In short
The hosts and guest discuss Snail Mail’s new album Ricochet, her move to a rural North Carolina home, and the realities of touring/creative process—plus side tangents on NYC protests, scams, celebrity fashion/eyewear industry hires, and internet culture.
Guest backgrounds
Lindsey Jordan (Snail Mail) is a queer musician and homeowner who recently relocated from NYC to rural North Carolina. She’s been touring and writing for years, and describes building a “recluse” life with neighborly community support. She also plays with a band that includes a cellist/guitarist/vocalist (Isadora).
Key claims
Ricochet’s string-heavy arrangements were intentional and planned; she used vocal melodies to “pretend like you can hear strings” and cites realistic cello. She says she’s been “crash routing” (touring hard) and that her band’s lineup changes are mostly additions/returns of a longtime friend. She claims her relationship is stable and non-competitive, describing her partner as deeply spiritual and supportive.
Notable examples
A neighbor reports “a dead dog in the creek” on her property; she speculates about local town corruption/coverups and a furniture-trade-show-like event. She mentions a pink Stratocaster and discusses queerbaiting talk (including Billie Eilish) and JoJo Siwa’s Squier.
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VOProtests and Maduro's Arraignment
0:45 to 2:35
Hosts discuss the protest outside related to Nicholas Maduro's arraignment.
“Not to be confused with a GLP one, but the guy, the guy from Venezuela.”
Jailhouse Stories and Remixes
2:35 to 4:36
Conversation about jailhouse recordings and music from incarcerated artists.
“Yeah, from the only other guy from the OC who could claim Ben Trill, right?”
Travis Scott and Oakley's Creative Team
4:36 to 6:44
Discussion on Travis Scott's role at Oakley and the structure of creative teams.
Social Life and Daily Struggles
6:44 to 8:43
Hosts share their daily lives, social outings, and personal experiences.
“She's going to stay super silent on mute for five minutes and just chuckle along.”
Lindsay's NYC Experience and Homeowner Life
11:59 to 14:04
Lindsay shares her experiences living in NYC and her new homeowner status.
“We asked Lindsay to put on headphones, and she's come back to the table with a gamer headset rig.”
A Disturbing Discovery in the Creek
14:04 to 14:48
Learn about a surprising and unsettling encounter involving a dead dog in a creek.
“And then he was like, but there's a dead dog in your creek.”
Speculating on Foul Play
14:50 to 16:53
Discussion on the possible causes of the dead dog and the implications for the neighborhood.
“Because obviously that dog could have flowed into your area, and depending on weight, could flow into someone else's.”
Living in a Neighborly Community
16:54 to 18:45
Exploration of the differences in community dynamics between urban and rural living.
“One of the easier riddles to solve in local governments.”
Finding a Home in North Carolina
18:46 to 21:08
Insights into the process of relocating and purchasing a home in North Carolina.
“But they would love nothing more than to help you out as a neighbor, which is dope.”
The Local Town's Dark Secrets
21:09 to 23:03
Revelation of a town's hidden issues related to corruption and potential crime.
“There's an outdoor balcony over an acre.”
Show all 35 chapters
Conspiracy Theories and Furniture Trade
23:04 to 25:09
Discussion on bizarre theories related to the town's furniture trade events and secrets.
“I was trying to like, I've been, when I was looking for the house or for when, no, no.”
Home Gym Setup and Lifestyle Choices
25:10 to 27:05
Exploration of fitness habits and gym setup in the context of rural living.
“but I haven't been able to find anybody else on Reddit saying exactly that.”
Community Engagement and Online Life
27:06 to 28:00
Discussion on balancing real-life connections with online presence.
“I just don't like being looked at while I struggle.”
Friendships in Remote Living
28:00 to 29:40
Exploring the dynamics of forming friendships in isolated settings.
“Just kidding Seriously So you're living in the middle of nowhere and have you made any local friends?”
The Complexity of Female Friendships in Music
29:40 to 31:10
Discussing the authenticity of female friendships within the music industry.
“Yeah, like, you think we like any other podcasters?”
The Art of Music Production
31:10 to 33:00
Insights into the intricate process of creating music and instrumentation.
“She's playing cello and guitar and vocals.”
The Challenges of Artistic Creation
33:00 to 34:30
Understanding the struggles artists face during the creative process.
“And then one of the songs, I was like, I can't remember which one.”
Reflections on Aging and Touring
34:30 to 36:20
Conversations about the physical toll of touring and aging as artists.
“It takes me really long, and that's why it's good.”
