Special Bonus #620: Daisy Kelliher and Marc MacNamara from Yacht Mess Pod

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1:13Ben Mandelker: What's up,

1:27what's crappin's?

1:33with Daisy Kelleher and Mark McNamara from the Yacht Mess Pod. Hello, welcome. Hi, guys. Excited to be here. Thanks for having us. So good to see you guys. Oh, my God. Mark's like, oh, I'm just in my little bedroom. It's so sad because I'm hiding from my dogs. That's as big as any apartment I've ever seen as a background. That's gorgeous. That's the one nice thing I have is my apartment. Everything else sucks. Mark's apartment's pretty nice. It is. I got to stay there a few weeks ago, and I was living my best New York life. I was like, oh, this is where I belong. That is how to do it. Daisy, where are you right now?

2:08I am in London, also in a bedroom. Not my bedroom. This is a much nicer apartment than mine. I am babysitting my friend's baby. So I'm fitting this in. Oh my gosh. I need Andy and a camera.

2:22Ben Mandelker: I know. Is the baby going to be okay while you podcast with us? She's still here. She's the mom is still here. It's all safe. Okay, good. baby's holding onto a fan blade just swinging around in a circle we did a podcast where stacy had she was babysitting and she was going door to door asking him if this was his home so i am concerned this is the same baby i know we had a meeting and i was in a cab and i was like cosmo which is your house he's like this one he's like two and i'm like it was very stressful amy our manager and mark was on the meeting and they were like what is going on here I was like, yeah, this is a lot.

3:04Ben Mandelker: It's very stressful. Do you find that actually your experience in yachting makes you a very good babysitter? Yes. People have said that before. I'm pretty organized because, you know, in previous boats before Blow Deck as well, they were like, I worked on like family boats. And so I'd be like, we're going to the beach. And I'd be like, here's your sun cream, snacks, towels, but for the crew as well, not just for the guests. and I had a few people comment to being like, why you could honestly be a mom for 10 children. You're just thinking about everything all the time. You're like, yeah, I've trained my brain at this stage.

3:40The table's set gloriously by the time the parents get home. The kids just putting, you know, gay penises everywhere, gay penis puppets everywhere. Like, where did I get this? So how is it, so how long have you guys been doing your podcast? guest we've actually just hit the six month mark wow nice yeah god it feels like you've been around yeah i don't know if that's a good thing or something but it is that would a great way it feels like you're established how did you guys meet by the way uh mark was actually a guest on um below deck so yeah he was a guest on below deck uh sailing season five the drag charter that almost got us fired kind of at the end there.

4:29And yeah, Mark, he was the one who kept saying anal. I know. And you guys hated me because I listened to you guys and you guys, oh, that idiot. Listen, I said anal twice, which is two times too many. I agree.

4:44Ben Mandelker: Okay. So I personally don't remember because it all blurs together, but I'm assuming we did something like this. Anal! Right. Did we do something like that at the Empire Podcast? I actually remember that episode of Watch What Crapins really well as well because it made me laugh so hard because part of editing is you don't see all of it. So like Mark said, it was two times too many, but it really wasn't that bad. But everyone like online and everyone was like, God, what's this guy's obsession with anal? And I'm not obsessed with anal. I'll do oral, but like it just, I shouldn't have brought it up.

5:19It's true. I just feel like every time there's, every time there's gay charter guests, they're like, take the gayest shit they do and then just copy and paste it 30 000 times yeah throughout the thing you know the guests also don't help it you know there's always like a pride team or you know a drug but it's um they're super full and and yeah me and mark and you know we got on and well you mark you tell the rest of the story because you came to me with the pilot well someone came to me with the pod and the original idea was for uh you and asia and then it ended up being me and you and then the same person named it yacht mess.

5:57And then we kind of did a test because we hadn't, we didn't really know each other. We had known each other from the boat. We had met when Daisy came and did watch what happens live, but we weren't, we didn't know much about each other other than surface friends. So it was kind of like a leap, like we're going to do a podcast together. Let's test it. And we just got on really well. And it, we got to know each other through the process. Yeah. It's been a fun kind of journey and yeah, getting to know each other and it turns out we're like the same person so we've got that and yeah it's been a really fun you know you're super into anal now which is weird

6:40mark what's it like when you're a guest on that show when you know you just come in for one charter and you've i would imagine you'd feel like well it's no big deal you know maybe i'll just kind of be in the background and then you're kind of famous forever because they repeat over over and over and over. Do you get recognized a lot from being on it? Not necessarily from being on it, but I was, so when the call came through to ask me to be on it, they had originally asked Detox and Bianca Del Rio, another drag queen. And because I'm really good friends with them, they said, oh, let's go with Mark.

7:14And then I was on the safari, like away from any communication in South Africa. And they're like, hey, would you do it? And then I wasn't able to go on any, they do like a couple of zoom calls to tell you what's going to happen and everything. I didn't get to be a part of any of that. So I just showed up that day and kind of jumped into it, not really knowing what was, you know, like, I didn't even know how many days we were going to be there, to be honest. So I just got really lucky and just kind of lived it as if a vacation, which I think is better because then I wasn't nervous about anything or nervous about what the process was.

7:46I was just able to go and be myself, talk about things I shouldn't have. and have a vacation. So it was a lot of fun for me. It was no stress.

7:56Ben Mandelker: Did you have anything on your preference sheet that was violated? Yes, actually, the chef was not. Very old. I don't know if you remember Chef Kois. He was like 21 and a half. Yeah. Oh my gosh, Kois. Yes. A little haircut. It just came rushing back. They were kind of good guests because the best guests on the show are you know you guys have seen a lot of seasons now but what people really enjoy is when guests are um they're fun but they also tell us when they're not happy and they don't have to be rude about it but you know it doesn't work in production when they're like to each other oh my god we hate the food and then I come up and then I'm like how was everything and they're like amazing and then I go back down in production like they fucking hated it and I'm like I don't know what to tell you i'm like you know they we can't move with the story then and so they were those guys were great because they were fun but also kind of said like we don't like the food and you know that puts pressure on you know whether it be me or um or the the chef whatever it is that's you know the kind of best to push story so yeah mark was not happy well i don't even think you were the worst he was oh lola was not he did make me throw up because he asked for biscuits and gravy because I'm trash and he made it with like clam juice and like clam chowder and I threw up immediately but like I ripped my mic off so I did because I didn't want them to get that and like he made me throw up so it wasn't like just being dramatic it was actually gross yeah clam chowder gravy I mean I love clam chowder but like that's just going a little bit too far like you're not expecting it Like you don't want to unexpected clam chowder.

