Fall Movie Preview Part 2 with David Canfield, Plus Charles Melton on Beef's Generational Battle

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0:30Hi, everyone. I'm Katie Rich. This is the Prestige Junkie Podcast, and today it is part two of our fall preview series. Joining me again is my colleague, Chris Rosen, to talk about the indie labels of studios. There's got to be a better phrase for this. We're going to talk Searchlight, Focus, Sony Pictures Classics. And joining us for this round again, David Canfield of The Hollywood Reporter, favorite person to talk about awards with who isn't Chris Rosen. It's so nice to have you back, David. Hello. I love that label. Hi, Katie. Hi, Chris. Hey, David. Well, I feel like you specifically love talking about like focus features in Searchlight.

1:02These are all labels. My dreams. I know. You got me at the right time. It's all upon us. We'll talk about all three of those and what they have in the Oscar race. And after all of that, you'll hear my conversation with Charles Melton, an Emmy nominee this year for his role on Beef. All of that and more coming up. Welcome to the show. All right, Chris, I jumped right over you in the intro because I was so excited to hear David talk. But you too also love Focus Features and Searchlight and Sony Classics, right? I love it so much. They're my favorites. I love a studio indie label, whatever you want to call it, because I'm just like, they make the good stuff.

1:38A lot of times, maybe you guys have experienced this in journalism, but it's like you do this stuff you have to do, and then you do the stuff you like. And sometimes the stuff you have to do is like, I'm aggregating a news story or whatever in the past, right? And then it's like, but I really want to write about. I have no experience with this at all. Yeah, I've never written about X, Y, and Z. And so like this is the studio indie labels are like the X, Y, and Z that you really like. And then you're putting out Spider-Man because you have to, but maybe Spider-Man is good too. So it doesn't matter.

2:01So Sony has to put out Spider-Man, but their true passion is the only living pickpocket in New York. I mean, speaking for myself, that's how I would run Sony. So yes. Well, and we're in an interesting position where there's a new one. Warner Brothers announced Clockwork not that long ago. And I mean, I don't know how you announced that while also being in the middle of an acquisition, like what we're supposed to anticipate there, But it'd be very nice if we have four, you know, Paramount Vantage, Good Old Days, Warner Independent. We're down a few from these. So I'd love to have more of these coming in.

2:30Yeah, I think that they were in the mix for the invite at Sundance. So they've definitely dipped their toe into the, you know, festival, buyer's market and all that good stuff. But nothing this season. Well, yeah, we'll be skipping them for now, but hopefully we'll have them to look forward to. And I don't know how to divvy these up, but maybe to start with Searchlight, which has, from my count, the fewest titles that we'll be talking about in the Oscar race. Really just two, but two very big ones. And I think at this point, David, you are the most likely of me and Chris to have heard from people who have seen things and heard tell.

3:05And you can tell us how much you're allowed to say about any of these. But Wild Horse Nine, I will say, that's the Martin McDonough movie. It's the one that I've been hearing the most of. Like, I heard from someone who had seen it or I had saw a thing. We saw a trailer so early on. And I feel like it's a lot of us are assuming it's a sure bet in the Oscar race. Is any is any of that misguided based on what you're hearing, David? No, it is not. I would say I'm probably embargoed from, you know, what I have maybe seen. But I feel comfortable saying that because Searchlight is clearly really confident in this movie.

3:40And quite a few journalists have seen this movie, at least in L.A. and I think that there's just a general bullishness around the fact that the movie is really well positioned in an otherwise very thin Venice lineup for example Martin McDonagh's Oscar track record of late has been really really strong and there's just a lot of different narratives I think for the movie to ride and carve out its own lane as a pretty strong player yeah Chris after coming off of Banshee's of Inish Aaron which felt like weirdly slept on despite having gotten all these Oscar nominations. Like, does that just put McDonough in this position to launch even further with this one?

4:16That's what it feels like. I mean, the putting out the trailer like right after the Oscars this past year. It really was like the same week, wasn't it? Like flag plant you could do. Yeah. They're obviously incredibly confident in it. I have no reason to believe that it won't be great based on, again, like people we've spoken to maybe have seen it, maybe not. It looks great. Like Dave was saying, the narratives, there's just so many great narratives in it. John Malkovich, Steve Buscemi, Sam Rockwell, McDonough again, right? Like all these people who are either beloved by the Academy or maybe need to be beloved by the Academy.

4:46Parker Posey maybe getting an Oscar nomination. You know, like there's, it's a wealth of narratives to me. And like, bring it to Venice. And if it's early in Venice, likely then maybe to Telluride if it could come there, like after it premieres at Venice. And then, you know, we'll see if it hits the other festivals. yeah it just feels like their number one priority and probably the best bet to get multiple nominations I mean like picture maybe director screenplay actor supporting actor multiple times over etc etc yeah David have you if I throw out you my theory about all the Lebowski supporting actors just having we'll talk about uh several of them you have not but I have independently become very very very invested in this narrative I feel very strongly about it I think it like could happen.

5:31So yeah, that's really exciting. And we're obviously including Julianne Moore as well. Well, and we're talking about, we were talking about this with Joyce last week about like supporting actor, multiple nominees. And I kind of just realized just now that Martin McDonough is kind of the reigning king. He's the guy. He's the dude. Yeah, he did it twice. So like, that's Buscemi and Malkovich. Again, David, whether or not you can confirm or deny anything. Buscemi and Rockwell. And Rockwell is supporting Malkovich's lead. I believe, yes. Interesting. Okay, this is what I That would be my impression, too.

6:03I've not seen it, but just based on the trailer, it seems like that. That would be it. And then you could have the two supporting actresses, too, maybe. And again, with Guessing Games, we don't know if it's going to be at Telluride because it wasn't on the TIFF lineup, so we didn't get that as a hint, but we know it will be in Venice. Correct. Yes. And McDonough is a pretty, you know, he's the kind of filmmaker who plays very well in Telluride. Searchlight really likes Telluride. They tend to take their movies there. So assuming the scheduling works out, which really is always the thing with Venice, is you have to be able to get from Italy to Colorado in a matter of hours.

6:40Assuming that works out, I think, yeah, it's a pretty safe bet. Well, also thinking about the Middleburg Film Festival, where David, you and I went last year. Like those regional festivals where movies can just play over and over and over again. And it seems like McDonough movies play there well, and this one might be a good candidate for that too. Yes, Searchlight, I believe, won that festival with Rental Family. Is that right? Wow, that's good lore pickup. I think that they did. Well, I was thinking, obviously, preparing for this conversation, last year was a rough year for Searchlight. They did not have anything break through, and they kind of tried to play everywhere across the festivals and over the fall.