The Influence of Guitars in Music Culture
36:20 to 39:50
Examining the significance of specific guitar models in contemporary music.
“And the principal definitely just thought it was cool.”
Queerbaiting and Celebrity Culture
41:05 to 42:00
Analyzing the concept of queerbaiting within current celebrity dynamics.
“No, you guys are female queerbaiters, dude.”
Queerbaiting and Hollywood's Dark Secrets
42:00 to 43:19
Discussion on celebrity behaviors, queerbaiting, and Hollywood culture.
“Okay, what's the age break-off to where you lose your queerbaiting immunity.”
Social Dynamics in New York vs. L.A.
43:20 to 44:39
Exploration of different social interactions in New York and Los Angeles.
“I can't even I feel like I'm I feel even weirder when I'm there.”
Relationships and Support in the Music Industry
44:40 to 46:31
Insights on healthy relationships among musicians and the importance of support.
“Not at all, which is actually pretty cool.”
Debating Musicians and Actors
46:32 to 48:13
A lively debate on the crossover between musicians and actors in the industry.
“How my staff has been the exact same the whole time I've been playing.”
The Challenges of Fame and Success
48:14 to 50:42
Discussion on the pressures and challenges faced by rising artists.
“I saw her one time at something and I feel like I was mouth breathing really close to her face.”
Growing Up with Musical Roots
50:43 to 52:46
Personal stories about family influence and early jobs in music.
“Some part of me, just when I see an actor get band fame and then they're like, okay, now I'm a band person.”
The Evolution of DIY in Music
52:47 to 54:45
A conversation on the changing landscape of DIY music careers and its impact.
“You can't be an uggo and open a lingerie store.”
The Importance of Song Quality Over Background
54:46 to 56:00
Discussion on how the quality of music should outweigh an artist's background.
“I don't think DIY exists anymore like that I don't think you can get anywhere with it unless you use the algorithm to your advantage.”
The Changing Standards of Acceptability
56:00 to 57:20
Discusses how standards for music success and acceptability evolve.
“And that shit looks like it's, you know, good enough for MTV.”
Ice Skating, Hockey, and Gender Norms
57:20 to 59:20
Explores memories of ice skating and hockey as a queer experience.
“I mean, it was like my, I loved hockey so much.”
Unexpected Celebrity Encounters
59:20 to 1:02:10
Shares anecdotes about encounters with musicians and celebrities.
“No, I think it's like signing type of thing.”
Separating Art from the Artist
1:02:10 to 1:04:40
Debates the complexities of liking art despite the artist's personal flaws.
“Wait, you guys are stressing me out so much.”
The Impact of Music Reviews
1:04:40 to 1:07:20
Discusses the significance of music reviews and their influence on artists.
“And you're like, well, I'm still going to listen to your music or whatever.”
Crafting and Creativity in Relationships
1:07:20 to 1:10:01
Talks about personal craft projects and their sentimental value in relationships.
“I make little ashtrays for people as gifts.”
Casual Banter and Backstage Plans
1:10:21 to 1:10:58
The hosts share light-hearted banter about backstage plans and drinks.
“I don't even want to know what your insides are going through right now.”
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:17How long gone? It's a beautiful noisy day here in Manhattan. We've got some protesters outside, Jason. They're vocal. They don't have jobs. They're out here in the middle of the day, you know, doing God's work. I'm not exactly sure what it's for, but there's a lot of action happening right now.
0:33Jason Stewart:Okay. This is business by the courthouse. Yes. It's about the courthouse. People are protesting. They're walking. I think it's about the Venezuela homie. Yes. The arraignment of Nicholas Maduro. Not to be confused with a GLP one, but the guy, the guy from Venezuela. Yeah. So anyway, it's loud. It's fucking annoying. And this is the price you pay for living in New York, unless you want to live in Cobble hill and you know cosplay like it's boston unfortunately you got to pay your dues okay big day in them hatton starting off really i forgot about my man maduro when we uh kidnapped the president of a country four months ago and forgot about it and then i guess he's just been posted up in rikers with with harvey he's at rikers shooting dice with harvey and then and i think he's i heard he's up actually um i heard he's currently up okay that's good to know he's currently up i put a little bit i put a little bit on his books just so he can get some honey buns um but i haven't i haven't really you are too white to be talking like that chris he hasn't called he hasn't called me i heard a remix i heard the an r kelly chris brown remix that he recorded over the jail phone i was going to send it to you no i think i saw it online but typically the jailhouse recordings are not really up to snuff for my audio file i i likely doubt he uploaded the flack file so it was better than i thought it would be i thought the same thing not that I have the ears that you do.
