#3438 The Valley S3E14 Part Two: Loose Lips Sink Hips

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1:54Ben Mandelker: Hello and welcome to Watch Your Crappens, a podcast about all that crap on Bravo that we just love to talk about. This is part two of the recap. If you missed part one, go check out your podcast feed. It's right there. And without further ado, let's get right back into the recap. Oh my God. So I was at the library and I used up all of my meeting room time, so I apologize. Oh, it's okay. Where are you now? I'm outside the library. oh i love this there's it's a children's library and so like all the other tables are around children so i apologize we have another very amusing uh audio update here ray had to change locations so now ray is actually just broadcasting here from from a bench outside on the streets of new york city right yes i am i'm homeless so if you hear birds tweeting or passing traffic just consider it an immersive experience just like the just like the valley itself okay so where we left off um we were talking well i don't remember while we were even we're probably ranting about someone or something tom schwartz whatever but we're just gonna move on which is that now everyone has climbed onto to this party bus to get to the gay club for Zach.

3:12Ben Mandelker: And people are dancing up on the top, but down in the bottom of the bus, Brittany is talking to Jesse, and she's like, you owe me an apology. And he's like, for what? Well, for what happened last night, where I was like, confused, I was like, oh my god, and you said that Jack said that, like, you said to say that I want to, like, set up Danny and all things, this like that, whatever. And Jesse's like, oh my god, I'm just like so sick of all this Danny and Mia shit. She goes, well, it's not even about that. It's about the way you treated me. and Lacey's like yeah yeah Jace Lacey of course jumps in she's like yeah you lumped her in with Jax I mean he's obviously an abomination you made her feel just so bad so just apologize because Brittany's whole thing is like how could you say that I had it out for Danny last season just because Jax Jax announced it on our podcast so um uh she basically wants an apology from Jesse about this and she's saying how Jesse just loves to start the pot and you know he always believed whatever Jax was telling him, whatever, whatever, whatever.

4:08Ben Mandelker: Um, so Jesse announces, he did, he says that he's had a resentment for Brittany for over a year because at Yamashiro, when Lacey showed up at the end of filming, um, Brittany mouthed off to her and was said something about like, Oh, Jesse should never have introduced, uh, Lacey to Isabella in the first place. See, this is like, I, I found this like so interesting because, um, I expected this season, you know, because Jax is such a like, like attention sucking, like he's a black hole, right? Like, so I thought that like the ghost of Jax would like loom over this season and it like shows up. But it's like, it's not as present as I anticipated it being.

4:51And like Jesse's trying to make it like matter. But, but like, but like Jesse, Jesse, like Danny's ghost is like the bigger ghost, you know? like Danny's ghost is the Slimer eating Jax's girl but like um I like Jesse just needs something to do I don't think he cares this much about that like Brittany we all know what Brittany was going through he's just picking a fight he just doesn't want the attention to be on Danny he needs something to to he needs something to do I think he just needs something to do you know yeah and like Lacey's here like okay they were if Lacey's not holding the resentment when she's the one who got yelled that.

5:32What are you mad at Brittany for?