9:43Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Clam juice. Clam juice. Isn't just something you, you put in anything, especially biscuits and gravy. I mean, what the hell? Cloyce. I mean, I guess if you said it was,

9:53Ben Mandelker: Hey, this is a clam chowder with like served on a biscuit. It's really not that far from like scooping your bread into a bowl. But I think again, if you're expecting like Southern gravy and then you're getting clam chowder, that's like a shock to the system for sure. Daisy, what is it like being on this below deck versus sailing? Because sailing, I mean, I felt like sailing is a rough start. Jesus, they really put you guys through it on that show. So are you in heaven being on this show? What are the differences? Stability. Physical stability, in a sense. I mean, you know, like I love sailing and I love that extra element of the boat.

10:35like it really is the kind of 10th character and all of those shots and you know of us tipping over and everything going flying like I could even see the humor in that just like being involved in it um but yeah it was you know this was just a different challenge it was a much bigger boat you know the stairs in this boat were really like quite tiring so physically it was it was a lot but really I mean the differences aren't really that much like you're so consumed with everything going on you know there there wasn't like moments this season where i was like thank god we're not healing over i didn't even have time to kind of think about that um but yeah it was it was a nice

11:13Ben Mandelker: change we have more space looks like in your quarters also like on the sailing yeah you guys were so cramped oh i loved my cabin my cabin was absolutely huge maybe not my cabin mate but the Like, having was great.

11:29Can't have it all.

11:30Ben Mandelker: I mean, one thing that I love about you, Daisy, on the show is that you're not afraid to lay down the law for the people, you know, working under you or around you. Like, you're kind of fearless in that way. You're always going to be like, yeah, shut up. Like, you go toe-to-toe with Ben. You went toe-to-toe with Gary and others in past seasons. Where did you hone that skill? Have you just always had that ability or did you have to kind of like develop that by working up in the yachting industry or other work experiences? Well, thank you. I appreciate that. I actually think it's something I do quite, what's the word?

12:12Like I'm very conscious of it. So it actually doesn't come supernatural to me. Like it's something that I'm very aware that that's my role. and I think being you know not only a chief stew I think you know being on a on a big show like Blow Deck for several years I think you have to constantly progress and you you need to work on your management skills so that's something like this season I went in you know feeling like I maybe I think sometimes I am too soft and sometimes people mistake kindness for weakness and finding that balance of trying to be people's friends, which I love, but also trying to gain their respect.

12:53And I think season five of Blow Deck was, you know, obviously a tough one with Deanna and Danny. And that was something that I really, yeah. I know, we're all glad that was over. But that was something I really carried with me going into this season. I was like, you know, I can't allow people to kind of speak to me this way. So it's actually something that I'm very aware of. So when, you know, when I found out Ben was my chef, like I was, I was so nervous. I was like, I was feeling really strong and I was like, I'm going to be the queen of this boat and no one's going to put baby in the corner.

13:31And then I was like, oh crap, Ben, I was like, how am I going to do this? So I was very, yeah, very conscious of it. it was something that wasn't it didn't actually come as easy to me as maybe it looks um but you know i know my place i feel very confident now you know having done this for five years having been a chief stew for 10 plus years now i finally feel like i'm in a place where i'm like no i know what i'm doing stop just right i was like i like i was just imagine like did you learn how to do

14:06Ben Mandelker: that on all those family boats you're like okay children get in your bedrooms you know yeah i mean each year it's it's been just uh you know a confidence thing kind of getting and better and better at it but yeah something i'm constantly working on and you know finding that balance of being nice but also you know i've i'm queen of the boat yeah you are you really are when we watch below deck it seems like every season there are multiple romance storylines and you know talking to people from the show over the years a lot of them seem to be kind of put on by producers or at least encouraged by producers is that still happening a lot or is that natural i guess my question is like joao okay so do you know what um jenna put it really well this year because I also get people telling me like oh I was forced to be with this person um which people have said about me and you know and it does get into my head I'm like oh well that's charming um and I you know this year specifically I spoke to Jenna about it and I was like I'm really annoyed that this person has said that they were forced to be with me and I was like were you forced to do anything this season and she goes unfortunately not and i was like thank you she's like i made every single decision all on my own and i was like thank you so personally um five years later i have never been asked to do anything from production ever that i you know haven't been um a willing participant in you know we drive our own storyline i think the most production and ask you to do is if they see something they're like they they kind of want you to lean into it because they can't tell a story but like they're not going to go up to me and say you and eddie can you two get together you know it doesn't work there has to be something there and so i personally call bs on that narrative it's never been my experience and it's just these bad decisions are all by our own doing yeah because on uh the latest season of classic below deck they were all hooking up so much that it was actually to the detriment of the show and i'm like is this normal for yachting life or were these people who were like trying to make a splash on reality tv i mean i know you were on that boat but like i feel like that's not par for the course necessarily for these shows or is it just like we just normally had don't see it as much on tv because they emphasize other parts the narrative um no i think i think the majority of the hookup and things you'll always see there's definitely been a few kisses like random drunken like um i don't know like truth or dare that make no story like sometimes i'm like yeah i kissed that person like i've kissed some of the girls before like on nights out like this year i was kissing jenna like i don't think that makes story because it was just fun it wasn't you know me and jenna i think at one stage they were like you and channel i was like don't go down that route yeah we're just having a good time um so i think if it makes story it's a part of the story they're talking about it it's a thing um i would say i'd say it's a mixture of both i would say you know i wasn't there during og but i will in my opinion i think some people do self-produce and you know i certainly see it with the junior crew and I get it like the junior crew don't have the same amount of story as the senior crew do so kind of sometimes our only way to get a storyline is is really conflict or a love interest and you know that's not really their fault like being just the good you know you see it with Batool just being the hard worker you know they're they don't get much story time and you know a lot of these people come on maybe maybe to be an influencer or maybe to whatever elevate their career in something so i think they do self-produce knowing their way of getting a storyline and then i do also think that we these relationships escalate really quickly we're in it is a very intense environment and it's very easy to do an 18-hour shift and then you know suddenly a warm body looks pretty inviting you know yeah so i think it's a bit of Yeah.

