33:05People generally, I find myself often the odd one out in any situation where we're talking about eating because not many people love vegetables. It's not a comment. It's not a comment. I really like, I love them. And I love them more than like when I have a vegan burger, for example, I always want there to be like more lettuce on it. I have a thing. Do you know, do you guys know Subway takes?

33:29James Acaster: Yeah, I love Subway takes so much. Oh, fucking hell. you have no idea how you just tapped into something that is currently my entire world that's why I left my phone in the other room all I'm doing is watching subway takes all the fucking time man it's so funny have you seen Nish's impression of the subway takes yeah yeah yeah Nish just puts on I've heard Nish just puts on shades and tends to be subway takes he looks a bit like him he looks a bit like him but it's funny he puts on the shades and says I'm subway takes yeah that's all you have to do so your subway take my subway take would be I think that all burgers, everyone I've said this to disagrees with me, all burgers should come with a pile of shredded lettuce on the side, just like extra lettuce, so that when you're eating a burger, if you want to top up, you can.

34:19And also, because often the burger will leak some sauce on the plate, you can just mop it up with the lettuce, and you can just have a nice sauce of lettuce. 100 % disagree.

34:27James Acaster: That's what Subway Tech can say to you. I think this is a good idea, partly for people like me who are really into lettuce. I love lettuce. I think it's really good. Yeah, plain is fine, but with a sauce, it's just the best, I think. Like lettuce on a taco and you get all the sauces. It's the best. But yeah, I always want more lettuce on a burger than there ever is. And then I feel like, I don't know what the rate of going through lettuces at restaurants, but because it is just like a, I don't know, I feel like you can get a lot of it out of a single head of lettuce, right? If you're shredding it thin as well.

35:04Precisely. Surely they have so much leftover and that does not stay fresh for like, you know, more than 12, 24 hours or whatever. Shortly. Like I can't imagine a good restaurant is using the same lettuce as yesterday's lettuce. You know, so you got to get rid of the lettuce. So like, why not, instead of wasting it, just put a little extra on the whole plate for everyone, you know?

35:25James Acaster: Yeah. I think most restaurants may as well shred that lettuce straight in the bin. No one's getting it. They're using it as a garnish or something like that, but they're doing so much chopping it up. When I worked in little pubs and stuff in the kitchens, I was chopping lettuce most of the day and then I would just watch it 10 minutes later come back through the door, be put in the bin before the plate goes in the pot. What is the point of my job? So definitely I think if you are a fan of lettuce, you should be able to say at the start of the meal just so you know, I love lettuce so much that I would request that instead of scraping it into a bin you put it on my plate.

36:02Maybe that's the modification, maybe that's my take. It should be socially acceptable and free to ask for extra lettuce at the beginning of your burger. Well for your dream meal for every course we can happily bring you an extra bowl of lettuce because we've got loads back here. We've got loads. I'm excited. How do you feel about a grilled lettuce? Have you had that before? Grilled baby gem lettuce. oh you know what I think I've had that I think it was okay yeah but does that ruin something about the lettuce for you do you like the fresh no I like it all I like it done all the ways nice yeah except for soggy soggy's gross soggy's nasty

36:38James Acaster: what about with a burger when the bun is lettuce when they do that no I think that's stupid really I thought that would be so you need no you have to have bread you gotta have the bun oh okay I'm a bun guy as well yeah okay there's gotta be bun too Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I think. Every time I see it on a menu, I'm like, I know this is for someone who's got some sort of dietary thing, but it is not for me. Okay. It's not for me. Oh man, I thought it was going to be so up your street. No, no, no. This is perfect. No, just in the burger's fine. Or on the side. Fair enough. Yeah. You fucked up, man.

37:10Yeah.

37:10James Acaster: Fucked up big time. You don't even know me.

37:21James Acaster: Your dream main course. I've struggled with this and I actually don't know if I can like pick the definitive one like that's really hard for me I think because yeah it just it really just does depend on the day right like for me but I've what I've gone with is something I make at home quite a lot actually which I think is just the most delicious thing and I love having it and my partner as well who isn't vegan but will eat just eats vegan with me at home this is like his favorite thing and he loves it and it's a lentil bolognese. It's really good. There's this one recipe that I found on Pinterest that he put a cup of red wine, maybe two cups of red wine in there.

38:03Just really nice. Is it brown lentils? I actually can't even remember if it's just brown or if it's your red. I don't think it's red. It's almost certainly brown lentils. I don't know. It's just really tasty. It's really rich. I think it's honestly better than a regular beef bolognese or minced bolognese or whatever. These big words. Yeah, I do think so. A lot of people. And it's less like you can eat a lot of it and you don't feel gross in your tummy, which is really nice. But I can eat so much of it. It's so delicious and it's so cheap. Just make it at home and it's the best.