5:34Ben Mandelker: Exactly. And then Brittany clarifies, like, no, I just meant it wasn't fair. You weren't supposed to introduce the significant others to Isabella just yet, and you made that boundary, and then you introduced Lacey to Isabella, and it just felt like a violation of that. And even Lacey's like, yeah, I get it. Shut up. Apologize to Brittany, you know? So he does. He's like, I'm sorry. You didn't deserve it. I shouldn't have jumped in the middle of the conversation. She's like, thank you. Thank you. so um back on the bus on the top of the bus i mean it's great times dancing frolicking there's literally nothing that could ever go wrong and then um zach is like oh my god a bird shit on me a bird shit on me and this is one of the great like celestial mr x that we've seen because like a bird shits on zach yeah and he's so focused on that that he doesn't realize there's a traffic light coming that just bonks him in the head and honestly it's like very funny because he's like oh my god bleeding but like that he could have literally been decapitated looked really bad i was surprised that he was still like conscious and speaking you know what i mean and like i don't i was like you know production is i mean they seemed worried but they everybody's a little lax you know what i'm saying like this boy's gushing from the head and he's just like go party whatever how tall is that did you how tall is it he's taller than you would think actually he's i think at least like six three he's really tall yeah because i was like this is i was i was astonished and like jasmine looks so small comparatively and i'm like it's a double-decker bus they have to factor in like buses will factor in the street lights and the bridges and shit like that so how much higher than the actual double second deck does he actually stand that's crazy that's crazy and i mean if his head had been facing a different direction it could have gotten like like eyeball and i don't know like if they're going faster like that is death that's not just like a thwunk that's not just stitches that is like dead like someone lost their head in the most embarrassing way on like on like ho era night for the valley you know and you got decapitated in mexico like that's just a bet so now so now he's bleeding and now the producer's like oh my god oh my fucking god they're like oh my god we're gonna get sued um that's mexico i don't even oh my god if i were on a production and you die in mexico what are we supposed to do because that's it that would take down the show they would cancel the show and then they would cancel a whole bunch of other things enough it would it would take down what what is it is it um pop which which uh this one i think is it may be truly original i don't know but like we saw what happened with you saw what happened with like what megan wants a millionaire or whatever like the whole the whole see the whole vh1 reality universe that like yeah that whole what's his face why am i blanking on his name you know the clock yeah public enemy the universe that came out of flavor and brigitte yeah 10 different shows and they all had to stop they all died they all died they had to rebrand the production company so like that would have that traffic light could have like severely impacted everything i brought alex baskin's entire life would have been over um out of beverly hills fans who would not have minded that yeah people are like oh should we have made the bus go faster um so now zach is like he's bleeding out of his head and he's like you guys my request is that you still go to the bar like you have to go to the gay bar so he gets carted off to the hospital it's funny because they like arrive and he i guess he thinks he's at the hospital but it's at the gay bar but it's not so they all go into the was the gay bar next door to the hospital like what was happening i think he thought that's what it was but it looked like They just dropped everyone off there, and then he got into a production vehicle and drove off to the hospital.

9:46Ben Mandelker: So they all go in, which is, by the way, this is like a nightmare. It's like you're in a gay bar, and a whole bunch of basic straight people walk in and then take over. And then suddenly the straight guys are dancing shittily on the rafters. When you're a gay person, you're like, oh my god, it's the basic straights. Do you know something that surprised me? because like Nia is like, you know, I just think of them as like the church LA. I'm sure you've talked about this on the show, but like LA has a weirdly like super churchy, like subsect. And so like, I think Nia is so exemplary of that. So I found it very weird that she was like, do you like her at one point, Jasmine is like filming selfie videos next to the go-go dancer.

10:31But then Nia was too. And I was very surprised by that.

10:35Ben Mandelker: yeah I actually thought like as annoying as it is to be someone in a gay bar where he's like oh god here come the basic straights there was actually I thought something kind of nice about the fact that all these straight people came in and there are people who are on the more conservative side of the spectrum they came in and they were like it's not it wasn't like oh wow we're in a gay bar they're just like oh we're here we're here in a gay bar like let's keep on going like the normalcy of it all was actually kind of nice to me, even though I would not want those people in my bar. I thought the story about I was like, is this homophobic or not?

11:12But the story where Zach talks about how Schwartz put someone put an Applebee's card in someone's hammock. I'm like, that's cheap.

