You Can See Everything and Festival Hype, Plus Alden Ehrenreich on His Very Big Year

0:00I love that Digger advertised like a mediocre Rotten Tomatoes score as a badge of honor. I think that's so cool. Yeah, like there's I think Steven Soderbergh said this. There's like there used to be a lot of merit to like divided opinions about something. Not does everybody in school think this person should be homecoming king?

0:22Hi, everyone. I'm Katie Rich. This is the Prestige Junkie podcast. And today we are in the thick of regional festival season. And we have been there to witness so much of it. I was in Middleburg, Virginia this past weekend. My colleague Christopher Rosen here with me again was at the Montclair Film Festival in New Jersey. Hello, Chris. I'm glad you didn't have to cross state lines to go to any film festivals for once. Not at all. I took local roads. Didn't even take the highway. No Garden State through way for you. And joining me in Middleburg last weekend and on the podcast today, David Canfield of The Hollywood Reporter.

0:54Former colleague. So happy to have you here, David. and you flew home from Middleburg and jumped right back into a word season in LA. So are you exhausted? No, I think I'll just eventually crash and not wake up for three days. Not until March though. We have a long way to go. Six more months of not sleeping. So David and Chris and I are going to talk about our film festival experiences, as well as a lot of news that is going on in the world. Everyone is seeing, you can see everything. I haven't yet, but we'll get to that in a minute. We'll talk about all of that as well as our festival experiences.

1:24And after that, you will hear my conversation with Alden Ehrenreich, the star of the very fun new film, A Talent for Murder. All of that is coming up. Welcome to the show. So, guys, as I said, I want to get into all of our fun gossip and name dropping and all the best past apps we had at various fall festivals this weekend. But I do think, and David, you can corroborate this for me, that one of the biggest stories of Middleburg was you can see everything opening in theaters around the country and not playing the festival. Am I right about that? That sounds about right. It kind of reminded me of when we were at the fall festivals last year and one battle after another was waiting in the wings.

2:04Not that that necessarily gives away my thoughts on you could see everything's Oscar chances, but it did feel like the fact that it was eating up all of the conversation said a great deal. Yeah, there was a lot of box office talk because we were there with a lot of people from Netflix. They were keeping a really close eye on the theater average for La Bola Negra. They're reporting box office for the first time. We'll get to La Bola Negra in a minute. But Chris, you and David both saw you can see everything at Telluride. You have seen this coming for a while, knowing it was going to be huge. Was it even bigger than you thought it was going to be?

2:34Yes, I would say yes. Even at Telluride, you were like, oh, this is great. I can't wait to see what people think of it. But it really broke containment in a major way. And I guess we kind of knew that after the Telluride screening, the next day when you saw how the response to the trailer was like so overwhelming just because I thought that was a great marketing ploy by A24 to release the teaser for it right after or during the Telluride screening. I think it was while you guys were still in the theater. Yeah. Boy, oh boy. It really like kind of it was just it went viral like immediately and you kind of can't buy that kind of enthusiasm for something.

3:07So it definitely exceeded my expectations. And to David's point, it reminded me so much of One Battle After Another this weekend, even at Montclair. That was the only thing people wanted to talk about, too, is you can see everything. It feels like it's bigger than just our little bubble too, which I think is going to help it. Also, it's Oscar chances. Yeah, I wondered while we were at Middleburg if it would have played well there because I think it has to, it has to win over those Academy audiences. I wonder if you thought about that too, David, if the crowd that we were surrounded with there would jibe with this movie the way the box office did.

3:36I think that the surprise factor for the movie helps a ton because it really, there's no, What I've been saying to people for the last month, I guess, I saw it actually right after Telluride. I saw it in a screening room by myself, which probably helped kind of quell the hype machine a little bit and allowed me to evaluate it on my own terms like 48 hours after everyone went insane about it. And I, too, went insane about it. So there you go. But I think that because of what the movie is, no matter how hyped it's been for you, the experience of actually watching it is so wild and fascinating that you kind of it's it's it's immune to that kind of bubble.

4:22And so I think even if it were in Middleburg, you would see like breathless chatter coming out of that ballroom. Honestly, I mean, I know people who saw it, a lot of people who saw it this weekend, and they told me that they'd never kind of heard that immediate conversation just coming out of the movie theater of like, what do you believe? What do you think of X moment? This moment was the most insane thing I've ever seen. Like all of that stuff is happening really is an organic reaction to the movie. And Academy members, yes, it's a specific demographic. And yes, Middleburg is a very specific demographic, but you've never really seen anything like it.

4:59And I think that that will extend to pretty much any audience, whether they fully jive with it or not. Yeah. I mean, will the Academy jive with it? It's just I haven't seen the movie yet. I'm trying to figure out where I can find three hours to do it. I promise I will. But I mean, Chris, you've been bullish on it since Telluride. Is it in your best picture predictions at this point? Go full pundit for me. It is in my best version. And I actually think, what if it's like two to the Odyssey? I know that's crazy. I know it's crazy. Like, I understand this. Oh, Chris, you're not disappointing. You're not disappointing.

5:27I'm like, I just think the amount of enthusiasm, again, it's October. Who knows? It's so many months. But I think it's like so, it's something that's so singular. It just feels like when you look at, like, I was thinking of like everything, everywhere, all at once, which is not a, it's an interesting comp to me only because it felt like that was such, at the time, like, oh, this is a different kind of movie. and like people were really enthused by it and they kind of kept going and you had the cast and all these things and Nathan Fielder is not going to be like Jamie Lee Curtis cheerleading this movie, obviously.

5:54That would be really fun to watch though. But I just think it's got that same like gotta see thing. I guess the alternate where it wouldn't win is like it reminds me a little bit of The Substance where that year everything I went to, everyone was like, did you see The Substance? You gotta see The Substance. It's so crazy. I've never seen anything like it and obviously that didn't, you know, win, like it's not going to win Best Picture, but it got in a lot of awards. I don't know. I think it's like, I'm pretty bullish on it I'm bullish on ever directing for the two of them. I think that could really happen.

6:20I don't know. I'm like. Are you bullish on redacted? So what are we going to talk about? We can't really. We're not going to. Sorry, I jumped the gun there. No, it's a valid question. I mean, I don't know about that because I think it's terms of. We should just clarify that is the potential acting nominee. Yes, there's a supporting nominee who maybe that's as far as we need to go. Less. I'm less sure of that. I think that maybe would be a tougher sell. But at the same time, I think it could really happen, too. And then maybe like I definitely think like editing is in play also because I thought that was like good.