1:56Jason Stewart:Use some of Meek Mill's newest claw tools to improvise the jailhouse phone recording just to get things up to studio level. Distro Kid will pick it up. Not R. Kelly jail phone recording. Put some commissary on my Distro Kid. Put some money on my Distro Kid. There's new Tory Lanez. apparently distro kid really really does be have the jails on lock no pun intended all right no pun intended oh man uh yeah but anyway it's it's yeah it's serious it's serious out there and i i'm gonna i'll be able to focus though don't you worry tj okay not a lot of protests going on over here in glendale i know they were cracking down on uh there's some people doing some scams some like daycare center scams some assisted living hospice scams on my uh pouring a little cognac pouring a little brandy out for the Armenian homies out here jogging oh that got hemmed up by the feds yeah gotta gotta pour out a small shot of douce for the homies who were scamming the hospice i i i agree we gotta keep those guys in our thoughts and prayers uh that's that's a kind of a i mean they're gonna die anyway all right we're gonna go walk to get a new battery for my vape you're coming with coming with granny well i mean look it's that i'm not gonna say it's a victimless crime of course but it does you know i mean if they're if you're that close to kicking the bucket and it's insurance money anyway who's really being harmed here no i mean i see it you know it happens not only in glendale but all over the place where you see the the person who's just kind of on their phone while they're the 90 year old person they're taking care of is just like staring at a wall or something like that in the parking lot of course it's one of those things where i'm like damn that sucks but also like if i was in that person's situation if i was like a 16 year old vapor who listens to fucking travis scott i would probably be you know same level of irresponsibility would be i gotta buy a new nucky tech somehow i'll give granny her pills at 3 p.m and 8 p.m one for you one speaking of yeah speaking of speaking of uh creative visionary Travis Scott, they just, Matthew Williams, former, you know, he was at Givenchy most recently, but of course of the brand Alix, which I know you're familiar with, Kanye affiliate, Lady Gaga affiliate, OC, I believe he's an OC legend actually.
4:24Jason Stewart:Yeah, from the only other guy from the OC who could claim Ben Trill, right? Exactly, exactly. At the top it's just us, M-Dub. ventrail og uh he has been named creative director of oakley who has a rich actually a rich footwear history that i believe he's going to re-explore along with the eyewear and clothing um but i i know it's funny because four years too late but uh so isn't travis scott the creative director of oakley here's here's the crowd he's the cfo that's right i always get a mixed up create no he's the creative literally i believe he's the creative visionary is the title and matthew williams is a creative director so this is what i'm trying to understand does that mean that matthew williams someone who regardless if you like his designs or his personality has a lot of experience in the field is he having to clear and i know i know travis scott is quote-unquote twin that's twin it's not his playboy cardi but it's close enough do you think that travis scott has final sign-off do you think travis scott's getting tech packs right well i mean i think we can talk once our guest comes on about this just typically about how um org structures work out and how it's uh how chief visionary officer is going to net out over creative director on the hierarchy i don't know if the entire cactus jack creative team is pulling the puppet strings of m m williams obviously travis scott has not worked a day in his life for oakley as their chief visionary um i don't think it's yeah no i don't like you see like i'm that's not a knock on his irresponsibility or laziness i'm saying he's like the biggest rapper alive and constantly working in you know touring he's on a fucking private jet in russia you know like he's i don't think he's got the nine to five at oakley hq no i i don't down in irvine or whatever i don't think that either i think that there's probably some uh text message exchanged and someone from his camp is overseeing it it's getting done but i think that okay well actually maybe a better question sorry to interrupt a better question to frame it what is the highest level of of software or computing that he is using in his role as chief visionary officer of oakley is it does it exceed beyond text message no definitely not no no i i i believe that travis scott ain't no microsoft team do you think do you think travis scott can use recording programs do you think he's able i do okay so you think he's sick with it on the pro tools or is he more of a fruity loops cat i think i think he's a little proficient in both at this point okay because he produces some of his i i think it couldn't change a light bulb but he can work garage band pretty sweet i think okay okay then yeah if he can do that i think he's probably focused on that and he's got some team members that are going to able are able to sort out this pesky this pesky sort of creative direction stuff but i thought that was an interesting hire and i hope the baggioli is good i hope the baggioli is good as do i i say all i can all i can do is hope everybody's getting paid because we sure are our Our guest is in the lobby.
