Wrighty’s Message to Jude & Rooney’s United Contract Revealed | Stick to Football EP 103

0:00Just before we get started, a quick thanks to our partners and clothing. We hope you enjoy the show. Hi, everybody. All good?

0:14I'll put that under there.

0:19No Kieran. No Kieran. Oh, no. Oh, no, I've left my glasses. That's a bad start, that is. No, they're in the car, they're in my car.

0:41I'd say it came in I'd say a word It's quiet It's never late I know Which one am I on This Jill's one Yeah This one Got Jill Are you ready Are you ready This is all quiet Say I haven't done it We'll carry on Haven't you done it We'll carry on Really We've finally got him going back while Liverpool still having one. I saw somebody about my hip the other day by the way. I need to see a specialist lads. I told you. So? My hip, yeah. Honestly. Last couple of months. It's sore today. Yeah, I think it's not looking good. You're probably going to have to. Don't jump into operations. Do you need anything or are you guys all right?

1:26I'm OK. Yeah, all right. Tea. Tea. I think someone is coming. I tell you, I was in the queue for age, but I'd come here. No worries. No, no, it is coming. I promise, Roy, it is coming. Well, we've got loads of patients around here. I hope so. All good. Thank you. There he is. Forgot my glasses. Oh, you're wearing a hat. I thought you were doing that for a joke. Who springs to mind? Who are you thinking? Frank Spencer. Frank Spencer. Robert Frank Spencer. Franklin Spencer. Is this ours? I don't know. Is there any... So Ciarán's gone to Australia for the ashes or whatever? Bruce, he's gone over.

2:09Steve? Is he? Yeah. Cara's back. Not for the whole series, is he? Liverpool didn't lose. Liverpool haven't lost any international break. As I was saying, Cara, people are saying, where's Cara? Where's he gone? He don't come. Are you bringing up? No, someone just... I haven't had no breakfast. What's that, a bacon sandwich? Yeah. With what? Brown or red sauce? It's got to be brown sauce. I'm waiting for brown sauce. Have we got brown? Is it brown? You're waiting for brown? I've got red sauce. Is it red sauce? Is it? No, it's brown. Is that the... No, ketchup. No, it's brown sauce. I'd go brown.

2:40Brown? You've got some butter as well, please. Is that some butter? Yeah. Is that an oven thing? Is that an oven thing? I thought... What, brown sauce? Yeah. You've got a new butter as well. I didn't think I'd have had things there. HP. What for everyone? Like brown sauce? Ketchup? Well, congratulations on the Premier League. What was it? the Hall of Fame. Hall of Fame. Yeah, it was good, that. Yeah. Tuck the heat off you for a bit, didn't it?

3:08I thought it was one of them politics things where you're getting all this shit thrown at you. What did he call it? A dead cat or something. Get something out there, let's divert the news. That's why we took you off for a month.

3:25Who votes for that? It's the 24 previous winners. Oh, so not the public? No. Oh. But basically all the man United lads who were already... LAUGHTER James, don't take it away from you. We've done it at the same time. Yeah, we've done it at the same time. You're going to vote for him. So stick to football and the Hall of Fame is a bit of a United sort of monopoly. Who's in it? No, James, you're belittling Gary's achievement. How can I work out he voted for it? Probably. It was 24. Four votes. How many man you knighted, lads? I don't know how many are in our own, innit? There'll be a few. Who's in it?

4:05Eric? Roy? Is Eric in it? I don't even think Eric's in it. I think Eric's in it. Is he not? Yeah, I think he's in it. Skull's in it. Skull's in it. That's one vote.

4:16Schmeichel, has Peter in it? I think he might be. Rio. Rio, yeah. I think Rio might be. No, I think he'd have the names there. Yeah, I think Rio might be. Jill's in the jungle. Yeah. Doing jungle extra. Oh, sure. I missed you. You missed you? I missed you. Yeah, I missed you. What's happened to Liverpool, Cara? Not heard your voice. Yeah, Cara, we're not... I go into Hyden, I don't think I'm going to. I thought people were joking about that, but you genuinely do. I do, don't I? Do you think it's a crisis, no? Yeah. Yeah. Do you think it's a crisis? Well, yeah, well, how bad did I think? What is a crisis?

4:50I hear people say, is it a crisis and not a crisis? I think it's a crisis. If you lose seven out of ten, is that a crisis? I feel that's a crisis. That's a crisis. For the champions. Yeah. For the champions. That's pretty boring. Probably, yeah, it might be. But why has it happened, do you think? Why has it happened? Oh, my God. A million things, isn't it? It's a Soviet, man. Butcher. It's not spectator sport, is it? Caro eating a bacon butter. That doesn't Edmund, the band.

5:22Stick to Football is brought to you by Arm Clothing. Would United finish above Liverpool this season? I don't think so. You're desperate for that, aren't you? I don't think they're ready for a black superstar. I sent a message to Jude, right, saying, listen, my friend, be ready. How can we be in a situation where Anthony Joshua is fighting a YouTuber, but he's never fought Tyson Fury 40? On the rails. Oh, they're doing an arsehole. I think it was a little bit over the top, though. But what, at the end? Just a celebration there. I thought he's actually qualified. I was like... He had to check the table.

5:56Would that be good wages then? He'll tell you. You're on four, weren't you? Yeah, but I was a much better player, obviously. You've got three million, basically. Is that what that works out? Yeah. And that Liverpool, that would have been cash, obviously, wouldn't it? Of course. I've still got it!

6:18Right, let's get back to Liverpool then. So he said, but surely Liverpool, pound for pound, can just take people on punch for punch and just win more games. I don't understand why they're not... I like the way they were playing in the first few weeks. Listen, there's probably so many things. What are we going to do? Just repeat ourselves. We probably all said there at different times. Was Salah ever going to have the same season? Again, he was possibly going to have... Canate's fell off a cliff. Things like that make a big difference. McAllot has never quite been 100 % fit. Sometimes he plays three games.

6:47I think there's lots of little things. But you know what? For being totally honest, when you actually look at the games they've lost and the type of games they've lost, they can't handle the physicality of the Premier League this season. They can't. When you think of teams that lack something, they normally let you down away from home against teams who have a physical game, if you like, in a physical nature. And they've gone missing so often in away games, the final at Anfield. I think the record, they only lost one, which is the Man United game. I think they lost 22 at home, I think, in the Premier League.

7:18So they're fine at home and they've got the fans with them. They feel comfortable. Homers. Yeah, homers. so with the yeah they're just lacking a little bit of I don't think the simplest way of saying it I think is that Liverpool were sort of Arnie Sopps wanted to move Liverpool oh thank you you want red don't you I haven't got anything James yeah but I think Slott Slott when you listen to Slott talk about Liverpool last season even though they won the league he always talks about every game sort of went to the wire the only one by the odd goal he almost wanted to have more football more goals more entertainment he loved when you hear him speak about Paris Saint-Germain last season it's like oh my god that's the football I want that's the I want it that's amazing even last week when he was playing so when he played Man City last week he's talking of Pep like he's his hero do you know what I mean and he is probably is isn't he for probably a lot of coaches that's his football and I think the Premier League he's trying to push Liverpool even more this way and I think the Premier League has actually probably gone back in terms of physicality so his team is probably a little bit weaker and you know the Premier League now everyone's just giant set pieces long throws and the team can't cope with it How was he going to fix it Jeremy?

8:39I'm not sure he can I don't think this group of players is is equipped to win the league this year even with the points and how far behind you look at the difference in the Champions League look fine you know Overtz, all his best games have been in the Champions League, haven't they? But I think they'll have to recruit more physical players. And that's when I look at actually... You mean in January or the end of the season? Maybe even January, because I'd just seen the Semenyo thing came up. And obviously he's got a link with Richard Hughes, who was at Bournemouth. But when you actually look at him as a player, light and quick, big, powerful.

9:14Liverpool don't have a lot of pace, really, when you think of the wide areas. Sarra's not a flyer machine. Gakpo's not really. but I just think maybe more physicality in the team more pace more power They'll regret that decision as well at Kehi in the summer won't they? That's a bad mistake That looks worse now than what you look at it How did he get that done? All over the place as well Yeah I think it was Liverpool are known as being really smart in the market and I get that and not paying over the odds and really good at selling but this thing like oh he's only got a year to go we've got you by the year the town halls type of thing on the last day the window you have to give us 35 million and they pull out of it and you just think that could cost them I think if Liverpool don't sign a centre back in a how long am I taking to open this foot I think

10:04I think if Liverpool don't sign a defender in January I think they could Would United finish above Liverpool this season? I don't think so you're desperate for that aren't you because not just because he got ridiculed didn't he for his predictions so I'm well aware every week he's on the phone to people at Sky saying well what did Cara say in the predictions what did he say well my predictions as we've established in the first day Monday Night Football are more accurate than yours over time but I actually think this season you're in a bit of trouble okay I'm going to lose my job or something because I've got to what was wrong what was your predictions what was your predictions what was your well he had Liverpool winning the league I had United in the top four didn't I?

10:52They could sneak into fifth You can't You do this every week Every week

10:59I get the Champions League I said they should finish in your Open League position No they won't finish fifth

11:11Just waiting for James to finish eating Let's move off from the pool Can we move off Is there anything else you've got to say on that? Oh no We had to catch up with you Yeah, because you haven't been about, yeah. And people have been worried about you and just concerned that you've been not coming on for the wrong reasons. You're a show-up type of guy. You know, the accusations have been that maybe you don't turn up, but we were fighting your call. We were fighting for you. You know, we're losing, but we're fighting for you. This episode of Stick to Football is brought to you by Arm Clothing.

11:47Scotland. Brilliant. how good was that last night it's like even Ireland the other day with Troy Parrott it's just that's what it's about isn't it surely that's what football's about that's unbelievable that was I mean I had that feeling watching two two countries like nothing to do with me but that feeling of happiness from yeah it's just unbelievable I do think from a I'm thinking maybe from an English perspective when Ireland or Scotland and Wales qualify for Tons I genuinely feel a little bit of happiness with it do you feel like do you feel the same I feel like there's like a warmth of yeah I want them there and it's not as patronising that.