11:25Ben Mandelker: That's also uncomfortable for the dancer if you have a hard piece of plastic up against your dick. it's like what and wait also also what's really insulting about that is that there's no applebee's anywhere close to the abbey so if you're a go-go dancer in west hollywood you have to like travel at least 35 minutes out to like burbank to find the closest applebee's and i'm not even sure there's an applebee's in burbank like you have to go far to get to an applebee's so here is like a gift card that you're gonna probably spend all the value in gas just getting to be able to use it right and and if you have the body of somebody who's fit to work as a go-go dancer at the abbey you're not eating no damn applebees you're not you're not eating anything you're getting colonics so um this is where the famous moment happens where nia pulls danny aside and it's like maybe no hip movement he's like why can't i she's like people are uncomfortable you need to control yourself so this is like this is really annoying to me because now nia can claim that she tried to be proactive and address the group's complaints but this is actually not addressing it at all this is actually completely not understanding what the issue is and especially to think that like the hip movement is the thing that's gonna bother people it's like don't do the movement maybe don't grind on anyone that could be something you don't do but like that you grow her fiance with your hips is that what she said you did it's it's it's still it's still like an image obsessed attempt at like controlling a narrative she didn't say drink more moderately she didn't say don't lose control don't uh don't don't act out of temper she said don't move your hips that's you hyper focusing on the sexual part of it and not like the actual alcohol part of it it's also there's something so funny to think like okay we've got to curb his um his being like skeeviness so don't move those hips i was like it just felt like that's that's that's the body part we're gonna focus on you're the hips um too you know what i mean like my whole body can pervert not just the hips what are you doing it's just such a i keep going back to the church thing but it's such a churchy misunderstanding of like the issue you know what i mean it's the same as like telling girls not to wear short skirts because that's how you get how you temper lust as opposed to just telling people not to like act inappropriately with people's boundaries it's like it's like just putting the emphasis on the wrong thing like and you're deliberately doing so like yeah um i uh i also feel like there's an element about it that's it's almost like such a it's such a strange response in my mind it that it like it's sort of it almost has like that passive aggressive quality which danny leaned into earlier this season like look at me i'm not dancing i'm not drinking it's fine i'm not drinking it makes people uncomfortable where You're like, okay, you're highlighting this great sacrifice that you made, but the sacrifice is not what we're looking for.

14:42And also, it's very passive-aggressive. It's not an intentional, thoughtful thing because you got pissed at me for suggesting it, first of all. And second, you're trying to blame everybody else's discomfort for why you can't be yourself. And it's like no one's asking you not to not be yourself. Everyone's asking yourself to not infringe upon the comfort of other people. You know what I mean? It's like they did. I think they know exactly what the issue is. They're just purposely choosing the parts of the arguments that can work for them. That's all. Because now, like you said, Mia gets to be like, I told Danny to calm it down.

15:20But like Danny not moving his hips isn't what groped Jasmine. It isn't what cussed you and Lala out at whatever San Diego trip that was. That wasn't his hips. His hips had nothing to do with all of that. I mean, his hips aren't drinking in the pantry. Like, like this is so it's so obnoxious. It's time for a commercial. It's time for a crappin's commercial. I needed some new furniture for my patio. And the first place I thought of was article. I have purchased from them before. I have bar stools from them. I have kitchen chairs from them. So I thought, why not outdoor? And they did not disappoint.

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17:34Ben Mandelker: So then, of course, he goes up to every single person and be like, well, apparently I can't swing my hips. Apparently I can't move. Apparently I can't do this. So it's going around to everyone. It's like, okay, if you want people to not think that you are annoying or weird or make people uncomfortable, if you're like, okay, I will moderate my behavior because I've heard that my friends are uncomfortable by my behavior, by what I do, I will moderate it. then you just do you moderate it you then don't go over to everyone and complain about how you're not doing the thing that that you want to do because the action by you complained everyone you're just you're saying you've actually not changed you're actually upset that you can't do the thing that you truly want to do which is to make people uncomfortable like he's not saying oh i want to make people uncomfortable but you want but you do want to do the thing that's upsetting everyone and now you're going to go and be a martyr to everyone you're going to go around being like, oh, look at me.

18:29Ben Mandelker: Look at the grand sacrifice I made at the gay club. And also, it's like, if you, what I noticed is, and I guess it's because he doesn't want to concede anything and admit that he does have a problem. So he, you know, it's like when a lawyer tells you not to say anything in court that can fuck up your appeal. So even if you are remorseful, you can't really show it. Never once has he gone to anyone and been like, hey, what is the thing that makes you uncomfortable?