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21:43Ben Mandelker: That's cachava. K-A-C-H-A-V-A dot com. Code crappens. What was it like with the Real Housewives of Salt Lake City on there? I mean, as you can see, it was busy. They were actually really lovely. They genuinely are really nice women. They're professionals. They know what they're doing. Again, they know how to you know drive story and they just kept us busy it was just you know asking us for water margaritas coke zero hair dryers can we do this can we do that i was like my head was just frazzled by the end of it um but always said thank you always you know they were never rude to us and i mean those ladies can can argue that that's really impressive yeah so the ellie of it all um what's been going on with that because i saw a clip of ellie saying we don't even need daisy in the what the hell what was that about it seemed like you were getting along fine with ellie yeah so we're we're kind of halfway up um through the season and obviously we have a whole second half where you can kind of see me and ellie kind of start having some conflict and but you know i can only really speak up until this point you know we do get on it she came on and I obviously knew her her history but was very happy to to give her a second chance I'm not part of casting I'm not part of hiring so you know I she's a yeah she's an interesting person she's um we got on fine um but she's not the easiest to get on with uh you know and you see just the little things like in the latest episode when I tell her to to move I was being polite I was like hey can you move over and she's like and I'm like sorry I think you missed this like you know and then I kind of have to get the claws out I'm like you're pushing me like I don't want to be mean but you're you're annoying me move and you know the Ben thing was pretty escalated and you know in the second half you'll see we we kind of yeah really start to to butt heads um and you know even now she's i mean whatever like i don't have a problem with her per se which she's like yeah i don't know what daisy's problem is i don't have a problem with her i'm like are you watching yourself like you know and then she does on the after show like i mean which was the weirdest comment i'm like yeah this show can go on without me like there's millions of yachts millions of slow decks that have gone on without me but I'm like I don't know why that was a dig I'm like it's also okay without you Ellie like um so yeah she just she just rubs me up the wrong way you know she says some stuff on social media to wind me up and then says oh I don't know why Daisy's mad you know it's this kind of poking the bear and then when I snap she kind of and she does that you'll see in the second half she does the same thing winds me up pokes me does stuff to disrespect me and then when i snap back she's like daisy just attacked me and i'm like oh god that's a bit of an exaggeration yeah it's still to come she just moved her and ben become besties and i become her enemy that's essentially no oh i mean that's great for us because that's going to be amazing television but i'm sorry that you had to go through that but uh thank you for making your sacrifice for us the viewers you know what i gotta give it to her she is fascinating to watch um you know even even on the boat i was like wow this is this is these moves are so interesting you know um the joao thing was interesting and you know she was she's fine to be around um but she she does kind of isolate herself she removed herself from the groups like she wouldn't kind of drink with us before when we were getting ready you know we're having a few drinks at the bar upstairs she never joined in on that she she just really had no not much interest in getting to know the crew um but yeah she's interesting to watch great green screens um you know it's interesting because she's making she's making little moves every second you know it's like okay the Ben thing wraps up okay let's immediately Joanne needs a massage okay that's done you know go for the oh yeah who deserved it frankly but like go for Alicia you know she's always got a ball she's always got a couple of balls in the air it's pretty impressive i you know i was i was fine with her coming on because like i said she was fascinating to watch and she really was she's a little chess player she just never um kind of stopped but yeah she'll you know she makes up for the second half and i wish her the best of luck but um yeah me and her i'm bestie i wish her luck in hell.

26:42Bring some ice, bitch.

26:44Ben Mandelker: How much communication is there ever before a charter season? I have to assume, had you ever met Joao before? Just do Bravo things or have you met Ellie or anyone or you just come on the boat and you just don't know who's going to be there? No. I have met people in the past. I'm friendly with Fraser. I'm friendly with Aisha. We've met at BravoCon there were like a few other random people I've met like Katie Floody and Malia mainly things through BravoCon or Upfronts but a lot of the junior crew I wouldn't have met unless they were on sailing and so when you know this season I came on or pretty much any season unless they're reoccurring like Colin, Gary, my captain I've never met any of the people coming on so So this season, I had an inkling that there was going to be returners, but I didn't know who.

27:40And I did not guess Ben and Joao. And I had never met them before. I'd never met Ellie before. So it was, yeah, all very new. And I'd never even spoken to any of them. I had, you know, seen them, seen their seasons and seen them online, but never interacted with them. So it was interesting. What about Below Deck Sailing? Is that just completely done? is that officially done so it doesn't have to and if it is or not does it have to do with the actual boat being available or not so i have the boat still floating by the way the boat is still floating apparently down in spain so i do not know i think as far as i'm aware it's put on pause and i don't think they ever really cancel any of these shows it you know the simple thing is it's on pause maybe it'll come back um whether that's next year or in you know five years and i do think from what i understand i think bravo loved sailing i think they were very proud of that spin-off um and i think that the element of you know sailing the physical sailing they love i also i think glenn people just love glenn so you know i think never say never and we just no one knows the future of Below Deck.

