Sophie Howard on life at Como, adapting to Serie A, and falling in love with football again

0:28Welcome to Upfront, I'm Chloe Morgan. to hear all about her sunny sunny life in Como, the most stylish club in the world as it's been called.

0:38Sophie, welcome to the pod. First time on, thank you so much for joining us. Can you tell us where you're joining us from and can you explain the view? Because I think all of us here in rainy, miserable, dismal England just need a bit more positivity. Yeah, to be fair, I do feel really sorry for you guys. but I'm currently recording from Sislaga which is a town in the middle of Como and Milan that's where our training ground is based so north Italy and my view I mean it's a tiny village so it's not too scenic but I've got the sunshine out on the balcony and yeah just a lot of greenery which is quite nice love that I'm already jealous honestly I'd love to I went to Lake Como when I was I think I was about 20, 21 or so but I was on a student budget so I stayed in a hostel it was horrible ate like mouldy sandwiches and I just feel like the experience that you guys have is probably slightly better than that a more elite and premium feeling I was there this summer on the way like from we drove after the Euros in Switzerland over the mountains to Italy and we spent two nights in Como and it was beautiful so I'm very jealous of yeah your whole set up Como is beautiful but you just said like the journey to Como we did that when we moved down here and that's probably even more beautiful than just Como itself I'd almost say yeah the winding roads It's a challenge, but it was very, very nice.

1:57Very fun. Go on, Chloe. Hit us. Right. Well, I think, I mean, I kind of don't want to know anymore in a way. Like I kind of don't want to. Even more just. Yeah, I'm not there. So I feel a little bit aggrieved by that. But let's start with something super, super positive. Because obviously you're having such an amazing season so far. Currently sitting second behind leaders Roma. You've got to be really super excited and sort of pumped about how the kind of first season has been for you. How's that feeling right now? Of course, yeah, we're sitting second at the moment, and I think that's better than any of us expected when we first all joined together and started the season.

2:33I think we've been doing really, really well, I think especially against the so-called bigger opponents, we've stood our ground. And just from game to game, we fought ourselves into that second position. We are aware that, yeah, Juventus, Fiorentina, they're on our heels, but we just take each game as it comes, and that's what we've done from the first game, and that's what's got us in this position. But you know how it is. The season is so long. So as much as we're excited and we celebrate every win, it's incredible how literally every win we won 1-0 against Parma and it was a really ugly game, but we celebrated it.