6:53The only thing I don't think is to play his best documentary hilariously. Well, I wonder if we should talk about that, though, because given how huge this movie is, like a doc making money in theaters is exactly what all these doc people have been wanting for years. Like I get that it's unconventional and the doc branch can be weird. But I mean, David, you know, these doc branch people as well as I do, like should will they take it more seriously than we thought they would? Uh, I have no idea. I have, I don't have a clue. I mean, they will occasionally go for the popular choice when it is something that they deem artistically sort of brazen and unconventional enough.

7:34And I think this movie fits into that category, but it doesn't really align with what we know of that branch who do not like movies that are American or have any famous people involved whatsoever. Or popular. Or are popular. I mean, that's just, that's not even a judgment. That's just kind of the facts of where they're at and where they've been at the last few years. and we don't, you know, I think documentary at this stage is the hardest category to predict. We just don't know the movies that will pop. I find that regional festivals are actually really useful. I'm going to be moderating a bunch of those panels in Savannah next week.

8:14And I found last year that that was pretty helpful, but I mean, I would hope so. Like that's just kind of the answer is there's absolutely no world in which they should be snubbing this movie. And we've had many examples now of, well, the Academy's got to really take a hard look at that doc branch after they snub something that frankly should not be snubbed. This would be the biggest example of that. Certainly not the only example of that. But I am, I am with Chris. I, this movie is getting a Best Picture nomination. This is, this is a done deal. And I think the substance is a perfect comp because, you know, I did hear a little bit of this in Middleburg.

8:50It was, as you could imagine, and Chris a big talking point, a debate. And it's like, will Academy members go for this? Will they get it? Will they deem it, you know, worthy in that way? And it's like, we had this conversation about the substance and it keeps happening with movies that seemingly fall outside of Academy tastes or what we know of a Best Picture nominee to be. And if the Academy's proven anything over the last few years, it's that they're more willing to react to how people are getting excited about movies. And this is the movie that people are most excited about this season. A hundred percent.

9:24I think that's really true. I guess the other thing is in terms of the doc, I could, I don't want to like demonize the doc branch. I guess you could argue that this is so, there are so many non-traditional aspects to it that I guess it wouldn't be surprising if they snubbed it. But I also think maybe in terms of if A24 wants this to win best picture, which again, crazy, probably. Throw it out there. But I was like, if it gets snubbed in Doc, when we're all saying like it's like the biggest it's going to be like it's considered a Doc. It's making a ton of money as a Doc, like all these things. If it gets snubbed, is that like a Ben Affleck snub for Best Director?

9:57And that jet fuels the Best Picture campaign into phase two where you're like, well, I can't believe this stupid this movie got snubbed. How stupid is that? And then like we could like maybe we could win Best Picture then. Who knows? I don't know. I think I've heard that theory before. And I feel like that's precisely. It feels like the likeliest outcome. We'll see. It does. And I think with each of these categories, it's it's kind of a brand new question. How does the acting branch react to a, you know, will shall remain unspoken performance that is in a documentary? Right. Like that's we just don't know how that goes.

10:33How does the directing branch, which is also very particular and finicky, react to whatever the hell this movie is? we don't know. That's really exciting because the movie is now so firmly in the conversation, I think really is at the front of the pack, generally speaking. Not at the very front, to be clear. I'm not saying I'm predicting it to win. But like those are all questions that are going to be, you know, tested on the Academy over the next few months, I think. To linger on this for a little bit longer, we just talked about what A24 wants to do. I feel like we had this conversation in the summer, maybe when the invite was really popping, like can A24 get four movies in the best picture lineup because you've got The Invite, Club Kid, the debut, and now you can see everything as not equally strong, but all very strong possibilities.

11:21And I think four is a lot. And you can imagine some combination of all of those falling out. But can they juggle all of this? Do we think? I think yes, they can. I think that would be a tall order to get all four in. And I've been like surveying, looking at that field and like trying to be like, what will actually make it for them? like David said I think you can see everything is now like top of the list because I think it just clicks so many boxes um I feel like the debut remains strong because it has like an acting win right so like maybe even if the movie is like a little strange in times and whatever I do think that helps but I'm like less I've become less bullish on the invite and maybe more bullish on Club Kid because I think he was hearing you talk about it Katie and David I'm sure you saw this too it played incredibly well at Middleburg it sounds like it played here at Montclair and I heard people being like, love that movie so much.

12:09And it just is playing so well. And it's such a crowd pleaser that I'm almost like, the invite is so prickly, obviously. And like, it's so interesting in its prickliness and kind of downcast ending and view on relationships in certain ways. And I wonder if like, it's more, does that become more of like an Olivia Wilde, best actress nomination, best screenplay, and maybe Penelope Cruz, and then that's it. And it doesn't get in for a picture. So maybe they still just get three, which would be also a crazy amount if they got three movies in Best Picture. But I kind of feel like maybe that's the order.

12:42Well, David, you were watching the Club Kid thing firsthand at Middleburg, right? Because you moderated the Q &A with Jordan Firstman? Yes, Jordan Firstman and who else, Katie? Oh, and Colleen Camp, that's right. Supporting player. For those who don't know, that matters quite a bit. And she was shaking hands with every single person there. Colleen Camp, who throws a lot of tastemaker parties in L.A. She is the person who will get all the behind the scenes energy behind something in a way that all the jokes that Katie and I made about Francis Fisher in the two Leslie year. Really, it was calling camp.

13:15Yeah, exactly. And it often is calling camp when you're like, how's that? How's that happening? When did that start? Because she is she's just like a she's a tastemaker in L.A. And she is someone who knows every single person. she's in Club Kid in a supporting role and is firmly, firmly, firmly behind Jordan Firstman in a way that probably should not be ignored. But yeah, I don't, it's hard to tell all of these movies have different strengths and different weaknesses. We talked about, you can see everything. I personally think the invite is, is really strong and probably the safest of the others just because that June release date, I think really helps it.

13:54It's been moving around LA with different permutations of Q &As for months now. It has a lot of people it can dispatch on its behalf. Yeah, the narrative of just Olivia Wilde's comeback with this movie is really strong. The performances, all those actors are so well-liked. Seth Rogen has been going everywhere for it. He was a middleberg. Yeah, but to Chris's point, it doesn't have the mid-film applause break for Julianne Moore. It doesn't have that euphoric feeling coming out of Club Kid of, wow, I really like that movie. I had no expectations for this movie. And that's really compelling in its own right.