12:19I know what you mean. I like Scotland and Ireland a lot more than Wales. Don't worry, it's about Wales. What have you got against the Welsh? Why? I've got nothing against the Welsh. I'm happy when they qualify. I just don't know. You always think, obviously, particularly Ireland, and I've been biased, you think they'll bring something with their support, don't you? And the Scottish family. Same with the Scots, yeah. Scots as well, yeah. Yeah. I don't think they'll bring something special on it. Have they done something? It'll be hard, though, in this. Have they done something? Remember, Were you part of the England team when Wales celebrated when England got knocked out?

12:51Were you captain then? Yeah, I was on the coaching staff as well. Maybe there's something from that. What happened? Is that what it is, Wes? Does it feed into it? No. I think they celebrated when we went out. They were in the hotel, weren't they? Yeah, they weren't playing with us. They filmed themselves and we got knocked out. Oh, right. And then they went further than us, didn't they? Yeah. They've got to do that, though. No, they did great. I mean, I wouldn't celebrate Wales going out or Ireland going out or Scotland going out. I don't think we would because I think I always remember when I was a kid sort of growing up I used to always think of the Everton players playing for like Kevin Sheedy for Ireland or Graham Schaaf for Scotland Southall and Ratcliffe for Wales I'd be always wanting them to do well and hoping they did well and it wasn't until I was about sort of teen or just someone saying to me they hate us they hate women but I still can't not like that you know what I mean I always want them to go through we're doing history they say we're nice to be like Mark Hughes and Norman Whiteside Joe Jordan Gordon McQueen Martin Bucking all these players that played for United that were Irish or Scottish or Welsh loads of them you wanted them to do well yeah I wanted them to do well but the week Ireland Scotland obviously qualified brilliant but for the few days Ireland had still a lot of work to be done I think it was a little bit over the top though at the end but you know when I get it but when the celebration I thought he was actually qualified I was like you had to check the tables Ireland you thought Ireland qualified that's what I thought but I didn't want to feel bad.

14:16The only thing I'd say about that win, Ireland has been so bad from the last few years and to get to winning Hungary, last kick of the game, a lot of work to be done still to qualify, obviously. But no, I wouldn't begrudge him that moment. When these teams who have been struggling for so many years to get a bit of a lift for the country and to get two back-to-back big wins, to beat Portugal was obviously you, Sikimicu. No one fancy them. And then to go and beat Hungary and knock them out and you qualify for the playoffs, last kick of the game. if you can enjoy them moments and I think the Irish fans and the players and the managers I wouldn't begrudging it honestly enjoy that moment I love Roy you talk about I think in the international we end up talking maybe even in the show so we're talking about Troy Parrott we're talking about Kenny McLean's goal you know Keiran Thiem's goal so they're not if we're on this show or different TV shows we're talking about the top teams in the Premier League all the time these big players and players are just having careers where you're not quite sure where they are.

15:15You mentioned to me before, Troy Padderton playing in Holland now. But I think it's brilliant, that players who aren't at the absolute... Yeah, the Irish players. You go through a lot of the Irish players, a lot of them are obviously doing well in the game, but they're not stars anywhere. Yeah, yeah. A lot of them are making a living in the Premier League. And they would have, obviously, a lot of them would have grown up watching Ireland, maybe going back to the years and seen a little bit of success. So why can't they? It's their moment. Yeah, I love that. They've got to enjoy it. They've got to still get a big job to do.

15:39And they're not real superstars, I suppose, at the moment. but they're making a living and I honestly I was delighted we're from I love the fairytale ending of both of those even with the Scots I loved it like watching it and just feeling is this going to happen and then it happens it was just it was a moment wasn't it what you're thinking about is the sucker punch that could come yeah no I get it what you said I understand that but I just think it was a little bit too much I think to beat Portugal in Hungary is like it's a freak really a knock in Hungary or to go and win in Hungary Hungary 2-1 out of 10 minutes to go and the draw will do them so they probably didn't know what to stick or twist so for Ireland to find that and Ireland have struggled over the years particularly away from home we always think there's a big result in them maybe at home but to go and get the back-to-back wins and obviously they'll need another because the next leg the next draw they're away from home so that's the challenge for them I think you could get lost as well in because England we qualify we qualify this time I can't remember which game it was you know you look at Ireland and Scotland and the trouble they've had to try and qualified, finding the players to get to the levels to try and beat these teams.

16:44And even the games that Ireland had, no one would have fancied them. Especially the start of the campaign. I think that the reason why they would celebrate like that, and I was celebrating alongside them, is because you could feel a genuine shift in something. Something's happened for them, and they've achieved something there. Obviously, Scotland are going to the World Cup, and Ireland hopefully they'll get there, but you feel like something's happened. I'm happy for them. And in Ireland, there's so much competition with sport and the rugby have done really well. So the soccer's fallen way behind, a lot of problems financially, loads of issues going on.

17:16So the whole country needed that lift. At least they can enjoy it for a few months now because obviously the playoffs are on until March. The Irish in New York. The draw. The draw, you need a bit of luck with the draw. The one team I don't want to go to Poland. Wales obviously in the playoffs, and Northern Ireland as well. So yeah, it's interesting that draw tomorrow. It'll be exciting. To be fair, we take it for granted with England, but we shouldn't. Because you'll remember, obviously we didn't qualify back in 2000 2008 2008 we should take it for granted when you look at the groups now come on no it's a little bit I think it's a little bit easier with how it's set up now than it was but we still shouldn't take it for granted that ultimately how easy and how comfortable they're making it this current group that's what you miss don't you you miss them moments what Scotland had last night with England group games now you know England have gone unqualified it's quite boring like the last two games England played but the consistency not to concede a goal you have to give them a little bit of credit for that of course What do we think about England in respect of what are their...

18:11I mean, we know they've got a brilliant group of players. It's like he's got an embarrassment of riches in certain positions. Where are we at with England in terms of what are the challenges that Thomas Tuchel's got leading up to the World Cup? What are the things that he needs to just address? Because obviously they're in a great place. They've got a great group of players. Loads of strength in depth. There's not going to be this big shock that someone's going to be left out, I don't think. He's got 26 players, so you've got 22 sometimes. Just injuries now between now and the end of the season.

18:35Just say something happened to Kane or something like that. I think, you know... Left-back, centre-halves, you know, the centre-back position, I think, left-back and left-side. Who starts at left-back? Because obviously he's got Livermento, he's got Miles Lewis-Skelly, he's got Nico O 'Reilly, he's got Jed Spence. Who do you think he's... I think he's going for Jed Spence, as he sits. Do you reckon? I think he'll go for Livermento. Do you think so? You want a left footer there. Even Miles backing him up, I'm not just saying. You can invert as well, but, like, you probably... I think he'd go with Livermento.

19:06Do you reckon? I don't know. No, you're not fair? Think the young City kid done all right. He's done brilliant. And if he's going to play for big games for City... I think he's got a chance. He's a big, strong boy as well. I think push comes to shove in a proper game where he needs... Because his centre-backs are probably one of the weaknesses in the team, I would probably say. I would say he's going to go for a more solid back four with Spencer tucking in as a third... Why are you saying Spencer's a solid? He's not that solid. No. No, but I think he's more... I don't know. I think he's more solid and stable than maybe the other three.

19:34What a different chance. He might bring a right-back, as you say, who can play left back. So Jed Spence does that or Livermanto, but I think Livermanto is a better player than Spence. No, footballers, they're all three of them better players than Spence. I just think when it comes to the tournament... But you think Spence is a really good defender? I just think if he said to him, stick to someone who's a good right winger for another team, I think he may, he may put him in at a game whereby push comes to shove. I'd like to see that simply because if he picks Spence it's because he knows that Spence can do it.

20:02You know, he can play right and left. Who would you go for righty at left back? If you said that there's a big game... If the World Cup was next week, forget the group games. I honestly think in the group games, England could breeze through. I'm talking about when it comes to that proper game that's going to come quarter-final, could be second round, could be semi-final. That one game where you think, this is a proper game, it's 50-50. Who is he playing at right-back and at centre-back? So he left-back... Left-back and the GMs, obviously, yeah. It would be Stones and... Konza? No, we were Gaye, weren't it?

20:35Gaye? You think Stones and Gaye would play? Yeah, I think so. I'd probably say he'd go for Liverpool. I'd probably go for Liverpool. Are you talking about a semi-final v France? I'm talking about who is going to be his back foot in that game where you think, right, we're going to need to be a bit more solid because we've got a lot going on up front, we can score goals, but who is going to keep that clean sheet? Who is going to be that Englander? Is that not the problem in terms of what you're saying there? You're thinking about playing a big team and we're thinking about stopping them. Would the team who are playing us, would they not be thinking, I'd want a left footer there to cause them problems so we can go forward maybe have a better balance actually being on the ball whoever that left back is is probably going to struggle to play from that position because he's on his weak foot I've played a left back as a right footer do you think that's probably he'd have a chance he's the best left back I've seen in the last 18 but he's got to get back in the Arsenal team that's the thing that's the problem months away the World Cup is and I'm sure he'll get yeah but if you're asking if the World Cup was next week I've seen him play in the Bernabeu last year it was unbelievable unbelievable yeah Real Madrid So who are you starting at left back?

21:36If Myles Lewis Skelly got to what I saw last season, I'd start him. Okay, who are you starting at left back? Myles Lewis Skelly now. Yeah, I wouldn't disagree with that, but I think the boy... And O 'Reilly. O 'Reilly, I like that. I think O 'Reilly could surprise everybody. Was I? I'd go Liverpool.

21:55I think he likes Liverpool. That's the thing. I think he likes it as long as he's... Yeah, I'd go for O 'Reilly, but I think he might revert back to him. Jed Spence? No, I said I think he will go. Oh. I think he will go for Jed Spence. I think he might just revert back to being a bit more solid and thinking that he needs that sort of... I'm not convinced for Spence. I don't think Jed Spence will go. You don't? You don't think he'll go even as a... I think if he gets injured... Who? I just don't know where they're going. Kane's goals now are getting too ridiculous. It's ridiculous. But if he gets injured, I just don't know where he'll go.

22:29You walked off the horse with Kane, didn't you? Obviously, wouldn't you? anyone I've ever when I speak to who walk with him or coaches or people this is so highly honestly he's a and he's a fierce like massively fierce determination like he's not this is like he's hard almost like I obviously played with Shearer who's got that sort of like sense of mentality of just like a brick just solid as a rock all the way through Kane I mean Kane when he played for England when I was there was not the football player that he is now. I mean, the football player he is now has evolved in the last eight or nine years.