3:06We won the Champions League pretty much. So that's really exciting. We celebrate every win, but we're fully aware of what's still ahead. How has it been, that transition from WSL to Serie A? I know we talk about the weather and the beautiful views, but from a footballing perspective what's that been like? I think initially when I moved here quite challenging in a sense of if I'm really honest I believe women's football is quite behind here still and I think for me playing in the WSL for so long in my opinion probably the best best league in the world and definitely in Europe that was challenging not only to accept but also to kind of be a part of it's almost like a step back for me which also I try and always see the positives is it gives me a platform to hopefully make some changes and push the game forward here as much as I can um in terms of the league I believe like any opposition it's really tricky it's such a hard game no matter who you play against the league if you've looked at the table it's so tight with one league or sorry with one win or loss you could drop or jump four or five spots which I think makes it really exciting um and for me personally getting away from the whole I knew every single player in the WSL I'd analyzed them over and over again especially every striker that's my job and the amount of individual clips I did on every single striker I was playing against um I knew them like literally I could dream about them I knew everything and and coming here and not knowing a single player was really refreshing um that was definitely not the reason why I moved but I also didn't realize how much I almost needed that um I was going to say that's something I never really thought about when you move leagues is that individual knowledge right like it's obviously you know the teams but you kind of don't think about those individual things you have to do to prep for a game and how that variety can actually bring a lot more joy I suppose when you're and more challenges yeah like I enjoyed and I still enjoy preparing for the opposition but especially for me individually for the strikers I'm up against but because I played for so many years and for example like Bonnie Shaw at Man City the amount of clips I watched on Bonnie like I knew not I knew how she played but like I was prepared and coming here and like playing against the top strikers of Roma Juventus I knew nothing about them so I did have to do my homework but it also was kind of refreshing I enjoyed that that um I didn't know the big names and and I believed in in England in the WSL I was always compared to my previous games my previous seasons my this my this and I had a complete fresh start here so that for me probably was the biggest change that I didn't know I needed but I welcomed very much yeah I was gonna say when you're kind of doing the the research and prep about the Italian strikers as opposed to WSL strikers what what's the biggest thing that you noticed I think we saw a lot of like Italian passion and fieriness like in there in the in the in the Euros just gone and they did so well and it kind of amplified like how people thought about Italian football but what would you say is like the biggest like stylistic difference that you've noticed that you have to be more aware of in in Syria um I think so far I've only come up against one team that plays like the teams I played against in the WSL and that was AC Milan I think that's down to the coach obviously changing she's a Dutch coach and she came in um and they played a typical one holding strike and two winning it ringers one in behind in Italy from what I've experienced so far and obviously I'm still very new so I don't want to kind of make a statement of what my uh perception is but there's a lot of um receiving the ball and flicking it on there's a lot of playing together flicking on and that's really hard to defend by yourself so you really rely on that collective defending because you can't defend those flick-ons by yourself when you play against a striker that's meant to hold the ball up and initiate that play you can almost battle that not by yourself but you have a better chance and i always compared to bonnie sure that was my job to to make sure bonnie couldn't initiate those attacks and I've only faced that once so far when we played AC Milan and apart from that it was always these flick-ons and these layovers and off but in behind and all this stuff that I believe also having done my coaching courses is like really difficult to defend by yourself you need that collective defensive line to to deal with that so it's like that defensive unit becomes even more important and I suppose like communication and collaboration between you guys and knowing who's like who's going who's staying back who's covering who's like those kind of things seem like Yeah, absolutely key.

7:38In terms of the kind of communication between you and the other players, is your Italian improved at all? Do we know any kind of decent defender phrases in Italian yet? Well, I think for me, fortunately, because I grew up bilingually, I can pick up languages quite quickly. I think that added the challenge of moving here because so far wherever I've played, I've been able to speak the language, whether that was Germany where I started off or when I went to the US or England, I could always speak the language. I can now understand most of what the manager is saying. He can only speak Italian, so there's no translating from him.

8:14That's so impressive already. I think it's a football term. You know, like when someone's pointing at me and doing this and that, I kind of know what he wants from me. And then the words are so repetitive because he's saying the same stuff kind of thing in the jules. So you kind of pick them up really quickly. I guess if we had a conversation off the pitch, it would be more difficult. Like when I go to the shops or go to the post office, I just came back from the post office to send some Christmas presents off and that's hard. And they talk at you and you're just like trying and trying and guessing.

8:44And the thing, what I didn't realise, especially in North Italy, more Italians can speak German than they can speak English. So for me, that's all right because I can speak German. But for example, my partner can only speak English. So that's a challenge for him. But yeah, language wise, I'm taking Italian lessons because I believe it's really important for me to, I guess, respect the culture and the language and I really want to learn it as well. Fortunately, a lot of players can speak any, so if there's anything I don't understand, they can translate. But I'm quite surprised how much I actually understand.

9:16I can't speak it, but I can understand most of what the coach wants for me. Have you found that, from your experience, you touched on it there, playing in Germany, playing in the US, playing in England, has that made adapting to new cultures, I guess, both on and off the pitch have you found yourself quite adaptable because you've had that experience I'd say yes I'd also say any move abroad is tough um it's initially a very isolating move um but I believe I mean I left home when I was 15 to move to a different club in Germany and then I went to America when I was 18 so like I've moved and moved and moved so I do believe yes that has made me very adaptable and all these challenges that you face moving abroad like I'm almost ready for them because I've had them before it doesn't make it easier but I think I'm just more prepared for it I also think because I'm not moving abroad for I guess other reasons other than the football in this moment and I'm initially part of the team so I like I immediately have that community that helps me feel at home very quickly.

