The Lionesses hit 500 matches, trailblazing Marie-Louise Eta and the Champions League semi-finals!

0:00Active Campaign is the marketing automation platform built for big swings and big dreams. Generate ideas in seconds, import your brand, and create full campaigns with simple prompts. Get started for free at ActiveCampaign.com. Craving the coffee flavor you love, but without the caffeine? Cachava's got you covered with their newest coffee flavor. This all-in-one nutrition shake delivers bold, authentic flavor, crafted from premium decaffeinated Brazilian beans. with 25 grams of protein, 6 grams of fiber, greens, and so much more. Treat yourself to the flavor and nutrition your body craves. Go to cachava.com and use code SMOOTHY.

0:39New customers get 15 % off their first order. That's K-A-C-H-A-V-A.com, code SMOOTHY. Hey, Chicagoland. Wayfair's big sale is coming to the Wayfair store. It's Way Day, and it's almost here. Starting April 25th, you can score huge deals on everything home, in person. like up to 60 % off mattresses, up to 40 % off appliances, and up to 60 % off home reno. Plus, you can take home the small stuff that day and get the big stuff shipped fast and free. Shop Wayday from April 25th through 27th at the Wayfair store at Edens Plaza in Wilmette. Wayfair, every style, every home.

1:19Rachel: Welcome to Upfront. I'm Chloe Morgan. And I'm Rachel O'Sullivan. England, stay on course for World Cup qualification. it wasn't a classic performance against Iceland but a win is a bloody win we'll give you the lowdown on the Lionesses 500th game and we'll hear how Ireland completed the double over Poland in part two we'll be chatting to journalist Kit Holden about Marie-Louise Etter who was recently named head coach of Union Berlin men's team last weekend she became the first woman ever to manage a men's side in Europe's top five leagues but what does this step mean for Etter and female coaches in the future finally we're looking ahead Headed to the Champions League semifinals.

1:56Rachel: God, it's been a while. Two big matchups, four giants of Europe, including three former winners. We can't bloody wait. Rachel, we've got quite a lot to get through. We do. This pod. It's obviously been quite a punchy international window. Has it? It's felt long. It's punchy in the sense that we've just been in our face for the last three weeks, essentially. Yeah, and we've kind of forgotten about domestic football. We've forgotten about European football. And we'll talk about the length of this window because I kind of miss the league, you know? 29th of March was the last time there was a WSL action.

2:27Rachel: Mancissia just like... We've got a trophy cabinet waiting here, guys. Can we speed it up? Just building away, building away, you know, like level by level. England pick up the points, amazingly, from a 21st-minute goal from Alessia Russo, which now means that they are first in Group A on 12 points, Spain just behind them on nine, Iceland on three, and Ukraine on zero, nil poids. it was a really good, obviously 100 % winning record in qualifying, four wins out of four. But like I said, Rach, it was a bit, it was a bit choppy in patches. It was, it wasn't one of the easiest games that I've ever seen them play.

3:03Rachel: It didn't feel as assured and kind of confident and I don't know, a little bit like fluid, I think, as the last Spain game. But I think obviously there were different conditions. You had the pitch. Sorry. Wasn't great, go on. Pitch was shy. What were you going to say?

3:17Chloe: No, I mean, pitch was shy for both teams, wasn't it?

3:19Rachel: Yeah, but I think it's, I think it does make a difference when you go from being able to play fluid football, being able to tick-a-tacky passes, the quick pace, it does get caught up. The ball bobbles differently.

3:29Chloe: It does break up the play a little bit more. And I think when you're... For both, but it does. But when you're a team like England who are doing a lot of running versus maybe Iceland are doing less running, particularly in that first half, the second half, when Iceland then decide to start pushing forward, England's legs are suddenly like lead. So yeah, but like I say, it was the same for both teams. but it's not an excuse it was just a factor

3:52Rachel: Yes, it was a bit claggy It was indeed But let's talk about the first half because I feel like that was actually quite a dominant performance There were some really good opportunities for England to kind of extend their 1-0 league but didn't kind of take it But like that Russo goal can we just talk about that for a brief second? That was a beautiful

4:09Chloe: passage of play Lauren Hemp doing the dog's work of getting the ball up the pitch shirking off at people trying to tackle her and laying a lovely pass for Russo. The turn then from Russo, kind of she received it kind of with her back to goal and then turned, I think, kind of clockwise around with the ball and arguably like from a ridiculous angle put in the bottom corner because when I watched it back, I thought, oh, I didn't realise she must have taken another touch to get that more central. But no, she just, she buried it in the bottom corner and it was that nice kind of from back to front quick football.

4:43Chloe: None of this kind of passing it around the box, trying to break up the defenders. and that's I guess the danger of for Iceland when you're sitting back a bit and then you counter you can get caught out with quick play like that I definitely think that's in the the game plan

4:54Rachel: because we saw exactly the same almost like a template situation in the Spain game previously you know I think it was Kira Walsh that started the play and then it was Hemp and then it was a ticky tacky with Lucy Bronze and then I think it was I think it was Hemp who struck the struck the post and you kind of see that that's what England are trying to do is kind of invite play up into their half and then counter very very quickly these long balls in midfield that kind of generate this kind of um additional momentum and kind of hit them so quickly on that counter but I I was just I was super impressed in the first half I thought it was punchy and then you've got this kind of the second half Iceland kind of I would say probably look like the more dominant side but still some really good chances from England you had that uh the Bethmead header um I mean the great great save from the keeper like point blank um but a save from it's a cross coming in wasn't it um but yeah i did think um iceland obviously came through and also we've got to give a bit of a shout out to hannah hampton but but yeah it kind of felt like they dropped off a little bit

5:47Chloe: yeah i think probably part of their game plan for iceland and i think a lot of people are just saying england switched off without kind of crediting the fact that i switch off like at all they looked yeah they just looked a little bit tired and on the back foot and i do think part of that was iceland's tactics to kind of maybe sit and absorb a little bit in that first half they definitely came out on the front foot in the second they were pressing England higher up the pitch and forcing them into kind of and England were a little bit sloppy then in possession and I think as well like as the game ticked on and it was 1-0 the momentum the crowd that just starts to swing Iceland's way because they know they're so loud yeah we're up in the box we're you know peppering their goal we're causing problems we're getting corners plenty of corners and that kind of confidence then starts to grow for Iceland in the second half I think Iceland got six corners and I imagine most of them were in the second half.

6:38Chloe: So, you know, it starts to kind of ratchet up the tension a little bit. Definitely. And I was just saying to you before we started recording and we'll get to Ireland later on, but this win, I feel like, you know, maybe last season or in previous iterations of the Nations League, a game like that would have resulted in a draw. So I think it's, you know, we were touching on the small margins that get you over the line in games like this. It's an element of resilience. It's an element of luck at times, you know, and these are important moments for England to ride out games like this. I think maybe, I don't think England underestimated Iceland.

