Amorim Under Pressure & Scholes Calls Out Arsenal! | The Overlap Fan Debate

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1:58I've got bigger fish to fry I want the league I don't think United have any of that In any position No, we went through this Right

2:12Hello and welcome to the new Fan Debate Brought to you by Skybet And this week I'm joined by Scolzi and all the fans as usual Where's your Shane? You're on the quiz Yeah, I'm nervous You're nervous? I'm terrible about quizzes Terrible about quizzes you're terrible alright well I've got the questions for you here oh Scholes he's got the thing here yeah we're on so you've seen it before you know what goes on yeah for sure how long you've got to go so we don't need to go through that okay so we've got 90 seconds okay name the player that has scored the most goals for West Ham in the Premier League McAntonio okay who was the only West Ham player to score a penalty in the 2006 FA Cup final Koczki no how many West Ham players have won the Premier League Golden Boot

2:56Pass I'll give you that It was none Who scored the winner Who scored the winner For West Ham When they defeated Man United 3-2 At the last game Of the bowling ground Winston Reid Yes Five non-British managers Have taken charge Of West Ham In the Premier League Name four of them Slavin, Bilic Pellegrini Lottegi Oh One more Who's playing for Chelsea Zola Zola Yeah Jared Bowman scored the winner In the 2023 Conference League final Who played the through ball? Paqueta Which World Cup Golden Boot winner Played for West Ham in the Premier League? Yeah I'm not good at World Cup Pass again Paulo Dicanos Sporting caught the ball Which Everton goalkeeper went down injured?

3:45Which Everton goalkeeper went down injured?

3:49Pass You won't remember him as crap Paul Gerrard. How many goals did Kevin Nolan score for West Ham? Pardon? How many goals did Kevin Nolan score for West Ham? 30. I'll give you that, 31. Carlton Cole opened the score in the 2012 play-off final, but which Portuguese striker scored the winner? That's 10. How many points did the West Ham manage when they were relegated in 0-2, 0-3? That's the highest number of points. 44. 42. You got seven. They were tough. Oh, she's going bottom Poor effort You had the hardest questions They were difficult Started slow and got worse

4:41Right, loads to get into With the FA Cup A few smiles A few sad faces in here So Flav, I'll start with you out of two cup competitions in four days. Yeah. I mean, I think most people probably would have predicted that. Yeah. But how does it feel on the back of those two defeats now? Pretty bad. Yeah, bad. You know, you go into Liverpool, you can kind of sort of understand that going to Anfield is going to be difficult, that perhaps the first leg was managed properly by Anaslott. We thought, oh, we just beat Liverpool. Getting a little bit there, it's two legs. And then you go to Anfield and actually, this is the actual Liverpool that were supposed to be playing and it was impossible.

5:23The performance, even though it was very difficult, the performance just wasn't there. Yeah, it was bleak. But you kind of, to some degree, thought that it was a difficult result to get. But then you go into Villa Park, at ground actually we have a decent amount of format. We won 4-0 last year there. And it was a similar sort of issues. But the issues you're seeing play out for Spurs are that there are several reasons behind it. And it wasn't just isolated in that 90 minutes. So I wasn't surprised by what I was seeing. You know, the Liverpool game, we were obviously doing the game for Sky. We were really critical of Tottenham after the game.

6:02Yeah, it should be as well. No, but was it the performance more than going out? I couldn't believe how meek you were in that game. I think the problem is, Jamie, right, is that people have got used to seeing that Spurs 11. And that isn't the Spurs 11. That's not the 11 that Ange Positogoglu wants to play. And the injuries, I know people don't want to hear it. The injuries are an issue. But the even bigger issue is they got used to seeing Archie Gray play a centre-back. They used to seeing Beraval play in midfield. And there is the gap between playing at that level. And as you'll know, playing against Premier League regulars and people that are comfortable at that level is gargantuan.

6:41We've become used to seeing Berravar in midfield, but when Madison's on the pitch, you realise he's twice the player of this kid. That's not to take anything away from these players. It's just that it's almost impossible to play the way we are with the playing staff that we have. Now, the question is, why don't you change the way you play? Why don't you become more pragmatic? And you could argue, all right, we'll replace Postogoglu for David Moyes if he wasn't at Everton. Would he get more points with this group than Postogoglu currently? Yeah, probably would. probably get a couple more wins, a couple more draws.

7:12What happens when our players come back? Do you want Postal Coglu with that group of players or David Moyes? And the answer is Postal Coglu. So while this is difficult, while it's almost an endless barrage of abuse that I'm receiving on a daily basis, I see the bigger picture and I'm kind of hanging my hat on that in the hope that it comes true. Sorry, Joe, but I think it was the manner of defeats, wasn't it? More than anything, they were quite tame, weren't they? when you we think about autonomy yeah they can see goals but they look like they can score goals for most of the season that seems to have gone a little bit this last couple of weeks on Thursday night against Liverpool you didn't look like you were going to score at the time look Anfield is a tough place to go you're playing against probably the best team yesterday again it was really tame and a cup tie but you still look like you're going to concede loads of goals there is massive issues and again it's the idea and the way he wants to play and the midfield being what it was means that we are going to continue to get exposed until these players come back.

8:14It's just, do we have the... Is there a will within the fan place and in the football club to see this out? And it may take till the end of the season. It takes essentially to when van der Ven and Romero come back. Will they come back? I don't know. The messaging coming out of the football club is really vague. We don't know whether they're going to be fit. When van der Ven played 45 minutes against El Spog the other day, he didn't look right. He was kicking the ball. I think they just have to be careful this time because they brought him back that many times and they broke down straight away.

8:42Did I see Romero was training as well a couple of weeks ago? I was thinking, God, don't bring him back. You probably need to strengthen up all the next couple of weeks to try and just make sure they're right this time rather than going back to the early. To what end, though? If we finish 15th or we finish 9th, it doesn't make any difference, really. What we've got, all we've got for the rest of the season is Europa League. That's a month away. Can you get these players back and prioritise that competition. If you win that, optics are very different for the season. I mean, probably the best season I'll ever experience as a Spurs fan if we somehow win the Europa League and finish 15th, which tells you everything about Spurs.

9:19That's a really good point, though. You've got a month to Europa League. It's important now you get them two back. Even if they're ready now, I forget about it. Just give them an extra two or three weeks when they think they're ready. Give them that extra two or three weeks more and get them ready for that. Sorry for that. I listened to Ange coming in on the radio. It must have been his interview from after the game. And he was talking about... He mentioned it a little bit, almost like a little bit of an agenda against him. A little bit. It wasn't a big thing he said. But he almost said, what these players have done for us in the last two and a half months has been fantastic.

