Henry Pollock Special

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0:46Today's episode of The Ruck is brought to you by Allianz. They've been part of the rugby family for over 13 years now, backing the game at every level from the muddy grassroots pitches to the biggest stages in the sport. And their partnership with the home of England rugby, Allianz Stadium, isn't just about putting a name on the building, it's about backing the future of the game and the generations still to come. We're proud to have them on board. Let's get into it.

1:27Hello, everyone, and welcome back to The Ruck from The Times. It's Will here. And look at this. It's a two podcast week for you. You are so welcome. And with good reason, as we have a very special guest for you today on The Ruck. Alex and I are up at Northampton Saints, where there's powdery snow brushed across the pitch at Franklin's Gardens and a young superstar waiting for us in the warm inside. you all know him how could you miss him really the celebrations the haircuts the rise and the rise again through saints england and the lions in 2025 it was definitely the henry pollock show but we've not really yet understood the boy or now the man behind it all so we're up here to learn a bit more about pollock a young man just 21 years old next week with the world at his feet loads of things that he wants to achieve in 2026 lots of misunderstandings about who he is how he goes about his business and all sorts else so let's get into a ruck special with a man of the moment the man of 2025 maybe the man of 2026 as well ladies and gentlemen it is henry pollock

2:39okay a belting guest to kick off 2026 for us on the ruck a man who needs little introduction so I won't give him one. It's Henry Pollock. Hi guys, thanks for having me on. Thank you very much. How's everything? How's life? Yeah, good actually. Yeah, very good. Obviously big week this week, so yeah, just very excited. Is it a really exciting time to come back from Christmas? And I know that you guys played and won and the team's flying. You've got six nations around the corner, a massive game against Bordeaux. Are you just looking at the next few weeks going, how fun is this? Yeah, exactly. These are the kind of games you want to play in.

3:12This weekend's massive and then as you said, it kind of just gets bigger and bigger as it goes on through the start of the year. So, yeah, it's been a kind of great start to the year with Saints and, yeah, we're just trying to kick it on as much as we can. Looking forward to a happy, hospitable welcome in Bordeaux of the weekend, isn't it? Hopefully, yeah. Like, yeah, looking forward to their game like I never played down there before. And, yeah, we talk about in Europe loads of times making memories and going on adventures. So I'm looking forward to going down there and, yeah, playing with this team.

3:39How much is the final, before we get on to yourself in the final, just the final, how it played out from a tactics rugby perspective. Does that get referenced a lot in the week? Not too much. Obviously, it's a different squad now. So lots of players have kind of gone, like, you know, Timo Mandovinua, he's gone back to Fiji. Joao Augusto has gone. So it's a different squad, different group. So the tactics probably do change a little bit. But yeah, we're definitely kind of looking at that potentially and yeah, kind of righting some wrongs, I guess. Does it still hurt a bit the way the final slipped away like that?

4:12What do you remember from the game itself and the elements that you were maybe disappointed about? Yeah, it was always disappointing to lose games. Obviously, it was a final, so we lost the final, which was disappointing. But yeah, massive credit to them. They were the better side of the day. They got some world-class players in their squad and unfortunately, we weren't good enough. We had some early injuries in the game that kind of didn't help us. We had, I think, James Rand's first run. He pulled his calf and then Ferbs obviously had that horrific incident with his head. so we had two of our players down before we even got going into our game.

4:42So I'm proud of the way that we kind of stuck in that game and showed fight but I think definitely this time around hopefully it's different. You could have had two tries that day, couldn't you? Exactly, yeah. As I said, two disallowed tries, you know, potentially they go our way. It's a different game but, yeah, we're disappointed from that game but, yeah, full credit to them. They're the best side in the game on the day. We won't dwell on it for too long but what is your memory of what actually happened at the end with the scuffle and all that? Yeah, so after the game there was a kind of push and shove and then also I got kind of choked at the end by one of their players from the sideline.