7:12Chloe: I certainly didn't, we certainly didn't underestimate Iceland. I think some maybe did, maybe fans, you know, I saw some media saying that Iceland and Ukraine were kind of similar level. Absolutely not. The Dotties are pretty strong. They're a force to be reckoned with. But also they know their game plan. They're very, very good at it and they can do it and sustain it for 90 plus minutes. And I think that's where maybe a lot of teams fall down when maybe they rely more on their defense and being compact is that they don't have the fitness essentially to continue doing that for 90 plus minutes against a team like England or a team like Spain.

7:46Chloe: And I think Iceland are so diligent and disciplined in the game plan and fit enough to, you know, carry it out for that long. And they've got some quality in that team.

7:54Rachel: Well, I think that was the thing that I noticed most is like your back is kind of against the wall. you're 1-0 down you've got minutes left in the game sort of like 10-15 minutes and it felt like instead of them just sort of being quite tired because they'd obviously been running on those pitches a bit claggy it's a bit heavy they've not been able to capitalise on some of the chances that they've had earlier those last 10 or 15 minutes Iceland took it up to another level to a next gear and really put England under pressure I mean you've got 79th minute you've got Jansdottir on that left side who kind of cuts in cuts back hits the post it comes out Hannah Hampton absolutely incredible save just about managed to get her foot to it.

8:29Rachel: And then you've got in the 81st minute, it kind of falls to Johan's dotter from the corner. Again, Hannah Hampton coming out to smother it. But it kind of feels like that's the point in the game where you should be most tired. But it felt like the crowd getting behind them, it felt like they were really gunning for this draw. And to be honest, I think that second half especially, they kind of deserved it.

8:48Chloe: Yeah, I think a draw was probably a fair result. Yeah, I wouldn't have walked away from that thinking that was an injustice if it was a draw. I really liked what Anita Asante said in the BBC. on the BBC about Hannah Hampton. She said that Hampton's ability gives the team confidence in big World Cup qualifiers. That's what goalkeepers are there for. Bail out the defence when they get exploited. Hampton makes pivotal and vital saves in vital moments. She's a goalkeeper that loves a challenge and loves being there. She's alert, makes massive saves. The mentality to focus on her job and execute actions in vital moment gives the rest of the team the confidence that they can manage the momentum swings.

9:22Chloe: And I really like that. You know, when you know a game, and it happens in games, it doesn't matter if you're not playing a team who's above you in the rankings or who you should, you know, will expect a difficult game from, even if it is a team further down the rankings. There are going to be moments in games where the momentum shifts and it's how you manage that. And I think, you know, we saw a couple of periods in previous years where maybe those momentum shifts, England maybe wilt a little bit. And I think, I just really like that Hampton gives them the confidence to say, okay, the momentum is shifting, but we know we've basically got a brick wall back there that we're going to be able to manage it.

9:53Chloe: And I just really like that. I think there's,

9:55Rachel: I mean, that was perfectly put by it's really hard to add to comments that are so like eloquently stated um but i've got to agree and i think it's the development of hannah hampton i think has been super crucial over the past couple of years because we've seen her step into you know international football sort of a fair few years ago but kind of not getting a chance mary erps was number one there was a little bit of a controversial bit drama a bit of hoo-ha behind the scenes hannah hampton then steps in for uh for the euros last year does an incredible job is an amazing part of why we succeeded essentially in those big, like you said, pivotal moments.

10:26Rachel: But even with Chelsea, again, we kind of see her week in, week out, kind of dominating and being gone.

10:32Chloe: Arguably, and it's been said in kind of the media that, you know, this maybe hasn't been her best year at Chelsea. But, I mean, her bar is so high that even when she's not at her absolute best, she's still world-class. It's been no one's best year at Chelsea. No, that's fair. But I think the point is, you know, you can go through maybe rocky patches here and there. Sometimes I find with players, like when you pull on your country's shirt, there's just like another level that they find it's like the power she's obviously still a superb goalkeeper at Chelsea don't get me wrong don't come for me I'm just saying that in some of the media afterwards and even some of the questions asked to Serena Vigman it was look she's having a difficult year just generally the team I guess are having a more difficult year domestically and how valuable she is when she comes into the squad and pulls on performances like that you know Rachel Brown said it as well she was like if anyone thought that Hannah Hampton just had a good Euros and that was kind of a flash in the pan.

11:26Chloe: Like this is a reminder that she is an absolute world-class goalkeeper.

11:29Rachel: She's been building this for a very long time. I think there's a resilience and like I said, a maturity in her that I'm really starting to love. I'm very humble. She is very humble.

11:38Chloe: I asked about her post-match. She was like, it's my job. I can't go down the other end and score goals, but I can stop them going in this end. Alessia does her job one end of the pitch and I do mine.

11:46Rachel: I was like, she's very classic goalkeeper-esque. Like when she was making these amazing saves against Iceland, it was almost like Like there was no, there was like a small, I did see like a corner of her mouth. A quiver. Like when the players came over to her, like slapped her hands and stuff. But there was just like a, okay, great. Game mode, straight back in. Well, yeah, I guess you can't dwell on the moment too long. You can't be like, yay, I saved this. Oh, it's a draw. I lost my concentration. Yeah, no. So I'm going to be fortunate enough actually to see Hannah Hampton in real life this evening.

12:15Rachel: Rach, you're not going, but I am with your wife. So let's clarify, I was invited. You were invited. But I'm in a hospital tomorrow.

12:22Chloe: and I can't go. And me and Soph will be attending. It's a Sky Sports event. Sorry, you and Soph will both be attending the event separately but you just both will happen to be there. You're not going like together.

12:30Rachel: Yeah, we're not going together but we will see each other and probably spend the evening together.

12:36Chloe: Why are you saying it like that? There's going to be other people there as well. Why? What is wrong with you? You have a girlfriend. Why do you get so weird about my wife? Anyway, you're going to see

12:47Rachel: Hannah Hampton too. She better be careful. Yes, she is speaking with Kelly Cates. A little fireside chat which I'm really looking forward to most likely to kind of tell us a little bit about all the amazing save that she's been making over the past week or so but like you said I think she's probably going to be so frigging humble about the whole thing I'm hoping there's a Q &A and I can pop a little hand up and say something

13:06Chloe: if she asks you a question she's going to derive a different meaning from it

13:11Rachel: thank you Rage

13:12Chloe: should England qualify top of the group there are moments that you're going to look back on through these qualifiers and say and I just keep coming back to that Hannah Hampton save against Spain. Now I know you touched on obviously you made a lot of saves against Iceland as well but the save like kind of point blank last minute against Spain they're the moments that kind of where games turn on their heads or don't if you like and I just think you know I know we talk a lot about the goal scorers and the wins but there are other moments in games that have as much of an impact and I just you know they're the kind of if England qualify directly they're as big as the goals that were scored and speaking of goal scorers Lesley Russo 30th goal 30th goal What a moment for her.