14:33I don't think they're going to have four Best Picture nominees just because that doesn't ever happen. But I don't know what the three or two or four will be because they're all in it. But I think it just generally speaks to those last three or four slots or even five slots still feel really malleable for Best Picture. to tie all of these things together. There was a reception at Middleburg where I was talking to some people who were on the board who were all kind of like older-ish women who had gone to see Club Kid with their husbands. So the husbands were all a little iffy on it and they all loved Club Kid and they all had the same reaction that we talk about of being like, I don't know if this is going to be for me and then walking out delighted by it.

15:10And that was shortly after we had watched Colleen Camp being delighted watching Guitary Cadella Fuente performing live. So the... Yes, she was. She and Diane Warren were sitting together. They were dazzled by everyone in that room. Everyone who's encountered him in real life is dazzled by him, as we know. And the other box office story of the weekend in a much smaller way, but significant is La Bola Negra. It was in, what, four theaters, I think? Like very, very small. Yeah, four theaters. Netflix reported box office for the first time. And, you know, they chose well because it did very well in limited release.

15:39Do we know how big the theatrical release is going to be? Have they said how many theaters it's actually going to be planned? I think it's up to 300. Okay. Is that right? Maybe more. For them, that's big. I think when it reaches kind of its it's wide ish birth, it's 300. But yeah, it's got a month before, you know, a full month of actually reporting box office. They're really committing to it. It's been everywhere. David, you did the last of five Q &A's with the team in L.A. on Sunday night. Mere hours after we'd all returned from Middleburg. Really, really remarkable. I mean, Chris, you you talk about box office every week with Sean McNulty.

16:17Does the Lobolo Negro box office feel meaningful to you in any way? Or is it just kind of one extra data point in the awards push for this very big movie? I think it's more than a data point, less than meaningful. But like, so it's like in the middle there. I think it's like great, though. I think that's a great thing to hang its hat on. I think it was the second best per screen average for non-English language films other than Parasite, right? In terms of the debut. So if you're in the headline with Parasite or in the graph of Parasite, Netflix has got to be thrilled with that, right? And I think it just shows that there is an audience for this and that.

16:49But at the same time, like we know like a little bit of like we know this movie has been well received since Cannes and like we've seen it at these festivals. So I'm not surprised that it did really well and that it would do well in theaters. So it's kind of like a little bit of a mix, but it's great to get out there. And I think if people are reticent to historically like throw their support around a Netflix movie because they're not in theaters or whatever, like this is a nice way to be like, we are now and love this movie, which maybe could win Best Picture. So we'll see. Yeah, I feel like I have heard some rival people kind of pointing to the box office thing as being like more of a campaign strategy than anything about them really doing it.

17:26like maybe Narnia will feel different with it. But I mean, David, I think what probably matters more for it is the Q &A vibe at these LA events where they're getting out there. So you watched it firsthand last night. How are they doing winning people over? They're doing quite well. No, it is the most I mean, it is, you know, at the risk of comparing it to Parasite and letting people run wild with that. it is the most charming kind of irresistible group of people that are really unknown to the Academy for the most part. And then, I mean, Penelope Cruz and Glenn Close were not at this particular Q &A, but they've certainly been out and will be getting out for the movie.

18:04So when you throw that in, you know, that's a really compelling combination. I think that the box office really does help cement the kind of campaign and narrative that Netflix wants to run for this movie, which is a kind of old school Miramax-y, big, sweeping, beautiful platform release epic, right? That starts out small, that builds these, the kind of word of mouth that is a lot harder to do post-COVID, but the movie seems to have done that pretty seamlessly. And Netflix is generally good at that, even without giving, you know, reported box office releases. But I think that only helps it because the movie is a kind of a throwback.

18:44and it's a throwback with a very current, timely message and set of campaigners, right? Like you have two queer directors leading the charge for this movie. So that combination of classic and fresh is the movie's sweet spot and the box office reflecting that it can kind of hit that classic aspect of it is really helpful. Yeah, they should really embrace the English patient thing, I think. Like that's only part of the movie, like the middle sequence of it feels the most like that. But I don't know who wants to like conjure Harvey Weinstein. But I think that what you're talking about, David, is exactly right.

19:17That like you say, if you like The English Patient in the 90s, your taste has evolved. Maybe you're ready for something a little bit like bolder than that. Like this is exactly where that is hitting. That's where it makes sense as a 2026, 2027 Best Picture winner, right? Is that it does sort of reflect Academy history while also how it's moved forward. Yeah. I mean, I think a lot of us have been putting it in the second spot behind The Odyssey kind of as a default. The question of if not the Odyssey, what has been the big lingering one? I think it feels pretty firmly in that spot, given where it's I mean, it's kind of at its peak hype right now, obviously, because it's doing this opening.

19:52But it feels like it is earning that spot for now. And I'm not maybe you can see everything is toppled if you ask Chris, but it feels like it's going to it's going to stay there for a little while. Does that feel right to you guys? I think so. I mean, like my enthusiasm for you can see everything aside. I think like logically, yes, LaBella Negro would have to be number two based on how it's performed so far. And like the audience award at TIFF and like all these things, it does feel like it's primed to be that alternate pick. And like you could see a world where it mentioned Parasite or like I was talking about everything everywhere in terms of like you can see everything.

20:24But or like, you know, like if that wins SAG Ensemble, you could see it kind of like steamrolling. You could imagine conjuring old campaigns to compare it to beyond English Patient 2. So it does feel like a safe thing there. I wanted to ask you both because you got to see it. Like, is Guitarica going to be a thing that happens as a acting nominee? Because it feels like... Watching it a second time in Middleburg, I like sat through it. He was better than I remembered. Like, I kind of remember the big overwhelming ensemble. I think he really, as his first performance, that's a huge story for it.

20:56As I said, like, if you meet him afterward, you'll be like, you know, even more dazzled by him. I'm thinking, yes. Like, I think I had him in my predictions already, and now I feel much more firmer about it. Yeah, I mean, it's a tight race for those last couple slots in Supporting Actor. But, I mean, certainly Netflix would love for that to happen. I think that they're pretty bullish on it being possible. It is possible. I think it depends on how he fares in those precursors. precursors. You know, I could see him just through like Globes and Critics' Choice campaigning kind of firming his place in that race.