23:06But his character, he was young at the time, relatively young to what he is today. But you could see there was just a meeting, I remember, I think I remember, it was around, there was a tragedy that happened and we were playing France and there was a suggestion to swap kits. I can't remember, I tell you what, it might have been something that happened in France. It might have been the concert, the Paris attacks and there was a suggestion that France would play in their blue kit and we would play in the away French kit and Harry Kane I think it was 21, 22 at the time said no we're playing in the England kit he said we'd never ever go out onto that pitch without the England kit and I always remember he wasn't the captain he wasn't in the leadership group at that time and I thought ooh I think I was the captain I didn't know I was the captain I was the captain I remember we played Spain by Benidorm yeah Benidorm there was a team meeting and it was something that was suggested by I can't remember it had happened from the media or it had come from the FA and I remember him just saying in a very quiet manner no we play in our England kit we go out there and we play and I just thought do you know something just a little thing obviously he was a great player then as well he was a great goal scorer his training his precision his mentality if he missed a chance it didn't absolutely faze him When we're on the pitch and when they come out and they practice, I always say to them, you watch him.

24:31We watch some people, you know, they do that shooting and they just shoot. He's never shooting just for shooting. The goalie's either making a great save or it's going in, in that moment. I think to myself, that's what a centre-folder is just about to play. That's how sharp you should be in that particular warm-up session everyone's watching and he's always on point. He's a proper character. I think you said something about a year ago maybe that you think he could be the greatest England player ever, which is a massive statement when you think of Sir Bobby Charlton and, you know... Him? Bobby Moore, yourself, you know, Kevin Keegan, Brian Robson, all the amazing...

25:05Gazza, David Beck, all these players that have played, you said Harry Kane... Lineker. Yeah, I think... Lineker Shearer. You know, guys, bro. It's true, Shearer, Lineker, all those great players. I think just his goals he scored and, as you said, his performances, he'll go on and get the Caps record as well. You'd imagine the Caps he's on. I just think how he's evolved as a player is incredible. It reminds me of Cristiano when he was at United when he was younger. Sometimes he's in a mad angle and he's shooting and you're like, what are you doing, shooting? You might take passer, but as you said, it doesn't bother him.

25:42He'll try it again and he'll keep going and both right and left foot. I just think he's, for me, he's the best player. I absolutely love him. I think he's a little bit underrated, even though we're talking about how great he is and there was always that thing about trophies, wasn't there? Do you think that's why people think that? I think an interesting one, right, I know you've just mentioned it, you know, Shearer was almost like the centre forward, wasn't he, of the Premier League. When the Premier League started, it felt like Shearer for sort of six or seven years was like sort of the guy and he was England's guy and his most goals in the Premier League.

26:14And I think if you ask most people up and down the country, Shearer or Kane, I think the majority would go with Shearer. for me I've always been Kane she is amazing but I don't know what you can say against Kane you know he's gone to Bayern Munich he's getting like Ronaldo Messi level he's broke their records yeah and it's like he's going to get more goals and caps than sort of Linick, Ishida Jimmy Green you know all the great you and it's like what hasn't the lad done what can you throw at him you know people say he didn't score he didn't win a trophy I should say there is a big club back Having played for Liverpool, Arsenal and United, if you don't play for one of those three clubs, and I saw this when I was with England, I think Sven was the manager and I think it became a parity.

27:00You don't get the same... I don't know what it is because he's not won the trophies, he's been with Tottenham. Now he's obviously gone off to an amazing club, a huge club, and he's a little bit off of radar. There's an element of that. It's a big club bias, it's an element of snobbery. But you definitely get... I think if you play for Liverpool, United or Arsenal, you've certainly got more scrutiny, you've got more publicity, you've got more PR, you've got more just noise around you, whereas actually Tottenham can play on Saturday against Brentford at home and that game might go a little bit unnoticed.

27:30No Arsenal-Liverpool or United game really goes unnoticed. Tottenham are a massive club, but just don't have that same level as obviously those three. Do you think that could be a bit of it? Yeah, there could be something in that. And I actually think there's this thing about Kane, and probably Ash-Uain, you're probably better than most of us to answer that in terms of in the biggest game. So I think there's a lot of cup finals maybe he hasn't scored. Maybe that's that one thing if he could win the Champions League for Bayern Munich, get the goal in the final. Is that something maybe you look at yourself?

27:58You've been there and scored in Champions League finals. Would you look at that? Yeah, but I think he's probably been in the underdog team in the finals, hasn't he? When he played Liverpool in the Champions League final. You weren't expecting Tottenham to win. I weren't expecting Tottenham to win the game. and yeah you could throw that at him but I just think you know what he's doing his numbers just override all of that you think his numbers because we consider all we consider his football right his game now is unbelievable but then Ronaldo if you're trying to compare a strike sometimes you do have to look at numbers them stats are pretty his numbers are amazing so sometimes you have to talk about has he not scored these finals or has he played for Spurs yeah all this part of the conversation but look at his stats for goals it just speaks for itself really I agree I think the numbers he's getting is incredible I mean the thing I love about him as well I know he's been top goalscorer in the World Cup wasn't he a few but sometimes you watch him in tournaments and he can look a little bit sluggish I think sort of at the end of the season the heat pitches are a bit dry do you know what I mean he can look a bit sluggish and he gets written off a little bit after tournaments a bit like ok we've got to move on from Kane and he's just there again isn't he the next tournament he's just like there's no one else no one's taking place What age is he now?

29:18He's got that mindset Anthony the last two games I didn't think he should have even beaten the squad What is he? You said go and have a holiday the last two games He's got the winter break this year for Bayern I think that would certainly help him There is an element of towards the end there's definitely a thing that towards the World Cup he has at times tailed or to pro tournaments he has tailed towards the end of a season that this is definitely his better period my feeling is having sort of work with him that he does tend to because he's put so much he plays every game never misses he gives everything in training every day and there is an element of probably mental and physical tiredness coming towards him so if he can get that winter break But why doesn't why doesn't he step back from playing every game for example for England when England played the so real Leicester teams I'm all about in friendlies why doesn't he sit out to some of them Oh he's scoring those goals isn't he No I get it we're talking about Ronaldo Messi the one playing every game and obviously we give him a thumbs up for that but if you're on about peaking at the right time then there has to be an element where you go you've evolved your game obviously you've gone to Bayern and maybe diets and different types of training and he's playing for the best team over there so it's not like Spurs he's probably getting more chances and he's maybe not working this hard to get back but come towards the end of the season when England have one or two friendlies before the game just sit up a couple of these games and make sure you're ready for the most important matches so I give him a thumbs up for wanting to play every match Ronaldo's the same Messi these boys are fantastic but there must come a point where you go we're just going to ease you for one or two games I think that should have come from Tuchel.

30:42I think the last two England games, I don't think he should have been there at all. And he's going to want to be there, so I think Tuchel, I think he should have just left him out. Coming from you, though, I find that a bit rich, because if a manager tried, if someone tried to have a word with you, I remember towards the end of your career with England, if Roy tried to have a word with you to say, look, you know, you're never accepting that. You'd never accept not playing. He won't either. That's where, I know I wouldn't have, Harry Kane wouldn't have but I think that's where the manager's got to take control of it and say is that a lack of respect to the staff yeah but then you get the newspaper aspect of it I say he's trying to arrest Wayne Wayne doesn't want to arrest Wayne Rooney defies manager no but I think if he actually sits him down he's experienced enough now obviously to yeah but he's never disrespected managers but what he did say is no I'm playing he would just be I want to play that's disrespect that's fucking business man it's not disrespect it's not if your manager says you're not playing and you say you're not playing but Roy you probably had a bit of that and you wouldn't be rested I mean I never saw you rested hardly it's something when you get to 31 32 and obviously we're a bit older a bit wise you know you have to sometimes say to a player about looking at the bigger picture we're on about missing the odd game I don't disagree with you but certain characters for example England will have two friendly games before the World Cup won't they two friendly games miss one of them just sit down and it's not just the physical stuff there's a mental side of it and then you're giving other players an opportunity sorry Wayne you're giving other players an opportunity to say listen if he is missing you'll be ready it's not easy yeah but that happened I got rested in the League Cup final against Aston Villa got rested in the FA Cup semi-final against Everton when he was in the squad how old were you then was I?

32:2614 mid 20s mid 20s mid 20s yeah because we had Champions League games he had schooled an exit I don't know why the fuck is this story and go to school. This episode of Stick to Football is brought to you by Arm Clothing. Right, I want to draw towards, on Instagram the other day, and obviously there's a lot of hoo-ha around Bellingham, and I think you're absolutely right. There's a comment that you made off the back of a story that was brewing around Jude Bellingham being unhappy. He said, they need to create this kind of beef because there's nothing else to talk about till the World Cup, so it's going to be all the way to the World Cup.

33:05They hate that they can't get to him. They hate that they can't negatively influence his club career like they have done with so many before him. A blessed young man with talent and love in abundance. When you said they hate that they can't get to him, what do you mean? Look, his parents have kept him away from the Premier League. You know what I mean? He doesn't play in the Premier League. He kept him away from the journalists. They can't get to him through, like I said in there, through his club, like through a Real Madrid, so as they can try and taint the way Real Madrid's thinking and say, yeah, we're going to keep him in line and that.

33:37They cannot get to this guy. And this is somebody who is very much an achiever. He goes out, he's a winner. He wants to do it. He wins. What they said about Jude not celebrating that was complete fabrication of life. So what they're trying to do, they're trying to build something because England have qualified so easy. They've not conceded any goals. They've won all the games easy. So they need to have something else to pile on top of the narrative. You know, you've got a manager who's very, very honest in everything. He said, we spoke to him more. He's really candid in how he speaks, you know, and he said that.

34:08We asked him a question. I said, are you worried about having any regrets about your honesty and giving so much detail? He said, no, because I say the same thing in there. So they know that. Them journalists will know that, and they will try to ask him something that he will answer that they can run with again. And I'm worried for Jude simply because he's somebody that they can't control. You can't control him. Obviously, coming off of the who else and what he's done in the World Cup, he's showing people that, you know, I'm here. I'm black. I'm proud. I'm ready to go. All that vibe is something that a certain man can't deal with.