7:20So I wonder if part of that Wild Horse 9 really, really early launch, because, you know, having been in that first look game, I can't remember running a first look as early as our lovely friend, former colleague, Rebecca Ford, did right before the trailer. Like, that was a really early launch. And I do think it was maybe just a clean slate. Great movie. Here we go. This year is behind us. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, The Testament of Anne Lee did premiere at Venice, but Searchlight didn't have it until fairly late in the game. And it feels like kind of a classic example we think of now of the early mover advantage.

7:54Chris, you and I talk about this all the time. And Wild Horse Night is not the same as Project Hail Mary in terms of getting out there really early. But it does seem like that Venice premiere, if you know you've got a strong movie, can only benefit you from there. Yeah, definitely. Yeah. Well, I mean, on the opposite side of then, I guess, Behemoth, as minutes before or minutes into this recording, announced that it's going to be the centerpiece premiere at the New York Film Festival. and I'm looking at the email now, I don't know if it, Oh, October 2nd. So that will be the date for it, which is not late in the grand scheme of things, but is, you know, getting past the Venice TIF Telluride corridor.

8:30I don't know if any of us really expected this like world premieres at New York film festival had become more rare in recent years. Is this just like a composers, Lincoln center boom kind of thing? I know it's an LA movie. Like David, does this make sense to you as a premier for it? I'm thinking about it. It's interesting. I mean, we're still processing this news. Definitely. I think it shot fairly recently, so that could have something to do with it. You know, they did have Is This Thing On as a New York premiere, Searchlight did last year. I like that movie a lot. It just did not go anywhere.

9:07That was, though, I think because, you know, Bradley Cooper was racing to finish that movie and it was not done in time for the early fall festivals. So I don't know. I think there's so much affection for Tony Gilroy coming off of Andor and the cast, you know, led by Pedro Pascal, people like Olivia Wilde in the movie. I remain really, really excited for it and hopeful, but yeah, it's not where I would have expected that movie to launch. Yeah. Chris, is it a good zag? Yeah, I guess so. I mean, I think it's definitely, it feels strategic in terms of getting away from Wild Horse 9 a bit, like we were just talking about, right?

9:43Because you're going to have, like, it doesn't make a lot of sense that Behemoth may, let's just say Wild Horse Knight does go to Telluride. It doesn't make a lot of sense that Behemoth would also go to Telluride. To me, if you're going to have the two from the same studio there and kind of competing and maybe in the same categories where it's competing. Well, the studio is bringing multiple movies to Telluride all the time, though. True, but I guess, like, in terms of, like, if the big play for this is, like, Pedro Pascal, best actor, versus, like, John Malkovich, best actor, I don't know, it feels like they do have to figure out a little bit of a balance and what will work.

10:10So I think having the data points of Wild Horse Nine already going into New York with Behemoth and then seeing how it pivots off of that is good. It also feels a little, you could see like based on, I don't know what New York has been doing lately in those centerpiece screenings or whatever. I'm like, it does feel kind of interesting, I guess. I don't know. Like last year was father, mother, sister, brother, which is Jim Jarmusch. The year before was The Room Next Door. That had been in Venice though, I think. Yeah, so not world premieres. None of these are world premieres. Priscilla was Sofia Coppola in 23.

10:40All the Beauty and the Bloodshed in the centerpiece spot. Power of the Dog. Nomadland in 2020, which doesn't really count. Marriage Story, which was not a premiere. Roma, not a premiere. Wonderstruck, Todd Haynes, maybe. Was that in Venice or was that, I'm not sure. Oh boy. That may have been a premiere. 20th Century Women before that. Steve Jobs, An Inherent Vice, which I think was the premiere in 2014 if you go back like the last decade or so. Yeah, I don't know. It's an interesting spot. Those are good movies, not always hitting with the Oscars, maybe hitting in different ways. I mean, trying to read the tea leaves off of that.

11:13But Tony Gilroy does, even though I'm sure the movie's very L.A., it seems, he does feel like New York coded just because of Michael Clayton, even though that's not really true. And I wonder if he'll be able to play into that. He feels Gorman coded to me because of Andor. Sure. Thank you, Katie. Yes. Do we have any sense, so the trailer came out. We have trailers for both of these, which is nice. And I know I floated the theory, like partly unjust, but who knows? So like Olivia Wilde gets a supporting actress nomination and a best director nomination for The Invite. Who knows? I mean, she does pop in that trailer.

11:43But have we heard any scuttlebutt about who else besides Pedro Pascal would be a play for this movie? I've heard good word on Olivia Wilde, which is not shocking. She's having a good year. She's having a hell of a year. She's also amazing in the Gregoraki movie. Yeah. Man, Olivia Wilde and Anne Hathaway both having a good year. There's something here. Like maybe this is just me and my like women in their 40s. Like we're doing it. Some sort of cultural reckoning. We've all escaped from the 2000s intact and we figured it out. Okay, so it seems like we all agree Searchlight is very likely to have a better year than they did last year for many reasons.

12:16Yeah, definitely at least one Best Picture nomination, right, for Wild Horses 9. And then we'll see how Behemoth plays multiple acting potential director as well. We'll see. So I'm excited. Good for them. All right, well, then let's ask that same question of Sony Classics, which has like a pretty substantial slate. But as far, I mean, so there's Bunker, which we don't know a lot about. That's the Florian Zeller movie with Penelope Cruz and Javier Bardem that's going to, it's world premiering at Venice, right? That's right. And I believe it's going to TIFF as well. And we don't know anyone who has seen it or who can admit that they have seen it.

12:49I know some, you know, people on the studio industry side who saw it because it did pre-screen pretty aggressively to find a buyer and ultimately did. I think Sony Classics acquired it. If not last month, earlier this month. And I've heard it's like a really strong acting showcase. I don't think it's going to be the father, but I don't think it's going to be the son either. So that is an enormous middle ground. The twin poles of Florian Zeller's career. Yeah, an enormous middle ground, and we shall see what that means. But yeah, I have heard from a couple people who've seen it. I mean, because Bell B.

13:23Cruz is also having a hell of a year. She's got the invite out there, and Lobola Negra's coming around the bend, and then Javier Bardem's the beloved. I know it's on a festival lineup. I can't remember if it's coming out this year. That was his big hand movie where he's a lead actor. So just an interesting year for both of them to see what pops. But to me, the most interesting Sony Classics title is The Only Living Pickpocket in New York, which premiered at Sundance. I did not. Did any of us see it as part of Sundance this year? No, I'm dying to see it. I'm so mad I missed it. Show us the movie.

13:52We are all, I have asked to see it. But again, to get back to our Lebowski guys, this is John Turturro in a lead role. He got, I mean, the Sundance buzz is so hard now. And I don't know if you guys have counted this too. Like there's a movie that people really like, and then you feel like, oh, that movie didn't really pop. And then it can swoop right back around and get attention once more people see it. And I don't know if that's a travel to Sundance thing, but it did feel like this got exactly as much energy as it needed at Sundance to now go play every single fall festival and do Blue Moon.