21:34And that I think will be a crucial first step for him. And then I think for the movie too, right? In terms of like, exactly. Well, yeah, because they, an acting nomination is very important. And that's, that's been its, its perceived weakness so far. Yeah. I mean, I guess Parasite is your comp that you can get it as far as you need to go without an acting nomination. But I do think if like on Oscar nominations, Morning Global, it doesn't have a single one that will hurt that steamroll thing that you're talking about, Chris. And I think they're embracing a comparison to Moonlight where everyone goes supporting Mahershala Ali, who kind of becomes the torch.

22:05Although Naomi Harris got nominated too, didn't she? She did. Okay, so all right. Get Lola Duaneus in there, who for my money is the best. I think they believe more in the Penelope Cruz possibility, but yes, Lola Duaneus is amazing. But Lola Duaneus is incredible in that movie. Yeah, she is. Okay, before we do more festival gossip, do any of you have any big takeaways from the Academy Museum Gala, which happened on Saturday. As we said, everyone was in Middleburg and hopping on a plane and probably from Montclair also, all around the world to make sure they see Taylor Swift perform. I've just like looked through the photos, basically.

22:36So I'm kind of at a loss in information. Were there any big winners from this, from what we can all tell from outside of it? Taylor Swift. Yeah, Taylor Swift, right? She did what she came there to do, right? Yeah. She has staked her claim in this race. She's out there. She took pictures with many, many people who were in this race. A lot of Academy. Oh, were they? I missed them. I saw her with like Bill Kramer and the, you know, Academy staff. Yeah, the whole crew. That race is going to be fascinating to watch. I maybe naively think this is the year she will at least get in finally. There's a combination of elements that make it feel more possible.

23:18But as we know, there are only four slots for Best Original Song because one is reserved for Diane Warren. And Diane says she has two songs, which I learned in Middleburg. She's got one for a Maserati movie. Apparently that's her pivot. That's her focus now. That's what I'm told. By any means didn't have. Versus by any means, which was her. I do need to. I think I need to update my pundit picks for that. I'm so fascinated by the original song race because we've had, you know, it comes and goes. Last year it was such a steamroller with Golden. And I think we were sitting at dinner at Middleburg, David, and I was like, oh, but the debut song, like that's the front runner, right?

23:49And that song, yeah. Everyone else disagreed with me and thought it was La Nieve, the La Bola Negra song. So that's an interesting race in itself. Then you third Taylor Swift in the mix. I don't know, Chris, do you think Taylor's getting in? I kind of, I do think she's getting in. I think it really helps that the song is great. Like, I think people just like the song. And so like, that plus the toy story of it, like where those songs always get in and it feels like it's like a nice song. It's not like, like the other, like was she ever going to, what was, like she did, the song she's done previously were not as formidable, I don't believe.

24:21I would argue none of her movie songs have been any of, like, close to her best work. This is the best one that she's had, but they've all been kind of, like, album cast-offs, and this one is a little bit closer to the real thing. And it feels like, again, it's a credit song, sure, but it does feel like more tying into the movie than these other songs, too. It does feel, like, important to the movie. I think the song is, even if it's at the end. And the movie's a guaranteed nominee in another category, which has to help, too. I think so. So I don't know. I don't think she's I don't think she's going to win, but I think she will get in and that'll be nice.

24:52And we'll see what happens from there. Am I crazy that I think that the Jesse Eisenberg debut song is still really competitive or am I just like. No, no, I do, too. I mean, it just, you know, when you're talking about Taylor Swift and a movie that is in that top three for best picture, it will see. We'll see. Well, the song is amazing. And the narrative there with Jesse is. Well, during this dinner while we were talking about this, a few tables away, Julianne Moore was eating. And one of the other big takeaways from Middleburg was everyone you looked at being like, well, she's going to win. Like there was just no hesitation.

25:23That's going to keep happening over the next several months. I didn't expect it not to, but it was just like no one tried to make another argument, which is the way that it should be. And also impressive to see it happen. All right, Chris, we've talked too much about Middleburg. You were at the Montclair Film Festival this weekend. Do you want to plug the panel that you did before I ask you for your Oscar buzz? I would love to plug the panel. So I hosted a panel yesterday, Katie, on Sunday, actually, with it was called Who Gets to Make Movies Now? What a great thing. Great question. And we found out anybody can really make movies.

25:55We answered that question. But it was me and we had a couple of people. We had Wesley Wang, who was is he is like 20 something. He dropped out of Harvard to start his own company. But before that, he made a short film, Nothing Except Everything, it was called. And it got like 10 million views. So he was a nice to just be totally owned by like a young person, which is always great. And then we had Allison Morgan, who is a producer at Montclair Film Festival, but also was like a writer and director who's had short films and stuff, which was really fun. And she has a feature film, too, I think on Hulu.

26:30And then Emily Tess Katz, who's the head of content at Mad Reality. So it was a great panel. We talked all about the future of movies. The audience was really nice and they had good questions. I did audience questions. I don't always love doing that. but I was like, it looked like it, the room looked cool. And I was like, I think we could do it. Middletberg doesn't do audience questions. I was like, we shouldn't do it. And then I was like, you know, it didn't look like is all lost. Do you remember that apocryphal story? Boy, I don't think it's apocryphal. I feel like many people we know witnessed that happen.

26:56David, do you know that one? No, I don't think so. All is lost. The screening of Robert Redford movie, right? J.C. Chandor. And it was at New York Film Festival. And then they opened up the audience Q &A. And the first question, I think like it was one of the first questions I was like, is all lost? It really makes you think. Yeah. Yeah. And that's why I don't do audience questions. Good reason. Well, so Chris, you also revisited a movie at Montclair. Also, I don't know if there were any weird audience questions, but great movie. Wild Horse Nine. Boy, is it good. Absolute. Just smash. That's the second time I've seen it.

27:30And I was like, this is what if it's better than I even thought. I thought it was just so good. Played really well opening night in the room. I heard Stephen Colbert. So Montclair Film Festival is obviously like Stephen Colbert home crowd is his wife, Evie. Evie is like the co-founder or co-chair now. And she's now an emeritus. I think she's moved on as like the president, but they're heavily involved. And it was like Patrick Wilson, who's a local celeb here in Montclair or in the Montclair area. Anyway, just heard Stephen Colbert hysterical laughing through this movie. Oh, that's fun. Like you could hear him laughing.

28:02That's great. I love that. And he was just loving it, I thought. And he was very enthused. I didn't talk to him, but like I could just tell by his laughter. Yeah. Played great. And you'll be shocked to know a lot of the movies that I'm sure you guys saw there were also here at the Montclair Film Festival. And all the ones that we've said have played great, continue to play great. Anecdotally, just talking to people here or whatever, like Club Kid, like I said, Wild Horse Nine. I Play Rocky also played really well here. It played very well. I saw it finally in Middleburg and it played really well.