13:52I think she's now in the top 10 of goal scorers for England, I think.

13:56Chloe: Christ. So that was a nice little 500th game, 30th goal.

14:00Rachel: Also, our Queen, Leah Williamson, returned and started alongside Esme Morgan, which was lovely to see. Welcome back, Leah. And like you said, Rach, let's touch on this 500th moment, because it's been, I don't think you can appreciate kind of the scale and the gravity of what a game like this means, what a milestone means for the Lionesses, the history behind this fixture. And they did loads of amazing activations, kind of bringing in some of the first lionesses back into the picture and doing these amazing commemorative shirts. Then you've got the Iceland players also kind of leaning into it, which is really lovely to see.

14:35Rachel: A lovely show. I love that.

14:36Chloe: We will applaud you at this, but we're going to try and spoil your project.

14:39Rachel: We will destroy you. We are going to try and make it

14:41Chloe: a most annoying 500th game.

14:43Rachel: It would have been. And it would have been such a horrible thing to have had your 500th game as a loss. So the Iceland players were kind of applauding the Lionesses onto the pitch before the kickoff to mark the game and then ahead of the game the players were asked if you could have 500 of anything what would it be? Alessia Russo said handbags which is unusual because I don't see Alessia Russo as a handbag girly if I'm honest.

15:04Chloe: I don't often see her with one so I mean 500 how are you rotating them?

15:08Rachel: And then we had Alex Greenwood saying cars I mean how are you driving 500? Where are you putting them? You'd need like your own car park. These are very superficial ones I will say Lionesses. Niamh Charles, even worse. Bars of gold. Smart girl. What, the investments? Absolutely. The value of gold is going up. Laurie Hemp.

15:26Chloe: Well, essentially, it's money, isn't it?

15:28Rachel: Yeah, no, fair enough, fair enough.

15:30Chloe: And, you know, women's football doesn't pay.

15:31Rachel: And then she can buy 500 cars and 500 handbags. It's very unlikely to be able to retire on the money. Laurie Hemp, I thought would have said Lego. Instead, probably down a level, custard creams. Love that. You're not building a lot with 500 pieces of Lego. 500 custard creams will keep you going. I don't think 500 custard creams would keep a lioness going, actually. It could be the end of your career, to be honest.

15:51Chloe: Depends on how you spread them out or how frequently you receive them. Leah Williams said pounds from Leah Williamson. That's kind of boring. Yeah, I was going to... I thought she would have said, like, plain ham sandwiches or something like that. She loves a plain ham sandwich.

16:03Rachel: How do you know that?

16:04Chloe: She's spoken about it. Really?

16:05Rachel: Yeah. Hannah Hampton said chocolate milks. Aw. A mixed bag in here. A really mixed bag. I love a chocolate milk. That's a hard one. What would you have?

16:15Chloe: good question maybe like go on like either like 500 wishes which you could like oh fucking drop me out or like dogs

16:26Rachel: 500 dogs

16:27Chloe: yeah

16:28Rachel: where the fuck are you gonna put 500 dogs

16:30Chloe: struggling with two cats 500 with anything 500 what would you want can we maybe get our listeners into this because we could be here a while thinking about it see it's not that easy it's not that easy a question no it's not that easy a question because you're like if it's gonna be like big things where are you putting it? It could end up being more of a headache than anything. Trainers for me. £500 would only get you like a train up to Manchester.

16:51Rachel: Yeah, I don't know why Leah said that. I'm not going to get you anywhere. No, trainers. It would be trainers for me. Yeah, all right. I'd take trainers. Yeah, okay. Or 500 like vouchers for like meals. You just got to be smart with it.

17:02Chloe: This is what I mean. That's why Neves is clever. Yeah, no fair. 500 like diamonds. No, that's not very ethically produced. Something like that. 500 lab grown diamonds. that's where we've settled on I don't know if lab grown diamonds are as expensive basically you want something that you can sell that's worth more than houses the gold I can't manage 500 houses I need to hire a whole team then and then you're wasting more money listen we're down a road we're down a road here 500 episodes so that we can discuss

17:31Rachel: 500 more minutes on this podcast right in terms of the remaining fixtures that England have we've got Spain in Mallorca on the 5th of June and Ukraine at Everton's Hill Dickinson Stadium on the 9th of June. If they win both, they will secure automatic qualification for the World Cup in Brazil next summer.

17:51Chloe: If they, like, draw against Spain or lose against Spain, it puts even more pressure on that Ukraine game. So interesting. Don't. Because Spain now have the same goal difference as England. They're both on plus nine.

18:03Rachel: But it also depends on how Spain... Get on against Iceland. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Because the Spain game is second last as opposed to last. But I think it's also the importance of trying to get this thing wrapped up now. So you don't have those additional games. Like, you know, you want to be as fresh as possible. And the least minutes you have to play between now and Brazil, the better.

18:20Chloe: Do you know what, though? Maybe it's good that the Spain game is first. Because I think we've seen over the last few windows. I mean, I think this window is going to be two weeks as opposed to three weeks. But, you know, you see England have come out in the first game being probably a bit better than in the second game. And I think they spent that chunk of that first kind of week and a half focusing on Spain and then they had about a three-day turnaround to prep for or four-day turnaround to prep for Iceland so maybe it's good that Spain's coming first rather than second I

18:50Rachel: think it's also the mentality of it like you got you want you want you want to get your biggest battles out of the way with first you do not want to get into a situation where Spain would have won their game England win their game and then it's like the finale of like yeah I think the pressure is too high so yeah but like saying this it does feel like it has been a very long time since we've kind of talked about any other football apart from international football this three-week window has been great i think in some ways but in other ways i feel like it's the end of the season you just want things to be wrapped up you want to get things out of the way man city are kind of like for fuck's sake can we just can we just see out what is essentially going to be their title um but yeah do you not think it's felt quite quite wide it has and i think it's because i mean the

19:33Chloe: window is designed to play three fixtures but you don't have to play three fixtures if you don't want to obviously um which england and a lot of european teams haven't done serena veegman said essentially that what she's enjoyed about it is that it gives them more time to kind of talk tactics and do you know look at stuff like that which maybe you're so wrapped up and just game focus in normal windows that it doesn't allow you to do that much kind of tactical stuff which is kind of interesting but she also said which i thought was interesting given this stage of the season players are in different places essentially with their clubs so like maybe you're still in the Champions League or maybe you're still in the latter stages of the cup you know you think it has been bloody ages since the WSL because we had FA Cup right before the window so that sounded like an extra week I remember domestic football exactly but you know so she said that basically players will then come in in different stages if you like of some might be tired some might be a bit fresher and that extra week then gives them a bit more time to get them all up to the same level which I thought was really interesting.

