#3251 Ladies of London S4E02: Truth or Dara

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1:00Ben Mandelker: What happens when there's so much that crap ends? What happens when there's so much that crap ends? Who cares what happens when there's so much that crap ends? Hello and welcome to Watch What Crappens, a podcast about all that crap on Bravo that we just love to talk about. I'm Ben Mandelker and joining me today is the one, the only, is he a madam or is he not? Ronnie Karam, how are you?

1:26Ronnie Karam: Oh my gosh, I wish I had the business acumen to be a madam. Yeah, it's hard.

1:31Ben Mandelker: It's a lot of work. It's a lot of effort. We are talking Ladies of London, the second episode that premiered at the end of last week. Before we dive into that, only a few days left to watch the replay of the crappies. Thanks to everyone who went and made little watch parties over the weekend. That was so cool. I saw some people gathered around. There were some videos of people. Some people got together on their sofas and watched together. and we are really flattered and we really appreciate that you took the time to sit and gather and watch the crappies. So if you want to check it out, if you haven't seen it yet, go to watchwhatcrappens.com.

2:11Ben Mandelker: There's a link there and the replay is available through Friday, Friday, Friday. Also, patreon.com slash watchwhatcrappens. That's where you get our ad-free feed, brand new newsletter. just hit the streets. It's hit the streets. It's walking down the streets. It's poking in to Starbucks, getting a coffee and continuing down the street. It's having a great day. So check out the newsletter. Also, our video is on Patreon. So all that great stuff is there. Come join us. Today, we are doing Amazon Live and that's going to be at 1.30 West Coast time. that's new time 1 30 and that means of course 4 30 east coast time so that's all the exciting stuff unless i forgot anything i don't think i did um and let's get on with it let's go to part two basically of the two-part premiere ladies of london i have to say ronnie um first episode i was like i'm not really feeling mark francis i felt like he was so over the top he felt like more affected but second episode i was it was either the second episode or me having more time to get used to him i totally was like on board i'm on board with mark francis no notes on this show anymore it's like it's an amazing show it's so good it's a really good show i hope it keeps up

3:30Ronnie Karam: you know i hope it doesn't like fall on its face in episode three because all week i've been like ladies of london ladies of london ladies of london i'm the town crier you know watch it please

3:41Ben Mandelker: Well, it felt like a lot of people on the internet or all weekend long, people were talking about it. Like it seems to be it is the rage for the Bravo sphere. Everyone's talking about that in Southern Hospitality, which really had two super strong premieres that last week. So I'm hoping the ratings actually match it or whatever metrics that Bravo is using these days to decide what shows are successful.

4:02Ronnie Karam: Yeah, me too. Because that's good. So here we go. Ladies of London, season four, episode two. I wish they wouldn't call it season four because it's really not the same thing. I get that they're rebooting it, but the first Ladies of London wasn't that popular. And so it's like, why bring back a show that wasn't that popular? Just either give it a name or just call it Ladies of London, The New Reign, and just have it be season one. Because I think it confuses people. If they see season four on Bravo, they're like, well, I can't watch that. I haven't watched the other three seasons. And then they watch the other three seasons.

4:32Ronnie Karam: They're like, meh.

4:34Ben Mandelker: even though we loved the thing is also the first ladies of London was I think a little bit closer to a real housewives brand but this one definitely has a different feeling to it right it definitely feels like we're watching socialites going out and doing socialite things it's not as family oriented we've barely spent really any time with their families and I think that's really good because you need to have some sort of separation between the brands right And so I think the show just has so much attitude and I love it. You know, as the gays would say, this show is cut fitnessy. It's really cut fitnessy.

5:13Ben Mandelker: I think it's like actually the most cut fitnessy that any like Bravo show of all time. Like already. I'm like, I don't think there's ever been a Bravo show that's been so cut fitnessy.

5:23Ronnie Karam: Yeah. And I can see how that would turn into a bad thing if it's someone that we really liked that they were going against. But in this case, it's someone that deserves, you know, seems to deserve it from everything that we're seeing. So it was super fun. And they also do it in such a fun way, you know? Yeah. Like the whole, oh, you think she'll be offended that I called her a madam? I had no idea. Like, yes, that's a horrible, you cannot call somebody a madam. Like, I just thought it was making her more interesting. Like, they're shocked that anybody would be upset that they're telling the whole world that they're a madam.

6:00Ben Mandelker: Yeah, an architect. Like an established architect.

6:03Ronnie Karam: I thought I was making it more interesting, darling.

6:05Ben Mandelker: I know. Yeah, the show is so cup fantasy. Maybe Gallery Girls is probably still the number one of all time. But this one, so far in two episodes. I mean, just the opening line, it starts with Mark saying, people often ask, can you tell when someone's an American? Well, yes. The moment they open their mouths. That's like right out the gates.

6:28Ronnie Karam: Cut to Micah. She's like, hello, London calling. Got a telephone. Or even before. So then Emma is, okay, we have to remind ourselves who all these people are. Which one's Emma? Oh, Emma. Okay. Emma. Yeah. Emma's like the socialite. Which one is Emma? Why can I bring it in Emma? Emma's the royalty. She's the one that lives in the castle that has been turned into a safari and has to bathe rhinos every day but pretend, you know, like she's happy. so she's like when you go to america when you go to a shop they're like this is my name this is what i do we don't talk as much here and then we cut to margo and margo's like yeah i'm an actor i give a guy a hand job one time in a movie yeah i mean my hands were sticky but it really got me some popularity i have kids now you know i love the smell of these candles do you like candles that smell i love candles that smell i'm giving this candle a hand job olivier award am i right

7:27Ben Mandelker: we are so chatty it's crazy we're out of control emma's like and it's lovely they're much friendlier than us probably i like when she says when it's which is lovely which is her way of saying which is so unsophisticated and embarrassing for them as we call it lovely yes bless her heart you know

7:47Ronnie Karam: it's like the southern bless her heart they're much friendlier than us probably and then we got a lotty and she's like but i think my advice to any american trying to make it in the london scene would just be good luck maybe if you could find yourself a johnny depp in a skinny pant you'll get by but until then good luck so then kimmy is having lunch with and um then the waiter comes up

8:18Ben Mandelker: to her and was like, would you like another drink? She goes, well, I would have liked one 28 minutes ago.

8:25Ronnie Karam: I think on the whole, we rather like Americans. I think. I mean, on the whole.

8:33Ben Mandelker: She's like, well, I'm sure there's exceptions and now that I think even harder about it, maybe not on the whole, maybe on the half. On the half, we'd like them. On the quarter. Maybe down to one-fifth.

8:43Ronnie Karam: So now we go to Micah, who is the manners lady, the American trying to teach British people manners, which is hilarious. So we go to a business meeting at her house with Ari, her head of marketing, and they're going over her schedule. And the producer's like, okay, well, tell me how you got into doing etiquette. She's like, so I was an American living in London, and I was at this amazing dinner, and everybody just knew their cutlery so beautifully, and they were holding their champagne flute so effortlessly, gliding around a dinner party, and I just felt so insecure. And then Marco, my husband, I mean, he grew up in Switzerland.

9:18Ronnie Karam: So, you know, this was second nature to him. But he wasn't going to tell me I was right or wrong because, you know, Switzerland. So, you know, he actually took the time and said, well, why don't you learn something? So why don't you take an etiquette class? And, you know, I know that's the last thing that the boy you're dating, he wants to say to you. Like, wow, you're a pig. Take some etiquette class. But I did. And we got married. Worked out for me.

9:41Ben Mandelker: so then she's like yeah i actually trained underneath a former member of queen of england's household staff and she taught me princess diana at it she probably she taught princess diana's etiquette yeah she did that and my love of etiquette came from confidence i got through it and i just wanted to give it to other people which i think is such a beautiful thing i would love it if like her etiquette teacher was just a full-on con artist like yeah uh so uh yeah that's right governor i taught princess diana etiquette you know i can teach you to you want my resume i clean them i clean the queen's eye soul all right pay me a fishing chip today if you feed me a fishing chip today i'll pay you tomorrow so we see a video called try this trick to eat chips

10:28Ronnie Karam: quietly she goes guys chip chip noise is rude so if you don't want to offend everybody around you eating a chip put it in your mouth and then put your lips around a chip and it makes the noise soft it dampens the noise to the chip oh my god but now you have chip shit all over your lips

10:46Ben Mandelker: if you've ever wanted to see what it looks like to give a chip a blowjob watch this video she's like literally blows the chip i was like whoa but also i was like i'm gonna try that because that was really cool.

10:59Ronnie Karam: Don't do it because the salt from those chips, I mean, your lips are going to disintegrate. They're not going to have lips anymore. That stuff is not to be touched.