28:32The crowd was very into it. it's a lot of crowd pleasers I don't know I don't know what's going to happen with all these movies how is there room for all these crowd pleasers as I wrote about it in my newsletter I did the Q &A with Martin McDonough after Wild Horse 9 in Middleburg and that DC crowd like CIA veterans in there probably they were all about it they were on their feet for Wild Horse 9 they didn't watch through it so I didn't get to hear the laughter but I wish I had but actually my pick for the crowd pleaser of Middleburg and David you again saw it first hand was Wicker everybody wanted to see Wicker oh my god that's awesome i walked past just the line of people going into it it was the most crowded that i saw that space uh in the hotel and then david you did the olivia coleman q a after right it was the well because because of the way that middleberg is structured the screening room's capacity is is flexible let's say so i was told before the q a started it was the fullest that room had ever been um the press got an email like about a week before that screening basically being like this is sold, like the demand for this is genuinely unprecedented for this festival.

29:36We can't guarantee you're getting in. Please don't come. There's other good movies playing at this time. And it was true. I mean, it's in a ballroom. So you walk in for the Q &A and it's just, the rows are like wall to wall, front to back. the craziest, most enthusiastic crowd I'd seen at that festival in the years I've been going there. The movie is such a delight. I love it so much. I feel like we don't, we haven't really given much space in this conversation. And, you know, I don't think it's going to become like a big Oscar player or anything, but it is one that is, you know, it's generated many memes, as that film would be ripe to do.

30:24and that is kind of extended to what the movie is, which is something very, very original, really fun, a great Olivia Colman performance. If you don't have her in your Globes comedy picks, I might look at that race and rethink it. What if I put her in my act? Like what if I put her in Oscar picks? I was just going to ask this. Best actress is fertile territory. And you were talking about this last week, like in terms of it getting in for makeup, right? Where it's like, oh. I think that has to happen. The way the makeup branch works. It's really remarkable. I haven't seen this movie yet, but just hearing you guys talk about it again, it sounds like very similar to the stuff we're saying where it's like, this is a movie that people are just loving, right?

31:02Like kind of like all these crowd, like people are really responding to it. And like in a best actress race where we know it's flexible and there's like not a ton. I mean, there's small, I think there's enthusiasm for all these people on like an individual level, but the only one that has got the most enthusiasm is obviously Julianne Moore. But like, what if Olivia Colman can get in for this? Like, I don't know. Like if enough people see it, I guess that's the barrier. But if it's playing so well, maybe they will. And it's a big swing of her performance. And she's so good in the movie. She also has, you know, she was there.

31:34She was there for Q &As with two movies. Yeah. We don't associate Olivia Colman with someone who gets out on the trail all that much. So to see her getting out there for Elsinore and for this, you know, smaller passion project, I think says a lot about what she thinks of the movies and about their ability to play. I don't know what the box office tracking is, and it's Black Bear that's releasing. Yeah, I think that they're hoping it's kind of their first breakout. Yeah, I just feel like in a world where Verity is opening that way, like it's a similar audience, like it's got the romanticity tie-in that's like such a popular book genre that there haven't really been a lot of movie versions of.

32:14Like if the people, if the audience for this, I did, our friend Joanna Robinson sent me a picture of a wicker like standee in the ripped bodice romantic bookstore in L.A. So that word's getting out to the people it should be with. I just I hope next week that we get to talk about wicker as a breakout hit and go from there. I was going to say what if we've been talking so much about like double nominees and what if it's Olivia Colman for Elsinore and wicker out of nowhere? Like, I mean, like it's I think Elsinore is possible, too. Oh, yeah. Because like she's like really great and like obviously like a coattail on Andrew Scott.

32:47But like, yeah, like what if Wick? I don't know. I'm like, I can't believe I'm going to talk about it. But I'm like, it really sounds like this could be something that I think a lot of people maybe weren't expecting as seriously until maybe this past week or so. Yeah, there were whispers from some studio people that I talked to in Middleburg that they're like, this movie could actually be a hit, you know, for the size of the movie, obviously. And from there, who knows? It's been such a good year for hits. I want to see it keep going. Okay, we should probably wrap this up. David, is there anything else from Middleburg that stuck out to you that will linger with you, either gossip-wise or just watching how people are being received?

33:25You just never know who's going to be there. There's a lot of Bill Pullman action. Bill Pullman was everywhere. He was everywhere. You mentioned Julianne Moore opening night at the debut. I watched her walk through that opening night party, and it was like the Queen was moving through. like she was people were so blown away by her to have her and Olivia Colman there was like a lot of not at the same time tragically like waiting for them to to overlap it always shocks me like when I see this like they're just everywhere like Julianne Moore was at London Film Festival like on Sunday you know what I mean like it's just like the amount of travel I think Jack O 'Connell flew straight from London to Middleburg because I did a Q &A with him for Inc just crazy so many of these people are going to Savannah where I will be this weekend And I'll be doing a Q &A with Nathan Fielder and Lance Oppenheim for You Can See Everything.

34:14Well, let's look back to that to end this, I guess, because when we were talking about it playing well, like it doesn't sound it's not going to do the La Bola Negro five Q &A's in a night thing, presumably. But it does sound like they're both going to get out there for this to the extent that they can. Yeah, I mean, the rollout has been brilliant. I think we can all agree that this has just been an unbelievable way to build excitement for the movie, the Telluride secret screening. Nathan Fielder did an interview with Wired this week, and he was talking about the kind of short window and how he was a little unsure about it from Telluride when nobody knew about the movie to just a month later releasing it.

34:51But it's clearly worked out okay. It worked just fine. There's the spoiler element, but now they're going to get out there. And I think the more they talk about it and the more a certain someone also can talk about it, you can center it more in the awards conversation. Because rightly, they've just been focused on this movie gets nowhere without organic buzz and public excitement. And not revealing too much so that people want to see it. And now they can do a little bit differently. Like I'm moderating a Q &A in Savannah, which is going to be insane having done Q &As there where like Dylan O 'Brien, I did worry for his safety a little bit last year or two years ago, whenever that was like it's college students.

35:33There's I'm kidding, but there's the enthusiasm is like the enthusiasm is. Yes, the enthusiasm is like you've never seen. And so, you know, this Q &A, there's going to be there's not going to be a way to contain whatever happens in that room. Right. In the way that might be true of of other more industry centric crowds. Yeah. Interesting. OK, I will wrap it up there for David. Thank you for coming back to join us, obviously. For those of you listening, stick around. I'm going to be back in a moment with my conversation with Alden Ehrenreich about a talent for murder. David and Chris, have you either of you guys seen this one yet?