34:38I agree with you. A personal experience, and I've spoken about this in 2016, that Raheem Sterling came to see me in the tournament and said that he felt as though he was being persecuted, that it was unfair and it was basically not relating to football. And I remember at the time me giving him a completely and utterly inadequate answer, and I've spoken about this publicly since, where I said, look, Raheem, it's because of your quality and who you are and what you are that they're criticising you. I remember they did this with Wayne Rooney. I actually name-checked him. They did this with David Beckham.

35:05They did this with Paul Gascoigne. The best players, the biggest names. But actually what I didn't read at the time, and to be fair what he was actually crying out and asking me for help for, was around the fact that this wasn't relating to his football performances, which it was with maybe yourself or with Gazza or with Bex. It was more around the colour of his skin and this persecution around how, if he had a car that was this and another player had a car that was this that was white, there was a difference in reporting of it. Do you think that is happening again in front of our eyes here? You know something?

35:32I remember saying I had to do something for GQ not long ago, and I said, I don't think, as Englishmen, there's certain Englishmen, I'm an Englishman, I can't hide from that. Even though when I was younger, people would say, yeah, but you're not really English, are you? Yeah, I'm English. I don't think they're ready for a black superstar like that who can move like Jude's moving. You know, they can't touch him, like I just said. He goes out there, he performs, he does what he does. He says, who else? It's too uppity for these people. Something that they used to say back in the day, if you're a black guy or a black man who's, you know, I'll put it in a football term.

36:06So everybody, they love N 'Golo Kante. He's a humble black man, gets on with what he's doing. I'm not saying that he's an Uncle Tom or anything, just saying that's how his personality is. But if you get a Pogba or a Bellingham and you get that kind of energy, that does not sit well with the people, that kind of person. So someone like Jude, for some reason, frightens these people because of his capability and the inspiration he can give. It's something that you're taught when you're, as a black man, when you're going out there, you just want to try and do the best you can and keep your head down and be, what, for want of a better, a humble fucking slave.

36:41This is where this is coming, this is dragging up from that kind of energy. Because if you are outspoken black, and doing that kind of, playing to that kind of level and not caring, that frightens certain people. And that's what's going to happen with you. This guy who I'm telling you about in respects of, he's obsessed with him he's moving off of that energy he can't look and see a black man doing what Jude's doing and think that that's not uppity he's not an uppity n*** that's where I'm going with that that's where that comes down to I mean that's some speech that righty and I think it definitely is I remember with Raheem coming to see me placing it back in two hours thinking right I've got to pick him up because he was low he was really low He was down on the...

37:28Because you don't know where to go. There's nowhere to go. And he had nowhere to go. So he comes and sees me, and I've not got the ability, probably education or the understanding, to be able to give him the answers and the understanding that he was coming to me with. I remember at the time, and it only actually, I only remember seeing, it was something on X a year later, where it showed an article, the articles on Rahim, where he had a car, house, jewellery, a watch, and articles about a white player and what the headlines were and the difference. And you could see this complete and utter bias that just right, now I get what he means.

38:06I only saw it a year or so later. But that's something that I can see at the moment. It is happening with Jude Bellingham. You know what? Again, it's a tiring thing. It's a tiring exercise to talk about. I sent a message to Jude saying, listen, my friend, be ready. You know, I feel something you can feel. When was this, Rytey? Before the England game. This just now? Yeah, before the England game. And I just said, just be ready. Well, it's good that you can help him, Rytey. Well, the thing is, you know what the thing is, though? And I'd say, maybe, you know, of course it's private, but he said, ready for what?

38:41And I said, listen, it's coming and I'm here. I'm going to be here. I'm going to make sure that I'm going to be on this side. Because what happens is that it just comes and it just keeps coming. It's like a tsunami. And unless you play well and do something, and that just shifts it for a little while. Because as soon as you play again and you don't play well, it comes back. And so he said, Woskari, I said, just be ready for it. And it's here. It's funny with Belling, I think the older we are and the more we're sort of away from the game, if you like, you don't know players. Maybe obviously you've got a bit of a relationship with you, but we don't know players that well.

39:2222 as well 22 but he's the one sometimes we'll see players when we're around the interview areas they might join us and when we do Champions League stuff for CBS now and again if you go on the road you go in the mix zone and players have to do interviews it's contractual and when I read reports about Bellingham sort of how he's perceived or how he's supposed to be around the camp and I'm not just saying this he is the best player who sort of speaks to me. He asks me about my son. How's he doing? He knows where he's playing, how he's doing for Malta. He'd have a laugh, a joke, and he looks genuinely interested in speaking to you.

40:00It's not just like, are you, you know, sort of moved on. So you read things, and that probably does influence people, doesn't it? We know how powerful the press are. And listen, we're part of the media as well. We shouldn't forget that. But he is completely different when I see him face-to-face than what I read about him. Yeah, 100%. He is an absolute diamond. You know, it's a shame because I think that his parents, they read the room very well. They don't speak to no journalists again. It's, again, it's everything what you're not... It's a bad thing because... You know what? Remember Des? Des was on.

40:35Des said the same. But with the help of the... You know, to see that on a side... Then you have to have somebody who will go to him and then that guy holds you to, OK, I can speak for Judah. All players have to do that right. He doesn't need to do that. This is what I'm saying. No player really wants to do it. But I'm just saying, if they could see the other side... Obviously, they have to do it when they're in Europe. They have to do it because they're contract-wise. And Jamie's just saying... What, speak to the journalists? Yeah. Most footballers I know don't really want to speak to journalists, but they think it's part of their job.

41:04Is that enough? I'm just saying... No, I'm not saying... I'm just saying we don't see the other side to the kid, you know what I mean, that Jamie just spoke about. And maybe that would just help that... Instead of getting bogged down by what, the media are chasing and trying to paint the picture of the kid. Well, maybe you look at it from the parents. They're not fussed about how he has to deal with it. They just want to keep that away from him. And that's fine, of course. That's their choice, obviously. Go on. Jude Bellingham is definitely England's biggest star. He's playing for Real Madrid.

41:33He's the biggest talent. So naturally, I think journalists are going to ask about the fact that Thomas Tuchel is leaving him out of the team. That's natural, I think, because he's such a... It's that balance, isn't it? And that fine balance of being able to make sure that you can ask the questions about the football where it doesn't become a persecution. That's what I think you're talking about, isn't it? Without a doubt. You know the thing as well, I don't think Jude's got any problem with Morgan Rodgers being the number 10. He's got to dislodge him because Jude will believe he can dislodge him.

42:01And you'd like to think that Morgan Rodgers would say, well, I'm going to try and make sure you don't dislodge me. I know how good you are. That's what England needs. That's how England end up winning the World Cup is that great players have to wait their turn and when they come in... Thank you, Roy. So Jude ain't got no problem with that. But it's all the fluff around it to try and build more onto that. And then anything happens. Like they say he threw his arms up when he got substituted. And Tuchel said, well, I didn't see that. I didn't see that. I'll have to look at that. He didn't say that.

42:29Yes, he did celebrate with the guys. So that's those little foolishness things. Those foolishness kind of actions that they're trying to take is what kind of just slowly builds like what Jamie said. Seems like a nice guy. But people, like you say, Roy, you read about it. You listen to what you're reading and you think, yeah, he looks like that. Look at him. Who's not vexed if you get taken off? Who isn't? But, you know, when you're saying what Tuchel said at the end of the game, you see the clip on social media. You think, oh, Tuchel's maybe having a little pop at Bellingham. Yeah. But he's getting asked a question.

42:59He's getting pushed into that direction. He's got no idea. He didn't really know, did he? As soon as the question's asked, oh, I'll have to have a look at that. But, you know, we want players to be together. And before you know it, it becomes something, doesn't it? But from Tuchel's point of view, I actually think he's handled it pretty well. I think if you go back to the last tournament, it did feel like it was Bellingham. It was just all about Bellingham. He was scoring the goals. It was like, if Bellingham is not playing, England can't do nothing. And it probably takes me back to Stevie at Liverpool.

43:31And I always remember something Ferguson said about Brian Robb, somebody first coming to United, where sometimes you have this figure and everyone feels if they're not playing, you can't win. it's almost like oh my god they're not playing and I think what Thomas Tuchel's done in the last yeah I think it's in a good way it's that like we know he's a great player we want him to fight for his position like everybody else he'll be in the team he'll be in that position when the World Cup starts I have no doubt about that but there's also probably this feeling in the team as well that if Jude is injured or the manager decides we can still win a game we can still play we can still have a decent tournament so I actually think it's been really good for Jude and really good for Thomas Tuchel and the score what's happened over the last couple of months in terms of the selection No one's got a 100 % starter.

44:13There's other players come in and done well. So I think Tuchel's handed it really well in terms of the selection and sending a message to the rest of the squad. So if you can, you get Kane, Rice, Bellingham, Endersons there as well, Stones. That looks like a really good leadership group. That's got to be together, surely. You're on about Jude saying, obviously, it's nice to speak to you and get some advice, but you hope there's other lads in the squad helping. because you forget how young he is. You hope this Kane and these other lads are having these chats. That's where the senior players are so important.

44:45If they do see a player who thinks people are after him for the wrong reasons, not footballing, then hopefully he's getting that help from players within the squad. Surely. I hope so, yeah. Maybe that's why Henderson's coming. Maybe that's why as well. When he replies ready for what, he obviously means he can't see what's coming. Yeah, because he obviously can't. Because, you know, why would he? Would you think it's impacting him right now in respect of the level of sort of the tension that he's getting and the sort of scrutiny and the stuff that you're talking about? No, I don't think so because I think it's another...

45:21I think that Jude's the kind of person that will use that as fuel. But he has to. That's what he's done, yeah. He'll use it as fuel because even the other day, he got married a match. That was his frustration of coming off, weren't it? His frustration was being left out of the previous squad and then he started this game and he hasn't scored. That was his frustration. He got a player of the match for the game. Should have scored in the game, he'd admit that himself, but I think they're trying to, they're trying to portray somebody who's not the person they want him to be in respects of the flash, arrogant, I'm going to cause problems in the cat, he's not that guy, but you know, he's somebody that is not afraid to say how he feels, he's not afraid to do the who else, that really rankled a lot of people, and what for?