5:13But yeah, that's kind of all done now. He had his ban and was kind of pushed from there and I just want to credit them for how they played in that game and they were the better side in the game on the day. So there's no bad blood, I don't think. So I'm just looking forward to this weekend, kind of looking right at the wrongs from last year and kind of hopefully win. Did you find it quite funny and entertaining when they won the title and they were doing your pulse check celebration and things like that? Did you look at that on social media and go, what's all that about? Yeah, you kind of look and you go, there's not that much need for that.

5:43But obviously it's the way they wanted to celebrate and I can't change that. But yeah, we're not talking about that this week. It's all kind of about us and how we can play and we can perform on the weekend. And yeah, I'm looking forward to the challenge this weekend. You seem, since you burst on the scene with everything you've done, and we've loved watching you, embrace all that sort of stuff. the niggle a bit of the like you were booed in poe and you said i'd boo me on social media as well just having a laugh with it like is that kind of your attitude to all of it of sort of like if they want to have a pop crack on i'm still going to enjoy my game and everything else yeah exactly i i love playing for the saints in england so um my main focus is always kind of playing well and um like no one really knows me outside of my kind of circle um so they can have assumptions of who i am and um what i'm like but all that kind of matters about me is my family my friends are They're still tight with me.

6:32And obviously my coaches and my teammates are still very tight with me. So that's my kind of mentality going into this and going into every single week is kind of, how can I be at my best for the team? And hopefully this weekend we can see that. So you have a profile, but you're saying that the Henry Pollock who the people see isn't the real you. And we're going to talk to Phil Dowson shortly about perhaps some of the work you do behind the scenes that isn't on social media. but would you like people to know the real you or are you quite happy for them to see the player and the guy who, if there's a scuffle, you can guarantee Henry Pollock's right in the middle of it, the celebrations, all of that sort of stuff.

7:11If there's much more depth to you, would you like people to know that or are you quite happy for them to see the pantomime villains? Yeah, I'm happy either way. I don't really think about it that much. Like, as I said, the main thing is my coaches and my teammates value me in the squad. and then outside of that people can make assumptions where they can and they want to call me who they can call me. I don't really read into it. But again, it's good for the sport. It kind of makes it enjoyable, makes it exciting, makes the game on the weekend more exciting. So from that aspect of it, then yeah, they can keep doing it.

7:46There was something I think that Ellie Kildun said on a podcast she was on where she met you and everyone might have a preconception of what you might be like. She goes, oh, he's just like a teenage boy, like her brother. and I don't know if you feel that yourself that you're slightly misunderstood or people have a projected view of you that isn't anything like what you actually are like yeah like with Ellie I only saw her for a day and she always did some nice things about me online but I'm not like a big brother she's wrong about that but yeah like it's difficult like you obviously want to be yourself and everything and on the pitch I'm very different to what I'm like off the pitch you know so but no one really sees it on like off the pitch it's difficult but as I said like I don't really care that much don't really think into it too much like that's just who I am on the pitch and then obviously outside of that I'm very kind of just relaxed and then just always kind of making having a laugh for the boys.

8:37So give us a bit of an insight to you've got a training week this week for a big game what are the sorts of things that aren't going on TikTok and Instagram that you are doing like rugby wise that are going to make yourself a better player for the weekend? Yeah Going through videos about Bordeaux, looking at their attack and defence, having chats with the coaches around what I can potentially do better at from the week before or two weeks before because I didn't play last weekend. And then just working hard on the pitch, doing off-feed conditioning last week because I wasn't playing, that kind of thing no one sees.

9:08Working hard in the gym with the S &Cs, putting my weight up, all the kind of little things, eating well in the evenings. And then just chilling out in the evenings, having downtime, going to like kind of the sauna with the boys or go around some food or just just just being a normal a normal 20 year old yeah because it is another thing there too isn't there of like the modern athlete you can do both can't you you can have like a social media presence and a bit of a character and a personality and work really hard do you feel like that's what you're trying to do as in you don't have to have it's not either or you can do both yeah well yeah 100 % like I'm As you said, big on social media and kind of pushing that kind of aspect of my kind of life and then kind of what I'm like around that, different from that.

