Brandi Carlile

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2:17Hello and welcome to Table Manners. I'm Jessie Ware and mum is giving me daggers. You look very glamorous, mum. Do I look glamorous? You do. Your hair looks good. is it? Yeah. I don't know why I've just been in the wind and the rain. Windswept. We're at my house tonight. I've cooked. Thank you. No problem. We have the phenomenal Brandy Carlisle coming on and apparently she's only five minutes late because she's stuck in traffic because she has come from Sir Elton John's house in Windsor. So we'll have to ask her whether he gave her a packed lunch to see her on her way. Yeah. And apparently she's been staying there all week.

2:54And we're talking to her because she has a new album out on the 4th of April with Elton. Well, it's a fabulous album. I listened to it yesterday. Their voices meld together. Ugh. Euphoric. It's so exciting. The production is so brilliant. The singing, the songwriting, all of it is so beautiful. Also, they're honouring lots of queer musicians, Little Richard, Laura Niro, so it's kind of honouring them as well. The album's called Who Believes in Angels and they're just, it's absolutely gorgeous. And I'm sure Brandy's going to tell us, but she's been the biggest fan of Elton John since she was 12 and discovered him and sung Honky Cat at the talent show in a white suit.

3:42Anyway, it's amazing, but I'm very interested in Brandy's upbringing. She moved a lot when she was a child. and we're going to be talking to her all about this album, all about her life and how she's finding England because she got married here. She must love it here. Well, do you want to know what I've made? She's not fussy, is she? No. She didn't get any dietary requirements, thank God. Yeah. I've done a new recipe by Sophie Wybird. It's in her book, Tucking In. It's spiced meatballs with dates and chickpeas. Delicious. However, I didn't read that it was beef mince and I did lamb. That lends itself better.

4:23Well, I think that's okay, but still, I wonder. Beef can be a bit hard when they're cooked. Do you think they're going to get hard now? No. You're just saying that to me, aren't you? No, just turn it... Have you turned it off? I've turned it off. It's fine. Anyway, I've done it with couscous, some toasted flakes almonds. I'm going to put some parsley and coriander on the top and some cavallonero. and then I've done, because I thought Brandy's probably had a crumble in her time here. I did a... Do you think Elton tucks into a crumble? Well, we'll find out in a minute. Brandy Carlisle on table.

5:07Cheers. Cheers, ladies. It's a joy to be here with you. Thank you. It's such a pleasure. We're so honoured. That you decided to not stay in with Elton tonight and have a takeaway and you've come all the way to South East London. No drinks at Elton's. Oh thank God, we'll give you a straw on the day at home. How have you managed to weep and no drink? Oh mum, stop! Well I had one last night because I went out for dinner, you know, with Kat's mum. And Kat's mum will get you wasted, so. Well let's talk about your wife. Yeah. A Brit, a fellow Brit. Yeah. And she's here. You got married in the UK. Yeah.

5:44Was it Chelsea Town Hall? Chelsea Town Hall, yeah. That's like best. Well done. Well researched. Best one to get married in. Yeah. And then we kind of walked down the steps and we got in a vintage double-decker bus and we drank loads of champagne and like drove around the city. And then we wound up in like a crypt. Oh. In Bleeding Heart Square. Oh, yeah. I've been there. Where is it? There's a pub and a restaurant. Yeah. And you walk down an alley. What area? It's in the city near Hatton Garden. Yeah, we had a little dance party. And it's called Bleeding Heart Square. Yeah, it's cool. What was your first dance?

6:16Are we on tonight? I think we were kind of dancing more to things like Like a Prayer. And we were dancing to a lot of Whitney Houston and 80s music and just holes in the socks, blisters on our feet, walking home without our shoes. But it's a good restaurant there, isn't it? Yeah, it was amazing. Did they do the catering? They did, yeah. And what did you have? Can you remember? Yeah, I can remember. we had some steaks and like roasted carrots and like a salad with pomegranates and my favorite thing about it was our wedding cake was made of cheese instead of cake like literally like yeah it was awesome do you like british cheese i love it yeah what's your favorite british cheese i mean you're gonna embarrass me with the name give me some cheddar okay do you like your cheddar yeah but i feel like that's an american thing vermont no no no it's pretty We have a place called Cheddar Gorge, which is where it comes from.

7:08Okay, you own it. Good point. Ding, ding, ding. So you have just been in the car for a long time because you've been in Windsor. Yeah. Staying with Sir Elton. Yeah. Your beloved friend. Yeah. Does he have a full fridge? Yeah, and you can get in it and you walk in it. It's like a room. Shut up. Oh my God. Yeah, and it's got all the good things in there, all the things he can't eat, but that we can eat. And it's just delicious. And he's got a full pantry with like loads of chocolate and you can, it's kind of heaven actually. It's like Willy Wonka and then chocolate factory. Does Elton cook?