14:22Basically just do the Blue Moon playbook all over again. Can they do it? The weird thing about this movie is that it premiered really late at Sundance. And so, you know, a lot of people in our world who normally would have seen a movie like this did not see it. But I remember reading the reactions and just being like, oh, this narrative is painfully clear for Turturro. And I'm already far too invested. Barton Fink is one of my favorite movies of all time. I'm very, you know, I think John Turturro is one of our more overdue actors for this kind of, you know, moment. Yeah, it feels like the Blue Moon playbook is exactly where we should be going with this, which is to say, I think Telluride, I don't know if it's going to Telluride.

15:03I actually have no idea. That feels like a really good potential place for it and for Turturro to start, you know, just getting out there, being charming, talking about the Knicks and whatever else he wants to talk about. That can only help him. I did give him enough credit for the Knicks bump. I was talking about Chalamet and the Knicks bump, but Turturro is right there. He is listed as a Canadian premier in the TIFF lineup, so I think Telluride is a very strong guess for that one. Well, because it was at Sundance, It was a Sundance movie. Oh, you're right. It's hard to know. They don't always take Sundance movies, but I think they would, based on history, I would say this has a very strong potential to be in Telluride just based on all these things.

15:37Well, I mean, for me, that's where Ethan Hawke happened. I mean, when Blue Moon premiered in Berlin, I think Andrew Scott won an award out of Berlin. And, you know, there just wasn't that much chatter about the movie or Ethan Hawke. And then when people started seeing it in Telluride, that was one of the performances I heard the most about on the ground. Another good example of a Sundance to Telluride relaunch is Rose Byrne. Because if I had, like, Zad Kikiu, I was a huge fan of that movie. Was not sure about how that Oscar narrative would go. And then it just really took off from there. So it's a really important kind of second phase for movies that premiered at the beginning of the year.

16:20Ethan Hawke had the Telluride tribute too, which I imagine would be certainly on the table for Turturro. It seems like obviously like an ideal thing to go through his like great movies and have him sitting up on stage with maybe you, David or Nicole Sperling, whoever's there doing a nice, you know, chat about their career, Rebecca Keegan or whatever it's going to be, which is what I saw Ethan Hawke doing. And it was great. You're just painting such a vivid image here. It was so fun. It's how it goes. And I was like, this is great. I feel like as crowded as Best Actor is, based on Turturro's, I think, affection in the industry, you saw that even when he was nominated for Severance for an Emmy Award, like, people really love him.

16:56I think they have such an affection for him, and, like, he's never been nominated, so that's such an easy kind of, like, narrative to hang your hat on. That, plus Sony Classics being, like, actually incredibly good at this, just makes it feel like, no matter how crowded Best Actor is, I think you have to have Turturro on your five because of that. So I'm very excited for this movie. It sounds like something I would love. I love John Turturro. So like, yes, let's get him an Oscar nomination and several tributes along the way. Middleburg, I'm sure, any of these things, right? Just he'll be everywhere.

17:25All those East Coast, he doesn't have to leave New York. He can just go to Hamptons. Hamptons, yeah. New York only fun. How does this not play New York Film Festival, right? When they do their lineup? I mean, truly. Like it's gotta be like all of these places. Yeah. Like they've gotta do all of these things. Like, I'm just like, yes, let's do it. So yeah, this sounds great to me. I mean, they've got, Sony Classics has a couple other titles coming in the fall. They picked up Hachan, Shake Your Booty at Sundance, which I did see and is a lovely movie. I'm not, I don't know if I'd totally see the Sony Classics strategy on that one.

17:53And they had the Almodovar movie that played at Cannes. I did not see it at Cannes. David, did you see Bitter Christmas at Cannes? Okay. And I don't think that's gonna pop or no one expects it to. Yeah, I think it's for people who love Almodovar, like a fascinating kind of key text. I don't think it's his most successful movie over the last decade by any means, and I don't think it's a movie that would go any significant awards distance. Well, then it's the Totoro show plus the Bardem Cruise household TBD. That's an interesting lineup for our friends at Sony Classics. But I do think the most interesting lineup in the I Have No Idea How They're Gonna Do This award has to go to Focus for this year.

18:32Because who in the world would have thought that Focus would have the highest-grossing movie in their history with a spring horror movie that is, I mean, from all signs that we can tell from, I guess, things we know and can't talk about and things that can, like, it's going for it. Like, they are taking obsession out on the circuit. Like, David, what have you seen from your end of how Focus is really all in on this? I would say it's been sort of in parallel with the rest of us, which is, okay, this is happening. Okay, this is a phenomenon. Okay, okay, this has never happened in the history of our company.

19:08Okay, a lot of people are talking about this performance. And so what I've heard is just them focus, kind of just positioning the movie as they have learned more, as they have gotten more data from viewers and audiences. So yeah, at this point, you can't not give it some sort of run, right? Yeah. Yeah, I mean, the day before we were recording this, We saw that Neon had moved Michelle Williams' movie out of the race, which like knowing that the best actress field was so thin, it was like, oh, she could have the whole thing to herself. I'm interested in what's happening with that one. We'll do our Neon episode later.

19:45But like, Chris, like can Indy Navarrete just get in because she's in a movie that everybody really likes? I think so. I really do believe that. It's a good performance. So having watched the movie finally, which is like embarrassing that I had not watched it until it was streaming here on Peacock, but watch the movie. I was very excited to do so. and watching the movie, I was like, yeah, you could definitely see Elaine for it. She's the, she's the best part of the movie by a long shot, I think. And she's the best actor in the movie by a long shot. That's not to disrespect like the other people, but it is like, it's such a low budget film.

20:15The acting in it reminded me of like a mumble core or clerks kind of thing where you have like non-actors or first time actors or like, kind of like, I don't want to even say like YouTube or whatever, but that's what it feels like a nineties indie movie. And then you have this actress who is like legitimately good on top of that. And it just feels like she's running laps around the entire movie because she's so good now whether she would be great opposite like Meryl Streep or like Olivia Wilde or any like like who knows but in this movie it's fantastic so I think you have like a great performance it's a great discovery narrative as we've seen like kind of in the past like that is always a help and it made so much money I think now it's like if she I think she could get in because it's such a weak field but then does the movie get in for best picture it feels like it'll get a PGA nomination maybe it gets in a like critics choice with like 10 nominees or whatever and like does it get in at the Golden Globe so they could get in for picture and does it get in for original screenplay as Curry Barker as like the, you know, this is obviously kind of really caught on.

21:10You have Christopher Nolan saying the movie works like a motherfucker was what Christopher Nolan said. I didn't know he swore. I didn't either, but he loved the movie so much. Let's source Chris. David, he did to the Hollywood Reporter. He loved the movie so much he swore. I was like, man, so I feel like there is at least three nominations there that they could conceivably get. I think hers is probably the most likely, but the other two, depending on how the rest of the season plays out. But yeah, and it's kind of cool because we know Focus is like an incredible studio at mobilizing their Oscar movies.