20:33Chloe: But yeah, it does. It feels like a long time. I think that's the end of the three week breaks for this kind of period until, I mean, next year or whatever it might be. So I think it's two weeks from now on.

20:43Rachel: Oh no, fair.

20:44Chloe: But it has felt long.

20:45Rachel: It has felt long. It has felt really bloody long. And I miss the WSL. And I'm looking forward to sitting back on the sofa this weekend and catching up with it all. But before we talk about anything WSL related, we've obviously got a throw to your team.

20:57Chloe: Yeah.

20:57Rachel: Ireland. Getting their second win over Poland in the space of a week. Denise O'Sullivan almost scored the most amazing, incredible solo effort.

21:07Chloe: That would have been, I think it was Tony from RTE who's talking to her afterwards. And he was like, we witnessed you score. Oh no, we witnessed the best goal you never scored. Because she ultimately didn't put it in the back of the net. But like the most unbelievable solo effort of like two flicks and then over players. And then, yeah, hitting it off the crossbar. She got player of the match. Unbelievable. Marissa Sheva, again, unbelievable. Emily Murphy as well. that's the kind of

21:31Rachel: almost effort though that you think no one's ever gonna you won't remember it almost because it just it didn't happen it didn't happen yeah it's just like no one remembers an effort that didn't go in yeah

21:39Chloe: but it was you know really important game obviously having beaten Poland away it was always gonna be tough against the same team again and as cliche as it sounds the team that's just gotten beaten will always have more lessons to learn and you know they'll be bruised and they'll want to come out and spoil the party at the Aviva Stadium in front of 18 ,000 fans as well which is nice so to get that win it was a bit more of a cagey affair it wasn't like last time out where Ireland kind of were on the front foot Poland definitely came out in the first half but I thought Ireland managed it really well and I think again what I said about England was that like in previous windows I feel like they would have let that slip that lead slip they'd kind of wilt under the pressure a little bit if Poland were kind of knocking on the door towards the end and they didn't the fact that they were able to hold out, you know, ensure that they got the three points is massive, good for the mentality.

22:33Chloe: And it's huge. I think Carla was saying they're the first team from pot four in League A. So essentially like the lowest ranked team into a group that have won two games. So that kind of, that group is, I'm not going to say wide open. I mean, technically it is wide open, but you've got like the Netherlands beat France. So the Netherlands are on eight, France are on seven, Ireland are on six and Poland are on one. so I don't think we ever expected Ireland to be that close to either the Netherlands or France and the only gutting thing facing the Netherlands in Cork in June is that both Denise O'Sullivan and Emily Murphy will be missing due to yellow card accumulation the injustice no but like of all players we missed Denise O'Sullivan against the Netherlands the last time and there was just that it felt like a Denise O'Sullivan shaped hole in the midfield where the Netherlands were getting a lot of joy so she was really missed and you know for those two players Emily Murphy has gotten player of the match in the first three games of these qualifiers Denise O'Sullivan got it in the fourth so you're really missing some crucial players in that Netherlands game

23:38Rachel: Well I was going to say before the pod started you're obviously seeing the praises of Emily Murphy you think like she's the biggest best thing that's ever happened to Ireland obviously she's currently at Newcastle but we've got a really cool question in from Lank Chops on Instagram Could a WSL move beyond the cards for Murphy?

23:54Chloe: I don't see why not But I mean, equally though, she's getting game time at Newcastle, which has been kind of a big turnaround in her end product because she's always been quick. She's always been great at triggering the press, at kind of putting pressure on defences, getting up the pitch, the ball. But I think I said in the previous pod, it was the end product that was kind of lacking a little bit. And now that game time at Newcastle has really helped that. What I wouldn't want to happen is to go to a team in the WSL and her start getting less minutes. yep so sometimes I think yeah when players have a bit of form they end up getting snapped up you know there's been talk about Lucia Kendall will she get snapped up and go through you know sometimes you're like the value of being regularly playing I don't mean this in the way it's going to sound but like a bigger fish in a smaller pond almost you know that kind of way where you're more important in a team you learn so much from that so I mean she's good enough too but if she does I really hope that she's getting the minutes then she deserves it's great it's just really good like a lot of excitement around the Ireland squad I said it last week that kind of balance they've managed to strike between Ward Bowl and Ireland Bowl and they've kind of found that balance and again a bit like some of the players we were talking about for England like they pull on an Ireland shirt and I think it was Aaron Clark from LOIW he does a lot of the Ireland games and he was speaking to Kira Caruso afterwards and she had an unbelievable game she missed the first game through illness and he was like look I know sometimes you're not getting a lot of minutes a club or whatever over in NWSL but like what is it about this you know why is it your game is so like unbelievable and she was like you pull on this shirt and you get in amongst this team like everyone wants to do absolutely everything for the badge and for each other and there is you get that sense anytime you talk to someone who plays for Ireland that it's that that collectiveness that they've kind of developed around the squad they've had it before I think you know dipped a little bit after not qualifying for the Euros took a little while to kind of get around get their heads around that and get over it but there is a unity in that squad where people will literally put their bodies on the line for the team so yeah it's just it's exciting someone said you know we were so disappointed after the Euros you kind of felt like what was next and now it feels like something's building again and there's excitement building again and that's really nice to have

26:12Rachel: Sounds like you like them Not bad Yeah Well thoughts for Ireland and the Lionesses as they face these games in June we'll wait and see like what the outcome of that and where they land in that table is.

26:23Chloe: Carla Ward said that the, I think it was either that the World Cup would be poorer without Ireland or something like richer with it. You know, that kind of, it was like the World Cup deserves to have Ireland in it. You know that kind of way? I would agree with that. I love that. 100 % agree with that. Could you imagine Carla Ward at the World Cup? She would be so excited.

26:40Rachel: Oh my God. Coming up after this, journalist Kit Holden joins us to discuss a historic appointment in Germany.

27:19We'll see you next time. and use code SMOOTHY. New customers get 15 % off their first order. That's K-A-C-H-A-V-A dot com, code SMOOTHY.