7:18Jason Stewart:She's going to stay super silent on mute for five minutes and just chuckle along. Okay? Give me a thumbs up if that's okay. People would pay$10 a month to see this. Okay? So you're getting it for free. You're getting it for free. Yeah, Jason, did you go out last night? I saw there was a big Los Angeles club closing that I thought maybe was something you were a part of. Yeah, it was Echo Park's Tex or Tay, depending on how. no one's ever said it right which is i love it's either either one is wrong depending on who it is you know what i mean yeah they're both wrong i did not go carolyn went it was she went and hung out and like went somewhere before and then went to the the thing after i was at home so like by the time you know club whatever was 10 o 'clock came around on a wednesday i got belly full of tofu fans of my libby's cooking content stay tuned watch this space we got new shit coming up in the mango world but you know i was horizontal i was watching tv you know being an hour laid up i i'm not gonna go rally to you know smoke cigarettes in a parking lot on a wednesday for an hour i want to smoke cigarettes with tim all the time but yeah i'm not driving over there that's if i if i had already gone out to dinner at bar di bello before and i could just of course pop over a three minute uber yeah for sure you know we had a party we helped with the noah had a converse release party last night and it was across the street from my house which is as good as as good as it gets for location wise but i was i was still i was still home by nine and and i get to all right you know what fuck this our guest our guest is our guest is harassing us in the zoom chat so let's just you know what let's bring her little ass in here you know all right lindsey it's your turn all right lindsey lindsey jordan uh friend of the program fan favorite over here at how long gone you you might know her as snail mail she's a homeowner she's a musician she's a homo uh the new album ricochet is in when is it in stores tomorrow like soon tomorrow tomorrow in stores tomorrow okay so you've come out of your cave you're doing just fine welcome to how long gone thank you so much i'm so happy to be back i've been waiting uh this episode of how long gone is brought to you by quince jason the weather's changing is spring is sprung the the cherry blossoms are blossoming It's linen season, baby.
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12:13This is what they give you? Matador, legendary indie label. One of the coolest of all time. This is what they give you? Well, I was like, it was this or AirPods. And I was like, I'm sure those AirPods have been deep in my friend's ears. And I was like, I'll just take these Pilot ones or whatever. I guess maybe this is a gamer set.
12:30Jason Stewart:Yeah, you look like you're about to refinance my mortgage. I feel like I am. I can get you in a Honda Pilot for$500 a month if we do. All right, just last four numbers of your social. I'm going to get you pulled up, Mr. Black. All right, so you're in the Big Apple. Are you overwhelmed? Oh, yeah. I feel horrible. I feel horrible right now. It's been a lot. It's been a lot. You're in Jimmy Fallon's NYC and you feel bad? How does that happen? Yeah, man. What's the problem? You're in Brooklyn, for Christ's sake. It can't be that bad. I know. I know.
13:03I guess just the way that it works with like the, I was like helping make all the music videos firsthand kind of. And so then it was like, since we started making the first music video, I don't even know how long ago that's been. There just hasn't even been like one day where I would like go to the movies or something. You know what I mean? So I'm starting to crash out and get angry. But it's nobody's fault. You're one of the best crash routers in the game. Thank you. You're famous as a crash out. But I only mentioned your homeowner status because I know that you've become a woods recluse. That's right.
13:32Yeah, Uncle Ted up in here. That's right. I wanted to talk about what that has looked like for you. Has it changed your social life? But also, have you started buying stuff you never thought you would own to fill up the garage? 100%. there's also been kind of a lot of weird stuff that's come along with it um we were practicing the other day like two weeks ago and the room that we practice in is you can see it from outside it's in the front it's got these big windows we're playing and then this guy was like you know looking around like really you know we could see him and we were like oh let's stop playing he rang the doorbell and he was like it was weird i just watched the footage back this morning to show my girlfriend i was like he was like hey you can hear me and be like i know you guys play music didn't really want to interrupt your groove.
14:15That was the vibe. And we were like, okay. And then he was like, but there's a dead dog in your creek. Oh, hell no. You got a dead dog in the creek? Then he's like, I would have called animal control, but all these kids are poking at it with a stick. They're all like surrounding it. And I thought burying it myself over there would be more respectful. I had like chills. You could see how I'm standing in the ring camera. I'm like, and then he also said, it's not the first one. He said across the street there was another dead dog found in the creek. So I'm not going to lie. Like, that's the type of thing that I didn't sign up.