7:42No, no, he doesn't. Has he got a good cook? Yeah, he does. This lovely guy called Mark. In fact, yesterday morning I was nervous for the Graham Norton show. Were you? Yeah, I woke up and I was too nervous to eat and Elton's like staff, they just sat me down. They're like, right, you're eating a toasted croissant with ham. you're gonna have a banana you're gonna have a glass of water like they were just it's they're the sweetest people do you get quite nervous yeah i get nervous yeah i find that's i mean your voice is heavenly it's transcendental and also well your lyric all of it is just so for me i kind of think as a singer who does get nervous and can't always control what comes out of my mouth when i'm singing you know your voice is incredibly strong i listen today well thank you but i just um you're so accomplished and brilliant and it's um interesting to hear that you still get nervous for like a tv show that yeah i think you have to yeah it's especially to sing you know um because you can't convince people of your humanity if you're not right on the edge if you don't understand what the psychosympathetic nervous system is going through when you open your mouth to sing in front of people it's like you could maybe we could potentially lose that um that feeling of of uh other worldliness that you feel when you do something so risky and I don't ever want to lose that I love the way that feels how do you feel when you finish a tour though are you absolutely shattered oh grumpy and tired and and then the very last day I get this kind of like second wind maybe the last couple of shows where I wanted to keep going and I get sad and you do you have the The blues.

9:20Yeah, you get tour blues. Yeah. Of course. We might all be the same. Are you touring this year with this new... Yeah, Royal Albert Hall, mum. Oh, my God. I just got word that my whole tour sold out today. Muscle tour! Yeah. On the way here, they told me in the car. That's amazing. I was so excited. I didn't know what happened. Are you touring in Britain, all of Britain, all Europe, Britain, and the States? Not the States, actually. I'm just coming over here to you guys. Yeah, I'm doing Royal Upper Hall and a bunch of Manchester and Birmingham and Dublin, Glasgow. And then I'm going to go over to Europe and I'm going to do some cities over there.

9:56Amsterdam, Copenhagen for the first time, which will be really cool. I think you're playing Vega in Copenhagen. Yeah, yeah. Babe, when I tell you, the greatest backstage catering I've ever had. Oh, I live for that. They have. You feel like you're in no... They've got like flaming juniper berry bushes. What? And venison on. it's banging you're going to love it don't be nervous that day okay well are you a big foodie i am i love my food what's your favorite sort of food my favorite sort of food oh i'm very kind of day and date like it really it kind of depends on what's going on but i think that there are some basics i love some basic simple foods like i love oysters in any preparation oysters and champagne and just like beautiful.

10:42I love anything with tomatoes, big into seafood and shellfish, but my favorite thing to cook is a steak. Like I can make a mean steak. Which cut of steak do you have? I prefer ribeye to eat. Yeah, me too. Yeah, right? To a filet. Yeah. Because that fat emulsifies it. The fat makes it tender as well, I think. But have you got... It's more tasty, I think, than filet. I do, too. And the texture, I like a lot better too. And I don't mind eating fat. I actually like it. But do you find that, have you gone off rare and medium rare steak? I have recently. No. So what are you going into your well done era?

11:21I like rare steak. I think I'm in my medium era. As I've gotten older, I've, okay, actually I went to this amazing steakhouse in LA called, what are they called? Boa. And they have like a steak simone that will come to your table and talk you out of ordering rare or medium rare cuts if you get really high quality beef. because they want that fat to kind of permeate the meat. They want that to be seasoned internally with that fat. And when you get a medium rare or rare steak, you're just kind of eating congealed fat. You don't get the flavor. I'm just going to like that. Go to Argentina. Yeah, okay.

11:57They always overcook it. They overcook it completely. If you said rare, they actually would not understand what you're talking about. You're disrespecting a whole load of people, mum. When I went to restaurants, I said rare. I think they understand. And they just do it differently. They didn't want to do it. They kind of... No, if you're ordering medium, it's going to be a well done there. It's like you go on. So I would go medium rare. It's like you got the size. Yeah. Yeah. I've taken to do that. I'm all about the medium now. How often do you eat red meat, though? Kind of a lot. Do you? Yeah, a few times a week.

12:27I have like really low iron. I have just always had. My mom and sister do too. So I love red meat. Yeah. Let's talk about your family growing up, traveling. Yeah. a lot of different places what was it 14 homes in 14 years yeah like yeah we moved 14 times from the time I was born to when I moved out of my parents house at 17 and real why why did you move so much well there were always different reasons you know my parents the um they're amazing people they're fun they're with us still they're together and they're unpredictable they're like um eternal teenagers. They were really young when they had us kids and I'm the oldest of three kids.

13:09And it just kind of felt like growing up with complicated, charismatic teenagers. They were always changing their mind and in jobs and life and kind of hitting the skids. And we were either getting evicted or moving or there was a controversy. There was always something kind of chaotic and intense happening. So we would just kind of take flight, you know. What was your dad trained to do? My dad, when I was born, he was a Boeing machinist. He worked on airplanes. Oh, wow. And somewhere around, maybe around 11 or 12, we moved out to the, like, deep into the country, like into the woods. And he took up construction.

13:51So I had a construction dad. And my mom was a stay-at-home mom. Was this all around Seattle? Ish. you know like we say Seattle but really I live in like a really rural part of Washington state it's so beautiful it is beautiful oh my gosh when I've been on a tour bus you go through all those trees when you're kind of coming through from where's the spot where would I be driving from if I'm on a splitter bus so if you come from east you're going to go over Snoqualmie Pass you're going to see the Cascade Mountain Range and um that's definitely where you ended up through going through North Bend and that's where I live is right in that area at the foothills of the Cascade Mountain Range.

14:27Wow. Yeah, so you're talking about what my place looks like. And that was incredibly inspiring to you. It was incredibly inspiring to me, and I've always lived there, and I probably always will. I've lived in the same log cabin for 22 years because, of course, I moved so much as a kid that I'm like, right, I'm an adult, no one's making me move. And my mom and dad, they love my house, and so everybody kind of gathers at my place for holidays, and we host and everything. But everybody all around you gathers in the same place. You're in this compound. Yeah, yeah. So who lives in the compound? I'm very culty.