19:00He never says, hey, when it's brought back to him that other people are saying, that Michelle says that he makes people uncomfortable, he never says, what did Michelle tell you was uncomfortable? He never asks the next question because he doesn't want to confront the answer to that question. So now he and Nia are deciding for other people what would be appropriate change that they want to see rather and then get to finesses so that it suits them in a way that doesn't make them the bad guys as opposed to genuinely approaching their friend group and wondering what they can do to like accommodate one another because they also let's not forget

19:37Ben Mandelker: they they also have i think a bit of a conspiratorial view over everything which is that i know i'm not making people uncomfortable i know people now that jacks is gone they need to have a villain so they're gonna throw me under the bus as jacks had already declared that he was going to because Jax did say that. I mean, Jax did want to bring that out. And so he's like, I see, I'm not even going to give this life because it's so preposterous. I'm not making people feel uncomfortable. They just need to say this because they need to have a storyline. And so that's a way to kind of like, for them to reconcile what's happening here.

20:12Ben Mandelker: And so as a result, that's why he's not curious to find out because he actually doesn't, he doesn't believe it even has a grain of truth to it in the first place. So why would you try to find out what makes people uncomfortable if you don't believe it's happening in the if you think it's actually just a tool to make tv so there that's what his mindset is right now and i think that's why he's getting all in a tizzy because he really feels like everyone is working together to make a storyline so that way he's the bad guy but what he doesn't realize is that we're watching and like you're doing it you are doing all the heavy lifting to make you seem like the bad guy on this season Which also kind of goes back to what I was saying before, which is that I don't understand the motivation for him still remaining on the show, because even if the drinking is not an issue, the misogyny and the way he talks to his wife is an issue.

21:02So like, even if even if like, I genuinely don't understand, maybe he just doesn't see how he talks to Nia as a bad thing. He just inherently doesn't because I'm just like there. He has not positioned himself well to have any sort of thing to offset the complaints other people have. It would be one thing if he were like, not just fighting them on the alcohol issue, but he was bringing something different to the table. He's not even doing that. He's not even trying to be likable. He's just being like stubborn about this one thing. And it's like, okay, I can understand if you say, I don't want to let Lala have this one thing, but he's not bringing anything else to, you know what I mean?

21:36we're not seeing him be likable in scenes with jesse we're not seeing him be likable and seeing i haven't seen a single thing about him that would make me want to root for him even if i thought that everybody else was full of shit and that jacks did and conspired to take him down you

21:53Ben Mandelker: know i mean he's not yeah and one thing and one thing that definitely makes me not want to root for him i can't stand when he does this or really anyone does this so now he's sitting around now he's moping because he he can't he can't move his hips so now he's moping and he's like oh sorry i hope i didn't move my hip too much right then hope i didn't make you feel uncomfortable oh i guess everyone's triggered i don't want everyone to be triggered around me he's doing this thing like making the same thing he did to lala where he's like he's like making fun of basically he's mocking you for having boundaries he's mocking you for the funny thing is that he is the one he and nia are frequently having these like you know these alone scenes where they're talking in therapy talk you know they're not talking they're talking in um marriage counseling at the church that i mean like pastor when he said that um he said he goes to weekly therapy about his drink and i was like brother that's not therapy pastor says nice things to you because he knows that if you mention his church on the show he might get a bigger following Like, please, you guys are not getting any, there's nobody licensed medical, licensed social worker degree over here, you know?

23:10Ben Mandelker: Exactly. And so at one point, Michelle Lolly is like dancing on the bar. And of course, this is Danny's takeaway. Michelle gets on top of the bar. She takes her, she shakes her tail feather, dropping it like it's hot. Like, that's fine. But me shaking my hips, maybe doing a body roll to my wife. That's what makes everyone uncomfortable. It's like, he's such a literalist about this. The fact that he cannot connect these. No, he knows exactly what's going on. How is a hot girl standing on a bar at a party in a venue where this is the sort of thing that happens have anything to do with you having in the past groped somebody when you were drunk?

23:50You know those aren't the same things. You know those aren't the same things. And it's hilarious because if we're talking about problematic drinking, Michelle Lally, of all people, isn't the problematic drinker. Not in that group. This is the one time she's letting loose. And now you're using her to contrast with yourself. You are Mr. Kent. Do one event without sneaking off into a bathroom or some shit to suck down a white claw. And you're talking about Michelle. Michelle has never even smiled on this damn show.

