Tim Cook

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1:05Hello and welcome to Table Manners. We're in Clapham again. I'm sorry, Mum. It's fine. And I did forget the pudding. But it's in a cab, I think, on the way here. You hope. And it's a morning affair today. Very early I've been up. Have you? Yeah. And there's the sweet smell of fish. Smoked haddock. Yeah, it's quite... It's quite powerful, isn't it? It's powerful. Much like you, Lenny. What? Thank you. You're comparing me to smelly fish. Thank you, darling. Why did I think... Well, he wants fish, this. Did he say he wanted fish? Yeah, he likes fish. Oh, OK. That's why I did it. Do they have kedgery in America?

1:42No, I don't think so. Well, we'll find out. They don't think they have kedgery in most places, do they? No, maybe there's a reason for that. Yeah, because it smells when you cook it. We have the CEO of Apple coming on, Tim Cook. probably one of the most influential, successful, powerful CEOs in the world in tech. Yeah. And he seems probably like the nicest one too from what I've read. Seems lovely. He's also quite a man of mystery. Not many people know that much about him. He doesn't do many interviews about his personal life and he's been in Apple for 26 years, I think. He took over from Steve Jobs.

2:25Yeah, and made it kind of one of the most profitable businesses in the world. So I'm interested, you know, we don't usually get big tech guys on the podcast. In fact, I think he's our first businessman. Yes. That we've had. But yeah, so we, and he doesn't do that many interviews. So we're very privileged. We're very lucky. And apparently he's on his way to meet the king after this. So what have you made? I've made Kedgeri. And I. Because he said he liked fish. And they also said that he really likes chocolate. So you've made your chocolate. Well, actually, my son made it after nursery yesterday.

2:58So I hope it hasn't got like a Lego piece. I don't know. Or he's probably licked a lot of it. Yeah, he's probably tasted it all. Had his finger in a lot. Yeah, but anyway. And so we, my three-year-old made the Nigella. Peanut. Peanut. Crunchy, Rocky Road bars. Yeah, it's got like honeycomb in it. So delicious. Salted peanuts, golden syrup. and dark milk chocolate, and you kind of, it's like a chocolate bar, and you just have it. It's like a tray bake, yeah. We have done it for somebody else. Who did we do it for? No, we didn't. Oh, but you've made it before. Yeah, I've made it for you. But it's a Nigella recipe, and so hopefully that will just hit the spot before he goes and meets His Royal Highness.

3:41I've done a combination recipe, because I didn't think, Alex, your brother said, curry for breakfast. So I didn't put, I only put a pinch of curry powder in. Oh, I like it. Yeah, but I just wondered about it. So I've done it with cinnamon and cardamom and some mustard seeds. And so it's not, and turmeric. So it's not overpoweringly curry. Sounds nice. Yeah. Am I allowed to test it? No. No, because you'll pull your face and then I'll feel anxious. Should I grate some lime on the top? Would you have lime or not? I'd need to taste it first. Okay, well, I've done some lemon zest, so it should be enough.

4:20I think a squeeze of lemon will be nice for him to choose to do if he wants. I'll put some on the side. Yeah, that's what I think. Or a lime. Why a lime? Because he lives in California, darling. They all have limes there. Yeah, and we're in South London. Okay, fine. So I think the limes are going to be a bit better there. I just wanted to make it perk him up a bit. Why do you think he's not going to perk him? I don't know. He's probably had like what Jake Shears has. What's it called? The red eye where you have like four shots of coffee before like seven o 'clock in the morning. Yeah. We'll find out.

4:52Tim Cook coming up on Table Minors.