27:35Rachel: Now, we wanted to tackle something a little bit different this week. Last week, unless you're living under a rock, you will have seen that Marie-Louise Etter made history by becoming the first woman to manage a men's team in one of Europe's top five leagues. she will be Bundesliga side Union Berlin's head coach until the end of the 25-26 season everywhere this was huge news and it was really nice to kind of have this like beautiful positive moment that everyone was talking about as this you know this woman who's achieved this historic moment by becoming the first coach in a men's top flight we still haven't seen this in the UK so for this to be happening in Germany it kind of felt like we wanted to explore a little bit more about what was going on, what the reaction was like.

28:17Rachel: Yeah, getting a view from someone who really understood how this has landed.

28:20Chloe: Yeah, and also, we've been talking about it in the frame of the Premier League and the discussions there and how it will be received here. And it's interesting to kind of find out the difference of how it's received in Germany and just how, not necessarily more progressive, but like how fans receive it and media receive it over there versus here. So definitely want to delve into that.

28:41Rachel: how was this appointment initially received in germany at such a massive moment not not just in germany but across the world i mean we were talking about it quite quite a bit in the uk too yeah i mean i think strangely the initial reaction was probably a bit muted but that was mainly because they announced it at quarter to midnight on on saturday night so i think a lot of people already in bed but once once everybody woke up it was obviously obviously a huge huge story as you say not just here but but across the world and i think we saw that on your last week i mean i turned up at training on Tuesday morning and the groundsman's eyes were out on stalks because he said he'd never seen so many journalists there and it was the same a couple of days later at the press conference and you know at the game on Saturday so yeah it was a huge story and I think you know obviously for obvious reasons I mean Germany there are other female coaches working the Sabrina Wittmann and Ingolstadt but obviously this is a groundbreaking moment in that it's a it's a Bundesliga club it's a top flight club and obviously that that you know has a lot of significance but I think in Berlin itself and around Onyorn it was perhaps a little bit less surprising because Lieta has been around for a few years, she's a very very well respected figure at the club and really both from the media perspective and the fan perspective there was a general consensus that it was an obvious choice she was the right person to jump in at this point and a safe pair of fans to get Onyorn over the line in the relegation fight

30:00Chloe: She has broken records before November 2023 she became the Bundesliga's first female assistant coach also at Union Berlin and also deputised for Bialetze who was coach at the time while he was serving a three match suspension she was also managing the Union Berlin's under 19s team as well so maybe no stranger to breaking through those glass ceilings and as you touched on has obviously developed quite the reputation that a lot of respect in the game Like what kind of, she's highly thought of, you said there, what do you think her kind of strengths are as a coach? Yeah, I think first and foremost, I think she's a good people person.

30:40She's a good man manager in that sense. It's a kind of old fashioned term. I think she, you know, she talked a little bit in the press conference last week about, you know, she was asked, is it different to coach men or to coach women and to coach youth players? And she said, not really. It's about individuals and building those relationships with the person in front of you and adapting to different characters within a team. And I think you can see that on the training pitch. She's very involved with the players, very vocal. She's building those relationships individually and with the group. Tactically, I think she's probably, her instincts are a little bit more attacking.

31:13With the Ender-19s, she's played some really, really good football this year. But with the men's, I think she's going to have to rein that in because for the last five, six years, they've been a classical lower half of the table Bundesliga team who play its safety first and its counter-attacking, its defensive stability. and that's what she's going to have to be doing in the next few weeks. And I think she's fine with that too. But I think that kind of, yeah, those personal skills and a straight talker as well. I mean, Ronnie Kadiro, the vice captain, was talking yesterday about how she's come in and she's not minced her words and she said what's going wrong.

31:44She said what's going right as far as she's concerned and the players have reacted positively to that.

31:52Chloe: Given her time at the club and the fans know her and you guys know her, Do you think it was the reaction to her appointment more widely? Was that expected or did it come as a bit of a surprise, given I imagine for those in and around the club, as you said, it felt like a natural appointment and I guess maybe they thought it would just carry on. But now you've had all this kind of media scrutiny around the club. Yeah, I mean, I think obviously people knew that it would be a big story. I mean, it's obviously it is a big story. It's a big moment in German football and European football at large. but I think there is a bit of a discord between how much it makes sense from an Onyong perspective I mean she's done the job before as you said under Bielica she stepped in for a few games she's been in that role before, she's been in that position and also she was under 19 coach and as the sporting director Horsetel said last week once they made that call to sack the manager and to get an interim coach in internally rather than externally who else do you go to apart from the, you know, Oñon don't have an under-23 team, so the under-19 coach is effectively the next one down.

33:03So she was the obvious choice. And I think she does fit. Oñon is a, you know, it's a smaller club. It's a club with a very, very strong identity. People really like the coaches to understand the club and understand the identity of the club and to kind of chime with the general vibe of the people there. It's very, very rooted in the local community. and Maki Luzieta definitely does that. You know, the way she goes about her business, that kind of what I was saying earlier about her being a straight talker, not mincing her words, that's very in line with Oñon. She was born in Dresden, which is albeit a different region, but not so far away, and I think a lot of people do identify with her and see her as a very kind of Oñon-like person generally.

33:45Chloe: I guess as well the other thing is having to block out the noise, which must be so frustrating because the scrutiny is if things don't go well, it's because she's a woman. They've had to deal obviously with online backlash. Horst Held, the Union of Berlin's director of football, said, I've noticed the sexist comments, but I refuse to give these voices a platform. I find it absurd that we still have to justify this in 2026. Their strategy online has been, especially on Twitter, has been to respond directly to the comments, which I don't know, I kind of like that when you see a club coming out and just kind of directly approaching that kind of rubbish that you see online.

34:23Chloe: What do you make of their strategy of engaging with that? Yeah, I mean, I think club president Dirk Singler said it, sort of phrased it on Saturday. He said, we've thrown ourselves into the fight in that regard. You know, they've kind of gone out all guns blazing. And yeah, it is good to see them. And there's some people asking, you know, do you have to do it? Do you have to be on a platform like Exitool? You know, are you not giving more oxygen to those voices if you're engaging with them? But I think once you're there, I think it is good to stand up to it and kind of expose it for what it is.

34:52And I think part of what Unión have done in the last week or so as well is they've reacted to the bad stuff and the negative stuff, but they've also pointed out the good stuff. And club spokesman Christian Arbeit pointed out last week, he said, even in areas of football, which are generally a bit more male-dominated, a bit more conservative, a bit more backward, we might say, even from those areas, they've had a lot of support, a lot of positive messages. And I think that's been part of it as well to kind of say, look, yeah, there are these idiots online, you know saying the negative stuff but there's actually the overwhelming response has been really really positive and and and from all corners and all sides as well i think as well it probably

35:32Chloe: helps for etta as well because you know she is the focus of this big change if you like and breaking through that glass ceiling and she's under the microscope so to know that the club i guess outwardly has her back obviously they they believe in her they've appointed her but to see them kind of, as you say, go to battle a little bit for her must be quite reassuring for her as well. You know, she's not doing this alone, essentially. Yeah. And I think, you know, she's sort of trod the line quite well. I think, you know, she's not shied away from how big the story is and how big the appointment is.

