Niall Gray: How to go Viral on TikTok

0:00Catch flights, not feelings.

0:02Ben Hanlin: Oh my God, those three parts absolutely bombed.

0:08Ben Hanlin: Welcome back to What's The Trick? I'm your host, Ben Hanlin. This is the podcast where I sit down with some of the world's most creative people to try and understand their creative process. I want to know how an idea pops into someone's head and then it goes from just being in their head to becoming something we see out in reality. Because often we see these end results without actually understanding all of the hard process behind it so i want to get geeky and dig into that and over this series we're talking to comedians authors musicians magicians and today's guest is niall gray before i talk about that by the way this is episode two episode one was simon squibb thank you so much for every single person that dm me and commented um i've got i've got my first bit of fan mail i'm not gonna do this every week but it was the first person who dm'd me straight after the episode.

0:56Ben Hanlin: And it was from Ollie who said, Ben, I absolutely loved Simon. Great idea as a concept for a podcast. Can you interview Steven Spielberg? Okay, right. Chill it out, Ollie. All right. I mean, budgets allowing, et cetera. We'll see. Maybe one day. Hello. But let's talk about today's guest. It is Niall Gray. So Niall Gray is Capital FM radio presenter but also TikTok's favorite parody presenter you've probably seen his viral skits he does British TV staples like A Place in the Sun Top Gear and he gets millions of views of doing these parodies and he's also gone viral for his sound which is catch flights not feelings and why do I want to interview Niall because I've been watching his content for years and I find him really hilarious.

1:46Ben Hanlin: I think the way he goes about making these videos is really different. He really leans into nostalgia. So I wanted to talk to him all about that and how he comes up with ideas and he's made a career out of making parody videos. We filmed it in London in late August in a lovely studio. This is on YouTube if you want to watch the video as well. And we talk about his ideas, his content, and his general approach to how he is creative, really. And the first question I asked him about was in 2019 is when his content started to pop so we started there talking about him in 2019 talking about tiktok enjoy

2:25so i was already on the radio at this point i was at capital so i've been at capital for seven years that was 2018 um and i always feel like i've just been posting content for for as long as i can remember now really it was like 2009 i think was when i uploaded my first youtube video So anyway, that was always going on in the background. As you say, we don't want to go too far back there. So I've always been posting stuff. Nothing's ever really picked up. I've just been doing it because I just sort of enjoy making videos and putting them out there. But yeah, 2019, this is when I first downloaded TikTok.

3:00And I actually re-uploaded a video that I'd posted on Instagram and even Twitter about two years before. It was a DJ Dave video. So I've sort of got this character. Yes.

3:09Ben Hanlin: the old wedding dj here we go um so yeah i just had that on my phone i was having a little look through tiktok and it was as we all know it's quite dancery there was a few little sort of i don't really know what the content was on there at the time but i thought you know i'm going to post that video and it just seemed to do quite well yeah um and then i actually remade another version of dj dave this one was a primary school disco dj spiky hair flame shirt all of that yeah And again, that one did quite well. And then I went on holiday with a mate and we went to Fort Aventura. Right. Was this, this is how geeky my research has been.

3:50Ben Hanlin: Yeah. Was this about February 2019 is when this came out. Yeah. Because this is, if I, this is what we want to talk about, is this Escape to the Sun parody. Yeah. Is that right? That's it. Yeah. Tell me how this came about. How it happened. So we were just, we were driving around, we hired a car and we kept seeing all these old abandoned buildings. And I just wanted to get a quick clip from my Instagram. I was like, that'd be quite funny if I was pretending to be a presenter that was like selling this house that just doesn't exist. It's just like a structure to a house. And I was like, oh, just get a quick Instagram story.

4:22I'm going to be like, oh, today we're at this three bedroom, semi-detached house. And the mate who I was with, we worked together and he's just got a real creative brain and he's a great writer. And he was like, you know what, let's go to town with it a little bit more. I think this is a bit more than just an Instagram story. Yeah. So we just spent about an hour just walking around this derelict structure to a house. But by the way, not just that, you're also in quite an ironed shirt.

4:48Ben Hanlin: And in my head, I was like, he's gone home. He's dressed up for this scene. Really thought about this. Yeah, yeah, yeah. What a holiday you're having. Honestly, at the end of this, I'm just, as you were saying, we're going to talk about the nerdy side of things. And I think between us on this holiday, I wouldn't do this with a lot of friends. like we would probably be in bars and just sort of yeah having a good time on holiday but for the two of us we were like this is just great fun just like writing some stuff we spent about three hours editing the bloody thing when we got back later on just in this dingy hotel room we're like what we're doing right this all-inclusive thing we should be at the bar get pissed but we weren't we sort of spent a few hours that day actually going around almost different locations at the end of the day um and yeah we were just sort of writing it on the fly sort of had a bit of a vision of what it's going to look like in the edit and all in all we just had fun doing it so that so that character because yeah this has been a big if anyone's watched your content this is a returning character and then you've done property shows and it's essentially spread out onto this kind of daytime tv parody but that literally came from in the car driving let's film this but then the character just happened there and then it wasn't pre-planned or anything like that oh it was it was exactly that and it was just sort of again sort of like i was saying with the dj dave stuff earlier on it just seemed to work and just enjoy doing it so posted that and that did well and this was when i got really excited because a lad bible reposted it and i feel like especially back then in like 2019 when lad bible repost a video you think oh we've done well That's like making the national news, isn't it?

