Goldbridge On Carrick’s Departure, Poch Is A Long-Term Appointment & Wilcox Staying? | Overlap Daily

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2:24visit abt.com today well Mark I've got something for you you got me a wee pigeon thing last week didn't you I did I've got something for you what's that? it's a jigsaw I'm sure that's you on the front there by the way a younger version of you so you want to tell us all about it? yeah I do ready?

2:49so this is when I first got into the team at Forest I was a young lad who was 19 and obviously I had Brian Clough as my manager and he had a lot of nicknames for me. Right. So I'll give you the nicknames and then we'll get on to this. So he used to call me Shithouse because apparently I was built like a brick one. Yeah. Imbecile. I got that as a nickname. I get that one. Barnsley, which is where I'm from. He used to shout, Barnsley, Barnsley. And then I was playing against Coventry City. It was my third game in the team. FA Cup, third round. We got a corner down that end of the pitch. Yeah. He comes off the bench, rugby shirt, green sweater, remember what he looked like, comes on the sideline.

3:33He's not watching the corner. He's looking at me down the bottom end. And I can see him. He's caught my eye. Right. And he goes, Jigsaw! Jigsaw! I thought, he's shouting at me, mind. Jigsaw? Where's that one come from? I'm thinking, right, it's on my mind during the game. If we win today, I'm going to go and see him on Monday. I need to know what's going on here. We beat Coventry 2-1, so I plucked up the courage to actually go and see him, to ask him about this, another nickname he's got for me, Jigsaw. So to get to see him, you've got to go through his secretary. She rings his office, I go down.

4:19I'm terrified that I'm going to ask him a question. I knock on his door, I walk in and I just like, oh. He goes, what can I do for you, shit house? I said, that's why I'm here, boss, all these nicknames. Right. I said, and on Saturday against Coventry, Jigsaw. Where's that one come from? And then, you know when you're in the manager's office and it's like silence, so it's 20 seconds, silence. and he goes, every time the ball comes in the box, you'll go to bloody pieces, son. So, ends the jigsaw. Yeah. Ends someone's give that to you to give to me. So, I've got a hundred piece jigsaw. I don't know what I'm going to do.

5:10You do the outsides first, don't you? Yeah. I wonder if he actually knew your real name. Did they ever call you by your actual name? No. Never. Never? Never. It's amazing, isn't it? Did you have any nicknames? Eh, no really, nah. Nah. Just, nah. I don't think anybody's a bottle to give me a bad nickname, you know what I mean? I think people were probably too scared. Most people call me Dunk. Dunk or Big Man or something, you know what I mean? Give you a nickname in case you didn't like it. Yeah, well. Yeah, I suppose in a way. No manager would sit with the divers. Nah. Nah, but he was different, wasn't he?

5:45Brian he was totally completely different from a lot of the other managers I suppose it's like he's he's left me with that but it's funny how he's looking at you he's not watching that he's looking at you shouting jigsaw he's shouting at me there's a ball coming in the box I've not come for it I go to pieces when the ball comes in the box and it's his way of like letting you know yeah great manager incredible personality the best mate you would have loved him and he would have loved you guarantee you honestly you're a lovely manager don't you what Smith God bless them Howard Kendall guys like that your guy Brian Clough they're wonderful wonderful managers aren't they yeah you would run through brick walls for them absolutely absolutely as you were a brick shithouse wouldn't you lad a brick shithouse you've lost a bit of weight since then haven't you I have yeah back to my plane weight just under it's amazing what the podcast can do for you you always try and get the timber off you that's not you is it is that you you're no bad looking lad are you no bad looking for a goalie Normally you're a bit punchy drunk, because I've punched you.

6:55This is the Overlap Daily, brought to you by Sky Bet. The biggest stories, the biggest talking points, and the opinions getting football fans talking. We're bringing you right into the art of the action with Sky Bet. Coming up on this week's show, reaction to the second of Michael Carrick, including Mark Goldbridge's take, and we talk to John Barnes about Harry Kane in England. Let's get into today's show.

7:33Big news this morning, Michael Carrick has been relieved of his duties. Joining us this morning is our Chief Football Correspondent, Mike Keegan. Good morning, Mike. How are you doing? Morning, gents. How are you doing? Hi, mate. All right? All good. What's the news, mate? Better than Michael Carrick this morning. Yeah, obviously. Breaking news. Again, it seems to happen to me and you a lot, Duncan. So, breaking news. So, the news, you know, what you're making of it this morning, he went into training I believe so what's happened? Yeah so he's gone into training this morning and Omar Barada has delivered the news that he was clearly expecting and the rest of us were.

8:18United wanted to do it face to face. There's been a lot of criticism of the club because obviously word has got out that Maurizio Pochettino is in the frame to take over and that Michael was effectively dead man walking but the reality of it was that they were in Monaco with Jim Ratcliffe kind of signing off the decision and they wanted to deliver the news face to face so from that perspective this morning was probably as quickly as you could have done it right so you went into training this morning and the news has come we find well it was the inevitable wasn't it where everyone's just been waiting to hear the news um how do you think that he's actually being trekked through all this you know because it seems that he's been going into work, but there's already a manager appointed, already a deal being done.

9:04Seems pretty bizarre. Why not before now? Yeah, it's difficult. I think United wanted to get the replacement lined up. They wanted to get the Ducks in a row. So I do have a little bit of sympathy with them there. They could have handled it better. They could have told him after the Villa game that this was done, but they wanted to get everything signed off and they wanted to do this face to face my information is that this has actually now been two weeks in the make in the making uh it was over a fortnight ago united got a call from somebody to alert them to the fact that pochettino had a release clause in his deal with the u.s men's national team and they've been pretty unanimous since then but obviously it's not done until it's done and it's taken until this morning to deliver the news to Michael and if you're Michael you know some people I've seen some people saying oh well this is you know the way the treatment is a disgrace why would you not just walk but you guys will know if you're under contract you're going to get your payoff and until someone tells you otherwise you're going to turn up for work every morning yeah is is Potch a universal um you know is is it what everybody wants because he wasn't even in the betting was he uh when we're looking at the favourites to get the job when Michael was, when it was all the news was out there that he's going to lose his job.

10:25I remember a few weeks ago, he was mentioned slightly, but he wasn't in the running to actually get the job. So how's that actually, how's it happened? What has actually happened? When's the first contact been made with him? So I think it goes back to that tip that United got. I think people just assume that because he was with the US men's national team his contract was to take him through to the next World Cup I don't think they really saw it as an option so somebody gets in touch with them and lets them know that look guys there is a release clause there you know I think it's around 10 million dollars so if you want to do this then it is doable and from that moment on it just makes sense it ticks a lot of boxes for them he's got a track record of working with young players of getting the best out of what he's got.

11:12And he is kind of a statesman-like figure. He carries himself in the way that you'd expect a Manchester United manager to carry himself. And it just, it seems like the logical choice for them. So that's my next question. Will he be given, would he have taken the job or will he have been given reassurances before he actually agreed to take the job that he can actually manage that football club? Will he decide on the players in January? with what's gone on up above will he have been reassured that this is the way forward he will be in charge he'll decide what players are actually coming into the football club or will he just have to work with the players as a head coach he will have to work with the players that he's got and get the best out of them but he's not stupid it's Maurizio Pochettino he's worked at some of the biggest clubs in the world there is not a chance that he is looking at that defence and thinking, I'm going to stick with those and that's going to be my defence going forward.

12:12There will have been reassurances that he will be backed in the transfer market. I don't know what extent that is. I don't know exactly how much money there is. But as you guys know, there are ways of working around it. Maybe they go into the loan market in January. There is an urgent need to strengthen that defence. But then the flip side to that is he will probably back himself to get more out of those players. This isn't a squad that should be 18th in the Premier League table, which is where it finds itself at the moment. massive job on his hands, Mike, yeah? Big job to get Manchester United.