11:08Ben Mandelker: It just was the funniest image. It was like fish lips. She's like, she's going to take her 10 minutes, eat that chip. She's like.

11:17Ronnie Karam: And she also didn't learn that from the queen's assistant. That symbol. She's just making shit up for content. You know, it's like, oh my God. Okay. What are we going to do today? What's something that's rude? What is something that's rude that needs to be addressed? Oh, God. Oh, God. Chip noise. It's chip noise. It's chip noise. It's chip noise. Hurry, get me out of here.

11:37Ben Mandelker: I'm writing a memo to the Frito-Lay Corporation to reduce their chip noise. Yeah. I feel like no one in the palace, Buckingham Palace, is eating chips anyway. Although those types of chips. So now, yeah. So, Micah's telling us, you know, I met my husband in New York City in 2008. and I just fell madly in love. And then boom, Marco gets a call that he's being sent back to London. And then I went. He said, you weren't supposed to come with me. This was what we call a ghosting. And I said, no, I'm going to follow you. And he said, but I was sort of hoping you would just stay back in New York. I said, no, I'm here.

12:13Ben Mandelker: And so he said, okay, well, I guess we'll see how this works out. So now he just flies away every week and he's gone every single week and I never see him. So we're really happy.

12:26Ronnie Karam: I just write him letters saying, I figured out the chip noise pollution. Come back. Come back.

12:34Ben Mandelker: He's trying to get away so badly. He's like, sorry, got to move to Europe. I guess this is a deal breaker. So I guess our relationship is over. Not necessarily. I'll come with you.

12:43Ronnie Karam: I was like, yeah, he's never here, but he wants to be. So, you know, I'm raising the kids. He wants to raise the kids. So he just can't because, you know, private equity. It's very private. I can't talk about it. So private. I don't even have his phone number, really. But I do write letters.

12:58Ben Mandelker: I did try to tag him in the video about the chips, but he didn't give it a like yet. But I'm sure he'll see it soon.

13:04Ronnie Karam: So the kids, Max and Valentina, are there. And she's like, oh, yeah. I mean, there's definitely times when I'm burnt. You know, at the end of the week, you're burnt out. And all you want to do is melt to the ground. That would be so rude. Or just be a puddle of human on the ground. Don't do that. If you want to melt into the ground, don't do it. Go into a walk-in. Get yourself together. Nobody needs a human puddle on the ground. It's rude. Don't embarrass America. Your husband will never call you.

13:29Ben Mandelker: I love that her daughter's name is Valentina because it maintains the tradition of having a Valentina on Ladies of London. Valentina formerly was Caroline Stanbury's assistant. So the spirit lives on. It's like there must always be a Valentina. And I would love that Valentina also talks about that. Bad news, mom. Bad news, mom. We learned about shapes in school today.

13:55Ben Mandelker: Bad news, mum. Got a B in my simple fractions quiz.

14:03Ronnie Karam: Bad news, mum. We're not doing math anymore. Now we're doing Singapore math. What the fuck?

14:09Ben Mandelker: Bad news, mum. Just learned about the history of this country. It's pretty dark, mum. Oh, well, that's great.

14:19Ronnie Karam: Long line of loud chip eaters. We've got here. Mom, can I go to this toy store today?

14:28Ben Mandelker: Sorry, I'm choking on my own saliva. I'm laughing so hard, I'm choking on my own saliva. I can barely get out of Valentina.

14:35Ronnie Karam: Oh, Valentina the assistant. I will never forget that voice. Oh, Mom. It's like, whoa, Valentina. Here's a lozenge. It's time for a commercial.

14:46Ben Mandelker: It's time for a Crappens commercial. Ronnie, there are some moments when I crave a little treat. Do you ever have those moments?

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17:46Ronnie Karam: facetiming marco and uh max is uninterested because you know he's probably got abandonment issues or whatever and micah's like well i just i rely on my friendships in london because you know i don't really have a husband here you know some people get to talk to their husband i don't really so you know i get to talk to my friends without my friends i've just got this sock that i put on my hand hi marco i love you honey i wish i was with you i wish you were with me too marco my god why is my hand still moving it's just my voice it's still the sock talking marco come home

18:18Ben Mandelker: hey sock marco do you want to try eating a potato chip okay look quiet so micah is like yeah so you know I don't have family physically with me in London my friends are my family my family well my family actually said we're not here right now please leave a message on the machine which is funny because answering machines haven't been a thing for like 25 years but that's what happens when I call and I just have my friends and it's really just Dara if I don't have Dara then who do I have who am I without Dara

18:51Ronnie Karam: who am I let's go to Dara this is Dara. She's at a restaurant called Ivy Asia and she's getting ready for a dinner party and putting out name cards and stuff and she's like, you know what? I think that we should put the name on both sides of the card. I love that. I love when there's a name on the front and there's a name on the back. That's how Dara does it. Architecture.

19:16Ben Mandelker: My dinner party is at Ivy Asia because I want to treat everybody to something special with the Chinese culture to show them a little bit of my culture. so I'm like these ladies are going to be too drunk to get any sort of appropriate lessons from any culture right now so then Dara sees Lottie she FaceTimes Lottie and she's like oh my god you look beautiful she's like oh thank you it's my pregnancy boobs plus just being naturally British I just have a general beauty about me don't I stupid Americans that was a diss on them a little bit you want to take a dig at an American right now

19:50Ronnie Karam: alright well you've heard about Mark's garden party haven't you she's like yeah i mean my colleague filled me in a little bit but like it sounded like an interesting conversation and the producer asks her so what about this rumor that you're a madam and she's like oh oh oh and then they just show her kind of staring off into the camera that's my favorite thing they're doing with dara like everybody even the people who are shooting her are like this lady is such gold don't even say anything just keep the camera on her she never answers the question by the way and she just kind of like stares off into this she just laughs and kind of stares off into the distance and um what i'd love

20:30Ben Mandelker: is that she obviously quits the show by the end of the episode and um they clearly don't have any interview footage of her like they don't have any pickups so they clearly just have like the weird low quality cell phone interview they did for the sizzle reel so it's like this low quality interview in the middle of the show, just Dara. And she's like, I mean, like, is it a big deal? Like, no. I think that Micah's certainly more sensitive than I am. I mean, the truth is people will formulate more opinions about a public figure. And Micah doesn't have a public persona yet. So for her, it was probably a bigger deal than it was for me.

21:11Ben Mandelker: I've been called much worse is what I'm saying.

21:13Ronnie Karam: She is more upset that Micah knew about it first. She's like, well, it's just that Micah's not really famous enough to understand that people make stuff up about famous people. Poor Micah.

21:26Ben Mandelker: Yeah, she's like, she's just so alarmed because she's just not famous enough to know what it's like to have, you know, crazy rumors made up about you.

21:35Ronnie Karam: Well, it'll be cleared up on Thursday, I'm sure. It's going to be so fun. Now we go to the Mayfair district and Emma's going to a tea house to meet Mark. and he sees her and he's like, oh, good lord, it's you, woman. I've never seen a woman as wonderful as you.

21:54Ben Mandelker: He basically gets up in the middle of the restaurant and goes running across the restaurant. He's like, oh. And Emma's like, Mark Vandelli is incredible. He has been my friend for ages now. We met in San Troop here 14 years ago and he's the funniest person in the world. Wait, do you want to see me laughing at his jokes? Here we go. Ha, ha, ha, ha. Anyway, he's also so kind. He's amazing with children. He's my youngest son's godfather. He's wonderful.

22:22Ronnie Karam: Emma and I are not friends. Emma is essentially my Siamese twin. Because whatever we are, wherever we are in the world, we're somehow always connected, and we're always thinking the same thing.

22:36Ben Mandelker: So they sit down and everything, and Mark's like, oh, look at us. We're both so fat. she's like i always say i'm prosecco and he's champagne and that is basically what you need to know ah ah so then uh she orders tea and everything she's by the way this woman is like very elegant and very beautiful and there's like a sadness behind her eyes like i kind of feel like she's like trapped in a life she doesn't want but yeah she lives in a fucking zoo a literal zoo

23:08Ronnie Karam: She's like, I thought I was getting a castle. And then they told me we had to start a zoo in the backyard to keep the fucking lights on. Now I have parties and everyone smells dung. Okay. This is my life.

23:19Ben Mandelker: But she also does seem like she is someone who is in the aristocracy. I mean, she is. And like, you can tell the difference because she's just, she's just way more restrained. Whereas like Marca's like, oh, hello, darling. And she's like, oh, hello. Hello there. So I enjoy her sort of like her quiet restraint. I'm not going to say disdain because she does seem to really love Mark. But there's something about her that is like silently judgy, which is one of my favorite qualities.