15:00Culty. No, Alanis Morissette lives in a very similar setup. Oh, is that right? Where she's got lots of people living around. Yeah. So how many people are living there? You've got your log cabin. Yeah, so I've got my log cabin that I live in with my wife and two girls. and then on this like say it's like 100 acres I don't know how you know acres yeah yeah yeah so like 100 acres that's a lot of acres that is a lot of acres yeah and my band the twin brothers they live there who are kind of part that you've talked about them being yeah one's married to my sister and then also in my band I have a so one my basically my two band members the twins one is married to my little sister and the other one is married to a woman called Hannah who's just kind of like our sister through marriage and then this is going to get really strange.

15:55I'm into it. And then my cellist is married to Catherine's sister, my wife's sister. Oh my gosh. Wow. And then my engineer is married to Catherine's other sister and they all live there. Wow. Wow. So we're all married to each other and working together. I hope you don't fall out. Well, and it happens. It does. It does happen. Look at the end of it. That is weird when that happens. What do you do? You just go to a different acre? Well, we all have the same therapist. Oh, stop! Stop! She's called Pam. Does she live on the compound? She doesn't? No. She lives on one of the San Juan Islands and every time the shit hits the fan, it's like, well, we better call Pam.

16:34That's amazing. Yeah, it's dark. I was listening to Ariana Grande today when she got nominated for her Oscar. Oh, yeah. They said, you must have had loads of texts. I said, oh yeah, from everyone, even my gynecologist. So when you got nominated for your Oscar, who was texting you? Oh my God. Who did you ring first? I'll tell you what, they come out of the woodwork when you get an Oscar nomination. Yeah, and I have given my number to everyone I've ever met since I was 19 years old. Right. So I had maybe a thousand texts. Wow. Just from school friends and doctors and distant cousins and just everyone I've ever met.

17:11Old radio DJs that are like retired for 20 years. yeah I don't even know who came first who was the one that you rang first? Elton yeah he's my best friend we call each other every day I mean let's talk about Elton and this trailer that came out today yeah I mean for people that haven't seen it and I know this is going to be coming out of it later but like it's a trailer of the making of your record together and it's the first time Elton has allowed cameras i presume maybe is it the first time you've allowed cameras in there or not the thing people don't know about the cameras yet it's really a kind of a missing point here is that we didn't know where they were they were fixed cameras there were no cameramen right yeah and we for utterly forgot about them within six hours of the first day and then never thought about them again until we were watching these trailers because i've always wondered because everyone wants everybody to have content now yeah yeah and everyone said to me you should just put a gopro in the corner and I'm like I wonder whether it would make me feel inhibited I forgot really I never actually saw Elton was throwing shit at you so yeah and I mean I don't think he would have cared even if there were like people standing there with a camera but the way that you behave when when you don't know there are cameras around is like really interesting I don't want to say I didn't know I did know but I really forgot but this trailer shows tensions yeah initially and how you made this record in 20 days and you know this you being with your icon your idol oh yeah and and you then having to be i don't know i guess you're kind of being pam sometimes therapist pam a bit pammish a bit pammish also maybe mediated between andrew what the producer and elton because they're both slightly more fiery than you potentially yeah and there you go everyone's passionate she's witchy and psychic no i've actually met andrew what years ago okay And he rocked up at my mate's house and he had like a Mustang.

19:08It was like some sexy car. Does he still like sexy cars? This is making sense. He likes sexy everything. He wears like no shirt under his suit jacket, guy. Lots of necklaces. Is he married? No, he's got an amazing long-term girlfriend called Charlotte who's just like heaven. Great. But so you were making this record and the trailer's come out and it's warts and all. Yeah. And it's very exciting. Crap. And also, by the way, the record is stunning. Divine. It's that opening track. I know. This is what I wanted to ask you because it felt, you know, it has this big crescendo in it. It's got this big overture at the beginning.

19:51But, like, you know, it gets so exciting. You feel like you're at a gig. And it's so nice. Yeah, that's what I wanted. I mean, it wasn't my idea. but when I first heard that I'm like oh imagine opening a gig with that. That's exactly it was a perfect opener to an album but then I was like that I had goosebumps I was imagining Elton back at Glastonbury and you there and now he's retired so what's going on? Please say you're going to play this album because it's so perfect. I mean we are right now just leaving it up to the great mystery of his healing and whatever happens or doesn't happen with his sight but I will say that we don't talk about this because I don't want him to feel pressure or nerves or to feel like he's letting anybody down because of his vision um but I have hope that something will happen because we did that performance yesterday and he sat down at the piano and it was the first time we've and it when I tell you it came out of him like a thunderstorm it was incredible what he was doing on the piano didn't miss a note harmonies went straight to the right harmony I had to sing loud just to be at his level.

20:59I was like, God damn, you're 78 and just unbelievable. So I think it could happen, honestly. Who Believes in Angels is a really complicated song and he just had 10 minutes and he had it. I mean, also, you two sound so great together. Oh, thank you. Obviously, he was a fan of yours. You were a huge fan of him. That's what you always loved him from a small child. How did you first meet him? Well, so I guess I'll give you a background of my actual childhood. You know, I kind of talked to you about that I had a really strange and chaotic, but kind of wonderful childhood. Our family was really entrenched in country music, and country music in the States in the late 80s and early 90s was not just a genre of music.