46:01Do you know what the great players do? They do deal with that stuff, don't they? They'll always be that in football, in sport, people go after people for the wrong reasons, is almost mafia feel with some of the media. They'll chase a certain player, but the top people, and you've experienced it, just push that to the side. Absolutely. I'll focus on the game. It's like Beckham, bro. Beckham, yeah. They can deal with honour. Jesus Christ. That's what makes them brilliant players. Yeah, I mean, obviously, you received scrutiny for obviously with England, obviously for different reasons than potentially we've just discussed there with Wrighty on Jude Bellingham.

46:30But did it ever get to you, the sort of, because you obviously, you're the person around this table that probably received the most scrutiny when you played with England at times? Yeah, he gets it, of course. Obviously, a lot of mine was... Again, because I was controversial and things I'd done probably more off the pitch than on the pitch and I spoke about it, it was almost like you were getting bullied and there's not really much you can do about it. So I get what Wrighty was talking about there. That's why I stayed quiet on it, really. But I get it, I understand it, but not from a racial point of view.

47:05so I can't really comment on that bit. But in terms of, I felt like, yeah, you... But did it affect you on the pitch, Randall? Not on the pitch. On the pitch is where I just felt... At ease. ...safe, yeah. What about on a daily basis, just every day when you wake up, you're ready to go and there's something else? Yeah, no. Something else. It's horrible. And you think more about your family than you do yourself. And, you know, your parents and your family back home, that's what you think more about. So you were glad at the games? You were glad when the games... So when the game today, that's...

47:35that was that was the easy part the games was the easy part but dealing with it and you know a constant judgment basically of yeah was that was tough yeah This episode of Stick to Football is brought to you by Arm Clothing Do you think we're going to have to be more careful moving forward as pundits I'm not just talking about boards I'm just generally the whole of the actual sort of you know I think when I first came into pundits 14 years ago I think the idea of being very direct about what you would say about a player, to be fair, was deemed as being sort of, that's what everyone wants. You want the enthusiasm, almost like you think of yourself as being knowledgeable about the game, but you're trying to be like a fan in the pub and connect to that sort of football fan.

48:18Do you think what we're talking about and how we say things now, we have to change how we do it, don't we, I think? I'm not talking about the Jude thing specifically, I'm talking about just generally the responsibility of words and what damage they do to players. I said about David Luiz that he was like basically a nine-year-old being controlled by someone in the crowd. He's like he's being controlled by a nine-year-old on a PlayStation in the crowd. I, at the time, thought it was a great line. Everybody thought it was a great line. Except to have a... No, but do you know something? It says that.

48:49He actually direct messaged me about four or five years later. I didn't repeat the line, but I sort of said that, you know, there he goes again type thing. And he actually direct messaged me and it had an impact on me because he said, here you go again, my friend. And I thought, do you know something? he's a human being that stuck with him I'm not saying that it was to be fair I was trying to think of an analogy of someone at the time we think about back fours used to be very solid you didn't used to see sort of defenders charging out and sort of doing things which is more of an international Brazilian, Argentinian, Uruguayan maybe sometimes Southern European defenders do that you know you think of sort of Laurent Blanc when he came to United he used to sometimes you know do that sort of where's he gone and it catch you by surprise so you're trying to do it with a bit of humour a bit of intent but the impact that that would have had on him.

49:35Yeah, but pundits are entitled to make a mistake as well, of course. But that's been going on for years. If you remember Luke Chadwick, Chad's came out years later. Remember, he used to get heavily critical. He said a really effective life. That was more from fans, really, wasn't it? No, I get that, but it's still criticism from... No, it wasn't from the fans, it was people on the TV. Were they? The way he looked. What was that programme? Oh, sorry. Yeah, you're right. What's that programme? The fantasy kind of... Captain something. Yeah, you're right, you're right. The quiz thing. Those are the...

49:59Criticising week and week, over the... and he said that had a huge effect on our mentally. So yeah, as pundits, we do have to be careful, but we can't become robots either. I think we're entitled to make mistakes. And we're also, we're emotional. We're watching games. I'd hate to be sitting doing a match as a pundit and going, you know, you do get emotional about games. But I was critical. When you move away from the football, and then it starts getting personal. Well, I was critical of Harry Maguire, and I kind of, did I cross it? I apologise to him. So I think as pundits, if we do cross the line, and you do think you're affecting a player, and you've gone overboard, then you do apologise to a player if you've done it and I've done it I don't know if you've done it either if you think because on a match day you get emotional sometimes you do get carried away and you get frustrated with a player it can be it might be frustrated with Maguire but it doesn't mean to say I don't think he's a bloody good lad or a decent kid and if you do get a chance then you apologise I got it wrong I do think if you think when we were playing and think of England teams and you think about the media way then I think the media as in like the press and the papers I think it's a bit softer now than maybe it was when we were playing with the history It really goes for a player after a tournament.

51:01But I actually think us ourselves are probably a bit more direct than what Punditry were 20 years ago, where it almost felt like maybe they would just look after the mates on the pitch or the manager they knew. So I think we're probably a little bit more on the front. Yeah, I think Punditry is definitely more punchy and on the front foot. And I actually think players would probably be more worried about what we'd be saying than maybe what Mark they got in the paper. Whereas when we were playing, it'd be like, what's on the back of the age? Yeah, the journalists, yeah. And there's a lot more games on the TV, isn't there?

51:32Yeah, and there's a lot more pundits, there's a lot more TV, there's social media. I don't think players are sort of... I wouldn't say I was worried about the press as such, but there was definitely a feeling around England that if you went out of a tournament badly, someone would be a scapegoat. I don't see that now. I think players are probably more worried about what we say. Yeah, you're talking about Brian Woolnough, Stephen Howard, Harry Harris, that sort of group around that time that were deemed... You thought you were being abused, basically. you thought it was bullying. You felt as though their power was so great.

52:02But are you giving them the power? Are you giving them the power by taking so much notice? The newspapers, so media has changed, Roy. Back then the newspapers were a phenomenon in terms of, you basically, if you remember the turnip on Graham Taylor's head or you remember David James getting depicted as something, you think of the big sort of Steve McLaren. Can I tell you something, Nev? Sorry, don't underestimate the Irish media. The Irish media are up there with all that stuff. Are you terrible? Absolutely. I'm sure. They go after people. I've experienced that in Ireland. And it can be, yeah, they go after you.

52:32But now I do think the papers are more responsible. Actually, I think it's actually social media and probably the sort of pun. You're right. Back when I was playing sort of with England maybe 20 years ago, 15 years ago, I can't even really remember who was on television, criticised us because I don't remember anything standing out. Obviously, the Alan Hansen line, if you can't win anything with kids, was a brutal line. But it wasn't a brutal line as impersonal. It was more a case of, I don't think you can win things for young players. It's fair. I remember Des Kelly. He done a piece. We'd probably say exactly the same.

53:02We saw a young team. Really personal with me. My mum cried when she read how he was speaking about me. I thought to myself, I don't speak about people in a way. I'll critique what they've done. As a forward, I would never critique that individual. But some of the things that he was saying, even up to this day, even now it's still with me, some of the things he said. We do have a responsibility in that way because I don't think we do need to go for the individual. You can say anything about what he's just done on the pitch and how he's played. You can say anything. That's a terrible pass from him.

53:36You can say things like that. If you're a footballer and you get upset for that, then you're not in the right place. You should be able to be critiqued about your play and what you've done and if you've got something wrong. You should never, ever go to personal and going behind the scenes of people, what they're doing. Never, ever, as a pundit. Again, as a pundit, you've got to bring something to the party. I think if we all sit there as pundits like robots, if we're just there to analyse certain games, you have to bring something to the game as well, don't you? I don't mean go after players. I agree.

54:06We had Madison on there. I remember I had a bit of banter with Madison. And players can give you a little bit back. I like that. If players take it in the right spirit, if you're going, oh, he's got to do better, he's got to get in the team a bit more, there can be a little bit of humour to that. I just feel that with the social media, Roy, Sorry, with the social media and everybody who's doing something on their way, whoever the team, it's all about the criticising the players and what they've done wrong and how bad they've been. And they garner so much attention through the negative. And this is why I feel like the players are like they are.

54:38But after five minutes, I guarantee if you walked into a dressing room, Wayne, obviously you've managed recently, most players would be on their phones within five minutes. So as much as we're saying, don't take too much notice, is sometimes they're chasing that. They're chasing that almost in the madness. They're obviously looking for good stuff, but a lot of times it will be bad stuff. And the players are the first to start looking for it. There also has to be a response to be the players going, don't. You're not going into that world, you're looking for trouble. And I'm on about within five minutes after a game.

55:06I don't know why you would even think to go on social media as a player, good and bad. I think you just have to have a complete blanket ban and just stay away from it. Even as a pundit? It's true. It's true. I don't look at comments. I can't see comics. I don't look at any like that. Oh, God. But if you're a player again, why within five minutes after a game would you be checking your phone? Because you're addicted to it. You're addicted to the love or the hate. Hate, yeah. You know what I mean? You get so much love. Oh, they love me. And then you get one person say, you're a fucking chair. And that's the one you remember and you think to yourself, you've spoiled my fucking day.

55:37Why have I spoiled my own day? Looking at the comments. Turn them off. Take them off. Talk about spoiler day. Let's get Super 6 in. Where's Ben?

55:50Super 6 are giving you the chance to win£250 ,000 this weekend. It's completely free to play. Just predict six scores this weekend and the money could be yours. And don't forget to join our mini-league. You must join our mini-league using the code S6-STF. S6-STF. Get your Super 6 picks in before 3pm on Saturday, the 22nd of November, for a chance to win. 18 plus TNCs apply.

56:23Oh, we had a nightmare. Did we have a nightmare? Well, you did. Of course we did. I think we only got two points. Do I need to move here? Yes, you're on that side, Wazza. On the side, Wazza? Oh, we only got two points. Yeah, you're on that side. Seriously, was he looking at it? I wasn't looking at it. I was looking, because I care. You know what? I care. I'm going to stop contributing to this, because I'm not good. We had it. What's that shirt on there, Ben? Super six. Thanks for asking, man. OK, see, I know the script. Right, Ben, let's go. We've got two. We've only got two. We're coming back, Cara.