10:24Whereas I think if I didn't have that, had that, if I didn't have that, see now my English is getting worse because I'm speaking Italian. If I didn't have that, I think I'd struggle more. But being part of a team immediately, wherever you go, makes this move and transition easier. Yeah, because you've got like a base to at least start from. Yeah, exactly. On the pitch, do you find having played different styles of football does it make you do that you feel like a bit more of a rounded player because you could you've played I guess play different styles are a bit more prepared for a different style because you've experienced it before does do you feel that kind of a bit more well-rounded I think so yes that's partially because I've moved and played for different teams in different countries I think it's also down to having so many different managers yeah every manager wants to play differently and you just have to adapt almost if you want to succeed and survive you have to adapt um I also partially thinks it's it's my experience in the game um that's contributing to that so I think it's a it's a mix of a few things you mentioned um a couple of a couple of moments ago about sort of taking that that jump and that leap at 15 to you know start your your football career and kind of take it forward like what was that like that at such a young age to you know make such a massive leap that's huge yeah so when when I was 15 I stayed in Germany like my family I grew up in Germany my dad's English my mum's Scottish but um they moved to Germany so I was born there and grew up there so I left the family home but I still stayed within Germany so it was only I think something like 150 kilometers away from my family home um so I didn't quite leave the country however I left home and that was tough because I'm quite close to my family um as you can imagine like mom and dad moved over there we didn't have grandparents in Germany we didn't have the extended family we just literally had a six and mom and dad and my three siblings um so when I left that it was that was tough because we are so close um equally I knew why I was doing it um and and credit to my mom and dad they dove down probably at least every other weekend but probably like once a week to see me which made that transition easier I guess but I think the main thing is I always knew why I did it so like the tough moment you kind of get through them because you know why you're doing it I did it for football and it paid off we will get on to Mercury 13 in a second but I feel like one of the big changes from Como to maybe some of the WSL clubs is just like the coolness of the club they are very much like a chic, sophisticated luxury images of these kits and the branding and you know what what do you make of that kind of image that we all have of of the squad from maybe from you being inside the club um the image that is portrayed is definitely that we're stylish we're um we're very innovative we're very out there um i think we still have to put a lot of work into the areas behind the scenes to really drive this club forward in a sense of if you really want to compete in Europe in the next couple of years, then we have to really push forward.

13:41I think the element of the media side, who we present ourselves as, I think that's done really, really well. I think now we need a follow-up. And I think our performances are showing that, that we are putting in the work behind the scenes. We just really need to dig deep in the years to come to kind of make it sustainable, if that makes sense. Yeah, I think it's quite clever, though, isn't it? because you're making yourself a very attractive prospect obviously yes the on the pitch you want to play football and you're doing well in the league which you're kind of backing that up but it's quite a a smart way to in a quick or short space of time put yourselves on the map and have people talking about you and you know make you an even more attractive prospect for people to come and join so like from that respect you know it's a new way of doing things it's quite smart it's definitely is smart and there's a reason why it's been done like that um I think for me it's really important to say that that so the moment I joined this team I felt part of the team and I've never besides playing for Scotland because I always speak about how tight-knit we are at Scotland and how that's my second football family in terms of a club experience I've never experienced how together a team can be the amount of work every single player puts in is unbelievable I always say and that might be quite harsh but I always believe what is asked from us I don't think any squad that I was a part of in England would commit the same way that these players in Como are um there's crazy things like as an example when I first joined we had 18 days on a trot of double sessions in pre-season 18 days that is unheard of in England and most players would have tapped out but there was not a single player that tapped out and we just got together and thought through I'm not agreeing with this by the way it was almost survival of the fittest in that sense I'm not agreeing with this and I'm not saying this is how it should be done but to see the resilience within these players and the team is something I've never experienced so yes I think the media side and we're very attractive as a club once players join this club there's a reason why no one wants to leave

16:13so we spoke about mercury 13 on a recent episode after they took over bristol city but for anyone who missed that they are the parent company of como uh their co-founder and co-ceo is victoire cogevina reynal and i've actually been i've been a couple of pounds with her actually you're our I'm banging on about it. Well, I'll probably see in the box for, you know, a couple of games or something when that hospitality invite comes through. I remember speaking to Victoire, I think a couple of panels, some panels quite recently, and she was sort of saying about it. Obviously, they've got the massive brand image, this kind of very elite, premium feeling brand, but behind it, it's actually backed by this kind of want and investment into the infrastructure to making sure that actually it's the quality of the players, the quality of the staff, the quality of all the resources that you guys have around it.