9:51They're very different, you know. What I'm like on the pitch is very different to what I'm like on a Monday morning when it's freezing cold like everyone else is. But then when I get on the pitch, I'm still the same person I am when I'm training. So I guess, yeah, two different people, but one person with, I guess, the same kind of goals in life. I noticed your Instagram profile as you've written down as a content creator rather than rugby player which I read that and thought that's a dig at somebody I actually don't know why that's happened it does say that yeah it does say that yeah content creator then maybe what's it like being here at this place at the moment you're so tight you've got such a good group of mates here but the rugby that you're playing and the levels that this team are reaching is exciting for everyone to watch.

10:40You're in the middle of it. What's it like here? It's an amazing environment to be part of. Obviously, the coaches are an amazing coach and they're driving us so hard, but the composition for positions is amazing. Boys getting rested, boys getting time off. It just creates the excitement around the group. Every training session, we're trying to get better. You can see on the weekend how well we're playing at the minute. It's a credit to how we train. We always say how we train is what we're going to be on the weekend. The squad's so young. we've got so many young England players in the squad that are striving for positions and other players that haven't got the chance yet.

11:13So it's definitely a place where I'm looking forward to what's ahead. Obviously this year we haven't won Silverwell for a while, so that's definitely the goal of ours. But yeah, we're trying to take it week by week and day by day. That performance in Bath, in fact the back-to-back performances with the squad being split, that was a statement over the festive period coming into the new year. to win those games as you did, Bath and Queen's. With Europe coming out now, Bordeaux, to kind of almost sign off before a break for the Six Nations, it's a statement of intent from Saints, isn't it? What you've done the last few weeks?

11:48Yeah, massively. We talk about how it's a whole squad effort. In the week, you know, the non-23 boys are busting their balls every session. And they're the ones that ultimately make our team better. So if we didn't have them, we wouldn't be anyone. And lucky enough, that week for those boys, they got their chance. Obviously, we had to rest some of the players that played a lot of the minutes this year. So those boys got the week off, which was nice of them over Christmas period. But yeah, we kind of spoke about that week that everyone kind of wrote us off and that's good. We love being in that position where we kind of have no one, everyone kind of doubts us and we can just go there kind of under the radar and do our job.

12:22And then you saw that against Bath. Their team was fully stacked and we showed that we can kind of believe what belief does, I guess. in games that now you have had basically a whole year of playing sort of men's professional rugby do you are you starting to notice people coming for you a bit whether that's verbally or physically or anything else or targeting you in inverted commas um and if you do what does that kind of feel like do you quite enjoy the yeah well yeah i feel like i i like getting into games where kind of i'm in it for minute one and i'm kind of i'm my aggressive self and like i love the confrontation of kind of the physical aspect of sport is why I play.

13:00I love that kind of it. So I guess I haven't really noticed teams kind of coming after me. It's more just I'm getting less time on the ball or I'm getting shut down when I'm getting in defence and stuff. So that kind of aspect of it is enjoyable because it makes you a better player. But the squad we have here is the same as training as in playing. You're getting less time on the ball because the squad's getting better. So, yeah, I definitely enjoy that kind of game. If they want to come for me, come for me. and then I guess we'll see what happens after that. Do you spend club weeks with your head only here or we've got Six Nations less than a month away and you play in a position, whichever jersey you're wearing, where the competition is fierce and Greg Fizzle out at Exeter this season has really stepped up and Mika Ileoni's fit again and is a hell of a player at Leicester.

13:49There's just more and more competition. Do you ever watch the highlights on TNT or watch other games and recognise the depth of competition? Or is your mind just here, then you rock up to England and see what happens? No, definitely it's in the back of your mind how well the other players in the squad are playing. Like Greg Danonex has been outstanding, I think. I think he's kind of definitely stepped on this year from what he was last year. And he's definitely a player that I can definitely see playing for England this year. But that kind of competition is what you want. You want players driving you, making you better.