24:20Ben Mandelker: What are you talking about? you've never seen someone so sad up there doing the coyote ugly thing so uh so the other the other way that danny makes people uncomfortable on the show because he again like we've mentioned before he thinks it's purely a sexual thing that's like no it's your it's just the things that come out your mouth because now he's moping around and he's talking to jesse and nia or or not nia to lacy maybe i forget who but he's like well i'm just gonna get i'm i want to make i'm gonna get uncomfortable. Everyone's going to get uncomfortable. Watch out. I'm going to make people uncomfortable.

24:53Ben Mandelker: So now it's like, oh, when I talk to you, I can't even have fun with you because you're actually just going to gripe to me about how you're put upon by people's boundaries, right? And so he doesn't realize that shit is the thing that makes people not want to be around you when you're drunk because you're either going to be obnoxious to your wife or to other people or when you're checked, you're then going to go around and complain about how you were checked to everyone. And either way, no one wants to talk about any of the above. Any of those things. None of the above, right? So the thing that was really annoying me in this scene, and maybe we just didn't see the other conversations, Nia was the one who told him to stop shaking his hips.

25:29Not a single fucking person told him to stop shaking his hips. It was his wife who did. So now your wife misunderstands the assignment, and she tells you what to do, misunderstanding the assignment, and now you're blaming everybody else for you getting the homework wrong. Like, this is crazy. at what did did anyone besides me tell him not to shake his hips i didn't see it all i saw was tom schwartz that he didn't have rhythm you know what i mean well he's probably you know he's

25:57Ben Mandelker: complaining about everyone you know in the cast but he's also kind of complaining about neo too i think it's like a mix of everything he's like upset at her for doing this and he's upset at the cast and he's just being a baby i mean at the end of the day he's just being a giant baby and no one wants to party with a baby so speaking of which uh zach has returned and now he has a bandage over his head he has a full-on head wound i was so shocked production let him come back to the party genuinely i don't care what a doctor says i'm not risking it yeah like if you've got stitches in your head this is how i know i'm watching a show thinking about liabilities come on now but like yeah like you're like if you get drunk and you've got head injury and you fall over that's another thing alcohol was i think alcohol thins your blood maybe like it's just it's not yeah i'm surprised that he kept like what are you doing bro yeah did they kind of form like if you die at this party we not you're not gonna sue us your family can't sue us had to have been had to have been so britney's sitting at by the way britney's sitting at the bar and she's showing the bartender she's like this is my son.

27:07Ben Mandelker: He's five years old. And the bartender's like, uh-huh. I'm going to say this right now, Brittany. I think generally speaking, bartenders don't care when people show them pictures of their family. But I think especially at a gay bar and you're a street woman at a gay bar being like, this is my son. Literally no one. You're barking at the wrong tree. She's my boo. She's like, this is my boo. My boo. So she's sitting there and she's sad and Chrissy comes over. She's like, you okay? You're feeling a lot of feelings. She's like, I'm good. I'm good. And she says, it's been a whole weekend. Like, just everything's coming out right now.

27:43Ben Mandelker: But she's smart enough to know she's not going to have this conversation with Kristen while there's so much sound in the background. She's like, we'll have an isolated conversation on the next episode. So now... Right in the New York City streets, sound in the background. She's not like Watch for Crappins, where we welcome all sorts of sound interference. interference. So now they all go back onto the bus, and Danny lays down across all the back seats because he's, guess what, too drunk. And he gets car sick, but let's be honest, he's also too drunk, right? So he needs to lie down, and he's being grouchy and loud about it.

28:22Ben Mandelker: He's like, I need to go sit in the back and lay down. I can't even look at them. Come back with me. Get back here get back here he's just being like very petulant it's like he's not even yes he's being belligerent but it's like his tone is not even belligerent his tone is just like spoiled brat he's just like a whiny child right now and it's just it's grating to listen to so danny's in the back seat and so he's bitching ammonia is trying to get nia to come back there to take care of him and everything and he's like why are we leaving who's in here nia who's in here she's like it's Brittany and Kristen and Luke and Jesse and Lacey, just people that we like.

29:01And he's like, can we get the air conditioning turned on here?