12:41It is, but it's one... He's clearly excited about it. He's got this thing for Manchester United that he's had for a long time. He's spoken about it before. He actually sneaked into the Champions League final in 1999 when he was at Espanyol with a goalkeeping coach. I think they managed to blag their way into the corporate seats. So he's actually been there for that, obviously that historic victory over Bayern Munich. Very close to Sir Alex Ferguson. they've been for dinner before now he gets the club he's gone on record previously to speak about it so it is a huge opportunity for him because for all the nonsense and for all the toxicity and the unrest from the fan base at the moment and the sheer hatred really towards the owners if you're the person who turns that around that's an incredible thing incredible achievement and an incredible thing to have on your CV So for the moment then Michael Carrick's the only one that's leaving anyone else no you know yeah it'll be Carrick and his backroom staff I think they've all been told of their fate as well but Pochettino will want to bring in his own staff my information is there's an outside chance Pochettino might get announced tomorrow one of the things they will have to iron out is deals with his backroom staff and whether he takes the US for the final two games that they've got against Haiti and the last information that I got is they're undecided on that but the expectation is that he will be in the dugout when United go to Liverpool a week on Sunday Some first game to be involved in that is Liverpool away trying to get that team on that football pitch working for him and getting the best out of them it's a massive task what do you think the players will actually make of his appointment?

14:28I think they'll respect him because of who he is what he did in his own career and where he has managed I think they'll like him. I think he'll figure a few of them out pretty quickly. He is big on culture. He's big on fitness, which might come as a shock to some of them. But he's a very likeable personality. I did a couple of Spurs pre-season tours when he was the manager at Spurs. And it's silly little things, but they give you a bit of a picture of what he's like. So we went to the Far East, so we were in China. and this probably doesn't speak well of the journalists that are out there but we're all moaning about the food i remember we're in a hotel and i think the speciality was duck's blood soup and we were like you know we weren't shy in making it known that we were struggling with the food and pochettino heard about this and he basically invited us to a state restaurant i think it might have even been an argentinian state restaurant and at the end of the night he picked the tab up and that's just i know it's only a little thing but he's very approachable he'll go for coffees he'd speak to you if you'd taken the trouble to go on the trip, he'd speak to you over a coffee and he'd give you a bit of decent information.

15:40Just a proper, you know, kind of statesman-like figure, which to me is what you need at Manchester United. Mike, Stunken here, how long's a contract, do you know? How long's Pochettino's contract be signed? How long's it going to be? Do you know? Any ideas? I'd be amazed if it was anything less than three years because it's going to take that long to turn this thing around. And obviously he's got a great contract with the US to take them to the next World Cup. So the deal will need to be right for him as well. So how long do you think they're going to give this Pochettino? How long do you think the board, the people in charge are going to give the guy?

16:16You know, obviously they want this to be long term. But they're going to give the guy a bit of a chance. Because they never gave Carrick much of a chance, did they? Mike, they never gave Carrick much of a chance, did they? No, I think they gave him... How many games has Carrick done this season? Ten. They've gave him 10 games to turn round a bloody sinking ship. Actually, he turned it round last season, didn't he, Michael? Finished third. And done a lot of great things last season. Then they've gave him 10 games of the second season. Are they going to give Pochettino 10 games? No, and one of the reasons they're not going to do that is because I think it's pretty clear, if this isn't a success, then if you're Jason Wilcox and Omar Barada, that's probably you out of the door, as well as Pochettino.

17:03So they will give him a decent crack of the whip. I think they will look at the transfer window and probably admit that they didn't back Michael. You won't be able to judge Maurizio until he's been given the opportunity to bring in the players that he needs. So I'd be, I mean, look, in a world where Manchester United get relegated, then maybe they've got a decision to make. But I think anything other than that, and then you'll see him here for at least next season. it's amazing it's amazing how the people above get they're like cats aren't they they get nine lives don't they the people above don't they but the manager gets gets done in the neck right away ten games they've gave Michael but yet they're still there did they not say they liked the same thing about Amorim was it they brought in a guy from Portugal who played up three centre backs they played three centre backs and they brought him in into the Man United why when has Man United ever played three centre backs but they put Amorim in an absolute disaster Carrick did well for them last season saved them in a way, gave them 10 games, a club legend knew they're bringing Pochettino in you know.

18:07Yeah, that's my next question Mike as well, just to touch on Dunk there Michael Carrick, still be loved by the fans, club legend Yeah, absolutely and Duncan's right, you know, that he will feel that he's been let down in this transfer window and he'll probably make the point that 10 games this season isn't enough. I think it's also worth pointing out that he delivered Champions League football for them last season and all the extra revenue that that brings. So it's like, well, cheers, guys. I've done that. I've brought you the extra revenue. You've not backed me in the transfer market. You've not brought in the players that I need.

18:38We've not strengthened the defence. And then it's me that's packing my box this morning and saying goodbye. Thanks a lot. But I suppose the flip side to that is he'll get a decent payoff. And if you're Michael, you probably take a break now. I think he turned down quite a few different offers that I'm aware of in the Championship before he decided to help United because you can't turn United down. So it wouldn't surprise me if he takes a break and then we see him somewhere potentially in the Championship next year. Realistically, what will Potch be expecting as a league position by the end of this season?

19:13Top 10? Survival? Listen, let's not mistake about this. At the moment, looking at that team, they're in a relegation fight. We shouldn't be saying this about Manchester United, but And we're a quarter of a way through the season, by the way. Yeah, and when you look at the fixture list that they've had, the opening to the season that they've had, it's been pretty kind. Like this isn't, you know, well, they've been playing all the big teams and there's a reason why they've struggled against them. You know, they played Hull already, they played Ipswich already, Bournemouth gave them a good pace. And, you know, this is, as we look at it now, a relegation battle.

19:49And I know that's a ludicrous thing to say this early in the season, but first things first, get them organised. get that defence sorted out and get them out of the immediate danger of an unthinkable relegation. So it's a bit of a free hit, really, for Poch this season. It can't get any worse, surely. It cannot happen. That cannot happen. Relegation cannot be a word that's mentioned around Manchester United. So it is kind of a free hit for him, yeah? I don't know if there's anything free hit, maybe. I get your point because they're at the lowest of the low, aren't they? So the only way is supposedly up.

20:23but they've got Liverpool next week or two each time they've got away they're away to Liverpool so it's not a very good game for the new manager coming in that's why I was a wee bit surprised that Carrick's went because they could I think they could have let Carrick run a bit longer to see how the Liverpool result went but obviously they want Pochettino in to work with his squad work with his team try to get on the training room with them you know but it's some first game isn't it? Of course they're running out of time basically if they get beat against Liverpool obviously they're going to fall further behind aren't they?

20:51Yeah I mean I'd probably flip that I get it. If you come in and you get absolutely spanked at Anfield, it's like, oh my God, what's going to change? But if you're Pochettino, you come in, everybody knows it's going to be very difficult. Liverpool appear to be on the up at the moment and obviously they've got some great players. But if you're Pochettino and you go in there and you get a good pace and it's like, well, this is the starting point. This is what I've inherited and this is where we go from. So this is almost like this is the bottom for us and this is how difficult it's going to be. And you kind of build that into the narrative of the turnaround.

21:26This is where we start from and it only gets better from here. Thanks, Mike. Well, great talking to you this morning. Cheers, guys. Thank you. Manchester United have released an official statement, which I will just read. Manchester United can confirm that Michael Carrick has departed his role as men's first team head coach. After a disappointing start to the season, the club has come to the extremely difficult conclusion that a change is necessary in order to achieve our ambitions. Michael is and always will be a Manchester United legend. Just as he did as a player, he has conducted himself with the highest standards and dedication and professionalism throughout his time back with the club.