6:24Ben Hanlin: That is like the goal, yeah. So did you know straight away, almost instantly, you put this one video out, it's done well, and you were like, right, DJ Dave, you're going in the back of the drawer for a minute. A little bit. I'm going to do more property bait. Because I would say, again, if someone's not had a deep dive into your stuff, it's a bit of DJ Dave. You've got Escape to the Sun and Escape to the Country, but a lot of property parodies early on. So then did you just double down onto that? yeah pretty i mean there's never really been a proper plan about the content especially actually earlier on when posting videos i never really wanted to do the same idea too many times because i just felt like oh i feel like i'm milking it too much but actually i do look back now and think i really should have gone bigger with it because you see some creators and they almost did the same video word for word and it's just a different video and it does well time and time again and i sort of wish I did double down even harder.

7:19Ben Hanlin: Yeah but then the thing I know is let's fast forward a bit so you've done the escape to the sun parody and then fast forward you're back in the UK and you're doing property parodies and you start collaborating with Imogen Andrews right? Yeah yeah. So the question I've got there two questions if you haven't seen the the particular content I'm talking about basically you and Imogen pretend to be very daytime tv showing people around a house like a property program so my first question because i never get this how do you get the houses because there's one house especially that excuse my french is an utter dive and a dump and in my head i'm like well who have you called to get that house that's my first question so there's a few stories about actually one of my mates he's a uh he's an estate agent right so you know i don't get him in too much trouble here but i just be like oh mate we really want to do this video like is there any houses that you've got that are just awful grim houses he was like say no more i've got one that you can come around and nice guy like he just sort of he helped us film for for the hour basically and and we filmed this video there he so he literally just let it out to us for for this one hour brilliant i think he might have scheduled in a viewing or something okay and then in that video there's an actor as well there's a guy dressed in like painting and decorator so then i'm thinking so it's not just him it's now imaging he's got a house so obviously now we know how how do you get the actor guy involved he again he's just my mate i'm just like oh can you help us out i never really every now and then i would sort of pay a videographer but for what it is it's literally iphone hold an iphone anyone that can hold an iphone just can film the video so i don't really need to pay too much for a videographer so usually i'll get a mate to film sometimes i'll get them involved as well so that's that guy and the other thing we see a lot and i don't again not i obviously i make content but i'm not in the content creator circle because there's a lot of what they call UK content comedians and things like that.

9:10Ben Hanlin: You collaborate with Imogen. How does that come about? Because I'm seeing it more and more. And even recently, you've been collaborating with other people because it feels like everyone instantly knows everyone and is in each other's videos. How does that work? Yeah, it's definitely a small world. We both reached out to each other just on TikTok. It's like the classic thing. You just follow each other, a few likes here and there. And then you finally go, I think we should do a video together because she was doing a similar thing at the time where she was more of an estate agent. yes and she was doing this voice and i've only found out what this the what the name of this voice is local fry do you know this no you know when someone goes well she was like welcome to this property okay this and everyone in the comments is going love the local fry that's google what the hell is local fry anyway she was playing this character really well and we were like right i think we could be some daytime tv presenters here bit of a kirsty and phil uh Yeah, Place in the Sun kind of vibe.

10:06Ben Hanlin: And then it got carried away because then you and her are then like filming abroad next. So you're going back to Place in the Sun. So what do you two do? Just go, right, we're going to go book a few, like go on a holiday together to make content? It was exactly that, yeah. We were doing a few of these videos at this point. Maybe done like five or six videos in the UK before we need to shake this up now. We were like, well, they always go to Benidorm, don't they? Yeah. Well, let's go to Benidorm then. Might as well. and then literally yeah me her and her boyfriend just went to Benidorm for two nights and it was almost just a work trip like it was fun we both had two different videos two or three different videos we wanted to film we just spent both days just filming these videos and it was great fun it was sort of I mean it didn't it didn't feel like a work trip obviously we were in bloody Benidorm and seeing posters of Sticky Vicky and like you know one pound pints but it was a great time but do you think as well so you go back to your first video like the effort you make so even putting the outfit on the shirt on if you'd have been in the holiday clothes it wouldn't have hit the fact that you spend that bit of effort bit of money going to benedorm do you think that's what makes it hit a bit harder it does it is that production that goes into it even if it's not necessarily people realize because i'm sure most people just thought we were on holiday and we were just sort of pissing about our filming a few clips and making a video out of it um because the funny thing is as you say sometimes i'd get in and i'll get in my car with a shirt on and do a video, whatever the idea of the video is there.