14:47Jason Stewart:Okay, quick follow-up. How many milligrams were you on when this guy did all this? Definitely like 89, like 89 milligrams. All right, you're at 90 milligrams. You're like, all right, bro, hold on. You know how you own a creek? Well, there's a dead animal in it. Anyway, toodaloo. How does a creek work? Because obviously that dog could have flowed into your area, and depending on weight, could flow into someone else's. Yeah, do we suspect foul play? Do we suspect foul play? I suspect foul play because, so it's at the end, it's basically a drainage moat that surrounds all the houses in the neighborhood.
15:20One side of my yard has a, not to brag, one side of my yard is fenced off, but then across the moat, there's so much yard I can't afford to fence it off. So, I mean, that's actually, I just like unbragged it when I said I couldn't afford to fence it off.
15:32Jason Stewart:Unbragged? I'd just say it wouldn't be a wise financial decision to spend that much capital on a fencing for that much acreage that you possess. Exactly, exactly. We'll reframe that. I only build a fence because I got a dog, but my house is on a corner, so it was at the very end of the drainage moat. So the fact that there's two is what kind of like - So we think we have a dog killer roaming. Well, I hope he doesn't listen to this, but part of me, I don't want to make any direct accusations because this is my neighborhood. It's always the guy that knocks on the door. Whoever you thought lit the fire and called the cops.
16:07It could be, Lindsay, it could be an animal though. could be an animal that's doing this.
16:11Jason Stewart:Yeah, do you know if this dog was unhoused? No, I don't. My first thought was a coyote, because there's coyotes, but my second thought was that it was weird to... Some part of me respects the idea of respecting the dead, but the dead animal, but I don't know why you couldn't let animal control take care of it, because either way... Yeah, I think that's kind of what animal control is supposed to do, historically, based on what I... I mean, you know, I'm not a roadkill master, but I know that when I've seen... I'm the roadkill master. When I've seen roadkill, I know that somebody gets called and a guy comes through and scoops it up and takes care of it.
16:50I know it's not my job as a tax-paying American. Right. Yeah. Right. One of the easier riddles to solve in local governments. Also, were you like, loser, I'm going on tour. Like, I don't have time for this right now. Like, I'm fucking down-tuned. Like, I'm going to need 15. No, man. I was, like, shaking and I was like, please remove it. I don't want to see. I don't want to see. I can't handle it right now. Yeah, you don't want to see that. You don't want to see that. He said it didn't even look like a dog anymore. Oh, hell no. Because it had been so bloated in the creek. Can I ask what this country gentleman was wearing?
17:19Like, what was his vibe? Red shirt, sporty athletic shorts. Honestly, I watched the footage back this morning because we were talking about this last night. And I was like, he actually doesn't have a weird vibe. He really doesn't. He was actually kind of cute. Did he have any sort of bag with him? Maybe. True detective ass right now. Do you walk around your neighborhood with a bag? I don't. I'm just putting it out there. No, I don't. Wait, no, I don't.
17:46Jason Stewart:I would never walk with a bag, officer. I mean, obviously I live in New York City. Sometimes I'll have a tote bag with me under duress. But in the countryside, unless I'm hauling logs, I don't need a bag. This guy has a bag, everybody. Stop. All right, Lindsay, you have to stop calling me gay in the chat. You have to stop calling me gay in the chat. She didn't call you gay. She asked if we thought you were a guy. It's very different. You know what she meant, Jason. You knew exactly what she was trying to do. She thinks we're stupid. Yes or no answer, Chris. She thinks these old guys are stupid.
18:17All right. So you're dealing with some dead vermin around the property. Yeah. But you have a dog. Are you concerned with your dog's safety? Are you keeping they them in the house or are they allowed to roam free? So she has like a dog door now. Okay. One of my neighbors kindly helped me install. Everybody there is really neighborly, which is tight, and I've never experienced anything like it in Maryland. Well, they probably think you're helpless. I would assume... Marilyn mentioned, this young woman has found success in the arts, but as far as other stuff goes, she might be incapable. Well, that is...