5:09Hang on a minute. What is it? Thank you. Oh, wow. Guys, thank you. This is my favorite California wine. Oh, wow. Oh, Tim. Tim. Oh my gosh. What is it? What kind of... It's Kistler. I don't know if you've ever heard of it. It comes from the wine country. And it's the most marvelous Chardonnay. I love Chardonnay. It's so wonderful. I'll have yours, Mum. Thank you so much. That's so kind. It's so sweet. Most people love red wine. I really like white. This is my favorite by far. And what's this? Jam? This is some jam. But the special thing about this is it's from Apple Park. Apple Park. And so we basically converted the land at Apple Park to all of the indigenous plants and shrubs and so forth that were there in the beginning of Silicon Valley before all the concrete came in and took over the valley.

6:12And we flipped the park from 80 % concrete to 20 % concrete, put all the parking underground, and returned it to the park-like setting that it used to be. And this jam is from the trees that are grown there. Oh my goodness. And we served this in our cafe. So you planted apple trees? We did, yes. Only apple trees? What else is in there? cherry trees I believe and all of the indigenous plants that were there in the beginning are back there again Thank you so much, that is so kind Tim Cook, you're here in Clapham you are in London for kind of 48 maybe, yeah, about 48 hours I believe you met with our Prime Minister yesterday and you're on your way to see the King after this Yes, no big deal It's a fabulous day.

7:11I've never met the King. And the fact that he's coming to Apple Battersea is such a huge deal for all of our team. And he's done so much from a sustainability point of view, and that's one of our core values. And, of course, he does a lot for the youth as well, and we work with them on the King's Trust. and so it's a it's a big day a big moment for us and of course yesterday we announced apple intelligence coming to the uk wow and so it's been a jam-packed 48 hours for us so what are you going to serve the king are you going to give him one of your favorite chardonnays because you know actually we had a guest on recently that got given a bottle of wine from the king yeah and so i feel like if you've got a spare bottle you need to give it maybe that's maybe we should do that.

8:08I think maybe. Does he really like wine? He likes wine and he gave it to somebody else so I feel like if that's your fave maybe. Okay all right good suggestion. What are you going to serve him? Is there going to be? We're serving him tea. He's there in the afternoon like at 3, 3 30. What like a traditional afternoon tea? And so it's before dinner right traditional afternoon tea. Do you like that? I do, yes, I do. And I like the setting of the tea and sort of the relaxation of the moment in addition to the tea itself. You're going to have to let us know if he's got good table manners. Are you a tea drinker?

8:48I drink some tea. I drink coffee more than tea. And I think your coffee is probably... I've made you like rude. I'm going to let you do it. I hope it's okay. It's one of your brother's coffees. Oh, well, then it's going to be strong. It might be strong. So, Tim, can we start at the beginning? Yes. You grew up in Alabama. That's right. Who was around the dinner table, and what is a very memorable dish from your childhood? Very family-oriented. Okay. Very family-oriented, and it depends on what time of the day as to who would be there. My father worked the second shift, so he was never there in the evening.

9:26and so in the evening it would be my mom and my two brothers and myself so I was I'm a middle child how is that for you Tim um Jesse is my middle child I'm a middle child and I feel incredibly well adjusted my son at the moment is everyone's going well it's because he's a middle child and I'm like hang on I didn't understand this have you ever been prescribed the middle child syndrome I'm not sure I know what the middle child syndrome apparently we're really tricky you're not tricky well you are a bit tricky well compared to my sister my mother I'm a breeze thank you I think I was a little bit different in what way uh different in most ways different uh from a what I wanted out of life maybe different in in probably many different ways uh I I put all of myself into school and my brothers did less so of that.

10:27Which university did you go to? I went to Auburn University for undergrad and then I went to Duke University for a graduate. And what did you do? I was in engineering in undergrad and then for grad school I did an MBA and grad school I was working during the day and going to school at night because it's the only way I could have afforded to go to Duke was to have my employer basically pay for it and it was a fabulous time it was a fabulous time all my life has been a fabulous time. Was this when you were flipping burgers? I started flipping burgers in when I was probably 14, 15. I was first throwing papers.

