920. - Jessica Koslow

25:21But we were probably, we were at least in the same bars and clubs in 2005, if nothing else. Were you there in 2005? Yeah, yeah. I was at MJQ in the local and the Righteous Room. And Claremont Lounge. Wow, okay. I didn't know you were that kind of nasty chick. But yeah, I was at Claremont Lounge occasionally. Jessica's a little hornier than you are, Chris.

25:39Jason Stewart:Jessica, I didn't know you were doing coke over a trough, but God bless. A different time. I've been to the Claremont Lounge. I've been to the Claremont. No, no. I'm fine with the Claremont Lounge. It's a fun little establishment. Chris, you should probably explain it. The Claremont Lounge, I would say people that listen to this podcast know more about the Claremont Lounge than Bacchanalia or my Benzo Bowls, but it's basically, the Claremont Lounge is a famous strip club where the strippers are gross, but it's like a place where you would go, you know, they would play like - They're not gross.

26:10No, they are gross. They're just unique. No, they're literally gross. That's the whole thing. I mean Jessica you would agree that's the whole point it's sort of like a ball yeah I think like the famous woman at the time was someone who crushed Blondie would crush beer cans between her breasts yeah and Blondie would get hired to be brought out on state like if a band was finishing their tour in Atlanta you know taking back Sunday or whatever Dashboard Confessional would hire her to come out with taking back Sunday do a little dance everybody knows and then

26:38Jason Stewart:she goes back to work I was expecting you to say something more in the hip hop realm but Dashboard confessional bring big mama that's what's so interesting about the claremont lounge and atlanta strip club culture claremont lounge is the only one that specifically panders to like guys that wore cheap mondays and drank pbr and listened to the black lips it was not it was the one the one that did not have any hip-hop angle or soul or anything interesting about kind of the the jumbo's clown room of atlanta in some ways but chris is more chris and i are more magic city folks. If I had to. We feel out of place at the Clermont.

27:11How much time are you spending at the strip club? That was your first thing you offered to us as far as bars. You were saying bars. I agreed with them. I just added that last one. Oh, you agree. I'm sorry. You were shaking your head so they couldn't hear you agreeing. I might have missed it. I just thought I saw you. You probably did. I was a lot fatter and had glasses, but it could have been me. I don't tip, though. It wasn't me crumbling up bills and throwing them. That was not me. I swear to God.

27:36Jason Stewart:I don't tip either, but I am a crumbler. I'm a crumble and tosser. Come on. He rolls it like he's playing one-on-one. Who amongst us? All right, so you worked at Bacchanalia. Bacchanalia, is it a Michelin star restaurant or is it just serious? It is. It is. It's a Michelin star restaurant. And at the time, there was also Quinones, which was even a finer dining restaurant. And then there was Star Provisions, which was her kind of market. Star Provisions is the first overpriced larder essentials place I ever visited in my life. Provision Eating House-ass restaurant? No, but it's like an actual market.

28:11It's actually Provisions. But she really and really cares about ingredients and tchotchkes and kitchen items. And it was always fun to go. It was always full of things that I had never seen before. And so, yeah, I moved to Atlanta in 2005. and from LA from DC okay well I finished grad school in DC and had been working I didn't know they had grad school for cooking but that's cool that you did no you know they got dessert grad school that's fucking crazy sweet green sweet green you yeah sweet green and and um who else there's a Georgetown Annex program yeah did you so you lived in DC when there was still a Dean DeLuca in Georgetown the way God intended yeah yeah it was it was a good time what did you go to grad school for Jessica?

28:58Uh, it was a media theory program. Okay. Yeah. So you were trying to go a different route and the kitchen kept pulling you back. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So I, I did that route. I moved to D I moved to Atlanta. I went to Bacchanalia and like sat at the bar, which, uh, I'm also a big fan of. And I watched that open kitchen and it honestly, the open kitchen there has like a glass wall. So you'd kind of, it's like watch, watch them dance. Um, But I'm a pastry person. That's where I started. And I had this dessert, which is actually on the menu at dinner in a different format, but also in the same format.

29:40What is the dessert? It was like a molten chocolate cake, right? Like the most simple, like 90s molten chocolate cake. Jessica, you're talking to it. That's what I want. Yeah, with a mint chip ice cream. uh carla the pastry chef is still there as the pastry chef at bacchanalia give her the rolex i know she deserves it she's she's a master um and i i loved it so much i wrote to ann and ann was like it wasn't a time where you just like wrote an email like professing your love and asking for a job so she met with me and kind of laughed and at the same time someone had quit and she goes look if you want to start tomorrow you can start tomorrow and it really was my first foot in the door um and forever grateful because i was there for i was there for a year and then i ended up back there a couple years later helping her with abattoir if you were there at the time that was another restaurant did you work somewhere else in atlanta or did you move i moved to dc i moved to new york but in atlanta i worked at star provisions yeah baccalia and cuñones all in pastry oh okay okay and then you moved to new york and then i moved to new york got it when you when

30:51Jason Stewart:you were first starting out at baccalia what would you remember your first like pastry creation that made it on the menu i didn't have that creative liberty no i was i was a pastry cook you're like i was the one who moved the flour from the bags into the plastic bins exactly exactly i that's what I did I was watching some I was at I was at this there's a place in London called Corner Shop that's like at 180 the Strand that this woman Alex Eagle opened and it's basically like a Dean DeLuca Erewhon thing but it's really focused on like the food is really good you order and you sit down and I was sitting down upstairs next to the pastry team which was live and I was watching this guy in fucking Birkenstock's doing exactly what Jason just said and I'm like damn this job sucks bro but but but the pastries were I had a little treat and it was fucking delicious but man I don't know how you – that is – it's so physical too.

