EFL Extra: Promotion chasing or relegation threatened - "The games are running out"

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0:58Exclusively reveal, had these charming words for me when planning this show. I said, should we start with Southampton's big win in the championship against Wrexham? And he replied, surely let's just get Lincoln out of the way. So let's just do that. Lincoln have been promoted to the championship back in the second tier for the first time in 65 years. Done. Great achievement. Let's move on. Let's move on. Let's just leave it there. the wrong way Tom

1:26Gregor Robertson: I've just made this has to be you know we have to lead with this we have to you know shower Lincoln shower Lincoln City with praise we have to lead with this quite right quite right we do so you were there you were there you were there I was there twice I was there twice so in terms of dishing out praise we should give my wife Amy some further praise we did so in the preview show she did not only allowed me to go to Friday's game abandoning my three year week old daughter but also then when I came back and it wasn't quite done Gregor we needed a point from the game at Reading and I said, do you mind if I go on Monday as well?

1:58She said, are you bloody joking? And then said yes. So thankfully she did because it was amazing. It was incredible. It was absolutely incredible. The atmosphere at home for the 1-0 win against Wimbledon was brilliant and the 3 ,000 away fans behind the goal at Reading was just superb. Everyone stood on their feet the whole game, chanting all game. Brilliant atmosphere. Loads of young kids there as well. Clearly been taken for a special moment by supporters who may be my age or a bit older who'd never seen anything like it and taking their kids being like, this might be as good as it gets, guys.

2:30This might be as good as it gets. And in terms of finishes, for any listeners who didn't spot it, we were 1-0 up after an opening goal in the first five minutes. Perfect start. Then a little bit nervy. Then Reading equalised with a brilliant free kick by Lewis Wing that was one of those where we were right behind it. And as soon as he hit it, we were like, that's in. That's straight in. A brilliant, brilliant free kick. But that didn't matter. Point was still enough. we were going up anyway but then Jack Moylan on the counter attack 96 minute charging towards the away end if anyone can be bothered who listens to this show go and watch Moylan's goal and behind the goal about five rows back you will see a deranged sleep deprived man in a red hat and a blue jacket with arms aloft just screaming shoot please God put it in the back of the net and I should also say thanks to Carl and Hallie who were the father and daughter sat next to me who I gave a spontaneous hug to because I was there on my own unfortunately my dad couldn't go to this game so I was there on my own hugging randoms it's absolutely brilliant it's exactly what you'd be a football fan beautiful stuff beautiful stuff

3:36Gregor Robertson: and you must there must be so much pride too in the fact that you can have you know you look around you know every kind of every news outlet and every everyone analyzing the EFL and they're basically saying that Lincoln this season story of the season but also like a model club a model club and this is the way you should run a football club in the terms of like your budget is is is like in the bottom eight of the division you know I think I think I read that your highest wage is three and a half thousand a week which is in league one standards not enormous and it's been a story of sort of incremental growth and intelligent leadership yeah absolutely I think like that is genuinely a thing that I've joked about previously on this podcast talking about oh you know if we stay in League One that's fine because the club is so well run and you know we work in the media we're covering stories like Sheffield Wednesday and you know clubs from back in the few years ago Macclesfield going bust Bury as well they were clubs that I grew up watching Lincoln play against all the time growing up in the Northwest so the way the club is run is a source of as much pride as this achievement.

4:43And I mean that genuinely. That might sound mad, but the way it's run and the way we've done it is a source of... Sustainable. So much pride. And you mentioned some of the finances there. I wrote a piece for the Times website about the achievement and what it means. And just mentioned some of the financial reporting that's been done in the last couple of weeks and stuff. And even for last season, Charlton and Wrexham recorded losses of 16.7 and 14.9 million in achieving promotion last season. Lincoln's losses were 2.9 million. And I know from speaking to people at the club that it is around that same figure for this season.

5:17So it's not like they've suddenly spent a load more money this season, operating in a loss of around 3 million pounds, which is not ideal, but the people at the club believe that that is sustainable. And as you mentioned, in the lower chunk of the league in terms of losses. And yeah, you're quite right. 3 ,500 is the most we pay any of our players. And just for some context, it's widely reported that there are other clubs who've been chasing promotion paying players between£10 ,000 and£15 ,000 a week.