11:15Okay. And then I graduated to flipping burgers. Where did you work? I worked, when I flipped burgers, I worked at a place called Tasty Freeze. Was it tasty? No. But it was the only fast food kind of place in town and so everybody kind of congregated there was it a bit like I can imagine like back to the future it was like the diner and back to the future where like they'd all hang out and it was like the spot very much so you know they served ice cream and they served burgers and your friend did your friends come in they would come in yes and generally make fun of me that I was working at the burger place did you have to wear a little hat and things I wore a little hat and I wore an apron and uh it was uh I was making a dollar ten an hour at the time it was sub minimum wage uh which was legal at that point in time and uh and you were 14 I don't know 14 year olds would be allowed behind a grill now right I think not I think not but then you know My upbringing was, a lot of it was centered on work.

12:30And the belief that hard work was essential for everybody, regardless of your age. And so I started working when I was probably 11 or 12 on the paper route. What did your dad and mom do then? My father was in the shipbuilding business. In Alabama? In Alabama. You made ships? There was a dry dock in Mobile, Alabama, and he was in the shipbuilding business. And my mom, when we were younger, stayed at home and took care of everyone. And then after a while, she began working at the local pharmacy as a sales clerk. And so I came from a very modest, extremely modest background. and in a rural town. And the town had 2 ,000, 3 ,000 people in it, so it was a blink-your-eye-you'll-miss-it kind of place.

13:31But it was terrific. You know, the house was filled with love, and everybody knew everybody in town and what everybody was doing. So it was a very different upbringing. What was Christmas like in all those? Oh, Christmas was so huge. It was so huge. And we had the family would congregate at Christmas Eve. That was our key time. And everybody pigged out. And it was a very enjoyable time. So you said your dad was doing the second shift. So around the dinner table, it would have been your two brothers and you and your mom. That's right. And what was your favorite go-to meal that your mom would make for you boys?

14:15Oh, it would have to be fried chicken. Everything in the South was pretty fried. You fried chicken, you fried shrimp, you fried fish. Everything was fried. And strangely, you're still alive. And I'm still alive. Okra was fried. And so most everything. So is it put in a batter? It's put in a batter, yes. and sometimes deep fried and sometimes fried more on the shallow. Just delete fried food. I do because it brings me back to my childhood. I know that sounds maybe kind of strange, but it's one of those things like music is. You hear a song that you grew up with and it ports you back to your childhood.

15:05Food does that for me as well. but I don't eat it nearly as much as I did I couldn't do that at this point in time I hear that you start your day around you wake up, you've got quite a not a strict but it's pretty disciplined you wake up at 5? probably a little earlier than that why is that? well as it turns out it's the part of the day that I can control the most As the day starts to unfold, it becomes less predictable. And by the end of the day, all these things can happen to commandeer your time and attention and energy. And so I love the part of the day that I can kind of block out the world and focus on a few critical things and just be silent for a while.

16:05So do you do some work at home? I do. Get going, yeah. I do. When I get up in the morning, I typically grab coffee and some cereal. What cereal is Tim Cook eating? What is it? We need to know all these details. Cereal is like cashew, if you're familiar with this. You buy it. It's a bit like bran. It's a bit like nuts, ground nuts. Yes, that's right. And it's a protein-based cereal. Like a granola? No. No, it's not a granola. They sell it in Whole Foods. In the market. Yes, I bought it, yeah. Yeah, they'll sell it in the market. What milk are you going with? I do unsweetened almond milk. Apparently very good, actually, the best for you.

16:47It's very good for me. Yes. It's very good for me. Hard to find unsweetened stuff in America, though. I mean, like, it's kind of, everything's got something delicious and sweet in it. California is a little different. Yeah. It's a little more available there. But you're right. Of course, my childhood, everything was sweet. The tea was sweet. everything that you had had sugar in it. And then, so you have your cereal, and then you do your emails. And then I'm doing emails. And generally what I'm focused on in the morning is responding to employees and customers. Yeah. And so I get an extraordinary amount of outreach from customers.

