Proper Calcio Weather

0:22hello and welcome back to the studio podcast i'm isukwong kwanga i'm ryan hun Ryan, how are you doing? I'm alright, thanks for having a long time no see What, like a few hours no see? A few hours longer than it should have been which is why we're late Yes But actually How are you? Exhilarated, tired but exhilarated Yeah, I mean before we start we hope everyone's staying safe and well wherever you are Yeah, yeah, goodness And we hope everyone's doing okay We're recording this Monday evening before we all go and watch Moose's beloved Manchester United at home to Bournemouth some admin quick from today for the last two weeks in December you can get all of the podcasts ad free and in full for free by going to patreon.com forward slash stadio and you can just sign up as a free member you'll get three shows this week ad free and in full or I suppose two more technically if you're listening to this on the free feed and you'll get the stadios you'll get the football things to be grateful for episode ad free and in full until the 31st of December.

1:27Go to patreon.com forward slash stadio and you can sign up as a free member. However, if you do wish to sign up as a paid member, you can still do that and it would be much appreciated. Obviously, we'd love the support and we appreciate everyone who's signed up so far. You can sign up for the podcast or if you want to get involved with the Stadio Social Club Discord and all those kinds of things, you can sign up as a Stadio Social Club member. So yeah, patreon.com forward slash stadio and you'll get to hear the stadios and the football things to be grateful for episode on Christmas Day ad free and in full.

2:00So there you go. Our little offer for the rest of the year. Get involved. Tuck in. Shows this week. We're going to do Monday, Thursday, Friday this week. And I think we've got Monday and Christmas Day next week and then two the week after. Christmas Day. We won't be live stream on Christmas Day. Just don't worry. No, I'm doing the I'm doing my four-hour Svita Bundesliga look back at the season so far on Christmas Day. The worrying thing is there's probably a demand for that. I'm not doing that. You're not. Today, we are going to shout out a few results up top very quickly and then we're going to talk about a trip that Moose and I did this weekend where we watched a game in Serie B between Venezia and Monza on Saturday and then we saw Milan's draw against Sassuolo on Sunday.

2:48It was our first time at both grounds and it was quite an interesting weekend for us in terms of two very different footballing experiences but two really wonderful footballing experiences. And it got us thinking because two very different clubs and two wonderful grounds that are not going to be around a huge amount longer. Right, which is scarcely believable in the latter case at least. Yeah, so we thought that we wanted to just get a bit excited and kind of geek out a little bit. But first, let's wrap up some results. So there's only one place to begin? There is, actually. You won't begin there, but there is one place to begin.

3:29I think in Manchester. You're probably going to go to Manchester, but I would begin in Sunderland. Nope. Oggs there, three, Lille, four. Jesus Christ. Four red cards. Seven goals in Liga this weekend. It was right there. It was right there. It was right there. so that was a game of the weekend it was fair enough it was let's start in the Bundesliga very quickly before we then do the Premier League because there was quite a big weekend in the Bundesliga St. Pauli won their first game since the 14th of September I think in the league they obviously had a cup win a few weeks ago a 2-1 win at home against Heidenheim which was a massive win considering that Eric Smith got sent off before half time so a much much needed win for St.

4:13Pauli Leverkusen beat Köln on Saturday night in the derby. And then on Sunday, a couple of really big draws, actually. Because Dortmund drew one all with Freiburg. And Bayern then drew, they came from behind to draw two all against Leipzig. Right on, yeah. And Union had beaten Leipzig. So none of the top three won this weekend. And a huge point for Mainz, who are bottom and looking in big, big trouble. Four points behind Heidenheim still after that win. But it suddenly got very interesting because Augsburg lost as well. Yeah, lots more to come. Lots more to come there. I was looking to lose into Frankfurt.

4:52So yeah, Bundesliga really delivering on excitement this weekend. Really delivering. Next to La Liga, maybe? Yeah, we need to talk about La Liga quick because Real Madrid are fine. They are. Just let Xabi Alonso do his job. I saw a comment from someone saying that they thought that that Xabi Alonso had basically been dining out on one incredible season at Leverkusen. Anybody who says that wasn't aware of the reconstruction job he did at Leverkusen when he took charge in his first season. And the work that he did, the position they were in, and the brilliant work that he did, the Europa League run that he got them on, the results he was getting out of them, the tune he was getting out of them.