28:57I think, I don't know, no one has ever told me why it got put on pause, but from what I'm aware, I think it was a mixture of the ratings of our last season. I think some of the drama that I will not mention. And I think it was also... I think it was also boat logistics, but sailing boat is harder to get. Well, sailing is the only one that is around that there are so many conversations about the actual boat and like what's going on with the boat and where it came from. Like there's actual drama with that boat, which I've always found so hilarious that there will be entire Reddit threads. Like, well, they can't do it because the boat, you know, the owner of the boat got mad about this thing or that.

29:43There's just always seems to be like some kind of drama about the actual vessel. I do love Reddit. They're like, oh, no, the boat's been sold. I'm like, you know, they could do it on another sailing boat. like parsimals didn't say it's me or no one like yeah parsimals i mean there was it was always so

29:58Ben Mandelker: funny for us because it felt like every season it was like oh guess what one of the masks fell over you know it's like the whole thing is like a disaster there was that one season where the engine just wasn't working and colin went in there and took like bubble gum and cotton balls and was like well it's working now and i was like what and like and of course there was the crash into the dock i mean that boat took a battering over the course of the seasons and like i don't know i'm I really am surprised it's still in one piece. Mark, what was it like for you as a passenger on a sailing yacht? Was the diagonal of it all crazy?

30:30It was a lot. And to give you an update on the boat, we had Glenn on our show a couple of weeks ago, and the boat just had a total rehaul. So that's where the boat actually has been. They refurbished all of it. They had to fix the engine because it was season five where the engine stopped working. So Parsifal is alive, but it's been redone. i love the uh glenn's still with it so glenn's still with the parcel no i think i think she may have gotten sold to be honest um i think that's what's happened but yeah sailing boats are just there's not as many of them i think they're a little bit more treasured than you know we the motorboats get ripped apart in the season they got like oh i'm sure yeah so it's you know usually more run down boats and maybe owners looking for some quick cash things like that not owners that love their you know possession and they're like their baby i know this one there are suede walls right aren't they suede walls or like are they velvet walls there's like some kind of fabric velvet yeah it's like some kind of velvet or something on the walls and i'm like no no all right food service up and down i'm just and someone in the service i was like oh god please

31:45Ben Mandelker: yeah i can't imagine suede walls and then also aren't like a certain number of those rooms just dedicated to your crew like the the tv show crew that has to like be there and like that's what they have to like there are control rooms and all that stuff and and like doesn't that how does that affect you as like a stew just just dealing with having a camera crew in there and producers and like microphones dangling all over the place um it's do you know what it's not too bad when it comes to production they really stay out of the way uh we rarely see the producers and they're very professional and they don't like and try you know i i have a little bit of a different relationship five years later than maybe some of the junior cast member members but um we really just see the cameramen and the audio people like we're carrying our own mics on mics and cameras you know i'm sure mark can tell you as well and it's pretty discreet i think it's relatively discreet than what you would um imagine it's not like a tv set where you've got like the boom mics or But sometimes you do for like jumping off the water and stuff.

32:51But they're very, very good at keeping to themselves. And I do think, I really do think it's one of the only shows out there that is pretty much not produced or scripted. And they take the fourth wall very seriously. And I think they, you know, take it seriously because they are, you know, sure that it's one of the key ingredients of its success. Yeah. Yeah, there's a notification that's going off, and I love it because it sounds like a submarine. Oh, that's me. I am so sorry. I would have said something right. It's totally fine. It just sounds like a submarine, so I like it because it's a nautical-themed episode, so I'm into it.

33:34And I guess this is for both of you. What about the preference sheets is real? Are they usually that intense? and the parties and stuff that you guys have to throw, like the themed costume parties, is that normal? That has to be something they just do for TV because I can't imagine a bunch of rich people are like, we need a drag night and then we need a circus night and then I want seals everywhere. I just want fake blow-up seals everywhere. And a little busy gets the crew, yeah. Is that kind of a show invention or is that real? Well, I'll say with the real stuff and then Mark can kind of say, because he actually did the preference sheet, I don't actually know how that works.

34:13With regards to the show and the comparison, what I will say is weirdly enough on rail boats, they do like a tablescape. I hate a tablescape. And I kind of get it. I think it's when you're on a boat for two weeks, they like, a lot of owners like to see their money. So they like to see the stews work. And that can, you know, sometimes we do tablescape and they take a while. like they can take like two hours and you're putting like sand and you know doing all these big candle things like every time I'm like this is so tacky like it's really not my thing at all but most boats you'll do some sort of tablescape different now to below deck it's more like sands and shells and things like that and in regards to the themes you will do a theme if it's a theme thing so like we've done parties for fourth of july and it's pretty tacky it's that the um what's it called sorry the flags the balloons things like that a birthday party and bastille day but they wouldn't just come up to me and be like hey daisy today we want like a rodeo theme that would never happen yeah that's not a thing so it's kind of a little bit meeting in the middle there and a little bit real, but also a little bit hyped up for the kind of drama of it.

35:37And then, yeah, Mark, you've done the preference sheets. And they're very serious about them. I did mine at the last minute. They'd asked for it like five times. Then finally I filled it out. And when I got there, they went over it with me and I didn't remember filling it out. So bringing back the clam juice, they asked what your favorite juice was. I said, clam just to be an ass. And they're like, oh so sorry we didn't we don't have that um and they they took it really seriously but i think they kind of uh wanted us to do a theme night because they're like they visually it's it's more fun for them to see us dress up and not see like oh what did cole's cash buy you this week they wanted to see like some razzle dazzle so they wanted to put a theme on it so it visually looked more exciting i think because it's the show but they take them really seriously they want to know what you want for breakfast for lunch for dinner like how do you like your meat what you have what type of fruits do you like they're very specific on you have to fill that out everything that you drink needs to be on there everything you eat needs to be on there and did you feel

36:38Ben Mandelker: like when you were a guest on the boat did did that affect you in the sense that like a lot of times we see on these shows there's always like a primary who comes on and then there's always like a friend of the primary and it's like the friend of the primary is the one who is making all sorts of outrageous demands it's like they get like a power trip or something did you did you like step on that boat did you ever have a moment of like i'm a normal person that you step on the boat and you suddenly had these like instincts and urges that you're like oh i have to like curb this like something's taking over me or is that just what i imagine happens you hit the nail on the head that did happen with one of our guests uh a queen named lola who i'd never met i'd only known detox before I got on the boat.