5:45Gregor Robertson: And just to also illustrate the scale of the leap that you're now looking at the average losses in the championship are£450 ,000 a week and the average wage bill in the championship is now£31 million a season so it's an extraordinary leap but it's a bit like Luton's rise to the Premier League you feel like we're not going to change the way we do things and you've got to try and overcome the odds despite the odds so you wouldn't imagine you're going to tear up the blueprint that's got you here so far and I don't think any fan would want us to I don't think any fan would want us to I mean if we can keep hold of Michael Scobala who obviously will be catching the eye of any clubs looking for a new manager I have to be realistic about that obviously hope he stays but if there was a club in the championship who were after an up-and-coming manager then he'd obviously be in the list and in contention but obviously if he stays the coaching staff stays and we bring in some players we probably do need to bring in some players as good as this squad is I've mentioned it on this podcast before we don't really have like a superstar talent that I'm like oh they're gonna light up the championship and we've got a lot of brilliant experienced pros we've got a lot of really hard-working players who will give it a good crack but I honestly don't think a single fan would want us to do anything different we just want to go up have a crack try and put some noses out of joint and have a good laugh doing it well but it is amazing and one thing I wanted to ask you was I mentioned in my piece and obviously I've made jokes about Wrexham on this podcast before I compared this achievement to Wrexham's rise through the leagues people in the comments section on the Times website said Lincoln's achievement is a bigger, better fairy tale than Wrexham's.

7:28I mean, there's been loads of great stories and even this season, if Bromley, we'll talk about League Two as well, Bromley winning League Two would be as good maybe as Lincoln's. What do you think is a completely unbiased opinion? Where do you rank it in terms of achievements that you've seen in the Football League over the last couple of seasons?

7:45Gregor Robertson: Yeah, I mean, I mentioned Luton earlier. Luton is a kind of similar story in that, you know, climb from the National League, they climb from the National League to the Premier League in basically a decade. you've done nine years I think it is from the National League to the championship with less investment I think although it's changed recently of you've got a you know a US co-owner now haven't you and Landon Donovan's involved and there's you know you're looking to sort of to to get investment from it from outside as well now Lincoln had a kind of although it was like a supporter owned model sorry Luton had a supporter owned model they were also very wealthy supporters but it's the same sort of story it's like really intelligent leadership great culture and as the line you used in your piece and as Michael Scobala said to me it's like where do we put our chips to get the best returns and even things like focusing on set plays being the best set play team in whoever thinks Arsenal is the best you guys are the best of the last two seasons and I like the idea there's a thing that one thing that chained for me is the idea that there's very little between the highest earner and the lowest earner.

8:55Gregor Robertson: And I remember when I was at Grimsby, that was a central sort of tenet of Paul Hurst's, our manager. He sort of said, like, everyone's got to be in the same boat. And that has got a kind of strength to it and a power to it. So, yeah, a great achievement. And, like, look, Wrexham is a fairy tale because it's a confected fairy tale. But it's, you know, it has the whole Hollywood sort of sheen and glamour to it it's very very different and has been expensively kind of fuelled so this is very different and as I say as impressive achievement as we've probably seen in the last I don't know decade because because of the odds that you've had to overcome really even at League One level to do it Yeah just one final thing to you because you mentioned it there in terms of kind of the team spirit and stuff I wanted to ask you as a former player because I think the kind of community aspect of the way the club is run also feeds into the dressing room and the playing staff as well.

9:59Speaking to people at the club, various points in this season kind of stand out, had the big run of Christmas fixtures, and then they gave all the players about three or four days off. Good gap, we were out of the FA Cup, and someone at the club said all the players were back in after two days. They just wanted to be in training. They wanted to be at the training ground. They wanted to be there. And other factors, you know, you mentioned about, you know, the spirit of the changing room. James Collins is one of our strikers, you know, towards the end of his career, really important player. Did his knee ligaments, I think, this season, out for the entire season, contract coming to the end of the season.