5:36So yeah, I think that that is a coach who doesn't get credit for the foundational work he does and rebuilding squads, reconfiguring squads, and the fact that a coach like that just needs time. And the discourse around Madrid has toxified to the extent that it threatens to push a very, very good coach out of the door, an outstanding coach, and I just don't see any reason for it. I think people just need to calm down, actually. We've said before that we would be very, very surprised. We think it would be a terrible decision if they wanted to sack Alonso. But if defeat to Alaves probably would have, you could have seen it happening after that because it would have just felt like you know three defeats in a week it would have felt like if Real Madrid were going to do it then at least they could be seen to be doing something in quotation marks I think that it wasn't easy going against Alaves thought Alaves were pretty good but they got the win that's all that they kind of really needed another great goal from Bape another strike for Rodrigo I mean what's not to like so yeah just some of us need to calm down I think that's the that's the headline Musa Kwanga says just some people just need to calm down I think they do I just think it gets a bit extra sometimes and I think sometimes you dignify discourse by giving it oxygen not us we're a podcast we're literally meant to give it oxygen but within a club sometimes narratives have to just be like stop and again it comes back to that thing of I do think in a different iteration in Madrid I do think if Kroos or Modric or both were there it would just be like come on guys like really because actually what we're really seeing with Madrid now is how much of a lid those guys kept on stuff actually and now there's not really a handbrake on anymore but anyway Barcelona beating Osasuna 2-0 2 from Rafinha yes Atleti beating Valencia 2-1 and there was a big result down the bottom of the table Girona beating Real Sociedad way at Anueta 2-1 to open up a 5 point gap on Oviedo below them and go level on points with Valencia above them after that like I mentioned their defeat to Atleti we'll talk about Serie A maybe in a little bit but should we go to the Premier League yes the big result there Sunderland 1 Newcastle 0 poor poor poor Nick Voltemada with the own goal it's just one of those things that feels you know what I think the thing about it was such a good header but I think as well it's such an absurd outcome for him that you almost just have to be like you have to shrug and go that is life yeah there's nothing really could do about it I don't think you know a game with very few chances funnily enough it was only ever really going to be decided in a way like that and Sunderland putting an exclamation point on an that's not patronising an outstanding start to the season incredible implies that this was not on the cards let's put it differently an outstanding start to the season getting the new signings to gel and full credit to coach and players and fans actually to road they look a little bit in this game though.

8:37Yeah, but who doesn't in a derby? Who doesn't in a derby? I think Brian Broby was very, very lucky to stay on the pitch. Yeah. Very lucky actually. In any derby, like, you have to ride your luck and for, I mean, spectacularly petty, they didn't even list Newcastle on the scoreboard. So when they took the lead, it was like, Sunderland won visitors nil. There was an amazing bit in this game as well. I think it was near the end when there was the flurry of bookings. yeah everyone was kicking off because of the thing that happened in the Sunderland box and then they look up and you know when you see like these wildlife documentaries and it's just like the baby lions like the lion cubs they all kind of start galloping together somewhere and it's like oh where are they going and then it's like they are following their parents over there it was like that everyone was kind of scrapping and then they looked up and then everyone started running to another scrap it was great more like a shoulder fish though wasn't it in terms of the dynamism in terms of the flow it's like wow that's really amazing how flocks of birds just know where they all know where to go at the same time wow another fight yeah yeah but it was low it was if any game was going to end up with with a flurry of bookings and and a kind of scrap at the end it would have been this not really a scrap i'm actually impressed it wasn't i'm impressed that they kept the bookings on a lid on the bookings actually till till late to be honest because that's the kind of game that has a real potential to run away with it.

10:03And the Sunland players all having a photo on the pitch at the end of the game, I think it was a tribute to, it was a nod to a Newcastle beat Sunland in the FA Cup and Newcastle did the same. Oh, right. Yeah, yeah. Jason Tindall did the same. Oh, yeah. No need for that. Well, no, no, no. Tindall put himself front. There was no need for the provocation, I think, because it's like Sunland in the FA Cup and Newcastle, then you're kind of kicking a team that's down because you're not even in the same division. This is at least parity. I mean, it's just great to see that derby in the top flight again.