9:52And if you're not saying that, your analysis is skewed, basically. And we analysed him. Do you feel like when you listen to Ange on the radio, do you think he's fucking talking about me? Yeah, yeah. Do you? I'm just having a puppy, yeah? But suddenly you do think, well, OK, what have we said? Have you gone too far sometimes? But the way he described it, I thought, you lose every game. So you can't say it's amazing. Because his point being was, these same players are having to play every three days, and I get that. And what you've just said there is young players. I think we've said on this show, for me, don't change that post a cogler you've got to let him get his players back but I you know we played every three days didn't we and if you get beat it was amazing I know there's injuries I get that but I still look at it and think it it's still not enough even though for all the mitigating circumstances it should still have been a lot better than this and even though Anfield is tough I looked at the team he picked and I think it was almost it was probably the team I would have picked if I was post a cogler and we've almost said are we always wanting to you know play great football but he went to Anfield no number 10 he only has people between the lines it was almost like going away in Europe that's what it felt like to me and that's probably what I would have done so I wouldn't be critical of the team he picked but the midfield just didn't put a challenge in being aggressive and then I watched yesterday and it's almost a flip and within one minute the right back is closing Villa's left back down straight from a kick off and the next thing Villa go from the scoring and I'm just like what is this?

11:29I'm like Yeah, I mean, Pedro Pauro lives literally, like he's marking the goalkeeper. It's crazy how far forward he gets. And it is an issue. And you'd have seen the amount of times we get exposed on the other side of the pitch. It's a part of his tactics, the way he operates, and he bakes in that to his tactic. But when you see it get exposed over and over again, it can be frustrating. But to be fair, you saw what Liverpool did at the weekend. When you make wholesale changes, it has a massive impact. And Spurs, I know people don't want to hear it, It's boring. I'm bored even saying it. But we've had to play like that since November, more or less, buying a couple of games.

12:07And if you think that that isn't going to impact your domestic campaign and cup competitions, then it's foolish, really. And I think, just to answer your question quickly on what you said about Postacoglu's comments, to me that was just him protecting his players. There's an element of just moving the narrative away rather than him saying, this is a fine performance. What have we got? Something like 36 points from 36, something like that in the league. It's not good enough. It can't continue. Any other football club, he'd probably have been sacked by now. So I'm surprised he's still in the gym.

12:39At what point do we start blaming players? Because they have to set responsibilities, don't they? You talk, you made a really good point about Porro there. In the first minute, he's bombing on it. He does it all the time. Every chance I saw, and there was a lot of them, were in that channel where he was. We know that little inside left channel. Ramsey kept getting there. It's happened probably. At what point does he think, I can't keep doing that? I'm getting destroyed back here. We're going to concede goals. Where's the centre-half say, come in, just stay here for five minutes. Where are you going?

13:10You've got to take responsibility at some point on the pitch. We're having looking at your manager. I just think it's a little bit, and I never want to be one of those people who says, oh, we used to do that, because the game moves on, the game's better, it's quicker, all these different things. But I just don't know. I sometimes think information gets given to players about we've got this game plan. And whatever happens in the game, it's like, no, the manager's told me to do this. So I think if that was when we were playing, away at Aston Villa in a cup tie, early on from the kick-off, you'd have your full-backs in it.

13:41Let's get through the first 10 or 15 minutes. Then we'll start maybe pressing there. Once you've had your first... I bet your potter probably hadn't even touched the ball. By then, basically, I bet there was a lot of Tottenham players who hadn't touched the ball and were getting beat 1-0. You know, straight from the kick. I just think that sort of game management, that's always been my criticism a little bit of the manager, Poster Coglu, just smelling what's going on in the game. And you can't always have this idea of what you want to do and playing exactly the same way, no matter what the game state is or who you're playing.

14:09A way of Villa under massive pressure. People are talking about if you go out to the FA Cup, he might lose his job. I don't think that was going to happen. But you want Neil down after a minute. Do you think it was an inexperience? Did you see an experience on that? Is it a system issue? because if you look at our starting XI, you've got Archie Gray playing out of position as an 18-year-old. You've got Mikey Moore, 17-year-old, on the left. You've got two brand-new starters in Danso and Tell. Beraval, 18, in midfield. Isn't it sort of... Isn't it kind of understandable that these mistakes are happening to some degree?

14:40Yeah, you can, but you've still got a little bit of experience around it, haven't you? You think of Sonnet, Fronzo's experience. Benton Coe's an experience player. Now, they don't look like they're helping the players around them. I think Jamie makes a good point about players listening to instructions to the manager it's almost tunnel vision to go out he's told me to be here I can't think for the self on the football pitch which is a big difference You said something in the last episode last week Paul you mentioned about how Fergie gave you the freedom to operate that you had a you had a formation but it was up to you to make the right decision at the right time how much was it just like go out and play do you think?

15:16No it wasn't go out and play of course it wasn't you were in a structure you were in a a formation, normally 4-4-1-1 or 4-4-2, whatever you call it. But he never took the freedom away from you. You think of players like Roy Keane. Everyone sees him as a disciplined number six player, like your McAlealy. He wasn't like that, he was bombing off everywhere. But as long as everybody's filled in, so I couldn't go and Roy go at the same time. You had to make sure there's a gap filled. It was common sense, really. I think Tottenham do have a structure, but it's that, defensively especially, they're not that bothered about conceding chances because they think they're going to score.

16:01They think they're going to be attacking all the time and it needs to experience the right... Look, if Romero's there right side centre half, he might be one saying. I haven't seen any evidence of that. I think back when Jamie moved, don't go back to... If Jamie's right side centre half or a right back, if he's right back, he's not going anywhere. He's staying there. and if they're getting exposed by his right back, he says, fucking stay here. Don't go anywhere. Away from home in a tough game. So there has to be structures to it, but players have to think for themselves. The manager's told me this, I'm going to do this, that's that.

16:32Things happen differently during games that sometimes the manager might expect. I just think players thinking for themselves is something that's gone out of the game. Flav, I want to ask you, if you notice, the Spurs fans are probably more with Poster Coglu than they are maybe with the chairman. You hear it on the TV, and Levy out and stuff like that. Do you think that has any effect on the chairman? Do you think that would make him think, oh, this is not the, you know, it's happened before. And if he was to make a decision in terms of the manager's position in the next sort of few weeks or months, who are Spurs fans actually thinking about right now?

17:06I think actually they're not thinking about the next manager. They're not thinking about... There are segments of Spurs fans that think that he's not the right manager and they want him out for sure. But this growing sentiment and the issues that we're currently experiencing is Daniel Levy and putting pressure on him. Is he going to leave, I mean, he owns 20 % of the football club on his own, so no is the answer. But can you put pressure on him to change the way he operates, potentially? And there's a movement called Change for Tottenham that's happening. There's going to be some activity before the game against Man United at the weekend and fans coming together to express the disappointment in the way Daniel Levy is running the football club and you can find him on Twitter if you want to find out more.

17:46in terms of a name if Postacogli wants to go or if he gets sacked rather. Flav, sorry, can I just stop you there? What is Daniel Levy doing so badly? I think you just have to look at the two decades of his tenureship and think that structurally... You've gone a long way. Yes, we have come a long way. The stage and training ground, the business side of it is brilliant. I know that needs to catch up on the pitch but I don't think it's for the want of not training. What for me it comes down to is that there's an idea about what Tottenham are and how they're going to operate in the transfer window.