10:37The club gave him a new contract for another year anyway, to be like, we will look after you, we will help you through this recovery. and again from people I've spoken to they said what that did for the rest of the players it said we're in this together this is a family this is a team this is a proper team spirit and I've also spoken to people who said that that then goes out elsewhere when players have left the club they've then spoken to people who may be joining the club well what do you think of Lincoln and oh yeah go there does that exist amongst players where that kind of network that connection can have a massive difference because I'm thinking as well about the idea that maybe you go into the championship we might have to start bargaining and begging people for some players on loan maybe we'll start getting that word of mouth that it's a good place to be it's

11:24Gregor Robertson: a good place to go definitely I mean players know when no know what a good club looks like they know what a sort of exciting ambitious club looks like and and actually a well-coached club looks like um you know i was even just looking at well this is a sort of different context i think looking at some of the comments about you know coventry are getting very close to the end and there were a lot of people very excited to to work with the frank lampard and edwards and the coaching staff there and a lot of people have stayed in the summer because of that when they had opportunities to go to probably to go on to do bigger and better things that will give it another year this is a good place to be and that's what that's proven to be the case and i think i think that's actually been the case at Lincoln for a while I mean even go back to Michael Appleton and there was a feeling about the way that you guys played then you got some really exciting players on loan Brennan Johnson Morgan Rodgers like you have if you have a reputation within the game then that does help you in that regard but it also attract it makes you more attractive for when you're trying to sign players as well look you're also coming up against a completely different level now in standard and yeah and wages will become an issue you'll have players some of your players will be offered great riches compared to what they're on and it becomes a real challenge.

12:43Gregor Robertson: But I back you to compete. Yeah, well, we've got to wrap up the league title first, Gregor. We've still got plenty of chances to mention Lincoln on the EFL show, but we'll leave it there. Delighted to have been there behind the goal at Reading. As I say, go and check out that winner from Jack Moylan, see if you can spot me going absolutely mad in the crowd. Let's wrap up League One as we've started there, Gregor. Cardiff City in second place two draws over the Bank Holiday weekend just one win in the last six for them Bradford, they've got a game in hand though on the teams below them but Bradford picking up two wins there on the charge in third, Bolton and Stockport we mentioned them in the preview show what a big weekend it was for them they both won on Friday but then drew against each other on Monday so the playoff picture kind of looking as it was but I think maybe just a question for you on Cardiff I've bigged them up I've seen them this season I think they're excellent maybe some of the youth that they've got under Brian Barry Murphy may be starting to tell a little bit of inexperience potentially in getting over the line do you still think they've got enough to see off a challenge from either Bradford or Bolton well it's going to be interesting because their next their next three games are Bolton Huddersfield and Reading who are fourth eighth and ninth like all definitely very you know in the playoff hunt so that's a real test then it becomes a little bit easier for them afterwards, but that's a real test.

14:03Gregor Robertson: But actually, the thing is, if you look around everywhere, Bradford are the big winners, being the only team that got two wins over the weekend, up to third. Bolton got four points from Plymouth and Stockport, which isn't a bad haul from those two games. And their running is ridiculous. They've Cardiff, Stevenage, Huddersfield, Bradford, and Luton. Every game there is against a potential playoff opponent. So, everyone's playing everyone. Stevenage even, and they've still got a game in hand. Their next three games are Bradford, Bolton and Lincoln. Obviously Lincoln may be on the beach, but he'll also be trying to get 100 points and win the title.

14:42Gregor Robertson: So everyone's playing everyone. It's a bit mad, really. I think Cardiff will have enough. That's probably because everyone around them is going to be taking points from each other. I think really the likelihood is there's one place still up for grabs. because I think the top five will all be, obviously Cardiff looking for second, but then Bradford, Bolton and Stalkport, I think will make it. And then you're asking for Stevenage, Plymouth, Reading, Huddersfield, and Luton are still in it after winning two games back to back over the weekend. Big, big results against Peterborough and Wimbledon. So all to play for, but I think there's one place to play for now in the playoffs, and it's very, very hard to call who's going to take it.

15:32Yeah, proof that there's still plenty more to talk about in the League One promotion race. Let's just finish with a quick look at the bottom. In the preview show, you said that Blackpool could finish it, really, by beating Exeter on Friday. They did just that, but then lost to Stevenage, who, as you say, are chasing the playoff places. Exeter then went and ended their 15-match winless run by beating Doncaster 3-0. So it's not quite over yet, but you're still sticking with your thoughts that it probably is extra and that the teams above them, including Blackpool, Wigan and the like, will survive?