21:39And so putting that apparatus onto a horror movie hit like this, I do think it'll be bigger than like Weapons was last year. It's like an obvious comp, but I think like Weapons was like Amy Madigan or Bust, and this could be like a couple other nominations. Yeah. I mean, my biggest question for it is how they have that with Werewolf. Like, Focus as the horror studio in the mix this year is totally fascinating. But I've been so bullish on Werewolf just because Nosferatu did so well with Oscars. If it hadn't been such a late release, I feel like it could have done even more. And Werewolf is coming out on Christmas also.

22:10But Nosferatu have sowed the ground so that I feel like Werewolf can go even further if it's actually really good. Or does Obsession as a known quantity make people think, like, no, we have a horror movie already. Werewolf can do its own thing. because Werewolf has such a crafts bigness to it that could make Obsession look like more of what it is, which is like a small indie budget thing, and Werewolf is kind of the big deal. Can they do both? I think they can. Nosferatu obviously got several Oscar nominations and was probably right outside that Best Picture 10. But the way I see the Obsession campaign materializing is I think you can run it as a comedy at the Golden Globes.

22:48That is my, I don't know if that's a hot take. Good take, David. That's good. People will be mad, I'm sure. My husband hasn't seen it, so we watched it again on Peacock. And I was like, oh, this kind of plays like a comedy. So, which is to say that that should help it, I think, rack up nominations if they choose that route. And so by the time Werewolf comes out, you're going to see Obsession fully kind of in motion as a contender, I think. whereas Werewolf you know it is just it's a Robert Eggers movie it's going to be carefully rolled out I think the way that we saw Nosferatu rolled out too was making sure that fans of that filmmaker and you know the way that they like you know don't want that movie to be treated as like a fall festival awards thing which I think is a very considered choice it's just a different strategy so we have to see how good it is We have to see how much money it makes.

23:50And the runway is a little bit obviously shorter. But I think it's just really different. I think they're really different categories. And the way Focus works is a campaign is partly developed out of how much money a movie makes. And Obsession has managed to, you know, get its own campaign set up just fine. The comedy thing is incredible, if that actually does happen. but just sitting here processing that, I'm like, I don't really, off the top of my head, we're already like, it's a weak field. She could win Best Actress Comedy at the Globe. So then you get her up there on stage, like giving a speech, like that alone.

24:29Then she gets like a SAG nomination. So I feel like all of this is good for her to get in. Certainly. Who do you even put, I mean, Anne Hathaway and Meryl Streep for Devil Wears Prada 2? Like how do you fill out that category? And that feels very old Globes. It does. Very old Globes. It really does. So, I mean, we'll see what, who knows what the categories are and what they run. Is Digger a comedy? Like, who knows? Oh, boy. Certainly could be. The big question mark of this entire thing. Well, and Werewolf also has, I feel like, competition from Dune. And that, like, December prestige-y popcorn release, which I, it didn't.

25:03We were Nosefrosu definitely didn't. I can't remember where Dune Part II fit in with that. But that's going to be an interesting corridor. Like, can Werewolf do as well? asking it to do as well as Obsession feels like almost unfair. Like, can it get out from under the dune shadow? Again, I'm feeling very bullish on it, but it's going to be an interesting and kind of busy Christmas window for that. Yeah. All right, should we talk about the Andrew Scott business that Focus is also in? I'm also in that business, by the way. We are all card-carrying members. As David, you'll hear in the New Year's Next Oscar draft that we did a little while ago, he was my pick, my first pick, I think, for someone who will win an Oscar in the next 10 years.

25:39partly due to bullishness about Elsinore, which again, breaking news as we were recording this is set for a November 20th release date. It is festival wise, we think probably going to Telluride and definitely going to Toronto, which I had wondered for a while if it might go to Venice, you know, about Hamlet. It's vaguely European, got a star in it. I don't know if I know why it didn't, but it does feel like a pretty strong festival lineup for it regardless. I don't know which movies this applies to exactly, but I heard that there were a few movies that were accepted to Venice and were going to go to Venice, but chose Telluride because of the dates, because they wouldn't be able to do both.

26:21I don't know if Elsinore is one of them, but I believe it was listed as a Canadian premiere when TIFF announced it, which would indicate it was going to hit both beforehand. Interesting. And it's not going to Venice. You are correct. No, you're correct about that. I don't know if it applies to this, but it was a Canadian premiere. That's a good explainer for that. I think you said Hamlet or Hamnet did the same thing last year. It was listed as a Canadian premiere in Toronto, but didn't go to Venice. And I mean, Focus to me has played the Telluride game better than anybody. They had Conclave, which was, you know, the launch of that year.

26:53They had Hamlet, which was the launch of last year, both of which were, you know, in that top three, four, two, in Conclave's case, Oscar players in the end. they make that festival really count. And so this feels like a perfect launch for them for that movie. Yeah. Well, and Andrew Scott has like, it's not quite the John Turturro thing of being overdue to that extent, but he's been on the horizon on these nominations so many times at this point. It just feels like it's going to have to burst at some point. You know, Blue Moon, like, I don't really know why he didn't go anywhere alongside Ethan Hawke with that Berlin win, but he just didn't.

27:28He was busy filming all these movies. I guess so. But it's true. No, he really didn't do anything because I don't think he could. Yeah. But it just feels like that is such a strong thing. And again, we talked about this when I had him in our draft, like the Tom Cruise, Matt Damon kind of huge movie star thing is going to be such a dominating force that then like the John Turturro's and Andrew Scott might just be able to like stay locked in place and never move and have the entire season themselves. It feels like such a strong play for him. And they've got like, he's got his own lane. I feel like, you know, like we're saying, like you have the movie stars are the movie stars and they're all going to be fighting it out.

28:02Turturro has like the old veteran. So does Malkovich kind of, right? So they're both going to be in there. And then Andrew Scott, as we're saying, like on the come up, it feels like we've been waiting to get him an Oscar nomination. And this just feels like the perfect movie. This, if it does, assuming, let's assume it does go to Telluride. I do think this would be like an absolute slam dunk smash at Telluride. The crowd there would just like, just like, it would be like they won the Super Bowl after seeing this, I'd imagine. Just like, I know, but like I've seen. I remember walking out of a movie, Empire of Light, which I'm still waiting to see come out.

28:35And the Telluride response from that crowd was thrilled. They were like, this is great Oscar movie. So I'm like, if this is actually as good as it seems like we're hearing and it's in that same like emotional, like old school, you know, 80s vein or whatever. I don't know. I'm just like, this feels like the best kind of landing spot for it. And then just launch from there and Andrew Scott. And the only thing I'm wondering now, I have like him in for an Oscar, Katie, that was a great pick in the Oscar draft or he could actually win this year maybe. But I also do wonder like, is he going to be strong enough to actually pull the movie into best picture?