10:30Yeah, yeah. Just a quick shout for Villa. Wow. Being West Ham 3-2 at the London Stadium. What a comeback win this was. Morgan Rodgers balling out. Balling out. All the conversation about the England team and should Bellingham start all of that. Like, Morgan Rodgers just deserves that conversation about the quality of the form he's in. And the thing about this guy too, we've talked before about the positions he can play in. Basis scores from central midfield and from the number six. So he scores as a nine, he scores as an eight. He was playing as a winger in a previous game. Villa have won nine on the bounce and it just seems to be, you know, there was a big discourse about strikers aren't scoring enough but what they're doing is they're making room for midfielders like him to score and it's unconventional the way that Villa are doing it but they've shown so much resilience, right?

11:20They've come from behind a couple of times now in the last few weeks and they've hung tough with some pretty resilient sides. and just a great win. Morgan Rodgers, the winner from him, the one that he drives from distance is just... God. Some bangers galore. That guy's got some serious, serious skills in his locker. Hey, speaking of bangers, not in a forest, it was like a pure bangers only. Sangari with the, don't you forget about me when I'm at AFCON, lacing it from distance for the 3-0. Two from Callum Hudson-Dodoy as well and that second one, I mean, it was 100 % across, but still, looked amazing.

11:56You can tell from the way he celebrated it, actually. 3-0 against Spurs. Yeah, that first goal, it was the first goal, wasn't it? The Guerrero again playing out. But why is that going to Archie Gray? I just did not understand. Yeah, but sometimes when I see that, I just think it's autopilot. When I see that stuff, I'm like, has that been really drilled into you to play like that in that situation? It's just such a dangerous way to pick up the ball. Like picking up the ball, look, we know that midfielders drop in and get the ball. But if you're having to drop with your back to play and you're facing your own goal and the keeper gives you the ball as someone is closing you down, like their momentum is going to, like, you're in trouble.

12:42That just should have gone to Romero. I don't understand why I didn't get to Romero. Yeah, but you know what I think has happened? Because everyone's grown up watching Busquets. This generation has grown up on Sergio Busquets. And it's like, yeah, but you can't do that. It's not that that would have happened. is that the people grew up with such a way of playing that it goes away from the original intent, right? Like Tiki Taka, for example. Remember Tiki Taka was people, oh, like key possession. It's about, it's not about like dead possession, right? It's meant to progress the ball, have people rest in possession.

13:14And even Pep got annoyed about possession for possession's sake. It wasn't his point. And I think sometimes you have an ideal that's taken to extremes where it's no longer productive. Pep was not averse to going long. and I was saying to you actually I was watching some of these old like Serie A games these old like Milan games the amount of times they pumped it long to Ruud Hullit on the edge of like the 18 bucks and it had a 60 yard pass like into us and there was no shame in that and especially with some of the issues that Spurs have had in recent weeks playing out from the back you would have thought they'd eradicate that especially away from home especially away from home against that Nottingham Forest team that we know are ferocious on the press you know they're like well we know that sometimes you look up and you see like there's like no a lot of nature on this program on this podcast you know you look up on the wire and there's no crows you look up like a couple minutes like a couple seconds later there's like seven crows will stand in that's nottingham forest like where the crows come from great win for forest another 3-0 man city beating palace 3-0 away that's a big win but man city looking a little bit too calm at the moment for my liking palace had a chance to go ahead there yeah they could have done more and I think I think Glasner Glasner knew he was like if you let these lot go they'll come at you and yeah Dominic Calvert-Lewin with another goal for Leeds and their 1-0 draw away at Brentford good point there couple of 2-0s Chelsea beating Everton 2-0 at home and Mo Salah was back before he went again and he got an assist in Liverpool's 2-0 win against Brighton Liverpool were 2 for Ekotiki first one was like what less than a minute in great finish Burnley 2 Fulham 3 Harry Wilson with 2 assists and a goal he's been amazing also as well Ballon d 'Or Ballon d 'Or look I mean in terms of individual performance that's like a parrot door maybe the journey he took them on a journey here because Fulham had not won at Burnley in about 70 years he's going to call it the Harry door the Harry door he said the Harry door you know but honestly they hadn't won it at Burnley in like about 70 years that's a wild you've been like telling that's your being that you anyone like guys I need to tell you because it's really important it's big everyone listen gather round listen because it's big listen it's big people aren't winning trophies these days yeah it's big it's big it's big tell a Fulham fan it means nothing I didn't say say that it's the sound of the summer you're listening to the sound of the summer it's only going to be hilarious if I say it like six months from now if I'm like hey do you realise that Fulham hey do you remember that time that Fulham didn't it's law it says law so I was lucky enough after we caught the train from Venice to Milan I was lucky enough to make it back into the hotel to watch the second half of Arsenal against Wolves which oh my god if Arsenal hadn't won that game I don't think I would have recorded today it was that is the first time I'm going to keep this super brief because I don't I really don't want to talk I don't want to talk about but that was the first time this season I've been like actively annoyed about like what what they were doing like Declan Rice knew it Declan Rice went off afterwards he was just you could tell he was just like this is oh there's that amazing video they posted about Declan Rice after the late, late winner where Declan Rice is like, focus.