16:02Gregor Robertson: Yeah, although, I mean, it's been interesting how the table is taking shape over the weekend and the fact that, like, if you think about Blackpool, Blackpool are on 48 points in 20th place. And this weekend they play Peterborough, who are in 13th place on 51 points. So, if they win that, then, you know, it drags Peterborough into the next. The only thing is that Blackpool and Exeter have only got four games left, they've played 42 games and there's teams above them who've all either played 41, Barnsley have even played 39, Peterborough have played 40 so you know time is running out for them, that's the big issue and Exeter this weekend have the Devon Derby which is a huge game, huge game for both teams because Plymouth are still chasing the playoffs then Stockport, then Burton Albion who are still not safe and then Bradford so it's a tough run and I'm not sure how many points any of them are going to take now there's not, I think on the one hand you think it's going to be quite a high tally you know possibly a team on 50 points will go down but the games are running out so I still think Exeter have got a lot to do and Blackpool have shown a lot of kind of, a lot of spirit in the last five games they've won three of them and you know one they'll defeat the Stevenage who are really motoring again isn't a kind of a disaster I think Exeter still have a lot to do but getting their first one in 15 games has given them some hope It gives them the start certainly does plenty more to play for and plenty more to discuss on this EFL Extra show we'll take a quick break and when we come back we'll talk about the Championship see you in a second

17:55Welcome back to this EFL Extra Show from the game podcast at the Times and Sunday Times. I'm Tom Clark and I've got Gregor Robertson with me as usual. Gregor, we were talking about when to record this show, get straight in after Tuesday, and then we thought, no, no, let's wait. There's a couple of big games on Tuesday night and they didn't come much bigger than Wrexham against Southampton. I'm not sure many people, as good as Southampton's form has been, would have predicted a 5-1 away win in this one. Tonda Eckhart's side really, really on the charge in the playoffs. We talked about the top of this table, Gregor, before the preview show.

18:30Because of the way the results panned out, and we'll get into them in a second, Southampton, could they maybe make a charge for second? Am I losing the plot here?

18:40Gregor Robertson: It's not impossible. I mean, the form they're in is extraordinary, really. you know after you would have been thinking it could have been after the Lord Mayor show after that remarkable win against Arsenal and this is a huge week, it was the start of a huge week for them, they knew this and they made a few changes and you saw the depth of their squad but to beat Wrexham so convincingly I mean they raced into Leeds and then Wrexham rallied a bit towards the end of the first half but in the second half they blew them away and so many attacking options so it's not impossible I think again it's when you start to look at run-ins and Derby at home this weekend is a big one because Derby still have faint hopes of making the playoffs and then they've got Ipswich on the penultimate day so Ipswich were the big winners I think of the of the bank holiday weekend getting the 2-1 win against Birmingham in quite kind of controversial circumstances but that meant that they took advantage of Millwall slipping up against Norwich having beaten Middlesbrough on Friday so you know and Ipswich only played one game they still got two games in hand so they are in the driving seat but Ipswich have got a pretty tough run in too they've got the two games in hand are Pompey away who are obviously fighting for the lives and as I said Southampton away on the penultimate day so and they've got Norwich in the in the derby this Saturday so Norwich who keep beating everyone who just made this unbelievable charge up the table there's a world in which Norwich fans having been thinking god we might get relegated will be going Christ why didn't we make some changes earlier on we'd have gotten the playoffs I mean they're only 8 points off it now probably left it a little bit too late with only five games left to play but it's been a remarkable run for a team that we both talked about you know recruitment maybe not right discontent behind the scenes this has been as good as Southampton and Eckhart have been Norwich isn't far behind and Norwich I think they've collected the most points of more points than any other team in the last four months like yeah Philip Clement's done an incredible job like remarkable and yes if the season was going on a little bit this went on like maybe two more games they would think we've got a chance uh but uh i think it's going to be too too big a task now the reason being really that so thampton who now occupy the sixth place are in such good form and hull are two points ahead of them so really that's that's 10 points norwich would have to make up because i think hull are the team the only team that anyone has got any realistic uh like chance of reeling in and i think even that's going to look difficult for Rexham who are four points behind or Derby who are five points behind but Norwich will have a say between now and the end of the season they've got Evertswich to play they've got Hull on the final day they've got Derby in a couple of weeks so yeah and you know whatever happens they will definitely look forward with enormous optimism after what was a kind of torturous start to the season but it's been a lot hasn't Although it's been a peculiar weekend, I think, in many ways, because the way Millwall's result against Middlesbrough was huge.