14:20But my main focus is kind of playing well here on the weekend and hopefully the rest takes care of itself. I'm just doing it day by day and we'll kind of see what happens in the back of that. Is there anything, just on to Will's question earlier, anything that you're doing differently in day-to-day, this season to last season, that you've learned along the way from being in England camps, being on a Lions tour, just your application and whether it's the kind of questions you're asking or the work you're doing in analysis. or is there anything that you're doing different this season to last season which you could pin down to the experiences you've had?

14:52I don't really know too far. I think I was just taking it more day by day. I think last year, because I wasn't at the start of the year, I was still playing rugby. It was difficult kind of trying to find my feet in the squad here at Saints. And I kind of, I feel like I got kind of too caught up in that kind of aspect of it and kind of thinking about the next week or the week after. And actually, if I'm working on each training session, and trying to get better in that, then the rest of it will take care of itself. But then obviously on tour I learnt so much from those amazing players in the summer.

15:21Yeah, just talking to players like Johnny Section, what an amazing player he was. Yeah, just kind of getting bits from him, Andy Farrell. So those kind of things have definitely got technical bits to definitely work on. But my mentality is definitely the same, just doing it day by day. We've obviously known about the best moments you had of last year because they were so out there, like Leinster away, the line stuff, licking your lips before the Hacker, beating the All Blacks, those things. But what would you pick out from 2025 as maybe like a couple of little unseen moments that you really cherished about last year?

15:53What, that no one saw? Yeah, or just things that now with on the next year you go, wow, I love that experience or this moment or something like that. There's probably a couple. I'd say that my debut in Wales was very special. having my family in the crowd and then kind of yeah coming on scoring two tries was pretty cool but then kind of in the post match after my mum and dad there like they kind of handed me my cap and then Finn spoke which was yeah kind of a day that you never forget and then the build up in the week of going down to the principality kind of doing the team run and that kind of thing was my first I guess exposure into that kind of high level so that was an amazing experience and then probably the drive back after I got pit for Lions um being with all the boys in the in where we were and then kind of walking out of that room and then just a realization like looking over seeing Finn crying speaking to his mom and dad's um Mitch going off with his family or going to phone his family and then just sitting in the car and then yeah like trying to phone my mom and dad they weren't answering I was like okay it's class um good timing yeah great timing um and then like calling my brother he was just like mate this is actually crazy like what have you done and I was like I actually don't know like those kind of moments like that drive back i'll probably never forget and then we went to the so went to a bar with those boys that day and just sat and just was like this is actually happening lads like we'll go on the british and irish lions tour um those kind of moments no one sees and um yeah they're just special and if we were to give you a couple of things you'd love to achieve in this calendar year the big second season i suppose what was what would you take this time next year um definitely winning winning silverware with england is definitely no sorry with saints is definitely a goal getting so close last year to the European in the final.

17:43So definitely winning something with this club would be special. And then obviously I want to start for England this year. However that looks, when or how it looks. But yeah, that's definitely my goal. And then potentially winning something silver over them as well would be cool. I guess people don't realise that. There's five caps, is it? Three tries? Yeah. But no starts? Yeah, I haven't started yet. So that's definitely a goal of mine to start to get kind of that kind of starting shirt. Awesome, Henry. Which number? Any number. Doesn't matter where it is. 11? 14? Never know. Awesome, Henry. Well, look, it's been great to have you on the pod.

18:18Really appreciate all your time and all the best for another great year ahead. Thank you very much, guys. Cheers. Cheers, lads. Thank you. Just a quick breather to tell you about today's sponsor, Allianz, a partner that's all about opening rugby up to more people. Their support goes way beyond Allianz Stadium. Through the Allianz Future Fund, they've already put over£100 ,000 straight into community clubs across the UK, helping fund projects that bring new people into the game. And with the Allianz Kickstart programme now reaching 5 ,000 schools, thousands of kids are getting their first taste of rugby, some for the very first time.

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20:40Okay, so we've had the man of the moment, the man of last year, Henry Pollock, on the pod. Now his director of rugby, Phil Dowson, joins us. And, Phil, you've talked consistently with Henry. about kind of keeping calm, not overdoing it with him, but also letting him fly. Is that the consistent theme for this year, 2026 as well, in his kind of second big year to just keep boosting his tyres when he needs it and down to earth when he needs it too? Yeah, I think so. I think trying to coach him like every other player in the environment. I appreciate he's slightly different in terms of the following he has and the presence he has.