22:13His leadership and achievements last season will always be fondly remembered. the club intends to appoint a permanent successor as quickly as possible so what do you make of it mate? I think it was on the cards wasn't it? I think it was heading in that direction I feel a bit sorry for him to be honest I think he did a wonderful job last season although it was last season as you said he won a lot of games last year and he put Man Utd into the Champions League is that right? Yeah they never remembered that very long did they? Finished third just show you about loyalty mate you know what I mean there's no loyalty is there really they've gave the boy 10 games 10 Premier League games now I get it he's only won one so there's been a big drop off for last season but what he done last season they've not gave him a lot of money in the transfer window he's not a miracle worker is he but he should have been doing probably a wee bit better than what he's doing I'm disappointed that they've got rid of him I think they should have stuck with him a bit longer but it looked like it was on the cards the pressure was building on them I think you could see that in the last game I just wonder if they'd beat Aston Villa in the last few minutes if he'd kept his job you know because football's like that isn't it you can turn that around very quickly but no I'm no surprised but I'm disappointed that they never stuck them they're not loyal they're not loyal 10 games man what you done last year give him another 10 games man you ain't done to get relegated big fella are they nah well come on I don't see them getting relegated well you'd like to think that the position that they're in at the moment they're certainly in that fight Liverpool away to come yeah no I get that part it's a big tough away game for them isn't they but you know a couple of results you turn it around I thought they'd have stuck with him a bit longer but I think the writing was on the wall over the last few weeks the pressure was building I think he can be a wee bit disappointed with what's happened to him.

24:18And he is a proper professional. The way he's handled the situation has been absolutely superb. He's going into work and he knows that there's another manager about to come in. So I think a lot of people feel better. Like you say, football. There's no prisoners in football. All managers know the situation. There's agents involved in the game, obviously, as you know. The people get to know. Agents get to know what's going on, who's talking to who, what's going on. He knows himself he was under pressure because obviously he's only won one game in ten in the Premier League. So you're automatically going to be under pressure, aren't you?

24:49But you've just got to go and be professional, go and do your job, do the training, and wait for that phone call. And obviously they've went out to Monaco, I think, to discuss it with the owner, and then they've come back and probably had a face-to-face up in the training room with him, which is nice that they've done that, you know what I mean? And ultimately, the players that have crossed that white line every weekend, every midweek, Champions League, Premier League, they've let them down, haven't they? The players have actually let him down. It's just fine lines, pal, isn't it? I watched the Aston Villa game.

25:18The goalkeeper throws the first two goals in. I think there was a game before when the centre-back, I remember a couple of games before, but the centre-back slipped and they go in. It was just, he was so unlucky, but managers get unlucky, don't they? He just needed a wee bit of luck in his favour. He never quite got it. And as I say to you, I mean, 10 Premier League games and he's gone. 10. Yeah. You know what I mean? It's not a lot of games, is it? It's not. and it's ruthless it's ruthless and who's to say the new manager's coming in is going to do any better he's got Liverpool away would you fancy Man United to beat Liverpool away?

25:52so he's only a bit of hiding right away isn't he? yeah it's a nice start it was a bit like me when I had my first game at Glen Torn my first game at Glen Torn got cancelled because of the weather so we're playing a team underneath us in the league so the weather cancelled because the pitch got waterlogged so then we went away the next week to the team at the top of the league which was cold rain so my first game in charge was a game away Colrain who were at the top of the league and they'd only dropped points in two games previous to that you know what I mean and no that's your luck as it happens we've got a goal in the last minute to get a draw you know what I mean brilliant but it's there you go but no I'm disappointed that Michael's lost his job I think they should have stuck with him and I'm not too sure a new manager coming he'll get a bounce he'll get a reaction Man United aren't getting relegated they're not getting relegated so what are they wanting I'd have stuck with Michael for another and they gave me Christmas This episode is sponsored by Arne Clothing Here on the Overlap Daily we like quality and that's why you'll often see me Gary, Jamie Redknapp and Mark Goldbridge all in Arne Clothing Arne's range is timeless offers great value and you can wear it throughout the day to any occasion Why not check it out in one of Arne's amazing stores?

27:05They've recently opened another in London's Westfield Stratford joining existing stores in Liverpool Poole, Manchester and Kent. Or have a look online. Visit arnclough.com. This episode is sponsored by Hure, the official nutrition partner of Overlap Daily. All right, Stevie, it is that time. We're in partnership with our favourite Hure. We on Overlap Daily, we discuss one less thing we'd like to see in football now because this is your first week doing this. You are going to go first. You set the topic. What one less thing would you like to see? VAR. I want to see less VAR. So by less do you mean gone?

27:46I wouldn't miss it. I wouldn't miss it but I think less. I'm someone who goes to games of football and I'm not just talking from a Liverpool or England perspective here. I'm talking about any game of football I watch. I love referees that let games flow and they're fast and they're intense and you see less of the referees. I just think now with VAR it's become more about the referees, there's more delays, there's more stoppages, more frustration, the crowd, it's just, I'm all for VAR help in the game but let's just see less of it. Does it feel like every time someone goes into a tackle now? VAR, VAR, VAR, everyone's just like, is he going to go to the screen?

28:25It's dominating the game at the moment and there's a lot of stoppages. We're now playing like 90 plus eight, 90 plus nine minutes. It's like, can we just have it for the main things? Can it be quick and can it be swift and get it done and let these games flow? It's a more enjoyable product when the game flows. And then the referee's relying on VAR not to make a decision. The referee's referee the game. It's the same for everyone, just less VAR, less stoppages, less interruptions, let's watch football, let's get the ball in play and get the ball on the pitch. How would you have coped as a player now?

29:01Well, the biggest buzz in football, Becky, outside of winning or winning a trophy is scoring a goal. And I just think now, when I watch my goals or I see them or they come into my life again, I just look at my emotion and my expression and how I behaved. I'm not sure I could have showed that passion and emotion and that feeling, thinking, is this going to be allowed every time you score? Is this going to go to the screen? It must take a little bit away from that. And the best thing on a football pitch, the best buzz in a four-year score and a goal. I just, I'm glad I played when I played. Do you think now in training as well, well you're a manager now, well have been, do you train a player differently now because of the technology?

29:47I don't think you train it different, but you have to make all your individual and the team aware that certain referees and the trends in the game, what's getting given. You have a referee meeting before the start of a season. They come in and say, look, we're going to be stamping down a little bit more on shirt pulling or lunging in, whatever. They sort of set the scene of what they're looking for. So you have to obviously mention it, especially if you have some of the players that have played for me, like Alfredo Morelos. I was going to say, we know your names. You know, Alfredo, there's 50 cameras in the ground and they're looking out for you.

30:24VAR, yeah, yeah, I know boss next minute. Aberdeen, red card. But what I mean is, let's get the ball in play more. The ball's already off the pitch for 30, 40 % of the time. And then you think about the stoppages for VAR. And games are going to 99, 100 minutes. It's like, less VAR, more football for me. Well, the verdict's in. Stevie would like to get rid of VAR. That is one less thing in football. And with Huel, we've got one last thing to think about when it comes to our nutrition. Huel is a complete meal in a bottle, high in protein, high in fiber, with all essential vitamins and minerals. Save£10 on your first order with code DAILY at checkout.