23:46Ronnie Karam: Yeah, I think part of her is like, why am I here? You know?

23:49Ben Mandelker: Yeah.

23:50Ronnie Karam: So she's like, oh, she says, oh, so Kimmy comes in and she's like, oh, hello, darling. Hi. I certainly hope you killed that animal that you're wearing yourself, Kimmy.

24:07Ben Mandelker: Kimmy is an icon I first met Kimmy when I was like 17 through my husband Koli Sulin is what we decided that's how it's pronounced and Kimmy is like oh I love I met Sulin 100 years ago back in the decadent days when we were still allowed to go to the big country houses and break antiques you know that there's someone that was like, did they let that American back in who was breaking all the antiques?

24:37Ronnie Karam: The first time I met her, she was like 17, and I went to her house so drunk that I collapsed on the floor. And her mother was like, are you alright? Do you think you could make it home? And I'm like, I don't know. So her mother handed me my car keys, and off I drove.

24:53Ben Mandelker: So, where have you been? I see you were in Cannes. I love the pivot from, like, I was so drunk, I fell on the floor, and her mother yelled at me. So, how was Cannes?

25:03Ronnie Karam: Well, I was in Cannes for like the longest Cannes of my life, doing simultaneous jobs, overlapping. I got to be glamorous. Oh, fantastic. Oh, carefree. Were you carefree? I was carefree. Kind of. Well, anyway, I need to know what I missed. Oh, God. Did somebody step in poop of some kind? No, it was me. It was me.

25:23Ben Mandelker: Sorry. You don't understand. I was doing so much in Cannes. I had to take a picture on top of a staircase. I had to take a picture in the middle of a different staircase. I had to take a picture at the bottom of a different staircase There was just a lot of staircases that I took photos at I'm very tired

25:38Ronnie Karam: Can I ask you a question? What happens if one needs a wheelchair in Cannes?

25:44Ben Mandelker: They didn't have a single rhinoceros down there So Emma's like Tell me about this party This garden party And so Kimmy's like Well, the funniest part about the whole fucking party So Martha Sidwell's fresh She's fresh They're like, oh darling Don't choke, darling.

26:03Ronnie Karam: Don't choke. That's what happens when you eat. Don't eat. How many times do I have to tell these ladies? Eating causes choking.

26:13Ben Mandelker: This is one group I never want to choke amongst because none of them will give you a high-milk. They'll just sit and laugh in your face. Oh, look, she's dying. Isn't this positively hilarious? She's going to die. Well, enjoy your last few moments while you asphyxiate. We're going to have a martini in your honor. Have a great life. Congratulations. R.I.P. fatty. That's what she got for eating. Am I right? So Kimmy is like, Margo came out and said the other day that this Dara girl, thank you to whoever did that, is a madam.

26:49Ronnie Karam: Oh, we're spilling tea, are we? Oh, I just love it, a madam, I tell you. Well, I don't know about this. This doesn't sound good. Oh, shut up, Emma. It's funny. It's a madam.

27:02Ben Mandelker: Think about it. A madam. First of all, it's a French thing, which is hilarious on a show about British. But also think about it. She knows prostitutes. If you really, she's an architect. She probably built her own brothel.

27:17Ronnie Karam: It is funny. Probably less funny to a Marquisa or whatever I am. And she's like, well, I'm not saying I don't gossip. Of course, who doesn't love gossip and tea? You know, it's just funny, I suppose. I mean, Kimmy says it is. but the less I know about this, the better, frankly. Su Lin won't like it.

27:35Ben Mandelker: So this Dara person, was she there? Oh, no, no. She told me she had her best friend's wedding and she said, oh, it's in Tuscany. And I said, oh, that's great. You know, I just bought a house in Tuscany. Where? And she goes, well, I don't know. My assistant book it. I said, oh, hoo-hoo.

27:52Ronnie Karam: Oh, so she's rich, rich. Hoo-hoo-hoo. Yes, well, anyway, she's invited us to dinner. A lady who went to Tuscany But doesn't know which part of Tuscany I can't wait to see what she's going to serve for dinner

28:06Ben Mandelker: Wait a second Mark Francis So you bought a house Where did you buy a house? Oh yes it's in Florence I bought this house because I thought actually It was a very good way to spend more time with my father Unfortunately he's slowly deteriorated So let's have a moment I'll be serious for about 10 seconds I'm so sorry This is very this show

28:25Ronnie Karam: where everybody, it's like they turn a switch and then everybody gets really dark. I mean, his whole face gets, he has kind of a dark face anyway. And I mean, emotionally, like his eyes get dark. You can see like little dark clouds swirling in his eyes. He's like, yes, I bought this house because actually it was a good way for me to be close to my father, who's deteriorating rapidly. Anyway, anyway, fabulous, Tuscany, wonderful. We've just got our first olive garden, did I tell you? Ooh.

28:56Ben Mandelker: So you're the only child? Sad. Sad. He's like, yes, I am the only child. Can't you tell? Oh, well, back. Back to fun times.

29:08Ronnie Karam: My relationship, dark moment, dark moment, thank you. My relationship with my father growing up was very simple, really. I would fly to him, go to Italy every weekend, and then fly back on a Sunday night. It was just a constant series of goodbyes. All right, lights back. Lights back. We've got that one, right? Print. Print that one.

29:29Ben Mandelker: Sir, it was also a constant series of hellos, okay? I'm like, put a smile on your face. Be American. So Kimmy is like, well, if you need help with anything, just ask Dara. She probably knows who to help.

29:45Ronnie Karam: She'll at least find someone for you to snog.

29:50Ben Mandelker: I'm still having a dark moment. my father and I haven't really spent very much time together in the past 30 years too much solitude, too much pain too little understanding, too little connection, really am I doing lyrics that sound like they're from the 90s? Perhaps, but that's okay I don't want to be too late it sounds like that Kathy Dennis song too many walls have come up between us oh father

30:16Ronnie Karam: dark brother, Tova oh father Here I am dancing on my own

30:26Ben Mandelker: So Kimmy is like Well if there's anything you need If you need just a bowl of cockles I can make that for you It's my children's favourite

30:32Ronnie Karam: Well I need so much Dark moment over Dark moment over Well she's already got a nurse's uniform And a cupboard Vintage I'm sure Except it's latex

30:47Ben Mandelker: and then Kimmy takes a napkin puts it in her hair and she's like look it's like my leisure nurse's hat and they're like oh could I come in I'm sultry now

30:57Ronnie Karam: how could I refuse such a generous offer oh I couldn't I couldn't

31:03Ben Mandelker: Dr. Dara the madam she represents me

31:11Ronnie Karam: so now we go to a photo Kimmy's enjoyment over this madam storyline is hilarious so now we go to a photo shoot and uh lottie's doing her pregnancy photo shoot but she doesn't look pregnant so they're gonna do it anyway she's 17 weeks pregnant and she you can't even tell but she's like i'll just put my hand on my stomach does that work and then her husband who looks like a goth mr peanut is there of course she's like joshua and i met at the box

31:43Ben Mandelker: which is an infamous nightclub in Soho. And the man walked in with his fedora and his mustache and behind them was a family of women with lots of lip liners like Lexi Wood and her mom and dad and her sister. Hi! And I thought, my God, is it Johnny Depp? Is it the year 2001 when Johnny Depp was someone that we lusted after? Because it's dark in here, you know? And he does have that look. And I thought, wow, I'm about to be super famous with Johnny Depp. Turns out it wasn't Johnny Depp, just some sort of playmation stick figure person. And I thought, sure, why not?

32:21Ronnie Karam: It wasn't Johnny Depp, but it was something more infamous. Anemia. So we got married immediately. You know, it was two hours later, someone found us snogging downstairs at The Box. By the way, I'm just going to keep saying The Box because it's very popular on Bravo lately. The Box, The Box, The Box, The Box. We're hearing a lot about The Box. Is it a

32:41Ben Mandelker: chain yes i guess i wonder if it started in london and then went to new york probably did well the

32:47Ronnie Karam: rest is history we got engaged after eight weeks of dating we were married within the year and this year we'll be three years married and we've got a baby on the way oh so we see this is baby cane up on the screen as she holds her stomach and uh this guy really is like i can't wait for this baby to come out so i can suck out its stem cells he looks creepy this guy the first ever sonogram

33:10Ben Mandelker: that has a handlebar mustache. So she says, I think it's just the obvious thing for people to assume, oh, he's a man that works in fashion, so he's gay. Oh, he's a man who dresses well, so he's gay. Oh, he's a man who has sex with other men, so he's gay. But you know, honestly, I find his flamboyance really attractive. We do our nails together, like we do our makeup. It's so fun. And honestly, it's like a proper partnership. It's not just you're a boy, you're a girl. It's like, we are one.