38:44James Acaster: It can't just be brown lentils and red wine. There's other stuff in there There's onion Actually, is there even onion? I think there's onion There's got to be onion in there There's got to be garlic There's got to be tomato Yeah, diced tomatoes or crushed tomatoes or whatever it is And, you know you put like whatever you want parsley on there or basil or whatever you like Spaghetti Spaghetti, yeah Or you can do fettuccine as well if you want No one's going to stop you? No, no one's going to stop you although I always I really cook with fettuccine because I find it always sticks together and I don't know what the solve for that is.

39:19There's probably a solve. There's probably someone on YouTube who's like, here's how to do your fettuccine without sticking. A lot of people say olive oil in the water. Oh, interesting.

39:26James Acaster: I was about to say, I bet Ed knows the solve. Yeah, right. I thought everyone knew olive oil in the water. No, no, no. Everyone knows it. Ed, you think that everyone knows your little life hacks but they don't. You got a... It feels like a 90s thing, olive oil in the water. It's not a 90s... It's a 90s mum thing, olive oil in the water. The best of us watching Friends. Yeah. In the 90s. I was busy getting born. My mum was cooking pasta. Yeah, busy getting born. Someone screaming at you as soon as you were born. All I'm all in the water. Yeah, my mum played that on a tape recorder while I was in the womb just so I'd know.

40:00Make sure it was internalised from the get-go.

40:03James Acaster: In case you had fettuccine one day. Obviously not good enough because I didn't remember. Yeah. That's a shame. But Ed's mum made it very clear. All I'm all in the water and then throw it against the wall to see if it's... Would she do that? No, I don't. No, she wouldn't do that. I would do that because I think I read about that and I just wanted to throw stuff at the wall. Yeah. Are you throwing it like against just a normal wall or like a... A clean wall. A wipe clean. Yeah. Not a whole, sorry, not a whole portion. Do you know we're aware of taking one strand and throwing it at the wall and if it sticks, it's cooked, right?

40:33No, I'm not aware. Are you not aware of that? No. That's another 90s thing, sorry. You're not throwing the whole portion of spaghetti against the wall and then scraping it back into the bar. That's what I thought you were doing. I was scared, honestly. I'm already, I'm starting the podcast scared and I'm continuing to be scared. Yeah, yeah. And you thought it was the scary one. No, you take one strand and throw it against the wall. I mean, I don't do it anymore, but it was fun when I was a kid. Yeah, right. On the ceiling, just leave it there. That would be fun. See how long it stays. Throw it on the ceiling?

41:00Yeah, for a laugh. Crazy kid. Oh, cheeky. Ever get stuck? Ever get stuck over there? Yeah. Can you reach it? No, just wait for it to, to sort of peel itself off throughout the day. hope it drops on my mum's head and I'm in the corner giggling

41:18James Acaster: one of my favourite things is just Ed as a little kid hanging out with his mum I find very funny I can't really like describe why but every time it's Ed hanging out with his mum and it's the idea of him waiting for the fettuccine to drop on his mum's head at some point is just funny I like that that's that's your relationship I was a prankster oh yeah I put itching powder in my mum's bed Oh my God. Got it free with a B now? I was going to say, it's so Dennis the medicine. Yeah. He's got to be involved somehow. Yeah. I think she went out and there was a babysitter and I put itching powder in the bed and then the next morning my mum was like, I could barely sleep last night.

41:54I was so itchy. I was like, yeah. Itching powder will do that, mum.

42:01She was not happy. Oh yeah, I bet. She did not think it was a laugh. Oh my God.

42:04James Acaster: I mean, I don't want to like, you know, be one of those people. You wouldn't get away with that now. you couldn't give away itching powder in the Beano surely what do you mean itching powder's been cancelled surely surely surely comics aren't allowed to like just give away stuff that like a bag of itching powder to kids now that they can use on people did you get your bag from a comic yeah from the Beano from the front of the Beano that's what the Beano is sorry the Beano is like a like a kids comic that's been around for like decades yeah right and all of these sort of is it a person legendary no so the Beano's the name of the publication and then there's like Dennis the Menace oh you're saying comics like okay so not a comedian like comedians yeah I'm not a comedian you thought Beano was a stand up comedian it was really weird actually when I was a kid this guy came around he was like I'm a comic called Beano have some itching powder stick it in your mum's bed thanks Beano thank you Beano Beano's so funny any other kids live around here I've got more itching powder than I know what to do with it's a comic book Dennis the Menace is like the main character I see he's like a kid but they never really specified his age that's the Beano okay but that's what Dennis the Menace looks like in England so he's from the Beano in other countries Dennis the Menace is like a blonde little kid but like yeah black spiky hair and a stripy red and black jumper and a dog called Nasher and knobbly knees and a dog called Nasher guess who's been in the Beano more recently the Beano's still going yeah guess who's been in it us really that's really cool probably the highlight of my career wow like as little characters yeah just in the sort of foreground of the first panel of a Mini the Minx cartoon we're in a restaurant that's cool it's been given a cheese board and I'm angry about it yeah damn we're very very happy about that very exciting So fettuccine or spaghetti with your lentil bolognese.