17:27And they're telling me things that are critical in their lives. maybe they're telling me a story of how the Apple Watch saved their life. Oh, come on, tell us. This is an unbelievable, these are unbelievable stories where somebody's wearing the watch, and they get an alert that they have AFib. Because the watch can detect AFib. And they go run to the emergency room and get fitted with all of the EKG kind of stuff. and it confirms the diagnosis. And it turns out, in many cases, they tell me that the doctor, the cardiologist told them they would have died had they not come in at that point in time.

18:15Wow. Okay. Have you ever had a medical alert on your watch? I haven't, but my father, when he was alive, he fell in the house and he was living alone. and the other thing the watch does is send you send a notification to your family and to emergency services if you fall oh this is what i need this is what my worries about being somebody that lives i live on my own and i'm always scared if i fall over that my toes will be growing hairs before they find me i mean tim we speak about 10 times a day but is that because he could then contact you on the phone no it's alerted it did it automatically yeah how could it do that i don't Because it detects the fall because of the accelerometer in the watch.

19:04And so it detects the fall. It notifies emergency services. And it notifies your emergency contacts. So it does both. And in this case, it notified emergency services. And they came out to the house. He didn't respond to the door. And so they kicked the door down. And it was a good thing they did because he was not conscious at the time. Oh my goodness, I'm so sorry. And he came out of that. But did he then, when he came out of it, go, well, my son. My son actually saved my life with this watch. No, he was focused on the door, to be honest. He was more upset. He took down my door. Yeah, I would be that.

19:44Well, you wouldn't pick up the phone anyway. Oh, piss off, I would. You always have it on silent, so she wouldn't pick up the phone even. Oh, really? I'm seeing you've got your Apple Watch on, and it did have a few notifications coming up, but like do you sometimes I mean do you sometimes not want the notifications you just want it to be yes and I silence it like at night if I'm sleeping with a watch I'll silence the notifications okay um because at night now the watch detects sleep apnea you know a lot of people have sleep apnea but don't know it and so a billion people over a billion people have sleep apnea around the world and don't know it and so it's just amazing the kinds of things that are detectable from your wrist now and um we just keep pulling the string and putting putting more and more sensors and so forth in the watch for it to help people um back to your childhood you were flipping burgers yeah tasty freeze yes um can you still make a good burger when was the last time you made a It's been a long time, to be honest.

20:50Do you cook? I don't cook. Is it because Cafe Max is so good on Apple Pie? Cafe Max is so incredible. I have lunch in Cafe Max, and I take a dinner home from Cafe Max. Fair enough. It's your business, so I think that's all right. Do you curate the menu at all? I don't curate the menu because I found that the curation of it is so great. And that I don't need to curate the menu in order for it to be great. So do you have like fish and chip Friday like we do in England? On Fridays, as it turns out, we generally don't go into the office. Oh, okay. Because we're on this 3-2 kind of schedule. Although I go into the office four days a week.

21:39Right. And then on Friday I typically work from home because nobody's in the office and it's depressing when there's nobody there. Yeah. Did you change this after COVID? Did it kind of change the way that you were? Yeah, COVID changed. COVID changed things in a major way. And it taught us that we could get some amount of work done online, but it also taught us of the value of all being together. Yeah, for collaboration. And so we've tried to find a hybrid approach that works. so if we were coming to cafe max which is at apple park what would you be like i really jesse and lenny i really want you to try this like what would be your favorite dish from cafe max at the moment oh um i i typically go for the fish yeah and the fish changes uh in terms of what they're offering and there's actually we have so many employees from different parts of the world there.

22:41There's food from all around the world there. Lots of Chinese food, lots of Indian food. There's a sushi bar. There are burgers. There's pizza. There's salads. There are soups. I mean, you name it and Cafe Max kind of has it. I'd love to go there. Oh, you're invited. Thank you. You're definitely invited. I think you'd enjoy it. So do you, I presume you live quite near to I live in Palo Alto, which is about 20 minutes or so from Apple Park. And where are you? Do you go? Because, I mean, San Francisco has some really great places to eat. I'm sure Palo Alto does as well. But where if you're in San Francisco?