16:28Yeah. Harsh on Wolves really because they did quite well to get back into it. But yeah. I'm glad I'll have to see them until next weekend. Just a quick shout out for the WSL. Manchester E beat Villa 6-1 to stay top. Chelsea return to winning ways beating Bayern 3-0 away and Arsenal beat Everton 3-1 to go third because Manchester United dropped points against Spurs although they could have dropped more they were 3-0 down ended up coming back and drawing 3-0 thanks to a Rolfer brace and a 94th minute equaliser they had like a ridiculous XG compared to Spurs as well yeah 4.98 Manchester United's XG was because Spurs is 0.78 they had 34 shots to Spurs is 4 wild alright man so let's let's go to Italy let's do it I mean let's talk about the results very quickly before we talk about the weekend as a whole.

17:24Yeah, we were at Milan-Sassuolo on Sunday. 2-0 draw. In a wild Sunday, actually, for results, Udinese beating Napoli 1-0 and then Inter beating Genoa 2-1. Juve also beating Bologna, which meant that Inter go top by a point and Milan stay second, luckily, because of Napoli's defeat and Roma now can't catch them even if they beat Como. where we're recording this ahead of the Como game and Juve go up to fifth in Serie B which is where we were at on Saturday basically everyone won in that top half apart from Monza who lost to Venezia so it was a big result for Venezia Monza second and Venezia fourth started in fourth yeah started in fourth stayed in fourth but level in points now 2-0 win against Monza and went to the game and loved it absolutely loved it we posted a reel on our Instagram if you want to go follow us on Instagram Stadio Football on Instagram you know it was just a quick thing we put together but it's quite hard to actually put into words the uniqueness of the footballing experience going to the Stadio Pierluigi Penso which is the ground of Venezia and I think it's obviously because of Venice as a city but also the tightness of the stadium it's very small it's a very very old stadium I think it's the I might be wrong but I think it's the second oldest in Italy football stadium but yeah the first time that we've been back in Venice for a long long time I hadn't been there for a few years I've been there a couple times before but this was I saw it differently this time I think it's the first time well I know it's the first time I'd seen Venice from a Venetian perspective and no coincidence that it was the richest experience I could have had so I arrived a day after you and there was a strike that day, public transport strike, which was a great thing for me, not only because I support unions, but also because it meant I had to walk instead of getting a boat taxi.

19:26So I had to walk all the way to the south of the island and it's a stunning walk for anyone that not had the pleasure of going there yet. Stunning walk with gorgeous sun, but it meant I get to see the stadium, you know, the stadium approach as I walked up. And just, I mean, in terms of the setting, very different stadiums but in terms of space constraints uh for those who know a bit about the english sort of lower league or second division remind me of luton town kennel with road in terms of the way that's just really like really in the heart of a community and the fan base just stunning and talking to actually um one of the guys shout out to luca we were there with him watching the crowd and he was talking about how the big teams really struggle to come to Venice and get a result because of the energy, the atmosphere that the crowd build.

20:16And also it's an incredible day out. I think a lot of people might go there expecting an easier ride of it. But that old cliche about a crowd being a 12th player, the intensity in that small space of what they generated, the crowd was spectacular. A lot of noise. Yeah, a lot of noise. All game. Especially because for a stadium that only holds about 12 ,000. Two very different footballing experiences between that and San Siro, Venice is a place and Milan is a place as well, but also the two clubs. There was something really, really cool about the uniqueness of Venice, for example, and the football sense there.