37:21So the rest of the eight people I had met on the boat. So there was a queen named Lola who came with that. None of us, all of us on the trip still talk. We have a group text. We're still in communication except for her. Because as soon as we got on that boat, he thought he was a real housewife. He started trying to create drama with detox. And I took off our mics and I took us to the bedroom because the cameras won't follow you into the bedroom if you're not mic'd. And I said, listen, I'm not doing this. I'm not having this. The show is about the crew. We're here to have fun. Be yourself. I'm not going to cause some fight just to get some camera time.

37:57So if you want to do that, like either I'm going to get off the boat or you're going to get off the boat because I'm not, that's not who I am. That's not what this is going to be about. We're here to have fun. Just be yourself. Relax into it. And she did the entire time and was just so obnoxious about it. I think that's just another good example of like, you know it's the same with the crew and i'm sure it's the same on other shows people self-produce you know that's why everyone's like this is so scripted and i'm like girl we don't need a script like people take it upon themselves and you know and we get told it every year they're you know they're very adamant and saying at least us and i'm sure they say that to the guests as well be yourself you don't need to be anything but yourself like you've been brought on because you're special and we want you here because of your personality and then you know you get one or two people whether it be the guests or the crew go nah i'm gonna be someone else and it never ever goes well and you know afterwards they're like i'm kind of told you

38:58Ben Mandelker: to not self-produce is mike self-producing you think he's very gossipy like gossipy to the point where i'm like is he just trying to make yeah it seems like mike would be that that one for this season yeah i think you know i'm not i you know i don't want to speak for him i don't know and and you know maybe i think sometimes they're not even sure themselves but i you know he'd obviously done a tv show before and you definitely get every year one or two people where they don't realize how hard we work like every season one or two come on and they're like why this is this is really hard work and i'm like we're like yeah like you signed up to a real job and sometimes i think you know maybe a deck person and maybe a stew come on and they think they're doing real housewives or you know whatever and you you're kind of sitting around and then they're like action we work crazy hard and i i'm not i'm not entirely sure with mike but yeah i think there was maybe a little bit of he thought he was doing his other tv show um you know and he's you know very entertaining and he's funny and i like his green screens but yeah i think he thought that the work wasn't as important as it really was and it catches up on him for sure.

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43:01Are there a lot of times where they take the guests who don't have enough people and just add other people onto their group? Because it seems like sometimes people come on and they don't really even know the primaries and they're like what that this person's acting crazy and i want no part of this person you know and i've always wondered if it's just like maybe they had a group of four and they're like okay well we had another group of five that wanted to come on so let's just mix them together that is actually a good guess but it's not spot on so i had the same thing when i um watched or not watched when i did my first season i was like this is wild i I was like, I started asking questions.

43:41I was like, how long have you guys known each other? What happened, especially the first few years in COVID and not as much now, what happens is, is when the charters, the charter guests are given their dates, they're really specific. So they're like, can you come to Mexico on the 20th of June until the 23rd of June? And that's their window. So a primary, like you guys, you go, oh my God, this is amazing. You know, you have a podcast and suddenly you go to all your friends who have nine to five jobs and you have children and you're like, come to Mexico on the 20th to the 23rd of June. They're like, I can't, like, I have a job.

44:22I have to get babysitters. so they end up reaching out to really far corners of their groups people they went to university and they haven't seen them in 20 years people that they were friendly with on instagram a friend of a friend of a friend and that's why they're so disconnected and that is so you're not far off um but yes i was also wondering the same thing because i was like you guys don't seem like that good friends. They're like, well, I haven't seen her in 20 years. That makes so much

44:55Ben Mandelker: sense because we always are like, what are they trying to con us? You have like these three people and then those four people. I was like, these people do not know each other. And I guess that is sort of true, but it's not because of production. It's because people have lives. They want to go and they, you know, they've been given this opportunity, but they're struggling to get nine friends. In COVID, it was really bad. That's really when you saw it because people didn't want to travel or they couldn't so they were scouring like you know their friend from middle school and then they were like oh i don't actually like this woman anymore um it's not as bad anymore but yeah you get some really disjointed groups so yeah that's to answer that that's funny how do you deal with the audience reaction i mean that seems like it would be a huge part of the show because you shoot how long how long is the season to shoot how long does it take three months to air yeah by three months but like when you're when you're actually shooting it how long are you on six weeks oh so it's only six weeks so it's six weeks but then it runs for what three or four months and then you have to deal with the audience reaction which can be pretty intense i mean below deck has a shockingly intense audience reaction i find i'm like geez i mean there's people who will get so mad about something in service like that wasn't even the right fork idiot you know and they'll go crazy for weeks about shit like that what is it like navigating that you know in your position um you know what actually it was uh i think oh how do i answer this i think it's hard to stay silent it's hard to definitely not react and sometimes i find myself reacting and i'm definitely somebody who stands up for myself and that is something i've had to learn and to take a minute not react you know it'll go away sometimes i don't always sometimes i clap back um it's hard that it's patience and i've definitely gotten better at it over the years there were really difficult times uh you know during the breakup with colin where there were it was a very complicated story and a very complicated background and it was very much not shown the experience of what I experienced so that was really difficult to not be able to and I kind of tried to voice it throughout the reunion and it was just a mess I just couldn't vocalize what I was trying to say the story was so convoluted he obviously was keeping one side of it very quiet which is fine I'm over it now but that was really difficult to have so many people have such a strong opinion about me and my relationship and something that was very vulnerable but in hindsight I'm really glad I went through it because I think it's made me so much stronger if I ever have to experience anything like that again and now I'm like oh I I feel like I'm much more equipped for that and my perspective has changed you know when I first joined the seat the show you get told be yourself this is your you know your time to shine your time to show your true identity and weirdly that can actually be a lot because when somebody gets a lot of hate like some of the other junior cast members who get really bad hate you kind of walk away from it being like I was myself and now I'm so hated and I'm getting death threats and you know this really negative online attention whereas now i've kind of readjusted my thought process and going this doesn't define me this is a job and this is a moment in time and you're allowed to grow you're allowed to change and i think that's really helped i actually think it was a bit detrimental when it was like this is you this is who you are and i was like oh god what if i mess this up like this is the only chance i guess and well yeah because i mean even being yourself in regular life i mean you can't just go to the office and be yourself or you people would get fired you know i mean i can't just walk into the office and be like i'm taking a nap or you know like ronnie would you do this no fuck you i'm not fucking doing it you know because that is myself so i would get fired in two seconds so we you know we all have to have kind of filters so i guess that is kind of scary to take that off really anywhere, but especially in front of cameras.