36:06And she's sort of been very open about how she understands the responsibility and the significance of her role in this whole thing, while also trying to say, look, I'm a football coach and I want to concentrate on the football first and foremost and I think yeah I think having the club behind behind her in that respect is helpful and I think to be fair I think you know it's quite clever in some ways if you look at the long term the way when you want to have done it you know they they have a very good coach on their hands they understand it's going to be a big deal to put her in charge of the men but you know she was put in charge for one game as an assistant coach under Bielica then she was part of a duo coaching them with Croso when Bielica was fired now it's the next step as interim you know head coach but interim coach and and you know who knows maybe in a year two years three years we might see her you know taking on the role permanently um I don't think anybody would be surprised and I think in some ways that kind of phasing in has sort of normalized it a little bit more at every step and allowed it to be to take the pressure out a little bit yeah I mean

37:00Rachel: what what will be the transition period I suppose between her going from the men's into the women's again is there do you see a future in her going to the men's again I suppose in in the long term like you kind of alluded to. Yeah, it was interesting. I mean, initially, Oñan didn't rule out that, you know, if she did well, that maybe she could stay at the men's beyond the summer. I mean, she signed her contract with the women's, I think, two weeks before taking over the men's as interim. And they went back on that at the end of last week. And part of the rationale for that, the thing that the president said, was, you know, he didn't think he'd be doing women's football any favours to say if she does well, she stays with the men.

37:33And if she does badly, you know, she goes back to the women, in inverted commas. and I think that reflects on Jorn's general kind of strategy at the moment. They've invested really, really heavily in women's football over the last few years. They're on a hugely ambitious project to basically bring the women's team up to the level of the men's. They're building a training complex at the ground at the moment, which is going to be shared by the men's and women's professional teams. It's not equal pay, but they're paying some of the highest wages in the women's Bundesliga. They really do see themselves as trailblazers as a club that's trying to raise the bar for other clubs in women's football in Germany.

38:09And part of that is having what Singler says is one professional department, professional football department, with two teams, a men's team and a women's team. And I think Ita and her role at both in the next few years is quite a good example of that. you know essentially she's a very good coach who is who is on the books at the club and and they will want to employ her in the roles that that you know are best suited to her at any given time for the moment that's that's interim with the men's next season she's going to have to have a very ambitious project with the with the women and and everything they want to do um and then in the future who knows but i think the the general strategy on your own is to bring the two sides a little bit closer together and have them working much more as as one organization with with sort of

38:51Chloe: two sides if you like well regardless of whether she still goes to the women's team or stays with the men's team more broadly do you think how do you see this impacting i guess more widely on the clubs in germany like are there other women in positions in clubs in germany that could potentially you know make that step as well do you think it's going to impact that mentality Yeah, and I think it's certainly changed the discussion a little bit. I think even if you look at the way Vincent Kompany was asked about it and spoke very eloquently about it before the Real Madrid game last week, I think little things like that just, as I say, they kind of step-by-step lead to a certain amount of normalisation.

39:34And I think, you know, Etta herself pointed out last week, you know, she's not the first step. You know, talk about Sabrina Bittmann at Ingolstadt and other female coaches before her in German football, but also in French football and elsewhere. And this feels like a milestone, a watershed, but at the same time, it's part of a process that will continue, hopefully, going in the same direction in the next few years. I think Onyol definitely see themselves as a huge part of that process and a club that is trying to break new ground, trying to encourage and explicitly saying to other clubs, look, we expect you to come up behind us and to match us and to try and overtake us because that's what we're trying to do here.

40:13We're not just trying to kind of dominate the women's Bundesliga or make a big media storm or, you know, do any of these things in isolation. We're trying to change the entire structure and the entire culture around women in football and women's football in Germany. And I think, you know, it's a funny thing because on your own, some people see them as a very progressive club, some people see them as a very conservative club. It depends what issue you're talking about at any given moment. But I think on women's football particularly, there's a very kind of hands on sleeves up. Let's just let's just get stuff done.

40:43Let's stop talking. Let's not, you know, stop with the platitudes. Let's actually put on money where our mouth is and, you know, employ the right people in the right positions and invest properly in women's football. And as I say, I think I think they really do see themselves as trailblazers in that regard, who hopefully will pull the rest of German football up with them.

41:02Chloe: It's funny, isn't it? Because like, obviously, we celebrate this big moment, but equally, you're like, it's 2026. how are we having to still have these first moments and you know you're also then putting it not only is she the first person woman to be doing this job as we've touched on but like she has to then deal with that extra expectation that extra pressure you know it comes with so much more it just must be so difficult being the the one to be that trailblazer I guess I think it's such a

41:30Rachel: huge thing though to have created this moment and then the second person who comes up behind you has someone to kind of you know learn from their experience to kind of you know you create a more of a community because like you know in in the uk we still haven't seen uh a woman become a premier league manager or even a even a championship manager that still hasn't taken place i mean we're still struggling with all kinds of representation in the premier league but i think that that's the thing that i don't think maybe i mean when you speak to her does she sort of appreciate the gravity of what she's achieved or does she just think to see actually it's just a promotion into into a role that you know she was destined for because she has the credentials and she she was the best fit for the job?

42:06Yeah, I think it's a bit of both. I mean, I think, you know, she's a clever person. She understands exactly the significance of it. And, you know, she spoke a little bit last week at the first press conference also about wanting to be a role model and that kind of being the counterweight to all the negative stuff on social media, you know, ignore that stuff and focus instead on, you know, understanding that doing what she's doing, she's an inspiration to not just in football, but in any walk of life to young girls who can say, okay if I do excel at something and if I am good at something then I can you know do it to whatever level is possible or is there in my field and so I think she does absolutely take on that responsibility as a role model and see herself in that regard but yeah I think there's always that reining in and saying look at the end of the day I've got a job to do and that's why I'm here is because I like being a football coach and I like working with people that was her opening gambit at the press conference last week um and you know that's that's the kind of the bread and butter and and always the the first priority absolutely love that um no thank you thank you

43:09Rachel: so much for for giving up your time to talk to us about it because it's um it's been something we've been talking about the uk has got absolutely crazy for it um yeah we've been talking about sort of the impact that it's going to have on coaching here and how many more you know women and girls are going to want to get involved in coaching programs we've got um there's a great organization that we have here called the powerhouse project and they're kind of working with all types of organisations to get more coaches in and they were saying they've seen an uplift in the last year and you know the ambition is not just to you know grow women and girls coaches to go into the women's game but it's to grow coaches at every single part of the infrastructure so you know moments like this really really matter so I really appreciate you giving us a bit of a behind the scenes look at what's been going on with the club and the players and the reaction so thanks for your time.