20:51Like, just the amount of people coming to and from the stadium on a boat because it's one of, that sounds really, really lavish, but it's actually not. It's just, it's part of life. You can't walk between the two parts of the island without getting a gondola at one point. You have to get the gondola. like you're on google maps and i was walking up so this is a necessity in terms of like the specific crossing i had to make i had to get across there um and so yeah it's necessity and also just in terms of like crowd dispersal it's very efficient to be able to disperse one foot and buy water yeah and i think venezia as a club are in a really interesting time let's say because they they obviously had a real emergence as a cult club a good few years ago they kind of went a bit global as you know one of a few clubs through that time who really crossed over because i think a lot of the time because of what was going on with you know the kits or the branding or or whatever and them and then making it to seri-ar and seri-ar but then getting relegated and i think well they come back up once didn't they and then they went down again because football moves on you know like flavour of the month club for want of a better term it shifts quite quickly and I think there are you know there's obviously like a worry sometimes about clubs like that being not left behind but being like well hang on what do we do now and I think what's really interesting with Venezia is that they're moving to a new stadium on the mainland in a couple of years which is just a reality for them they need to do it and there's a couple of crossovers and there's some threads there that are very similar to San Siro but for very different reasons so from a logistical point of view for Venezia it is a bit of a nightmare getting to the stadium even for fans because a lot of fans come from the mainland you know there's not I don't obviously fans live on the island as well but not everyone does so the logistics of transporting to not just just over you know near the train station on the island but the very far end of the island is quite testing I mean that was a lovely sunny day imagine if it's foggy the rain's terrible well this is the thing right you know we had the proper football weather joke about like proper football weather when it rains we were so lucky this weekend because we did not see a cloud no basically on saturday or sunday and it was chilly when the sun went down it was like 10 11 degrees and sunny and it just felt like proper calcio weather yeah totally yeah um and that setting where where venezia is it's just such an interesting kind of mixture because you've got this this incredible city this incredible like like this incredible city that's obviously historic and global and tourism is over 20 million visitors a year they were saying and then you get to the stadium and it's raw and kind of like small and cramped and not very like grand or luxurious and i think that they're going to take a little bit of an element of the design aspect of venice with the new place even though it's obviously going to be on the mainland it's going to be a new stadium but it's going to give them I think more capabilities of like easier access for fans easier access for teams as well but also I think to build a stadium that's going to fit in the modern era for them.

24:08Well actually it's funny you talk about that you talk about the modernisation there's also a conversation we were lucky enough to chat to some of the people there in the executive team had a chat to shout out to Nick running the marketing and also Tank Crady the managing director about the strategy because there's a big conversation at Venezia about sustainability so it's not just having you know this great visual offering it's not just a great merch and all of that which is great but the sustainability being like what is the recruitment model looking like how do you get the players to compete with these huge clubs and one of the models people are looking at is you know what atlanta have done and bergamot is incredible and the catchment area for this region for venezia the surrounding region it's really really exciting and there's real possibility there and there's something this this Venezia team kind of offers a taste of that a taste of what's to come because the oldest player was 28 they had this lovely thing where you look over the back of the stadium they've got the the national flags of each of the starting 11 as you look up Iceland Ecuador USA yeah USA I mean it's unbelievable Austria Svoboda was a veteran at 28 years old a veteran I mean Kike Perez scored yeah Actually, I think he's the oldest Kiko Paris and then it's from 1727.

25:23And then you've got, in goal, you had Stankovic, the son of Dejan. So you've got a really nice link to old and new even there on the pitch. But I think the future model of young players coming through the ranks with this kind of homegrown identity mixed with young players from abroad, it's kind of cool. And you can see people have an enthusiasm, but there's always something really exciting about watching young players develop and going on a particular journey. So yeah, I mean, it was thrilling. And on the day, obviously, it was a bit too much for Monza, who I think expected, you know, when you see a team who expect more time on the ball, and I'm not saying this out of, it's not a criticism of Monza.

26:01It was more like when they get, you saw a team that when they were building up, they expected to get from their spots, get to their spots a lot more easily than Vinets are allowing it. It's a young, dynamic team that presses really well as a group. and it was only it was only until about 25 minutes into the game that Monza I think first actually got their two kind of playmakers alongside each other and started building something and again that's credit to what they're doing over there Giovanni Stropper the coach by the way former Milan player who I enjoyed watching back in the day and yeah it's just a really they call you know the word project is often overused in football but if it's going to be used in any way that is enticing exciting even a bit thrilling then I think that's it.