31:42Like they look tired. Yeah. It is hard. It's hard. And actually like the bread production, adding that bread production layer to squirrel, that might be even the most challenging thing because of the weight of the dough that comes out of the mixing bowl. And that's why you like see tartine and now they have these big machines that just like pour the dough out.

32:06Jason Stewart:They got an Elon Musk robot moving 500 pounds of dough. It's funny. I'm going to start using that, Jessica. Every day of my life is about bread production, if you know what I'm saying. That's a new, I'm going to use that. So you're saying tartines got performative bowls, or you're saying they need those big ass? Okay. Yeah, no, no, no. Let me tell you, they have performative bowls, but they're not performative. They need those bowls. They're making such a huge amount of bread every day, and the amount of uh it's a liability to be honest to to be making that much bread and not have those kinds of like things to to take the bread off yeah yeah sure there's a lawsuit waiting to happen imagine dying because just a ton of sourdough starter just fell on your head would you be lying on the table when that happens yeah a heavenly don't make it horny again jessica would you be lying face up or face down when the sourdough fell on you and it was so heavy you couldn't move when the starter hits you did you hear our starter story i didn't know you had a story is this like your coming out story no i we gotta we lost our starter in the pandemic i think

33:28Jason Stewart:God, I cannot wait to edit this in four hours where I put like in the arms of an angel like sad music over this. Well, we lost our starter in the pandemic. Yeah, wait, how do you, I'm sorry, excuse my ignorance as a person who doesn't bake. When you lose the starter, you mean you physically misplaced or the starter dies an untimely death. You neglected so much that it dies. It shrivels up and dies. I mean, during COVID, because there was a time in which we were not open for service, we were not feeding our starter. Like, we weren't feeding our starter. We were doing meals for the hospitality workers.

34:02First responders.

34:03Jason Stewart:Oh, okay. We forgot about the first of the first responders. Yeah. Mrs. Starter herself. Don't gender. That starter could have been a male as well, Jason. Yeah. That's what you think, but no. Bellas can be starters too. No, no, no. No, mother's starter gives us life. Okay, so your starter, you weren't feeding it because you were worried about all these quote-unquote first responders you had to bang your pans for. Yeah, and we lost the starter. They're like, no more kumquat jelly, please, please. My family is, do you have ramen? We're starving. I can't have any more yuzu. I don't care if I starve.

34:43Jason Stewart:Sorry, go ahead. No, no, keep going, keep going. So, but if the starter dies, the only way to revive, there's no way to revive the starter. You must obtain a new starter and go from zero. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, okay, okay. So, we ended up getting our starter from Walton Goggins, who, I know. You know that little freak has a couple starters on deck. Yeah, he stores them in his gums, you can see. It's like a zen. I just got a little starter right up here. that guy is a magical yeah he's a he's a bread maker he's a he's a bread guy god damn it eli god damn it yeah okay so goggins starter you know everyone says like this is what i always wonder about because i've never i've always wanted to like make my own sourdough because i love a good sourdough i love fresh baked bread but i for whatever reason my brain tells me don't get into it it's going to be you're going to get too many little dumb gadgets and you're going to it's going to fizzle in nine months and you just so don't even bother but when i hear the starter talk and people are like i got mine from you know this instagram i got it's a thousand year old starter that i got from a shaolin monk in a temple somewhere this is from a grandma in oaxaca over seven generations i want to know ask you i want to ask you can you tell the difference between the starters i mean probably not got my quince on but it looks like laura all right this episode of how long gone is brought to you by our dear friends at quince jason i've you know i've looked in your closet you've looked in mine and we can both agree that a thoughtfully built wardrobe comes down to pieces that mix well and last and that's where quince shines premium fabrics considered design and everyday essentials that feel effortless to wear and dependable even as the seasons change Jason.

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38:00Start your spring with low prices guaranteed at the Home Depot. Exclusions apply to HomeDepot.com slash price match for details. Okay. If you look at the comment section, the comment sections can go wild. We posted something about our focaccia because it is out of control amazing. And we use his focaccia. I mean, we use his starter, and people are just like, once you start feeding it, it's not about the fact, you know, like, why are you even mentioning this? Okay, fine.

38:29Jason Stewart:Like, once you add the starter to the flour and the other ingredients, it loses its... Once you start feeding it every day, it really takes on the environment that it's in. So it really is about the water that you're feeding it, the flour that you're feeding it every day. And not so much its origin. But the origin story is good. so the atmosphere of the room the temperature, the climate, the humidity the flour, the water, that all changes the starter into this new starter which is cool, the rest is still unwritten it's an open book

39:01Jason Stewart:well that's the beauty of starters and sourdough I'm never gonna get to the point where I'm happy with my sourdough and I've never made it before so I just go and buy it from people who have like devoted their life in a fucking autistic level to sourdough and just enjoy the fruits of their labor that's the way to low for ten dollars it would have cost me like 87 seven dollars to make it at home you know yeah that does seem that does seem like a lot of fucking work have you had the two rows country bread yet i've had it yeah it's so good he's he's such yeah he's he's great he's the guy who used to do hail mary pizza in atwater village and they had oh that place is good we used to go there we used to yeah we used to go there because they had this really rustic super tangy funky interesting you know so much character with the dough and I'd love it but then he sold the business to somebody else they're still making it and then he came back doing just bread alone yeah pop up in his house great guy great bread bread alone one of the one of the most beloved New York bakeries from upstate is that Woodstock do you know what I'm talking about Jessica I just meant that he did bread alone as in nothing I know but he makes a dank loaf where are you able to purchase the dank loaf only at a farmer's market full of guys in fucking Birkenstocks follow his Instagram and he's like, I'm at this coffee shop.