44:11Yeah. How are we feeling about vegan cheese, vegan parmesan situations? There's actually some good ones nowadays. They're hard to find. You can't really get them at a supermarket. But there's ones that are like, they're not the same as the sort of like shaved parmesan. You can't get the shaved stuff, which that's the nice stuff. But like stuff that's just like a kind of graded one, they're doing a pretty good job of that nowadays.

44:33James Acaster: So would you add that to your lentil bolognese? Yeah, I would add that. yeah definitely and for your dream meal do you want to make it this is made by you no someone else has to make it but someone has to use this recipe who would you like anyone in the world can make it oh no Beano my partner but he has to get better at cooking oh yeah well this is the dream restaurant this is the thing my dream is that my partner cooks for me more no it's not it's not probably a problem if I say heck he and cookie cooks yeah but like he he's not good he's not he's he like when he when we were not together and he was living alone, he would just do packet soup or noodles or whatever.

45:10He does not cook, even himself. He's not one of those people. He doesn't enjoy it, doesn't look forward to it. So I do most of the cooking. I do enjoy it. Sometimes I'm like, oh, I can't be bothered. And we just order takeaway. We actually order a lot of takeaway.

45:26James Acaster: What was your go-to takeaway? Is that a place in Melbourne? I'm pretty fresh to Melbourne. So it's like we're still developing the repertoire. but if I lived closer to it I would probably order from I don't know like Veggie Bar a bit more it's like this place in Fitzroy in Melbourne that's like vegan vegetarian mostly vegan they have just like a range of different stuff like they've got a burrito and they've got pizzas and they've got like some Asian dishes like a pad thai or like they just do a range but it's all vegan it's pretty good it's big portions nice yeah it's back when I it's been so long since I've been to Melbourne.

46:05James Acaster: But when I was there, really the main option for vegans that everyone was talking about was Lord of the Fries and that was it. Yeah, right. It's not as big anymore. No? It's sort of, it's still around, but like... That name grosses me out though. Lord of the Fries. Yeah, crazy. Crazy thing to name yourself after. It's a pun on flies. Yes, but also it's... And on children who kill each other. Sure. But it's mainly the flies thing that puts me off. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that book is like, that's just like light reading in Australia. Yeah, that's right. That's right. That's not everyday life. That's every school experience.

46:37James Acaster: Good on them. Good on the kids. Yeah, exactly. Was that your Australian accent? No, it wasn't. But like, good on those kids. Well done for killing each other on the island. Good on you. We've been testing a lot of Australian accents on the tour bus because we've got some Scots. We've got a couple of Icelandic fellas. We've got just ranged. I'm the only Australian and they're really bad. Yeah. I think the only person who's good at it is one Scot. And occasionally he'll say something. I'm like, oh, that's quite good. but not full sentences just one word they're really struggling yeah it's funny I like it everyone thinks they can do a good Australian accent yeah I think so too until you speak to an Australian and you go to their face yeah and then you're like oh it's just not no I think it's quite hard actually I think it's just very it's not it's not very intuitive you know I almost find like a classic Californian accent it's like I think it's quite easy because well maybe I'll do it it'll be fucking shit but like because you just like you like roll roll your r roll your r's like you you just like stay in this kind of like rounded place and stuff and like that is quite good you know like yeah yeah but but because australia it's like i'm trying to think of any word that like is hard to say like i guess it's just anything that's like ah like hard or like although you guys have the R a little bit ah oh you're ah are you ah that was my Australian oh that was yours ah had yeah sort of sort of maybe yeah you can be honest with Ed that that was yeah it wasn't good no thank you it wasn't good thank you yeah yeah

48:20James Acaster: your dream side dish yeah side dish is hard I think because I think it would just be like more vegetables really it would just be like I recently had there's a place in Melbourne called Smith and Daughters which is amazing I've got the cookbook actually it's really good really good cookbook yeah it's no surprises I still get surprised by him all these episodes in a guest mentions it's a good cookbook where they're from yeah what and he just he's got the cookbook yeah yeah there you go well they're like serious business like the vegan food they do it is like kind of fine dining-y they also have a deli that's like just sandwiches or again all vegans so delicious it's so good but they have this like fine dining restaurant um and i recently went there and had this like roasted carrots like blackened carrots thing just had the most delicious sauce on it i wish i could remember what any of the other ingredients were on it i think maybe hazelnuts might have been in the mix or something like that but fuck it tasted so good like i couldn't believe it and i was so upset I had to share them with the other two people at the table I was like I want to eat all of this I was like that guy I think you should leave I'm going to eat the whole thing I wanted to be that guy when he houses his bird yeah yeah yeah exactly so you're going to kill the president I almost turned into that in that moment I was like these carrots are so delicious precisely Yeah.

49:52But no, I thought I'll be civil. I'll be civil. I don't want to alienate these people that I've been releasing my album with. Sure. I don't know if they know me that well. You could order more though. You know, that is so true. I really could have. And I didn't. And I don't know why I didn't.