31:05Just go to Huel.com forward slash daily. What's one last thing you would like to see removed from football? Let us know in the comments. Hey, we're Nick and Jack, hosts of The Best One Yet. Behind every episode, there's research, email, spreadsheets, and our shared Google Doc, the headline hammer. With Google Workspace with Gemini, Google's AI is built right into the premium versions of tools we already use, like Gmail, Docs, and Sheets. No new tools or extra logins, just personalized AI for the way we work. That means less time on the work, around the work, and more time finding the stories worth talking about.

31:38Get AI tools for work. Upgrade to Google Workspace with Gemini at goo.gle slash workspace with Gemini. That's G-O-O dot G-L-E slash workspace with Gemini. Hi, this is Robert Mays from The Athletic Football Show. In the market to buy a new car, you're not alone. Navy Federal Credit Union members have a helping hand. Technically, a helping globe. A mission assistant whose mission is guiding you through your car buying journey, offering low rates that can save you more. Your mission assistant helps you budget, estimate your payment, and understand your terms so you roll into dealership ready to negotiate on your terms.

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32:34Hello, everybody. Welcome to Overlap Daily. I'm Mark Goldbridge. Just reacting to Michael Carrick being sacked, walking through London. a little bit like Michael Carrick actually I've got my bags packed and I'm not leaving London well I'm leaving London, he's leaving Manchester but he's got his bags packed there's a lot of sympathy about it don't want to get run over there's a lot of sympathy about it but ultimately it is the right decision I hear all this good lad, legend of the club top lad, all this yes, that was the case before he got sacked that was the case a year ago as Man United manager he's worse than Amrim, worse than Ollie worse than Ten Hag worse than Ranić it's been a disaster of a season so look I think there's a lot of mates there's a lot of journalists who know and like him there's a lot of ex-players that know and like him there's a lot of fans that love him as a legend of which I am but I'm not sympathetic I think it's been pathetic and we needed a change and ultimately look the problem at Man United though is the bigger problem is that people like Jason Wilcox and Omar Barada are sacking him and not sacking themselves they're picking the next manager so I think that's the big problem for United now I'm conflicted about we've sacked managers in the past have been happy I'm conflicted now about whether I'm positive or not because I don't trust these people in charge at all so look Michael Carrick needed to go happy about that but the next stage you've got to be clearing out that boardroom hopefully the owners as well Pochettino I just don't know what to think really better than Carrick but who isn't and oh look there's one of them blue things there Thomas Cage maybe he could manage Man United don't know who he is never heard of him but yeah I heard of Pochettino good coach but I don't know I just think the club's in a mess it's going to be very interesting to see what comes next not optimistic to be honest Listening to Mark there he's obviously happy that Michael Carrick I don't think Mark's being fond of Michael Carrick and he's wanted a change but he also mentioned there that up above is the bigger problem.

34:42What a mess. What a mess this is. It's like... People just don't know what they want, do they? At the end of the day, he mentioned there about he's worse than Van Gaal, he's worse than Amorin. Really? Is he? Did they get 10 games? Did Amorin get 10 games? Did Van Gaal get 10 games? Because that's what they've got. That's what he's really got, isn't he? Yeah. I'm not right. Carrots with 10 games. 10 games. So if they brought an Amorin, or a Broton van Gaal would he give him 10 games and get rid of him so I know he was in last year as a caretaker and he did wonderfully well as I say to you he had a fantastic record last season and this season this season I get it but they've gave the boy 10 games I don't think they ever really thought seeing him as a long term did they because his contract after last season it wasn't I think it was a two year contract so I think he's got after this he's got he had one more year on his contract so it's not really faith I know in a manager that you think you're going to keep for a long time.

35:41Like Mark mentioned there, up above seems to be the main problem here. You go back to the beginning. Big man, it's the main problem in all clubs. Yeah, but you go back to the beginning and let's take it back. Fans not being kept up to date. Listen, whether they should be or not is another thing. Not being kept up to date with what's happening in a football club. Fans being ignored. the players coming out digging the manager out one player coming out digging the recruitment out it shouldn't happen they've become actually they've become a laughing stock in my eyes that shouldn't happen with Manchester United Yeah I know I don't agree with the captain coming out and talking that time but I think Michael and their buddy dropped him for the next game didn't they so no and then it was Martinez before that I get that and when you're losing games it does become a mess doesn't it everything becomes really bad when you're losing when you're winning everything's Rosie in the garden but Man United they've not been winning they've not been winning consistently for a long time he doesn't even the mark there doesn't even know what manager he wants he's now dissing Pochettino he's now putting his neck in line saying oh Pochettino's the one so he's sitting on the fence already so who do they want?

36:50so they don't want Pochettino who do they want now? what do you think of him? what do you think of him? well I think he did a good job at talking to him didn't he? he did a good job at talking to him back in the day he was at Chelsea as well he struggled didn't he? struggled struggled with Chelsea you know he's going into a lot there was problems at Chelsea at the time he's going into a lot worse problems there but he's got a good he's got a good time to go into them it's a good time to go into Man United you're at the bottom you know the only way really is up I know they can get relegated but are they going to get relegated would you put your money on Man United and get relegated I wouldn't be right so they're going to move up the league aren't they so but how far they're going to move up what's their their expectations this season you know and he's saying does he know about Pochettino so who does he know about so there's no there's no there's no certainties in anything everything is a gamble everything is a gamble with every single manager that you bring in everybody's a gamble because nobody knows what's going to happen and there'll be another gamble with Pochettino will they get will they get more time will they get more time than 10 games he probably will get more time than 10 games people say this is a long term plan this is going to be a long term is it you lose to Liverpool you lose again you lose again and what's going to happen?

38:04What's going to happen? They'll get this out. They'll chase someone else. And they'll get somebody else in because that's what they're doing and that's what happens now in modern day football. Nobody's got no loyalty anymore. Show some loyalty to your managers. I'm saying that because I'm a manager now. To my owner, show me some loyalty. But to every owner, show a bit of loyalty to your men, man. And you might be able to build something because the players smell the fact that the manager's got no power because if they play a few bad games or they're mouth off in the press, the managers will go because the players will stay but give the managers give the managers some power in your bloody dressing room man and you'll be better off for it and I know the manager sets his stall out to go and win a game of football chooses his formation choosing his players but at the end of the day them players that cross that white line on a Saturday why are we not talking about them they've got him the sack yeah and you know if they like go and like start pressing on things now and like start showing energy you look at it and you go oh is that because the new managers come in I think What about the players?

39:02I think when the Martinus thing the Man United Martinus thing and the Bruno thing was bad that's wrong that should never have happened because that does cause the manager problems but I'm pretty sure all the players got in the pitch and tried their very very best didn't they? They tried their very very best for the club and as I said to you the goalkeeper threw a couple in last week didn't he? He can't legislate for that Michael can't coach the goalies as well can he? But he can coach his defence he can coach his outfield players and if I was the new manager coming in. They need to make sure they stop shipping goals.

39:34They've got to stop shipping goals. Which goes back to when Manchester United recruited in the summer, front, midfield, nothing at the back. Same back four, same back line. Goalkeeper, is he a Man United goalkeeper? He's not a good Man United goalkeeper at the moment. Well, they've had Smeichel, they've had Van der Sar, they've had De Gea, and then since then, it's like someone's just tossed a coin and said, will get him you get a new job as a manager because the teams are getting beaten you're shipping goals don't you that's how people get their chance because you're losing games so obviously you're losing goals so a new manager comes in he's got to stop shipping the goals and he'll know that and Michael would have knew that as well they were conceding far too many goals so you basically you work on your defence you get your defence into shape and you build for there make sure you're getting hard to beat make sure you're hard to beat I know that's not what Man Utd want to be hearing it's probably what their fans because we're man-united we want to be attacking with full-backs we want to be attacking with wingers but they've got to stop shipping goals he needs to work on his defensive units and then come the summer come January if they've got a few quid if they've got a few quid which I'm pretty sure the new manager come in and they'll be demanding that they go and work on that defensive unit bring in some good defenders and maybe a goalie or whatever I don't know and try to stop the goals they've gone in brilliant and Michael Carrick how will he be feeling right now he's applied himself he'll be absolutely gutted he'll be on the floor yeah because he's a fighter he's a winner he's a man united legend he's done a wonderful job last year and I've gave him 10 games this year and he'll understand football and he understands that he wasn't getting the results and he'll understand that it was probably coming because the pressure went on him but he'll be upset what's happened and he'll take a while to recover for it because the day when you lose your job you sit in your house you don't go out very often you know what I mean you hide away for a long time he'll be like that and he'll be feeling like that he'll be feeling like a failure Sense of relief maybe tomorrow when he wakes up I don't think so Will he wait off his shoulders now?