11:35And people go, oh man, love the effort you went to to put a shirt on in the car. And then when we go to Benidorm, no one's going, oh, I can't believe they went to Benidorm to film this. But that's what I think I quite love about it. It is the effort that you go to. And I always appreciate it when I see a video of somebody and you can tell that they've really put effort in, even in the editing and the sound design and just the props. I know that they bought that prop just for that one gag.

12:01Ben Hanlin: Yeah, and you can tell that with a lot of your stuff, actually. A lot of the angles and the editing, you're in a good way, and you have to be. You're a bit of a geek over it, aren't you? And you're kind of looking at all those little extra 1 % details. That's it. Yeah, and it's nice to see when people pick up on it. Even the mate that you were talking about earlier on who was the property guy, you just sort of skew the angle a little bit, do a little Dutch angle, and people are like, oh my God, that's so true. That's always in every episode when they're talking to the property expert. So it's fun to see.

12:30It's those little bits that some people would pick up on.

12:32Ben Hanlin: So I'm going to fast forward because I think, tell me if I'm wrong, but I'm going to say a sentence that may or may not have changed your life. It's probably your catchphrase, right? You know what I'm going to say, I'm guessing. May 2023. So you started 2019-ish on TikTok. May 2023, I think it was. Tell me if I'm wrong. We all heard catch flights, not feelings. You do it. You do it. Do it properly. Come on. Catch flights, not feelings. That wasn't as good. Wasn't as good. A little ropey there. Okay. So that video, describe to people who haven't seen it, because this has gone massive. The audio trended.

13:11Ben Hanlin: It still goes. Tell me about this video. Oh, so the way it came about is somebody that I used to work with, I still follow on Instagram now. and they just whenever they're on holiday it's always like a pint with the sea in the background yeah and like they'd always put the caption saying how's your monday yeah i'd always think oh you're just rubbing it in you're on holiday and i kept seeing them and i was like oh you know what this could just be a fun little compilation video just using these cringy little captions that people use you know today's office yeah so i actually filmed this over like two two different holidays did you Yeah, I went, again, I actually went on a work trip and I was just there on my own.

13:53So I sort of set up the tripod and filmed that first clip in the airport.

13:57Ben Hanlin: Catch flights, not feelings. And then I filmed maybe five clips there. I went away again with a friend and then we filmed a few more clips. And I just, yeah, put it together. Put that little, I just went on epidemic sound and just like sort of picked one of the first sounds that I could find. And it was the do-do-do-do-do-do-do. And now, and you didn't know when you post it. because am I right in thinking this is your biggest ever video? It is, yeah, yeah. And did you know when you posted it, this is going to be, or did it just go crazy? It actually really didn't. It sort of trickled in. The views sort of came in a little bit.

14:30There was a few nice comments. And it was only a year later, somebody did the audio. Somebody, you know, lip-synced the audio to it. I was like, oh my God, no way. Somebody's lip-synced to it. And then somebody else did it. And then all of a sudden, it really was like, oh my God, loads of people are actually using this audio now. And this was a year after I posted it. And then my video just slowly started picking up the views. And then there was this one TikToker. She's really big now, Leah something. She was in that show Locked In.

15:00Ben Hanlin: Okay. And I think she actually still has the most viewed video ever on TikTok. And it was like a proper first trap video. It was just like she was in a car and she was just zooming into her face. And that was it. And it got like 100 or 500 million views, which is crazy. With your sound. And it was, so that was a separate video, but then like two videos later, she did my sound. Yeah. The Catch Flight's Not Feelings. And then after that, I think it really just picked up. Am I right? Maybe I've misremembered this. Did like Rita Ora do it? Or some other celebrities? There was a good few celebrities in the end.

15:33There was Anton Deck jumped on it. That is nuts. Who else was there? Olly Murs did it. And it was just so weird to see these great names just like, oh, they don't know what it is. um and yeah and it's just as you say it's still picking up now and i've just done a little part