16:57That's the important thing they're trying to build whilst also trying to create this very marketable property. And talking of Victoire, she obviously, she was talking about the rebrand and, you know, how she's dedicated to kind of growing this, you know, big female audience in Como. And she was saying it was partly because when she was growing up, she kind of felt that football was never really built for her. It was always kind of marketed pretty much as a men's and a boys game. But is it something that kind of resonated with you? Because she obviously has such a personal connection to the mission that she's trying to achieve.

17:24I mean, Victoire is one of the only owners of a club that has ever spent the time to come to me and say so tell me about you as a person you know and that says a lot um of course there there's a huge business mind behind this person uh but first and foremost she's a person first and foremost she treated me as a person the moment we met and we'd met only I probably was a club at the club for two three weeks um and she was in the building and before that only spoke to mario her business partner um when it was about moving to and having these conversations with like I guess the the leaders of the club um so I'd never spoke to Victoire before but when we met it was an instant so tell me about you like I've heard about you but like who are you like what's your journey and I had never experienced that before um and also because I believe women's football is still so behind Victoire's right and it said there's a huge platform to get this going and push women's football the way she wants to do it It's quite inspiring from, I guess, the outside.

18:26And I think it's really interesting seeing different approaches to women's football and teams. And, you know, we've seen it with London City Lionesses. Like, to then see them be successful and know that the people behind them are really genuine and in it for the right reasons, again, is just another thing that makes the club such an attractive prospect, right? Yeah, like, you hear about the club and you want to be part of it. you get you feel the club you don't want to leave so I think they're doing the right thing like

19:00I like I almost I only heard about Como two seasons ago or yeah two seasons ago and that's when I showed a little bit of interest in terms of like just reading up a little bit um but from the day that I've heard about them I was following them and what they're doing to So I guess getting that attraction is quite impressive. And they are doing it differently. They want to do it their own way. They've just acquired, like Mercury 13 has just acquired Bristol. So they are pushing to become one of the biggest, I guess, multi-club ownership, I believe, in the world in a couple of years. Well, it's great to hear from the inside that environment they're creating.

19:44you know it's for us we always see it from the outside so it is cool to know like more about what that internal side of things is like and it's great to hear how the environment that they built sounds really really quite quite productive and attractive and yeah it's very cool um off like off pitch slightly I guess you know back in October we had um Tottenham's Molly Bar Trip on the pod and we chatted to her about her work with Common Goal uh for which she's an ambassador and I know you also work with Common Goal and have done for many years. How did that come about? That came from one of my close friends, Christy Murray, who played for Beringham City and obviously the Scotland national team.