40:17Jason Stewart:I'm at Proof. I'm at this farmer's market. Let me ask you a quick question. He's in his backyard. Let me ask you guys a quick question. Or he's in his backyard. It's giving COVID. How do you make money doing that? Let's be honest. Come on. There's no way you can make a living to support your family selling bread pop-up style. There's just no way. I don't know. I don't think that's true. That's how Bub and Grandma started and now he's got a huge wholesale business. I think something like that where you just don't have the overhead of. That's true. That's true. Insurance, like the workers comp, the insurance, the commercial real estate, triple net, all of those things, additional labor.

40:58Like those line items are really what are challenging to a restaurant. You would know better than me. That makes sense.

41:05Jason Stewart:Paying unemployment to some bozos who fucked up, but you got to do it anyway. The list goes on. I can't imagine the shit you got to deal with, Jessica. oh my god that that shit having employees is the worst i i can't imagine that because how many employees do you think you have if you had to if you had to estimate like right now look i'm so like my fingers are so in the business like i know all of these things we have 62 employees right now and before when we just had breakfast and lunch we had 42 so with the addition oh wow you added you added 20 people for dinner that's crazy we had but there's crossover there's crossover too I'm sure.

41:40No. It's like a separate staff almost. Yes. Yeah. Why, why is that though? I think, I think the separate staff is important because there's a different tone, right? Like the breakfast and lunch is casual. It's serve yourself. The dinner service is really refined and like service at the table, you know, people who know about wine and cocktail programs. And, um, you just need a different type of service professional. Like you can, you can, you can have the blue hair and the fucking hat taking the latte order but they can't be telling somebody about the fucking wine list it's two different jobs i mean it depends on the person like they yeah yeah because there are some folks from am that have crossed over into pm for sure that's a cool way to talk that's a cool way that's a cool way to talk about it like that am to pm yeah it's a nice i like that yeah yeah i mean i guess that there's probably people that are in the am that would aspire to be pm and they're going to work towards that because it does feel like that could carry them further in the restaurant business if that's what they're looking for if like they're people who are true hospitality professionals they they do stand out and have transitioned into pm i've noticed that my check

42:47Jason Stewart:totals for the pm are a little bit higher than the check totals for the am so i mean this is true from a server standpoint you know if i'm tipping my 22 on 187 dollars don't jason you're full of shit you've never tipped 22 don't lie to her she can look it up true she can look it up you're 18 max i'm gonna look it up now if you give me if you give me enough free shit i'll tip you over 20 you know what i was you know what what's very interesting is the is the especially in a place like los angeles right there are a lot of of celebrities for lack of a better term um you know from everyone from reality star to a pop star to a famous actor etc they're all coming into place from bijou phillips to them jeans we run the gamut they're all coming into squirrel and i know some of these people aren't tipping right and i know that you have that data i know that you have that data and does that i will never tell i would never know i would never ask you to tell but does it change your opinion you know when the new record comes out you're like you know what fuck yeah does phoebe bridgers tip more than kumail nanjiani answer the question just i just think that if i was a person of note i would be tipping 30 minimum so that dumois never finds out who i really am True, true.

44:01I think that's a good way to be. I think so too. There's no downside to that. You have the money. What if you're a person of note who is secretly broke and can afford it? I don't think you should be having dinner at Squirrel then. As you said, Jason, the check price has gone up. I should be having my rotisserie chicken at home. exactly i will say that the check our check average for pm is lower than i've seen at other like establishments that i've been to in the same echelon which which is which i think is good i think it's i think it is good for like consistency like we've seen you three times which i appreciate Right.

44:41And you're not the only one we've seen. I have gone out to dinner recently to a lot of new restaurants and very rarely do I go, I'm going to go back. And I've seen people already back for their third time. And a lot of people are just talking about how, oh, yeah, I had this part of the menu, but I'm really excited to come back and try this side of the menu. Like, that's that's great. Like, we've just created an album of bangers, you know, and and we're already thinking about, like, what are our new songs who's in your who's in your sight see i know you got the ak pointed at all time i see you at the ar i see it never tell i love everyone squirrel has actually good wine

45:21Jason Stewart:and good food so that's the difference between them and all time i i i think going back to a restaurant for me honestly has all i kind of think it has little to do with the food is the reality i think the price tag and the environment is what gets it if you're priced sort of in the middle range you know like because it could be a squirrel or it could be like eleni oyster and silver lake like two restaurants in silver lake where like it's not cheap it's not overpriced you're like the shrimp cocktail costs how much a shrimp cocktail should cost the drinks are cold and stiff and it gets the job you know the fries are hot and crispy let's do this once a week let's do this three times a month versus like that was a unique dining experience i didn't know cucumber and black licorice and fennel pollen all work together.

46:08Jason Stewart:I'll be back again in seven years. I do not want a unique dining experience. That is the last thing I fucking want. I don't want any sort of unique dining experience. It seems like a good transition into Noma land, by the way. Oh, no. Chris, can I tell you about... Free the guys. I want to tell you, Chris, about a dish that we created at dinner that is specifically in some part because of you. Are you ready for it? Wow. I'm touched. I spit my magna out all over the floor. I'm already touched even if it's going to be somehow a diss. Even if it's a diss. It's not a diss. I paid for your grad school the amount of fucking pesto I bought from you.