56:54If you enter the league, you win a signed shirt. You've really sold that, Ben. Hold it up properly anyway. Beautiful. We were trying to get some ground on Cara before Cara come back as well, Cara. Sign it on set. Yeah. Cara, I've been fighting back without you. You doing all right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. We've got to get Moisey on our side. Oh, I think we only got two points. That was me. City would beat Liverpool. It's Jill's fault. City beat Liverpool. We miss you, Jill, but you're not good at this. What did I have? Right. I think I'd say it'd be Liverpool. Last week, Gary and Jamie, you got eight points.

57:29Oh. You got lucky. Top 23 % of players. Wow. We're really in front of you. We got two. I know we got two. Maximum. If we got more than two. Look at Ben, let me see his face. He's buzzing. Oh. Roy, Jill and Ian, you got two.

57:49on the rails oh they're doing an arsehole

57:56oh righty concentrate man Wayne's going to save us Jesus here we go you need to do what David Wise on to Neve last year Wayne's fault this is brilliant neck and neck you've blown your league do you want to go first do we go first how many points were we in front I know but if the league finished today we'd be champions wouldn't we you would be yeah alright so it doesn't matter if it's one or two you know when you get a medal doesn't tell you how many points you want to play. We're aware of that. OK, but we also know we're only halfway through the season. There's no medals being handed out today.

58:24So I think we always go first, don't we? Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's the problem. What are you thinking? OK, I'll go with that. 2-1 Liverpool. You said no home record's good. 2-1. I don't know. That's not bad. It's icy. No, they were the only team to win there last year, weren't they? Why don't we just come in every one of their scores and we'll win the league by a point? Literally, they'll probably... You'll find a way to win here. That's not you, Roy. That's not you. You wouldn't do that. Forrest, I'm going for it. You fancy... Forrest, to win at Liverpool. No. That's a meme on Sunday. Forrest, to win at Liverpool.

58:57Forrest beat Liverpool. I don't want this. So what are you going on for the fact that Liverpool... Their home record. Because they're at home. Their home record is still very good. Forrest will make it very difficult. United beat them, Roy. Forrest won there last year. United beat them, Roy. Forrest to win two years. 1-1 I think 3-1 I don't want to copy them I think 3-1 3-1 Right you two got to do something After the international break the lads come on back a bit stiff What did you say? The Hungarian lads will be crawling Bournemouth, West Ham, 3pm You love Bournemouth Bournemouth are winning that I don't know, West Ham Away from home, sit in, counter

59:41I like that with every game Yeah, Wolves Come on, what are you thinking? Come on You took 20 minutes for the Liverpool game Bournemouth 3-1 Well done Ben Did you just add a brown pen? This is a different one I think Bournemouth 3-1 I like the top I like the top That one You know I think You don't want stuff like that I think you'd either go fully open Or just I don't like that. Cheers, mate. It's the confidence I need to do a segment. 2-1, we'll be born. 2-1 Bournemouth. We don't need to be braver. We need to take more of a gamble. 2-1, I like that. That's great. Your next Palace at Wolves. Bournemouth, West Ham.

1:00:23What are we doing, Cara? Bournemouth, West Ham? I think Bournemouth will win you. I'm overthinking now. Shall we go 3-1? 2-0, yeah. We'll go 2-0. Bournemouth, 2-0. if it's 2-0 right Roy if it's 2-0 right you're going to something I don't know what I'm saying but I'm vexed you can sign a DM Wolves Palace come on don't be like that right Bournemouth West don't fit your brother 2-0 love a brother I felt that Wolves Palace I'd like under you because you're the boss it's your hand alright it looks awful yeah terrible pen it should have been a silver pen I'm not sure about this game at all I couldn't even call I mean what do you mean you could call that Palace are beating A draw in the manager's first home game.

1:01:07Would he be happy with that? 1-1. Yeah. We'll go 1-1. Draws are no good to them. They need wins. Yeah, but... Palace are beating them. Palace are all the... Come on, you Eagles. What do you think? I think Wolves are goal at home. 3-1. Go 3-1 Palace. 3-1 Palace. Go on. Good wow. Have we misread this game? You've got to Man City. Is that us? Man City. When's that game? Saturday, 5.30. Saturday, 5.30. Oh. Oh. It's before the Arsenal game as well. Is Arsenal 8 o 'clock Saturday night? Sunday 4.30. Sunday, yeah, I'm doing the game. Sorry, you've been before the game. Yes. Yes, so if they win... 1-1.

1:01:51Are you a bit worried, right? Oh, he's worried. 1-1. It's not that worried, but you know... 1-1, yeah? This is what the league's about now. Yeah. This is what it's about. This is what everyone's saying about how great our squad is. Yeah, it is, but this is when we find out what we're about. Stop crying it in you, will you? Gabrielle, writing. Oh, that's a big one. That's some news. Yeah, but we've got Mascara. Yeah, and we've got to discuss it then. Oh. Mascara. Yeah. This is big if City winning. I probably would have gone 1-1. I need to find out. I think Arsenal winning at Newcastle was big. I said exactly the same.

1:02:19Liverpool have won there. Arsenal have won there. This is my newspaper column on Saturday. Oh, is it? Yeah. Can you tell us what it's in, Nick? There's a podcast here on Wednesday. Yeah. Yeah. I just don't want people to think that I've copied you. I've already done that. That's why you're saying it now. No, but I just think if Arsenal win the league, I think everyone will just look at that. There'll be obviously other games coming, but that Newcastle game will feel massive. I think if City do, because I think if City win this, I think it puts big pressure on Arsenal going to that game the next day.

1:02:44You'll all be a little bit nervous. Come on, let me see your predictions. I'm not sure City are winning the game. I'm not, I know. 2-2. We're in Ireland's form. We can go draw, because they... We can go draw, we'll go 2-2. Listen, what do we want for the Premier League? We want City to win, so it juices up Sunday, doesn't it? Yes. For us. Sky till I die. Can make change everything. Narrative, yeah. If we give City a bit of confidence and they get that done. Go on then, what's the problem? Let's go with City. We'll go 2-1 City. Go on, I like that. I need the two. Leeds, Villa, Sunday 2pm. Villa.

1:03:22We're going Villa, 2-1. Villa or 2-0? Leeds were so bad against Forest, weren't they? I know they're a whore. 2-0? 2-0. 2-0. 2-0. Villa. 2-0. Yeah. You think? Leeds are going down, yeah. Wow. They were dreadful against Forrest. I said Leeds were going down after watching them on the first game of the season even though they beat Everton. I thought, it's not right now. I thought, ooh. Everton was shocking that night. He was like, but I just thought, Leeds, ooh. This is why I'm no good at them. Why am I giving somebody a goal just because they're at home for them? Yeah. Jesus Christ. Could it be the end where Villa go and win two or three nil?

1:03:56You go, oh, they're doomed. A little away from what? Yeah, Villa. Are we going with Villa? but are we going to win Leeds a goal? He's been struggling to score, haven't he? Yeah, don't give Leeds a goal. Unfortunately, Leeds, I love you, but bro. 1-0, Villa. Is he going to win 1-0? 1-0, yeah. I always remember your goal there, right to the chip. Do you remember it? That was a brilliant goal. I remember it. 4-0 at the time. Stuck on the foot. Oh, was it one of them? I know it was 4-0. What a big goal. He's talking about a swing. Was it the fourth and the fourth? No, I'm not about Leeds game. Yeah, it was 3-0.

1:04:27It's not a big goal when it's 3-0. Right, come on. This is the big one. Oh, here we go. Right, then. Big one. 3-2. Oh! Two. You're giving him two goals. Oh, wow. Isn't Gabriel injured? Yeah, but Mascaro's coming in. All right, fine, then. It's all right. It means you won't score from a corner, though. It means you won't score from a corner now. It'd be a good game. 2-0. Would you give Spurs a goal? No, I'm not giving Spurs anything. 2-0, Arsenal. You have to give him one thing. 2-0 if they can't score from a corner. We know Gabriel. No, we won't need the set-piece this week. We'll save it for next week or something.

1:05:01So you think Arsenal win 2-0? I'm going 2-0. I don't think they'll win 2-0. I think it'll be a bit more of a sort of... A bit more scruffy than that. I think it'll be goals. 3-2-1. Yeah, I think it'll be a bit messy. A bit Lionel? Yeah. What are you going to do then? Jesus Christ. I think 2-1 Arsenal or 3-2. I can't see Spurs scoring two. No, I think they could. It's that type of game. Arsenal's too strong. Spades don't look like scoring at all. You see, I didn't see us conceding two against Sunderland. That's away from home, though. You've got 2-1 then. 2-1 Arsenal. Right. Can't believe you're getting it.

1:05:39Have you slagged our score off? Going, oh, no, I've been messy. 2-1. One extra goal, do you know what I mean? Yeah, excellent 2-1. I think Tottenham will score. What is it? 2-1 Arsenal. 2-2-2-2-1. The most popular score in football. Thank you very much. Thank you.

1:06:05Right, so I was at my mum's a couple of weeks ago. Oh, you got your contract. I told you this, I was bringing my contracts in. This is like a sort of, think of it as like a raffle. I'm going to study your contract like you studied mine. Is this your boot contract and everything? These are just contracts. Oh, Adidas contracts. Adidas. Adidas. Yeah, we've had to ask for a period. There's another football contract. That one is 2001, David Gill. Oh, your mate looked after you, but yeah.

1:06:34Deodora, Deodora contract, right? So you don't want to, in case you'll get more than me. Look at that one. And that one's... What'd you say? That was another Adidas contract. That's horrible. He said, Dad, you signed your new deal? Yeah. What'd you get? Yeah, so they'll bring him in. Let me go to the money bit. Yeah. It's at the back of it. Oh, so... It's at the back of it. You don't want to ask you to sign it. So, beast, beast. You need to pull the papers out. Scary manifold. Just a little thing. Someone asked me, what's the ring of mine? Why do you keep these or what is it? My mum and dad kept them in the box in the house.

1:07:06And I went the other week and she was clearing them up. How much did they get paid off the Adora, was there? I couldn't see me. What's this one? Euro. To figure out. I thought you were going to be a lawyer. Last time you came in, you said you were going to be a lawyer. So, Neville, you're on 1.75. Am I reading that right? What year was that, Roy?