36:10I'm Stephen Tana. Oh, excellent. He was so delightful to talk to. It's sort of being Tom Ripley and sort of not in a really interesting way with him and Helen Mirren playing Patricia Highsmith. And David, I talked about his theater in L.A. for a long time. I don't know if you have caught this spot. Absolutely. But he's deeply investing in Los Angeles professional theater, which is very exciting. Fresh off his Tony Wynn. Exactly. I know. Well, he was honestly getting to talk to someone about their like deep passion project theater was so fun. So everyone look forward to listening to that. We'll be back in a moment.

36:50So what I didn't realize until I was just reading up for this is that this project was going to go with, I guess, you and Anton Corbin were working together. And then it fell apart for like a year before Tom for Murder actually got made. I know that's not uncommon at all in the world of indie film, but like what is that year? What do you spend that year doing, thinking about, talking about before you get up and go do it again? Basically, we had this week of rehearsals in 2020, whatever it was. And then, yeah, then it fell apart. And then I was of the mind because these I've had movies fall apart and say, oh, we're going to try to get it back going.

37:28And it never gets back going. Sure, sure. In my mind, this movie was not happening. Yeah. And then later into the year, at some point, they came back and said, oh, I think we've figured it out now. And I don't know the ins and outs of exactly what happened, but then it was like everybody had to kind of dust off their scripts and remind themselves what this was all about. And I kind of, you know, we were, I think, a couple weeks from shooting. So it was really, we were kind of ready to go. Yeah. And so we had a jump start, you know. Well, when you, you know, you get used to something that falls apart entirely, is it just a process of kind of making your piece of being like, well, I had that dream and it's gone and it will never exist.

38:07And it's, you know, as an actor, you get roles, you don't get all kinds of things, but it just seems hard to ever get used to. It's one of a lot of things that you just have no control over. I think the worst case scenario drives you sort of crazy and makes you a bit of a kook. And then best case scenario, you get better at letting go of things you don't have any control over, which sounds – that makes it sound like it's either or. I think that's like moment to moment, which kind of – When are you a kook and when do you have a peaceful acceptance of going back into it? Just how a movie comes out.

38:41I'd say it's much more painful to have a movie that you thought was going to be great come out poorly or have your own work in a movie not understood or – I don't mean by audiences. I mean, by like, like my best experiences, you know, when you go to a movie and you're like, oh, they get what I were. We had the editor or the director had this gets sort of what the take is or who this person is the same way I do. The performance that you were giving is the what you thought like you see on screen what you thought you were giving on the set. I think so. Or at least how you aspired for it to turn out, you know, best case scenario.

39:14Or at least you feel like an emotional. it's interesting like the longer you do this like you can feel um this is a hard thing to describe but you can really feel in an edit how sort of emotionally tuned in the people making it are to the material itself you can feel if they care about seeing into the eyes of the people on screen or if we're just cutting to information bit i think maybe this is somewhat the influence of television or people watching things on smaller screens or whatever it is but like there's a kind kind of a shorthand get the information of the story across version that is very different from a living in it and feeling it version of an edit.

39:55Yeah. Do you feel like you can see that in something you didn't make? Or is it only if you were there to make it that you can kind of see that difference? I feel like I can feel it in something I didn't make, yeah. Okay. Oh, you mean as an actor? Oh, I just like to watch something and be like, oh, the actors are giving something that the show is not that, or the movie or whatever is not that interested in. I don't really know if I can tell what the actors were doing outside of what I'm getting to see, but I can definitely feel if I've read a script and I see something that, you know, even if I wasn't a part of it.

40:27And I think a little bit of what this is, I hope this isn't too fancy seeming, but like, I think a little bit of this is like about embodiment, about like, are the people making it emotionally connected to what it's about and sort of in an empathetic relationship to what's going on inside of these characters. And if they are, then you feel like maybe they hold on that shot a little bit longer to see that person wince, or maybe it's that. But if they are just like in their heads trying to get this particular information across, then you can, there's a texture to the edit that feels different. Yeah.

41:03And I've been a part of things. I was, you know, in one movie where it was, to me, one of the most emotional roles I'd ever played, even though it was sort of a genre movie. And the way it came out, I was like, oh, we're just, we're just either cutting to the joke or we're just, you know, it didn't have the kind of, it didn't feel like what, that they were that interested in that part of it, you know? Yeah. It's just the kind of thing that makes an actor open his own theater. You're just like, no more cutting-by performances. Among other things. Yeah. I mean, my, my, my, yeah, Yeah, for sure. Yeah, there's a certain, I think some actor, you know, Helen Mirren, speaking of this movie, is someone who feels like she's worked as an actor her whole life.

41:48She knows the drill. She has a thick skin around it. She knows what to do. She knows how to give a performance that people are compelled by and is, I think, comfortable being a journeyman actor in that way and obviously a master of her craft. I have a hard time you know because I also I've gotten very spoiled I've gotten to work for great filmmakers so it's hard for me to stomach what ends up happening with some of the work and so that's pushed me to you know direct a short film and feature hopefully soon and then and open the theater as part of going like well this is at least what I'm interested in better or worse but it's what I want to not miss out on getting the chance to see.

42:31Well, the feature is interesting because I was going to ask if it felt like an either or thing, like either you can pursue making your own stuff or have a theater. I mean, running a theater seems like very time consuming. So presumably there's some balance of it, but it sounds like both feel possible to you like as artistic expressions. Yeah. I mean, you could talk to anyone in my life about how like balancing those things is quite a big subject right now. Who's watering the plants behind you? That is what you're going to figure out. Yeah, yeah. But yeah, I think that there's I think there's a finding a finding a way to stay inspired and stay working on things that are inspiring to you is is is a big part of the part of the life, I guess.

43:16Yeah. Yeah. And working really, really hard in the process of finding and hanging on to those things, it seems like. Yeah, I mean, I got so lucky. I got to be exposed to great films and I had great teachers when I was a kid. And so this like spark of inspiration got lit up and I worked with great filmmakers. Like, right, my first film was for Francis Ford Coppola and he was a very formative influence in my life. And so it's almost like a kind of love of something that's so you feel it so much and that you want to find a way to keep that alive. Yeah. Yeah, I wanted to ask about that early start that you got because you're getting an agent when you're a teenager and kind of jumping into acting.