29:03Ben Mandelker: He's making all these requests because he's going to get carsick or... I don't know what it is. He's like, Nia, ship back here, ship back here. And the thing is that Nia thought there was going to be two or three different bands, but there's only going to be one band. So there's not a seat for everyone. And so people... He's taking up too many seats by lying across them, and there's not room. And then Nia's trying to be like, Daniel, you have to sit up because there's not enough room. He's like, but why can't I lie here? I want to be able to lie here. What's wrong with you? Who's yelling at me?

29:34Ben Mandelker: And no one's yelling at you. And he's having a hissy fit in the back of this van. And he's also taking up seats. There's no room for everyone. And he will not shut up. And he's going on and on and on. And then Nia, he's like, shit over here. Shit over here. I'll put my feet on you, Nia. I'll put my feet. She's like, Daniel, I'm claustrophobic. I don't care. So then she's explaining, oh no, he's going to get nauseous.

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31:29Okay, but so like my thing is, why does she indulge him? That was what I was saying earlier. It's one thing to be like actively not trying to blame the woman for the obnoxious way that her husband behaves. But she indulges him at every turn. And then, again, like we said before, when someone approaches him or confronts him, she protects him. And then even when they're defending her, she protects him. And so here, when he's acting like a child, she babies him. It's infuriating. He's older than her, I'm pretty sure, right? This is crazy. And also, like, fuck you for acting like a child here, because I was so turned off by the fact that he was like, I don't want, who's on this bus?

32:15Who the fuck are you to decide who sits on what bus? Even if there were three vans, why do you get to decide who sits on what bus?

32:24Ben Mandelker: yeah exactly and so then at one point she's he's like ow don't dig your nails into my freaking stomach she's like it was an accident move it if i were her i'd be like who the fuck do you think you're talking to i am your wife and you sit there and you if you barf you barf but you be quiet right now i've had enough out of you but she's like it was an accident please move your feet i'm getting claustrophobic so it is he is being insufferable and basically the way the episode ends is that janet has to pee into a cup because and we see janet pee into a cup and then she holds it up she holds it up like she's giving a toast on game of thrones or something like like to westeros and i'm like put that cup down do not raise a cup of pee above anyone's head it stays low so that way if it sloshes it's on your hand and no one else and truth they hit a bump that thing was pretty dark colored you know what i mean it was like the color of red bulls like girl drink some water.

33:19I know you've been on vacation, but my goodness.

33:24Ben Mandelker: Hydrate. Well, the good news is, as we end the episode, it's Dani's birthday now. So, next week, we get to see more of a shit show, and we get to see Lala go off on Dani yet again. I will say, I was not excited about Lala coming onto this show, but I think she's been actually really good, and she is the only one who's been truly telling off Dani, and I think every time she does it, I love it. I love it, too. So first of all, like, I don't understand why Lala doesn't lean into this, but I think she, you know, is probably still, I do think somebody talked to production and was like, don't call us alcoholics on camera.

33:59I do think something like that happened, some kind of conversation happened. But I don't understand why she doesn't lean into the fact that because she's sober, she can identify a problem drinking. Like, I feel like that's her trump card here. and even I remember at one point in this episode when they're at the poolside like cabanas or whatever and Danny had already used the PTSD line at the beach and then he uses the PTSD line to the rest of the group after he uses it with her and just Luke and then when they get to the rest of the group with Brittany and them and Jasmine and them he brings up the PTSD from last season line again she goes I'm going to the water she literally just gets up and walks away because she knows he's full of shit so i'm just like why doesn't she leverage the pat the fact that she's a problem drinker and that she can identify it in him and maybe he's not ready to have that conversation but i know what i see and i mean he doesn't respect her she's a woman she's unmarried he's he's i think in the preview he's like where's your husband like that's supposed to mean

35:00Ben Mandelker: something yeah i mean like it's rich that danny likes to lean on ptsd when it works for him he's allowed to be triggered but like when other people are triggered not like no way it's so republican of him to like mock you for being easily triggered and then go on a freak out when you say even the slightest thing it's so it's so classic it's so trumpy but like but but also just kind of like i i'm i genuinely like i'm not gonna like uh blame a woman for being in an abusive dynamic but it is crazy to me that they have four kids under four i'm so curious as to how they have four children under four because they're that means they're having sex and i'm just so curious as to like what and what danny can do at all to get nia in the mood is he just like mounting her at night like this is game of thrones or some shit like what the fuck like like what about like I see her performing her wifely duties but and I don't know if it's just because of her personality and like maybe how she's been sort of like um sort of shaped into the mold of a wife by their beliefs or whatever but there's nothing about their dynamic that represents desire or affection or like oh I want to get it in and I remember he said at one point he was like that But he like went to church and asked for like, he went to church specifically to find like a godly woman, but who's also a freak in the sheets.