33:40Ronnie Karam: I've married me, a very sickly me, but a me all the same.

33:46Ben Mandelker: So good for those crazy kids. Is this the new Alex and Simon? Is this the second coming of them? This strange sort of codependent and wacky couple, but we sort of like them?

33:59Ronnie Karam: I'm totally into them. I think that that's a good comparison. Yeah, I really like this couple. And I like that they're so weird. And they're like, let's just do each other's makeup. Who gives a fuck?

34:08Ben Mandelker: I kind of love it, too. I love that they're like

34:11Ronnie Karam: I kind of would like to follow him and see what he's doing Cause she's you know she's not So it's only episode 2 but so far she's not that Interesting but he is Follow him around

34:21Ben Mandelker: I mean I will say he is a tailor to the stars And his suits are tailored Within a millimeter of his body Like they fit him like a glove I was like this guy is talented Yeah I mean I guess yeah He looks great He does look like a Victorian cartoon but he is talented

34:38Ronnie Karam: one thing has nothing to do with another i mean he looks like consumption but yeah he's very talented so then we go to martha's uh grottage uh the gross cottage oh and she's inside talking about how she okay so martha my favorite one this little shack that she lives in with all the paint falling off and all the stains and bird shit coming down the walls and she's like oh god I wish I could run the Hoover, but it's just too late now, isn't it? And Hekate is flying around. And Ernie, we find out that she's got other pets sleeping in his bed. And so she has this tin of biscuits, cookies, you know, so she's opening the tin.

35:20Ronnie Karam: And the producer's like, OK, talk to me about the British biscuit tin. What exactly is that? She's like, well, I live with rats. I've got to keep them out of the biscuits somehow, don't I?

35:31Ben Mandelker: So then her friend Mimi shows up. Mimi's like, and Martha's like, so Mimi's an interior designer and I have a very good friend of mine. She comes to help me with the grottage. I am prone to painting everything pink and then covering it in cherubs and gild. I'm basically a gay Arab man trapped in a white straight woman's body. This is good to have Mimi keep me on the right side of kitsch. I was like. First of all, I also did not expect her, like her, like her instinct to be like pink with cherubs. Like that's shocking to me. I thought she was going to say, I like to paint it black or something, but she just wants to make this like garish Rococo mess.

36:10Ben Mandelker: And so they sit down and she's like, I love the grottage. I mean, what I don't love is the wallpaper peeling off and the damp patches. The number of times she just says there's damp patches and you see like full on like mold and like the ceiling falling down. It's just a damp patch. Don't worry.

36:26Ronnie Karam: this apartment is basically like three week old cheese i mean it is just mold it is disgusting looking and she's like oh you know there's a bit of wallpaper coming off it's not the wallpaper it's the wall the wall is coming off of the wall okay she's like everything's covered in magpie

36:43Ben Mandelker: crap i'm like you could clean that though you know like that's something you can do like maybe

36:49Ronnie Karam: you should do it i mean it's dripping down all the walls and she's like well i did find a painter And Mimi says, oh, I'm so looking forward to this renovation and rebirth. Sometimes birth is best done through fire.

37:07Ben Mandelker: Oh, darling, you're such an angel to help me because I'm just sort of, I feel a bit drowning at the moment, which I love that. I feel a bit drowning. Not that I don't feel like I'm drowning. I just feel drowning. I feel the sensation of drowning. I feel a bit drowning at the moment. It's been a bitter five years.

37:25Ronnie Karam: It's been a bitter five years. And she's doing the hard blink and smile. Yes. And her hair is perfectly curly tightened. You know, those tight curls coming down. It's like, no matter what's going on, I will get my curls in. So she tells us her story. She's like, five years ago, I had a really tough breakup. It was really a death of the ego. Get dark. Get dark. Dark moment. Dark moment. And then I was just keeping my head above the waves with all the grief. You know, when a man outside my house started making strangling noises when I was walking my dogs at night. And I had to move. I had to move for my mental safety.

38:05Ronnie Karam: What? And you had a man making strangling noises at you at night as you went to your house. What the? Are you sure it wasn't just Mark? Like, darling, you're poor now.

38:16Ben Mandelker: I was like, are you sure you're just not living in Los Angeles? This is crazy, though.

38:22Ronnie Karam: I mean, all jokes aside. My God. Schizophrenic man who defense lawyer called a bit odd is cleared of stalking model and face of Royal Ascot, Lady Martha Sitwell. Sitwell.

38:33Ben Mandelker: So I'm not laughing. I'm not laughing at this. This is scary. Like whenever, like whenever you hear stories about stalkers, it is really terrifying. I just am laughing at the fact that like it's again, so British from our American perspective that the lawyer characterized the stalker as a bit odd. A bit odd. There's someone who's a bit odd outside. I'm afraid we're going to have to make some sort of injunction about the man who's just slightly odd.

39:01Ronnie Karam: The stalker was a bit odd, but in his defense, he did eat his potato chips quietly. So there was a plus for him.

39:11Ben Mandelker: Turns out it was just Micah wearing a hat. Yeah. Choking on the chip that she was trying to be quietly.

39:18Ronnie Karam: Like, oh, look, it's making shit.

39:20Ben Mandelker: This person's making strangling faces. I must move. It's like, no, I just need some Heimlich. Please, will any of you British people do Heimlich on me? No, unfortunately, we just laugh.

39:30Ronnie Karam: I'm sorry, I would, but I'm carb-free and you've got chips all over your lip. She can't do that. So they are looking at this apartment and it is really run down. And Hakate is, she goes, oh, there's this like little net hanging above a door, like a flat basketball net. And she's like, what's that? Because did you add that in there? And she goes, no, no, no, that came with it. But, you know, oh, God, look at that. Hekate has stolen my measuring spoons. That's where those went. Well, I'll just leave those up there. I'll just leave those up there. At least I know where they are now.

40:06Ben Mandelker: I love the bird. The bird took the measuring spoons and put it in its little net above the door.

40:13Ronnie Karam: So what kind of apartment comes with that net? She's like, oh, no, that was already here. What? What do you mean that was already here? Where are you living?

40:21Ben Mandelker: and and by the way it says in that headline that that lady martha sitwell was the uh face of the royal ascot which is you know they're big like one of their big races i believe it's just like crazy i think the face of this like esteemed event that happens in england is like living in this in this decrepit cottage with quote-unquote damp spots and like a magpie that's stealing measuring spoons above the doorway so martha's like my last real home before the grottage was very beautiful lovely airy light flat in south kensington also covered with bird shit you just could not even imagine oh it's so beautiful i miss it sad this poor designer this sad talk moment

41:05Ronnie Karam: over it's come back to life i'm happy now i'm happy now though she's got a lot of work cut out for her because she goes well we'll remove that net right i mean we're not going to keep that She goes, no, no, no, no. We should keep that. I love that. What? What are you talking about? And I can't stop obsessing over the net. It looks like a basketball net, but like with no hole in it. It's like, do British people just love the pain? It's like, oh, Americans, go ahead. Try and throw a bowl in there. Boom. Didn't get a basket. Loser American.

41:35Ben Mandelker: It looks like one of those nets they put out like under a Ferris wheel or like a roller coaster. That way when your shit falls out of your pockets, it just catches it.

41:44Ronnie Karam: Yes. Or when someone's doing stunts off a high building and they have like a thing to catch you. Yeah.

41:52Ben Mandelker: Or the nets they have to put at like a stadium. You know, they have to put the nets in front of the railings now because people will lean over to catch a baseball and they'll fall off. So they have to put a net there to catch the people.

42:03Ronnie Karam: Yeah. So Martha says, well, budget wise, at the moment, I can only afford to do the sitting room. I hope that's all right. And by budget, I mean, I've got a cracker. Would you like a biscuit out of a tin? That's my budget.

42:19Ben Mandelker: The rats haven't gotten it yet. And Mimi's like, okay, well, two and a half grand. Well, we can do that. But when I left my husband, I really wanted to behave honorably in our divorce. But it was difficult to get legal representation. And he had a big, he had big legal representation. So by the time we got to court, there was apparently no money to be found. so what I got from divorce was my title and not a lot else. Dark moment.

42:46Ronnie Karam: But I really want to build my life because at every turn I've thrown away my life to go look after these rich men and they're not looking after me.

42:56Ben Mandelker: You know, old Martha would have just been picked up by another knight in shining armour but new Martha doesn't want a knight in shining armour. I really want to do this for myself and it's harder but I'm working at it. I don't know what caused the new Martha, but I'm I am I'm rooting for new Martha, but I'm also concerned for new Martha.