49:14Yeah, and I think, you know, finding that balance and that's why it's so interesting doing Below Deck because it is that balance of being that work professional, but then being able to switch it off and have a love interest and then drink, but still have the, you know, respect of your peers. And I think that's part of why it makes it so interesting. And it's a part of why I wanted to do Yacht Mess with Mark so people could see a more unfiltered version of me and a bit more lighthearted, a bit funnier, because I do have to be still a cheese stew while working. So that's, you know, like we did, you know, we talked about Summer House on our last week's episode.

49:52And, you know, I know they've been getting a lot of hate. And we did it. We put up a clip and I just couldn't believe everyone's like, no, she should basically burn at the stake. I was like, like I'm talking about Amanda. I'm like, God, everyone needs to relax. like they are gonna you know suffer in their own way and their friendships are gonna suffer and i just couldn't even believe even on our clip how intense people were and basically being like you know mark was like i was right yeah he was like not that we weren't team cr but we were just saying like people need to to relax a bit on the hate and then they're like coming from

50:31Ben Mandelker: do you feel that you being someone who's on camera you have a different perspective for when these scandals happen in like the world of Bravo?

50:43It's hard to know if it's because I'm on camera. I think I'm a huge empath. I think I am somebody, you know, I've been told in my whole life, I'm a real devil's advocate. I can see people's perception from everywhere. So, you know, when people have affairs, like they come to me, they're like, I'm cheating on my husband. I'm like, it's going to be okay. They're like, I can't tell anyone, but you, you're the only one who doesn't judge. and I'm like, well, we're all human. I'm not going to sit in my high horse. So I think it's going to be great. Yeah. Well, you've also got the experience with the Gary and Colin thing, you know, which obviously isn't exactly the same, but it's similar in that there's like friendships and, you know, but that was my, that was my girlfriend.

51:24And, you know, I was, I had her and it's like, well, you didn't want me, but now you want me because he wants me. I mean, it's kind of the same, just like similar vibes there. And I would imagine with audience reaction, you are getting the same because whether you were right or wrong in the situation which i think you're always right if you're going to go against colin or gary personally but um whether you're right or wrong in that specific situations people choose sides and they're just like they're gonna they're gonna call you out and try and turn feather you on the internet you know massively and it's it's so interesting you know the colin and gary thing is one um one kind of example of things I've done in my life you know I'm turning 39 I've never really had a serious boyfriend I have you know messed around so much in my life I'm single I'm like going out there you know trying to find love like everybody else is and you know I think I'm a pretty good person with a pretty good heart who has made mistakes and you know I was talking to my roommate we've all done it.

52:26Even my friends who with the heart, the biggest hearts of gold, whether it be university or later on in life, every single person I know has made some sort of mistake and crossed a boundary in some sort of way, some more than others. And I just couldn't believe the lack of like any sort of empathy. I was like, wow, everyone in this world is so perfect. It must be so nice to sit there and never, ever have made a mistake or feel something they shouldn't have felt or have no empathy for anyone else yeah you know people make mistakes and maybe i did maybe amanda did but i i really i just think it's fascinating how perfect the world is it's really quite amazing to see yeah it really is it's so perfect yeah well i mean you see you guys should have some kind of reach out i mean there's the for people who only get one season because i I feel like, you know, we watch every second of these shows.

53:22So we've seen your and talk about them endlessly, as you know. So we've seen you kind of go from your beginning to where you are now. And just I think having season after season and watching you grow and learn and change from, I think, probably a mixture of what you're actually experiencing, but also how people are reacting to it and how you came back stronger and stuff like that. It's cool to watch that kind of a journey. and a lot of the people on the show, like you mentioned earlier, the junior crew, don't get that opportunity and they're like traumatized for life. Like that guy, Emil, from Below Deck Regular, suing, what is he suing for like$500 million?

54:00Or like something crazy. He's like, $1 trillion. I'm suing you for$1 trillion. So let's get you know the world needs Bravo. Please don't make the fuck world.

54:08Ben Mandelker: I know, don't do this, Emil. I mean, of course, the internet put up like, you know, shots of him being completely incapable the latest job but like yeah and it's like you know he was a jackass on a season but he wasn't you know the worst person and i don't even remember i mean i kind of remember him because i remember they caught him jerking off in bed and i thought that was hilarious like i still remember that i think that was like the funniest thing ever that they kept that in the show but um that's like all i remember and that he had curly hair so i don't even remember and then all All these years later, he's coming back with this huge lawsuit.

54:43Like it's really still bothering him. And everybody I've met pretty much, I would say like 90 % of cast members I've met over the years have been kind of traumatized from it, which is interesting. I don't feel like that with necessarily housewives and stuff. So how do you, how do you feel about that? And like, do you, do you feel like you could ever start like some kind of outreach for X junior that cruise where you could mother them or something or empty them i definitely i mean i've thoughts about all of that i think first of all i've often said that i'm very grateful that i got um more than one opportunity to redefine my story and for the the audience to grow with me i'm forever grateful for that um because you know there are many dimensions to people and i'm glad had not one story got told, but multiple to show like this well-rounded version of myself.