1:07:26So that, when is that? So that's, that was 2009. That's my last contract at the club, but I wasn't. That was on, I think the sign-on fees are different. It was 1.75 basic. In 2009? Yeah. You happy with that, Joe? No. You think that's underpaid him? Overpaid. Under. Massively underpaid. Oh, yeah, 100%. I always was. Why? No, but he's saying it on for you. Everybody's saying it on for you. Jamie's saying it because he knows he was on double down, triple down. He'd walk into his office, wouldn't he? Just tell him. No, no. I used to say, that's fine, no problem. Get on with it. I'm happy. Yeah, but you can do that now.

1:08:06Tiger Sports Management. No, but to be fair, you improve a little bit. Let me just have a look at that. Let's have a look. So it's one point. It was one point. He's bullied you for 20 years. You should not be on that. Do you know, Jim? Cara. He got looked after the last few years. Oh, did he? That was 2009. It was last year, didn't he? Cara, can I just make the point, by the way? Yeah, when he wasn't playing. The boss never did my contract with me at any time during my career. Never once. He had some say on it, Cara. He never once offered me a contract. It was always done via... So are you saying he doesn't know how much you're going to get?

1:08:33Jamie, he didn't kick a ball for the last two or three years. He was on that... I mean, if you're not kicking a ball... He should have got a lot more. He was officially retired in his last season. Cara, I was on... Staying around the club for six months, getting paid. Cara, I was on 2.25 because I got half a million, but I can't find it in this contract. Oh, yeah, offshore. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Offshore. Yeah, it says here, right, in 2001. Let's say, I'm trying to picture your creation. 2001, so I'm 26, 25, 26. Prime. Just won the treble, prime. Prime, right? You're on 1.5 million. Listen, I know it's a lot of money.

1:09:10A week. So that's, what's that, 30 grand a week? Yeah. So in your prime, in 2001, you're on 30 grand a week. I suppose what were players earning then? Would that be good wages then? He'll tell you, you're on four, won't you? I wanted to tell you. What? You're on four? Yeah, but I was a much better player, obviously. I'm not debating that. I'm not debating that. I'm a contract right now, but we keep saying, but you kept saying, long-term contracts, so you've never had a good bargaining position. I remember. met, did you sign a seven-year contract? Yeah, six years, seven years, yeah. Why? Because he loves Man United.

1:09:45Do you know something, Cara? It was never a focus for me. He does. Do you know something? I never, ever once worried about the much side of it. That's a good way to be. Do you know something? I thought, do you know something? If I can get to the end of my career at 35, 36 at Manchester United, I know I'll be all right. I know I'll be all right. Now, I won't earn as much money by signing his long-term contract, but I thought, do you know something? That worked for you, Gary? My Paul's football career, I thought, you know, being a one-club man, being at United was the right thing to do. Get into that place.

1:10:11When they offered me a seven-year contract at lower money, it was better for me than going for four years or three years at higher money and thinking my contract's going to run out. Like yourself as a player? You get injured. I always thought in a more cautious way that if I got injured or if I got sort of... So this contract... There's nothing wrong with that, gal. Look at you now. Look at us. All this because of you, gal. Just quickly, right? This contract here, right? So this contract, imagine this contract, right? I've signed for 1.75 million. That's basic though, Gary, isn't it? Is that including your sign-on fee?

1:10:43No, sign-on fee. I don't know where it is in there, though. There is a sign-on fee on top of that. Yeah, exactly, Gary. That's your basic. Just quickly, I then got injured in 2008, as you'll remember, was out for a year. And my contract ran for another four years, right? I'm still at Manchester United at the age of 34 because I signed that long-term contract, because I was out of contract base, because I was injured for like a... So your safety net was perfect. You was right. Your tactics walk you. I had to get to the end of my career at United. I couldn't bear the thought, and it's not disrespectful to any other club because it's an amazing club.

1:11:13I couldn't see myself in another shirt. I just thought it would have made me so unhappy. I just thought I had to get to the end of my career at United. Jamie, you the same? What did you earn at the end of your career, though? Double that? Treble that? No. I'm thinking you was my man United. You were England right back. Was you double that? No, the most I ever earned, when you talk about your basic salary, I'm just trying to think now. So when we won the Champions League in 2005, it was just that time when I was due for a contract, so I went to about£40 ,000 a week, whatever that was, a year, but it was about£40 ,000 a week.

1:11:53I'd have a signing on fee for about£250 ,000. I had almost four£250 ,000 things. So it was like a signing on fee was one. Another one was if we qualified for the Champions League. So you were about£3 million a year. Another£250 was for playing 25 games in a season, which I always did. I always played like 50 games a season. And the other one was if I played 20 league games. Do you understand what I mean? So you got£3 million, basically. Is that what that works out? Yeah. So you're a double what I was on. And at Liverpool, that would have been cash, obviously, wouldn't it? Of course.

1:12:29And no cash. I've still got it!

1:12:34LAUGHTER I've never seen a man carry as much cash as in him. Why have you had so much cash? Showing people your cash. He's a dead boy, isn't he? We've got so much cash. God, I don't like it. I've got a gig for you, mate. I've got a gig. LAUGHTER But you never got paid as much, did you, if you stayed at the... If you come through the academy at the club, you never got paid as much as players come in. Wayne's been quite about contracts. Yeah, yeah, we get yours under table. he's laughing at you you might not want to answer this but you also might want to take it out even if you do answer it what would your biggest contract have been at United biggest because I'm your teammate based in 2010-11 I'm on 1.75 I'm captain yeah 17 million at United I think I actually got paid a little bit more you say 1.7 or 7 yeah 1.7 that's amazing well done congratulations yeah Yeah, different time, wasn't it?

1:13:31Poor than Paul. Paul's still with him as well. Let's have a chat after, I think I need an agent.

1:13:38Paul's up there looking cool. All that stuff I said over the years about not needing an agent, you need a fucking agent.

1:13:4817 million, yeah. That's unbelievable, was that? Wow. It was changing then, weren't it? Absolutely, yeah. I think so, yeah. I feel underpaid now. Roy, what was your biggest one then that you ever had at the end? Did you get up to five? Yeah, about five or five and a half maybe, yeah. And that was big. I mean, that was huge back in 2003, four, five. Yeah, but I got better now. I keep saying, but my contract was running out a couple of times, so I was in a good bargaining position, whatever. I could have left a couple of times on a three. No, the sound was working. He did say 17 million. I did say 17 million, yeah.

1:14:24I'm just checking if everybody's heard it right. Wow. Let's get to my Deodora contract. Is this one here? This is Tiger Sports. This is Tiger Sports. Yeah, it's my company. Let's see if you earn more than Roy in Deodora. Roy, what were you on with Deodora? Oh, God, no. No, I wouldn't know. Seriously? I wouldn't have a clue, honestly. Seriously? With a Nike card all the way through. I don't even know what I was... The boot contracts were just a bit of a bonus. Yeah. You know what I mean? But you would have got big money for wearing them in the Champions League finals and stuff 2002 you know the only thing I'd say about that the only thing I'd say about that do you not feel a little bit like listen when you go in with a contest it was a bit of a game you're trying to get more for the club you're trying to get a bit cheaper I get that but when you think what you did for the club I'm being serious every week do you not feel like they've almost let you down a little bit I'm not saying you should be on what I'm saying you should have been on more they've took the piss a little bit but do you know something it sounds crazy now but even with like you know I earn good money now but if someone offers me a contract I can't be look if I'm happy if I'm really happy somewhere and I just I tend to just think honestly it's easier to do that girl I'm exactly the same especially especially in what we do now if you're on good TV shows and they go you don't want to ruin that I totally get what you're saying I get it but I feel like that's a little bit of a you know when you're defenders lads you know when you're doing contracts at your club have you a different mindset as defenders truthfully would you not be thinking like obviously the attackers and midfielders I know it's wrong but with the Fendersfield they deserve more money would you have that in your mindset at all I don't mean Gerrard because Gerrard is a brilliant player but other players at Liverpool who are attacking players going would you be thinking that at all in negotiations we're not going to get as much as them truthfully yeah I think that the attacking players are the best players aren't they I think so yeah but if you come through the ranks basically you've cost nothing to the club so you could try and make up for that a little bit by going well it was funny you know what I said before about the Champions League obviously good timing for me I've won the Champions League two years to go they come to you and I'd gone into the training ground you know in the summer I'd like to see the doctor the manager was there and so I thought everyone's in a good mood on the Champions League goes to see the manager Benitez and he goes oh we need to speak to you about your contract so at that time I was on about 30 grand a week or something like that and just won the Champions League so he said I don't want to be able to give you any more money and I thought if he was one of the champions they'd want to sign that when I actually signed that contract it broke my leg it broke my leg at Blackburn when I'd signed that one he said because he said we've got Zenden coming in on a free he said we've got to give someone a free I went I'm a fucking free every time I sign I'm a free but that's what I mean it does get forgetting but when someone comes on a Bosman it's always a free sans fiend but the local I'd come and crew we don't cost anything they're trying to take advantage of that I'm guessing Jesus I'm just trying to imagine your mindset as a defender are going to negotiate in a deal.

1:17:28And if you've got two or three years left, it is hard to negotiate if the club's going. If you've got two or three years left. Roy, for me, I used to go in on my own, partly because I wanted to just basically do it myself. The idea of sort of... You can see that girl. It was important to me. It was important I went in on my own. Why? Do you know something, Waza? I've always negotiated my own stuff. And to be fair, I'm thinking now it probably stands me in good stead as I get older. And, you know, improving what I was doing outside my football. because I was starting businesses and stuff. And I used to think, Joe, something, the length of the contract was the most important thing.

1:18:02So they would never start off with a seven-year deal. I'd start off with a five-year deal. They'd start off with a four-year deal, five-year deal, normal length. I'd go, no, I'll sign it if you give me a seven-year deal at that. But there's a renegotiation clause in after three or four. So I would always say length of contract was meeting security. So I knew that when I was 24 and signed that seven-year deal, they can't kick me out of this because I'm 31 and ain't leaving. in. So I was locked in and I had security. And then at 27, 28, I'd obviously go in again and do it till I was 34. And it was always for me the most important thing, to stay stable.