23:26Well, I usually go out to dinner in Palo Alto. Okay. Are there any spots that we should go to? Yeah, there's a place called Ethel's Fancy that is a really cool, eclectic kind of place that you generally have shareables with. So whoever you're eating with, you need to have some things in common with or at least eat with somebody that likes to explore new foods. And they have things from all over the world there. And what would you say if I was going there, what would be the dish that I should definitely try? Oh, which one would I say? Do you always get? I like the octopus there. Okay. It's quite good.

24:14And I usually also, you know, I'm in this fish sort of, I usually get the fish for an entree. But they also have an interesting beef there as well if you're into more red meat. We hear that you've got quite a sweet tooth, though. I do. You like chocolate. I do, I love chocolate. This was the thing that we heard. We heard that you like fish and you really like chocolate. Yes. So this is what you're getting. Oh, really? So I made Ketchari. Have you had that before? I don't think I've heard of it. Wow. Is it a British thing? No, it's Scottish, I think. Scottish? Okay. It's a mixture of fish with rice and kind of spices.

24:55Not spicy, though. Not spicy. Right. Oh, it sounds great. Cinnamon. You can help yourself. Sounds wonderful. And you have it with, it's quite something, lots of people do it traditionally around Christmas time as well, and like Boxing Day, it's like, I don't know, hence the smell of haddock in the room right now. It's quite strong. And the yellowness comes from the turmeric. You can help yourself. So, Tim, we ask everybody what their last supper would be. I guess this would be if you're going away from Apple Park for a very long time and you're not having all your creature comforts. And what would be your appetizer, your entree, as you call it?

25:39Yeah, your main, your entree and your dessert and drink of choice. Oh, I'd probably go for like a hamachi crudo for the appetizer with jalapeno. Delicious. Those are quite good. I'd probably, for an entree, I'd probably go for a really great branzino. What are you having as your sides? Probably maybe broccolini. Quite garlicky? Are we going garlicky? I like garlic. Me too. I like garlic. Oh, thank you so much. for dessert almost anything with chocolate in it you don't discriminate you'll have anything I usually like dark more than milk but I'll eat almost anything chocolate can you agree that we do have better chocolate bars in the UK than America I You're hesitating Tim You're hesitating There's great chocolate here Yeah Go on Well what's your favourite Because I just think I love a Hershey's Kiss Like if I For a moment But I don't I don't know I feel like Cadbury's Is far superior It's more Oh my god I do Yeah I like dark chocolate Better than milk chocolate Me too So maybe we're going Like You know like 70 % Yes.

27:17But again, have you had green and blacks? I haven't, but I'll try it. I think that's UK, isn't it? Green and blacks. Yeah. I don't know why we're good at it, because it's not like we have cocoa. I mean, it's like, it doesn't make any sense. If you want some lemon and salt and pepper, it's just there. Help yourself. See what you think. Do you like it? It's excellent. And I guess, would the drink of choice be the beautiful bottle of wine that you brought us over? Definitely. It would be Kistler. It would be Kisler. I love that Chardonnay. I can't wait to try it. You're going to love it. Let me know what you think.

27:54Send me a note on it. I will email you and you will read it at 4.45 in the morning. And I'll ask you where I can get the case.

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29:47so tim what do you do when you're not working you i hear you work about a 14 hour day and i believe you like hiking i love hiking and i guess northern california is probably beautiful for that right it is beautiful um and there's a lot of protected space there so you can really kind of with a reasonable drive go out somewhere and feel like you're way out but I find that hiking really clears my mind and and connects me with nature again which is so critical and I found moving west that there's a lot more land available for hiking and I've really just gotten into it more and more over the years.