15:49Ben Hanlin: two oh have you yeah so i did that video it was so big like you say it went global it took a year but did that change anything for you at that point did you is that when things went into another gear how's it how does it yeah it did really the followers started picking up there and all of my other videos from that point started getting more and more views so more and more brand deals started coming in uh and then as i said i did a part two and that was actually with easy jet that helps it does help it does because i've always been wanting to do one and then we sort of there was a brief that they sent over we were trying to figure out what the best video to do here and then i think we both landed on like let's do another part two of catch flights not feelings yeah and as you know as soon as you do hashtag ads the views don't do as well yeah but that one still did really well and the nice thing is which is sort of the dream for any ad like not many people would be able to tell it's an ad obviously it's a caption and everything like that but there's there's very subtle easy jet branding in there it's just like the first line yeah i think it was like uh outfit says private jet boarding pass says easy jet so obviously for them that's that's like good enough to be an ad and they were great so they sort of get it yeah you know how you get some brands that come on they're like no we're gonna need heavy branding they need to say it five times throughout the video but they just sort of they were sort of trusting what I was saying would do well and lucky it has done so that will happen and then you obviously carry on from there I suppose big question I've been thinking about this why do you think everything you've done that's gone viral not everything but it's very often like this daytime nostalgic TV presenter parody and it's slightly different shows you've done kind of a this morning parody etc lecture why do you think it works why what is it because you must know about this more than anyone else why do audiences bloody love it i wish i actually had the answer to it i think we all love a bit of nostalgia no matter what it is we love some nostalgia um and again it's the videos i love on tiktok is when is i don't know it's almost when you just think like how how this person come up with it like it's so random that this person's decided to make a video but they do it so well and maybe that is it like it maybe it's the voice it's the the camera movies the editing um and just because i'd sort of geek out a lot on filming and editing and that's half the reason why i wanted to do these videos in the first place it wasn't really to be like and it never actually has been to be like oh let's take the mick out of these presenters that's like never been at at all but I'm just like, oh, I just really want to replicate these shots.

18:32Yes. I want to get the music in there at this time. I want to sort of make this style of video. And I just, I mean, I haven't really spoken to any of these presenters. Actually, that is a lie, actually. Go on. There's now a new presenter on Capital called Lee Juggernaut, and he is a Place in the Sun presenter. Is he?

18:53Ben Hanlin: He is. What does he say? Does he like you or not? I mean, man, I met him for the first time two weeks ago, And as I saw him came in, I was like, oh, my God, yeah, he's on A Place in the Sun. And I was a bit nervous. I was like, hey, I watched your show. Oh, you, big fan. And then straight away, he was like, mate, people send me your stuff all the time and I love it. So it's nice. He's on board with it and he enjoys it. And he's even said, like, in those videos, you say the stuff that we want to say. Right. Let's go into the process. So let's get geeky, really geeky. I want to just set the scene, right?

19:26Ben Hanlin: I want to find out how ideas end up on your TikTok channel. But first of all, let's set some parameters. How many videos roughly are you making a week, a month? I mean, obviously you can't be flying everywhere every day. How does it work? This is what I suck at. And this is the one thing I would love to get better at because mine are really sporadic. I hope to do one a week, which isn't enough. I was going to say, because you hear people go, I do one a day, two a day. And I've really tried to do that. But because it's, you know, the location, if I'm doing the parody videos, I've got to find, first of all, a location to film at, somebody to film with.

20:01Writing it probably takes a couple of hours. Editing it takes a couple of hours. Filming it, you know, sometimes take a day. So as soon as I've done that and then I've got other stuff going on, I'm like, oh, my God, I need to post this. I need to get it out there. And for me, I've tried to do the simpler stuff where, you know, one take. Yeah. Just on an iPhone. Even just put it on a tripod. Yeah. In my flat. They just never seem to do as well. And I also don't enjoy it as much. I just enjoy doing the bigger sort of bigger production videos and the videos of Imogen and other creators. I get a lot more from that.

20:33Just I enjoy it more. The videos do better. Well, it's that thing.

20:36Ben Hanlin: I always think sometimes to create a style where it's so hard to replicate as well, because no one else is finding an estate agent to let them into a house for half a day or whatever. You know what I mean? You've created something that the chances are the next video on TikTok isn't going to be that, right? Yeah, of course. Of course. Yeah. Okay, so you're doing roughly one a week. Four a month. I thought it was going to be more now. Yeah, I know. And it definitely should be. Sometimes I'd get into it like I've got a bit of free time here and I'd do two a week and think we're rolling now. Here we are.

21:06Ben Hanlin: And then another week goes by and I haven't done one. And the other question, the thing we don't see, because obviously now you're doing a lot of this and like you say you're getting brand deals. Do you have a team or is it just you? It's just me really. Yeah, I sort of, I choose a few mates every now and then to help me film this video but uh the guy that i was talking about earlier on he helped me do that first parody video for quite a long time we were writing videos together yeah and he's just funny like i'd almost just say to him i want to say something along the lines of this and he'd just know it so like we'd write together and that was a lot of fun but then obviously sort of work gets in the way don't live too near each other and yeah i i that again is is one of the reasons why i'm not posting as much as I should.

21:49I'd love to almost be in like, not a content creator house, but you know, live with somebody I could just go, mate, let's film this. Let's go there.