26:48What they're building at Venezia I think is really exciting. Strupper by the way looks like he gives great hugs. He hugged your borough when he subbed your borough off and it looked like He had a great game, yeah. He looked like a great hug. You know what I mean? Like, oh. Good work kid. Good work kid, yeah. I mean he's like he's like late 50s Strupper and those guys a lot of them are like early to mid 20s there's very much a kind of like friendly but like firm uncle vibes I think in that yeah I imagine a lot of people listening to this podcast would have or some people listening to this podcast would have been lucky enough to experience a game in Venezia and I would just say that if you have the opportunity to be in the area and to go you don't I mean even if you're not staying in Venice there's good train services in and out of Venice and I would thoroughly recommend it especially because it's not going to be around like the stadium's not going to be around for much longer hosting Venice Venezia games there is nothing like it that I've been to before there is something just kind of unbelievable about watching football in that setting I wish I'd been to a few more games there and I will absolutely be trying to go to a few more before they move you will not have to drag me back there put it that way I can neither confirm nor deny that I was checking what the rent was like I was looking for teaching fellowships going to that would have been enough but I think then going to catching the train to milan and then going to san sierra on sunday for the saswolo game yes you and i had a proper moment okay can i just let me full disclosure so i was the last time i was um i had a bit of time i've been to italy a couple of times previously and primarily for work because i've not really had time to kind of like you know soak up the experience so when when my smartest because like you know what I'm going to watch football in Italy I want to you know look the part feel the part and Milan in particular going to San Siro where I saw two generations of footballers who I idolized really that Milan team of the three Dutchmen Rijkaard Hullet van Basten and then George Weyer's team you know when he won the Ballon d 'Or with them uh that incredible call against Verona the length of pitch at San Siro I was I was in awe I didn't realize how much I needed this as a bucket list experience until I got up to San Siro.

29:11So we get there, we get to the San Siro station at the very end of the line. Obviously it's called San Siro because it's in the area, San Siro of Milan. Yeah. That's the official name, Giuseppe Mianzo. Yeah, indeed. So get to the, named after the great Italian striker who played, we led him to two World Cups. And that's interesting because they actually hosted, the San Siro hosted a few of the World Cup games in 1934. I mean, that's how long it's been a fixture in the Italian football, footballing, the global footballing landscape. So we come up the steps and the first sight I get of it, I literally, I quite, I have, I have tears in my eyes because I had not really reckoned with the enormity of what it was to be like in the presence of that stadium with all the great football that came out of there.

29:57And, and it's not just like what those players did and what they won is what they symbolize. Like you had, you had black footballers in the late eighties, excelling in Europe, in the middle of Italy, like changing the kind of cultural conversation. I mean, this is, you know, Rude Hurlick when he won the Ballon d 'Or on his way to Milan, dedicated his prize to Nelson Mandela. Can you imagine a footballer doing that right now? Can you imagine a footballer winning the Ballon d 'Or and making a dedication politically to a particular leader? That's the parallel. That's what we were living in the 80s, right?

30:31And then, of course, Weyer being there. So just to walk up to the San Siro, and I knew you felt the same, watching it just emerge. So there's a thing that, and apologies if people have been there, I assume some people who listen have been there many, many times. I mean, it's very much like the first time, first time maybe. But there's a thing about visiting a place for the first time that's so familiar to you. And the thing about San Siro for me was like, I don't remember it vividly, but I remember Italia 90. Right. Football Italia played such a major part in just your... It's formative. Yeah.

31:12Seeing San Siro and seeing the goals that you mentioned or the players that you mentioned and some of these most iconic players of all time scoring some of the most iconic goals of all time in one of the most iconic stadiums of all time and playing on FIFA every year or Pro Evo or whatever it was and seeing the stadium before and playing games in the stadium, in computer games, and then actually getting that first glimpse of it when you come up the stairs and out of the metro station. And it's genuinely like, it's breathtaking. You know the Guggenheim and Bilbao? I've not been there yet. I've not had the joy of it, but I think it will probably have a similar effect on me because we were talking before, you compared it to the Barbican in terms of the beauty.