30:40Do you do it on your own or do you go with people? Both. If you're on your own, what music are you listening to and what snacks are you bringing? Sometimes I'm listening to classic rock. Oh yeah. Because I love classic rock and it takes me back to childhood as well. So like what kind of bands? Oh, what am I listening to? Rolling Stones. and Bob Dylan. And Steve was a Bob Dylan fan as well. And so, you know, he's an extraordinary, extraordinary talent. Were you close to Steve? Yes. So did you work together before you took over as Steve? Oh, yeah. I started working for Apple in 98. Oh, a long time ago.

31:28And so worked with Steve for 13 years before he passed in 2011. And, yeah, that was a very, very sad time. Terrible. And I thought he would always be there. And that's not how things worked out. Yeah. Can I ask you, you hike? do you I mean because Apple's become everything entertainment health do you almost not want to look at a screen at the end of the day but if you are what are you watching on Apple TV at the moment I like sometimes switching off and being just totally cool yeah and then at other times I love the entertainment value of TV plus yeah and so I'm watching uh Silo oh yeah I haven't watched that Oh, I would highly recommend it.

32:26What's it about? It has sort of a sci-fi angle, but you don't have to be a sci-fi fan to love this. Rebecca Ferguson stars in it. Oh, she's great. And it's being filmed in the UK. Oh, really? I was just on set on Tuesday. Did you enjoy that? Oh, it was unbelievable. It was really unbelievable. It's an extraordinary show. So I watched that. you've got to promise there's going to be 18 ,000 series of slow horses slow horses is huge we adore it he wrote 13 books he wrote 13 books yeah people love slow horses and bad sisters yeah we had Sharon on actually last week oh really? wow and we're filming F1 partially in the UK F1 is the new movie about Formula 1 Is that the one with Brad Pitt?

33:24Yes And they've just been filming in Abu Dhabi In Abu Dhabi as well Did you go? I was there How was that? Oh, it's incredibly exciting And you know, F1 as a sport has really just taken off around the world and it's going from strength to strength and it's so exciting meeting the characters behind it It's always been quite European, hasn't it? Yes, but it is becoming... I quite like it, I have to say. It's becoming global. And so I think the movie is going to just be fantastic. Good. Because it's always been NASCAR in the States, hasn't it? It has been, you're right. So Formula One is... It's fairly new.

34:06But it's so glamorous, Formula One. And they're so glamorous, the drivers and everything. That's right. But isn't it... I'm sorry. Isn't it just they whiz past you and then you just have to wait for... No, it's so clever. I can't imagine it's like... It's so exciting to watch, is it? It is clever. I wish they go fast. Why is it clever? Because of the driving. I'm sure because they're very talented. The driving is so clever. It's so clever. It's so... If you're into engineering... And it's a team as well. Okay, yeah. Right, the data and the technical side of Formula One is just huge. And so when you're down in the garage, watching how the team works, watching when a car comes into the garage and goes out in two seconds...

34:46Yeah, they changed the tires in nine seconds. It's unbelievable. Speaking about data, you're obviously obsessed by it. What was the first kind of bit of gear that really opened your eyes to data? I mean, you've been working within computing for a long time. I would say back in college, my first time using a personal computer, the light bulb went off about all of this power that you could have at your fingertips. and before that I was working more with a mainframe and you would do punch cards. Think of it as one big central computer that everybody uses and you access it through these punch cards to run your program.

35:33Oh my goodness. And you would submit your punch cards once a day and hope that your program would run and inevitably it would not run sometimes and you would be back again the next day to try to get it to run with a personal computer you could do everything yourself what was your first computer was it apple it was an apple oh yes i remember my friend having an apple and it looking like the sex it looked like it was futuristic yeah it was kind of and it looked very exciting yeah yes in case you oh my goodness have you finished with your category yes so this is terrific my three-year-old helped make this yesterday and it is a lot of chocolate it's dark and milk it's salted peanuts it's honeycomb did you manage to get the coffee i did get some coffee thank you do you need any more i think i'm good okay and speaking about alabama and southern hospitality was that very important to your family it was embedded yes right it was really embedded and uh you were expected to treat everyone with dignity and respect and be friends with everyone and uh and treat everyone as a guest and you know that it's just a part of being from the south some of the kind of southern table manners are there any that we should know about?