21:55Ben Hanlin: Let's do this. Yeah. I met, I booked it to Simon Squibb. You know Simon Squibb. Yeah, of course. And I said to him, I said, oh, you got any advice for me? Because he rolled in this event with six staff. And like two of them, one was on live on TikTok. One was live on Instagram as he was there. He was, one person was filming constantly. Somebody else was making notes. he was a mobile crew making content yeah and i thought wow and i said any advice and he went just commit just get a videographer full-time commit because then what will happen is you will by default create more content than ever created in your life yeah and then therefore the things will happen so it's like that's great advice and i was like oh yeah that's quite ballsy you should do that really yeah and you're right i'm sure it just pay off if you're sort of thinking like oh i don't know if i can afford it like how many things i can do but then actually it in the long when it will and that is great advice yeah next month you'll see me churning out 10 videos thank you simon um right so let's start with the ideas yeah where now you've got like a bit of a niche where do ideas come from because in my head i was like he's probably just flicking through telly going let's do that like where do your ideas start are you just walking down the street is it so what triggers it it is more that it's walking down the street or having a conversation with somebody okay we should be discussing something or some funny thing will come up and conversation and it's just the classic oh that's an idea i'll jot that down right so you take out your phone take out my phone whack it on my notes right let's see let's see i'm asking nara to take out his phone so you've got a note in your phone uh again i need to organize this a hell of a lot more because i've just got like i've just got video ideas i'll jot two down there and other notes would happen and then i've got another one video ideas and oh i want to i want to find So you just jot it all, stick it in your notes, and then at some point go back to them.

23:43Yeah, yes. And then sometimes it'll be a year later and I go, oh my God, I never filmed that. Really? This one is videos and it's football obsessed groom. Groom who can't be serious. So this is in your notes.

23:58Ben Hanlin: Is that all you've written? That's all I've written, yeah. So say it again. Football obsessed groom. Okay. And then I've got another one saying short kings ducking when they don't need to. hold on have you filmed that i have i've done that one now yeah i think i did it on the tube the other day i sort of got on the dlr and i went i don't need to duck what am i doing ducking to get on the tube so then i would sort of just go from more notes i'll even speak to people i'm like whenever you ever seen someone that's short duck and they just didn't need to duck that's so with the football one you haven't done right haven't done that so tell me what that idea is then if you can yeah so that one is going to be a best man uh doing a speech that is just obsessed with football because i think where this one came from was going through tiktok i've seen you know an actual best man do a speech and you know all they're doing is football gags yeah just like oh i remember that day in 2020 when arsenal won or whatever it was yeah and you know every gag is just like about football there was you know oh it's going to be a lovely little message about the bride here and it's not it's football right so i just wanted to i thought maybe that could be a bit of a series best man speeches best man who's in love with the bride that's good isn't it yeah man who's uh can't be serious yeah best man who secretly hates whatever i don't know it's that yeah thing is i'm not great at writing speeches so uh this this might be one to get uh you know get a little writing partner involved in and we just like riff a few ideas once you've got it but But once you've got it, you've got that.

25:29Ben Hanlin: Once you figure that thing out, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah, I think so. I need, where I'm at at the moment is I'm just trying to do more content. Like, I love doing the parody stuff. I do feel like sometimes I'm like, oh, am I just doing this again? Are people thinking, oh, okay. Although, as you say, oh, you're the parody guy. You're the TV presenter guy. But at the moment, I'm really just trying to do some more stuff. You know, quick one-take videos.

25:56Ben Hanlin: So this is Niall Gray. he'll be back in a second this is a very very tiny commercial break um but for no money because i'm not getting paid this is just me talking to you guys like a half-time chat if you will um firstly thoughts on niall uh i was thinking about i mean first of all he's a very happy guy isn't he very positive a nice person to be around but the thing i took i suppose my one takeaway is how in a good way he doesn't overthink everything he's not trying to make everything a five-year plan he's just getting up and doing things that he enjoys and as long as it's making him smile the rest figures itself out and i think often we can lose sight of that sometimes hence why i'm definitely doing this podcast to try and do something like that but i just thought that was quite a nice sentiment from now um quick one before we dive back into the chat uh youtube as i mentioned we filmed this in a studio in london you can go and watch this on the youtube channel i'm also putting behind the scenes up on youtube of how we're making the pod as well and what i could really do with from you people listening is to get podcasts up and off the ground it's really hard in the first few weeks reviews and subscriptions really help i know you've heard this a million times if you can just hit that tiny subscribe button or follow button and drop a review ideally a five-star review would be lovely and uh that would really help and it does honestly help and if you think anyone you know is into hearing more of these type of episodes from comedians and authors and etc let's share the love and pass this around be great and my socials as well um it's weird just talking to a mic.