21:13But I think what we're trying to do is make sure we get the best performance out on the pitch. And I think he knows that. He gets that as well. And so that will look after everything else off the pitch in terms of whatever else he's doing. If he's playing well, then he'll be in a good spot. And so that is my primary concern, really. What about this weekend particularly? Because we know how it all blew up a little bit in the final. Is everyone at the club generally, not just Henry, just really looking forward to have a go at Bordeaux because of how the final went and the fact that it became a bit spicy and things like that?

21:44Is that another element to this game that's exciting for everybody? I think that might be the narrative away from the ground, to be honest, away from the club. And that's a good thing in generating interest around the game. We were beaten in the final. We played actually really well on another day where, you know, loads of small instances and momentum shifts in the game, but credit to Bordeaux, outstanding. And things do get spicy when there's a lot at stake and it's emotional and things like that. And I think it just serves to show how much impact Henry's had in the rugby environment. He's only been around a couple of years, really.

22:19You know, the last year was his breakthrough year, I'd say. And the impacts he's had and the reach he has, you know, going to Poe where, you know, people don't know him as well, but obviously seeing him play for England. And they boom when he comes on. And he doesn't mind that. And I think he quite likes the pantomime villain stuff. And so there's definitely elements of that this weekend, looking back at that final. But it was also, I think it more the reach that Henry has from a charismatic point of view than anything else. And on the rugby in particular, What have you noticed in him after that kind of spectacular rise he had in 25 and the experiences that he got on that Lions tour working with different coaches and the best of the best?

22:57How's his game, maybe his decision-making or his, I don't imagine his attitude is any different, but his rugby, have you noticed anything that's stepped forward? Yeah, I think so. I think there's clearly a maturity thing. I think there's some off-field stuff that he obviously needs to manage with regards so he can't do every single event, he can't do every single appearance, he can't satisfy every single sponsor that comes knocking on his door, so he has to be professional around that, and that's come very quickly because he's a man in demand, so there's off-field stuff that he needs to manage that I think he's got a lot better at, and there's a maturity element to that.

23:30I think on the field, his focus has been pretty consistent in terms of what he goes after, and he's so natural in so many different areas that you don't want to curtail any of that clearly. But at the same time, there's some elements of his game where he would sit down and he would speak very, very maturely around his experiences in the autumn, his experiences coming out of the British Lions, his experiences of backing up performances and playing regularly for us. And so I think there's an element of, I keep using the word maturity, but there's an element of that experience that allows him to perform consistently.

24:03We know what he's capable of. And there's some more elements of his game, some set-piece elements around scrum and line-out and delivery of ball, elements around the fundamentals, whether it's collision in defence or valuing the ball, you know, a little bit more in attack. So he's not too loose. He's got the ability to break up in a game, but making those decisions. And generally, he's actually really bright. And so you see this persona that's sort of seen on the pitch where he's, you know, in amongst it and talking and giving it loads. Off the pitch, he reflects really well. He sits down with us as a coach after autumn, with coaches, sorry, after the autumn and he talks to his games with real clarity.

24:44So it's not stupid. And I think it's been a bit of a whirlwind, but I think he's taken it generally in his stride and he's got good people around him giving him advice. And that element of managing the whirlwind, there aren't many rugby players who find themselves in that position as such a hot property for sponsors and big magazines and red carpets and all that kind of stuff. does that fall on you to help guide him or and what's your experience of trying to you know I don't have much experience with red carpet but I think you get your sort of advice from to help manage that do you know I mean well I mean the only other player who who the icons and he's very different personality but in some ways the reach has been similar would be Johnny who obviously a play with at Newcastle and how he managed his private life and his his persona off and on field and again he always had the first things first was his performance and so I'd said to him around managing his time and I mean his energy you know he's not gonna be able to do everything and he he said himself you know there's a couple events he went to where he came back and then had another appearance the next day and was tired and and he just said you know I just can't do it because I've tried it and it's too much and I'm gonna pare it back so I'd said you know you've got to be really choosy around what you do and what do you want your name to be associated with and he came the next day and said is Burberry all right and I said I said yeah that's probably a good one to do um but yeah so he's not he's bright enough and I think he gets good advice hopefully he gets good advice from his agent I wouldn't necessarily know exactly what he's getting there but good advice from his parents from his friends I think there's other players who are on the cusp of that with Fremo and Mitch and Finn who are in that environment who can say you know relax big lad just just let that come to you a little bit and make sure the first thing's the first thing.