36:34And I'm like, okay, I guess maybe, but he thinks his hips are magic Mike. So maybe freak means I'm different to him than it means to me. But like, there is nothing like, okay, when Kristen and Luke argue, I still feel desire from Luke. I still feel like he looks like she's been berating him, but he still feels a connection, attachment, desire for Kristen. I there's everything about Danny and Mia's dynamic is sterile. So I'm wondering, like, when are you fucking to have these kids? Because there's nothing that gives off sex about y 'all. You know what I mean?

37:11Ben Mandelker: Yeah, I don't know. I just don't even like to think about... You don't want to see Polly Pocket fucking? You know what? My brain doesn't want to go up to Santa Clarita, okay? But yeah, they are definitely like an endless font of fascination this season. Ray, thank you so much for joining me and filling in Ronnie's shoes for this episode of The Valley. I did my best. You did a great job. I love your unfiltered and like pure, wonderful thoughts and opinions, all this stuff. And if everyone, anyone wants to hear more of Ray's thoughts on this or Love Island or really many other TV shows, you're at, what was it again?

37:54Ben Mandelker: Rough. Is it rough? pot it's at ray sani okay um you guys i'm so sorry for the noises around me i apologize um i'm ben is not unprofessional it's me that's why i don't have my own shit that's why i have you should you should have your own show because you just i don't know i love i've always loved your opinions i always love yours too you're very empathetic you're you're a very empathetic person when you watch uh these shows i think i think that's like a really i try to be but sometimes when i don't like somebody i don't give them grace yeah but you're you're very careful to like try and see like the other side like and i you know janet is like it's my damage as an adult it's my damage as an adult because i never i i never want to speak about something authoritatively if i don't have authority and i feel like i don't have authority until i consider all sides of the situation and then i'm like okay i've examined all the sides and i've used all the evidence and this is where i stand and some people just are like no i'm just gonna like shoot from the hip and like i've just never been that person but there's some times where i'm just like i fucking can't stand this person oh yeah i mean the other side sometimes sometimes you don't even have to see the evidence to arrive at fuck you but like it's nice that you try but also it's just i think you know too and it's like important to me and i don't know why i even take it this seriously but um lately I feel like there has been not lately, just over time, there has been an erosion in like, obviously in media literacy writ large, but just even the reality TV consumption.

39:33I don't want to say that like when we were watching Jersey Shore, we were smarter, but it does feel like the audiences watching Jersey Shore were smarter because we were able to give a shit about a villain to like think about villainesses in particular, like with more. And grace, you know what I mean? And, and it's so strange to watch. I think I'm being judgmental, and I'll let you go, I promise. But I think that Gen Z is so they're so traumatized by a Trump presidency that they're very like, there's no gray, it's black and white, we're fascist or not. And I think they're ascribing this to the people they consume on TV and think that it reflects on them as individuals and their morals for who they enjoy watching on TV.

40:23And I just it is important to me for some strange reason that we don't in the audience on social media moralize good entertainment off of TV, because if people got the show that they claim they want, we would never have anything.

40:40Ben Mandelker: I 100 % agree. I love my villains. I often don't agree with them. I am often politically not aligned with them. I love my villains because I love good storytelling. And I think that in the wake of Trump, that people are just very cognizant of that it can be dangerous to put people that you are not aligned with on a platform. and so i think we are constantly straddling this idea of like god i fucking hate ramona singer so she shouldn't be she should be eradicated and then we're like but then we also hate new roni you know and like like we like there are times there are times when like yes you actually should like you've lost your privileges to be on a platform but like we cannot moralize our villains off of every show so like it's good to have our villains storytelling requires protagonists and villains and without a villain things get born and you also and you also don't you aren't who you're watching on tv and i think that's like the biggest most important like part of this to like like uh i'll go theorize somewhere else but it's just like um like i noticed this most with like love island or even summer house and it's more of a racial thing i think um that i'll talk somewhere else.