43:51Thanks very much for having me.

43:52Rachel: Coming up after this the Champions League semi-finals are nearly here.

44:01Rachel: Oh, Rach. I forgot about them. European football exists. Yeah, we could finally get back to talking about it,

44:09Chloe: to be honest. It's got to be interesting, isn't it, for all teams to come back to these massive games after massive games. Well, but like a break from domestic football.

44:22Rachel: It's going to be even harder for the players who have been involved in the international fixtures to go from these massive, you know, major tournament qualifying games to then go back into a major tournament, or like, what kind of a major tournament? Like a semi-major tournament qualifying game, essentially. There's no rest for the wicked, do you know what I mean?

44:40Chloe: But there's also no, like, league game to kind of get your mindset back in with your team. No. Do you know what I mean? Where you're kind of like, oh yeah, lads, yeah, you're the person I'm, you know, going to be trying to find out the pitch. Oh, you're on the left. Oh, you're on the right. I'm with you now, like, I've got my club hat back on. It's just like, bam!

44:55Rachel: One of the biggest games of the season. Boom. We've got Bayern Munich versus Barcelona on Saturday the 25th. And then we've got Arsenal versus Lyon on Sunday the 26th. It just feels like this is the fixture. This Arsenal versus Lyon. Second year in a row that we've seen it. Obviously, Lyon, eight-time winners in this competition. The last time they faced each other, Lyon won 2-1 at Meadow Park in the league phase. It kind of feels like a... It's always a big rivalry. Oh, sorry. Yeah. Yeah, deja vu, but also a massive, massive rivalry. Yeah, there's something about Lyon that always, it always scares me.

45:31Rachel: Puts the frighteners up you. Yeah, it does. It makes you feel very, very... It scares the bajasus out of you. It does. Why are you saying it like that? Why are you not fearing this? I am. They're terrifying. But then also Arsenal, at the same time, you've got your Champions League trophy. You're defending it. But there's like a mentality shift, I think, for Arsenal that actually, they've done it before.

45:50Chloe: Yeah, and Arsenal just seem to, almost like it doesn't matter how they're doing in the league, they seem to really enjoy the latter phases of the Champions League. Yes. And what's interesting is, you know, we often say about, you talk a lot about, you know, the way they play at the Emirates and how much they enjoy playing at the Emirates and how important it is for them. And when they were playing against Chelsea, we'd said if Arsenal want to win this, they have to win the Emirates leg of it. What's really interesting is that when they played Lyon last time, they lost at the Emirates. and then went on to batter Lyon at the Groupama Stadium, which nobody was expecting.

46:26Chloe: So I don't think it's going to be the same kind of showing.

46:30Rachel: That's a big stake in the Suns.

46:31Chloe: I don't think that's how it's going to go this time around. But yeah, I mean, look, any of those teams would scare the bejesus out of me. But yeah, Lyon are quite frightening.

46:39Rachel: I just, I feel a bit nervous. But at the same time, I think when you are defending champions, I think there is something, and because it's been so fresh that they actually have the trophy, they have beaten you know opposition like Barca like they they've already kind of they've slayed a giant not too long ago in the same competition and I I think there's a lot to be said for something like that plus you've got Leah Williamson back you've got your leader back in the squad like you've got your there's assuredness I think that that she provides in in big moments like this so

47:06Chloe: I think that that will be helpful yeah I do like we kind of forget that I'm sure Leon are going to be like this is a tough prospect we're coming up against Arsenal they beat us in this you know situation last season like so they're going to be feeling pressure as well but looking from a perspective of you know in English media who want the English teams to go as far as possible they're a frightening prospect like Melchie and De Mournay is don't just there's a lot of names Katoto should I say that instead is that the vulnerable of women's football is that better like you know Johannes there's so many like some young players as well coming through yeah it's quite the stacked squad would you like some stats as well Yeah, go on.

47:46Chloe: It'll make me feel worse.

47:47Rachel: Lyon are unbeaten in Ligue 1 this season. 19 games, scored 68 and conceded just nine. 68 goals in 19 games. What? Do you know what I mean? I mean, it's also haven't had a bad season, but it doesn't. Comparatively speaking, it's not Lyon's season that they've had. Yeah, it's going to be scary. But I do think obviously, you know, like you said, I do think there's a bit of kind of a, the mentality around the Arsenal fans at the stadium. I think that is always like we talk about, they've been the 12th person, kind of like getting behind the squad. Like they know how much he's getting. They're all going to want to go to the final again, back to back Champions League finals.

48:28Chloe: Part of me wonders as well, you know, I was just saying beforehand about how they'll be coming, all four teams will be coming into this off the international break. But then equally, it means that they're, the backroom staff, the coaches, et cetera, have had this last three weeks to purely focus on this game.

48:44Rachel: Yeah.

48:45Chloe: So from that perspective, you're coming back into club this week. You don't have to think about, you know, arguably league football, right? All you need to think about is this. So maybe, maybe that is beneficial for the teams to be able to have all their focus on that. You know, I think we saw kind of almost, not two arsenals across the Chelsea game, but you know, they weathered a storm against Chelsea.

49:07Rachel: In the last, in the last matchup at Stamford Bridge.

49:09Chloe: And the first match, the opening 20 minutes, Chelsea hit the bar twice. They were on top.

49:14Rachel: I think they grew into that first game. I think they were more aggressive in that first game. For sure. In the second game, it was just like, we've just got to see it out. Just get it done for straight the hell out of them.

49:21Chloe: But it almost like gave Arsenal experience in lots of different things. You know, from weathering a storm against a team who have some quality up front that have frightening pace, you know, to, you know, being clinical in front to goal. That's the other thing that they were. To then kind of riding out that second leg where they were trying to score but equally they knew Chelsea had to score and was going to come out so they had to weather that a little bit as well it's just they're important kind of lessons and battles to overcome ahead of a team like Lyon because you're going to be

49:54Rachel: absolutely up against it I think um I think you're completely right I think there is a kind of um there's an experience I think you gather from going into these two leg fixtures because I think like the team that you face in the first leg even though it's the same team isn't necessarily the team that you're going to face in the second leg do you know what I mean like the mentality shifts depending on where you are, like the aggressiveness, like your tactics might change. What you're going to face in that first leg isn't the same as the second leg. And I saw Arsenal be able to pivot and actually adapt to that really quickly.