26:30Do you feel like it's difficult to tar everyone with the same brush, but English sport or English rugby is still not as good as it could be at embracing people who are slightly different or slightly more out there, to put it like that, maybe? Or do you think we are getting better at it? It seems like they are being allowed to be themselves. I definitely think we're getting better at it. I definitely think we're way more open and understanding to the fact that we need to get people interested in the sport. And Henry, you look at a number of kids wearing, you know, the headbands and the hair and the Pollock jerseys and all that sort of stuff.

27:04He somehow, for whatever reason, the way he plays and the way he carries on has caught the imagination. And that's very positive. But I think there's lots of people who now have the freedom to be themselves. And I think rugby needs that. And in terms of the kind of unseen bits that he'll do, because he'll be out there on TikTok and Instagram and social media and events and things like that. But he obviously is working really hard on his rugby, which is the forefront. So can you give us a bit of insight onto the things that he does, that he doesn't put on social media, that are really valuable to make him a better rugby player?

27:34Yeah, I think it comes down to your application during the training week. And I think that comes down to, he would never be sure of things to say in a social environment because he's that guy winding Colsey up, doing this, that and the other. But actually he comes to a meeting and he'll have technical points or technical questions and he'll actually, so it actually reminds me and I hate to make the I probably shouldn't make the comparison but Hask was great at that when he came here having been at Wasp for so long he would take the Mick and he would be a jester but when push comes to shove when it was business time he switched on and I think that was a real good skill to have and he probably learnt it over a period of time but Henry's definitely got that when training happens like we're on and I don't have to tell him to cut it out and get involved because he's already doing it and that's the same in the meetings, the technical meetings bits and pieces of that, how he drives the energy around the place.

28:25First and foremost, you know, he might be charismatic, but first and foremost, he's a competitor and he wants to win and he wants to play well and he wants to be in the best team and he wants to get stuck in. And I think I take those things first before any of the japes and the messing about, which is all on the periphery from my point of view. You're right to name check that other group, which could be wider. Alex Coles, you mentioned Fraser Dean. you've got such an exciting crop of homegrown players and the way that you're playing this season is if there's a buzz around Henry, there's a buzz around Saints.

28:59The rugby you're playing, the way you're winning, it must just be exactly the environment you want but you talked about having a day off. How do you keep the energy? It must be just a great place to be. Just to go back to the previous point, I think you mentioned some of those players. So Dingers, Coles, Finn, Freeman, They're all very bright lads. They're all down to earth. They're all sensible. They're just good men. And I think for Henry to come into an environment where there is a lot of balance, there is a lot of maturity, hopefully there's a lot of fun as well, so he gets that kick as well.

29:30But I think having that group of players, I think we probably didn't allude to that soon enough, really, from my point of view, is having that friendship group that keeps them grounded as well and shows them the way. It's hugely important. I'm really conscious of not getting carried away with the success that we've enjoyed in the last month or so. We've been playing some good rugby, we've scored a ton of points, we've enjoyed ourselves, but we've won nothing and we need to continue that momentum. And so I think I'm probably a bit of a miser when it comes to making sure that we're not getting too carried away with ourselves.

30:06And I think the players know that as well. They understand that we're halfway through the season in the league, we've still got two group stages in Europe, we've still got a sail away, where we haven't won there for donkeys. And then it's a PRC block where all these lads are away. So they asked me on the TV actually the other day, you know, everything's rosy, what can go wrong? And I'm like, literally everything can go wrong. And that's what I'm conscious of. So there's the injury point of view, there's a form point of view, there's a complacency point of view, there's a repetition and monotony point of view.