42:00But it's just like you are not your damage is not the damage of the person on the show. And so it's important to not think of reality TV as a mirror. It can be a contemplation of society writ large, but it's not a exact mirror of your direct experience. And so when I say that Ebony K. Williams ruined Roni, and I'm not a self-hating black person. She did ruin the show because there was a thing we were watching and also Ramona Singer is a racist, terrible person. These are all true. The world isn't what you think it is. TV doesn't have to reflect the world as you wish it would be. You can imagine, but also in your imagination, bad things can exist as well.

42:44I think we love this medium. Blah, blah, blah. I talk too much.

42:50Ben Mandelker: For more thoughts, check out Ray online and also check out Ray on the ANTM documentary where you were amazing. I forgot to mention the top of the show. You were so... Everything you were saying, I was like, oh god, Ray is so good. Thank you so much for being here. It's time for me to hop on to my next recap for Next Gen New York City. Love you, Ray, and I will hopefully talk to you very, very soon. Bye, love. Thanks for patience. Bye. Watch what Crappens would like to thank its premium sponsors. She answered the call. It's Adia Paul. Ain't no thing like Alison King. Our way is the Amberway. It's the Foster and the Furious.

43:27Ben Mandelker: It's Amanda Foster. It's Always Automatic with Ashley Otto. Put your hands together for Carly Clapp. Get on the right foot with Chrissy Offord. She's not just a Sheila, she's a Daniela. Etchles! We never miss her call. It's Diane Call. Sunday in the Park with Dylan Clark. Big Yay, it's Emily Gauthier. Erin McNicholas. She don't miss no trick-a-less. Hala Nagila Weber. You'll never hide from Heidi Eleanor Jones. It's no BS. We love Hugo E.S. Jamie, she has no last name-y. Sips some scotch with Jessica Trotch. She's our favorite streamer, Caroline Peacock. Kristen the Piston Anderson. Que sera, sera, whatever we'll be, we'll Lauren Sillsby.

44:10She gets an A from us, it's Lindsay D. Let's give a kisserino to Lisa Lino. Fresh as a daisy, it's Maisie McHenry. Come again? We're obsessed with Margaret O 'Halloran. Megan Berg, you can't have a burger without the Berg. Gather round for the lore of Michelle Moore.

44:28Ben Mandelker: This is Livin' with Michelle Vivian. I love ya, Olivia Williamson. She sure is swell. It's Raquel. Yes, we canna. It's Sadana. Cast a spell with Shannon Spellman. Let's share with Sharon Eldridge. Darn skippy. It's Tibby. And our super premium sponsors. She's VVIP. It's Amanda V. Somebody get us 10 cc's of Betsy MD. We're taking the gold with Brenda Silva. Let's get real with Caitlin O 'Neill Put us on a stretcher, it's Charlotte Fletcher Hoagel your horses, it's Christine Hoagel Don't get salty with Christine Pepper Can't have a meal without the Emily Sides Who, what, why, where, and Gwen Pentland Nobody holds a candle to Jamie Kendall We got our wish, it's Jen Plish Have a kebab with K-Rob My favorite Murdo, Karen McMurdo Let's get savage with Laura Wildman In the study, with a candlestick, it's Leslie Peacock.

45:25Ben Mandelker: We're ride or die for Lisa Ryder Barron. She's a whiz, it's Liz Sarthy. Always killing it, it's Lo Alkalani. Roger that, it's Marlis Rogers. The incredible edible Matthews sisters. She eases our woes, it's Melissa St. Rose. She's the lady of the house, it's Rachel Sherouse. There's a chance of meatballs, it's Rebecca Cloud. She's our princess, it's Rebecca Prince. She's the queen bee, it's Sarah Lemke. We cannot tell a lie. It's Sarah Talafson. Shannon out of a cannon, Anthony. Please don't stop. It's Soli and Pop. Let's take off with Tam LaPlane. Strike a pose. It's Tori Rose. She ain't no shrinking Violet Kuchar.

46:05We love you guys.

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