55:39Yeah. I think in regards to the junior crew, I do feel sorry that they don't get to retell their story. But, and this is something, you know, I do speak about. I think, unfortunately, I think in the world of reality TV, ideally, I really genuinely believe producers would love to have really well-rounded normal people. reality tv attracts narcissists we all um everyone has some sort of level of narcissism a reality tv their scope of narcissism is just huge i also have narcissistic traits but this was i i was like wow this is this is a wild room to be in right now um and so unfortunately this level of narcissism i do think you know a lot of these junior cast members i really think they're coming back they're like i am coming back and this is going to be my show you know i i think danny definitely thought like i'm 99 certain she was she thought she was taking my job and it was scary to like hear what i was hearing in the background i was like how were you so not equipped to to deal with this reality of what you know you've created a reality in your head so i do feel sorry for them but I also think this is a hard lesson to learn and you know with Emil I'm like is it is he still really bothered by it or is he just wanting you know a piece of the pie is he just kind of stomping his feet being like thinking everyone else is making millions which I'm pretty sure only the housewives of Beverly Hills are I don't think anyone else is um and he's going I want a piece of that pie but and then moving on to regards to the outreach there has been conversations um Which is me and random people being like, oh, maybe when this ends, I should come on as like a, you know, like a, I guess like a, like a, like a, like a, like a support group.

57:37Yeah. Like a, like a counselor kind of, I've been through this. Let's talk about what you're about to go into. And I do know, like Keith really, I was able to really help him because we were really close. And I was like, I, you know, Jenna was the same. And this year I was like, you know, my advice to you going forward is don't think you're coming back. If you do see it as a really big positive, but prepare your life as you're going to keep, you know, working your normal job. Because a lot of people don't go and get other jobs. They sit around all year waiting for a call back and then they don't get a call back.

58:14And they're like devastated and they haven't worked all year. So I think some of my closer friends on the show have kind of been really grateful for that. And I've been able to kind of coach them being like, take it for what it was, for a good experience. And if they bring you back, brilliant. But the reality is they probably won't. It's just the way the show works.

58:33Ben Mandelker: And the industry is like getting onto blow deck kind of a thing that people are sort of low key aspiring for. Is it like a real like feather in the cap thing or is it sort of immaterial in the yachting industry? Or does it work against you? um yeah i think i think there's a bit of everything there i think when i did it um six years ago i think it was the opportunities there are now definitely didn't exist then and i think instagram there's a lot more money to be made there i think kate has made a really good career for herself reality tv wasn't quite what it is now i think covid really helped with that so when i went and did it like i didn't even know you could make money in instagram like i I genuinely went in because I wanted to get out of COVID.

59:22I had no aspiration to be on TV. No idea. I didn't know what BravoCon was. I didn't know, you know, I'd be flying out to LA. None of this. I didn't know I'd meet Mark and we'd have a podcast. Not part of the plan. So I think now people are a bit more low key being like, oh, they look like they're having a good time. Maybe, you know, so I think some people are now um maybe looking at it as more of a a golden kind of gate thing um but i also think there's a huge amount of negative um press around or negative feeling in the industry and i would never recommend anyone to do it unless you were sure that you wanted to leave the industry people do still go on to have careers i think most people who have done this season and wanted to go back to yachting or decided to have are still working in yachts.

1:00:17But personally, I think focus on your career in yachts and when you're ready to leave and you wanted to take the opportunity, that would be my advice. Right on. That's interesting. All right. So before we wrap up, let's go over what you guys are watching on Bravo right now. What are your favorite shows this year, Mark? In the past year, it doesn't have to just start in January, but like a year-ish. Yeah. The new Rhode Island, I think, is chef's kiss. I am obsessed with it. The way that the Alicia just casually mentions that she ran over a woman is what I need in a housewife. So love her. And you know, I agree with Kelsey, not necessarily that you need to have a husband or a man that has a different, like someone else, like how he has that other girl in Miami.

1:01:04but I agree with like putting down a napkin in the summertime when you sit, how she kind of started off with that because I don't know about y 'all, but I wear my coochie cutters in the summer and it's very nice to have a little barrier napkin so that, that you don't get the marks on your legs.

1:01:20Ben Mandelker: She's got standards, standards, a lady with standards. Exactly. See that now you brought that up, Ronnie.

1:01:31I'm out of the Valley. I'm just not, I can't, there's too many kids i don't even care about my friends kids i don't give a rip so the valley i'm out there oh gosh wait till you see this week i just watched the screener for this week oh my god they're all holding a baby like literally every person in there is holding a damn baby or two or three i'm like where do they even come from nope i need kristen to suck a dick and not have a baby that's the kind of kristen i want yes babies

1:01:58Ben Mandelker: what about ladies of london watching ladies of london love ladies of london top tier programming i don't know where they found these these women and men from but like they're so good i'm obsessed with martha and her her magpie i i'm all aboard ladies of london i i'm obsessed with that yeah i think how about you days yeah i you know i'm enjoying ladies of london i think it's you know know it's just something different it's they're just so quirky and kooky and i'm like what are they wearing i'm like why have they stepped out of like the middle ages where did you get my term um you know i think everyone's really enjoying them just a different energy i you know i know um like beverly hills is getting a bit of a bad rap we've we also with sarah michelle geller um kind of said which i tend to agree i think their biggest problem at the moment is which I love our season this year for um is we just move story which Ellie is great for like you said she's like oh I'm done with this on to the next um which I'm all for and but I find Amanda fascinating she's like Ellie I'm like can we study these people like I can't get enough of it every time I feel like a trailer comes up on TikTok I'm like oh my god I need to watch it fascinating so I kind of one of those things you like love to hate to watch um thing and you know I don't think I'm really watching anything else I'm kind of I I was never really into Summer House but I think I might give In the City a go just because I'm friends with Lindsay so I want to support it and just see um what it's about Summer House there's too much to go back on I can't I I can't start from the beginning.

1:03:40So yeah, there's a lot of lore there.