43:54I mean, not like you're going on auditions nonstop like some people do, but I'm curious if that spark that you had when you were a teenager that started this, you know, you work with Coppola obviously as part of it, but I wonder if it feels the same like now that you are an adult and you've had this career for a long time, is there some of that same impulse still there? Yeah, I think trying to keep that impulse alive, trying to protect that kind of spark of inspiration. You know, when you're 17, it's very easy, or at least it was for me. And it felt like the people I was around to have like a clear sense of like, oh, this thing is sort of bold.

44:24This thing feels real. This has integrity. This doesn't. This is what I love. This is who's a great actor. This is who's a hack. Blah, blah, blah. And, you know, what's the line in Rhinestone Cowboy? There'll be a load of compromising on the road to my horizon or something like that. having a life and, and, um, and having a career and, you know, these things that I, I think actors probably think about way too much, but it is a part of it of like, okay, this director wants me for this role. That's the best script I've ever read. And it's the greatest role I've ever had, but he can't cast me because what I was in last year didn't make enough money.

45:04And he's telling me that, okay, so how do I find things? How do I, how do I keep moving forward, not do things that sort of blunt the inspiration or, or, or turn, make me like jaded about it. And, and because when you are on a set of something you don't care about, it does start to eat away at your relationship to the thing itself. How do I, how do I, how do I balance that and not become a sort of careerist? How do I stay on that? And then there's, you know, if you have a certain amount of success, then people, then you and people around you don't want to walk, do moves that feel like you're walking back from that success.

45:41But that what success is, is something you kind of have to try to define for yourself. So it's a bit vague, but you know, it's, it's a bit of a dance every year. Well, it's also what growing up is, you know, just a lot of being like when you're a teenager, you think things are very specific and black and white and then everything gets harder and harder as it goes. But it is so specific if you have a public career of saying like the, you know, you made a movie that made this much money, it's not enough. Or like someone says, oh, why did he choose that thing? And there's so many people who are going to come to you and be like, I know what is the right thing.

46:11I know how this is going to work for you. And when you're 20, I imagine you listen to them because who knows otherwise. And what's figuring that part of it out? Not just always listening just to yourself, I assume, but listening to the right people or knowing who the right people are. I always wonder how people figure that out. Oh, man, it's such a great question. I think when I was 20, I listened to everybody a lot less. I think I was like really kind of brash. Everybody kind of gets different opportunities. Some people get a certain amount of commercial success that opens up a lot of doors for them.

46:42Some people don't. Some people choose to not, you know, play the game at all. Some people play the game and they get trapped in the game. I think it requires to constantly nurture and cultivate a sense of your own internal quiet, what it is that you actually love and lights you up. And I think that's about work and career, but I think that's about your whole life. Like maybe I'm a person who wants to have a family and get married, or maybe my culture has taught me that I'm a person who wants to have a family and get married, you know? How do I hear what's true for me in this and sort of grow past the voices of my family, my culture, my community that I grew up in, and sort of move into the life that actually wants to sort of live through me, to borrow a phrase from James Hollis, who's a guy that I love.

47:38He's great. He's brilliant. He's a lot smarter than I am about this. So, yeah, I think it's a constant balance finding, I mean, if we're talking about agents and managers, finding people who actually see the thing you see, and you're kind of making the same movie who care about the thing you care about. And I guess the last thing, what's important to me right now is to make space to swing for the fences of the kind of experimental quality or like try the certain things when it comes to acting, try certain things when it comes to filmmaking, try certain things when it comes to theater that made me – it's really why I got into this in the first place.

48:17and not have, you know, and so make sure that alongside good jobs and working with filmmakers I respect, I'm also making enough space and time to like do the slightly more out there risky thing, which feels to me right now like that resides in building this theater and in making my first film as a director. And so like if those two things are happening, then we'll see what happens with the balance of that on the other side of that. Yeah, I assume you have plenty of people being like opening a theater in Los Angeles. Why in the world would you do that? I think LA theater gets underrated and obviously there's a lot of great actors in town, but I wonder how risky it was treated as a decision when you decided to jump into opening your theater.

49:00It was risky in like in so many like categories. It was very risky financially. It was very risky. Yeah, like just in a lot of different ways. The impetus of it was very much what we're talking about, which is like, OK, I'm watching incredible artists in L.A. sort of like lose connection with the spark that got them into this in the first place. Not because sometimes that's money, why people start doing work that they don't actually love. A lot of times I think it's a need for a sense of belonging. I think like you go to a party and someone says, what are you up to? And there's this kind of high school factor that I think I think Hollywood really functions a lot like high school.

49:40And I think maybe just adult life functions like high school where I want an answer that's going to make this person go, ooh, you know. And so maybe I take a job that I don't actually love, but it's that or stay in my room trying to finish my novel or whatever it is. And feeling like everyone else is working. So why aren't you? Why aren't you the person who got called in for this thing? There's like the auditioning over and trying for jobs over and over again creates a lot of that that you're talking about, I think. Yeah, and I think I've seen it with like A-list movie stars I've gotten to be around where there is constantly this sense that there's some center that everybody needs to be moving towards and get into.

50:15And then the reality is that there actually isn't. That center actually doesn't. That center is publicity. That center is show and isn't real. And so there are artists that I really admire who feel like they were comfortable, probably more comfortable than I've been in living outside of that pursuit of that kind of paper tiger or whatever it is. But yeah, the idea of the theater was, I think, like if people had a community of other artists who they were in conversation with and pushing each other where the focus is just on how good can this performance be? How good can this play be? What else can you try here?

50:54I think that would actually alleviate a lot of that pressure. I think that pressure is about groupthink and belonging as much as it is about money sometimes. And so like, so the theater is, and then the other tier of the theater is to have like a home for certain kinds of off-Broadway plays that I just wasn't seeing come here or were coming here and not playing to the right audiences or like a kind of theater Eastside LA that's like, that has a certain kind of work that I wanted to put on. And so those two things in tandem, and we have a few things that have been happening that feel exactly like what I want that to feel like, which is amazing.

51:32We're about to open. I can talk. I don't want to go on and on about it, but there's some things. We're about to open with our first production, and we have our playwrights. That's so exciting. Some things, yeah. Well, also, giving people work in L.A. is not a small thing these days, given how few things manage to shoot in the city. Totally. And letting people see their audience right in front of them, it's major. Yeah, that's the goal. And there's great, great actors that some of them we've gotten very lucky with the people who've come. Like Robert Downey Jr. did a reading for us and Stephanie Hsu and Ali Shaka and great actors who people know.