37:04That's a good question. Southern table manners. No, I mean, we eat with our hands because we are eating things like fried chicken and so forth. And so there's probably less emphasis on traditional table manners and more about the enjoyment and and enjoying the company that you're with. What do your brothers do? Do they do anything within tech? Not in tech at all. My older brother's now retired, but sort of followed in my father's footsteps of being in the shipbuilding kind of industry. And my younger brother is a financial analyst. Oh, wow. And yeah, so they stayed out of tech totally. Tim do you think you'll ever retire?

38:03Sure I talk to someone who's never retired But not the traditional definition of it What does that mean? Meaning I don't see being at home doing nothing and not intellectually stimulated and thinking about how tomorrow can be better than today and I think I'll always be wired in that kind of way and want to work. I mean, I was working when I was 11 or 12. I can't imagine retiring because I'm essentially lazy and I would do nothing all day. I'd do word games and crosswords and read and not do anything else, I think. That's why I need to... You're kind of allowed to do that at a certain age too.

38:49But I don't want to. Okay, fair enough. I need the stimulation also. Yeah, I feel the same way. is you want to be pushed a bit. You want to be uncomfortable a bit. Yeah, a little bit, yeah. And maybe not as much as today. Maybe not. But you want to be pushed. And I think I'll always want to be pushed. Where do you go on holiday? I usually go to national parks. Yeah. You stay in the U.S.? You don't? A combination. This summer I went to Slovenia for the first time. Oh, what was that like? It was incredible because I went caving, and I'd never been caving before. What do you do when you're caving?

39:34Well, you're going down many meters below ground. Oh, Jesus. And you're wearing lights, and you're kind of exploring the underground, and it's like a different world down there. and I'd never done it before I knew nothing about it but it was a great exploration because I've always been above ground and you know hiking above ground and going up mountains and so forth and so going down was very different. Sounds quite dangerous or not is it kind of? Well I had a guide that really understood the the surroundings and and you know. Do you like that level of thrill? I do even when you're having your time off and you're in a hiking yes are you hiking the highest mountain there are you jumping over a rock that maybe well my nephew likes to hike the highest mountain so he pushes to do that I I can I'll sometimes do that and then sometimes I'll just want to hike a long distance to wear myself out totally and so it's a combination of those two things but it's all about the summit and the the feeling that you have when you accomplish a long hike to a summit and then look at the beauty of surroundings that you have and uh there's nothing quite like that i think i've been moaning all the way up i remember i did machu picchu and we got to the top and they were like look around i was like I can't.

41:12I need hair. That's on my bucket list. I've never done that. It was amazing. It seems like, Tim, you're striving. You're always striving for a greater tomorrow. You push your limits in everything, whether it's like... I try to, because I think it's amazing what you can accomplish if you push yourself. Did your mum and dad instill this in you then, do you think? They instilled hard work, and that has stayed with me for a lifetime, is the value of it, the fact that work can be a part of your purpose. And what Apple provided me was next level because Apple is at the root about enriching other people's lives.

42:00You know, whether it's through some of the health stuff that we talked about or empowering them to create things that they couldn't create with the iPhone camera or the drawing on iPad or so forth, you know, really focusing on the creative communities. And so Apple had this nice intersection between it was clearly hard and challenging in a dynamic environment, but it was also focused on doing good and leaving the world better than we found it. And having that intersection with your work means everything. because you're no longer just working for work's sake. I think I, before Apple, I think I loved to work.