29:06Which we've kind of, is that possible? And I guess we have to see the movie first, but I would not be surprised if the movie's like a tearjerker or like really gets you really emotionally connected to it, if he's able to just pull the whole thing into the best picture as well. Not to just be like super obvious about it, but it's the Hamnet thing. Like it's about an actor playing Hamlet. We got the first like image, He's looking at that skull. That's what Hamlet does. And it's, you know, it's a blonde hair with blonde hair. Very early. He's playing a real actor, a Scottish actor who was dying of AIDS while playing Hamlet in a production.

29:37And, you know, not an actor I was familiar with at all, but I think probably British theater people know more about this guy. But it seems like it could do the Hamnet thing if you get to the end and you're really sad, but you also feel really like uplifted and brought into something bigger than yourself. And that is a humongous power to have as much as I defend Empire. of Light. I'm not sure Empire of Light quite had that much going for it. I didn't dislike Empire of Light. Many people do. It was more like, that's an odd story. It was odd. I think one of the unique aspects of focus buying this movie is they are pretty commercially minded and conservative with what they buy at a festivals.

30:19They don't really do what Neon or Mubi certainly do, or even what A24 does. Maybe they're more now in that lane, A24 is. So yeah, I was pretty struck by them buying this. Obviously, they probably had some buying power because of what Obsession pulled off. But I have to think that there is a good amount of expectation for a movie that doesn't have any big box office draws, that doesn't have this kind of genre scope that would get it, you know, over a certain box office threshold on its own. So yeah, I'm pretty optimistic about whatever this movie is. I've only heard good things. And I'm still so sad that Andrew Scott did not get nominated for All of Us Strangers.

31:05So yeah, this is a big one for me. And I think you're totally right, Katie, that you have these like Damon, Gosling, Cruise names in this one corner. and the way the Academy is now is they also like their Ethan Hawke in Blue Moons. They like the other side too and they usually have a balance and this feels like perfectly suited to that other side. Leonardo DiCaprio gave one of the best performances of his career in the Best Picture winner and no one ever really thought that he, I mean, I guess I did, but everyone thought it was crazy that he was going to win Best Actor because that was how, that was, I mean, he lost it as a movie star.

31:41I know, we always talk ourselves into all kinds of different outcomes on these. Um, so Elsinore is the only focus movie that we know of for now that is doing festivals at all. I mean, Obsession premiered at TIFF last year. You know, there's reason to believe there could be anniversary things around that. Werewolf, I think we don't think will do anything. But they've got two movies coming out in September and October that I cannot make heads or tails of. There's The Uprising, the Paul Greengrass, Andrew Garfield. What is it? So the peasant uprising against a king in like the 14th century or something like that.

32:12As someone who likes Andrew Garfield and Paul Greengrass, I know absolutely not. And it's fast approaching. I know absolutely nothing about this movie. And that can't be the best sign. It's so, and like The Lost Bus, like did a bunch of festivals, got that like visual effects Oscar nomination last year. Got decent reviews. Yeah, it wasn't a total afterthought. I cannot figure out what's going on. Why wouldn't The Uprising just go to TIFF and like premiere two days later to do the dumb money thing? Like that, I don't know, it costs too much. I have no idea. Maybe it's just terrible. I don't know.

32:41I mean, I can't say it's on any of my predictions right now. We were talking about this with Joyce yesterday, but when you have these movies that have like, yesterday, we were talking about this Joyce last week, I guess, in the episode we did on the studio. One of his recording schedules. But when you have a movie that's like a big movie with like people who are recognizable that should be in theory on paper, something that would be an awards movie. We were talking about Dog Stars previously with Ridley Scott and Jacob Elordi off an Oscar nomination, Margot Qualley and Josh Brolin. Wow, that should be something.

33:14And it's August 28th. This being September 11th. I'm just like, it just, you don't get the best sign. I remember a few years ago, do you remember this? Like, Poor Things was scheduled for September 11th. We'll never forget it. Yes. We'll never forget it. Why is this coming out September 11th? And then they were like, oh, actually, we're going to move it to December. And it was like, whoops, it's good. Sorry. So we have to move it. That hasn't happened with the uprising, unfortunately. Yeah. Maybe next time. Poor Things, wasn't it just because of the strikes that they moved it? I think, I don't know.

33:41I think so. Maybe. Well, it worked out well for everybody. And then the other big focus mystery is Sense and Sensibility, which is coming out in October. It's got stars in it. It looks decent. I mean, can it be as good as the Ang Lee movie is, I guess, the big question hovering over it? I was surprised it didn't go to Toronto. That felt like something that could really play there. It could still get added after this recording, but it just, it's odd to me that it's skipping it entirely. It's very strange to me. one thing we were talking about offline, Katie, is this is a really grim year for female directed movies, for movies about women.

34:16We were just talking about the best actress race as well. It's just really a sad state of affairs. Like the Venice lineup has one female director in the whole competition. It's pretty, pretty grim. And this movie looks good. I've started, you know, they're starting to screen it. I have not seen it, but I've heard good things. I think it's just like squarely, let's see how the movie does and go from there situation. I love the Ang Lee movie so much that I'm, you know, I feel myself prepared to compare against that. And that is not fair to this movie. And I'm sure a lot of people feel that way because that movie is kind of considered a classic of its era.

34:56And obviously it was a big Oscars player. So, yeah, I think they're just being careful with it. I don't think they want to overplay their hand with it. But as I see it, it has a very clear lane. It has a way in that is really specific to what the movie is. Like, it's directed by Georgia Oakley, who hasn't really been in the conversation before. Daisy Edgar-Jones, obviously, rising star, who has not been in the conversation before, at least on the Oscars side. A lot of room there. Yeah, I'm looking up Georgia Oakley. I'm not sure I've seen anything that she has made before. she made Blue Jean, which I have not seen, but I heard good things about.

35:38Yeah. I mean, I guess I can see them thinking like, oh, there's gonna be all these critics who are gonna see it in Toronto and say, okay, it's not as good as Ang Lee, or you could open it in October to a bunch of Gen Z people who maybe had not seen that one and it feels brand new and like let the audiences decide. Like maybe that, maybe that does make sense. Avoid us. You say that didn't make me shiver a little bit, but that's more state of the world than state of this movie. Well, maybe they see this and then they seek out the next thing. I think you're dead on. I think you're dead on. Six version.

36:04Yeah. I think that's probably the best way to do it. Chris, why won't they let any women make movies in the Oscar race this year? Why do you make this happen? It's not my fault, but I would say, I do wonder if that, like, this is not the venue because it's not the right studios, but I do wonder if that would make Olivia Wilde more of a likely contender as we get further down the road for director for the invite, just because that was, it did work, people liked it. Yeah. And that alone, like, you don't want to be, like, too cynical or craven with the narrative of being like, well, we're going to have no female directors again.