41:39No I don't think so I don't think so at all I think he'll be hurting he'll be hurting because he'll be thinking about all the wee unlucky decisions that went against him like the goalkeeper and Bruno mouthing off in the press and things like that that's went against the results and he'll learn he'll improve he'll be better for it in the end and someday we'll give him another chance because he had a good record last year at Man United and rightly so and he will get another job if he wants another job and he'll go back in and he'll go back in as a better manager because once you've been hit a few times you learn how to dodge a bit better.

42:16Well good luck to him anyway because he seems a proper human being proper football person good luck to him and hope things turn out for him in the end. Absolutely. We wish him well.

42:32Welcome to Games Gone, Games Back Brought to you by Skybet This is the part where we discuss Three different topics I'm going to attack a joke So your barman is gone, lad Why? What are you doing there? What do you mean? You need to get a wee bit tidied up there, lad What's the make-up artist Between your hair? What do you mean? Have you got that hair on there or something? I don't know I went to the gym this morning And that's what I did What are you pumping? What are you lifting? Not as much as you. But you don't know, because you don't ask what you put your bench press. So, about 65. 65k? Yeah.

43:02How many? I mean, I do four sets of 12. So how many can you do in a one go? I don't know, I've never tried. You've tried? How many can you do? I dare you bit more than 65. Don't ask me, because I don't do it. Can you get 100k? I don't think so. How weight are you? I don't know. You don't know the weight either? No. I'm not an athlete. I don't check. No, mate. get yourself work up to 100k right okay try and get to 100k 100 kilograms one rep max you can get to one rep you know what I mean if you can right let me know when you've got there and I'll double up for you see if we're still here in three years time I'm only kidding I'll do my best you look great mate so the first one relates to your pal Wayne Rooney or our pal the overlaps pal I should say it's ex-footballers on reality TV so Wayne's just gone into the jungle hasn't he?

44:07I want to do it I'd love to do it I'd love to do that jungle love to do it would you? I like it yeah you know like I don't know for a start off I'd lose a little bit of weight there's a bonus you're looking great No, I'm not too bad. Come on, don't be like that. You're all right. You're good. I've seen some on the dancing and that. I think it's like, I think fair play to him taking part. What do you think? Would you do it? I wouldn't rule it out, no. No? Just a 50-pie, wouldn't I? Yeah, yeah. So? Yeah, no, I think it's everybody at their own, isn't they? If you want to go on a reality TV show, you go on that reality TV show.

44:46I think it's an opportunity to bring your personality out as well, isn't it? I think Wayne's going to be amazing. I do, yeah. and he's got to be his missus Colleen hasn't he because she'd come running her up oh did she yeah she's on it wasn't she yeah she was good she was good on it wasn't she really good we're not going to be good we're not going to be good on it we'd be alright us I'd like to go on it because they build a fire didn't they yeah I would like that I love a fire me do you love an open fire I love an open fire and putting the logs on you know what I mean I used to do my granny so I love an open fire I'd be building the fire me but cook a bit that's the only thing I'd be good at cook a bit of cooking on you I cannae cook I wouldn't be able to do the cooking at all What would your luxury item be Or how would they take one item in To the jungle What would it be

45:30A bottle of aftershave Toothbrush Toothbrush Depends if you can take toothpaste as well I'm assuming you can take a toothbrush Yeah Yeah Because it takes some brushing These gnashes might I tell you They look well then mate Paul They come with toothbrushing for a month Because they're You're the reason they're there Perfect land. Yeah. Are we games back then? Games back. Games back. I don't see any reason why we're winning. Good luck to him. Come on, mate. We'll all tune in. I'll actually tune into that now, cos he's on there. We want Wayne to win. Mind you, you don't need to lose any more weight, Wayne.

46:04He looks a million times. He's been working hard, hasn't he? I'll tell you the luxury item he'll want to take in. What? His hairdryer. Yeah, cos he's sleeping. He fucking knows what he's sleeping. You know, I used to room next to Wayne Wright sometimes in hotels and that way. Right. And I would be in my bed and I'd fucking hear the television on and the next minute the hairdryer would be on, you know what I mean? All the way through and I'd be going, what the fuck's next door? He sleeps with a hairdryer on. What, to try and get him to sleep? Aye. Because of the noise? I've not been with my sleep, but I've heard it, you know what I mean?

46:33He puts the hairdryer next to him and he's... Yeah, he does. He has to take his hairdryer in. We're a strange breed of footballers, mate, aren't we? Good luck to him. Good luck to him, yeah. I just take sleep tablets now to get to sleep now. Right, second one. tiny shin pads so I don't know if you've seen there's plenty of players now and the shin pads I know I've seen them my lads got them my lads got them and I cringe I totally cringe I mean they're like that aren't they I mean some boys put a wee patch on kind of like the yeah because it's law to wear shin pads the physios use the physios use like padding for your ankle and all that some boys cut the wee padding out of that and put them in shin pads man it's ridiculous I mean that to me right away is completely is that because no one tackles anymore and they don't get kicked as much as what they do they certainly don't get kicked as much I'll tell you what I'm not having the holes in the back of the socks once one does it everybody does it what do you think don't it's just small shimpads not having it game's gone game's gone game's gone for me really how low are we I mean mid mid right here too bad because as you say they're not tackling that much I've seen boys wear shimpads in training yeah what was the rule Rule at one stage.

47:46When we trained, put the chimp pads on. I never put them on, but some boys had chimp pads on in training because boys were going right through you. Yeah. So the next one relates to the game between Ultingham and Notts County at the weekend. The fog was really bad, but they chose not to play with the orange balls. Right. No. No one could see the game, basically. I don't even think the players could. Was that a good thing? It was a good thing, that. I watched the first half. It was all right. Yeah? First half as well, right? You watched two? No, I just did that. Oldham against two? Notts County.

48:19You watched that? No, what happened was... What did you do with your life, lad? What did you do with your life except watching that? I was in the pub and they only had TNT. They didn't have Sky Sports so Nottingham Forest against City was on the other channel which is an absolute cracker and then Notts County against Oldhampton was on that channel. I had to watch that. Okay. That was my only choice. We used to play in the snow and we used to start with a yellow ball or an orange ball whatever colour ball do we need to bring the orange ball back then? Absolutely especially for for the fog yeah yeah definitely games back games back games back is that right games back yeah games back they need to come up with a new strategy where they put a kind of beeper light something on the ball like a can they make the ball flash so you know it's coming to you so somebody have to invent a flashing ball they play in the fog that wouldn't be a good idea in this day and age a luminous definitely a luminous ball definitely a luminous but orange the game's back that's that many thanks to Skybet for this segment and the game is back two of them were back this week so that's the first time there's a few at the bottom there's quite a few at the bottom it's getting a bit congested down there brilliant cheers guys Hey, we're Nick and Jack hosts of the best one yet behind every episode.