43:20Ronnie Karam: Yeah. And Mimi's like, oh, well, only good will come from here. Trust that. But the look in her face is like, you poor thing. And Martha's like, well, I live with the magpie. I deal with enough shit.

43:36Ronnie Karam: Don't show her your eyes. Don't show her your eyes.

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45:18Ben Mandelker: Offers valid for a limited time. Terms and conditions may apply. so uh miss a missy goes to a new house and um she is meeting up with her therapist and he's like so how are you doing i've got a man bun she's like i'm okay i am such an anxious person you know that like i've done three meditations last night and then i was still feeling like anxious he's like oh yes you've got some real stressful stuff being absolutely beautiful yes thank you i started therapy because I was living in survival mode. My relationship was failing. I have two kids with two different men and I needed to understand why I was always in this black hole.

45:56Ronnie Karam: You know, I was always kind of labeled, oh, she's hot. Oh, she's a wag. Oh, she's a hot wag. Oh, she's a wag that's hot. You know, labels like that. But deep down, I was super insecure because I always had to be like high maintenance image of like, oh, I've got my shit together because I'm a hot wag, you know. So it's very difficult. My first relationship was making me happy. Gave me everything. The house, the dream life. But I was bored. And then I met a fun guy and he was the most toxic person I ever met in my life. God, he was hot. He would belittle me. He would say, why do you want to do that?

46:31Ronnie Karam: What are you, a wag? Why are you doing that, you stupid wag? Oh, he made wag seem like a bad name. He said, why are you going to that event? Wag.

46:39Ben Mandelker: It started draining my soul. and then we see a headline that says Missy Bikiri secretly splits from fiance Jake Hall after five years following explosive rouse and her brother's murder but exes are trying to make things normal for her daughter so I guess her brother was murdered I'm sure we'll get into that later this season so she's like three years ago I would never think I would get here it is someone you loved but he did put me in a lot of stress because he'd be like, see, it's because the way you dress. You're making men look at you because of the way you dress. And I was drained by him like my whole soul was sucked out of me.

47:20Ronnie Karam: And when you go through toxic relationship, you fall into victim mode. And it's horrible because you don't want it. You're like, I'm hot. I'm a wag. And you normalize it. And you're like, now, how have I put myself this low? But you can't see a way out. But it affected my current ex because my dad was a little bit like that. And it was almost like I was accepting it because I thought maybe this is how it should be. My God, everything's so dark. I mean, this show's like so fun, but then all their backstories are like, oh,

47:48Ben Mandelker: geez.

47:49Ronnie Karam: And her therapist, whose name is Rue, was like, so what is it and where is it that you actually want to take things? Let's talk about that. She's like, I want to be proud. I want to be authentic. You know, I've always suppressed that. And, you know, it made me insecure, but I'm doing work on myself. Now I want to be more secure. He's like, confidence comes in layers. And the more you upset people, because she's saying, you know, I want to have a voice and feel like people aren't going to judge me. So I'm going to tell everybody about gossip that I heard at a dinner. Do you think that that's something I should do?

48:23Ronnie Karam: He's like, well, if people get mad, then people get mad because you're just being authentic.

48:29Ben Mandelker: Yeah. Fun fact, Missy was on Real Housewives of Cheshire starting season three, by the way. so she has some real housewives pedigree oh wow okay so yeah yeah yeah it's very exciting so now we go to holland park no relationship to holland taylor and margo is there with her daughter adela and their nanny yanira and margo's like you know it's like i'm a completely different person coming back to london this time i don't drink anymore and uh she basically is like i got sober because Martha said, well, broke me. And Martha's like, we cut to Martha going, oh, it's not funny, but why am I laughing? So Margot tells us that she was living in LA and she, Martha was, Martha was like, why don't you come to Ibiza for a week?

49:18Ben Mandelker: So she went there to Ibiza for a week with Martha and her boyfriend. And then they went to go grouse shooting in Scotland. And she's like, I was so full of alcohol. I was crying straight vodka and i was on the flight home and i just thought i can't do this anymore

49:34Ronnie Karam: she literally broke me i mean she took me grouse shooting what the fuck is grouse shooting anyway so martha comes to the park and she she has little gifts for the for the kid she's like oh this is a little doggy shaped out of bird poo poo very very fun and it's a toy it's a little net in case you want to put it in your oh there's a measuring spoon here's a measuring spoon for you She's like, ugh. It's so bizarre to see Margot as her mother. You know, Margot was literally the life and soul of London for a long time. And then like me, you know, she had some peaks and some troughs. Dark Martha. Hard blink.

50:13Ronnie Karam: We're happy again. We're in the park.

50:16Ben Mandelker: I'm just so happy to see her coming back in her peak. So proud of her. Oh, little Della, isn't it so fun to be here in the park? You know, this is the first time I've seen your mother when she wasn't absolutely shit-faced. aiming a gun at our guide instead of a grouse those were heady days weren't they margo so how's

50:34Ronnie Karam: the house gunting going margo she's like well the house that i really want it was an architectural digest can you imagine it's really like a vibe like an architectural vibe at digest kind of vibe like it's totally not in our budget of course but we'll make it work right i'm 50 000 a month i mean that's what that's what i actually have it's above that but how's it how's it for you she's Like, oh, well, I've had the palest shoe sauce box that I'm living in covered in bird shit about to be painted. So that's good.

51:04Ben Mandelker: You know, I met a sweet guy in the park who said he's a painter and a decorator. So he's come painted for me. Of course, I had to give him 300 quid in cash yesterday, which felt a bit strange. He was also not really clothed. And he kept on talking to a tree and saying, it is my honor, mum. So I don't really know what that was about.

51:23Ronnie Karam: He also kept making strangling noises as we talked about paint color. Margot's like, well, that's normal. You know, they have to buy your paint, so you need money. Oh, no, no, it wasn't for paint. It was for other stuff.

51:37Ben Mandelker: Margot's like, okay, well, that feels a bit crazy for me. She's like, oh, dear. Margot's like, why is she wiring money to someone before they work? She has serious life experience that told her you cannot trust strangers. I'm just terribly gullible. I just believe everything everyone tells me all the time. For instance, magpies make a great pet. That was a good one that I fell for.

51:59Ronnie Karam: So now it's the day of Dara's party and everyone's getting ready and Emma FaceTimes Mark. And he's like, oh, look at you. I love your Croydon facelift. And that means a tightly pulled ponytail hairstyle often associated with lower social classes.

52:17Ben Mandelker: We needed a tss. Martha and Missy are in a car and she's like, how are you feeling about tonight? Have you ever advanced a painter $300 in the park? Just taking a quick survey. Missy's like, well, I have to say something, you know? I called my therapist, to be honest, on the way. Oh, really? What did they say? He was like, breathe in, breathe out. You've got this. Did you call your therapist or did you just go to the Hallmark store and read a card? Yeah, exactly.

52:47Ronnie Karam: He said, hang in there. It was a cat. It was a cat hanging off a rope. So we go to Ivy Asia and Dara arrives and she gets the slow motion music. And everyone comes in and says hi and stuff. And Missy's like, I feel a bit unsettled. You know, I need to say something. I just hope Dara apologizes and, you know, moves on. Because for those of you who don't remember, I was talking to Dara on the phone and she dissed her friend Micah. And my therapist told me now is the time to be authentic. so I'm going to let it out at this lunch and prove I'm a healed woman after being a scorned wag.

53:23Ben Mandelker: Yeah, because I'm sure it will come up again in the recap, but a key thing is that Micah brought Dara pink walkie-talkies as like a cute friendship thing and then Dara later told Missy that she thought it was cringe and she doesn't like pink walkie-talkies. So, you know, which I love that this is like the crux of a big fight that's going to cause someone to quit the show it's like she was also

53:50Ronnie Karam: just cringe yeah she was also just shit talking her and saying like oh she's so awkward and she's so gross and she's so embarrassing and stuff like that so um micah is there micah the etiquette lady and she's like oh my god i'm so nervous for dara because she's seeing all these people that were spreading rumors about her and that are they're at her dinner party oh god so i tried to warn her

54:13Ben Mandelker: I was like, okay, 10-4, 10-4, over and out for Dara. They're spreading rumors about you. Get ready. They're spreading rumors. But she wouldn't answer. It was really unfortunate.

54:24Ronnie Karam: Martha is asking Dara's other friends how they know her. And one of the girls is like, how do I know her?

54:34Ronnie Karam: Well, I'm a fan. I'm a fan because she has an Instagram and I have an Instagram. And so she reached out and was like, oh, I like your Instagram. And then we became friends. And the other lady's like, yeah, we know her from Instagram. And so Martha just looked. And one of the other friends goes, oh, yeah, one of the reasons I just love Dara, she just pulls people together, you know, and then she puts people together, you know, especially the ladies. She loves beautiful, intelligent, you know, smart ladies. And then she puts people to have business together. And Martha's like, um, yeah, I'm still not convinced that she's not a madam.