27:25Ben Hanlin: I don't know if you're listening. Let me know. Just drop me a message. It helps me, encourage me to kind of keep going. And if I'm honest, let me know the bits that you've liked, maybe the bits you didn't. Be nice on that. And also any guests that you'd like to see on this pod. That would be pretty cool as well. And right, that's it from me. Enjoy the rest of the episode. We're going to jump back into Niall. I asked him about his failures and that's where we carry on. Have you put anything out that you thought was brilliant? You're like, oh, here we go. This is the one. And it's just flopped. And actually, it was the video I went to the most effort for.

28:07This was a few years ago. And I bought a car from Facebook Marketplace for 200 quid. You know this one? Is this the Cinquecento? It's not. That's actually a different, which has been a bit more successful. Okay, fine. So we'll come back to that. But this one was almost the trial. about three years ago and bought this car off Facebook Marketplace for 200 quid and decided to do a rally of nine countries in four days. And this is when I wanted to sort of step foot into the long form space.

28:36Ben Hanlin: Max Fosch-esque almost here. Funny enough, Max Fosch did comment on the video. It was great content. So yeah, it must have been quite Foschy. Fine. And yeah, went to nine countries in four days and it was unbelievable. It was a great trip. Just got two mates together. We had a real fun time doing it uh filmed it on like three different cameras it took oh my god it took probably like a month to edit it together yeah um and i posted it on youtube and i didn't think it was going to do that well because obviously on youtube you really got to build up yeah sort of a not just the following but you know an audience that uh a community yeah we go build up a community and my idea was to cut it down into three parts for tiktok yep oh my god those three three parts absolutely bombed.

29:20Ben Hanlin: No. No, it's literally been a month of editing, a week of filming, and quite a lot of money to do it as well, and it just didn't do that work. Why? I think it was just too different. I think it was, first of all, it was too different. If people have followed me, all of a sudden they're going like, why is this guy just in a car with his mates going on a road trip? Right. Maybe I should have done it as a bit more of a parody character and a bit more of a sketch. Maybe that would have done quite well. But I was just trying something. Yeah. And it didn't really pay off. but don't really see it as a failure because i just i've enjoyed the content yeah as i say i enjoy editing so it was a success in that sense of just like that was a fun project onto the next yeah you sometimes have to do that thing don't you where you go well if no one watches it and it bombs am i still proud of this thing and happy that i've done it whereas if you've done it just to get millions of views and then you go well i didn't particularly believe in it and it got no views then you feel a bit like a waste of time exactly yeah yeah sometimes every now and then And I still get it where a video just isn't successful.

30:20And it gets even like a couple of thousand views recently.

30:23Ben Hanlin: And I think, actually, I still think it's a funny video. So that's fine. So you are all wrong. Yeah, exactly. I've already looked back at it in a month and go, actually, they were right. That is shocking. But the other thing that's happened, it's happened to me definitely during lockdown. So I made a lot of content. I was making multiple TikToks a day, et cetera, is burnout. And I think if unless you're a creator, people don't realize that it's 24-7. It looks really great like you're having a load of fun, but like you say, you're coming up with an idea, you're finding a location, you're filming it, you're editing it.

30:54Ben Hanlin: As soon as you've done that, you've then got to do it again and again and again. Have you, I mean, you've been doing this a while now. Have you ever felt at times a bit of burnout? Definitely have. A bit of over it, like, oh, I'm so bored of this now. It's so frustrating. Exactly as you say, as soon as you hit post, it's like, that's done now. And you've got to move on to the next one. Yep. It's such a long process to do it. and I feel like almost every six months I have a bit of burnout where I've done a good few videos and really enjoyed it and posted them and think I don't know what's next it's just that constant conveyor belt of how long can you go for because it's not like telly where you kind of spend six months doing something and then you can take three or four months off don't even think about it and then start again type thing yeah and now actually this is where as I sort of touched on earlier on I'm starting to try new things so me and a mate of mine we've just made up a new channel and we've bought the in-betweeners car the actual one well it's a fiat chinkacenta yeah which is the the maker model which they used in the in-betweeners and we thought you know what let's just have a bit of fun with this let's just start up a whole separate tiktok and instagram channel and we'll document us turning this car into the in-betweeners car and just see what happens we'll just go from there yeah and it's been quite successful so far like as soon as we posted the first video we thought it's going to take a bit of a while to build up a following here but the first one did a million views oh so we're like oh my god what's happening on youtube on tiktok yeah yeah tiktok um and the same on instagram i think that did like a like a hundred k or whatever yeah did did quite well on there so um yeah now the series is off we've started it and we've started converting this car into the in between this car getting the red door on there we had to change the bumpers had to put the stickers on the back make it a hawaii because in the in-betweeners it's a chinkacenta hawaii which doesn't exist so all it is is a sticker so we just put a hawaii sticker on the back and now we're starting to dive into youtube right so we're having a lot of fun with the short form content but now we've finished converting the car into the in-betweeners car we've got it now yeah and we want to take it to thorpe park we've just taken it to the caravan club do you remember that right yeah yes i do indeed so we We went to the exact same caravan club that they went to.