49:47There's research, email, spreadsheets, and our shared Google doc, the headline hammer with Google workspace with Gemini. Google's AI is built right into the premium versions of tools. We already use like Gmail docs and sheets, no new tools or extra logins, just personalized AI for the way we work. That means less time on the work around the work and more time finding the stories worth talking about. Get AI tools for work. Upgrade to Google workspace with Gemini at go. That's GOO.GLE slash Workspace with Gemini.

50:41a quarter pounder with cheese meal. Now $8.

50:47Hi, this is Robert Mays from The Athletic Football Show. In the market to buy a new car, you're not alone. Navy Federal Credit Union members have a helping hand. Technically a helping globe. A mission assistant whose mission is guiding you through your car buying journey. Offering low rates that can save you more. Your mission assistant helps you budget, estimate your payment, and understand your terms so you roll into dealership ready to negotiate on your terms. Mission Assist. Everything you need to buy a car all rolled into one. Navy Federal Credit Union. Our members are the mission. Navy Federal is insured by NCUA.

51:20Credit and collateral subject to approval.

51:32Well, we're really delighted to be joined now by Liverpool and England legend, John Barnes John great to see you mate Hi John How's things? Good to see my old team mate and if I mention Newcastle because of course me and Duncan had a couple of months together at Newcastle but the least said about that the better but you know that's my old team mate Love that you see you John you're looking great pal hope life's treating you well and let's forget a few months in Newcastle there was a few nights out lad wasn't there but let's no go there just like the old days no let's not talk about that so let's talk England then John Croatia tonight should be a game that England will win but the main thing we want to talk about is Harry Kane breaking records breaking Peter Shilton's record tonight sensational sensational because of course I remember Harry I remember Clive Allen with the coach at Tottenham talking about Harry Kane.

52:38He went out on loan to Orient. They weren't sure whether he was going to make it when he was a kid. He went out on loan. But when you talk about somebody who maximises potential and works hard at his craft to achieve what he's achieved now, shows to all the youngsters what hard work can actually give. So, of course, I speak to so many people about him at Tottenham when he was... Tim Sherwood is probably the only one who saw that he had that and had faith in him. But it's an unbelievable achievement. Unbelievable achievement. You played with Peter Chilton, John? as well? Did you think that that record would ever get broken?

53:08Because he's a goalkeeper. Goalkeepers are always expected to play longer but did you ever see that happening? Well, Peter Shilton played with everybody, didn't he? He played with Bobby Charlton from the 60s and he played with me up until the 1990s. So Peter Shilton's got 100. But I'll tell you why it was difficult for Peter. It wasn't difficult but why his record is going to be broken. His record would never be broken had he played all the games because he had 125 caps. Ray Clements has got 67 1169 caps. Peter Shilton was the number two goalkeeper for every one of those caps. Chris Woods had 15 at the time.

53:40Peter Shilton has been on 230 trips with England. So he could have had 230 caps. But as you know, as a second goalkeeper, you don't play. So as much as his record is being broken, he's been on over 200 trips where he could have had over 200 caps. But he can't take it away from Harry because of course, even, and not just in the caps, but also the goals he's actually scored. So of course, yeah, it is well deserved. But I know Peter very well, yeah. John, do you know, Harry Kane do you put him as England's best striker in history because I mean you played against you played with some wonderful wonderful strikers in your England career where would you put Harry Kane mate on the guys you've played with do you put him at the top or do you put somebody else above him because you've played with some wonderful wonderful players mate yeah what I don't like doing is comparing people from different eras of course he's got 125 cast because you're playing many more internationals now than he did A, in the 70s, in the 80s and the 90s.

54:35So you're playing many more games now, so people are going to get more caps. And of course, but from his goalscoring records, and of course, you know, you can't take that away from him. But if you look at someone like Aaron Inica, you look at someone, you know, like one of the greatest strikers, but he never played that many times, what he did, but Jimmy Greaves. So, you know, to say the greatest ever, I never say, I mean, apart from Maradona, you know, Pele, you could put Messi and Ronaldo in that category. I hate talking about the greatest British or English striker of all time, but he definitely will be up there with the best, 100%, yeah.

55:06And so you put Greaves and Lineker up there as well? You put Greaves and Lineker up there? When you talk about finishing as a centre-forward, Jimmy Greaves was one of the best. So when you talk about the best ever, in terms of numbers, yes. It's a little bit like Ronaldo in terms of his numbers, and Messi in terms of his numbers. But of course, you are playing at a time where you're going to play many more games. And secondly, I do believe it's easier now as a striker, because, of course, if you played back then when people are trying to break your leg and it's much more difficult and everyone is creative and you are to do different things.

55:38So I hate to compare errors, but of course, as I say, you can't take anything away from him. Wonderful. And John, Thomas Tuchel, what have you made of his reign so far? What are you seeing from him? Is things improving? Do you see a future tournament of success? He has done everything that's asked of him. England were the number four team in the world, and they finished third. England got to the semi-final, we're 15 minutes away from getting to the final. When you get Thomas Tuchel, you know who you're going to get? You know who the pragmatic manager he is. You know that, yes, had he got room for Phil Foden and Cole Palmers?

56:16No. He likes hardworking players, and he understands that when England play all of these players, they do well in the easy matches, but then when it comes to the final stages, they falter. so he went for a very strong team whereby Harry Kane was going to score and Drew Bellingham was going to assist him in that and everyone else is going to work hard which is what he did and he got to 15 minutes away from getting up to the final so if you expect Thomas Tuchel to be the England manager and us to play in a way that Pep Guardiola or Jurgen Klopp or an exciting manager will play in terms of the football that we may feel we like you're not going to get that so once you get him you get him and you say we put up with whatever decision he takes and as I said up until 15 minutes before the end of the semi-final he nearly took us to a World Cup final.

56:54So, you know, I haven't got an issue with him. As much as I love Phil Foden, I love Cole Palmer, if you take him as a manager, you know you're going to get the players not to fall in line. He's a strong manager who's not going to, you know, shirk from shouting at players or substituting players. Whereas English players that feel they like to, and in English football, as you've seen today with the section of Michael Carrick, the players are more powerful than the managers. And I think England, more than any other country, we have that situation whereby we overemphasize the importance of the players.

57:20And you need a manager like Gareth, who's just going to manage their egos and he's going to rub their shoulders and let them get on with it. Whereas Thomas Tuchel is going to do that. So if you take him, you put up with him. So I like him. I would just say on that, I get all that part, which is right, but he got brought in to win the World Cup, didn't he? Which he never did, but I get he did very, very well. But he also gets paid to make crucial decisions and big decisions when they're under pressure. And there's no much more under pressure when you're playing against Argentina, whether it was with 15 or 20 minutes to go, and he's starting making all the decisions.

57:50so I get the part that he's done very very well but he was brought in to be put in that particular situation without pressure because of his experience and he choked did he know did he know start making a lot of terrible decisions at the crucial time which cost England their game their final is that fair or not why should England win the World Cup England are not the number one team in the world why should we win the World Cup because we're England Do you not think the France manager was brought into the World Cup, the Argentinian manager was brought into the World Cup, and the Spain manager was brought into the World Cup?

58:27Only one of them can do it. So if you go to the decisions he took, if you look at that game, when people talk about throughout the whole World Cup, we're not playing well. We're winning matches because we're strong. We're not dominating possession, we're not playing well. Then you go 1-0 up against the number one team in the world. So obviously after the event that we've lost, people are going, you made the wrong decision. When people say he should have brought on more attacking players, you're 1-0 up, not playing particularly well against Argentina, why are you going to make those attacking decisions?