18:53Jason Stewart:That's exactly right. That is. They wouldn't be wrong. They wouldn't be wrong. But they would love nothing more than to help you out as a neighbor, which is dope. It is beautiful to witness it. kind of like where I lost my like ability to respect you or like mess with enjoy humanity when I was in New York I was like wow people really don't care about each other like someone will like let a door slam like a pregnant woman's face there's southern guys like UCLA there's southern guys like me who've made out the slums I'll hold the door for even a guy that's how yeah but that's different I'm not beating the allegations but you're right you would okay yeah but how hot does a guy have to be Chris pretty hot I'll hold a doorman for a guy unless they're fat i will say that i will i will hold the door for a lot of people but it it can be looks based depending on my mood i'm not i'm not gonna i'm not gonna lie on this on this show i respect your honesty i was gonna say i held i hold the door for people when i lived in nyc but it doesn't it's not the majority it's not the majority no no no it's not the majority i would agree i mean it's it's it's it's dog eat dog no pun intended when it comes to doggy dog yeah it's doggy dog it's doggy dog all right so you're out here in the in the maryland countryside and what What is the, so you've made friends with your neighbors because they're helping you, but are you helping them?
20:06Are you putting one on the guest list or anything? Or what can you do? I'm on the North Carolina countryside. Oh, you're, I thought you, for some reason. I left Maryland. Okay. I thought you were, I didn't realize that. I knew you were close-ish to North Carolina, but I didn't realize in North Carolina. Yeah. I mean, like in a weird part. Why did you, what, what made you, did you close your eyes and spin a globe? How did we land on this? Well, okay. Y 'all know Brad, right? Of course. Yeah. Yeah. He like convinced, I know someone else who he. exactly convinced to go to North Carolina because it's like a good deal for real estate and like it's peaceful and it's chill and you can get a lot of land and the weather's beautiful and it's on the east coast.
20:39I'm Durham. I would live if I had any other career I would live in Durham. I love it. I would I would too but then I wanted when I started looking at houses in like big cities in North Carolina I was like what if I could afford to live in a palace on an indie man's budget. Okay Connor Oberst. Okay how big is the house? It's fucking huge. All right how but I I mean, what, three bedrooms, four bedrooms? That's cute. Four bedrooms, but then there's a room that I turn into a gym. There's a studio room. There's two dining rooms. There's an outdoor balcony over an acre.
21:11Jason Stewart:Two dining rooms, one for the help? Yeah, one for the help, one for my bandmates. Follow-up, quick follow-up question. Quick follow-up question. How far is it from an international airport? Dude, 20 minutes. It's a weird place. Oh, hell no. But the town is surrounded by a dark secret. Okay. I knew there was going to be a catch, Linz. I got to say. Okay. What have the ghosts done? What have the ghosts done in the past? If only it was only ghosts. What is it? Be honest. I mean, I hope that this doesn't get me taken out or anything. But the whole town is run by, oh, crap. You know what? I don't want people to know what the exact town.
21:54It might be worth it. The town, I'm going to blow it all up just for this
21:59Jason Stewart:Well, maybe I'll bleep it We'll bleep it I think if people hear the story, they'll know what I'm talking about But either way, let's just say The whole town is owned by a very corrupt man And he is the dean of the college in the town Oh, okay, okay, okay And maybe, oh damn, this is a crazy thing to unleash But maybe his son accidentally killed someone in a hazing accident And he's been covering it up ever since Oh, wow So you're saying there's an evil undercurrent when you're down at the local watering hole or hitting the Costco. You feel it. And then there's my theory. Which is what? That, well, let's just say it's furniture related.
22:43Wow, damn, it's all been blown up. I mean, there's a girl who works at my grocery store who rocks with snail mail. And if she's on secret Reddit, like she's definitely letting them know. but uh the town is is is only exists for an event that happens twice a year i know the town i'm familiar with the furniture i as a southerner i know this i believe it's sex trafficking related oh okay okay let's okay now i like it and this wayfair shit have they tried to get you or no
23:08Jason Stewart:you're good no they don't know no if you if you were if you were to be an armoire on wayfair how much money do you think you'd get 25 cents for me no for me inside of an armoire i like 17 18k for you yeah i yeah depending on if i got to make you sing or not you know what i mean that obviously i could be like an in-house singer the price changes that's actually okay so you they don't want you to sing honey did you find this how much research did you do like were you on zillow letting it change your pillow? Like, were you really in there? I was trying to like, I've been, when I was looking for the house or for when, no, no.
23:47Yeah, did you, well, I'm saying, did you hire a real estate agent? Did you find an indie real estate agent? Yes, I did, actually. He played pop punk music and so he got the music vibes. He was cool. I ended up going to a show with him like months and months after I moved into the house. It was cool.