33:12And we've shot this long form. I'm editing it at the moment, getting ready to post on YouTube. Surely the goal has got to be to get each one of the in-betweeners to come for a ride. In the car. It's got to be. Well, the nice thing is, because James Buckley went on the TikTok account the other day. I've seen James Buckley has just liked every single one of the videos. So he's there. He's seen them. Okay. I'm hoping that one day one day soon we'll get the in-betweeners boys in the car

33:42Ben Hanlin: it seems like everything that you've described hasn't been part of like a master plan you're like I have an idea I'd do it I bought a Cinquecento we're going to do that and then do you have a thought like you've been doing this a while now four or five years what the next twelve months two years five years might look like how it might evolve different to this or are you like actually I'm just going to keep doing the day to day videos how yeah how much you think about that man oh i sound like a mortgage advisor no you don't you sound you sound like you've got some great advice no because i definitely should have some sort of grand plan and everyone always asks me what what is what's the next step but i just sort of think like so far it's i'm just having fun with it and nobody knows what's going to happen next like even I never really intended to be a content creator and it just sort of happened and I'm just loving every second of it and step of it and I'm just sort of rolling with it.

34:42Podcast is definitely on the cards at some point. I'm trying to think of what that might be. A live show is on the cards at some point, you know, figuring it out. And it's just sort of, I don't want to make it feel like a job. Right. Because I did sit down once and had an Excel spreadsheet. Yeah. had a plan dates videos yeah here's a script for that one here's a posting date for that one yeah and I started doing it and I realized the content I was posting just I wasn't really enjoying it it wasn't really doing that well and I thought actually this feels like work now and although that's probably definitely the sensible thing to do I just thought I only started it because I

35:20Ben Hanlin: enjoyed it and I just want to carry that on so it's that idea I guess that the the when you come up with an idea or a thing as long as you're excited about getting involved in it that's the the litmus test right now in a sense yeah exactly that and also I think with social it's so hard to plan right you could have all the plans in the world but in six months time things could yeah things could look completely different yeah things change again I know which isn't which isn't ideal for the future you know speaking to a mortgage advisor you know what's your job how long is this what's your turnover going to be in the next five years I don't know fine just whatever pops into your head brilliant I'll write that down I know what awful advice well Well, Niall, this has been a lovely chat.

36:01Ben Hanlin: Do you know what? It's been so good because you see all this stuff and all we see is 30 seconds or 45 seconds. We never hear any of this thought behind that. So thank you for sharing all your thoughts and notes and all that stuff. But we are into the final section. Ben's Fast Five. Nice. I'm going to ask you five questions. Relatively fast. It's near what's... See what comes to mind. So you ready for the Fast Five? I'm ready. Strapped in. Literally, he is. It's bizarre. Buckled up. Right. let's start with the Highlander question in the film Highlander it's a film about immortals it's a very niche 80s 90s film and when they kill another immortal they steal the knowledge and skills of that immortal so Highlander question if you could steal they stay alive they're safe they're not going anywhere that's banked if you could steal the knowledge or skills of anyone who would it be?

36:56I love this probably seems quite niche

37:00Ben Hanlin: but there's a lad called Hayden Hillyer-Smith great name great name and he's an editor and he edits for or he used to edit for Logan Paul and now he's got this series on YouTube where he breaks down massive YouTubers' videos and he sits down with them and basically just completely roasts and grills their editing and he just goes one by one nitpicking every little shot and and it sort of explains how he could have done it differently to sort of make this video completely different have you seen him i i think i've seen little bits of him yeah you're talking high-end like online video editing yeah that's it and i think it's just so important storytelling in sketches or long-form video and just having that knowledge because you could you know you can have a great idea but you can absolutely kill it in the edit I think people don't give edits sometimes, you know, the justice.

37:56What's the word?

37:56Ben Hanlin: You know, they don't give it the credit. I get credit. Because I've always said this, especially I used to make TV magic. Things are made or lost in the edit, especially with comedy or anything, because it's about rhythm and timing and pace. And if you cut things, I say this to my editor, sometimes you can cut the soul out of something. If you cut it too much and you don't let things breathe. Yeah. So, yeah, you're right. yeah sometimes I'd do like I'd film for like another brand you know and they would get their production team they would get all over it and like it's a great idea really fun idea and I'd watch it back and think ah it's not doesn't really work there those gags didn't quite land because maybe it said it a bit too polished or yeah yeah yeah so for you your secret sauce your je ne sais quoi is being in a good way I mean it's very politely a geek in the edit yes exactly yeah yeah all right question number two time capsule they the mythical they are creating a time capsule you can only put one of your posts in the time capsule to live forever the rest will no longer exist i don't know why uh it's we'll figure things out and yeah what post is going in there i think it's got to be the one that kick-started everything the welcome to sunny fortaventura the first parody video i did had a great time filming it sort of look back at it every now and then and I still like oh that was a fun video that was good fun and I think I sort of wouldn't wouldn't be anywhere without that video so I want to put that pop that I mean there's people here going why is he not catch flight's not I know it should be really no it's your it's your time catch right third question your culture vulture you any books TV or film you have particularly loved recently that's you've gone that it's just people should watch this um this This is probably going to be really rogue from everything we've just spoke about in this podcast.