21:46It was like a cultural movement. It was like a lifestyle during that time. Is it not like that anymore? Is it different? It is, but it's a little more pedestrian than it was when I was young. It was really something you were proud of. And it was aligned, I think, with us sort of religiously and politically at that time. Again, a different era. And I was allowed to do a book report. Do you guys have book reports in the schools over here? I don't know. Explain what your book report is. You choose a book, and then you study this book. Like a review? Yeah, you do a project based on this book or a project presentation.

22:21and I got to go choose a book and I chose a book on a boy called Ryan White because I thought the boy on the cover was cute on the book and he had died of AIDS in the early 90s and in this book I'm reading about a worldview that I have never been exposed to before thinking of HIV and AIDS like really differently because what happened was the evangelical right tried to sort of like weaponize this boy against the gay community by saying that you know AIDS is caused by the gay community and this boy was not having it he was really brave even as like a young teenager and ostracized like in every way and then this gay british rock star comes into this boy's life and just changes his life like moves into his house starts taking calls for the mom steps in and starts helping with all of the media and the frenzy at the end of this boy's life and when he dies this rock star sings a song called skyline pigeon and at the funeral and i saw the lyrics to Skyline Pigeon and I was like right that that is going to be my job I'm going to write lyrics like that it's unbelievable turn me loose from your hands let me fly to distant lands over green fields trees and mountains and flowers and forest fountains and I was like I've never seen fucking anything like that in a country song and it took me to the library where I found two albums by Elton John and a book and was a different kid after that.

23:46I got a keyboard, I learned to write songs, and I learned about Queen and George Michael and U2 and the Beatles and Kate Bush and Snedo Connor and just my whole worldview expanded. So I carried that affection for this British rock star that I fell in love with as a person before I ever heard his music throughout my adolescence into my early 20s. and like as soon as I could get away with it I got a record deal I wrote him a letter and he immediately responded and said what do you want to do? He likes letters doesn't he? He was writing letters to announce this album Yeah So you still have this letter?

24:23I don't have it no and of course he doesn't have it it was just like a fan letter from Crazy Lesbian

24:33And then you didn't become pen pals but you we just stayed we stayed close I mean I I had picked like the most tumbleweed connection song I could think of and I was like will you come and play piano on my song and he's like well if you come to Vegas I will so I got invited to go to Vegas I'm like maybe 25 at this time and I go there with my files and we're gonna do this song and I'm like walking down this hallway and I can hear him talking in the control room and after seeing live at Melbourne and Tentrums and all of his interviews, you know, being this big fan as a teenager, I'm like, I'm going to turn the corner and I'm going to meet Elton fucking John.

25:15And I did, but it wasn't weird. We just like immediately were friends. And he sent me over a hundred albums and just started staying in touch and mentoring me. And it led to this, you know, however many years later, what is it? 18 years later how fabulous yeah and it's a crazy story as much more i love him more because of what i saw in the studio the absolute mayhem but he i mean he's so good at his art isn't he and it's so it's so wonderful to watch someone who's so accomplished and so good at what they do i mean look i the only chance i've been able to see him for format was at glastonbury headlining it and Or were you there?

26:04It was so beautiful. It was magical. And he had such a host of ages. And it was, you know, everyone knows some of his talent and the way he played and the soul and his life. It was just, it's remarkable. And he is so generous. I mean, his whole thing, uplifting other artists. He's so generous. I want to know, is it true that he has the best flowers in every house of his and he keeps them having flowers in every house, even if he's not there? He has the best flowers and he sends the best flowers. You don't need to look at the card to know they came from Elton John. That's if you can reach that high.

26:47That's a big bunch. Yeah. Are your children with you? They are, yeah. Have you been to Legoland yet? Yeah, we went to Legoland. Yeah, it's wonderful, isn't it? Every time they stay there, we go to Legoland. Yeah, my kids are back at home with Elton right now. Oh, gosh, he's babysitting. I mean, sure, we can call it that. Do they call him Uncle Elton? They call him Elton, and they call him Uncle Elton sometimes when they're with me, but he's the only man they've seen in his underwear.

27:20Have you just got sisters, or have you got a brother as well? I've got a brother and a sister, and we're really, really close. Yeah. Yeah, we're like a really close family. So who was cooking when you were growing up? My mum. My mum's a great cook. Is she? Yeah. What's her best dish that you would always want to cook? I loved when she would make Swiss steak, she called it. Swiss steak? Yeah, she just cut up a bunch of steak and put like mushroom cream sauce. And it was just like a big white trash meal that we would pour over mashed potatoes. And we loved it. So it's called Swiss steak? That's what she called it.

27:52And that was her best meal? I thought so. I thought everything she made was really good and nice and salty. And my mom doesn't under season. Oh, good. I don't either. And desserts? Are you big on desserts in your family? Yeah. I love to eat. Do you, on this big compound, do you have animals? Do you have, is it farming? Do you like to grow stuff? I've got chickens and a dog and some cats. I had, until a few years ago, a horse and some goats too. and we're preparing to get some more horses again. Yeah, because you had horses when you were younger, didn't you? Yeah, I love horses. Do you like, so do you ride most days?