46:49Jason Stewart:I got nothing.

46:53Jason Stewart:Okay, sorry. Go ahead. Go ahead. My jealousy is out. Please. Please. Chris, you had talked on a podcast about going to a restaurant here in LA where it was tough for you to find anything to eat and that there was a fish covered in bacon. That's right. Shout out to Dunsmore with their bacon vinaigrette. The bacon vinaigrette. Classic bacon vinaigrette. Let's just say that that is a fucking delicious restaurant. I do love that restaurant. Most people do. Yeah, and I also know how challenging it is in LA. you have a lot of vegetarian well this doesn't apply to vegetarians but you have a lot of pescetarians and you have a lot of people that don't eat pork big muslim community and the jewish homies and jewish community look if you're if you're fighting right now you ain't eating pork what doesn't matter what side you're on real talk my omnivore ass is over here touching everything deer reindeer penis i don't give a fuck no oink no oink that's why i look this young jason no oink my my my larder is full of large if i'm gonna keep it 100 with you guys all right i'm sorry we're interrupting this is okay so you heard me bitching and complaining as i normally do yes yeah yeah so she was like what if i made the dunsmore food good so you have a response to that you said i have it we have we have this dish on the menu called squimps i mean obviously at squirrel we're spelled incorrectly or correctly however you you call it we have something called squints it's squid it's pacific squid and it's stuffed with a chorizo at first we were you know in in kind of spanish fashion having it be a pork chorizo we had we talked about different varieties someone had brought up pork chorizo and i was like chris black will be so mad at this wow even though the flavors of of seafood and pork dance beautifully together chris does not eat pork so he chris does not eat pork you need an alternative chorizo so we made a squid chorizo so we made sorry not a squid chorizo so we made a shrimp chorizo and that shrimp chorizo uh we got some little tips from josh and island about uh and i don't think we ended up using that version but more of like a shrimp paste turned chorizo and so it's for you if i can inspire anything on the squirrel menu because jason i would agree you have spent more money to squirrel but there was a point where we lived in Beachwood where every time I got home from LAX, I would order my crispy rice bowl with extra eggs.

49:23So I have put in some work. I don't go to the restaurant a lot because it just feels far away. From London? Well, from London, of course, but from West Hollywood even. It's a little bit of a haul.

49:32Jason Stewart:Chris lives in WeHo when he's in LA. I see. It's a little bit of a haul. But Chris, you need to know that the East Side also has a pretty robust LGBTQ community that you'll feel comfortable in. They're not the same. It's a I like classic LGBTQ plus. I don't like the new versions. You know what I mean? I want old school. What's the new version? They don't have guys dancing in the front windows. Exactly. WeHo is one of the best classic gay neighborhood in the world. It's just guys. It's just buff guys of all ages, of all styles of dress. Is anything there good? No, but it's gay. No, it's gay. There's plenty of good stuff.

50:08Don't do that. I mean, I'm not saying food-wise. I just mean culture-wise. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. you know what's your we go to is it sean brock's restaurant no i know nobody's been there

50:19Jason Stewart:definitely not me people only go there to write bad reviews about it i feel bad for i really don't go i mean we go to grill on the alley and we go to ja and we go to san vicente bunga you know sunset it's all the places that you think chateau sunset tower uh shut up what where else do we go We go to the Chateau to drink more than eat because the food there is really pretty fucking bad. I don't think the food is as bad as you think it is. You think the food's bad at every restaurant, West Hollywood. I agree with Jason, and I also agree with him for saying, like, if you invite me to go eat there 10 times, I'll say yes.

50:54Just because the vibe of, I don't want to say the room because it's, like, outside, but it really feels like L.A. The space. You know? The space and how you're treated as you, you know, the tone of it. Yeah, I love how I'm treated. Like, are you sure you're on the list? Are you sure? Who are you here to see? I love that. I love the treatment. Once you're in. Once you're in. Yeah.

51:14Jason Stewart:Once you are granted access to the space, then yeah, the level of hospitality and service is unmatched. You know what I miss going to, though? Is unmatched. What I miss going to in West Hollywood is, what's the pizza place that Big Boy opened, Jason, that we went to when it was really hot? Funky. Funky. No, but not Funky. What's the pizza place called? Mother Wolf? Mother Wolf. I love Mother Wolf. This shit looks like you're in fucking Vegas. The food is good. I love that place. It feels like an Italian Balthazar. Totally. I walked in, I was like, I am in Balthazar. The only difference is the Balthazar clientele is usually pretty fantastic, and the clientele at Mother Wolf.

51:48Jason Stewart:That's wrong. That's wrong. The clientele at Mother Wolf is bad. I like mom and dad fighting. This is fun. For no fault of Funkies. It's just the location of it right in the center of Hollywood, you know, Los Angeles' butthole. People would argue that Balthazar is the same. People consider Soho to also be the butthole of New York. But I think Balthazar. Narcissism of small diffies. I think all of the Keith Miali restaurants are somehow the perfect mix of tourists and locals. No local would ever be like, I don't want to go there because there's too many tourists. Somehow. They'll always suck down a burger at Mineta or whatever it is.

52:25It's not part of the conversation. No one cares that it's mostly people from Idaho. I do have to say that our neighborhood and our area, our east side, I really love the clientele. I think that it's - That makes one of us, Jessica. It's warm. Hey, really? No, I'm joking. It's so weird. When I first started going to LA, I stayed in hotels in West Hollywood. And then when Silver Lake was it, I couldn't imagine going to West Hollywood for any reason, even. I try not to go over there at all if I can. And I don't know what there is for me besides like a restaurant. Is it because Jason's there? No, I go to Jason's house.