39:44This is really depressing and horrible. Go on. You know what? Not depressing, but it's nothing to do with content creation. But it's a book that I've read this year and I just got so much from it because I'm not a massive reader. But this book has made me want to carry on. It's called Rich Dad, Poor Dad.

40:00Ben Hanlin: Yes. You know it. Kurosaki. Yes. Yes. I feel like everyone needs to read it, especially being self-employed. It's such great knowledge. and it's all the stuff that they don't teach you in school about money. So just to clarify, this is not Diary of a CEO. Stephen, what? I am going to make you cry in a minute and then I'm like, that's going to be the worst. It's the fuel. We've got everyone sponsored here. But man, yeah, as I say, it's so rogue, but I read it, I was like, oh my God, I feel like Stephen Bartlett now. Yeah, acquire assets, not liability. If you like that, then go and read Psychology of Money.

40:35Ben Hanlin: Anyway, okay, fine. There we go. I thought you were going to say, oh, this sitcom or this. Oh man No actually Okay Can I have two Can I be really green Go on I saw Captain Phillips The other day Which I don't know why I haven't seen that before Captain Phillips About the pirates Oh Tom Hanks Yeah Amazing Unbelievable film I was watching it And I You know when you're Watching a film And you think I want to see this For the first time already And I'm only Halfway through it Yeah But I know I'm going to Want to watch this again And it's an unbelievable film I can't believe I haven't seen it Yeah and So I'm a big fan Of the phrase So when they pitch Hollywood films they use this thing called bluff bottom line up front right so basically when they they're obviously pitching 100 million dollars films sell it to me in one sentence and that film is an amazing film especially the last scene his acting in the last scene is incredible but you can sell it in one sentence it's a captain taking a cargo ship who gets attacked by pirates yes that's it's so simple that's it but you're in you're hooked you get it you're on a journey yeah yeah you're So right.

41:34Ben Hanlin: Right. Okay. Fourth question. Penultimate, some would say. Magic wand. You, with this wand, you have the power to vanish any kind of content, social media content forever. What would you vanish? I've got it. I would love to get rid of the fake couples pranks. You know, when I do. I boyfriend, girlfriend scenario. And it's so fake. And it's so clickbaity. Yeah. I mean I understand why they're doing it Usually the ones I'm talking about The ones you get on Facebook Yeah It's like a 10 minute video And They're hiding in the corner Yeah Something's about to happen And they're five minutes in And they're sunbathing next to a pool Yeah she's in a bikini You're always sort of that And it's those style of videos Or the ones that are in that similar world Of how to save petrol And they go over to the petrol tank and they get cling film and they stick it to the side of the car.

42:34Then they get shaving foam and you're like, what? This is so weird. What's going to happen here? And then they wipe it away and then they get sellotape and they draw on the car and you're like, wow, what's happening? This is going to be great. And that's all they're doing. They're literally having you on for 10 minutes just because they want the clicks and they want you to stick there with the video and the engagement.

42:54Ben Hanlin: And you're right, it's so Facebook and also all of those are millionaires now, aren't they? Oh man, it's ridiculous. They've got empires. they almost own every Facebook page, right? Yeah. So there you go. Why don't I start doing that, actually, for the money, you know? So there you go. How to save it? So you're vanishing fake prank, fake hack videos that are there just for clickbait. Yes. Do you know what? The world is now a better place. Well done. Thank you. It's cleaner. Thank you, Niall. We've all got more time on our hands now. Right. Final question, Niall. What's the trick? In particular, if another content creator was to ask you, what's the trick?

43:29Ben Hanlin: How do I do it? If you can repeat something you've just said here today, whatever it is, one quick answer for them. How do you do it? What's the trick, Niall? To being a viral content creator. If you had to give them a nugget into your world. I would say just do what you find funny. I think there's a lot of people that try to replicate other stuff they've seen. but if you've just got a bit of niche humour and just think I think that's hilarious just do that and actually just do it without thinking about it too much because the more you think about it you've overthought it you don't want to do it it doesn't happen I think just funny do it post it and let it go done don't overthink it don't do it for other people thank you mate thank you thanks for coming on this has been great fun