28:31I'm not like an equestrian person. I'm not like a classy horseback rider or anything. But you like horse riding? I love horse riding, yeah. I just love horses. So who's doing the cooking at home? Well, me and Catherine, we trade off. We love to cook. We cook breakfast, lunch and dinner because we live so far out in the country. Yeah. And we trade off just depending on whose food we're craving on any given night. But I love cooking for Kath and she likes cooking for me too. So what do you like to cook? Steak. I like to grill things and to cook on cast iron on the grill. I like to do a lot of like crispy skin seafood and prawns.

29:07And like I said, I love to cook ribeye steaks and filet for Kath because she doesn't prefer ribeye. And I grill vegetables. Yeah, I do. I am a fisherman. So outside of music. You like fishing. Yeah. I liked fishing. do you my dad used to take me when I was little yeah and obviously you know we lived in Manchester so it wasn't great for its fishing but there's something very peaceful about going fishing and you're with your dad and you're sitting alongside for some reason it's not that boring fishing for a kid no you think it might be boring yeah because not a lot happens it's a bit like watching cricket but it isn't somehow you're just waiting for the moment aren't you yeah it's i just think it's one of the best things actually horses and fishing are like the two best things i think you can do for your soul member of the royal family really horseback riding and fishing my manners would be all wrong no no but they say what is it it's a perpetual act of optimism to try to connect to something you can't see yeah yeah and so what fish do you get in seattle all kinds so tell me what would you cook?

30:14Which fish? Well, everything. I love all the seasons. They open up and there are different seasons, you know, so I'm about to enter into my fishing season right now. I've got a new boat. And I'm a boat captain. So I'm going to go out for lean cod and rock cod in April. And then in May, the halibut opens up. My favourite fish. Why? That big? They're huge. They come up like the trunk of a Volkswagen and they fight the whole time. And then they're just snow white and beautiful meat that preserves like nothing else. So delicious. And when we process it all from the catch to the processing to the flash freeze to the cook, when it's all only ever touched your hands, it's such a nice feeling.

30:57So fabulous. So that's what I love to cook is fish that I catch. I love the skin on halibut. Oh, that is the best. Oh, you don't like it? Tell me, how have you had it? Because it's slightly, when you can make it crisp and it's slightly oily around the side, I think it's delicious. Wow. So I'm surprised if you like eating the fat on meat. Yeah. I love the fat on halibut. It's just so rubbery. No, not if it's crispy. Really, got a really crisp bit. No, I like it. Well, and the cast iron on the grill is so nice for doing that. I love doing salmon that way. But do you catch salmon? Yeah. Okay. Yeah, so May is halibut.

31:33Yeah. End of May is spot prawns. What? Yeah, we have nine-inch spot prawns, the sweetest, most gorgeous prawns. Like langoustine? Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And we catch them in about 400 feet of water. It's a lot of work. How do you catch a prawn? Well, you take a prawn trap and you put about 30 pounds of weight in it. See, I don't even know what's a prawn trap. You'll have to explain. It's like a big cage. Like a lobster pot. Yeah, exactly. And you drop it down about 400 feet. Yeah. And you wait an hour and then you bring it up. And once you start bringing it up, you can't stop because they'll get out of the holes.

32:08Okay. They need to get that momentum behind it. And you can catch a couple hundred shrimp in a pot that way. At the end of the day, you've got five, six hundred shrimp. Too many to eat. You have to freeze some. Well, we usually all split them up on the compound. Oh, my God. Of course, there's a lot to feed. Lots of mouths. We just had a table made that can have 40 people at it. 40 people? Yeah. Bloody hell. It's like Dolly Parton. It is like Dolly Parton. Yeah, that's... She likes a lot at her table. Beautiful. No, it's spiced lamb meatballs with chickpeas and dates. Oh, God, that would be beautiful.

32:44And yogurt and, like, couscous with some flaked almonds and caballoneros. I love them. So, okay, good.

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35:07Oh my god, that's fantastic. Oh my god, my wife is so jealous right now. Have some. Just want some. Have you not eaten? None of you eaten? There's a ball for all of you. Catherine, do not be polite. Please don't. I've got loads. Don't do this. British. God. And is this yogurt? Yeah. So good. Greek yogurt. I love it. And I've actually, we're doing a crumb. crumble for pud. Have you put it in, darling? I haven't. I love crumbles. I felt like being married to a Brit, you've got to know about a crumble. Ask my wife and my favourite deserter, she's going to tell you crumble. Oh, really? Mm-hmm. Where did you meet Kat?

35:46I met Kat through Paul McCartney. Oh, did you? Mm-hmm. How? Well, I was running a charity and Kath was heading up Paul McCartney's charity foundation and she read about one of our campaigns, a really sad one actually, over here and was moved by it and called up and said, how can I help? I want to send a bass guitar, a signed bass guitar, some music books, anything I can help to raise money for this auction. And my management called me and said, this woman that works for Paul McCartney is really smart and we think you should talk to her about running a foundation. and so I started talking to this woman over the phone and over email and I thought she was 75 why?

36:32because she was so wise yes and she worked with Paul McCartney so I just associated her as his age for like a year maybe more yeah and so I'm thinking I'm talking to this sweet little old lady over here in London you didn't have to hear a call no this was Kath and I have been married for 13 years So this is at least 16, 17 years ago. And was there any flirtation with this 75-year-old woman? No. Okay, fine. God, no. I mean, no. I was like, look, I was a child. So I'm talking with this woman. I think she's brilliant. And I'm really grateful to her because she's really helpful. And she's actually sending us things and being really cool.