36:37It's really, like, a bleak kind of year. And, like, David was mentioning Venice. But, I mean, like, that is a lane that she could obviously fill. And, like, there was a lot of affection for it. And it was really well directed by, like, you know, like, people really noted that. And I do think whether or not she gets in, who knows. But that could be, like, a good lane for her as she becomes a double nominee for that in Bohemian. For a Bohemian. I like the idea of a Best Picture line that includes Project Hail Mary, Obsession, The Invite, and The Odyssey as this early year. I am currently predicting that.

37:07That's great. I mean, then that's four different studios. Yes, all these different sizes of movies. That's a really healthy way to say we can represent hits of different sizes. It would be really great. I think in the industry, there's still a lot of value placed on a movie like The Invite that premieres at Sundance, does not have distribution. Olivia Wilde has talked about the fight of getting that movie made, of needing to premiere it and see that it worked and put herself out there in that way. and then it does work and then A24 buys it and then it actually makes money and it has this really organic word of mouth success.

37:46Yeah, I feel pretty good about that movie at this point, especially just in the overall scheme of A24 slate. It has a good position. They almost did it last year, right? It didn't work with Materialist, but with Past Lives, it did and they got that in for Best Picture. And so they could take these Sundance movies, even like whatever, and make it work. I think that's, I'd love to see that. I think that would be good. And then, you know, that makes it even more, there's less spots. These fall movies, then there's only six slots left for Best Picture. I know. Yeah. I like the idea of 824 doing like the late June release date for like female directed urban dramedies.

38:23The same way like Pixar does mid-June. Like just own that slot. It's like Christopher Nolan's date. Exactly. Everyone just has their little spot on the calendar and everyone knows what to expect. Well, this made me really excited. I feel like this is good stuff And we're all in that period of like, all of these movies could be great. And, you know, some of them we have reason to think could be really great. And I'm excited. You ready, David? Are you napping? Are you resting up before this sprint ahead of us? It feels like summer's already over, sadly. I know. I know. But you know what? Maybe in a month and a half of the uprising will be the best picture front runner.

38:56So who knows what's going to happen. And Sense and Sensibility will have a TIFF Gala premiere and we'll all have that on our face. Well, this is incredibly fun. thank you for coming back and doing this with us. David, everyone should go read yourself. We didn't even talk about your John Leguizamo piece for the Odyssey, which I thought was a very important piece of pre-Oscar campaigning. Again, very invested. Very invested. We all have our phase at this point. You would not be surprised by who I am really focused on in the Odyssey campaign because you could focus on like 10 people and it's those Leguizamos and Mortons.

39:29Yeah, yeah. We're going to get there. We'll have plenty of time. We'll have so much time to talk about the Odyssey. But in the meantime, those of you listening, stick around. I'll be back in a moment with my conversation with Charles Milton.

40:19Now let's hear my conversation with Emmy nominee Charles Melton. He is part of the second installment of the anthology series, Beef. To me, truly one of the best shows that's been on television this year. He plays part of a young and striving couple alongside Kaylee Spaney. They are working at this very fancy Los Angeles country club, and they get caught up in this generational battle with this older millennial couple played by Carey Mulligan and Oscar Isaac. It is very funny and very dark. His character has to really go to some interesting places, especially playing a guy who's been a little bit underestimated his whole life and might be underestimating himself until all of this happens.

40:57So we got into how he did that, how he fit into a world as specific as the one of beef, its vision of Los Angeles as this place where there's very fancy battle going on all around you. And also what doing something like this allows you to do next as you're building a really exciting career the way he has been. We get into all of it here at all in my conversation with Emmy nominee, star of beef, Charles Melton.

41:24to rewind really just way back to the beginning of beef because it's just been so interesting the way you've talked about meeting with sunny the creator of the show and helping to create your character what was your first meeting like where were you what was the conversation what did you eat whatever else what do you remember about that yeah we were at a restaurant downtown and And Bing Chen, who's created Gold House, or was one of the founding members of Gold House, put together a dinner. This was during May-December Press. And so it was the same year when Beef Season 1 was going through the awards circuit, celebrating all their success.

42:04And he maneuvered his way to sit next to me at dinner. And he ended up pitching the whole series to me. and showed me a picture of myself and was like, this is in our writer's room. And I thought, oh, cool. For what? Does the character look like me? He goes, no, we're writing for you. So it was a very kind of pinch me moment when a creator, especially with the success that Lee Seung Jin has had, is telling me he's going to write in collaboration of my Korean American experience and pull from that. And so that just lent itself to hours of existential philosophical conversations, which he then excavated to put on paper and then allow, he writes to essences, which is really great, which is really exciting.

43:02The essence of like who you are or who your character Austin is or both? No, the essence of who I am. And then just like, you know, I think we go through so many different adaptations of ourself through different transitions in life. And I shared, we shared those chapters of, you know, his experience and my experience. And then I think that just kind of ended up forming what he wrote on paper for Austin, knowing that I was going to bring something off the page. Yeah. I mean, I know I've watched that award season process happen where you go to these events and you're over and over again and you're meeting people and there's a lot of handshaking and a lot of like, oh, we should work together.

43:46This is interesting. How was that process for you? Obviously, it's resulted in this incredible collaboration, but I'm guessing a lot of other people are coming at you and saying, do this, do that. You know, you got to make a choice at some point. How did you feel about how that whole process went? oh you mean like when I was doing May December yeah just like having all those meetings with people who aren't necessarily pitching you beef season 2 and you got to figure out like what is the right thing to do I mean I owe so much to Todd Haynes and you know just that I think that press tour for me that junket I mean it was incredible to be in these rooms with these artists who I admire and am inspired by and And, you know, I think I'm in a point in my career where I understand, like, as much as you want to work with a filmmaker or a writer, you know, it just has to line up and make sense.

44:41You can't just, like, force it. It has to come naturally. And I feel like I've been pretty lucky with, you know, ever since Todd Haynes, it was then, you know, Alex Garland. And then it was Lee Seung Jin with Beef. And then it was Nick Winding Refn. Yeah. And then Greg Quedar, and now it's the Daniels, and then Elijah Bynum, and then going on to what I'm going to do next year. So it's, you know, it's amazing. I kind of feel, I feel very fortunate and grateful. And it's amazing when people respond to your work, too, you know, so. Do you feel like you get, there's a kind of film education in that, that you're meeting all these people.

45:19Not that you, like, aren't a fan of their work already, but you're just kind of, like, learning about what influences them. You know, you're watching things that are inspiration for your character. Like, what's that learning process like? A hundred percent. Yeah, like that process for me is, it really is my education when I'm working with these filmmakers. You know, not only do, I mean, I learned, I've seen a couple of Todd Haynes' films before I met him and then I ended up watching, you know, I watched Safe before I met him and then Dark Waters. and then I ended up watching Velvet Gold Mine, Far From Heaven.