53:02Jason Stewart:No, when we went, we went to Erewhon the last time he was here. And you, Chris, did admit that the clientele is better looking than the WeHo Erewhon. Oh, yeah. The clientele was better looking. Oh, that Erewhon is some of the hottest people on earth. The one in Silver Lake? In Silver Lake. Yes. If you go at the right time, you know, you got two Hollis there. It's everything. You know, he got no shirt on. I refrain. You could catch a guy eating shirtless there. On the subject, I'm sure Connor Story's been there doing something, you know, buying some probiotic water. But on the subject of the neighborhoods, and I'm assuming you will not answer this, but have you designed the nighttime menu to exclude a certain type of diner consciously or subconsciously?

53:46Jason Stewart:Because I'm really into exclusion of people. not necessarily based on race class or anything like that but just like shitty people go over there nice cool normal people come in you know what i mean okay say no more okay that's crazy what do you mean that's crazy there's no way for a restaurant a restaurant in 2026 cannot exclude anyone or they will go out of business i really believe that come on dan dan tannis chateau Marmont. Dan Tennis, you can make a reservation on fucking open table. What are you talking about? Not really. It's not that easy to get a table at Dan Tennis. You can't just go into the chateau.

54:25Jason Stewart:You can't just get a table at the Sunset Tower. If you look like a goofy, they'll sit you in the goofy section. There's certain places that exclude that crowd. Sit me in the goofy station, you're still taking my money. Look, it could be like, we're talking about restaurants that you might not want to go to every week. Let's say Baby Bistro. It's a beloved restaurant in chinatown but the menu and the decor and the wine and the every you know it's it exclude it includes a certain type and it excludes a certain type there's certain people out there who you might not want to be around and you could design a menu and the aesthetics and things like that they designed it they designed to keep me out with that fucking name so that they already got they already got one on me okay now so an example food wise to maybe get you to say a word because i I don't blame you for not speaking because that would be insane.

55:16Jason Stewart:But some restaurants will have the cheeseburger, you know, as like Dunsmore, for example. You make a really good burger and suddenly your restaurant becomes a burger restaurant. You try to pull it. We only make 10 of them and you got to line up at noon to get them and blah, blah. It turns into a whole thing. So I've noticed you don't have a burger on your menu. No, we don't. We don't have a burger on our menu, but it's just because labor wise, you know, we have to focus on the things that we do well right now. And as we have the ability to do more, we'll do more. Our burgers, our, our burgers, our burgers.

55:53No, but like, let her talk. I'm laughing because we want to do something on Sundays. Like we wanted to do like a specific thing on Sundays, but then I'm just like putting myself back into the line of fire because we want to like do like a sausage Sunday.

56:08Jason Stewart:That sounds like a West Hollywood party to me. why is that putting you the line of fire in terms of gay jokery i mean you could do it at the eagle they'll do a co-brand collab yeah but i i'm down okay so bear night at squirrel every sunday come over for a keel box i think that's a nice idea yeah yeah i think it we were just in london as well we went to camberwell arms fucking delicious so so good and you know they do like sundae roasts i think that there's something really nice about like these pubs that do something very specific for sundae and so you know whether it's like a fried chicken sundae we're just trying to figure out what it is but i had always i really love this place in paris that has like the really soft palm uh and saw and sausage that they do i'm blanking on the name right now what is it what is a what is a soft palm well it's like it's a palm elego it's a it's a potato oh oh palm palm i was hearing you say a mashed potato yeah yeah yeah have you had the um and you you do a you do a very nice palm elego at squirrel but also wilds up the street they've got a nice little banger and mash set right i haven't been there yet i i tried to get in but i haven't been able to get in oh just do a walk-in we can go if you want but we've never made a res but you just go put your name down and grab a martini across the street and you know 30 minutes come by it's all good sounds great hey look that place sounds good to me but that that's the last kind of food i want to know the reason they eat that shit over here is because they're depressed chris i know you i'm i will take you to wilds and i'll order you the right thing and you will literally say best restaurant in la oh wow wow okay big talk we're here but that's okay because of the clientele it's it's all women that follow you on Instagram.

58:01Jason Stewart:And they have enough. You can get some French fries and a piece of fish with some mushy peas and greens that you're going to like and the bread and butter that you're going to like. I'm ready to try it. I mean, if I can go to Squirrel for dinner when I'm back, we'll see if she can fit me in. Okay, well, this is a three-top on the Zoom right now, honey. I would like to go with you to Wild's. Okay. Okay. But is it small, Jason? or is it just busy? It's not huge. It's not huge. It's bigger. I would say it's a little bit bigger than Stir Crazy. Okay. And very similar. That's pretty small. Yeah, it's pretty small.

58:39It's pretty small.

58:39Jason Stewart:Higher ceiling, so it feels bigger. Okay. Okay, so the no burger on the menu is not for any reason. So you plan to or you would like to have one on there even though if you make it so good, no one's going to order your thoughtful black cod dish and you're this and you're this and the pork chop and the peds and barnets yeah we're going to be running burgers and fries and your checks are going to be in half what's up mama yeah yeah i you know and and one of the things that i i think i might have said to you but we do make our own fries which i i take a lot of pride in i think that there's very few restaurants that actually do it you're saying all these restaurants are hitting the cisco truck for their motherfucking fries i just want you to ask tell me Tell me my favorite restaurant that uses fries from Cisco.

59:27I mean, almost most of them.