42:53I didn't love the work. And now I love both. And there's a big difference that you feel when you do that. Have you got something new that's coming up? Oh, we have so many things coming up. I can't give you a hint. Oh, you must be able to give us a tiny little hint of something. So many things. You know, whether you're looking at products and the product pipeline or whether you're looking at shows and different TV shows that are coming out or movies or services, it's a very exciting time to be at Apple. And Apple Intelligence that we just dropped yesterday in the UK, it's already helping so many people can you explain it to us yeah it what it really does is it brings generative ai to your iphone your ipad and your mac and what that what that really means to most people would be things like uh if you're if you're receiving like as many emails as I do you want to get through them as fast as you can and so it will summarize your emails for you it will when you reply it will help you reply by by suggesting a smart reply right it will help you if you write and you want to make something friendlier or more professional it'll do that for you so you may want to write it and get it to rewrite it so it's a kind of chat are we allowed to say that i don't know is it kind of a version of it's like well we're actually integrating chat gpt where if you want world knowledge siri now accesses chat gpt uh it does things like uh if you want to do just fun things like create your custom emoji it'll it'll create a custom emoji for you have you got a custom emoji i i was working on one yesterday and i i love um christmas I love Christmas and London is like the ultimate Christmas city.

45:09And so I was looking at what would Big Ben look like with a tree out front. And so you can do things like this. And it's just, it's both fun like that, but it's also serious like the writing tools. It's clever. And very clever. And it's integrated into all the apps that you already use, whether it's mail or messages or notes or wherever you want it. I feel my Apple phone knows more about me than myself. It probably does. Is there a danger in that? Will you be at that point where you go, you know what, shut it all down because they know too much now? No, well, they, in this case, what we do is we do as much on the device as possible.

46:02So it's not Apple. Yes. It's your device. Yeah. And we don't have access to your device. Okay. You have a passcode, and that passcode encrypts your data on that phone, and we can't open it. Okay. And we don't want to open it anyway, but we're not in the data business. We're about privacy. And so what we've tried to do with our Apple Intelligence is find the intersection of personal but private. Okay. And that's the intersection that we're at. Can I just ask, how many emails do you think you get a day? Oh, it's all in probably five, six hundred. Crazy. Yeah. Yeah. In some days where there's something extraordinary going on, it will be a lot more than that.

46:56And you answer them all? No, I don't answer them all. Well, your Apple intelligence will be sorting them out soon. Telling you which ones need to be. It also does that. It prioritizes the email for you. Oh my goodness. We're recording this in the run up to Christmas. is it just expected that Uncle Tim is getting his nephew something from Apple or is it like Uncle do a bit better than that I'm sorry I'm sorry he gets stuff from uh from me throughout the year he just got he just got a new Mac oh right okay and and so yeah I do a lot of Apple product for the holidays it's not too bad is it it's not too bad at all good on Tim Christmas list.

47:42Not too bad at all. Tim, before we let you go and go meet the king and queen, as you do, can we ask you what a not, well, I kind of think you've already answered this, but maybe you can elaborate, talk about the connection between food and nostalgia and memory. Is there another taste or scent that can transport you somewhere? It would be about fried food. It would be this combination of fried chicken and the scent off of that, the fried shrimp, fried okra. all of these things are southern delicacies and I can still you can kind of still smell those in my mom's kitchen and yeah it definitely ports me back to a different day and time Tim thank you so much for coming on the podcast thank you for your time thank you for the presence thank you for being so open thank you for having me Such a pleasure.

49:00Tim Cook, what a lovely guest. I'm so excited about drinking this Chardonnay, Mum. I know you are, darling. I'm really excited. I'll save mine for Christmas Day, and you can have yours at home with Sam tonight. Okay, great. so I get both bottles essentially. Perfect. Love that, that's selfless. Thank you so much to Tim Cook for taking the time to come over. Yes. Lovely man. We're sandwiched in between the Prime Minister and the King and Queen. As it should be, honey. He was really... A lovely, nice... Kind of unassuming, humble man that is basically... Who likes hard work, I would say. Yeah. He's probably the hardest-looking person I've ever met.

49:40But thank you so much. I've really enjoyed that. It was a real pleasure. Absolutely. Lovely man. And we'll see you next week. Yeah.

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