50:08James Acaster: That's the move to be like more carrots. Fuck, why not? This is classic Ed Gamble life hack because definitely... Ordering more. Yes. Because so few people would do that. But in the early days, I think Ed did not like it if it had to share and the thing was particularly good especially if I liked something yeah yeah we'd be keeping tabs in his head how many carrots everyone's had but now it's just like just orders more but you do that as well I see that as an Acastle move oh interesting to be like we should get more of this or for the table for the table that's really nice yeah this never occurred to me I don't know why I'm like that happened it's done now forever forever I can never go back never go back always forward like a fish exactly well no I think the other consideration for me is actually I have quite a tiny stomach is the other thing.

50:52Right. Is like I really have to meet out my, I have to pick and choose how much of any given thing I'm going to have because I'm like, well, the next course is coming and I don't know how big that's going to be. And like, if I like that, I'm going to, you know, that is the thing that I juggle sometimes. But I do think like vegetables very, they don't take up much space. So I definitely could have ordered more of the carrots.

51:14James Acaster: Yeah. Most of them are like, some vegetables are going to be, a marrow, for example. Marrow. That's going to take up a lot. A whole marrow? Yeah, if you eat a marrow. Yeah, right. I don't know if we get those in Australia. You have a marrow in Australia. It feels very British though, the marrow. A marrow, yes. What, is there another word for it? Look it up, Benito. Oh. There you go, that's a marrow we're showing you right now. For the listener, Benito is showing Jess a picture of a marrow. We don't get this. We just get the zucchini. We just get the zucchini. Which marrow picture did you get? It says there that the zucchini slash the courgette is like an immature version of the marrow.

51:54So immature. Yeah. Put itching powder in its mum's bed. Yes. Got for a peanut. Now I'm a marrow, of course, I would never do that. I was a little zucchini.

52:06James Acaster: You were doing that quite frequently. I've just got marrows in my head because my partner and I stayed in a hotel and there was only one channel on the TV. We basically booked in a nice hotel we're looking forward to. We got there and the receptionist said, welcome to the hotel. It's flooded. And we're like, okay. We couldn't get hold of you. So we just booked you into another hotel down the street. Oh, whoa. Oh, okay. And they went, it's just fair warning. It's not like this hotel. Okay. Went down the street. Yeah, this isn't very nice. We're looking forward to that nice hotel. This isn't a nice one.

52:45James Acaster: I guess there's going to be a few emails after this to try to sort out. Did they give you your money back? Yeah, yeah. It's so crazy that they booked for you instead of just being like, hey, when you get here, we'll let you know that you have options. Whoa. Yeah, because we got there quite late. It was like 10 in the evening when we got there. And they were like, we couldn't contact you. And we were thinking, sure, when we booked this. Put contact details into all the bookings. Yeah, sure, you could have, but whatever. Got in this other place, fucking dump. and then send us up to our room TV's got one channel never seen that before like everything else just was coming up what was the channel what was it was this in Valencia by the way no this is in Glasgow on the way to somewhere else we had one night there we were going to the Isle of Mull which is a little island off of Scotland so we had to break up the trip go to Glasgow go to this other place go to the room one channel it's Dave which you won't know Dave it's called You and Dave now which is yeah but like basically repeats of stuff right mainly that you're in yeah so we turned it on me and Ed actually yeah I turned it on it's a Mock the Week compilation right from years ago from like 2014 2015 so like 10 years ago yeah so I turned it on and it's a compilation as well so it's like loads of different clips of all us and our friends when we were just starting to be on TV so it was shit right absolutely I would have liked it shit where we're so unfunny and our hair looks nuts.

54:17James Acaster: That was the main thing I took from it. I was like, whoa. We were, we all did not know what to do with our hair. Yeah, no. At that point. You don't when you, I mean, how old are you guys? 40. Yeah. I mean, when you're at that age, like, you don't. My hair's the same as it was then. No, it's not. Is it? Go and watch it, Ed. You think it's the same. Did I have the fade, the proper fade in it? yeah but also it's just like it's like it's like an ai version of us now yeah because it's like someone's putting and so the ai can't quite do our hair right so it's like that's kind of ed's hair but not really it's not right yeah it doesn't work yeah so it's really weird watching it and seeing all of our hair apart from hugh who looks the same as the old man who's on it um but like but yeah i turned it on and it was us and there's a picture of the week they always do it's really weird having explained what's a week to someone who's not seen it it's a really weird show actually and they go it's a picture from the news this week and what's happening in this picture and they put it up and it was Jeremy Corbyn who at the time was leader of the opposition of the Labour Party and he's holding a massive marrow and that was the picture we had to be funny about so I've got marrows in my head now and that's why I brought up a marrow that's a long way of saying that's why I said marrow earlier the marrow feels like a very British vegetable because I imagine they have like marrow growing competitions in small villages and stuff village fates which old lady can grow the biggest marrow yeah there's a lot of that it's a wonderful country yeah we're very proud of it I feel that I'm getting that sense but these carrots sound nicer yeah they were pretty fucking good honestly here we go oh my god yes black carrot herb yogurt Aleppo pine nut butter not hazelnuts crispy shallots I think that was it that is great that sounds so good a vegan yogurt a vegan pine nut butter it was wonderful that sounds great I've got to get back into that cookbook imagine if they're in there they're a very new menu but there'll probably be something else to do with carrots yeah there might be a carrot in there we'll find another way of doing a carrot throw the carrots at the wall see if they stick yeah