59:29Jason Stewart:Because it's just like, for our listeners at home, she's doing the heart hands emoji right now to let us know it's all love. And she's doing the finger Korean heart as well. But making for true. I think a Cisco fry is very similar to how people prefer Diet Coke to regular Coke now. Or they prefer crack to cocaine or whatever. I mean, they're good. That's the thing. like they've made a good it's a good product that's consistent if you fry it the right way at the right time good oil good salt and serve it fresh like it's well the real quite good the real question is who can tell the difference you know what i mean i think it's probably a small i mean i understand the point of pride of making your own because that's obviously better slippery slope though i was thinking about this morning it's just like ai artwork like if nobody can tell the difference then who cares and then yeah why at a certain point why hire a graphic designer if nobody knows the difference you know what i mean i know i think you're right i see that i see what you're saying i just i mean i hate it but this is how this is like when i talk about like people saying they can tell the difference in in like a song you know that's mastered by this person or mastered by that person i'm like you're lying you just can't there are very few people that can actually tell the difference very few i think i think ours is like a there's a textural difference yeah but you might you might not be able to tell you might just be like wow these are great fries yeah i was gonna say all that matters is that they leave saying they're great it doesn't and You feel good.

1:00:45Jason Stewart:I think the people who buy and cook Cisco fries will be able to tell, and then everyone else will just say these are good fries. But your fries are quite good. The dipping sauce is just a little too spicy for my Caucasian palate, though. Did you ask for ketchup? You can just get regular old lemon's ketchup. I didn't ask for ketchup, but with my fries, I like a mayonnaise or an aioli, but I like it to be very plain. Well, you can ask for that, too. I will. There's no ego about us. I'm putting you on the spot. There's definitely an ego about you. I'm going to put it on the spot. Why do restaurants skimp on ketchup?

1:01:18When I ask for ketchup, I want an amount I can actually use. I don't want a cute little tin. I don't want a cute little jar. Either give me the 57 and I tap that shit myself and fill half my fucking plate up, or give me not a gravy boat. That was nice about horses.

1:01:34Jason Stewart:They had the big wine holder filled with ice, and it was just Heinz 57 bottles. Yeah, that was so smart. Grab it, plunk it down for the table. Last night I was at a great restaurant in London. The fries were delicious. I literally had to ask the guy three times because I was like, dude, this is a child size, if that. It's like a thimble of ketchup. And I know this sounds gross and American and fat, but what can I say? Look, you want the ketchup. Yeah, how many ounces are you squirting over there? I want to squirt. Give me a fucking squirt. Yeah, I mean, that's the thing that I think about a lot with dining is restaurants need to serve the amount of food.

1:02:10Jason Stewart:I guess maybe in terms of shareable dishes or sauces like if I'm let's say I'm super hungover and I'm going to order a little side of ranch with my pizza I want to not have to ration my dips of crust in the ranch or ration the amount of chips in my guacamole or whatever I want to be able to never hit the end of the ranch I want to be able to never hit the end of the ketchup Have you been to Musso and Frank's Chris? awful restaurant I like actually hate it I don't get it like I don't find it that charming I just don't find it that charming I like places but normally normally I love places like that like that's the kind of place I like but something about that one just it rubs me the wrong way what elements of Musso and Frank did you design squirrel after dark after the ketchup and the martini service the martini service but the ketchup comes in like a sauce bell.

1:03:10Jason Stewart:Yeah, it's hearty. Like a gravy boat of ketchup. Yeah, like dressing on the side. I want an embarrassment of ketchup. I would like to talk about onion rings because they're very underrepresented, I feel like, on a lot of menus. I would love to have onion rings on the menu. Girl, you would fuck an onion ring up. I could already say. There's going to be some indigenous masa flour up in there that's going to be supporting single mothers.

1:03:40Jason Stewart:why do these onion rings taste so good nixtamalized fennel rings are they hard to make or does it feel like old school to people I feel like they should be as popular as french fries they're delicious they're so good I absolutely love it and I agree I would love to have them on the menu again I think it's a matter of give us time because we've played around with it I grew up going to Tony Roma's did you grow up Jason going to Tony Roma's Oh, yeah. I bet. What was it? Like the onion loaf there? Like, I know it's not onion rings, but I am like a big onion ring person. And also the onions that were at Contra, not Contra, but like Wild Air.

1:04:23Did you ever have those? Like they had like this tapioca crust around them. That was, it was so, they're so good. Well, my favorite were from a, I mean, this is weird, but a vegetarian restaurant in Toronto. and they were quinoa battered. And the crunch really hit, I gotta say. Like actual quinoa was on them too? Like raw or? Yeah, at a restaurant called, no, no, no, like breaded. A restaurant called Fresh in Toronto that had a few locations. I think they tried to open in LA and it bombed. But Jason, at Kimble House in Atlanta, Kimble House in Atlanta has an amazing, my friend's restaurant has an amazing onion ring.

1:05:00I love Kimble House and the bread service there. Like, oh my God.