55:14Ronnie Karam: I mean, one of these friends is saying she's a connector. The other one she found online. I mean, there's some energy there. Just admit it. You know, listen, I can use some money.

55:24Ben Mandelker: So Dara's just talking with Margo. She's like, so you live in L.A., right? She's like, yeah, I have a place in Malibu and then I'm working here. She's like, oh, amazing. Yeah, I lived here for 20 years. All my old friends are here. All my contacts are here. Yeah, we both know Nicholas. Oh, no way. Yeah, he told me about you. No way. Yeah, I swear. Because I introduced him to the Milken Institute. Oh, my God. And I got him to speak in L.A. And I'm like always helping you to connect. I just love connecting people. So this is just basically a cocktail party pattern. But then Margo's like, this girl has a doctorate in diplomacy.

56:00Ben Mandelker: She has blown me away with kindness. Immediately with the people that we share in common. I mean, you would have to have those skills to be a madam. It's like a requisite. This is like literally just like, hey, we have a mutual friend. Oh, my God. That's so funny. Yeah. Isn't he great? Wow. Listen to that madam go spinning her web.

56:21Ronnie Karam: That's true. This one was this one was a stretch. But the first one with the friends was crazy. I was like, wow, could you hire people to make this sound any more suspect? Yeah, you know, she just likes collecting beautiful women and then setting them up with business ventures. Like, what the fuck is that? You know what?

56:40Ben Mandelker: I recently got a really good deal on a KitchenAid. And if you guys want, you can check it out. It's on Amazon. It's like$200 off. Wow. Only a madam knows about KitchenAid deals. Hmm. Yeah. Everything's like a smoking gun to them.

56:55Ronnie Karam: And Kimmy and Mark come in next. And you can tell because you just hear.

57:01Ronnie Karam: and uh martha has on cigarette heel shoes which are really funny and kimmy's like oh my god i'm desperate for a glass of champagne hello oh you must be dara oh god i'm so disappointed in this girl oh god get heidi fleiss in here am i right where's a real madam how does this one what a terrible man okay here's the new gossip we know a madam and she's tacky and terrible Give me a classy madam any day.

57:30Ben Mandelker: I mean, this is a madam, more like Madam President, as in Taya Leone on a CBS procedural. Boring! Okay. So then, actually, sorry everyone, that's called Madam Secretary. I totally got my CBS shows wrong. And I apologize to the listeners. So Dara's like...

57:48Ronnie Karam: Did you mean the Gina Davis show? The Gina Davis show called Madam President?

57:54Ben Mandelker: I don't know, but she was a president. She was a, I remember that. Yeah. That was probably called like lady president. Yeah.

58:01Ronnie Karam: She's like, guys, I'm Gina Davis. And let me tell you what I stand against. Terrorism. They're like, oh my God. She's the best president we've ever had. Yeah.

58:14Ben Mandelker: Honestly, I would fully vote for Gina Davis to be president. At this point. At this point.

58:20Ronnie Karam: Oh my God. Yeah. Like you dealt with Luc Besson. I'll trust you.

58:24Ben Mandelker: Yeah. I'm down. I'm down with that. I don't remember the name of her show, but I do remember that it was, it was her being a president somewhere. But anyway, so they're all like chatting around and everything. And they're settling in. And Dara's like, you're sitting here, you're sitting there, whatever. And Missy gets to sit right next to Dara. So Missy's like, oh, great. She's like really upset about it. So Dara's like, okay, everyone, I just want to say thank you all for coming. I wanted to bring us together because you know what they say? time is money time is money right you if you're out that you know when you're out there in these streets you know you're you're earning your money am i right everyone well anyway i just wanted to

59:07Ronnie Karam: say thank you for coming yeah um we're all entrepreneurs and we've all made something from nothing you know we've all come from the bottom and then turned ourselves into something that deserves dinner tonight and i just want you all to remember that and mark and mark and margo are just laughing and giving each other looks. And Margot goes, who is she talking to? I mean, has she looked around the table? These are not self-made people. And then it cuts to Mark and it says at the bottom, mother, Russian princess, father, Italian businessman, Lottie, daughter of a tech investor, Kimmy, father was a shipping entrepreneur, Martha, father was a famous entrepreneur.

59:50Ronnie Karam: And then it cuts back to Dara and she's like, yeah we all have something that we can share with each other to help each other because we're all self-made you know we're all here to help each other and kimmy and mark are just cracking up and mark's shaking his head no and he goes oh well congratulations to me for being a self-made woman

1:00:09Ben Mandelker: my gosh isn't that formidable i never knew kimmy's like i don't really know what dara is talking about she says everyone has an entrepreneurial spirit my entrepreneur is zero and this is where we have a huge departure from the real housewives and american cast because on the real housewives you have all these people who have like you know immense privilege and they're like i'm self-made i did this all myself like i'm this is i'm basically it's like bethany when she was like i'm homeless i'm homeless right now i i'm living on the streets you know and these people are like oh no we don't work we never have worked we don't want to do that

1:00:44Ronnie Karam: self made only trash makes itself

1:00:49Ben Mandelker: we're privileged and we have no idea what the real world is like and we love it that way

1:00:54Ronnie Karam: and the waitress comes and Mark is like oh thank god a self made woman

1:01:01Ben Mandelker: so Margo's asking where Emma was she's like oh it's in Kensington Palace and she's like oh that's nice what were you doing there fragrance launch It's just like, oh, your fragrance? No, we're not entrepreneurs like that. It was someone else's. Some poor person's fragrance they were trying to. I was attending as a guest, darling.

1:01:21Ronnie Karam: I wasn't making a fragrance, although I did buy about 19 gallons of it because I do live in a literal zoo.

1:01:27Ben Mandelker: Who was some captain on some boat with some sort of sandalwood fragrance? I don't know. The poet laureate was there. It was a whole thing. But I made excuses to come here, everyone. That's right. I left an event with the poet laureate so he could come here and accuse someone of being a madam. When did we start that, by the way?

1:01:44Ronnie Karam: So Dara doesn't have a drink, and so Kimmy grabs her glass and dumps some of her drink into it. She's like, you have to have a drink so you can toast. You can't toast without a drink. I mean, what kind of alcoholic are you?

1:01:55Ben Mandelker: That's Kimmy's favorite move, is to just pour wine from one glass to another. So Missy tells us, the old Missy would have definitely just kept her mouth shut, but I've closed the chapter, because guess what I did? I breathed in, I breathed out Just like therapy told me And now I breathed out old Missy Breathed in new Missy Because that chapter was full of lies, of cheat And in my life I made promise to move forward I don't want to do that Don't stand there and celebrate women And then totally trash women behind closed doors That is not cool Here comes new Missy So we've just had this

1:02:31Ronnie Karam: Welcome everybody Glad we can all be lady friends Lifting each other up speech Then Missy comes in after like a moment of quiet. And she goes, hmm. Well, I'm so grateful to be here. Thank you for inviting me. I do feel that you put me in a really shitty position, though. Because like when we were talking about your friend, Micah, and you said, oh, she's a bit cringe. You remember that? Yeah. She said she's embarrassing. She's kind of low class. She's tacky. And she's faking her lifestyle. And everybody just looks super uncomfortable. And Micah's like, hmm, God, so I'm leaving a chip. silenating a chip.

1:03:08Ronnie Karam: Yes, well, you said she's showing up with walkie-talkies. Well, I wouldn't want my friend talking about me like that.

1:03:15Ben Mandelker: And Dara just takes a moment, and then she sort of was like, Micah's my sister. I absolutely loved the walkie-talkies. The sound they made as I threw them in the trash was so beautiful.

1:03:29Ronnie Karam: There is no way I wouldn't have a walkie-talkie with my best friend. I think it's great. and I don't think this conversation's necessary. And, Micah, I love you. You know I do.

1:03:45Ben Mandelker: I mean, I'm... What established, famed architect who's a professional working woman wouldn't love some pink walkie-talkies to chat with her bestie about in the middle of the workday when she has meetings and obligations? I love it.

1:04:00Ronnie Karam: And Mark is rolling his eyes openly and they're all staring at Micah because this is the first fight of the show, you know? So they're like, uh-oh, Micah's the nicest one is the one forced into it. How's she going to deal with it? And Martha's like, oh my God, I felt like my ass cracker started sweating. I'm just so uncomfortable. Okay, well, let's just have some really nice food. Oh, let's move on. I mean, I guess, what can I do if she's not going to admit it? Yeah, we're going to have some nice food.