56:29James Acaster: now we come to the moment I've been most excited about dream drink did you drink did you drink shout out did you drink if you're listening did you drink my uh my drink's like pretty um basic I think it's just a bloody mary I love bloody mary I love tomato honestly like close second tomato juice yeah I love tomato anything I think a bloody mary and this lentil bolognese I hope you're tucking a napkin in yeah oh yeah oh yeah and don't wear white oh yeah no no you look like one of those statues that got pushed in the drink you'd be happy to be pushed in the drink quite frankly yeah have a bloody wash no exactly no i yeah honestly countless times i've gotten some of that little bolognese on the couch the couch is just it's not in a good way and it's not a good way because i do get the stain remover out i put it on and i don't we got a new couch because it's like a sofa bed couch so we can have people stay on it and for some reason this couch like you put the stain remover on and then and the stain remover patch leaves a mark.

57:35Yeah, yeah. Like, it gets out the shit that it was meant to get out, but then, like, the wet mark is there still. That's the trade-off. What the fuck? It lets people know that, look, it looks clean, but that was a stain. No, no. It's fucked up. I hate it. Guess what it is. Guess what you're sleeping on. Yeah, yeah, literally. I saw a tweet the other day that's really stuck in my head. I mean, I'm not on Twitter anymore, but just people post things on Instagram. Yeah, yeah, screenshots. Yeah. and it was it seems to have done really well it got like thousands of retweets it was a very old headshot of Tom Hardy yeah when he was really young and someone had said I bet I bet when he was a kid he went crazy on that spaghetti and someone went what do you mean he went he just looks like a messy spaghetti kid if you look at the picture he really does look like because he's so clean and clean cut and wearing a white t-shirt he really looks like he's a messy spaghetti kid tempting tempting he used to eat loads of spaghetti

58:29James Acaster: Yeah, so it's really in my head and I don't know why. Bloody Mary is an excellent choice. Spicy? You have any spicy? Yeah, I do. I love spice and it kills me every time. It's so funny. I eat a lot of banh mi as well. Honestly, banh mi close second as well on the dream menu. Eat a lot of it. I get chili every single time because I just don't think it's the same without the chili. But every single time I'm like snot down here, tears, everything. And my partner's like, why do you do it to yourself? I'm like, I have to. it's a high completely relate it is when you have it without it is like this is boring yeah it's like what's the point yeah what's the point you do need that yeah and especially like especially if they don't put enough vegetables in of course you gotta have enough cucumber enough herbs enough of the what is it is it daikon the pickled daikon or something they put that in the carrot love all that stuff that to me is the best part of the banh mi is the vegetables of course yeah and then like obviously you need well honestly I've had a lot of salad bar n'mees and they're good on their own I think even without a protein I'm happy with that plenty of chilli and where's the best place you've had a Bloody Mary on one tour that I went on a particularly long tour part of it to just keep it interesting was can we find the best Bloody Mary and where to get it which is eventually in a hotel in Birmingham that I've forgotten the name of so that was a waste of time but like it was really nice but like where have you found the best one and what is the criteria for you of a good bloody mary i actually did have a really good one recently but i also can't remember where it was oh man i i think for me yeah a lot of tomato juice like heavy on the tomato juice i think because vegan ones are different as well it's like you don't have this like worcestershire sauce or something like i don't know what they put in instead generally i'm not sure i think maybe they just skip that and put maybe like some olive brine and some other stuff in it and stuff like that.

1:00:28James Acaster: You don't go heavy on the accoutrement? I like a celery. I like a big stick of celery. People fuck around with Bloody Marys too much, though. Yeah, I think sometimes they do. I think because it's already so powerfully flavoured. That's why I like the celery because it's a nice, clean palate cleanser type thing. It works. It's a classic. It works. But anything else? People put bacon in it. Bacon? Yeah. But I mean, this obviously doesn't cross your path anyway because you're vegan, but people put bacon in it. Little burgers. Have you seen that before? Oh, this is just becoming a meal. Just have a pasta.

1:00:58In the Bloody Mary. Just have like a spicy brownie pasta. They have a puranesca at that point, you know? Put a blubber in it. Yeah. It's like the savoury version of freak shakes. Yeah, of course. Freak shakes, what's that? They do like milkshake, but then they'll put like whole cakes on the top and like brownies and shit, and they'll put so much sauce, but on the outside of the glass, so you can't even pick it up. It's just a gimmicky thing, isn't it? It's just an Instagram thing. Yeah, God.

1:01:24James Acaster: Although as soon as you said about putting pasta in the Bloody Mary, I thought it was a good idea. I'd love that. That is a good idea, actually. The burger and stuff sounds disgusting, but if someone was like, do you want a full load of pasta in this? I'd be like, yeah. Well, that's just like cut pasta, isn't it? Like you could just do that at any time. Yeah. You could just put pasta in a glass and just have a sauce in there and that's what that is. But that would be fun. It would be fun. Spaghetti in the bottom of a Bloody Mary and then you suck it up with one of those boba straws. Oh, my God.