18:23And that's what fundamentally all of this comes down to is can you buy players or get managed in better than what you have currently? And if Tottenham and Arsenal, who are on an even playing field in terms of revenue coming into the football club, can't operate in the same way, then there's an issue. And that's what we have at Tottenham. The key motivator for Daniel Levy, it seems, based on the evidence over the last 20 years, isn't about, first and foremost, about what happens on the pitch. It's about the infrastructure around them. I disagree with that, though, because you talk about bringing better managers.

18:53He brought Conte in. Unbelievable manager, successful. Jose Mourinho. Pochettino, at the start, was probably not... He turned out to be a brilliant manager. Look at the transfer window. Mourinho, you bring Mourinho in. In my opinion, at that time, it was probably the most ambitious move Tottenham could make, have made you look at the transfer window his first two transfer windows and they're appalling they didn't back the manager he didn't give him everything he needed to win when your trans wage spend is so far below the other top six our top five clubs in terms of you know be a big six if you will it's so far below how everybody else operates and you're paying the most to watch your football team play there's going to be a discrepancy between how the fans feel about the football club and and who runs it he has to answer to some degree he doesn't have to he never will but there has to be questions asked of how when he's running his football club if there isn't then what's the point is what's the point of Tottenham Hotspur currently what is it when when Arsenal went in for Declan Rice there wasn't a great deal on the pitch between Tottenham and Arsenal there wasn't a great deal right heritage wise in terms of trophies one I understand there's a gap as difficult as that is to say it's the truth right so at that time there was one club who had a sole intention in order to move forward, and that was Arsenal.

20:09And Spurs continually were happy to stand still. Is there any world where Declan Rice, a player of his calibre, is first any world where Tottenham go in for him, and secondly, is it that he comes to the football club? The answer is no to both those things. Why is that? In all honesty, with Declan Rice, if any player around the world has to choose between Arsenal and Tottenham, they're going to choose Arsenal. Right, but that needs to change, and that can only change with Daniel Levy. It can't change with fans clapping and singing and getting behind him because he's built a stadium. The stadium is lovely.

20:41Why does it have to change with Daniel Lieber? Why does it change with the manager and getting the right players in? It all comes from him. If a fish stinks, it stinks from the head. He's done great work building the revenue for the football club. You know what? I wouldn't mind Daniel Lieber at our club now. You'd have him. Well, I wouldn't swap him for Ratcliffe, for sure, yeah. I'd keep him, probably, instead of Ratcliffe. Would you swap Ange for Amarin? no so the case in point would you yeah you wouldn't right but would either of us swap those managers with David Moyes no he would get more points than Amarim's got for Man United David Moyes would wouldn't he nah he would you know we went through this right you know we went through this innit

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22:11Go to Upwork.com today and start hiring proven freelance talent fast. No bulky overhead. No rigid long-term contracts. Just the right expert right when you need them. Work smarter and faster with Upwork. Go to Upwork.com now and find your freelance expert. That's U-P-W-O-R-K.com. Post a job for free and get started today. Thank you for calling the Bombas Comfort Line. Bombas make socks, slippers, tees, and underwear made with the highest quality materials. Press 1 for comfort, 2 for style, 3 for donation. You chose style. Bombas is styles for whatever you enjoy. You can run in Bombas, lounge in Bombas, dress them up, dress them down, but always give back in Bombas.

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23:30Tara is a Mochi member compensated for her story.

24:00They're like legends. You're hard as, mate, hard as. Are we excited? Oh, yeah. Vicious rumour is we're recording a podcast called Stick to... Rugby. Stick to rugby, that's it, not football. Not football. I couldn't think of a better group of old men that I'd like to hang out with. A brand new podcast that dives into the game we love like never before. Stick to rugby. We'll talk rugby, but not the usual chat. Mike Johnson, hard as ****. Get it out of here. We'll cover the big talking points, but we'll share the great stories too. I lost once in Scotland. It was the worst day of my life. And then I appeared on the front page of the news the world the following week.

24:39Look at Flats there, holding a ball. He won Man of the Match once and didn't touch the ball. Big opinions. The number of people playing rugby is going down and down. And then when that needs to change. And some wicked guests. We need to widen the audience a bit. Who have you got in your Facebook? Jude Law, Ray Winston, Daniel Craig. Madonna. And that's a wrap. Wrap. This is the one rugby podcast you can't miss. Make sure you subscribe to Stick to Rugby, brought to you by Defender. Right, let's get to Gareth. Plymouth 1, Liverpool 0. How are you feeling about that this morning? Look, it's always disappointing, isn't it, to lose.

25:18You don't want to see your team lose. I said on here the other week as well, to me, any bit of silver with red ribbons on it is a good thing. seeing that on an open top bus and you stood there with your son and all of that, brilliant. So we've got one less chance to bring them on home. But I think some of the stuff's over the top. I think the team he put out was more than capable and you've got to be looking at some of the players who are on the pitch and asking them why they performed in the way they did. So, you know, Arnestlott puts a team out. He doesn't tell Simakas to play so many bad crosses.

25:51He doesn't tell Chiesa not to be able to beat a man all game. you know all of those kind of things there's enough there to beat a team bottom of the championship the other thing is and I'm probably going to take pelters for saying it but we've got bigger fish to fry and I want the league I want to see Liverpool win the league with us in the ground you know I said this the other week and it's such a huge thing I've been waiting all my life to see it I've seen us win the FA Cup we won the FA Cup the other year under Jürgen Klopp and look I like the FA Cup I love all the aspects of it in terms of non-league clubs getting a bit of revenue and giant killings, which this is one.

26:31But I think what he did and the discourse around it doesn't recognise that, you know, Liverpool have been playing midweek weekend since November. And we've burnt out before when we tried to win everything. And so I think they're never going to say it. no one at Liverpool is ever going to come out and go on the record and say we didn't really see it as a priority I'm going to say it you'd say it I don't know but you know Slott's not going to say it is he like afterwards he's interviewed he'll be thinking it it's not a bad thing though I thought looking at it because I came on this show I think about a month ago and I was gutted when Man United beat Arsenal that worried me from a Liverpool point of view in terms of the league because I think the last couple of years when Arsenal have challenged really pushed City close for the league.

27:20I think a lot of it, because I've always thought City were a level above Arsenal, but I think Arsenal have gone close because they went out to the cup competitions really early. I think even the Carabao Cup. I think this season's probably the first time they've had a decent run, got to the semi-final. I think the year before you got beat away at West Ham and we beat you in the cup. And I looked at when Arsenal went out to United, I was thinking, oh, that could be a problem. I thought we'd go far in it. And I actually think yesterday was just a great day all round. Great for the FA Cup, giant killing.

27:48great for Plymouth and it's I think it's really good I think it's decent for Liverpool I was gutted to be clear we know this more as well yeah I was gutted I think the way I look at it does that give Liverpool more chance of winning the league and I think probably a percentage of it probably does yeah because now we're going to have a free weekend when we likely would have had another game you know it's not the free week you know what it is I think I think it's the difference between the Carabao Cup and the FA Cup is the Carabao Cup besides the final it doesn't affect your league game So Liverpool now, because of the Carabao Cup final, have got to play Villa away and City away within four days.