24:03Jason Stewart:We seal the deal at a lag wagon concert? Okay, so you have a Warped Tour graduate selling your house like kind of I mean no but but I actually didn't do a lot of research I had like a a moment where I was like kind of bumming at my parents house until I could find a place in North Carolina and it was going on for a really long time and I was getting really tired of it and I my whole plan was to move to Greensboro but I just couldn't find anything there where that like I was like wow this is like this is like a house built for like a monarch um but monarch that doesn't have that much money and so i was like okay so that was my what i ended up starting to look for the more options i started seeing and then i found this area that has just all this beautiful architecture for like so cheap but i i really didn't research the town at all and i now i'm doing research i i don't even think i'm gonna leave i like the i like being in a in a weird place like where i can just hide in my house but you like being in a trafficking hub i I got it.
25:02Jason Stewart:No. No, no, no. That's just a, no. I mean, that's just a theory that I have that I've also asked other people who live in North Carolina, but I haven't been able to find anybody else on Reddit saying exactly that. My reason for thinking like it's 100 % that is just because the market is extremely hard to get into. You can't just buy a ticket and go. You have to be like a vendor or like whatever. You have to have all these like specific types of badges. You gotta have paperwork and stuff. And it's heavily, twice a year, all these empty buildings the rest of the year weird so this this is a this is a furniture trade show is that what it is yeah might as well just blow it up okay jason this is a pretty known like the people would go here if they need a cow like they would like like you would wait to go buy furniture at this event because it's it's the selection is so vast wow you have to bleep that out motherfucker okay wow speaking of furnishings though how many of the in your expansive in the snail mail rave cave how many rooms are missing furniture it's the playboy castle okay that's the wi-fi password how many how many rooms are unfurnished at this point i've been like really working on the rooms that weren't getting a lot of love i would say at this point one room is pretty much completely unfurnished and i call it yeah i just put like yeah yeah that that room i have plans for but what is in the g what is in the gym setup i would love to know the snail mail pump program you got the pilates reformer in there what do you got my whole vibe in there is like i get i love buying stuff on the tiktok shop it's like i i no seriously it's crazy it like looks like it's like alien workout from the future it's like all scam products but it's like one wall in like mirror tiles and then it's just like i bought a treadmill right when i moved to north carolina it's awesome that one's not a scam i would tried and true trusted tread first things first we're getting the tready yeah yes um okay because i can go on there for like a really long time but i hate running outside makes me feel like everybody's looking at me they are they would be if you lived in a place where people were but i understand what you're saying no not even because i'm the snail I feel like I don't want to be exerting myself and wheezing and having people drive by in cars or anything.
27:22I just don't like being looked at while I struggle. Oh, see, I love that feeling. I love that feeling because when I see people running outside, I'm like, I should be doing that right now. No matter what I'm going to do, I'm like, this person is better than me because they're exercising right now. No matter what time of day.
27:36Jason Stewart:Especially if they have a better stride than yours, Chris. Especially if their gait is sexy. Yeah. Oh, well. Come on. Get those knees up. I have a pretty nice gait. I'm not Harry Styles Harry Styles released his gate this week There was a Runner's World video of him sprinting for that album that magazine cover Amazing gate on that guy I was impressed with the stride What can't the guy do? What can he do? Just kidding Seriously So you're living in the middle of nowhere and have you made any local friends? I have an entire freaking community of all of my neighbors I hang out with all my neighbors those are the only people that I see it's awesome wow so you've really ingratiated yourself okay and this is this is IRL hanging we're not in the discord or anything nope and you mentioned Reddit I'm gonna go ahead and say you should get off there no matter what you're looking at totally I mean I don't look at anything music related on Reddit I will say okay it's just conspiracy stuff it is kind of a lot of conspiracy stuff it's a lot of like I don't know how this got added into the mix what else do you do on Reddit I have a secret account on there where I talk shit on a bunch of stuff movie related not music crazy okay okay i bet uh-huh no no no i actually i actually i have a deep fear of getting found out doing that so i i am being i can be honest with you guys i don't do it for music because if it got traced i'd be really embarrassed but if it got traced for movies i would be like what's a girl to do sure i want to get cast you're like charlie has a letterboxd why can't i yeah no i yeah well i don't like i'm not my real self on letterboxd like i give it like i am but i don't like i don't like go hard on there you're you're saying you give honest reviews but maybe some of your more scathing language is saved.
29:16Jason Stewart:And it wouldn't be a big deal if you got busted for talking shit on like Warner Brothers Studios versus like Phoebe Bridgers. You know what I mean? Yeah. Nobody talked any shit on... Nobody talked any... That was an example that did not happen. I just made that up in my head. Female songstresses, you guys have a love-hate relationship with each other. And I think a lot of the friendships are fake. And I like that about it. I think everybody's... Just like podcast friendships. Yeah, like, you think we like any other podcasters? Like, I want those losers to suffer, but we're all friends when we're at a Valentino eyewear event.