1:01:50I would choke instantly. Oh, come on. You know it was coming. I took on the boba and this fucking spaghetti is just going to shoot straight up. It's going to go so far down. And then I'm just, it's like fishing it out. It's going to be crazy.

1:02:05James Acaster: We arrive at your dream dessert. Yeah. Do you have much of a, what? Do you have much of a sweet tooth? I have a pretty sweet tooth, but like I can't hoof it like I used to. Like when I was in my 20s, I would eat so many sweets. Like I loved it. and now, I don't know, the older I get, the less – I can have like three bites of a thing. I'm like, okay, that's good. Like I enjoyed that and that's enough, you know. And anymore I start to feel sick nowadays. But there have been some things I've eaten where I'm like, I could eat the whole thing. And one of those was, again, Smith & Daughter's tiramisu that they did, vegan tiramisu.

1:02:43That was one of the most delicious things I've ever eaten in my whole life. It was so good. Wow.

1:02:48James Acaster: Was it very creamy? Did they get a really like thick cream on it? Yeah. Yeah. And they actually do this, like you can just buy it from the fridge and you take it home. And I did that as well. And it was as good from the fridge. Oh, great. It was really good. It's crazy to me what you can do with vegan food. Yeah. It's nuts. Especially in the area of like desserts and sort of impressions of dairy. Yeah. It's incredible. It is incredible. It's nuts. It was very not available even probably like five years ago. Yeah. Like it's crazy. Yeah. I feel very glad. Especially I do like the thing I really like covet when I like walk past a bakery, like a lot of the very nice like tarts and just like the very fine looking well made ones that look quite tough to make.

1:03:34And like you don't get a lot of that with vegan. When you do, it's like, I don't know, just like so stodgy and like shit. you know I hate it and like but I feel like we're inching towards possibly a future where I could have something like that oh yeah like a little dome little chocolate dome with a little crust on the bottom oh yeah like a mousse sort of yeah that would be nice yeah I watch Bekoff a lot like Australian and my friend do you know Tom Walker yes yeah he's hosting Bekoff now it's so fun is he yeah in Australia

1:04:06James Acaster: yeah do you not know that yeah it's really funny how does that work for the listener Tom Walker is an alternative comedy clown. Yeah. He's a real freak. He's a crazy guy. Yeah. I've seen him make himself vomit on stage before by shoving his hand so far down his throat that it just happened. And so that's his typical shtick. Yeah. And then... He's hosting Bake Off with Rachel Koo. Do you know Natalie Tran? Yeah. Yeah, Community Channel. Do you ever heard of YouTube Community Channel? No, I've not. Yeah, they're co-hosting. It's really fun. Yeah, they've dressed him real preppy. He's got like these nice cardigans on.

1:04:46That's insane. It's very bizarre.

1:04:48James Acaster: It makes no sense whatsoever. It does because Noel Fielding is on our Bake Off, which is basically the same situation. Yes, I guess so actually. Yeah, when you say that. Yeah, yeah. I once went to Sydney and it was when Tom Walker, Sam Campbell and Aaron Chen were hanging out constantly. Like you'd see the three of them. They were never separate. It was always the three of them and now they live in three different countries, I believe. But it was all three of them. It's a difficult conversation to penetrate as well. Yeah, yeah. Hey guys, how's it going? Okay, you're not normal, bye. Yeah, yeah, all three wacky guys.

1:05:23James Acaster: And Sam, because I was there for a couple of weeks and Sam had said to me, you like music, right? And I was like, yeah. He went, can you make me a mixed CD before you go home? I was like, I don't think I have the, I mean, I can make you a playlist and you can figure out how to get it onto a CD. Does it need to be a CD, Sam? Yeah, it does. did it he gets the CD by then thank you a few years later sends me a video of him Aaron and Tom laying on the floor listening to the CD in full and every now and again Aaron would say something like Sam does James like music? and he'd go yeah and then they'd all carry on listening to it really earnestly it was nice but it was weird yeah sorry you were saying oh what was I saying yeah you watch a lot of Bake Off oh yeah I watch a lot of Bake Off and I'm always like, God, I wish I could eat that.

1:06:12Like always, I'm just like, fuck, it looks really good. They do vegan week now and again, don't they? They do. And they did on the Australian one have a vegan baker and they were quite good. I don't bake at all. Like I've never touched it. I don't know. I've baked cookies a couple of times and every time I'm like, God, this is a lot of effort, isn't it? And it's also very messy. It's like cleaning afterwards. And there's people who can do it and you just buy one thing from them. Yeah. Bakers. Yeah. No, literally. Yeah.