22:10Gregor Robertson: It felt like that was putting Millwall on the driving seat. And if they beat Norwich, then, as we said last week, Millwall's running suddenly starts to look a bit more favourable. They play three of the bottom five, I think, and QPR and Stoke, who are kind of on the beach. But that defeat to Norwich kind of changed the complexion of everything again. and Middlesbrough are still, you know, really struggling in front of goal, still without Hayden Hackney and they are stumbling. So Ipswich are in the driving seat, but they have a really tough run in and I don't know, I'm not entirely convinced yet that they're going to just kind of serenely walk away with second spot.

22:52Gregor Robertson: I think Southampton might have a say in it and I think Millwall will continue to apply the pressure. Really interesting as well. You think about that psychology as well, when teams start to think about, or maybe we're going to drop into the playoffs as well. Middlesbrough's horrid, horrid run. No win in five, two defeats and three draws. Millwall as well. You just think, can they keep a bit of momentum going? Hull have been in there for so long. You just think, you know, I've spoken to people who are Hull fans going, oh, we don't actually want to be in the Premier League anymore. You know, we're not bothered.

23:21Just good fun to be up here. But, you know, they might then have a playoff chance. And then you think Southampton, Wrexham and Derby still in contention as well. Absolutely fascinating. We should say four points from those two games for Coventry City as well. They look like they're walking away with the title. They can have their promotion to the Premier League confirmed this weekend. I'm sure we'll be discussing that triumph and putting it in context on EFL shows to come. But Frank Lampard's team doing brilliantly again this season. Gregor, down the bottom, not much change. Everyone seeming to draw with each other.

23:52Everyone taking points off each other. We're basically as we were in the preview show. anything you've seen any results any little goals any moments that you've changed your opinion on who might stay up might go down because I think you had Portsmouth and Oxford taking the final two relegation places Yeah

24:07Gregor Robertson: I mean Leicester I think Leicester may live to rue this weekend not you know not managing to to beat Preston 2-0 draw against Preston and then and then drawing with drawing with with Sheffield Wednesday as well on Monday and like Pierce Charles the Sheffield Wednesday goalkeeper was an inspired form he made 11 saves which is a league high this season and leveled with the 11 saves he made against Leicester on the opening day as well so you know Leicester City fans are not a big fan of Piers Charles but as you say Blackburn are the only team that won in the bottom 6 and they look like they're going to pull away to safety West Brom although they let a 2 goal lead slip against Wrexham you know on the face of things that draw and then a draw against Blackburn, not the worst results considering what's going on behind them and Portsmouth Portsmouth via Oxford was a big one and there was more controversy in that, Connor Ogilvie was sent off for a tackle on Stan Mills that was it was on the borderline, it was one that Pompey fans were outraged by and one that Oxford fans would say it was a bit of a reckless tackle and also then Brodie Spencer could well have been sent off for Oxford later on in the game too so a bit of controversy in that Dazelle's 87th minute equaliser kind of meant that as you say nothing much has changed but again it's very very hard to call, I feel that Leicester as I said at the top there may rue this weekend because their running starts to get a lot more difficult and they've still got Portsmouth to play that's a huge game huge huge game only one point separating them but then their final games they've got Hull and Millwall who'll still be chasing chasing the playoffs and Blackburn in the final day who I think might be might be safe by then so as you say not a lot has changed but I feel that Leicester may be the team who will be most disappointed from the results at the weekend Yeah potentially a missed opportunity for Leicester what a remarkable thing it would be to see them relegated from the Championship 10 years on from that amazing fairy tale success of winning the Premier League.

26:29A difficult, difficult time for Leicester City fans. Let's finish with a look at League Two. Gregor, we talked about big games on Tuesday night in the Championship. There was another one in League Two. Bromley 2, Shrewsbury Town 1. A much needed win for Bromley. They'd drawn and lost the two games before that. Cements a little bit their place at the top of the table. 83 points there for seven points ahead of MK Dons who drew both their games over the weekend Notts County just behind them on 76 as well just three points from six for them what do you make of the playoff and promotion picture in League 2 after this Easter weekend?

27:07Gregor Robertson: I mean yeah it's very very big for Bromley because on Friday at Barnett they scored an equaliser in the 11th minute of injury time which when you look back on it now considering actually how poorly a lot of the top five really did over the Easter weekend to come out with four points has suddenly made their position at the top of the table look a lot safer M.K. Dons haven't won in four now Notts currently had a very strange weekend when you think about the way they lost 2-1 at Salford City with all three goals scored in injury time that was absolutely madness so much has been made hasn't there about those West Ham fans in the FA Cup who left and then wouldn't get let back in imagine being a Salford fan who nipped out to beat the traffic unbelievable you missed your side win one of those thrilling matches probably in the history of being a Salford fan but as you say teams not really taking opportunities in this playoff picture near the top of the table well then Nuts beat Newport 3-1 on Monday and that moved them up into third because Cambridge drew both their games I mean they were really They ruled the game against Swindon.