1:05:04Jason Stewart:No, the Hawaiian roll is unreal. Unreal. So where do you ring? My onion ring journey began at Carl's Jr. with the Bacon Western Cheeseburger. And then, you know, nowadays, I feel like Grill on the Alley, they've got a great onion ring that's served with a sidecar of blue cheese stock. Don't ask for it. It just comes with blue cheese, which is like... How do you feel about that? I mean, I love it because I love blue cheese. I love onion rings, but it is excessive and gluttonous. Like after you dip your second onion ring in blue cheese dressing, you're like, all right i gotta start making some life changes or or just like i'm gonna allow myself to eat too and that was my fucking like heroin overdose moment and i will come back to you again in a year that's why i asked for ketchup i can't do i can't i don't like white sauces though that you know i do both make it pink brother oh make it pink oh together no jesus christ get out of here i don't i don't dip i don't dip together but i'll do one one in ketchup bite one in blue bite let him swim around in the mouth for a minute you know what i mean you're just you're disgusting and i know you're doing it on purpose and i don't appreciate it one fucking bit um speaking of foods a little bit more we were talking when i was there a couple nights ago and you were talking about the fish dish moving from uh from one preparation to another and i was thinking what the strategy is when you are a restaurant that is primarily outdoor seating you open in the middle of winter and it happens to be 90 degrees and hottest you know the hottest place in the in the world do you have to you know move quickly on your feet and adjust some things i mean i'll step back to be to say that we were going to open in december and the menu was still totally you were all you were also gonna you were also gonna open in 20 look it's good that we waited no i love that you waited because it's one of it's one of those things where you're like it wasn't right you took your time and every single dish is considered enough even down to the little side of rice like everything was like okay it's all considered there's no there's no skips yeah since you said you made an album with no banger with all bangers Yeah, it's a good playlist.

1:07:23And there's some dishes on the menu that we had planned at the end of the year that didn't make it on because the weather changed, the season changed.

1:07:33Jason Stewart:It was a full Christmas roast menu. Yeah, pretty much, like sausage Sundays. And now it's ceviche weather. Okay, well, for example, the fish I had was a black cod with kind of a beurre blanc sauce. It was a rich, heartwarming meal. but then you have to you know nobody wants to eat that when it's 97 degrees outside it's a little it's a tough putt what are you going to do to the fish to make it a little more tropical i mean we're changing the fish all together so you know as we go into april that's also where like a lot of the ingredients change here in southern california are you saying because i've been having some first of the season asparagus over here in london and i have to say we're in asparagus land it's doing i know we're already we're already there i've had asparagus two nights in a row dude the the asparagus that i had with with the makrut lime i think that was that was the the flavor it's a highlight i have found myself coming back to the most out of everything i ate which is crazy to compete with you know it's special yeah it's special i think you know when you think about asparagus it's kind of like keep it simple you know kiss and we just didn't do that um and the sauce is just so good you said hollandaise i don't know her i'm going crazy on this shit we're going to recruit with it i'm about to do something different there's going to be a challenging dust on top as well of unknown origins that's true call me out call me out i love it it takes one to know one yeah um so yeah we're we're changing the fish we have mackerel that's coming in right now so it'll be like a grilled mackerel with you know some sort of preserved citrus situation and some don't put no hold on don't put your little jams on top of the fish now let's calm down no jams no jam no meat no jam i've been i went to fish jam 97 i fucking i did three triple stacks honestly it was sick um mackerel is one of my superfoods actually it plays well with my microbiome you're like a little cat but i love the mackerel the whole fried mackerel from bcd tofu a little squeeze of lemon on there it's fucked up yeah keep it nice so i yeah i think that that'll be that's just one of the changes we just have we have a bunch but you know we're we're a bunch of chefs that love to create and love to evolve and so it has to be thoughtful evolution that there's things that are coming on like we have like a vongole with a ramp pasta coming on not ramp season are we already there it's it's almost it's almost happening we're getting there we're like creeping into it you can't go to you can't go to the outwater farmer's market if it's fucking ramp season you might get took you might get got yeah real heads know when ramp season comes at whole foods grab you know seven of those and we're ringing in those up as green onions not organic just regular nice nice nice nice nice friend of the show dan fromer is too afraid to do it but maybe this year could be the year that he bucks up let's get dan let's get down on the wrong side he's a law-abiding citizen that guy one of the most law-abiding citizens i've ever met We need those people in our lives.

1:10:37You haven't met my husband.

1:10:38Jason Stewart:Oh, is he a narc? No, he's the kind of guy that stops at the stop sign, waits for three, turns both ways, and keeps going. Sure. No, that's a solid man to have in a narc fight. The last real fight I got in with Carolyn was about that. You were rolling or she was rolling? She wanted to stop. Really? She doesn't strike me as a stopper. On certain intersections where it's gnarly, especially in Glendale where people drive their M3s 120 miles You're not risk adverse behind the wheel. I'll say that about you. You're an amazing driver, but you're pushing it a little far. A red light is merely a suggestion to me.

1:11:13I don't want you to go Paul Walker mode, if you know what I'm saying.

1:11:16Jason Stewart:I'm very safe. I just happen to drive efficiently. Sure, sure. Yeah, really, you're just a crazy guy. Is the market still open next door to the restaurant? It is-ish. So something that's happening is that we're actually launching a delivery, but not the same menu as Squirrel. It's a new delivery menu that will be on Uber Eats. And so when that happens, we'll have - Hold on, Jessica. Did you partner with Uber Eats on this special menu? Oh, we just - Hold the fuck on. This is similar. So this is your CPK ASAP or your Chili's to go. Why are you doing a separate menu when you already have a good menu?

1:11:57You have two good menus.

1:11:59Jason Stewart:I think she's about to tell us. Certain things don't travel well. The dinner menu is really meant for dine-in. In AM service, we've created a menu that's delicious for here and to go. And the vibe is different. Now, post-COVID, we're in the 30 %-ish, sometimes more for to go. And it changes the experience when you dine in. You want to feel something. You want to be a part of something. And so for me, dinner service has to be like squarely dinner, but I still love the delivery arm. And I think it is an important part of keeping a business like a restaurant business safe and healthy economically.