37:11And then one day I go to New York City to play this gig. And we called her the charity lady. and they said to me I was getting ready to go downtown in New York with all my hip lesbian friends. I was going to get on the back of this cute little Baby Dykes Vespa and we were going to go down to the bars and sing karaoke and I was all excited and they were like the charity lady is here to see you so don't leave right after the show and I go oh not the charity lady I mean anywhere but New York City can't you come to Vermont? Not the old charity lady. Yeah you know I was like I mean I'm really grateful for her and they're like come on she's done so much for you please just meet the charity lady and i'm like okay so i get off stage after my stupid little show and i'll walk back into the wrestling room and there is this absolute knockout woman standing there who's my exact age and she goes hello i'm katherine shepard she i just couldn't believe that voice came out of her it was such a shock you know and I was just infatuated immediately infatuated with her did the charity lady go on the back of the bike and go to the club I didn't go to the club I stayed with the charity lady for the rest of the evening and lost track of all of those fun lesbians and they went into town without me and the rest is history that is so lovely and now I'm married to the charity lady Brandy can I ask you about Joni Mitchell and the famous Joni Jams.

38:45Yeah. How is she? Jon's great. In fact, I had a terrible moment today. I did an interview. Joni's one of my very, really good friends and we've been really good friends for five or six years and I've been able to be in a kind of passenger seat. She's better. Yeah, she's fucking amazing. She had that aneurysm 11 years ago. She had a stroke. It was an aneurysm. It was way worse. She was like, I mean, she hardly came out of it. She had to relearn everything, talking and walking and eating and everything. And about five or six years ago, I got to get involved with her musically and start to help her reemerge back into doing music again, even her own in her living room.

39:24Yeah, when you were the person that really encouraged her to do that, it was you were leading that. Yeah, I would say I would say that that was probably me. How did you feel? Is it because you could, cause you obviously saw there was a glimmer of like wanting and hope from her or was it, was there a tussle with that conversation where she was like, I am not doing this. And you were like, it was, it was like that, but it was, I didn't ask either. She just preempted this conversation. I was like, I think it was, um, I ran around that same time. Um, 2018, maybe something like that. I went to dinner with her cause she liked my wife.

39:59She didn't even know me. and I got invited. It's a long story, but Catherine and her met and they made friends and I come in on the coattails of my wife all the time. So I get invited to this meal and Joni's talking to me about music or whatever like a little bit and she goes yeah, you know, I don't do music and I don't want to hear it. Whatever you have to say about how you think whether that's a good idea or a bad idea, I don't want to hear it. I'm happy to not do music. I'm a painter. But my house, it misses music. She goes, so I'm wondering maybe you could get some friends together and you could start coming over and you guys could play the instruments and be in the house and these became the joanie jams these became the joanie jams and the very first joanie jam what happened was you have a woman that has not opened her mouth to sing or touch an instrument since this aneurysm and even before it honestly she was done with music and there was a moment where herbie hancock was at the piano you know just right and his hands are just kind of floating over the keys and everybody's drinking wine and talking and having a party and Joni's sitting quietly in her chair with a glass of wine and and nobody else knew what Herbie was playing but Joni did and you just hear out of the corner of the room summertime and the living is easy and the room just half the room burst into tears Herbie burst into tears oh my god I'm gonna cry she just opened her mouth and decided now's the time I sing now and she just started singing and she's still doing it with that voice and she takes risks every time she does it.

41:29She pushes her body to the very limit. And I may have helped, but no one gets credit for what she's done for the last six years with her body and her ability other than her. Can you paint the picture of the Joanie jam? You know, you say there's wine, is there snacks? Yeah. Joanie likes Mexican foods. There's a lot of Mexican food. Okay. She also quite likes hot dogs. Oh yeah. So we have some hot dogs. So we have a chef called Chef Steph that cooks for everybody. And we always have a margarita stand. Joanie loves a a Cadillac margarita or a Pinot Grigio. What's a Cadillac margarita? It's a really boozy margarita.

42:01How many margaritas were boozy anyway? It's only lime juice and tequila. I think of it because it's got Grand Monier in it. Oh, really? She amps that up. And then you end up with these buckets of tequila. And she can drink you under the table and not even blink. Cool. Yeah, she's really cool. You should come to it, Joni Jem, you know? That is one thing that I can... jam jamming i want to vomit why tell me why i'm just what do you cover when you cover a song i sing but i don't play and like i feel like a fraud look at you with all your instruments and then you can do that and like yeah i can write a song with the in collaboration and i guess jams literally it's like improv the idea of improv if herby's on the piano what are you playing what are you playing i'm playing guitar yeah but i'm often just facilitating i'm often you could do that asking other people to sing i make sure that everybody gets involved in the circle i make sure joni's getting to sing enough i make sure everybody knows that it's not a show for joni that we're actually there because we want joni to sing and also that everybody gets heard you know everybody wants that chance to like play for joni mitchell they're terrified you're a producer and a facilitator as well as being very talented.

43:18So is someone on drums? Is there a drum kit there? We have had a lot of percussionists in there. Marcus Mumford comes in and plays percussion a lot. Oh, he's lovely. Griff from Dawes, Abe Browns, Matt Chamberlain, my drummer's been a couple of times. Yeah, we've got amazing people. You have Ruben come and play piano. Ruben's the original Joni Jam piano player. He used to fly. Ruben James is a gorgeous boy. Gorgeous. Who used to play with Sam Smith. and so Reuben was always there smiling and being gorgeous and like when Sam was singing all their you know ballads Reuben and Sam would be there it would be them two the whole time and he I remember being at Glastonbury with Reuben one time we had a fun night he's intoxicating he's fab and talented oh he's a dream last supper you're going to a desert island for a very long time and away from the compound the right away from the compound what are you gonna have for dinner a starter a main a pud because you know what a pud is because you're married to a brit and a drink of choice would it be your very own cocktail that exists in seattle i'm you're gonna hate me i'm gonna say no what's it called the carlisle cup the carlisle cup my My wife quite likes a Carlisle cup.