45:58But basically, I guess you can say with each filmmaker, I'm kind of this sponge. I want to digest as much as I can. So when I'm working with a filmmaker on a specific project, I'm not just curious in what references or films they want me to watch for the specific role or character. I'm like, just send me the films you love. because there's so much out there. I kind of, you know, in a way, you're getting to know someone's cinematic language, I guess, no matter how specific or eclectic it is. And for me, I kind of had, you know, like I was exposed to blockbusters my whole life and love movies and franchises.

46:42And I didn't know what Art House was until I was like 23 or 24. or you're watching something and it's so profound and you're like, oh, whoa, like this movie, what's this about? Yeah, or like movies that's like, I didn't know movies could work that way. Like that's always a huge moment. Yeah, yeah. So it's like really spectacular. And then, you know, you see incredible filmmakers that kind of oscillate both doing, you know, bringing something on a grand scale, but like having those elements of like their art house filmmaking or indie filmmaking, like it's all one art form. But it's, I kind of get my, yeah, I get my, I learned from my directors.

47:22So what was the viewing? And I learned from my fellow actors. Yeah. Yeah. What was the viewing diet for Beef? Did you guys all watch something together? Yeah. Or did you assign yourself stuff? Yeah, we watched a lot. You know, I watched, I was late to the party with The Sopranos and it was incredible. So the element of The Sopranos that Sonny would say, he was like, you know, the show is like 30 % Sopranos. because what's so beautiful about that is like our characters are always hiding something like in the sopranos we as the audience when we're watching we know tony soprano is hiding something and navigating these circumstances and it's just like these beef characters where you know austin he's constantly navigating trying to make a decision when there's so much indecision and his mask is people-pleasing and codependency.

48:11And what makes him so funny is you see someone unravel with an immense amount of self-doubt in the most absurd circumstances when his heart is in the right place. That's funny. Yeah. That's funny. And so that kind of fed into some of my favorite filmmaking. You know, when you think of Parasite or Park Jong-un's Memories of Murder, there's all these genres that are in a specific film that are blending where you're scared or then it's like a murder. And then, you know, it's a psychological thriller and then there's comedy to it and there's action to it. So it was like blending all those films. I mean, you know, Handmaiden, Old Boy, Parasite, No Other Choice, Amadeus.

48:59Oh, Amadeus is such a good one. Yeah, Amadeus. Excellent rivalry movie. yeah there's there's so many uh amadeus gosh i'm just kind of jealous of this film festival you got to have it was yeah it was incredible and see for me there's a you know i hadn't seen amadeus beforehand so it's amazing kind of being i'm just more curious to for example katie what you watch what you're drawn to you know and you know you watch something i mean cinema is the most beautiful thing. But yeah, we had a very eclectic, a lot of PTA movies, you know, Magnolia. There's just like a lot of different things. It was really great.

49:43I think you said that you met Lee Byung-hun at some point, like at a screening of No Other Choice or, you know, something around that being in there. I did. The minute I read that, I was like, No Other Choice fits perfectly into the world of B for this sad, tragicomic capitalism mess. Totally. What's so... I was talking with Lee Byung Lee, Byung, I just say Byung. I was talking to Byung and Park Chan-wook. And, you know, it was funny because they were doing these Q &As and as an audience, the response was laughter, you know? And someone was asking Byung, they're like, man, like, you know, you're so funny, like comedy we didn't know.

50:24Like you had so many comedic chops and he was like, the process wasn't funny filming it. Yeah. Same thing with Austin. Like, you know, if I took myself out of it, I could see it and like kind of laugh at what was happening. But when it came to the work and being on set, I had to like live in those circumstances because if I'm playing the joke, there is no joke. You know, there's such a conviction, like with Parchan Wook, like it's so funny, no other choice because the circumstances like beef are absurd and the stakes are so high and there's so much propulsion. We can't help as an audience but to laugh.

51:04So I think I've been getting a lot of comments about Ryan Gosling and what he does so well with comedy and Brad Pitt and Burn After Reading, the Coen Brothers and people referencing that, which is a great compliment to have. And I'm really embracing the fact that like, yeah, Austin's funny, but it didn't feel funny when I was doing it. In the grand tradition of Ken and Brad Fittenberg after reading. That's a that is a great compliment. Well, and I think you said you talked about this with Sonny in the beginning is that Austin's sweetness is so key to this character, you know, just wanting to do the right thing, but being so frozen in that way.

51:42And sweetness can be pathetic if it's handled poorly. You can see him as kind of this loser. I mean, he's kind of a loser, but in this way that it feels very relatable. I wonder if you thought about that part of it. Not necessarily the comedy, but just making him feel like a real person who could just be that sincerely good-hearted while doing terrible things. Totally. That's very sweet. That's very sweet, Katie.

52:09There is, I think when we see this ultimate sweetness, I mean, with Austin, I mean, I had to just be as truthful as I could be because, you know, there's an idea of when you're so sweet maybe can be naive because the world isn't that sweet. It's actually bittersweet, right? And I think there's this optimism, this innate goodness in Austin, which I'm pretty inspired by and in my life, like inspired to be kind always. I think there's a difference between being nice and kind with Austin, but Austin is like fighting to be doing both at the same time. You can still be kind and not be in a good mood, but like your actions can like, you know, speak louder than the niceness.

53:00I prefer someone being kind opposed to nice, but Austin is trying to do both. Sure. But I think the frustration with Austin, you know, when we're watching someone who's so kind and so good putting everyone before himself is, there's like a very vulnerable place for me to be in this sense of like catering to everything around me. Right. and trying to fix so many things. And I think that's what Austin's just constantly trying to do. He's just trying to do the right thing. And he's kind of at this impasse where it's, do I do the good thing for this person? Or do I do the right thing for me, which is probably not the good thing for the other person?

53:43How do you separate that? And I think that's a part of our own evolution in our own journey of life. Sometimes we learn sooner than later that you kind of have to make decisions for yourself at times, even if it doesn't make everyone happy. But there is a sweetness and a kindness that is very familiar to me with Austin. That was maybe who I was. Not that I'm not to think myself as a kind, nice person. But, you know, there was more of kind of like this puppy dog, just stronger optimism and light of life, you know? Well, there's like a, in Austin, it feels like there's a refusal to acknowledge that sometimes you can't make everybody happy.

54:27But like you can be doing two feel like good things, but someone's going to be mad about it. And that just happens. And it's like a learning process in very dramatic ways over the course of the season. No, 100%. You can't make everybody happy. And sometimes I think in a way, without getting too heady and into it, that is selfish. Because you're always trying to appease everyone before yourself. And so you're then not living your authentic and true self. Yeah. Because you're trying to, you know, and I think that was kind of the place that I lived in. there's a lot of gray with Austin, which is, he's not selfish, but then I had to, you know, diagnose kind of the idea of certain things.