50:20Chloe: Yeah, and then conversely, obviously, Lyon were up against Wolfsburg and I think probably weren't expecting, I mean, I know I wasn't, to see Wolfsburg leading after the first leg. So equally, Lyon have gone through some battles to get through this as well, to come back from 1-0 down, away from home, to then go home and have a really good showing scoring four goals you know happy to be back home and winning the leg there which is you know compared to what happened last season against Arsenal is going to give them a huge amount of confidence to be able to take a match back home and essentially you know really comfortably beat the opponent at that time at that stage it was Wolfsburg they won 4-0 they've both I think gone through it it's been a battle if you like I'm going to keep saying battle because it feels like a war that they can both learn from It just makes the ties really intriguing because I think everyone's going to think about what happened last season and think like, oh, you know, no bother.

51:17Rachel: It's definitely not a no bother. And I'm just saying, don't be thinking no bother. What's your score prediction? I won't even say score prediction. Who do you think is going to go through?

51:26Chloe: I think it's really what makes it hard to call is because we've not had any league games in the last three weeks. So you can't be like, based on form, such and such are looking really, you know, in front of goal or they're looking compact. it's so hard to kind of judge based on not having seen them for the last few weeks to really be able to work it out like obviously would love to see an English team get through to the final again but Lyon are a very terrifying prospect Arsenal can do it equally so can Lyon it sounds like you're sitting on the fence I'm sitting on the fence for the love of God what about you?

51:58Rachel: Arsenal good one yeah thank you that's literally the question that I asked you know I didn't ask for all the analysis this is what this podcast is for no no I didn't ask you to sit on the fence and give me yes, but, but also on the other hand. It's not for you. It's for our listeners. Just in case though. Yeah. Definitive. In the other semi-final, Bayern and Barcelona, I'm eating for the second time. What did I just say?

52:21Chloe: No, but before you ask me who you think is going to win. Oh, right. I'm being definitive.

52:24Rachel: I'm being definitive. Oh, Christ. She learns quickly, does this one. The first time Barcelona thrashed Bayern 7-1 on the opening night of the competition. Bayern bounced back and won six and drew one in their following seven games um what do we kind of make of this matchup because Barca are fierce but whilst I think Lyon scared the shit out of me Barcelona give me nightmares like long-lasting PTSD type nightmares um they're another team that are just like the shite how she like yeah but like in another way they're like um almost like Or was it Stranger Things? What's the thing in Stranger Things?

53:02Rachel: The... The Demogorg. Yeah, that. Demogorg. That's it. Yeah, that's Barcelona.

53:08Chloe: I think my concern for Bayern is their defence a little bit. And, you know, with against United, especially the first leg, it was just a bit like, forget it, we'll just score more. It's fine. Defence looked a bit shaky. And I just fear for a slightly shaky defence against Barcelona. I'm a big fan of Pernilla Harder, so I don't think she's a wonderful football player. and I'm delighted that she's doing so well in this tournament. She's obviously desperately wanted to win. I mean, they all do. But for a player like that to not have won the Champions League seems crazy.

53:40Rachel: She's got seven goals already.

53:41Chloe: Yeah, let's hope she's got her shooting boots on.

53:43Rachel: She does have a history of scoring in the semifinals. She scored in Wolfsburg against Chelsea in 2017-18 and then for Chelsea against Bayern in 2020-21. So maybe that's something. That's a positive, I suppose, to take away in a way.

53:57Chloe: Yeah, and you know, coming off the back of a fairly successful international tournament, they beat Sweden. So yeah, I just, I slightly concerned about that back line. But Patri, I'm pretty sure is not going to make this fixture because she sprained her ankle, didn't she, against England, which is a big loss. And I'm pretty sure Bon Mati is still out. so that's not ideal if you're going to look for anything if you're a Bayern Munich player it'll be that they're missing some key players in the midfield but they do have Alexi Pateas obviously in there It helps, I've heard I think what we saw against much of the Spain backline is similar to the Barcelona backline and actually maybe that's quite beneficial for them to have kind of played together during the international window So coming back in may not be as, I don't want to say jarring, but you know what I mean?

54:51Chloe: In terms of the players in and around you, you're like, yeah, I know you. So that would be beneficial for that Barcelona back line. But I do think it's a mountain for Bayern. Look, you've got to beat the best to be the best, but no one wanted to draw Barcelona, did they?

55:08Rachel: No, quite frankly. And in a way, I'm kind of glad, being more of an Arsenal fan than anyone else that's left in the competition, I'm very glad this matchup didn't happen early doors. What's quite exciting, I suppose, in a way, is that we might have like a duplicate final and Arsa, Arsa? If you like them both. Arcelona. And Arcelona final. It was such a great moment last year. It was like one of the highlights of 2025, obviously, as well as the Euros, but it was just such a beautiful thing to have witnessed in real life. So would I say I'd love to see that matchup again? Yeah, probably. I'm just looking at their front line it is horrible Claudia Pina Vicky Lopez Eva Peor well the worst thing about that front line they obviously have been very prolific in this tournament so they're the leading scorers in this competition this season 32 goals so 10 more than anybody else

56:01Chloe: I mean they scored 12 goals in the quarter finals

56:04Rachel: yeah fair insane fair and they've also conceded the fewest just 5 goals as well so yeah bonne chance good luck

56:14Chloe: Good luck to Bayern. Look, it's a two-legged semi-final. Be in it in the second leg. Like that's going to be, that's the tough thing when you're going out against a Barcelona is yeah, you want to win the tie, but you're not going to win it in the first leg, are you? You can't expose yourself that much in the first leg against Barcelona. You don't want to be, what was it, 6-0 down or something in the first leg. You need to give yourself a chance in that second leg. So the way they approach them is going to be really interesting and it's, bodies on the line for that first leg to keep themselves in it.

56:47Rachel: I think the interesting one though is that you also want to have, you've got the home advantage for Bayern. So I think if you don't if you go into the second game with a deficit and you know that you're going to Barca that's a very tall mountain to climb.

57:01Chloe: Bayern fans can be good and noisy in the Allianz. So be in it. First leg, stay in it.

57:08Rachel: Squeaky squeaky button time.

57:09Chloe: And it could be super interesting in the second.

57:11Rachel: all right well it was quite nice to talk about something other than uh other than the um the qualifiers uh really enjoyed that champions league chat um we'll obviously talk all about the games next week after we find out a little bit more about how they've all got on um thank you so much for listening to up front find us on instagram and x slash twitter i'm at morgy underscore 89 rach is at girls on the ball and we are at up front underscore pod you can also find us on youtube at up front pod we'll be back on tuesday for all the reaction from those champions League semis and the return of the WSL.

57:42Rachel: What's that? Come on, come on. See you next week.

58:02Upfront is a Stack production and part of the Acast Creator Network.

58:37We'll see you next time. percent off their first order. That's K-A-C-H-A-V-A dot com code smoothie.