31:54It felt like someone was trying to design the future when they designed San Siro. They weren't just going, oh, let's make something that fits into the surroundings. They're like, let's make something that we will look at in awe we look at that thing but it's been there for decades and i look at it like it it feels like we're it represents a world that we haven't arrived at yet it genuinely walking up to it i felt this it's like a reverence like the spirals you know i was saying to you well you mentioned the guggenheim like it reminds that the spirals remind me of the guggenheim in new york like frank lord right it's just it's but this is all stuff like that kind of stuff is all stuff that for old people like people might be listening to us talking about this like yeah all right come on guys but it's like it's it's what i can't i can't over like i can't over exaggerate or over stress or over emphasize that even though it is so familiar to you the power of it and the scale of it and the beauty of it when you see it in real life is off the scale look like i cannot actually let me double down i was actually surprised i was actually surprised at how even though i was hyped to see it i was surprised i was still surprised at how overwhelming it was i'm gonna double down on this you're a nicer guy than i am you're like oh well you know if you may think rolls your eyes fine people can roll their eyes all i know is we walked up the spirals and i looked out and i saw the alps we weren't even inside the stadium yet and you could see the alps from there like and i was i was thinking about this like i may have said this to you the other day like when you arrive at milan like what's your ritual when you're going playing the San Siro?

33:27Do you just turn up and play like any other stadium? Or do you spend some time like walking around, looking at the plaques, imagining yourself in the history of the club? Because, look, I see why it's being rebuilt. Maybe there's just too much to refurbish there. Maybe it's like, you know, it's all stone and you want to juice the place up and you look with MV at the Etihad and the Emirates and the Spurs Stadium and all of that that's of state-of-the-art and you want everything to be brand spanking new for the sponsors and the luxury guests. okay I get that what I will say is when they move away from San Siro something will be lost something wonderful and profound will be lost maybe it'll be more practical maybe it'll be like fit for purpose in the modern age but in its own way it's still ahead of its time it's still ahead of its time because it's like a celebration at its best and even on the match day like the football we saw when the team and it was a point where Milan were actually looking really really good it could have been 2 or 3-1 at one point and the Corvo were really like getting into it and the drummers were off and I was like this is this is a symphony right this is this is how it should be but there's a footballing experience I just thought I'm so glad I got to experience that I'm just yeah yeah it was a real moment for me man honestly and I think that going to games in Germany like for example the first time at the Milan tour was was you know with the dome in the background and you know the ferris wheels going and it's freezing cold and it's snowing it was like it is a moment that is a moment i'm going to remember for like genuinely for the rest of my life because of the experience of it right and and how special it felt and you know the first time at dortmund first time at dortmund like again a little bit overwhelming i try not to forget but it reminds you of that like oh actually yeah this is this is sick like this is it's really important to retain look it's really important to retain a sense of wonder yeah and i felt like a five-year-old honestly i felt like a five-year-old the first time i saw sanseiro and walking around it and kind of just like you and i were like two kids just being like yeah this is amazing and yeah i mean like look and there is and i i also i also see having now visited it i see why the need for any stadium is there there is a lot like this it's kind of crumbling a little bit and there are sections that are not not being used at the moment because of damage and you can the way that it's mapped out and everything you can see how it's just been added to it yeah but my god like the shell of it is unreal and if there was ever a way to protect that and to modernize within it I don't think it will happen because it will be really really costly and I think I imagine it's that's that's why the plans are in place to build a sign next to it and then to eventually demolish it but you know I think about like my own personal experience when Arsenal left Highbury and there's a few things I'm super grateful for about the way that they did that the fact that the reason why they moved was also the reason why the facades of the East and West End couldn't be knocked down so you still essentially get to visit it yeah and I wonder what it's going to feel like with San zero because it is so like just overwhelming and especially with the size of it especially the current team so far from the grandeur of the old when you move to a new it's one thing when you've got it's not like it's not even like juventus even juventus like you know they haven't won the champions league for obviously you know 30 years now but even juventus when they moved to the new stadium, you still have that kind of connective tissue of we're moving stadium, we're not moving status.

37:22And Milan now, the role they occupy within world football, I don't know if we'll see Milan win a Champions League in the next 15 years. I don't know if we'll see that. It would be nice to move to the new stadium with a strong element of the glory that we saw in the 80s and the 90s. And we know that's not realistic because of the financial power of the Premier League and other leagues. But that's my concern, I suppose, that when they move stadium in their current state, a lot of the magic will be lost. That is my one worry, I think, because it's very rare that you can use the word magical to describe a sporting venue and not sound utterly pretentious.