55:13Like, I mean, I was sending books to Lee Sun-jin about codependency and anxious attachment and like understanding attachment styles and theories and relationships and codependency. And then really looking at identity, like, you know, Austin then to being exposed to his Korean-ness, like what effect that would have, you know, on him. And, you know. I'm just imagining you're reading all these books and then you mentioned your wife earlier, like you come home at the end of the day and being like, oh, my brain's been somewhere else. And now I got to go live my real life after reading all that. Yeah, it's interesting.

55:47I think, you know, for me, I have like a very spiritual way of like, I think like everyone does, like their own way of like working. you know i kind of i treat it very seriously like a communion you know on the day of communion it's you know when i think about the work you drink the blood of christ you eat the body of christ but at the end of the day and it's very cinematic and very beautiful on communion but at the end of the day i know it's grape juice and a cracker you know but then also you know there is like healthy separation when I go to work in the process. And what I mean by that is like, you know, you leave as much as you can at work, but the work is constantly moving in you.

56:36You can't just like forget about what you're doing when you're, you can't ignore the soreness you're going to feel when you go to a gym and work out. So you're bringing the effects of that with you when you come back home. Yeah. You know, so there's kind of like a psychological, mental, spiritual kind of aspect to that with the work, which is like very exciting. And like, I guess, you know, you kind of contain that the best you can, but I guess you can say that. And then I guess the reason why I'm saying that other than I feel comfortable and like, you know, whatever is because my wife, you know, there's like flashes of Austin that come out in your ordinary life and things change.

57:24Music changes. You know, I really felt like I was Gen Z. I'm not Gen Z. I'm Zillennial. I wanted to ask you about this because as an elder millennial, like I felt very attacked by this show and the music choices and everything else. I know that's intentional. And I wondered where you identify in the spectrum, knowing that you're playing Gen Z, but may not quite be there in your head. I think I'm both. I think I'm both. I think, you know, when you think of like certain like textures in the show, which is so incredible with Lee Seung Jin where, you know, Austin's kind of like the person who like sees the headline of an article or like reads like the paragraph about like, you know, certain attachment styles.

58:05And then he uses it like, you know, he uses it as if it's like Bible and other conversations. It takes it way too far. Yeah, like that guy who cancels his training session with Austin is talking about late stage capitalism and how they should have grabbed the bag first. And then at the end of that episode, of episode one, he's just like, late stage capitalism. It's the system. It's designed to make us feel this way. Like he's almost expressing, he's funneling information that he hasn't even processed himself, which is like sweet, but kind of funny. It's not dumb. But I like, you know, for me, I understand that.

58:50Like sometimes I read like a paragraph or the forward of a book. I'm like, this book is amazing. And I haven't even finished it yet. So there's like elements, like not that extreme as Austin. And I'm not saying, you know, yeah, I'm a Zillennial. I heard it. It's Gen Z and Millennial. I'm calling myself both. Yeah, well, I think it was Elder Millennials. We were basically saying, like, we have Gen X in there in the blood somewhere. But everyone wants to. Everyone's a micro generation, I think. We don't want to be lumped in with everybody else. But see, I guess that's like the great thing about the show is because, you know, at the end of the finale, we see kind of the samsara at the end.

59:30Oh, yeah. and it's just like a commentary it's like sunny's commentary on with samsara that you know no matter the generations like history repeats itself yeah everything is a circle yeah i don't remember it was you or sunny who said this in an interview but maybe both but that the read on austin and ashley at the end is that this can be a happy marriage like they've repeated the exact cycle that we saw at the beginning and how poorly it turned out for josh and lindsey but there might be happiness there also? A hundred percent. I mean, we just, yeah, I think I said aversion because people, it's amazing when at the end, when they think of the moment of Austin finally making a decision with conviction, which he has in all season, right?

1:00:15But then the mask beneath the mask then disintegrates and then he's making a decision. And we think we know why, you know, that taxicab moment where he decides to go back to Ashley. It's like, oh, someone was, you know, it's interesting to hear people's take on it because I'm like, oh, you're just projecting your answer and your narrative right now. And for me, I mean, it's very human to be tired and to not feel like, you know, staying up late or reading a book. You know, who says they're not happy? What is happiness? is happiness always joy that puppy love dog phase i think that's the beautiful thing with austin and actually too is you kind of see austin so in love and then the trials and struggles of life under the umbrella of capitalism start exposing things and cracking things and it starts to expose and crack austin and he's just trying to do the right thing even if it's not a good thing for him and then he finally makes a decision and someone was like oh you should have chose Eunice or he chose the easy way out but like or he chose the hard way out and I think it's just personally I think they're in love living like their best life right now and I think Eunice had wanted no part of us so a sparing Eunice for whatever Austin was going to offer was the right thing to do for her.

1:01:47So you were talking about this earlier. You've got this huge lineup of directors you're working with. You've got a bunch of things coming your way. You know, when you get finished with something like this, a character you've developed in this way, you know, filming a TV show takes a long time. You're in this world. When you come out of it, like what does it light a fire under you to do something? Or does it give you clarity on what you want to do or who you want to be or any of that? Like what is, what do you take with you from working on something like Beef?

1:02:13I think it's kind of like all you said and the above I think I just want to do good work personally I just want to do good work and be a part of great things even if I'm not in it that much I'd rather be a part of something great than you know be in every frame um I guess, you know, when you develop something, I mean, there's kind of like an evolution that comes with the characters I work with. And it's really a part of me, you know, part of my soul that has the opportunity to exist in this time frame. And I do move on in my life, but it's still like a part of me, the experience of filming with being with the filmmaker, the writers, the crew, the cast, like in some way, shape and form, it did kind of refine me in some way, which I really don't know how it, I really can't articulate on paper.

1:03:21But yeah, everything I've done up until now is a part of me. And in 20 years, you're going to look back and be like, oh, that's what it did. You can't see it now. Yeah. Or I remember that marker in my life. I was, you know, that was the year before I became a father. You know, there are different markers and art imitates life. Life imitates art. There's that cliche thing. But I really believe in that. They're all the unreality of the beautiful thing we get to do with art as actors and filmmakers and costume designers and everything informs our life and vice versa. Like it is this the unreality and reality of our life or, you know, there's a DNA to it.

1:04:13That does it for today's episode. We'll have more bonus episodes coming up. The Emmy nominees, there are so many of them to talk to. More great stuff coming in that direction. We'll also continue our fall preview series on next week's episode as well. In the meantime, this podcast is edited by Brett Fox and produced by Brett Fox and Mean. Our theme music is by Dave Gonzalez. Thanks again to our returning guest host, David Canfield. Subscribe to the Prestige Junkie newsletter at theankler.com. Watch this podcast on YouTube if you're not already. You can also subscribe to it on Apple, Spotify, or anywhere else you get your podcasts.

1:04:49We'll see you with many more episodes soon.