1:12:42And so we did develop a dinner menu that is just it feels like the Harrods boxes. Like you should go check it out if you haven't. I've had a Harrods box. Had a Harrods box. So it's a little bit in that camp. for delivery. Once that launches, then you'll have an active person on the market side and you'll be able to order to go. How much jam are we selling these days? That shit's probably cranking, isn't it? Low key. It's cranking. Low key? I knew it.

1:13:18We sell a lot to all over the United States. When can we develop a how-long-gone flavor? because we're, you know, I have a lot of thoughts. And I think I'm not. Okay, let's get into it. Is there a McCroot line leaf in there? Hell no. Hell no. That's what I'm saying. I think we need to take it back to the, we need to strip it back to the fucking bones, to the studs. We need to do something. What if we just made the best? I mean, because you don't have any regular shit. It's all funky. It's all funked up. We got some regular shit. We have like some very, very normal. But you don't have like how long gone blueberry where it's just the best blueberry.

1:13:54You know what I'm saying? That's true. I'm saying like what if we don't get crazy with it? What if we don't add tarragon? What if we somehow resisted adding tarragon? That is the flavor. Wow. That's what I'm saying. I'm aware of the blueberry tarragon. How long gone strawberry could be the best seller because it's just straight up what you want.

1:14:11Jason Stewart:Or maybe we can partner because I've been making these Christmas thumbprint cookies. Sorry, holiday thumbprint cookies every year. Thank you. And I've been wanting to sort of create it as our like Christmas gift, you know, like our little calling card, you know, like Tom Cruise's cake that he sends out every year for the holidays. Have you ever gotten one of these? I did get one, not from Tom Cruise though, from Ian, our producer. Was it amazing? The cake was not, it was not very good. It was not very good. I mean, there's so many good coconut cakes in LA now, you know, between quarter sheets and Erewhon and Jones on third.

1:14:49okay talk to me about what you fill this cookie with like what's your jam of choice well it

1:14:53Jason Stewart:changes all the time but i've used a lot of squirrel and the blueberry tarragon has been the one that works the most uh without because the the cookie it's like a cream cheese base cookie oh hell no i didn't know that don't tell me that now you don't want to do blueberry no no i love these cookies like i'm well they're really good but the other the two flavors are the almond extract is like the main under note flavor for it and then there's um chopped pecans on top jason what if we did a georgia style peach to complement the pecans and we go full below the mason dixon something to think about i don't want to take the i don't want to take the lead here but it's something jessica have you played in the peach fields of course of course but but what did you add to it i knew you added something you i know you added something funky What'd you add?

1:15:41She's like, well, I did unripe green peaches Lemon verbena That's hand soap, Jessica How the fuck are you gonna put that in my jam? What the hell?

1:15:52Jason Stewart:Little verbena, okay No, that's not a bad idea And we could do crushed peanuts on top and sad Let's see how far we can push it, right? Oh my god, we're gonna get Jimmy Carter in on this shit Would you have it go to charity? No All the money made for us Hell no, what the fuck? We're a business, okay? Yeah, I'm a charity We didn't get in trouble with our jam. Our jam, we're cool. We're good. You think Birkins are cheap? I'm the charity. Yeah, my shit is charity. I'm paying for the hotel I'm in. With my credit, my car note, high every month. Okay. No, but Jessica, I've never had a squirrel jam I don't like.

1:16:23To be fair, they're delicious. I just, I love the idea of maybe stripping it back. That's all.

1:16:28Jason Stewart:Yeah, Chris is big. He's trying to regular Max this summer. Yeah, yeah, okay. He said, what if my strawberry jam didn't have Szechuan peppercorns in it? You know? What would that look like? The thing is, Jessica, when I think about jam, and this is probably exclusive to a recovering fat person from the South, I think of biscuit application first and foremost. I do, too. Oh, you do? On the Bowberry Biscuit. Because I feel like a lot of people go to Toast, you know what I mean, is where their head goes. My head goes biscuit first, even though I don't have biscuits in my life very often. And Toast is a reoccurring character in my lunch.

1:17:00Why don't you have them in your life very often? Is it because none are good enough? Is it because you can't stop if you start? No, I used to go to this place called Flying Biscuit in Atlanta. There were several of. And now it's sort of, we still go because my wife likes it too. And it's like the biscuit is delicious. And they have like a weird apple butter, which I would never get, but I like there. You should have our biscuits. We only do them on the weekends. It's kind of like a donut. I've never met a biscuit I don't like, but biscuits feel close to my culture. It feels like part of my soul.

1:17:29Jason Stewart:He allows himself, you know, three biscuits a year. I see. It's a good amount, just like a donut. Honestly, it doesn't come up that much. It just doesn't come up that much. But now that I know you have them, I'll be back. I'm coming back in April. I'm coming to Squirrel for dinner if you'll respond to Jason and let us get a table. I can set it up. I'll think about it. You're okay with sitting on the rail, right, Chris? Yeah, I'll sit on the curb. I'm fine. Just let me get a$12 latte while I wait, if you don't mind. What milks do you have? Thank you, Jessica, for joining us on How Long Gone. It was a pleasure.

1:18:01We're big fans for a long time. and I'm happy that dinner is finally upon us. Thanks, y 'all. It's been a pleasure. And Jason is literally, Jason's the worst critic on earth and I've never heard him talk this positively about something. I don't even think he likes you that much. I think he really just likes the restaurant that much. I ain't just saying it. He never just says it. That's the fucking problem with him. Thank you, Jessica. We appreciate it. Appreciate you both. All right, we'll see you soon. Have a good day. Bye, y 'all. Au revoir.

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