28:22That is not easy. You can go to Villa and draw 1-1, tough game, 1-1. You can go to City, Haaland does some score. You've got to use five points. Do you know what I'm saying is, just because a game getting put in a position where you think, oh, Villa away, City away. I think the FA Cup can have, maybe, is it three of them? Definitely the semi-final and the FA Cup final means you've got to move. Where does it go? Where did it go? I agree with what you said here about yesterday. is probably a good thing but then you think about momentum you know what I mean you lose yesterday and all of a sudden there's a little bit more pressure on your Wednesday and if you drop points on Wednesday you think shit that little bit of momentum we had where everyone's going into games winning and winning it does put a little bit of pressure but I think you're probably better out of it I do I think Wednesday for me I think Wednesday is the biggest game of the season so far absolutely and we've got five games in 15 days.

29:17So I think if he put more of the stars on the pitch yesterday and then they're getting injured, what would we be sitting there saying today? Why did he go so strong? Why did he put Van Dijk there? Why did he put Mo Salah there? So to me, the logic is obvious. I think as well around the logic, again, you would never get this on the record from someone at Liverpool. But history shows that winning the League Cup and getting to the FA Cup final wasn't good enough for Kenny Dalglish to keep his job. they sacked him because he didn't do well enough in the league in their view. So Arnazlott surely knows that as well.

29:52And again, he's not going to admit it, but there is a priority in terms of what competitions are. I mean, look at the money as well. We don't like to talk about that as fans and we love all the romance side of it. But you win the FA Cup, you get two million quid as the winner. In the Champions League, you get 1.7 million per win in that league stage. Liverpool have already banked about 30 million quid out of the Champions League so far. It's not about money though is it winning the FA Cup? It's not, no. But I think it's got to be a consideration in terms of how the clubs run and maybe conversations behind the scenes that we're not privy to.

30:29So are we saying the FA Cup just doesn't really matter anymore? If you're going for the league just bin it off. No, I just think if you're one of the teams who is going for the league and the Champions League it can. It is, it's fair. I mean listen, City won the treble, but up until a couple of years ago, there's only been one team in English football who'd ever sort of won the three trophies. And I think Liverpool twice in the last four or five years have had this thing of like, well, probably three times now, including this season, or the quadruple. No one's ever done it because it's virtually impossible.

31:01But the thing that's killed Liverpool is, in the last few years, they won the Carlin Cup and the FA Cup, but they lost the league and the Champions League, the ones that they really want. and last year ended up just with the Carabao. So all this idea of winning all these trophies, they never ended up with any of the big ones. You burn them out, don't you? Because one of those finals against Chelsea when we win the two Cups for failing the big ones, if you like, I can remember being there at Wembley and Liverpool were in extra time and they couldn't run. They were just waiting for penalties. They were hardly crossing the halfway line.

31:34They were just knocking it round. They were done. They were gassed. and they were like, we'll try and win it on pens. That's how goosed he were at that stage. And that's what playing this many games does to you. So I think you're spot on when you say we've now upped our chances of winning. What does it say about the squad though? If you're going into the Premier League, Champions League run, you're going to need a big squad. Your squad can't beat. I think one of the reasons he got slotting though, if you look at his track record in Holland, him and his team have got a track record of keeping players fit.

32:04And I think that was one of the considerations for bringing him in. I was with an Evertonian at the weekend who said, why are none of your players getting injured? I mean, that's not strictly true because Trent is, now Gomez is, etc. Curtis couldn't come off the bench at the weekend because apparently he had a bit of a knock as well. But injuries have derailed Liverpool's seasons before. I mean, it was a miracle that we won that League Cup last season with the players that helped us get there and players that are on the pitch in the final, etc. And I don't think you can rely on miracles. You've got to try and keep your best players fit.

32:36and I think that's what he's doing. So it made sense yesterday for me. It made sense what he did against PSV as well. No one likes to get beat, but there's a bigger picture, isn't there?

32:52But Gareth, you were, you've got another podcast as well, haven't you? Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You had a few things to say about Manchester City, didn't you, this week? I mean, can you elaborate on them? and we've got a Mr Man City next door to you. It's just a theory. One of my mates has had this theory all season. He's like, if you look at the bet on odds, for some reason, and I don't know the reason, I was merely speculating on my podcast, but for some reason City are about 16 to 1 to get relegated. Seen that, yeah. And it's like, well, why is that? It's because everyone wants to bet on it, don't they?

33:28So everyone here, besides me, probably wants City to get relegated. If it was an option, and betting odds aren't necessarily just about what are the chances it's going to happen, it's about who's putting money on it. And if 10 ,000 people put£100 on City to go down, it's 3 ,000 to 1 and it happens, you're going to have another Leicester situation. So, yeah, I've seen that. What do you all think in the City bubble, if you like? What do you all think is going to happen over these 115 charges? I think the majority of us are pretty confident. We've come into these charges... You and your mates in the pub a little bit.

34:00Are we confident? The thing is, it's two years now since these came up. Since the owners came in 2008, it's been nothing but good. Even around the ground, you look at the developments, every facility is the best in class. We were on fire last week. Well, I think that was vandalism. That was the account department. Yeah. That was good. Since the owners have come in, they've not put a foot wrong. The only one question mark is the Super League and why we joined that, but I think that was a 50-50. If you look at that from their choice to join that, I think the hand was forced a bit, and obviously every English club came out of that, thankfully.

34:43I think everyone's got a bit of confidence. You look at the transfer window we've just had. We just spent£200 million. As I said a few weeks ago, we didn't spend much in the summer window at all, but we've spent that now. Is that not a sign of confidence from the board? Is that a sign that you think you won't be able to sign players in the summer? I mean, that's one take. Some people think, you know, is it going to be a transfer ban? Are we getting the numbers in now? But one, we need them for the rest of the season if we want to get in the Champions League, if we want to win anything. And two, I think it is a sign of confidence.

35:10You wouldn't go shelling out 200 mil if you were going to get relegated next year, would you? But it was very unlike City to kind of, like, I think Mahmoud looked quite good, but there's only really like 18 months of him being a very good player. And normally they're very, they like to scout people, like to take their time, like to bed them in. you're just chucking what's his name Kusanov I thought he was really good at the weekend he came on and scored to be fair in order to his head yeah he's been flinching but yeah I think I'm pretty confident I mean when the boards say they've got irrefutable evidence every City fan I've spoken to are all confident they're all a bit is there any City fans going I'm shitting it I think we're done I don't know how the thing is I don't know how I get that everyone everyone's like how?

35:56just by reading those emails the thing is though I'm confident because I've not got a reason if somebody if somebody consistently never let you down would you would you expect the best in them or the worst in them I don't know I'm not sure if I can say this but Ramos and Vandridge never let Chelsea down but he let a lot of people down I don't have a reason I don't care what's on the table I don't have a reason outside of I don't have a reason to not be confident so I'm confident I mean if I'm wrong I'm wrong I'm wrong are you comfortable beating Real Madrid No. I think the game this week at home, we've got the crowd, but I think we might sneak a win or draw, but I think the away game is...