44:37What's in it? Pimms. Oh. You'll be pleased to know. So the charity lady likes a Carlisle. The charity lady loves a Pimms. For me, okay, the cocktail, like the start, would be the classic whiskey sour with egg white. Oh, really? Classic whiskey sour. Okay. Yeah, with like Woodford Reserve or some kind of, maybe a Kentucky bourbon, something like that. Okay. And then I would go oysters. like raw oysters, champagne vinaigrette, shaved ice, lemon, Tabasco sauce. Okay. Okay. So we're starting there. Okay. And it's main next. Okay. I'm going to dish between that and the main. Okay. We're going straight to the main.

45:17You can have some extras. You can have an extra. You can do what you have. You can have a soup. Some kind of like a little bready baklava with goat cheese and like pistachios and balsamic. Where have you had this? Several places. like some kind of a flaky bready thing with those things on it like a delicious just tell me is it like our feta in phyllo or something like that yeah it is like that baked feta in phyllo and then you put you can put pomegranate on the top pomegranate would be perfect pomegranate molasses we might go with yeah okay go on and then it's really hard for me to decide between halibut salmon and a ribeye but I would maybe go ribeye.

46:02Are you cooking your own ribeye? I am, yes. And this ribeye is going to have on it some coarse black pepper, coarse salt, a little bit of brown sugar. Forget that. Ooh. Caramelization on the outside. I've never done that. That's a great idea. And some black coffee. What, the ground? Like a coffee rub. All rubbed onto this ribeye. And ground coffee. Yeah. And we're not talking instant coffee. We were talking grilled beans. We were talking real espresso beans ground, not too fine, and rubbed into the meat with the brown sugar. Wow. What would you call that, a rub? I don't know. I learned it from another singer, actually.

46:45Who? Emily Selliers from the Indigo Girls. She's kind of, her and her friends, Sue and Ross, kind of walked me through making a steaks early in my 20s. So I would do that. And on the side with that, I may have some, like, grilled eggplant, which you would call aubergine, and like rocket salad. That would be like my main. And then for dessert, I would probably go crumble. Apple. God, no pressure. Bloody hell. I'm scared now. Yeah. Or maybe a key lime. If it was fish, I would then finish with the key lime and some champagne. I like how decisive that was, Brandy. I think it sounds like a good meal.

47:26Yeah, I do. If you have meals, meals where everyone's all living near each other do you say oh we'll get together on sunday night you bring this or you bring that it's like a potluck supper yeah and we do it all the time you do it all i imagine each have individual things we're really good at like my wife's roast dinner is like the compound favorite which meat she does uh chicken chicken roast chicken yeah um and that's really popular with everyone and she also my sweet wife she does thanksgiving and Christmas and she cooks for everyone. Usually at least 20 people if not 40. And to get people to bring things.

48:05Yeah. My sister bakes like you would not believe. Like she bakes amazing baked goods. Cookies and cakes and rolls and she does what does. Cheesecakes and key lime pies and stuff. So my sister is like a boss with all the sweets. I want to live in this compound. You gotta come. If you ever come to Washington and you don't come to dinner I will be so offended. Don't come. I'm coming. And you're going to rub that bloody beef. I am. And with that coffee. And you I'm taking fishing. I'll go fishing. I've never known this about you. I used to go to my dad. I never knew this about you. Thank you Brandy.

48:34I love fishing. I wanted to also know if I was opening the fridge in your house, what would I be seeing in that fridge? Probably all my wife's healthy choices. Okay. Yeah. But if I want the things I like, like I like to eat like a child when I'm not cooking. Right. I will go and get those things at the grocery store. What are these things? Oh, you want know the names of them but like you know uh gushers kids candy fruit snacks and cheese it's and blizzard ice creams and oh what's a blizzard ice cream oh it's a dairy queen's you have read dairy we've heard of dairy queen somebody else has spoken about i can't remember do you guys know ben and jerry's ice cream yes okay so it's my dream to have a ben and jerry's ice cream named after me or at least like somehow associated what would be the flavors okay so i have a name and everything.

49:24Go on. So you know there's like Let's pitch it. Shark Tank. Let's go. Jerry Garcia has Cherry Garcia. Yeah. And it's delicious. Yeah. Fish, the band Fish, which you guys don't know but they're huge in the state. Yeah, Fish. Fish Food. Fish Food. Yeah, we have that. I didn't know there were all these fish. Is that named after a band? Apparently so. Okay, go on. They like bands. They like jam bands and rock and roll bands. Rocky Road. And mine would be called Candy Bar Lyle. Oh. Oh, yeah. That is so clever. All the best candy bars crushed up in your favourite ones, Heath and Hershey's with almonds and Snickers and Babe Ruth.