1:04:29Ben Mandelker: So Missy and Lottie go to the bathroom together and Lottie's like, well, that was stressful. I know that was crazy. No, just being around all those Americans. Oh, what were you going to say was stressful? Well, like, what the fuck is she doing? Why is she saying that? She said, like, on it, like, that she's making me look crazy now. She's like, oh, babe, I know, I know. So I wasn't really listening, to be honest. I was just making sure that my outfit looked good. But say whatever you were going to say.

1:04:53Ronnie Karam: They lost me at self-made. Well, Dara's making me look like I'm trying to ruin a friendship and I'm lying. Oh, she's crazy. She's a crazy woman. Well, does Micah know about this? well, she's looking at me like she senses something, like she's anxious. Oh, she's being controlled by her. She's being controlled. Surely, surely she's being controlled. So back at the table, Margo's like, are you okay, Micah darling? She's like, well, aye, aye. And we just still hear Missy. And she's like, how can you be so scared as not to have a voice?

1:05:25Ben Mandelker: Micah tells us, I've never been more embarrassed in my life. I'm like, you just made a video about blowing a potato chip, but that's fine.

1:05:33Ronnie Karam: I was going to say, you used to eat potato chips without your lips around it.

1:05:37Ben Mandelker: You used to make, yeah.

1:05:38Ronnie Karam: It's pretty embarrassing.

1:05:39Ben Mandelker: You used to just eat those Doritos and let the crunches peel through the audience. So she goes, I'm not sure. I'm not sure if I need to cry or just go into a fetal position. I'm like, you can do both, by the way. I just want to let you know. She goes, I do believe Missy. And the word cringe is one that Dara uses regularly. And it's an American word. And I'm just, I just don't understand. I love that. she was like yeah dara says cringe so much like she says cringe all the time like she's like says things like you are so cringe or can you please not give me those walkie-talkies in public it's so cringe or wow this is my cringe friend micah so i'm pretty sure that that those words did come

1:06:17Ronnie Karam: out of her mouth yeah so she gets up and excuses herself from the table and now emma jumps in she's like what is going on can somebody please explain i just got in here i just met the poet laureate so can we just explain it Kimmy's like well Emma walks into the I heard you're I heard you're a cup fitness what a way to walk in am I right guys

1:06:41Ben Mandelker: just came here to watch so Micah goes up to Dara and she's like hey when you're done with this course can we step out I love that her etiquette extends to even when she's trying to have a confrontation like I want to have a confrontation with you but I want you to be able to finish your dish may I have a confrontation

1:06:58Ronnie Karam: no babe no I love you and we need to talk just not right now she goes just not now no okay yeah I loved it

1:07:13Ben Mandelker: it was like no no just like no we're not we're not gonna talk which by the way I actually I was gonna say I feel like in terms of etiquette that was actually very polite of her to be like we can have a talk but just not right now now is not the time replaced which feels like that's that's etiquette right there

1:07:32Ronnie Karam: but my guys uh mike is like i'm in absolute disbelief i mean we've known each other for 24 years and i protected her and this is what i get i mean i don't even recognize my best friend so dara goes into the kitchen she's like i need to check on the food and now everybody's asking if missy's okay which is hilarious and um they're like oh come sit in the naughty corner with us missy you just got a better seat to this table you just earned your spot at the bad girls club congratulations so she goes over there and um meanwhile in the kitchen i want to get to the kitchen so bad but it's not yet so lottie is talking to me to micah and lottie's like in the kitchen she goes darren didn't want to talk to you i mean she's not going to i'm really disappointed for micah that her so-called best friend of 20 years doesn't give her that time just kidding i

1:08:26Ben Mandelker: don't really care two americans having a fight like who cares so then missy's like i just feel like i got really brave and like that was my moment i'm like okay missy you need to relax now it's like nice you you had it but she's like going on and on and on about this and she's like ah that was my moment i was so brave in that moment wasn't i so brave oh yes i think we should focus on what matters looks not that's whatever superficial he literally says that he's literally like i don't want to talk about your journey let's just talk about how hot you are but i came with the confidence

1:08:56Ronnie Karam: to have a scene on TV and they stole it from me. He's like, oh, please, you're a model. Let's just discuss looking good, all right? Not that we're superficial. No, no, not at all. Oh, you do look amazing though, darling. And that is half the battle, am I right? Sensational. I knew something was going to come up because there's no way that everybody I've spoken to thinks she's an awful person and she's just this nice. So then we see where Dara really went. So she's in the hallway confronting production. And she's like, um, yeah, I don't think I made for this, babe. Like I'm not made for it. This is just not me.

1:09:33Ronnie Karam: Like I love my God, but she just doesn't like have my experience of being thrown under a bus. I mean, I did say those things because I had just filmed and she's just like too stupid to get it. Cause she's not famous.

1:09:47Ben Mandelker: Yeah. She's like, I'm not cut out. I like how she simultaneously says, I'm just not cut out for this because Micah just doesn't have the experience of being thrown under the bus. I'm like, you're the one who got thrown under the bus and are quitting. You're saying, poor Micah, she just doesn't know how to handle these things. You're the one quitting. Why did you quit, Tara? I needed you to stay on the show.

1:10:09Ronnie Karam: You were the one who threw her under the bus. She's so funny. She's like, oh my god, she's just upset because she's not famous enough to get it and I just, I'm sorry, but I can't shoot with people like that.

1:10:19Ben Mandelker: And I did say those things, but only because I just filmed. So then, Mark is like, all I can say, back at the table, all I can say is, you never diss someone who has walkie-talkies because it means their boat is big. I mean, right? That means that their home is huge. It's decidedly sizable. Ask Emma. Everyone in the house has walkie-talkies. Even the rhinoceros is like, psh, put mud on me now. Am I right?

1:10:45Ronnie Karam: So Missy's like, what color are your walkie-talkies? And she's black. And Mark goes, bitch.

1:10:52Ben Mandelker: bitch and kimmy's like well just your basic basic bitch black walkie talkie

1:10:57Ronnie Karam: i wish they were pink he's like how big is your walkie talkie so now moira dara's friend is like hey guys i'm sorry to interrupt yes by the way another person whose name starts with m i mean

1:11:09Ben Mandelker: for us as recappers like everyone starts with an it's like margo missy moira

1:11:16Ben Mandelker: I don't know. There was like another M word in there. But like, it's like my mind is like exploding with all the M words.

1:11:22Ronnie Karam: So she's like, guys, I'm sorry to interrupt. Maybe should we call for Dara to get back to the room to tell the story? And Missy's like, but I told it. I just told it. Oh, no. Well, I don't know the background story. Well, maybe you should listen then because I just had the courage to tell it. And I'm a wag.

1:11:37Ben Mandelker: I'm brave. Brave wag. So Moira's like, the only people who are not here right now is Dara. which apparently the conversation is about her. See, now Dara's here. She came back in the room and now you can continue. That's all I'm asking you. And so Missy is like, but who are you to tell me what I can, I cannot do. I'm like, wait, I actually think that I think Moira as a friend of Dara, I think it was within her right to be like, can you not talk shit about our host while she's out of the room? And Missy's like, who are you to tell me what to not to do? So Moira's like, cause I'm, but they weren't really,

1:12:08Ronnie Karam: they were just talking about walkie talkies. Yeah,

1:12:11Ben Mandelker: but they, but they weren't dissing.

1:12:13Ronnie Karam: they weren't dissing Dara they didn't even say anything about Dara they were just like Missy are you okay and then they started talking about walkie talkies and she's like how dare you talk about walkie talkies my friend isn't here to stand up for herself

1:12:24Ben Mandelker: it was a strange moment for Moira to pipe in but I do think she was ultimately being like she could sense it was ultimately the walkie talkie was still sort of in service of kind of ridiculing Dara and so now Moira is like I'm her friend I'm her friend who just met her because I follow her on Instagram and she's like yeah and i'm who i am i have my voice i am brave my therapist said hang in there so i am hanging in there right now you cannot chop off this branch

1:12:53Ronnie Karam: strangers are just people you haven't met yet and um there's only one set of footprints

1:13:03Ronnie Karam: well i just met you well you know what if someone is lying in my face well if you're speaking about the person that's not in the room behind their back oh you know what tell the truth then tell Missy is ready to just fight and she's going to have it with this friend. She doesn't even care. So Dara comes back and she sits down. She's still got this big smile on her face. So Missy's like, what's it or was it not said? Let her be in the room. Just let her be in the room without asking her. Was it said or not said? Everyone, I did not say those things. And he goes, this is Dara five seconds ago. I did say those things.

1:13:38Ben Mandelker: It's a direct contradiction. So Missy is like, is this what you're saying? I'm lying. I'm a liar. And Dara's like, I'm saying that. I'm not calling anyone a liar. I'm not saying anyone's a liar. And Missy's like, well, it's black or white. It's not great. She's just, um, I just want to have, I just, okay. I just want to have a really nice dinner, guys. We should do the lie detector test.