36:37We've been there. We've been two goals ahead with added time to play and still lost there. We've been the best team in the world, really, and still lost to them. So when we're in this form and this season, I don't think... You've got a chance, though. Real Madrid... I mean, in a cup competition, you've always got a chance. I can't see how you stop them scoring. yeah I don't think we do I think it will just be a basketball game to be honest I think they've got a lot of injuries they've got there's a few players that I mean I'm clutching at straws a bit they've got about six players if they get a yellow in the first leg they'll miss the second leg so oh the dark out so hoping Grealish is a it might be over by then yeah I mean it could be we could get done 3-0 and I was speaking to one of my mates and I said we said like even City we're confident yeah if City won 3-0 would you say we were through guaranteed because I wouldn't well talking about the Champions League we've got Quinny in from Celtic he's making his debut and big game for you against Bayern Munich yeah one that many people fancies to do well in which is quite reasonable given everything but I've got to be optimistic about these things between us and City for who got Real Madrid and who got Bayern Munich and I think both teams have got lots of injuries in defence.

37:56So, you know, you can cross your fingers a wee bit with that, can't you? What are we thinking up there Celtic-wise? Obviously, you're at Posta Coglu. Brendan Rodgers come back after obviously getting a lot of stick, moving to Leicester and that. What's the feeling around Brendan Rodgers at the club now and how Celtic are doing? I think overall it's completely turned from when he first came, like when he was announced as coming back. There was a lot of mixed emotions back then because of how he left, you know, mid-season. and I was saying to the guys before we started, by all accounts, if he didn't leave in the way he did, the achievements he had was statue territory, quadruple trebles, invincibles and everything else that went along the way.

38:33We even drew with City and Champions League group stages and stuff like that. So to leave that in the way he did and then come back, there was a lot of mixed emotions around it, but it seems like the club over the last couple of years has really put a lot of time and effort into trying to level up in a lot of different ways in terms of infrastructure, are scouting. Obviously a lot more of our players are getting transferred for better transfer fees now which is lovely. And yeah, it feels like a lot of it has been driving towards maybe a little bit of the Champions League reformat that we've had.

39:01Certainly has benefited us when it's all. When I think of Celtic Champions League and European competition I think they can beat anybody at home. Not a problem. But they've always got to beat away. It seems like they've gone a little bit more solid away from home. Would that be right? This year it's been brilliant for it. We've got to draw 0-0 away to Atalanta and Italy has been the place where if something bad is going to happen to us it's away in Italy so to get a draw against Atalanta as well who are like And has it changed anything? Has it been more defensive when he's gone away from home?

39:29In Atalanta there was a big difference you could see that there was still the same shape same players and that kind of thing but there was much more of a focus on kind of what we were chatting about with Spurs and that earlier that's what I was getting to change the script a little bit but for the rest of the matches yeah it's been kind of the same but I think that's one of the things Brendan does kind of give us a little bit is that kind of Premier League level of expectation and you know like there was a real come down a real kind of drop off a cliff when he left because it basically took a Premier League football department out of Celtic into Leicester you know we're talking about 10, 12 members of staff or something like that so it really does lift the level like the floor on everything that's getting done and yeah there's been so many improvements away from home getting good points Zagreb we drew we probably should have beat them I think it was quite a team match the Atalanta one was fantastic and you know Aston Villa a few weeks ago wasn't great but it was kind of the battle of the B teams in some ways we didn't have a bench they didn't have a defence and in our day that could have went a little bit better Battle Britain matches Celtic have always been great at especially at home obviously it was at Villa Park so yeah Brendan's kind of got all the fans back on board now there's no more residual memories of all that kind of stuff that kind of hangs around and it feels like especially with the way the transfer window just kind of finished for us in January again there's some parallels with Tottenham where everyone's quite firmly in Brendan's corner and everyone's looking at the board going where's the checkbook you know we're missing a few players here sort of thing Does anything get taken away from his achievement at Celtic because Rangers are so bad?

40:59Not really because like as you see with the FA Cup games and stuff like that we were just chatting about and even the result on Sunday with Rangers in Queen's Park Scottish football gets talked down and everything like that in terms of the level and the Premier League is like the top of football you know in so many different ways of looking at it but it's still 11 men versus the living men. You know, there's still referees, which again, we could talk about that in Scotland probably for a full day, I suppose. So, like, yeah, there has to be context around it, but it doesn't diminish it at all because, you know, the complacency is probably the biggest part of that you're wrestling with then is keeping everyone on the same level, keeping the appetite.

41:38You must have enjoyed that yesterday though. Is that one of the biggest shocks in Scottish football of all time, that? Yeah, probably. Well, it's funny because the Rangers fans were putting around oh it's 25 years to the day since Inverness and Celtic you know and so they're probably the two biggest upsets so it's quite funny that they wanted the remainders of that and then had a taste of their own medicine later on but yeah it was a huge shock like Queen's Park are the oldest club in Scotland used to like their home stadium used to be Hamden and now their stadium now is like it's just like a lot of stand you know like 2 ,000 or 3 ,000 wherever it is so very very small club modest resources and yeah it was a laugh factor in Glasgow yesterday

42:22day.

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43:59Alex, I want to speak to you now. there's a big game on Wednesday night even though your team is not involved I'm sure your eyes will be all over that do you think the Merseyside derby on Wednesday is almost make or break for you in some ways in terms of belief that Arsenal can still win the league it's been a weird season because that is the framing it's been Liverpool the whole time and it feels like we've been waiting for like a lift off point and we almost had it with City with the 5-1 and then we go and lose to Newcastle and I think they're like 14 unbeaten but nothing feels like it matters because of what Liverpool are doing.

44:40It's such a weird campaign. We've sort of shot ourselves in the foot in various areas and stuff but I think the Newcastle game was kind of the microcosm where you watch us shoot ourselves in the foot with the rye pass which I'm sure you love and you also see Alex Isak pull out an unbelievable moment of skill and that's the difference. You know what I mean? and I think we're sort of talking about Spurs I think sometimes other teams can tell you about your team and I think Arsenal I've sort of been resisting for a while being like yes we definitely need that number nine we definitely need that forward you sort of go no no if we move that player around we do this whatever and you come to a point you just go do you know what you just pay for that talent you do that you get over the line and that's it and that's what everyone's been saying about Arsenal for so long I'm like okay I think it's time I'm really bored of watching Arsenal same honestly it's the same thing every week without a centre forward without a centre-forward and Saka who brings excitement and skill and can win a game on his own and you beat your cities 5-1s yeah but you need these big centre-forwards these big game players who can get you them little 1-0 wins and I'm really struggling watching it I think there's some lovely football and it's nice but it's not exciting because there's nothing at the end of it Declan Rice I'm a little bit not disappointed with him because I think he's been put in a place where we don't really know what he is anymore.