1:06:39James Acaster: And how are you meant to resist eating the mixture? Yeah. If you're making it. Exactly. That's unreasonable. Especially for choc chip cookie dough. Like that's delicious. No way that all of that's making this way onto the tray. No. And also I'm pretty sure it tastes even better as the mixture. Just raw. Definitely. Yeah. It definitely does. Yeah. Yeah. So like. Yeah. That is honestly. Well, yeah. Tiramisu. I like it a lot when I have a really good one. But choc chip cookies are like. that was the thing that when I went vegan I was like oh man because like I would do when I was like I went vegan when I was like 18 and when I was like 16 I would when I went to the movies I'd go to Kmart which is do you guys have Kmart?

1:07:21Yeah I know what that is we're aware of Kmart yeah but it's not it's you know much bigger thing in Australia but we went to Kmart and you get

1:07:28James Acaster: Rain Man gets his trousers from oh my god I was ironically said that's exactly how Rain Man would bring it up as well Vegas is underwear sorry but you could at the time get like a box of chock chip cookies really good ones I think the brand was called like Decadent or something like that for five dollars big box I just take that into the cinema just how was the whole thing just eat the whole thing it was the best yeah those days definitely couldn't eat like 24 cookies in one sitting anymore but do you reckon oh I don't know it's easier in the cinema though maybe how was that easy in the cinema yeah because it's dark yeah yeah get it down it's like it's not you doing it no yeah yeah it's not you doing it yeah exactly I'm in the film and I'm taking these cookies and I'm posting them into this hole yeah yeah not connected to me in any way it's in the dark yeah you don't know what's going on yeah yeah then the lights come up and then it's bad yeah then you look at the crumbs you look down like oh god that was me all along yeah my favourite part of the Drake and Kendrick beef were you following that last year A little, not closely, but I was hearing, there was hearsay.

1:08:40James Acaster: It was brilliant. Yeah. Sometimes they let themselves down. But it was mainly brilliant. And the best thing about what Kendrick was doing was bringing up stories and not a lot of people knew about Drake. And the best one was that once when Drake was in the cinema in the dark, a member of T.I.'s crew was in there and pissed on his leg. And Drake didn't do anything about it. and he just put that in a song that he just got his leg pissed on in the cinema just like during the film a guy just went over to him and peed on his leg that's the thing when it's in the cinema though this is my point it doesn't feel like you're completely you're dissociated from your own being because you're in the film so if something takes a pee on my leg I wouldn't notice you're not dealing with that until the lights are up yeah yeah you don't have a body as far as you can say in the cinema yeah I'm putting crumbs on piss again which one of you did it this time remember TI TI I'm looking at you and your crew because this is piss on my leg again all the way down I know it was one of you TI and your crew why do I keep coming to the same screenings as you cookies are so decadent they were and they were yeah well if anyone ever got in a beef with you they could say that say you used to go to the cinema and eat a whole thing of decadent cookies and really shame you publicly about it.

1:10:04No, I'd own it. I'd be like, and I'd do it again if I could.

1:10:08James Acaster: Who would you like to get in a beef with? In a beef with? And that's a vegan. I know that's difficult. In a tofu with. I once someone made that joke at me, they were like, oh, no, it was my tour manager at the time. He was like, oh, it's not a meat and a greet. It's a tofu and a greet. I was like, ah. That's funny. Yeah. Yeah. What I like to get in a beef with There's many things to consider You've got to write songs about him You've got to have enough Yeah that's the thing Stuff on them Enough dirt That you can write decent tracks Where you can bury him Yeah And it's going to be someone also That like can't Like I could I would say like Elon Musk But then also I feel like He could actually change my life For the worst If I did pick Pick on him You know what I mean Yeah You almost want someone Who you'd be friendly with afterwards After the beef's done Yeah yeah no exactly And then you can sort of raise each other's profiles by being in the beef.

1:11:00Yeah, precisely. Exactly. There can't be someone to, yeah, it's, I don't know, like a feist.

1:11:07James Acaster: Oh, perfect, yeah. Like feist. Feist is due a revival. If only just because I want her to acknowledge me and recognise me and know who I am and then we can be friends afterwards. It's funny if the beef turned into that, your songs were just really about how you want to be. Yeah, that's a funny beef. Yeah. It's a funny beef to be like, you suck. Hello, I'm here. really like you. Yeah, exactly. Surefire way to get someone's attention is to start a beef with them and see what happens. So maybe, maybe they won't mind too much that you were ragging on them and then you become friends. Maybe that was what Kendrick was doing.

1:11:43James Acaster: He afterwards contacted him. So are we friends now? You fucking, you could be a pedophile. You kidding me? I can't be your friend after that. But it was like a beef. I was wondering, you didn't notice me. Well, yeah, oh, mission accomplished. I noticed you. My whole life is in fucking tatters now. I just said you were short in a couple of the raps. You come back at me with that. My legs are covered in piss. People pissing off me in the cinema now? That first story didn't even happen. I'm going to read your menu back to you now. See how you feel about it. You would like sparkling water. You would like focaccia with olive oil and balsamic and sea salt.