1:18:36That worked for you, Dan. You also won't give an agent percentages. I admire Roy at the time, which was quite, to be fair, new at the time, the Bosman rule. I admired Roy at the time and thinking, you know, no one ever thought in the dressing room, oh, Roy is out of order for going to negotiate his own contract. Even for you, when I look back now, I mean, maybe the statement that you made I don't think was particularly great but I think you're right to push the club and get you the best contract you're the best player in the world you know you were absolutely here so you should actually have been paid the best money in the world I actually completely agree with that and I used to think also as a defender the lads up front lads in midfield they were winning us the games every week they should be on a lot more than I'm on you know what I mean I was like grateful that they were like doing what they were doing I used to feel like that so when they scored a goal I'd like be oh my God what have they just done you know what I mean I used to think that way I might as well I should have just I might as well have gone in on my own the agent side right what was your best deal just because you know what you're a bit before this yeah but the thing is I think when I left to go to to West Ham I think I I ended up it was about 1.25 million that was your highest contract yeah yeah because at Arsenal all the time because it's when Wenger did you ever run more than that at Arsenal no remember I told you when we got to Arsenal you know what I mean I know I thought but when you were there I'm not about when you were there for a few years and you were like doing the business even when I was flying because you were there with Bird Camp all through there and all the time this is what I'm saying with the agent I had totally undersold me there with what I could do and I believe I could have like especially when I was I got to Arsenal at 28 after that I started to get some interest there was some interest from it was a Palmer I think it was Sampdoria stuff like that and you start to think about it because I'm thinking I'm not earning nowhere near what I should be earning at Arsenal.

1:20:24And even when I went to Arsenal, it was like, it worked out to about three, four hundred pounds more a week than I was at fucking Palace. And like Palace offered me three times what Arsenal would have offered me to stay. And I said, no, I'll go. Because like you, Gar, I just wanted to go and be there. I wanted to be there and thought, well, it's going to change. Didn't change. Yeah, don't, yeah. Didn't change. I wish I went in with a... He regrets not having an agent sometimes, but you have to have the right agent as well. That's the thing. You just want people to fight for you. I wouldn't be able to go in like Gary.

1:20:55I'd probably be going in like you with an accountant who knows what's going on. But I don't think I'd have been able to go in there and fight for myself like that. I didn't have that kind of mouse. Some people are good negotiators. My solicitor, Michael, he was really, really good. Don't get me wrong. But you have to give them something to fight with. And that's playing well. You know, it made me feel, in the end. It didn't make me feel like I was at the time when I was a striker at the time, being at that level with. I know what the other strikers would have been on. and I didn't feel... Why?

1:21:22Because I didn't feel I earned the money. I didn't earn the money to be up in there. I should have been earning the same monies as in and around. I know what Shira was doing, but I was there. I was up there in all those lists, those goal-scoring lists. You know, before you... You know, you're talking about... It takes me back. I keep going back to 2005 and you're talking about the agent, but I said, obviously, the Benitez thing brought me into the office and what you said about Ferguson there. I asked... I said to Benitez, I remember he said to me, we can't up your money type of thing I said I'm not signing to Benitez and he come out to me sort of a couple of hours later on the training pitch so I said before training so that was in the sort of summer I'd been to see the doctor when I come back for pre-season he sort of pulled me in and went like you know that's what we I said no no I won't be signing and then went out to the training pitch and then two hours later he went yeah it's fine now I remember when I'm because maybe he admired you as well I think you have to fight your corner I obviously always like it's not being greedy it's called self-worth what you think it's worth and I think managers I remember trying to sign players when I was a manager and I'm hearing what they're asking for and deep down the guys used to fight their corner and ask for deep down I admire these lads I tell you they'll pay you as less as they can won't they yeah so unless you actually stand up and say right well this is what I'm worth actually this is what other players who at your level are getting paid around around the world and it tended to be outside of England where they would pay more you know what when I had that problem with Bruce Riach.

1:22:50When I had that problem, I was like, Glen Odell was at Chelsea at the time and Chelsea offered me double and more what I was on at Arsenal. But it wasn't in your soul. That's the thing, so I'm thinking to myself, you know, I said, Can't move for money. I know, I know. Move for money, you're dead. I know. You're dead. And in the end, you know, can you imagine if I did, it would have been a nightmare. It would have been a nightmare. It would have been the biggest regret of my life. Right, you wouldn't be here now. Yeah, probably not. Honestly, part of your soul died. No, I'm serious. If you'd have played for Chelsea, you would be sitting there now.

1:23:23He wouldn't have picked you up. Look, to be fair, Jordan's a good example. Jordan, to be fair, obviously went to Saudi. But he will feel, because he's a good guy and he's a good man, he'll have thought... And he won't have enjoyed it. I think when you want that sort of post-football career and you want to make sure... Of course, lads who were at clubs should go and negotiate the best contracts and go and get the most money out of them. And to be fair, lads around this table have obviously done that. Maybe right, you didn't, maybe I didn't. but you couldn't leave the club for more money you don't do that that's ridiculous I mean unless you think it's an equal club whereby you couldn't have gone to Chelsea with your love for Arsenal and then you lose that thing what you're talking about I always look at Jordan and I spoke to Jordan at the time I don't know if you he's a great lad isn't he and he was talking about he wasn't going to be in the team Klopp was bringing new midfielders in Jordan Henderson would still be doing what Endo was doing for Liverpool and he would have got the big send off and I always think of Jordan I was like, oh, he missed something at the end of it.

1:24:20He still thought of as a brilliant Liverpool captain. I was okay with Jordan going, Cara. I was okay with Jordan going. I was more, he missed that. He was Liverpool captain in the club who lifted every trophy. He missed that thing at the end of the season, you know, getting a really big sort of... But Cara, I was okay with Jordan going, but obviously as he gets over there, he's not felt it himself, has he? That's the thing. I was okay with him going. If you can get a life-changing amount of money, and I think he would have done some good with that money, I think he would have come back and invested in his life.

1:24:43Yeah, but then when you're over there, and your heart's not in it, and your soul's gone you think you're on about signing for clubs and contracts and I know this player I won't mention his name he told me he went to United years ago back in the day and he was doing negotiating with Martin Edwards I think in Ferguson and he says I want what Brian Robson's on they were like oh no and they went no I want and they went alright you can have what Robbo's getting so he signed a deal so he's at United a few months and he's sitting down with Robbo going yeah I got what you got that's what I negotiated and they went what did I give you and he went I gave you that they gave him and he went I'm on a way more than that He just believed what they said to him.

1:25:19Give him a Brian Robertson. Because it was the number he was happy with. Yeah, he was happy with it. Yeah, is that what Rob was getting? Well, that's what I guess I want what Roy Keane's other than they say to me. This episode of Stick to Football is brought to you by Arm Clothing. We'll finish with... There's some boxing fans around the table and Jake Paul versus Anthony Joshua. What do we think of that? You know something. Are we getting into the point of ridiculousness or...? Dave. Why, it's coming off in a Tyson fight because we don't know what happened. It felt fixed because Tyson... If it's not fixed...

1:25:51Yeah, if it's not fixed then it's ridiculous. I don't know how it's being passed. It shouldn't be in there with him. It's crazy. If Joshua goes for him... Did you see what he's done to Ngannou? Did you see what he's done to Ngannou? I don't know how on earth it's being passed to fight. Is that a bit like what we were talking about before about going to... Is that almost like a... Are we saying now Joshua was like... Is that almost like him going to Saudi as a footballer? Do you know what I mean? So, I can't take Ante Joshua serious that I was like a world title sort of it's almost like if he's coming to the end of his career, fine he's going to get 70 million, whatever but to then do that and then go and fight for the world title it just doesn't feel right We've got to get him on, Gal We've got to get him on Make a call When he fought Nganou It's the same thing, obviously Yeah, loads of money Jake Paul's a better boxer probably than Nganou is but he's just not It's a size difference everything about the fight is just wrong Listen, if I don't blame Antti Joshua.

1:26:47I think, go and get your money. I have huge respect for boxers, but all that stuff, that carry on is ridiculous. He must fancy himself, Jake Paul. He must feel he's got a boxers, like a puncher's chart if he's got that because we've seen with Antti Joshua, if you catch him, he's gone. But at the same time, if Antti Joshua puts a couple of combinations on him, catches him in it, it could be dangerous for him. There's different levels. There's different levels to boxing. It's alright to fight Tommy Fury and whatever, but it's just similar size. But to go and fight It's anti-Joshua. It's dangerous.

1:27:17Yeah, I felt a little... If something seriously happens to Jake Paul, there's going to be serious questions. Boxing would be in a bad place. Yeah, it's going to be in a bad place. I watched a Ben Eubank fight on Saturday night. There was something I felt uncomfortable in that fight about the rehydration stuff that Eubank's doing and how gaunt he looked. He did look gaunt, yeah. I just thought... Really skinny. And how the fight played out, you think, it's not right, that, is it? It just didn't feel... There's something just a bit like... But it's just, again, about money for somebody's fighters.

1:27:42I have a huge respect for boxers. we go back back in the 80s when the great boxers were fighting the other great boxers that's where your legacy is built but these lads now fighting these fights when it's just about money that can't be right either it's a problem about football if you're moving just for money it can't be right the reason that you're talking about that it feels like when you go back to boxing we all go back to most of us are old enough to go back to the 80s and Hagler and Haynes they've got that legacy because them great fighters were actually fighting each other and sometimes it's not about You figure who won.

1:28:14It was just like, it was an unbelievable boxing match. But when you see this, what it is now, a little bit, it is, and listen, I go into the Rotunda I train and you see the boxers and some of them, most of them don't earn good money. They're fighting, trying to get to the top. Yeah, it's not easy. It's tough. They have to take it. It does feel like it's lost something. How can we be in a situation where Anthony Joshua is fighting a YouTuber but he's never fought Tyson Fury? Yeah. How can that happen? How is that allowed to happen in boxing? of these two sort of big fights have never fought. It pisses me off a little bit, to be honest.

1:28:48That should be the fight, shouldn't it? It's like you, man. I actually don't even want to see that fight no more. Which one? It shouldn't have happened years ago. It shouldn't be allowed not to happen. There's too many belts as well. Yeah. Yeah, 100%. There's too many belts. Right, that's it. End of the episode. Well done, everyone. Well done. Good stuff, girl. Well done. Nice, Bob.

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