46:00Is he that holding midfield player? Is he the one that people have heard Gary Neville say he should be the one getting forward scoring goals? I've never seen him that way. I think he's almost become a little bit stuck in not really knowing what he is and Arteta knowing what he is. I think those two things are related. I think a lot of Arteta's game model is about squeezing the pitch and just getting you in that final third. And he uses Rice to do that, so he's the one picking up second balls, he's the one grabbing everything. he's not necessarily dictating the play and if you know if you want to spend £105 million on a counter-pressing machine basically and Declan Rice fine but I would prefer myself go back and forth I like him deeper and I'd like to see more on the ball but I think what you're saying about sort of being bored yeah and you go back and forth and you sort of oh yeah but if we move this player or if we do that or you know but ultimately you just need attacking talent like it's that simple Saka's a big mess here yeah yeah it's massive I think he hasn't played since before Christmas and he's still the most chance big chances created in the league.

46:59Is that not a corner? You know the talk about Isak there's a lot of talk about Isak and of course there's almost like this feeling that like Arsenal are going to sign him or like Arsenal need to sign do you think are you looking at that as an Arsenal fan I think that's realistic that you can just go and buy Isak from Newcastle he's got like three or four years left on his contract. And the reason I say that as well because I think Liverpool are desperate for a centre forward if I'm being totally honest but there's no talk about Liverpool getting him I don't understand with all this Arsenal sort of talk.

47:29Because Liverpool needs one as well. And if Liverpool win the league, if he was to go, surely you'd pick the team who won the league, if Liverpool won the league. I don't get this. It feels like maybe it's me seeing it on social media or something. But that's not realistic, is it? We're still cashing the on-retax. Is that what it is? Yeah, he wants to be the number 14. I think you have to look at options and where he could possibly go. I think if Newcastle don't get Champions League, I think it's a possibility. I still think it would be... Would you pay$100 million? What would that be,$130 million?

48:02You'd pay that for you, is that? I think it depends on whether they get a Champions League or not. It's not achievable if they don't get a Champions League. And I think if they don't and he forces, it will still be over$100 million. And then whether you do that or not. But supposedly Arteta loves him. Well, everyone loves him. That's just what I was saying. I don't see a possibility of going to Arsenal. I don't. I think he has to go to bigger and bigger. I think you talk Real Madrid, too. Liverpool need to centre forward Yeah I hear that I think Arsenal are one of the options but I think if you know City have got Haaland Madrid have signed Mbappe I think there'd be an option but I think they'd be down on the list as an option I don't mean that in a bad way I'm just thinking is that Newcastle a really good team brilliant team but they're not going to win leagues they're not going to probably win European Cup and that's the next stage of his career and I think it'd be a risk to go to Arsenal and do the same thing.

48:55Now Liverpool have got a much better chance. Manchester City have got a much better chance. Real Madrid, Barcelona possibly going for it. I just think his sights should be higher than Arsenal. Again, I'm like, it's because you're not having a go at Arsenal, but you haven't won the Champions League. It doesn't mean you can't win in the future, but when you think of those clubs, you don't think of Arsenal as a Bayern Munich or even a Man United. You don't picture them as Champions League. You've still got to conquer that. he is a player that Manchester should have been would have been looking at there's no shadow of a doubt but in the position we're in now oh no he's absolutely he's not going to Arsenal 2 kick on to that next level it has to be it has to be a player of that level and they have to aim to do that whether they can or not is it possible this is kind of the point I'll back Arsenal I think he would look at Arsenal and I think he could be that player who takes us over that line and that might be enticing to him I don't know I don't know him but you know we totally agree with that well I agree with that yeah he could be you think he's better than Arsenal yeah I think he'd be brilliant for Arsenal I think he could possibly get you over the line but I just think there's bigger in him there's bigger and better in him Alex I want to ask you a question about obviously it's a week or so ago now the celebration the Haaland thing and I was quite critical of the young man I just wanted to know what the Arsenal fan base has taken and I know your defend your players that get that but was that almost seen as you enjoyed that sort of personality that arrogance do you think it was like maybe a slight problem yeah I loved it when it happened obviously you know it's your player I think the problem is and I understand it from now I try and think of it like if I wasn't an Arsenal fan what would I think and I'd think come on I would but I'm an Arsenal fan so I love it and for me within it I think it's important for players to express them so you know how often do we sit here on these sorts of panels and say, the game's lost characters, and, you know, where's the Zolas and these guys?

50:55And then he does it, and then we're all going, well, don't do that. So, you know, I love it, but I get that some people would be like, well, you haven't won anything, you're 18, whatever. But it's football. I don't think it's that deep, really. The bigger issue wasn't necessarily Lewis Skelly. He's just a kid, and he's, you know, he's living in the moment, whatever. It almost felt like it overtook your entire football club. This one moment that Harland, the flashpoint, at the end of the game where he says, be humble, be humble. And it almost, everything, it was just everything. They got him to prove his point.

51:26And then, I'm playing the song at the end. I feel awful. What gets missed is Harlan said who the FAU. Yeah, but he's won everything at 24, 25. He's probably the best striker in the world. What I didn't get, right, is it felt to me, because I was there, right? Obviously, I'm obviously going to be annoyed. We've just lost five, one. But to me, I'm 21. The City fans are older, younger than me, whatever. But I've seen everything. I could go now 60 years it's mental I've seen everything there's a good chance you've been in the month I could go another 60 years and not win anything and what I didn't get is like it felt you know in WWE and stuff when they have those like big like they've got 15 belts lined up and it's like the winner takes all you really watch that no no I don't watch that he's in it I'm just saying you know when you see all that stuff lined up and the winner takes all no you don't it felt like one of those boxing games where everything's on the line they've just nicked all our trophies that's how they were that's how they were celebrating it was bizarre it's bizarre I did not understand it if that had won them the league or something like that or you know a big trophy I'd have said you know what they can celebrate like that in the changing room what do you think might would they use that as motivation or is that what happened I was just thinking now as you talk about it's disrespectful it is disrespectful from a young player looking as excitable he's younger I get your point but you have to remember I might play against him the next 20-25 times you've motivated Haaland the best finisher in the league for the next 18 games so the next time he scores I'm not sure if Haaland will be that arsed about it to be honest but you can imagine him going up to Lewis Gilley and having a word of him if you were his teammate what would you be saying to him I wouldn't like him doing it to be honest if it was the centre half especially what the fuck are you doing I've got to play against him what's the difference between that and Madison doing the darts signal what remember when Madison someone stole Madison Moe Pye sorry he's an idiot he's just but do you not want that we want it's great copy for us we talk about it but I'm a bit with Scoles we did the analysis on Monday Night Football where you actually see Declan Rice sort of saying to him get back get back this game's not won now I don't think it's a big thing you're going in stone but it's a bit like just be careful slow down and don't forget there was an interview I think the day after or maybe the day before it Arteta was talking about the fact that the two young kids Nwanieri and Lewis Skelly don't actually get changed with the first team players yeah and we've all been there where you play a few games with the first team but even your own manager that's kind of keeping them like don't let them get too carried away but you don't actually change them so that's the point about it it's like even Arteta as a manager and probably a coaching staff was like, don't let these lads get carried away.