20:23And she, her best friend, Jane Ross, also a former Scottish national team player, Jane was involved and Jane spoke to Christy and then Christy spoke to me. And I think it's a matter of like-minded people that you would speak to. and anyways long story short Jane was involved and talked to Christy and myself and and said can we set up a call and and I was like quite impressed what Common Goal does and and did my research and then wanted to become a part of it quite quite quickly um and you previously obviously revealed that you considered retirement when you were at Reading because you'd fallen out of love with football how how did you get to that point and what got you out of it um how did I get to that point tough two seasons uh injury um I think I made the mistake and like I didn't I didn't see that then but like reflecting and and also talking about mental health and I was in therapy as well like I'll admit that um I I was so keen to have my I guess value as a football player validated by the coaching staff and when I didn't receive that I thought I was worth nothing and I was so keen to just I guess be seen be seen be seen be seen and that really affected how I saw myself so it got to a point where I just didn't enjoy football anymore like I didn't enjoy going to training because I felt the pressure I put myself to be validated in that in that moment um I I allowed to happen like it was my fault I also didn't have the tools to deal with that though so like kind of the the psychology support that we have at clubs now in England I don't think in Italy it's a thing yet but talking about the struggles like the general mental health struggles but especially the the struggles when it comes to like high performance and all this like there was no chat about that and there was and I didn't know that you could deal with that better than what I did um so it was just almost a downward spiral again as I said like injury not being selected being challenged by that then this whole validation piece like and then another injury and it just kept going and going and it got to a point where I just didn't enjoy the game anymore and the situation that I found myself in I had an option year my contract and it the club could activate or not activate it and I rang my dad once and I'm really close to my family even though like I haven't lived with them for so many years now but I rang my dad and said dad if they activate that option I'm done like I'm not doing it like I could see myself losing myself as a person I was just I wasn't depressed like I don't want to say that but I was just sad constantly and only later did I find out how much my family suffered from that because they saw how sad I was every time I rang them I was in tears but nothing had actually happened it was really hard to explain um only later did I find out how much they suffered because they couldn't do anything so I regret that part because I put them through that but anyways I rang my dad and said if they activate that option you're like I'm done I can't do this anymore like I'll move somewhere where I'm happy and I'll do something I don't know what I'm gonna to do um but I'm just going to do something that makes me happy again um and fortunately they didn't activate I asked them I begged them not to activate the option here unfortunately they they didn't and I moved and that move I moved to Leicester it was a tough move because I had to drop my pride and I went down to the championship uh went from like the WSL down and I needed that step back because I had to fall back in love with the game again and I am very grateful and I I mentioned that in my kind of leaving post when I left Leicester like I'm very grateful for the love because that is the place where I fell back in love with a game don't get me wrong five hard years very challenging but it is a place where I regained that love and and that allowed me to do what I have done in the last five plus now years it's so interesting you say that because um I had a did an interview with I'm not plugging my own podcast here but um we did an interview with Kirsty Hanson yesterday for a podcast we've started around mental health and uh she spoke about how the game when she moved into that kind of professional environment consumed her almost everything about her became about football even when she wasn't playing and she wasn't training and that kind of the need to talk to someone almost allowed her to find herself again and it just it resonates there with what you said about it becomes all in all consuming and you lose yourself and your kind of individuality and I that we kind of forget about that side of things when we talk about high performance and the expectations on players absolutely I think because everyone says it's just your job but it's not because it's my lifestyle everything I do from day to day is designed to make me perform again the next day and it's so hard for us to just see it as a job yes it's how we earn our money and make sure we can survive but it's so much more than just a job i i do believe the moment you accept that it's temporary like you're just a number and you will be replaced at some point it's almost like the weight drops off your shoulder falls off your shoulder because okay like i'll do my absolute best i'll give him my all so i can walk out of here with my head held high but in the end i'm just a number number i think that the sooner we can all realize that as players and i wish there was more support for younger players that are coming into the game yes give it your all like absolutely and you know what you'll face challenges but here are the chores like we can help you through them but just make sure you don't lose who you are and like don't lose sight of it's a small part of your whole life like when i retire what is that two three i don't know how many years i've still got more than half my life left and i don't want to look back on football and say those were miserable years because i was so sad and so you know like everything was so consumed so the sooner we can realize I think the easier it is to deal with these tough moments in football do you see those kind of um issues with younger players coming through the game because I feel like it's we sort of went through a period of you know it's very intense that you kind of you've seen the transition from you know how the game was to you know 10 50 100 people coming to watch the games and it being sort of a lot less pressure to And now we're seeing sort of, you know, 17, 18 year olds on the international stage now, you know, trying to vie for those positions and kick people out of their shirts and, you know, having to deal with all the online abuse and social media and things.