58:53Now, I did a piece on it, if you think about the decisions that Argentina took, like Argentina brought on loads of strikers, they can think there's space for Gordon, we're going to catch him on the counter-attack they brought on a central defender, a right back and a defensive midfield player, that's what they did, so why is there a need for us now to make a change? It's only when they brought on the centre forward that he thought, 10 minutes to go I'm going to bring on centre backs, because Argentina are going to get the ball wide, get crosses in which is what they did. So as much as it turned out wrong because we lost the game, I think at that moment, the decisions he took were the right decisions to take.

59:25When people say, now we've lost, he should have brought on strikers to catch them on the counter-attack. When you're 1-0 up in the semi-final of the World Cup against Argentina with 15 minutes to go, who's going to take off defenders or defensive midfield players and bring on strikers? So, you know, it was just one of those things that when you make decisions as a manager, you are wrong. But I think in that moment, I thought they were the right decisions. Would you like to play for Thomas Tuchel, John? Would he be your kind of manager? No. But if he's a manager, he picks who he wants to play. That's why Phil Foden and Cole Palmer and people like that, obviously he doesn't like that type of football, but he can fit them in to take them where he wants to take them.

1:00:06So just the very fact that I wouldn't like playing for him doesn't mean that if he's given the job, people have to support him and trust whatever decision he takes. You can't give him the job and say we want you to do what we want you to do in terms of the way we want you to play. If that's the case give somebody else a job. And which of the youngsters that have come into the squad now and obviously Jude's brothers in Job and who excites you out of the young players in that England squad? Well I think that is a very experienced squad and I think that once Harry finishes which he's going to finish very shortly we'll have that decision because of course not only is he our talisman and he's our match-winner.

1:00:43So, of course, you do have Jude, but Jude is not a centre-forwarder. He's going to score the goals. So who's going to come in and do that? I really look at the way the team plays rather than the individuals. You know, you can look at... Listen, I still love the Phil Foden, the Cole Palmers and the Ezeys and people like that, and Max Staumann coming on later on. So I don't think individually we're very competent. Very much like Arsenal. We could Arsenal. I don't think they've got great individuals, but they're the best team in the country because they play well as a team, which if England are going to win anything, I think that's what we have to focus on rather than the individuals.

1:01:13So, yes, we've got lots of good players. I don't want to put pressure on the Rio Ingramoas and the Diamonds and these players to say they're going to come and set the world alight. But I think if we're focused on the way we play as a team, then I think we can do well. Brilliant. And Liverpool, John? What are you making of Liverpool so far? Your old club, obviously. Do you see them as title contenders this season? I don't necessarily see them as title. I think we're a work in progress moving forward. Listen, the legacy of Jurgen Klopp looms large. And of course, Arnaz Slott having won the league, the legacy of Jurgen Klopp meant that he lost his job in the second year.

1:01:48Now, of course, Iroyona has now come in and he has to be given time because you can see the times we play well, the times we don't. We're inconsistent. We spent a lot of money. Verts in the last three or four matches, you can see, is doing really well. Izak has now picked up. The problem we have is when Ekotike comes back, is it going to be Ekotike, Verts, you still got Izak? will that work because we've got so many players who want to play with the ball and it's no surprise to me that he's actually better now that Eketike has not been there whereas before it was Eketike doing well but the manager has that conundrum to figure out and I think the message I give to the fans is that the solution to the problem isn't just to buy players when Arnestlott bought no players we won the league and he bought Endo and Chiesa who didn't play then we spent we spent five players for 400 million and look at what we did and the solution now isn't if it doesn't work to buy more players is really to work with what we have try and get a good balance and move forward but I think the signs in the last you know six weeks have been good but I think that you know Arsenal are too consistent for us really to challenge them this year but I think top four definitely and next year we make a push Well listen mate it's been great having you on thanks for joining us absolutely superb good to see you looking well Fantastic John you're looking well brilliant Paul thanks mate all the best I'll need it mate take care son nice one John

1:03:13Don't, Scotland. Yes. North Macedonia. Rolls right off your tongue, doesn't it? New manager? Yeah, Pogginogny. Pogginogny. Pogginogny. Very difficult to pronounce. What have you made of him so far? It seems to be like a stats thing. To be honest, I don't know enough about him. I know he came out of Belgium. I know he coached a few Belgium under 16s or 18s teams I think he made his name somewhere else was it Germany or something? I'm not sure to be honest I think he's done a couple of scratchy results it's just it's just how can I say it I would prefer a Scottish fella in the Scotland job so I'm getting a bit doing the thing doing the fella for no reason other than that I wish him well I'm sure he'll do well enough they've got as you say Macedona coming up I think it's Switzerland the way or something so he's got a tough away game there I've not actually watched too much of Scotland to be honest here but

1:04:19I would prefer a Scottish boy being in there you know what I mean so I've not got that much interest really in watching following them that much but I wish Scotland well I'm sure they'll get them gone in some way Yeah there's a massive boost because they've got Scott McTominay back. Yeah. Obviously, you had a little bit of a ticker problem. I know, I saw a bit of that in the news the other day. I wish him well. I'm sure he's back fighting fit. It's always a bit of a worry, that, isn't it? I think it happened just before the World Cup, the game in the World Cup, a few days before it. So that would be good that they've got him back.

1:04:50He's a top, top player, isn't he? Why on earth he had to go away? I think his career is beyond me. I mean, he'd have been a wonderful, wonderful player for Everton, for instance, you know what I mean? But he's gone away at the Italy, hasn't he? I'd have loved him at Everton what is their nutty like? There's one team that's actually missing him and that's Manchester United did they let him go? Yeah, it's just nuts innit Ten Hag didn't want him to go did he apparently? Right, okay well I'd have loved him at Everton you know what I mean 6 foot 3 whatever it is he's mobile, he can play he scores goals now doesn't he?

1:05:22Wins player of the year at Napoli Is that right? Yeah, last season Well God almighty so he's a good player isn't he? Listen you've got to be a top player especially when you get a pizza named after you he's got two pizzas one in Glasgow one in Napoli he's got two pizzas Scott McTominay is that right aye aye God almighty the only thing I got named after him he was a headbutt the Glasgow kiss so he's got pizzas named after him aye aye there you go he's a very good player isn't he really good and I wish him well and it's nice it's nice that he's he's also not you know what I mean that's the main thing isn't it aye He's had a scare.

1:06:00He's come back. He's strong. He seems a great lad. I've seen a couple of interviews of his. He seems a really down-to-earth top lad and good luck to him. And there's another record, I think, about to be broken. So Andy Robertson, well, it isn't going to be broken. He's catching it. Right. Andy Robertson. Right. Kenny Dalgleish, appearance record. He's close to it. Fantastic. What a wonderful player, isn't he? Isn't he? Fantastic. He was just top, isn't he? He was wonderful at Liverpool. Obviously, he won everything, didn't he? You're talking about Harry Kane there earlier on, how Harry went around about the fences a wee bit, for his career gone on loan, he went to Leighton Orient or something, and Leicester and a few other things.

1:06:44Most players have got to work really hard in their career. Most players. There's very few who are the best at a young age and continue it. He was, I might be mistaken, but I'm pretty sure that he got the least for Celtic. I think Andy Robertson got released from Celtic when he was younger and he went to Queen's Park and I think then he went to Queen's Park then he went on to Dungeon United and he was at Dungeon United and he started to kick on and I wanted him at Everton another one and then they went to Hull and Maguire and Robertson were in Hull and I remember when their agent was walking through Finch Farm and they were away with one of your CEOs and I was in my wee room doing my thing and they shouted me out Dunk and I come out and it was a sporting director and says, oh, Dunk loves your clients, Maguire and Robertson, he wants them here.