54:19They're not even going to be changing with the first team. Stay with your mate. Stay down there. Know your place a little bit. Now, if he'd done that when he was 24, 25, I'd be like, I just think it's that thing of when you're a young kid. But listen, it's a picture he's going to be signing. Oh, he'll have a long time. I love it. He'll make a few quid out of it. Absolutely. And also, when you say, Arsenal took over your whole club, I think that's just on social media. And social media

54:47It could have been We remember Arteta Using Ivan Tony's tweet In the dressing room Yeah fine So wouldn't surprise me If those things did Get into their heads And it is funny like You're going mad about The be humble thing and stuff But you're not top of the league It just feels a little bit weird I'm just saying we're going In Ireland shoes though And looking at it But you're saying we're going mad Who's going mad? Do you mean people on social media? No I mean in general Like they've been going Talking about this Be humble thing And acting Reacting towards it And all that kind of stuff That's the fan base It's almost like Miles isn't on Twitter You took the tie and Robbie That's what I'm saying That's not the players Is it The players are just playing He did it on the pitch He did the But it obviously was In the head Yeah of course it was If someone said to you Six months ago Who the F are you And you scored against him You don't think You'd give a bit And Gabriel screaming In his face And going past You can't You can defend it And I would If it was up You just got to be careful You do it against You don't do it Against the best number nine In the world And I love it as well I love it I think Ireland's around the bend, isn't he?

55:46I love it. See that thing that Virgil did when he... Drinks Monster for breakfast. When Virgil went to pick, I think, with Charles. I love it. I love all that stuff. Yeah, that was good. To keep it in the game. Adam, Man United. I mean, I would ask you a question now. How long could it go on in terms of, not just the results, because you're winning the odd one here and there, but the actual performances carry on going like that where you might start thinking, have we actually got the right man yet? I haven't got to that stage with the manager yet. Do you think you could get there before the end of the season if these performances don't?

56:20The one thing that does worry me is if we were to drop out of the cup competitions and then you'd have nothing to play for. I don't think there's really any motivation in the squad for the league games at the moment. We're fighting to go away 11th. I can see there's no motivation in those games and it comes across in some of the performances. So I think the cup competitions are really important for us this season, especially with the added bonus that if you can do something in the Europa League, you'll somehow make sure you're in the Champions League next season, which is really important, especially when you look at the PSR issues the club are facing, potentially looking at selling some of the younger players and things like that, which is very unlike the club that I've grown to love over the years.

57:01It is important that you get into the Champions League and winning the Europa League could put you in that position. and I think I was looking at the financial stats of how much Liverpool have already made this year in Champions League revenue like it's massive for clubs to be in there and I think if we were out of the cup competition I think that's when people start to worry a little bit but I'm I'm impressed with the manager but the football needs to get there I don't think it's happening now I'm not at the point where I'm thinking it's the wrong decision because it's coming to a mess and it still feels like a mess but there has to be with the league not so much the league form the way they're playing even in talking about cup competitions there and a big concern for me as I said to you before Jamie we've been crying out for a left wing back they buy one and it tells me his head's a little bit fried it's a little bit confused at the minute he plays in right wing back and keeps Darlow I did feel like that was maybe kind of like a Luke Shaw Jose Mourinho thing where he kind of just kept him on his side so he could speak to him because he didn't have any training sessions with the club.

58:11Maybe he should have walked around to the other side. Yeah, just crossed out by the line-up. How did he know he was going to win the toss-up for the kick-off? That's a good point. We always kick towards the Stratford end of the second half, JT. It's a good point, actually. I was going to ask you, when you talk about the performance, you've just mentioned the wing-back. So that, when you're wanting to sort of believe in your manager, you look at those things I saw Manu playing like as a false nine the other day and I know he'd said in the week he thinks he's more of a number 10 than a centre midfield he's not as good defensively as whatever and then he puts him as a father just little things like that if I was manual it'd worry me a little bit you know be thinking as you said with the new player playing on the other side Manu's position there are a few things that are concerning I think there's a lot of stuff he needs to do we all know that especially in transfer windows but there's no I don't see a core of players I say when you get I think when you look at teams you look right down the spine of a team Liverpool great goalkeeper great centre-half forwards midfield player whatever it is I don't think United have any of that in any position I think a new goalkeeper is needed possibly two centre-halves two centre-midfield players and two centre-forwards I disagree I go for one cent of midfield for one cent of foot but with a bit of stature a bit of quality and really create a spine when you've got that spine right I think Jamie then you can add bits to it now I think Maynou he's lost I talked about Declan Rice being lost before I think Maynou's lost as well I don't think he'd know what to do with him I don't think he knows where to play on a football pitch because he's been played in that what is it one of the number 10 positions he has been played in the two in the midfield, which you can see probably doesn't succeed.

1:00:07I don't think he's the greatest athlete. He's a great footballer. I think the number 10 does suit him the false nine. Never in a million years. But that spine, that core is so important. If they don't get that right this summer, this might sound ridiculous. But the form, since this manager's been in, they could be looking at being in that rally game. The form's dreadful. I'm telling you, it's been so bad. I think I look at the Cabemeno thing, I think he does suit the 10th position better. I think when you look at all his good moments for Manchester United, the goal against Wolves, Liverpool, the cup final performance, a lot of his good things have come in the final third from that left-hand side.

1:00:45So I think he does suit that a little bit. Playing him up top in a false nine, that felt to me like it was a bit of a message towards the board with the transfer window just closing. Yeah, because he's got the two centre-fours there and he didn't play. Yeah, but at the same time, you say we need two centre-backs, we need two midfielders. I do disagree with that. I think I've started to I like what I see from Lenny Yarrow I think he'll grow into the game I think he's a good footballer good centre back look he's a young player but I haven't liked what I've seen so far really did you see the Southampton game he had a bad one against Southampton but I think those are learning curves sometimes players are just going to have you yeah but he's one centre and a half I would keep when I'm talking about bringing that Spaniard team two centre and a half he's one that adds into that you're not right do you think he didn't beat him from the first you always see the fans I know I've been surprised by that because I think...

1:01:34Where your ambitions are when you say rating, I'm talking about getting a team to win the Premier League. Are you going to win the Premier League with De Ligt in Euros? You're something else? I don't know. I think there's been many players over the year, Eagle, how we won the league with some of them. I do think these players are quite good. What about that Lionel? Are you going to give him a new deal? Tell you what, he got away with one bit. He was like all of us just had to get out of Old Trafford on Friday. You just said, you think they're quite good. No but I do I think if Matt is to you've got a player there Lissandro Martinez unfortunately injured I don't I don't know if we can rely on someone like that He's not good enough to win the Premier League with Maybe Lich I do think De Lich is a player I think there's a player in there I think he's a good leader I think he plays well from the middle and I've been impressed with him since he His age and his amount of clubs already concerns me I do disagree You disagree?