52:06And then there's a bunch of actors that just never hit the right slot machine but are as good as anybody and are incredible. and getting to kind of put them on stage next to these more famous people and kind of embrace something that's really about how good is this person, not about their IMDb Pro Star Meter, you know, is kind of a part of what's fun. Have you ever been asked to know your IMDb Pro Star Meter? Hopefully people are doing that for you. No. I mean, I was, I mean, I'm not immune to caring about these things, which is probably why I'm doing all this in a way. That one was a very specific thing to care about.

52:42I just think that's probably the most like egregious. I think that and like Rotten Tomatoes has become so normalized. But I think in a way that is too. It's like. Oh, yeah. And I think it's I love the Digger advertised like a mediocre Rotten Tomatoes score as a badge of honor. I think that was so cool. Yeah. Like there's I think Steven Soderbergh said this. There's like there used to be a lot of merit to like divided opinions about something. not does everybody at school think this person should be homecoming king um and uh uh yeah i think one time i was i was making something as a filmmaker and uh there was a conversation around like where somebody's imdb pro star meter was and i was like egads that's not you get out of here wait do you have a dicker take you want to launch because everyone seems to be making I haven't seen it yet, so I don't know.

53:37But I love Tom Cruise working with, you know, in a read to Tom Cruise is to me over the course of his whole career, just done the thing that I love when actors do, which is like he's worked with every great director. I mean, especially in a more arthouse way in like the 90s and 2000s. But like he's just, you know, always gone after filmmakers, which I think is the best. It's awesome. So I'm excited. But talking about filmmakers, I want to come back to Anton Corbin here. I mean, you say you start your career with Coppola. You're watching, you know, you're learning how directors work by watching someone who like Coppola, who's done it for so long.

54:12And I'm curious what that teaches you to look for in the directors you want to work with. You don't want everyone to be the same. And it kind of depends on what it is. But if you where your brain goes when you meet a director and say, OK, I trust you, I want to go on this road with you. Sometimes it's a body of work. It's like the most easy way to, you know, if somebody made a film, especially somewhat recently, that was great, you know, I think that to me, it's that person's zeal and love for the material. Like if they're doing this because they vaguely want to direct a movie or if they like think it's going to help them direct a different movie or blah, blah, blah.

54:51You know, like I want to be in something that that filmmaker is in love with because that permeates every moment of the experience. And you have no control over how the movie is going to come out either artistically, critically or commercially. But you can somewhat at least try to predict what an experience is going to be like. And to me, if that filmmaker really genuinely loves that material, it's why you're, I think, often in better hands with a writer-director, then, you know, that at least lends a depth to the experience, however it comes out, that feels meaningful. So how did that come in part in Talent for Murder?

55:30Yeah, well, I thought, you know, Anton is obviously like a real artist and he was really, I think, delighted in this story and really liked the Highsmith character and all of that. And then for me, a lot of it was this is a role that your roles that were, you know, really enticing to play. And and then Helen, you know, like getting to kind of do this chamber piece with Helen was very was very exciting. Yeah. Yeah. Well, the way that you're describing the timing, if you know, you're starting in this in the end of 23, that's after Oppenheimer's coming out. And I don't you know, you make a movie and it can have all kinds of impacts on you.

56:09But I wonder if being in that movie, the success of that movie and what you got to do with it with Robert Downey Jr. kind of put you in a headspace that made you want to go toe to toe with an actor again or made you feel like you could make something smaller. Like, did you think about how that kind of affected the choices that you could make or wanted to make? That's a good question. I don't remember quite where. I don't remember. I don't remember 2023 that well. I don't think so in that sense. I mean, it was amazing to be an Oppenheimer and it was very, I felt very grateful that I ended up getting like folded into so much of the movie.

56:42Like I, it was, you know, I think I showed up and I was, I think, 71st on the call sheet. And I felt like, I hope if people, and I hope at the end of this, if people even know my name, but, but yeah, it was, you know, and then, and then Nolan and Downey were just like incredible to work with. I don't remember. I think it was on the other end of the strikes. And I think honestly. Oh, sure. I guess Fair Play was a Netflix movie. It wasn't a Netflix movie. Netflix bought it. But it was a movie that I did. I think it had been a minute since I was like taking on a lead role. And I think there is. There's a lot of fun in playing supporting parts.

57:22And there's, I think, a little more safety in playing supporting parts. And there's also like. Yeah, it's great. It's really fun to do. It's great. But there's a kind of the actors, the performances that I loved and grew up caring about were typically like they're the movie in that way. So it was I think part of it was the draw for that. And I feel a bit of that. Yeah. I was going to ask if it feels really great to be in a giant hit movie, but you're not the star. So it's not as much pressure. Like you just get to be in it, but not have to lead the whole thing or get the box office credit for it or anything like that.

57:55It seems ideal to me. Well, if you're the lead and it goes well, then it's great, though. But if you're when you're making it, if you're not the lead, you know that, you know, it's not you're not you're not at the center of it. Yeah. But there's also to make the movie. Sure. Exactly. It depends on the supporting part. I mean, you know, some of some supporting parts are the best roles in the movie. Yeah. Fair Play. Also great. You haven't seen A Place in Hell yet. Right. Her next movie. No, no. But I feel, yeah, Andrew Scott and Michelle Williams are like probably my two favorite actors under the age of 65 or 70 now.

58:34Which is about right. Yeah, yeah. They're just, I just adore them. So I'm very excited to see it. Yeah, and Andrew Scott, a fellow Ripley. Although technically your character in this doesn't get called Ripley. So I don't know if you guys get to share a brotherhood with that or not. It seems like you feel okay calling him Ripley a little bit. I should ask somebody about this because the reason he's not called Ripley was not a creative decision. I really understand. It's very non-canon, the story we're telling. But I don't know. I should either stop going around just calling him Ripley. I took a bit of a stance when we were making it.

59:13I was like, let's just not say he's Ripley and let's just let him be Ripley, basically. I think we should be allowed to fiddle with our characters. in that way and go beyond canon and see what comes out of it, which is what I think makes it so interesting. That does it for today's episode. This podcast is edited by Brett Fox and produced by Brett Fox and me. Our theme music is by Dave Gonzalez. Thanks again to our co-host this week, David Canfield. Subscribe to the Prestige Junkie newsletter at theankler.com and subscribe to this podcast on Apple, Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts.

59:47Don't forget there's a video version that you should watch if you're not already. We'll see you next week.