30:35And probably critically, there's the cultural point of view of being really hungry to go and do something special and keep working as hard as we possibly can on the fundamentals of our game to give ourselves the best chance to perform. It feels the difference though, Phil, that last year in the league in particular the injury thing was a problem. You were facing challenges every week. You couldn't quite get it going. This time around it's about trying to ward off the problems. Has there been a notable change? I would have a different take on it. I'd say last year we had the capability to mix it with the best sides.

31:09We didn't obviously win Europe, but we mixed it with the best sides in Europe and we went at it. And at different times in the league, again, we showed that capability. We didn't have the consistency. And I think some of the experiences of last year where I've turned around and said, I actually said it mid-season last year, and I think back to it sometimes, I said, I don't want us to become a good cup team. We want to be challenging on both fronts. We want to be more consistent in the league. And we actually became a really good cup team. On our day, we could drive that level. What we've said this year is actually that consistency, that depth of the squad, making sure that when people take time out other guys stepping in are ready to go on lots of different fronts from a physical point of view, mental point of view and an ability point of view to try and keep that continuity and that consistency so I think we've just managed to do that better and I think the work of Olly Dix and our psych is probably a good factor there in terms of where that comes from and how hard it is and this is something that Colsey's so good at how hard it is every week to make sure you're in the right place to go and play Decent place to go Bordeaux Yeah Big challenge Next place We haven't played them away I don't think since 97-98 I was just looking at the stats today Great part of France From what I gather So excited about that We've been to Poe For the first time Bordeaux You know For 25 years We haven't been so Excited about doing that I think this side actually We talked about it And I think the thing is I talked about it in interviews It was actually Colsey actually On a podcast Had said You know I think we get excited About playing away in Europe We went to Munster And we had some good times there and we went to Leinster and we've been around and the Bulls and that was a great trip last year where we spent a week together because we haven't had much time away in pre-season so Bordeaux is another opportunity, see somewhere go into a great stadium, I've played there in the Sevens a long, long time ago and measure ourselves against a very, very good side.

32:58Well look Phil, all the best for it and hopefully we can keep coming back and having nice positive chats about Henry, Saints and everything else. Yeah, yeah I hope so. Awesome. Thank you very much. Cheers Phil. Thanks again, everyone, for listening through both of our pods this week. We had Laurie Downrimple from Harlequins on the State of the Club there on Monday. And now the Henry Pollock special. Really interesting to hear some insights from Phil Dowson, his director of rugby there. What a year ahead it is for Pollock, for England, for Saints. A massive game against Bordeaux Begler this weekend in the Champions Cup.

33:31Follow it all on The Times and join us again for the Ruck next week If you've got any questions about the Quinns pod or the Pollock pod, the email always is theruckatthetimes.co.uk. And we will see you all again on Monday for the next Ruck. Before you go, we just want to shine a light on the great work Allianz is doing behind the scenes to support the game we all love. We talk a lot on the Ruck about Premiership stars and England internationals, but every one of those journeys starts somewhere, usually on a freezing morning at a local club with volunteers hand-me-down kit and a belief that rugby can genuinely change lives Allianz gets how important those places are which is why they're launching a special edition of the Allianz Future Fund just for Ruck listeners they're offering grants of£500 to£1 ,000 to help local clubs become more inclusive more sustainable and better set up for the next generation.

34:29Whether it's new kit, safer facilities, or giving young players the space to grow into tomorrow's heroes, this is a real chance to make a difference. Sign up for the Allianz Future Fund, nominate your club, and help support the grassroots heart of the game. Hey, it's Paige from Giggly Squad, and if you've been thinking about tackling any home or yard projects lately, this is your sign. Lowe's Spring Fest is on. Lowe's Spring Fest is happening right now at Lowe's, featuring great deals to help you refresh your homes and outdoor spaces just in time for spring. We talked about airing out your home, and Lowe's is just taking it to the next level.

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