1:03:44Ben Mandelker: A lot of lore. Are you a team Dorit or team Kyle on Beverly Hills these days? Oh, that's it. It's a little bit tricky. I'm not really team either of them. I'm a bit, I feel like Dorit needs to let it go a little bit. Like she, she's a little bit kind of contradictory. She's like, you need to say it to my face. And then people say it to her face. And then she's like, you didn't say it to my face before i'm like oh it's just going around in circles like there's you're never they're never um reaching an agreement and i kind of kyle's like well i'm saying it to your face now and you know it it's just going around in circles so maybe if i had to pick probably team kyle what about you mark bold i think well first of all i think that ellie and amanda are like the dr kimberly shaw from melrose place like i don't want to be around you i don't want to be anywhere near you but i love that you're blowing up the building like and i would say i'm erica i'm not team kyle or team dory i i don't agree with any of them but when erica stepped in you know as we know she invented the word cunt so i'm on her side yeah i brought that to this group you have nothing before me to be fair i would kind of lean towards that as well like holland are just kind of annoying me and then you know erica just tied it up was like you're all but i as much as it's like a bit of a slow season i mean kathy and jennifer tilly like i live for these women when they speak i am just everyone stop talking just let the queen speak um so yeah it's been slow but it's been still entertaining i still really enjoy watching it and we're always saying like housewives don't have to fight all the time They don't need to force these fights all the time.

1:05:34And so we're kind of getting that with this season. And I mean, I like it. I'm still entertaining. I think it's really picked up in the last part of the season.

1:05:44Ben Mandelker: Yeah. Yeah. Mark is now a fan of Sutton. He wasn't there for a while. But yeah, I think the arguing about the she's late and she's, it's a little exhausting. Like move on. I think that was part of, you know, Salt Lake City, I think was a good season. but again they were just moving on they were just tying it up and then moving on to the next thing i think that's kind of an important in reality tv people get bored if you drag it on too much yeah yeah and what's great about below deck is that it's built in is that like kind of there's always a new charter and the charter is going to bring its own pressures and it's going to bring on its own new dramas so that's why below deck just like working out the cast yeah yeah our our season for the second half it's it's going to be fun it's the same we a lot of changes and i i loved it for that reason we just moved on nothing was too deep there was just a lot of little fights can i give them a great season i know that you guys are talking about returning cast members but there's still one yet to come this season who was such a lightning rod she's like that this person is one of my least favorite below deckers ever and they come back so oh my god I am so excited to figure out who that might be.

1:06:55Ben Mandelker: I do enjoy that. Yeah, I know. I think you're always worried, you know, even when you're filming, you know, you get really into the second half. And even watching the season, I think we had kind of just gone one or two a little bit slower episodes. And then it just ramped on back up again. And I was like, yeah, it was a good season. It was a fun season. So I hope so far. Guys, thank you so much for coming on and talking to us. It has been really fun talking to you. Everybody check out the Yacht Mess podcast. And where do you want them to find you all personally? I don't want to mess up your handles.

1:07:32Well, I'm Daisy Callagher 87. That's my Instagram handle. And yeah, you can find us on Spotify, Instagram. Mark, you're good at this. TikTok, Instagram, Apple, Spotify, YouTube, all Yacht Mess pod. And yeah, check it out. If you want to see it or listen to it, it's there. Beautiful. Thanks, you guys. Thank you for being here. Yeah.

1:08:21Daniela. Itchles. We never miss her call. It's Diane Call. Sunday in the Park with Dylan Clark. Big yay. It's Emily Gauthier.

1:08:29Ben Mandelker: Erin McNicholas. She don't miss no trick-a-less. You'll never hide from Heidi Eleanor Jones. I go, you go, we all go for Hugo. Jamie. She has no last name-y. Jamie. She has no last name-y. Sip some scotch with Jessica Trotch. She's not a McBee. She's a McBride. Jess McBride. She's our favorite streamer, Caroline Peacock. Kristen the Piston Anderson. Que sera, sera, whatever will be, will Lauren Sills be. She gets an A from us, it's Lindsay D. Let's give a kisserino to Lisa Lino. Fresh as a daisy, it's Maisie McHenry. Aren't you glad it's Marianne Arns? Megan Berg, you can't have a burger without the Berg.

1:09:10Ben Mandelker: This is Livin' with Michelle Vivian. I love a ya, Olivia Williamson. She sure is swell, it's Raquel. Yes we canna, it's Sadana. Cast a spell with Shannon Spellman Let's share with Sharon Eldridge Darn Skippy, it's Tippi And our super premium sponsors She's VVIP, it's Amanda V Can I have a Kavanaugh? It's Anna Kavanaugh Somebody get us 10 cc's of Betsy MD We're taking the gold with Brenda Silva Let's get real with Caitlin O 'Neill Put us on a stretcher, it's Charlotte Fletcher Hogle your horses, it's Christine Hogle Don't get salty with Christine Pepper Can't have a meal without the Emily Sides Who, what, why, where, and Gwen Pentland Nobody holds a candle to Jamie Kendall We got our wish, it's Jen Plish My favorite Murdo, Karen McMurdo Let's get savage with Laura Wildman In the study with a candlestick, it's Leslie Peacock We're ride or die for Lisa Ryder Barron She's a whiz, it's Liz Sarthy Always killing it, it's Lola Alkalani Roger that, it's Marlis Rogers The Incredible Edible Matthew Sisters.

1:10:20She Eases Our Woes, it's Melissa St. Rose. She's The Lady of the House, it's Rachel Sherouse. There's A Chance of Meatballs, it's Rebecca Cloud. She's Our Princess, it's Rebecca Prince.

1:10:31Ben Mandelker: Maximum Love for Sandy Maximoska. She's The Queen Bee, it's Sarah Lemke. We Cannot Tell a Lie, it's Sarah Talafson. Shannon, out of a cannon, Anthony. Please Don't Stop, it's Soli and Pop. Let's take off with Tam La Plaine. Strike a pose, it's Tori Rose. She ain't no shrinking Violet Kuchar. We love you guys.

1:11:11She's the lady of the house, it's Rachel Sherouse.

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