1:07:34So I wanted Maguire and Robertson at Everton when they were at Hull and they were getting a package for£12 million or something for the Bathom, for the Bathom, for Hull. Wow. You would arguably say that he, Andy Robertson, for me, over the last couple of decades, he has probably been one of the best buys of the Premier League, not only for Liverpool, but in the Premier League he was outstanding second best buy second best buy Seamus Coleman was the first best buy but I think he went for about I think it was about 10 million quid and it was like you know what a career yeah what a career unbelievable but fantastic and a guy who got released originally for wherever I'm sure it was Celtic he got released and he went to Queen's Park and found his career makes the story even better that's it and he's got a wonderful left foot and you know why did he leave Liverpool?

1:08:25why did he leave Liverpool? I think, was his contract coming to an end? They must have no fancied him, didn't they? Obviously, his age is catching up. Yeah, but he's still playing the Premier League at Tottenham, isn't he? Yeah, yeah. No, great player. One of the best. One of the best in Sir Kenny's, Sir Kenny Dugliese's record. Is he closing in his record? He is. Incredible. I mean, I know the lads play a lot more games now. but yeah he'll go down in the 1-8 or if no the best Scottish player ever ever really especially in the Premier League what he's won unbelievable what he's won in the Premier League he must be the best player that's come down from Scotland you know in the Premier League he's the type of player that you just want in your team you know he's reliable and how important is him 7 out of 10 at least I've only met him once I was going into I was going into the dentist remember kids you've got to brush your teeth I was going into the dentist I was going into the dentist before he got a filling or something done, he was walking out.

1:09:23We were in the same dentist at the time, he was walking out, and only sat for a second with him, you know what I mean? He said, all right, big man. I said, all right, Andy. That's the only time I've met him, but he seemed a really nice fella. Yeah, well, well done, Andy Robertson. I wish him well. There's plenty more caps to come. Yeah, and just on a little bit more football gossip, just while we're here, what do you make of this one? Kevin De Bruyne being rumoured with Everton. Kevin De Bruyne? 35 years old. Mm-hm. He's rumoured with... He's been linked with a move to Everton. Napoli? Where's he playing?

1:09:55He is at Napoli, isn't he? Is he? Yeah, he is at Napoli. No bad guessing, is it? Scott McComedy won't want to lose him. Yeah, he's been an incredible player, hasn't he? One of the best players ever played in the Premier League. Would he say at Everton right now? I wouldn't see him at Everton, no. I don't think that would be a David Moyes signing. That would be... That maybe would be somebody else doing that, I would think. It's just rumoured. I don't think... To be fair, he's a wonderful player isn't he I'm not sure if he's he would still have the legs for a Moyes team if I be honest with you but quality quality would be the best one of the best ever but I would like him to get more flair players in there he's been a great player because he had a big problem with Jack Villas so maybe maybe that's the link maybe Jack will go back to Man City whatever they'll do maybe they'll look to bring De Bruyne in January maybe to get a bit more flair in there to make up for Jack no being there and obviously little bit more rumours in the Premier League Man United have kind of taken over the talk.

1:10:50Right. From the issues with Manchester City, with the allegations of... Yeah, yeah, the points thing. The points thing, and then we've moved away from that. Manchester United talk has actually taken over from the Manchester City talk. Yeah. Mayo Club Forest last week, 3-1. They beat them. They were outstanding. Dillap. Big Dillap. We've talked about him, didn't we? Two unbelievable goals. He'd have been a good sign of for Everton, hadn't he? This is an example of the manager comes out. The manager came out after they've been struggling. They haven't scored a goal at home. They hadn't won in six.

1:11:21He came out, he went, things have got to change. You're either with me or you're gone. Glasner's basically said that. We're going to do it my way, it's my way or the highway. It's basically what he said. And then they respond from that, from him. They've obviously seen him in the press. And they're going absolutely... They didn't bat on Man City because it was a perfect example that possession doesn't win a game of football. Manchester City had 78 % possession in that game. Man City, 78, wow. And Forrest beat them 3-1. Right, OK. Big Dilap, is he one now that we've got to start looking at? Because I wasn't sure.

1:12:02When they paid 50 million quid for him, I've got to be honest, a young lad hadn't done the business at Chelsea. But his performance against Manchester, he was a right handful. It reminded me a little bit of you, actually. It can happen. I've watched all the goals. He looked powerful, didn't he? He's got a good drive of pace on him, you know what I mean? He's not electric, but he's got that strong run on him and he can back people off, you know what I mean? Yeah, no, he looked a good player, didn't he? And as you said, when you're on form, you are going to start talking about him for England, aren't you?

1:12:30Yeah, so does the manager coming out and saying things like he said, do the players take note and think, oh, this fella now means business? I don't know. No. I don't know about that. I mean, I think people take notice, aye, but I mean, They'll still be playing hard, won't they? They'll still be playing hard for Naughton Forrest, I think. They're fighting relegation a wee bit. I don't know if he's changed his tactical setup or did he go... Obviously, you're telling me he's sat back. So he's sat back in a low block, counter-attacked. He did against Manchester City. They haven't. Forrest have played a lot better than where they are in the league.

1:13:03I've watched every game. They could have beat Palace five and they've actually played okay. Okay. But the problem's been they can't put the ball in the net and he's come good. It's the hardest part of the football, mate, isn't it? Yeah. Saving it's the hardest part, but sticking the ball in the net is the hardest part, isn't it? And you need a wee bit of a break as a manager. As we talked about Carrick earlier on, where he didn't quite got a break, didn't he? Because the goalkeepers threw a couple of looked at boys coming in and tapping them in. You need your goal to make a save. You need your striker to stick one in, don't you?

1:13:33And that's the main thing. It happens in the base boxes. You're crucial, aren't they? Yeah, and with that result against Manchester City, is it safe enough to say we're a quarter of a way into the season now is the league over? Can they be caught? Yeah Do you see them being caught? They are, no I don't I don't I tipped them last year to win it but I tipped them a year before to win it because I knew they were building something and you know the thing about it is they gave Arteta a bit of time didn't they? They gave Arteta a bit of time I'm pretty sure that Arteta's first games in charge for Arsenal or mirrors Carrick's first 27 games in charge at Man United they actually mirror each other wow but they've kept me Mikel they've sacked Carrick but their actual first 20 games in charge are very very similar wow but going back to do I see do I see Arsenal getting caught no can they get caught yes because they can because it's football you lose a few games you're getting caught aren't you but no they're the team to beat and if you finish above Arsenal you'll be winning in the league what a great way to finish today good luck tomorrow night mate come on let's get that first win you need that first win it's so stressful man honestly I don't know why I put myself through it you're going to do it Friday you're going to do it absolutely we'll do it we're at home we're at home it's a big thing I've had two tough away games and they've been tough to the league leaders the first time and then they've had a big long throw mind you when Wimbledon back in the day with the crazy gang and all that you know what I mean they were picking it was a wee tight pitch they were picking the bop and they were playing for throwings so I always tell my players don't kick it out you know when the ball's lying there and the ball oh sorry the ball's lying there right and I'm saying don't kick it and it's like that fuck it they kicked it out you know what I mean and then they picked the ball up and they threw it right in their box this boy was picking the ball man he was throwing the ball into the box he had a half Y line in that so right on top of it but to be fair they defended the box brilliantly I mean the players are putting their bodies on the line we go to the breaks but we've got a home game coming up and you know but hey we can't make the goalkeeper you can't shave the ball for me big man can't you we need the goalie to make a good save and we need the striker to stick one in the net.

1:15:41Same as every Saturday with every manager. You need your goal to make a save and you need your striker to stick one in the net or somebody to stick it in the net. Let's hope next week we're talking about your first win anyway. I hope so. Thanks Mark. Yeah, talk about it. Nice one.

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