38:12but it's magical actually. I think Juve are a slightly different case because they moved so frequently. And the Dele Alpi was unloved as well. It was unloved. Whereas San Siro has been Milan's home for what, 15, 16 years longer than Juve's? Sorry, than Inter's. It's been there for what, like 100 years? And even before the addition to what we see with the pillars, the extra pillars and stuff, like the stadium looked amazing and so yeah I mean it's going to be it's going to be hard man it's one of those like you understand the realities of why it needs to be done and you understand that probably from a logistical and like a construction point of view it's going to be it would be a nightmare oh god yeah totally totally but you're going to have to come up with something mega iconic because it's so beloved and it's so like again I can't I can't stress enough I know I'm going on about this but like it looks like the scale and the the the architectural like wowness of it is i can't remember going to a stadium and feeling like that have you we talked about andor there's um when you have like the galactic parliament we have the meeting the senators from all across the galaxy and they gather there it's like this it's yeah i mean yeah in a star wars sense it just looks like one of those like huge ships on the horizon.

39:39Yeah, totally. Like when you come out and you're just like, because it's so, it looks so far away that even in this, it was a clear day, but if there was like a haze, it's just mad, man, honestly. Like it was just, I could sit here and talk about this for hours because it was such a, like it was genuinely overwhelming. Yeah, I think that, I think we wanted to, we wanted to like almost like do a diary entry of visiting, both of those places like Venezia and going to watch a Milan game at San Siro because two very very unique footballing experiences for different reasons and I really loved having like the contrast of them both in the same like same trip because it was you know clubs facing very different realities and very different problems and very different you know aspirations in two places that are beloved and are going to be missed for different reasons.

40:37You know, it just felt like a, to be honest, we didn't really clock that until after we'd been to San Siro and we're like, oh, actually there's... The kind of tradition you were saying about the stadium, I was like, oh, that's a good point. Like I never, it was, we were so absorbed by the spectacle that thinking about where both clubs were in relation to the transition, how they were quite similar was interesting. But yeah, as an experience, oh my God. And there was obviously, there was some football too. And one of the other treats was that we got to see Luka Modric play. I mean, it was the first time I'd seen him play live.

41:07So you had a picture, you had a, you like filmed me watching him like sort of jogging along. And I was just like, oh my goodness, it's Luka Modric. And just watching, you know, obviously like, look, he's, he's near the end, very near the end of his career now. So a couple of passes, a couple of things that he tried, he wouldn't, probably would not have tried under Zidane in a Champions League, in a Champions League final. but just incredible to see that and to see him obviously like getting really well with his teammates and mentoring some of the younger ones it was awesome yeah real treat yeah not the result they wanted and Sassuolo frustrated him yeah not the first time no no absolutely they've hit the bogey team Bartosaki left wing back teenager got a couple of goals it's a shame they wasted a match in performance he's very popular with the cover and rightly so because he's a local lad, came up from the youth system.

42:01He was probably the high point. Funnily enough with Milan, the star players kind of struggled. Pulisic and Nkunku didn't have the greatest games. And Modric, despite completing, I think, over 90 passes, actually wasn't at his best. The star free did well, of course, he did outstandingly well. But yes, that's what a good value for the point. And actually, I think Milan kind of got away with this one because them playing the early game allowed the other teams competing with them to get a good look at this. Napoli getting done by Udinese 1-0. Knowing full well they could have got a result that took them over.

42:40Milan, that was a missed opportunity but obviously into taking their chances. Yeah, the Serie A title is shaping up really, really well. Less than halfway gone and far, far too close to call. Is there anything else we want to talk about from this weekend? I think that is it. I think that's it. All right, then. Well, let's roll. Apologies again for this coming to you late. It's going to be very, very, very late Monday, probably by the time you're hearing this. But yeah, we hope everyone's staying safe, staying well, wherever you are. We'll be back Thursday and Friday this week. And don't forget, if you are listening to this on the free feed, go and sign up to patreon.com forward slash stadio.

43:19You can sign up as a free member and you will get all the ad-free shows in full for the rest of this year. and you'll also get we're going to do a newsletter and you're going to have some other Patreon treats as well so yeah go and sign up if you want to if you also want to sign up as a paid member you can still do that and we would obviously massively appreciate the support but yeah until next time don't forget to check the Stadi Archers players on Spotify speaking of which we're playing out on Didi Mirage and Teddy Bryant trackwood echoes anything you would like to add Musok Wonga nothing further I was going to do a he'll comment on how I heard the echoes of the greats in the San Siro stadium but I won't go there so yes nothing further I heard the echoes of you just going wow wow wow

44:07that's basically how it was the first 10 minutes of the San Siro wasn't it all right everyone much love we'll be back with you on Thursday see you then

44:31Thank you.

45:05Thank you.

45:30Thank you.

46:00Thank you.

46:25Thank you.