1:13:59Ronnie Karam: Lie detector test.

1:14:02Ben Mandelker: So Kimmy's like, what? Dara's a two-faced biot. I mean, she seems like she's one of these social climbing women that'll step on anyone to be something that she's not. I love her. Mark's like, well, I think it would be very flattering to call Dara a social climber because it suggests that she would have something, some climbing ability, which I don't believe that she has.

1:14:24Ronnie Karam: Well, obviously, there's something that's been said, or she wouldn't be so adamant on it, am I right? But I didn't say those things. Do you know, listen, I think of friendship. In a friendship, it's normal to have differences. So I think celebrating difference is probably what tonight should be about.

1:14:43Ben Mandelker: Thank you. Here's a difference. You're American and stupid and I'm British and fabulous. There.

1:14:50Ronnie Karam: I know neighborhoods in Tuscany.

1:14:52Ben Mandelker: You don't.

1:14:53Ronnie Karam: And that's fine. I like that. And other people, well, we should be honest. No, where's the speech about honesty? Indeed. Precisely. But she called me a liar. Well, that's exactly what I'm getting at, I think. I forgot. I had one good speech in me, ladies.

1:15:10Ben Mandelker: Okay, may I interrupt? Should we be honest? Here we go. I heard a rumor, Dara, that you are a madam. And I thought it was an awesome rumor.

1:15:20Ronnie Karam: I was like, Martha, what? Mark just starts laughing into his drink.

1:15:27Ben Mandelker: Dara goes, Dara's like, I'm an architect. Well, I spread it, and I'm sorry. But you have to admit, it's a great rumor.

1:15:36Ronnie Karam: I heard it, and I spread it. What a wonderful rumor, am I right? But I am sorry for that. Kimmy's like, I love Martha. I mean, the thing about Martha, she's just always too nice. Always too nice. She just spread a rumor about someone being a madam. Mark's like, well, also, I think that having a sense of humor is absolutely fundamental to one's existence.

1:16:02Ben Mandelker: well as i told you i'm an architect i run two businesses let's just have an amazing dinner and just move on please and missy's like she's not honest she's not honest but the truth is obvious you can't do that shit by the way this is where you actually can tell that missy was a real housewife in a previous life because she like everyone else is just like cackling and having a great time just getting drunk and she's like but i'm brave i had a brave moment this was my moment you cannot do that oh it doesn't matter because it's obvious everyone and Missy's like really okay she doesn't feel like I'm being made to look crazy I mean I don't I don't care about it but like I I I just you know it's like I'm I'm just being authentic I'm a brave person

1:16:43Ronnie Karam: it's okay it's okay this is London you're not supposed to be authentic anyway and Marco's like I want to be privy to what Micah thinks and feels what does Micah think absolutely I must I mean the only person who hasn't spoken yet is poor literally dear micah which i think is absolutely unfair micah take the floor and she's like um well i'm not usually so quiet but you know i'm hurt and i'm stunned and it's my best friend and then to hear that i'm just i'm a loyal friend and that's it's hard for me 10-4 good buddy 10-4 see no answer so i think that dara and i need to talk on the side and I always believe in very clear communication, battery operated though it may be.

1:17:31Ronnie Karam: And I'm very up front and my whole thing is if you can't say it to that person, you shouldn't say it about them. Please don't use your salad fork for dessert.

1:17:40Ben Mandelker: That was a beautiful speech. It was so lovely that I got you this complimentary cowboy hat so you could be a little bit more American. Well, I feel like she's really upset.

1:17:48Ronnie Karam: Well, of course she's upset, you guys. Okay, you know what? Cut! Cut! Cut!

1:17:55Ben Mandelker: Tara's saying cut Oh god Cut cut That's a wrap on day one

1:18:02Ronnie Karam: They look around like we're not being filmed What are you talking about What does that mean cut cut cut

1:18:08Ben Mandelker: Yeah I think that like I need to probably step out of this I think being on this TV show I'm really starting to disappoint everybody But I just don't think this is for me You know What TV show?

1:18:19Ronnie Karam: There's no TV show What kind of crazy world Is this woman living in

1:18:24Ben Mandelker: Emma's like you can't just leave when you're not getting your own way that's like what children do on a bad day just leave just leave there's no need to cut anything you've already been cut

1:18:35Ronnie Karam: well this isn't for me guys well she may as well be gone well I'm kind of done with dinner so I think I'm just gonna leave now I didn't really feel like there's anything more to discuss bye and it says Dara decided to leave the friend group

1:18:52Ben Mandelker: I love that they still call it the friend group. She quit the show. Look how brave I was while she quit the show. So Micah is like, I have cried more times about Dara than I've ever cried about anything in my life. Have you ever found yourself crying into a CB radio? It's a very lonely feeling. I feel like I lost a family member. I lost a friend. I lost trust. My friendship with Dara is never going to be what it was.

1:19:17Ronnie Karam: John Joy. funny show you know there's a lot of conversation on if it's problematic that they were calling her a madam because of her asian heritage and stuff i don't is that a stereotype i think that that

1:19:34Ben Mandelker: that i have to say it pinged on my radar um when when it happened i was like oh feels weird like the only um like asian american lady on the cast that they're gonna go there for but i wasn't i'm not as up on I wasn't sure if it was a microaggression or not but it definitely pinged me a little bit and I wasn't sure if it was a thing but yeah I definitely have to look into that and read more about that for sure

1:20:01Ronnie Karam: yeah I mean it's certainly not great but I have to say I really like Dara I thought she was perfect for this show I mean her whole like the way that she would just smile through the whole thing she was giving me a little bit Stacy from Potomac just how she didn't even care she would just smile You know, it's like they criticize her and she's like, oh, yeah, well, they say I'm a madam. They're not famous enough to understand gossip. So I get it. And just her whole vibe of like talking shit behind somebody's back and then being called out on it and being like, didn't say it. Yeah. So I think she was so funny and I wish she hadn't quit because I think she took that attitude and just said, like, listen, you guys, this is I'm a businesswoman and I have a family and you coming at me calling me a madam is really low.

1:20:46Ronnie Karam: Like that's disgusting, you know, or whatever, whatever she needed to say. But yeah, I think that this shows, you know, less, you know, it's missing something without having her. And it's only been on two episodes.

1:20:59Ben Mandelker: Yeah, I actually really liked her. And I just thought that she was a badass that she was an architect. I thought that was super cool. Like she's this accomplished architect in this group. And I would have liked her to have pushed back and been like, you know what? Like I'm not a madam. And this I've actually worked really hard to become an architect. and this is a really big deal. And, you know, you're diminishing me. And, you know, like there is like sort of, it does feel like a bit like a microaggression, although I don't know if, I don't know if this circle cares about microaggressions. They'd be like, Oh darling, whatever, thicker skin.

1:21:30Ben Mandelker: But, um,

1:21:32Ronnie Karam: I mean, if it's a microaggression, you can't see it without a microscope and we don't have those. So,

1:21:37Ben Mandelker: yeah, I feel like, I feel like being like, guys, this is a microaggression would just literally just fall on deaf ears with them or drunk ears with them. But yeah, I have to agree. I actually liked Dara and if she was going to become a villain of the show, then great. But you know what? The show has so many characters. I'm sure we will be fine moving forward without her, but it is a little sad. Maybe she'll come back for another season. If this, uh, if this goes well, or probably not, if you quit in the middle of production, I don't think Bravo likes that.

1:22:03Ronnie Karam: Yeah. Well, great show. Love it. All right, everybody. Thanks. This show is on Thursday nights after real housewives of Beverly Hills. So watch it. We will be covering it. Um, and we'll talk to you next time.

1:22:13Ben Mandelker: Bye everyone. Bye. Watch what Crappens would like to thank its premium sponsors. Ain't no thing like Alison King. Our way is the Amber way. It's the Foster and the Furious. It's Amanda Foster. It's Always Automatic with Ashley Otto. Put your hands together for Carly Clapp. Get on the right foot with Chrissy Offutt.

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1:24:19Ronnie Karam: She's a total knockout. It's Katie Manok.

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1:25:05Ronnie Karam: She ain't no shrinking Violet Kuchar We love you guys.

1:25:37Ben Mandelker: we dive into a case that's still active. Did Michael's murderous rampage start in the 1990s when he was just 17? His impulsivity and his rage was starting to peak around that age. Listen to Mind of a Monster, the Hollywood Ripper, wherever you get your podcasts.

1:25:55Ronnie Karam: Acast helps creators launch, grow, and monetize their podcasts everywhere. Acast.com.