26:58But you talk there about how consuming it is. You kind of, I feel like you'd be the perfect mentor for a younger player. Yeah. Do you kind of see that happening a bit more with the youngers? I don't know if I'd be a perfect mentor. I think I just talk about my experiences. Like, I don't have all the solutions or the answers. I can just tell you about the mistakes I made and I guess the lessons I've learned I think the fact that these young players now have the platform where they can be on the bigger stages and have all the facilities and support that I didn't have when I started playing is amazing it comes however with what you mentioned the pressure I think every 17-18 year old that I've seen in one of my squads has been promised to be the next big thing and that comes with so much pressure like all of these young players have these massive partnerships with like adidas nike like all these big brands and i'm like stop like let them enjoy the game like i always say like yes it was hard when i remember times where i got about five o 'clock because i gym in the morning then i went to work then i went back to um to football in the evening like training and I was still doing my uni at the same time so like I remember those tough days but I don't wish them away because I know why I started playing football and it definitely wasn't the money because there was no money involved I started because I loved the game so much and sometimes I just want to tell everyone out there just let them play the game like if you don't really love it I can guarantee you you're not going to survive because at some point you're going to face a challenge and if you can't dig deep and like remind yourself why you started in the first place it's going to be really really tough to get get out of those challenges um so I do I don't want to say I feel sorry for them for the younger players coming through now because they've got amazing opportunities that I never had but I'm also kind of glad that I grew up in the era where there was not a lot of money involved because I know why I started playing yeah that's it's so interesting you you say that because it's kind of I guess that's not often the way we reflect on the youngsters you think oh my god they're so lucky now they're growing up with xyz but it's yeah it's a very valid point about like the why and how the why maybe has changed over the years perhaps um speaking of tough challenges we didn't want to let you go without bringing we're talking to you about international football and scotland and it has been um a tough year with with lots of of change how do you look back on it um i think it's still to this day one of my biggest achievements to be able to wear that Scotland shirt I've already obviously had a very unique upbringing with multiple nationalities in my my home my dad's English as I said my mom's Scottish I grew up in Germany so I'd also have the German passport but it is still to this day like one of the things I'm most proud of and as I kind of briefly mentioned earlier being part of that team is something really really special and before joining coma I hadn't ever experienced in a sense of how how tight people can be and how much they can genuinely care about one another as people I think when we now talk about pitch it's been very tough many many years that we probably failed where we haven't done ourselves justice where we haven't qualified for major tournaments when I first joined the squad in 2017 we made the European tournament we went made the World Cup like everything was perfect in that sense and then we just since then we haven't really achieved let's be honest like everyone shies away from saying it but we haven't like we haven't been at a single major tournament since we've dropped out of League A in the Nations League multiple times kind of thing like we just haven't been putting it on the pitch um i do believe like we're creating something really special um there's a strong squad that's going for the next world cup um but i also have said that before and we didn't do it um so it's going to be tough it's going to be really hard getting to this tournament um but i know the squad we have will do everything to make sure it happened or at least we've done everything to make it happen yeah well we're definitely wishing you all the best of luck uh with that uh we'll have to have you on um yeah when you make it yeah when you make it not to touch wood yes um so if you really really appreciate you giving up your your time and and taking time away from the incredible scenery uh of como to to chat to us um this morning really appreciate especially with how busy you are with the training schedules and especially with those double sessions as well um yeah really hoping that those ease off a little bit more just mentioning there's no double sessions anymore that was only in pre-season right okay well i'll have a world with victoire and i'll get those right back on for you as well for january thank you very much um yeah no worries thank you so much cheers thanks for having me take care everyone thank you so much for listening to that fascinating chat with sophie super super really interesting i feel like we could have done like a series with her rather than just a single episode 100 i love learning about the infrastructure around uh coma ofc what they're building behind that incredible brand i really want one of the tops i need to get one of the tops too um and also loved how she kind of opened up about all the things you should you know experience like behind the scenes and you know just like mental health and yeah how tough the challenges and the journey can be it was she was so good so interesting so open considered really enjoyed chatting to her yeah we're definitely gonna get back on 100 once she's qualified uh we'll be back on tuesday in the meantime you can find us on x and instagram i'm at morgy underscore 89 rach is at girls on the ball and we are at upfront underscore pod you can also find us on youtube at upfront pod see you next week

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