28:17Gregor Robertson: They were 1-0 up. I think that was on Thursday night. 1-0 up until the 90th odd minute. And they really dominated that game. Swindon only a place behind them. And conceded a late equaliser. And then they drew with Lowly Cheltenham. So it's been a frustrating weekend for Cambridge in fourth. And then Swindon just refused to go away. I mean, after that game against Cambridge, they won 2-1 at Walsall. but it was by no means straightforward there was a remarkable finale with Broughton Fletcher Holman 21 year old striker on loan from Wolves and he's a hell of an athlete I mean his 81st minute equaliser was from the goalkeeper's throw I think it was from a corner and the goalkeeper threw it out and the speed of him just charging down the line and I think he took two touches before scoring it must have been one of the quickest goals you'll ever see on a break from a goalkeeper's throw and then another break in 92nd minute and he unselfishly teed up Drinan for the winner so that leaves Swindon still very much in it, they're 5th but they're only 2 points behind Notts County who are in the 3rd and final automatic place and then Salford after that great win against Notts, that dramatic win went and lost to Crewe who are in 8th so again this is another case of everyone around everyone playing each other in the weeks to come really really hard to see who's going to finish where and you know Chesterfield were the big winners getting two wins two 1-0 wins to move up into 7th but everyone behind them has still got a lot to play for and Grimsby have got two games in hand so impossible to call it still really looks like you know one place one playoff place up for grabs which Chesterfield, Crewe, Oldham, Grimsby and even barring it down in 11th or scrambling to finish on the final day.

30:17Gregor Robertson: Fascinating battle at the top and at the bottom. Yeah, at the bottom, as you say, you're talking about impossible to call near the top of the League Two table. The bottom of the table really is impossible to call. Absolutely fascinating. We've got Harrogate bottom on 33, then Barrow also on 33. They're the teams in the relegation places as it stands. Newport just outside on 34, then Tranmere 36. Crawley with a big win. in the first game on Friday. We teed that up in the preview show, but then defeated on Monday. They're on 37. Barrow and Tranmere Gregor both got games in hand. They could be massive at the bottom of the table.

30:55But as you mentioned, it's this time of the season, particularly in League Two. Anyone can beat anyone. It's a terrible time to bet on football. If you're thinking of having a flutter, do not do it, especially in League Two. Don't be putting any accumulators together. It's just a waste of time. But it really is looking fascinating, isn't it in these final weeks Greg and I've just noticed have you seen what the final game of the season is for Barrow and Newport facing each other 22nd and 23rd currently whether it'll still be that tight on the final day we're not sure but there's just no way of calling it is there absolutely no way of calling it

31:29Gregor Robertson: none of the bottom five won on Easter Monday and only two of them won on Friday as you say one of those was Crawley's win against Newport another was a really surprised win for Harrogate against Grimsby away at Grimsby so like this week Newport play Harrogate on Saturday, that's 22nd against 24th, there's only a point between them, so these head to head games are huge because like none of them really inspire much confidence of picking up enough points anywhere else and as you say that game between Barrow and Newport looms large in the final day and Trammy are plummeting. Trammy have lost 18 of the last 22 games.

32:13Gregor Robertson: A lot of stick coming Pete Wilde's way.

32:20Gregor Robertson: It looks to me like one win might be enough for one of these teams. It's a really, really poor bottom five. Crawley's win there takes them up to 37 points. Who knows, that might be enough. That's as mad as it sounds. It could be a really low tally this year. so fascinating and as I say more head-to-head games starting this weekend Newport v Harrogate is another humdinger so they've had really disappointing one against Crawley and can they bounce back against Harrogate this weekend we shall see There you go tantalising prospects for fans of those teams at the bottom of the table Gregor Robertson says it could just be one win from either your four or five remaining games towards the end of the season we'll be back with another EFL extra show very soon to look at how things have panned out in the coming weeks Gregor Robertson thank you very much for joining me as always.

33:07Thank you too for listening as well as the AFL show. We'll be back with a regular show on Thursday. We'll see you then.