1:12:21James Acaster: Starter. Leeks. Fennel. Sleriac. With a jus. All cooked perfectly. Yeah. Main course, lentil bolognese cooked by your partner. Side dish. But he can cook it well. He can't in this scenario. He can't cook it well. Not in real life. Yeah. Not in real life. Yeah. Maybe one day. Yeah, maybe one day. I'll get him there. Blackened carrots from Smith & Daughters is your side. Drink, Bloody Mary and dessert. Tiramisu also from Smith & Daughters. They've done very, very well out of this podcast. That does sound good. How do you feel hearing it back? I feel good. I like all those foods very much. Yeah. Yeah, that's why I picked them.

1:13:00I also think it builds nicely as a menu because you're saying you have a small stomach and can't manage that much food. I think you've got such a nice light starter. Yeah. Then a heavier pasta dish. Yeah. And then it's the big sort of rich blowout at the end of the tiramisu. Because, yeah, I am a person who's like, there's always room for dessert. Like, even if I'm really full, I'm like, no, I can force it. I will. And so, yeah, like the bolognese will be a bit heavy, but like I will eat the tiramisu. sounds so good

1:13:27James Acaster: well I love that thank you so much for coming on the podcast pleasure it's been fun any other business? business I'm on tour and then god what else have I got going on yeah I got my album my album's out you can go listen to it I'm an independent artist so I'm relying on like Bandcamp and Patreon and stuff now like you know you can stream the songs but what does that do? no one makes any money from streaming absolutely no money no zero money I don't think I've ever made any money from streaming like in the well I've left my label now I've not made any money from my time with my label despite having really big songs.

1:14:01James Acaster: Wow. Yeah, it's crazy. Anyway, yeah, that's my stuff. And then, I don't know, Twitch stream. I play video games once a week on Twitch. Yeah, that's fun. What's your favourite game to play on the Twitch stream? Well, honestly, I usually do music production. I make songs on Twitch live. That's cool. Yeah, it's fun. But I'll change up games because I don't... It's hard to just stay on one game on Twitch because I love playing games and if I'm starting a game that's quite long, I'm like, well, I don't want to just play it when I'm logged on to Twitch. I want to play it all the time. So I'll never do anything that's crazy or anything.

1:14:37Yeah, I don't know. Just like puzzle games. I did it with Charlie for a bit in lockdown. Charlie did Twitch streaming and we played Hitman on stream. I was really bad at it. So that's what it became about. Running around, fucking up the hit.

1:14:54James Acaster: I don't know. That would be fun viewing. I've seen Ed not be good at stuff. He doesn't take it gracefully. I don't like it, Jess. Not sure that would be a fun Twitch stream. It's not a nice feeling for me when I'm not listening. Yeah, got you. I see. Yeah, yeah. But luckily, I'm brilliant at podcasts. And what an episode this has been. Oh, yeah. Thank you very much, Jess. Oh, my pleasure. Thank you, Jess.

1:15:23thank you so much to Jess aka Montaigne for coming on the show James

1:15:28James Acaster: a lovely menu yes nice to get some shout outs for especially those vegetables in the starter that we don't often get shouted out on the pod well I didn't bring it up at the time because it didn't feel right one of the vegetables James was fennel yep you fucking hate fennel I do and any other guest that said that you would have gone mental about fennel being on there but you respect Jess's music too much. Yep. I left it. It's too early in there. James tries to play it really cool when musicians come in. Yeah, I do. Yeah. I do. They got off and come cool, man. I had nothing to add to the conversation outside before the podcast.

1:16:01Yeah. They were talking about beats and stuff.

1:16:03James Acaster: Yeah, we were talking about beats. Not Beat Truth, Benito. Benito doesn't know what we're talking about. He heard beats. Yeah. Beat Truth by Dre. Might as well be speaking to Dwight Schrute over here. Not talking about beats, mate. Benito is our Dwight Schrute he's very much our Dwight Schrute but instead of like talking about martial arts he's talking about roller coasters it's good you could sort of copy and paste roller coasters into all of the dialogue about Beat Tricks instead of talking about Beat Farm and he's talking about magicians I've just realised that's why we take a photo after the episode because it's like a roller coaster that's why he likes it we should put our arms in the air he keeps telling me put your put your arms in the air he keeps saying please put your arms in the air the guests are I'm not doing that who's this guy Montaigne Jess did not pick the secret ingredient which was fish which obviously wasn't going to happen because very early on we learned that they were a vegan so they're vegs why was that going to happen yeah but you know it's good to we've got a lot of secret ingredients over the years we'll have to choose loads more it's good to just be able to use fish because like the broad ones it'd be good to start using them they're dangerous and I don't want to chuck a musician out because I want to be cool around them yes talk about beats talk about beats and they won't let me do that if I just kicked them out of the restaurant thank you very much to Montaigne for coming on the pod go and have a listen to it's hard to be a fish yep and don't forget Montaigne is touring Australia in August for the 10th anniversary of their glorious heights album 2016 came out in 2016 for dates and tickets go to montaignemusic.com.au you check out their tour dates make sure you can see them live if you can yeah thank you very much goodbye goodbye