49:56That sounds fab. All crushed up in the ice cream. Have you spoken to Ben or Jerry? No, but I need to find Ben and Jerry and pitch my idea. Don't worry, this is going to go viral, right? This is the pitch. Candy Bar Lyle. Candy Bar Lyle. And what would the base be? Would it be vanilla base or chocolate base? Vanilla. Okay. It's got to be, Jessie. It's going to be a lot of sweets in there. A lot of chocolate in there, yeah. Is it mostly chocolates? Well, candy bars in America are just chocolate. There's different kinds of... What, Reese's Cups? Oh yeah, that would be perfect. Yeah. Reese's Cups.

50:24Butterfingers would be big. Butterfingers. Yeah. I'm thrilled for you. This is going to happen. You think? Hershey Kisses. You know, you got to do the Alton album. Two of my Grammys. I would give back two of my Grammys for a Candy Bar Lyle ice cream release. Candy Bar Lyle. Okay. It's so clever. Ben, Jerry, did you hear that? She'll give you both a Grammy if you give her an ice cream. It's not to be because it's so clever. This looks really nice. I hope it's quite good. I went quite heavy on the crumble. Are we having custard or cream? Do you want custard or cream? Ah, cream. Okay. Yeah, thank you.

50:57Thanks, darling. I feel like, I mean, you're an incredible storyteller on a song, but also just meeting you here. You are too. Oh, that's very kind. Thank you. But I would love to know, if you can rack your brains, the best dinner party you've ever been to. Mm. And if you remember the food. The best dinner kit for the food. Would it be about the food or would it be about the company? Well, maybe it's a bit of both. Maybe the food was not important.

51:33I had, it's just going to sound name-droppy and braggy. I've had some pretty great dinner parties. I've had some pretty great dinner parties. Do it. I love a name drop. Kath, what do you think is the best dinner party I've ever been to? I've had some pretty good ones. When you're rolling with Paul and Elton. Joanie. I think it would be with all them. Have you had one with all of them in the room? Yeah, and Bono. What's he like? Oh, is he fun? He's great. God, he's great. Oh, he has a drink and he's really fun and he actually encourages a lot. I have always gone over my limit whenever I've spent any time with Bono.

52:10We must get Bono on the podcast. Yeah, and he's taken the time to like, he sends me beautiful messages and words when something hard happens in the US because he knows I have a heart for displaced people. He sends me encouraging little things. He doesn't have to do that. He listens to my music. He, you know, we'll sit together at a dinner party and cause all kinds of trouble. And I just think he's, like, magical. And I love his wife, Allie, so much. Me and Catherine want to be Bono and Allie when we grow up. Okay. Do you remember the food that was fed to you? Or was it just drink from Bono? You can't think of the food when Bono's there.

52:44Really? Yeah. I remember a lemon cholo. Oh, God. and that's all i remember oh brandy does he keep his sunglasses on at the table uh no actually yeah yeah actually he does now that i think you mentioned and i'm having a fuzzy memory of the sunglasses yes before we let you go brandy back to windsor what is a nostalgic taste or scent that can transport you some somewhere oh a nostalgic taste or scent that can transport me somewhere oh for me it's gonna sound um generic but it's this it's the smell of the sea because that can transport me out of one version of myself and into the other version of myself are you a big like um what's yours i'm a gemini are you into okay i am not a gemini i'm a libra we're both you're both libra's well the gemini thing is that we're like two different people And that couldn't be more true for me.

53:41One part of me loves attention, loves being in a crowd, loves being very glamorous. I love champagne. I mean, I like that I'm getting to wear Valentino to the Oscars. But the other part of me is just walks around in rain gear and fishing and working on dirt work machines and doing construction and has this like kind of connectedness thing. but the sea takes me out of a attention-seeking part of myself and it really connects me um to something uh i think a little bit greater so that's the sea i want to go to the sea now you've made you've already sold it to me brandy no i love it you need a picnic to take in the back of the car i am absolutely stuffed and good like i cannot tell you how much i appreciate it was delicious thanks you guys you're so sweet you're wonderful I love the record I'm thrilled that you got to do this I know for the 12 year old person I just think it's magic and I kind of feel like you could probably do anything that you put your mind to so thank you so much thank you I'll try but I can't wait and we're going to I've got it in my diary I want to come to the Royal Albert Hall please please I'd love to come and you guys should keep doing this it's really cool Oh, we are.

54:58Until I pop my clogs.

55:14Well, it's official. I'm completely in love with Brandi Carlisle. That was such a lovely conversation. And she's funny. a generous, talented and tells a great story. I know. Candy Bar Lyle. Candy Bar Lyle. The best ice cream name. That was so good. And Ben and Jerry, if you don't do that you're fools. Fools to yourselves. Yeah. Thank you Brandy for coming on. Schlepping. She's going to do it schleps. But I bet you the bed that she's going back to in Sir Elton's is so comfy. Do you think he's given her a key to get in?

55:56do you think elton said look let yourself in and make a cup of tea before you go to bed maybe like she's got somebody ready for a foot rub for her or something i know anyway just amazing who believes in angels is out on the 4th of april it's gorgeous it's brilliant and just rousing and incredible and the songwriting on it is unbelievable and it's just so exciting to hear elton john and brandy Carlisle singing together and creating together. So, yeah, go and listen to it. And also go and listen to Brandy's music. I mean, you won't be able to see her because she's just sold out the whole tour. Yeah.

56:33Because she's just like, do you think we'll get a ticket? Yeah. Yeah. Good. I'm going. It was a banging meal, by the way. There's no buts. I thought it was delicious. Thank you, Mum. Just what you need on a Friday night. It was delicious. It was exotic and gorgeous. Really nice. Thank you for listening. and we'll see you next week.

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