1:02:26He's brilliant at Ajax He seems to be getting worse as he's got over the thing. Bayern Munich, Juventus, they've let him go for some reason. Adam, you know the change of schools you're talking about? You know, we probably all agree Man United probably would need seven or eight players to go straight into the team if they were going to some challenge, you know, for, you know, probably even Champions League positions. But what is realistic? I mean, do you know the financial situation probably a bit more than us? I mean, what is realistic that Man United can do in the summer? I think once you sell a few players, and I think it's important, that's why they're looking at these academy players because once you sell them, it's pure profit and you can spend like 3x that amount in that transfer window.

1:03:04That's why I think that we're looking at Garnaccio potentially leaving. If Marcus Rashford does leave United and we get 30, 40 million for him, I think we'll be in a similar position. I think it will be looking at some of those younger players maybe making their way so that we can free up some funds. But I think over the last two or three years, our wage bill has dropped massively. The amount of players we've been taking off the wage bill and I think that will continue this summer. You've got Lindelof who leaves on a free. I think Casemiro will be off. I think a lot of these players that are on big money will be off and a lot of them have already left.

1:03:34What did you think about them taking the option on Maguire? I'd sell him in the summer. I think he's done well. I was in to see his score and allowed us to leave Old Trafford after 90 minutes on Friday. I think he has done well and I think he's improved. But he's a bit like Anana for me now where I'm done with Anana and I think Anana is one of those players where he could somehow win Golden Glove in a campaign because he's a good goalkeeper but he's always going to have those moments where he chucks it in his own net we talk about wanting to win the league wanting to win the Champions League I don't think you can ever do anything like that with Anana so I'm kind of the same with Maguire I think he'll have those moments where he'll look good he'll look solid but he's always going to have a moment where he sticks one in his own net I think I'd get rid cash in while you can Right Roshane West Ham Saving the best club to all Yes Yes.

1:04:27First time on the air, the fan debate. So, Phil, what are West Ham thinking? How this season's gone? Will Oppa Teague and the change with Graham Potter coming in? I'll start with Graham Potter. A lot more optimism in terms of what West Ham can achieve under him. In honesty, over the past month, it's been a breath of fresh air, Potter coming in, because things were so bad under that teggy. It felt like anyone could just do better than this guy. Like, it was so bad. To the point where West Ham fans started calling him a floppy teggy. he just couldn't get the best out of the team and I must say on the grand part the team looked more energised I know over the past five matches only one win but there's been gradual improvements over the past five games the team looked more organised he's getting the best out of players someone like Pakita for example he suffered an injury a great injury against Aston Villa and the away fans are going oh no don't be injured if that hadn't happened a month prior no one cares because he wasn't playing well under Loptegi and my main takeaway so far from Potter is how good of a manager he is because myself and two reporters spoke to Carlos Soler two weeks ago.

1:05:26He was like, he speaks to us. He pulls us aside for one-on-one chats. He gives us confidence. And that's so important because we didn't see that under Noptegi. And with him, one of his first acts as head coach was to reduce the number of days off for the team. And the plan was that to increase the work ethic, but it didn't have the effect he had hoped. The players became annoyed and it had a big impact on morale. Another factor behind why it didn't work out for him was he kept changing his start 11. They didn't know his best start at 11. You guys are now, as some of the players, you need to have that continuity.

1:05:54He kept checking every game I watched. They made a couple of changes at halftime. You know what? West Ham, Ondar Loptegi, ranked first in the league for a number of halftime changes. So you see the start at 11, you think, he's going to change at halftime anyway. And it happened every match. Every match. And you know what? The match, right, for me, where it all unravelled was the away loss to Tottenham. It was a 4-1 defeat. And in that match, right, Mohamed Koudas just loses his call. Absolutely lost his call. Got a red card, which was meant to be three matches suspension but it got increased to five right and I said at the time there's no way Kudus used to be cool like that if Moyes is manager no chance and what I mean by that is under Moyes right and I know it didn't end in a best fashion but he had that authority he had that authority to play and they respected him and I looked at that bench when Kudus got sent off and not a single member of Lottegui's backroom staff went to see if he was fine if that was Moyes right I guarantee you Kevin Nolan Billy McKinley Johnny Heitinger someone's gone down there to check to see if he's all right.

1:06:50That didn't happen on the Loptegi. And I know everyone here doesn't watch West Ham. But what I'd compare it to, it's like watching a film, right? You watch a film, after about 20 minutes, the film was rubbish. But you think, you know what? I might as well just watch it. You hope it improves, it doesn't. And after about two, three hours, you're thinking, I wasted all this time watching this film. That is how it felt on the Loptegi. Five months is just pure waste. No, it's the truth. Absolute waste. And the board, they won't admit it publicly, but they know they got it wrong. because I often say, right, there's two people on this earth who love David Moyes.

1:07:23Number one is his wife. I'm close second. I'm a close second. I'll always fight that man's corner because he changed West Ham, absolutely transformed the club and I felt he deserved another new contract. They thought it was time to go in a new direction. A lot of West Ham fans probably used to get criticised for the fact, why do you want to get rid of Moyes? People used to always say, be careful what you wish for, which is not a statement I really like about any set of supporters, really because you know the club better than us but were you not one of those supporters who were saying we want a different style we want the West Ham way we want to be on the front foot more No because the thing is really I understand with David Moy he got the club he understood West Ham and the thing about David Moy is he's great at building clubs great at building clubs and if you look back over the past 15 years at Sullivan and obviously the late David Gold had been co-owners whenever they tried to go in a new direction before a manager it's never worked Pellegrini didn't work Loptegi didn't work Like, Bilic, fan-favourite during his time, but it didn't work.

1:08:20I believe, right, I know this is a bit of a controversial take, but the club have always done well when they had a British manager. So David Moyes won the club with European trophy. Prague, a day I'll never forget. I'll never forget. I remember myself, another reporter spoke to David Moyes after the match, and we could tell he'd been crying. And I just felt so happy for him. So happy for him. Before that, you got Allardyce, did well at the club. Pardew, got the club to FA Cup final. Haya Redknapp, John Lau. It's worked well whenever the club had a British manager. Whenever they go in the foreign avenue, this hasn't worked.

1:08:48So I hope with time, Graham Potter can do similar to what David Moyes achieved because I feel like him being out of work for over 20 months was the best thing that could happen to him. And what I mean by that is sometimes as a manager, you're constantly in a bubble. You sort of lose yourself in a way. And he said in a press conference the other day, he had that inner fire in his belly from getting sacked at Chelsea. And when he spent 20 months out of work, he was going to matches, scouting players. He went to the Falklands to spend time in the military. Just try to find ways to make himself the best going pot for his next club.

1:09:21And I believe that'll be now West Ham. Well, fingers crossed that it goes all right for them, mate. Yeah, good luck. OK. Well, that is another episode of The Fan Debate brought to you by Skybet. And we will see you next time.

1:09:39The reason I can do the Malta thing, my grandfather was Vassalo. She's from Malta. but my grandmother's maiden name is Sirio from Barcelona. How do you think I'd have feared playing with Barcelona or Spain? Do you think I'd have carried that off? James Carragher.