29:49Jason Stewart:Yeah, die slow, bitch. But if I see you at the coffee shop, what up, squad? How you living? Yeah, like, I like you, but in theory, I want you to fail because I, even though I know this is not true, you're taking food out of my mouth. Adrian Lenker taking money out of your family's pocket. That's a new flat screen in the fourth bedroom, bro. Yeah, you need a fifth bedroom. I swear to God, these bitches keep putting albums out. I'm suffering. No, I mean, that really is how we feel. I'm not kidding. I talk about this with my friends and my therapist, that I'm like, I know that these people are completely unrelated to me, but they do the same thing, sort of, and I want to see them suffer.
30:30Jason Stewart:Why do I want my friends and peers to become destitute members of society? It's not even, no one wins in the arts. Not comparing podcasting to music, obviously, because music is actually art. Podcasting is merely talking. But I think that a lot of people that do anything like we do for a living do have these irrational thoughts. And it is to be examined. If you want to succeed in life. Of all the things you said, I do agree that I think a lot of people's female friendships in music are not real. And I think it's not worth it to chase female friendships so that you can post them. yeah yeah but i do think i agree that's why i don't hang out with any chicks hell no well that's what i'm saying so you don't hang out no chicks you're like it's me yeah no chicks no chicks just guys just guys no no uh you guys i think there's some chicks that you might you know like sophie thatcher you know let me get the pic real quick for the close friends are y 'all good are you guys all right no obviously we're not all right we've never been all right Do you have any chicks in your band or is it all fellas?
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31:38Yeah, there's a chick in the band now. Her name's Isadora. She's tight. She's playing cello and guitar and vocals. Cello? Yeah, this album, you really went, you know what? You really went, you went, there's a hella instruments on this joint. Hella instruments played really elegantly. And I think like arranged in a sophisticated way. That's like, I was like coming up with the melodies of the strings and stuff. But like, then there was a guy being like. Okay, Mark Ronson, calm down. I didn't know you were in the studio like that. I am Mark Robinson.
32:05Jason Stewart:John Bryan ass over here. The king of uptown funk. Everybody get up. Everybody get up. That's Robin Thicke. That's Robin Thicke. Everybody get up. You are a singer. You're in the lab. You got that one. You're in the lab with the orchestra like on your little Tom York shit. No, I'm like, I have like a Mellotron keyboard and you can use it to like blend instruments, you know? And so I'm like, I'm making fake string arrangements and then there was like somebody helping me make them like actually be like like add some tension, take it away like I don't know anything about that and I could never like stand in front of a group of like of an orchestra and be like how about you try it a little more like this no we need the video of you with the children's choir that's one of my favorite when you see the producer with the children's choir that is like instant chills for sure classic no because when I first heard this I was like damn there's hella instruments on this And then one of the songs, I was like, I can't remember which one.
33:03Maybe it was the first single. I was like, this makes me feel like it's sort of like a graduation ballad. Like the strings were so dramatic. It was giving time of your life, the green day. Instant chills. The classic green day. Well, that was a graduation song for someone that's 43. Obviously not for everybody. Another turning point, a fork stuck in the road. Exactly. Don't start now, girl.
33:27Jason Stewart:Don't start. She really went for it. Yeah, Jason's going to get choked up. And that's why I'm going to let you let you go. What took you? Was it because you had this mellow track? You were like, I'm just going to play with this shit? Or was this always the idea? This was the plan. This was the plan. I just like, it feels like I could have done the same thing on just a piano. But it's nice to just actually just like hear, pretend like you can hear strings. Because there's some pretty realistic cello on that thing. But I come up with a lot of stuff. I come up with a lot of vocal melodies and stuff pretending to play a violin on there.
34:00Because I'm like, okay, what tone right now is not going to irritate me? And sometimes that helps me come up with string stuff. Because I'm like, okay, if I made the vocal melody out of a violin, I'm sure I could capture a better feeling right now than trying to sing it in my head over and over again. Whatever. Well, because you took your sweet fucking time. So I guess you were just playing violin in your head for months out there. I just got to say, fuck you guys. I just wanted to say that. I would tap in with Katie and Brad. I'd be like, what's up? What's up with Snail? Where's the music? They're like, we don't know.
34:34We let go and let God. So what were you doing? Touring. You son of a bitch. And writing. And writing. You know how long it takes me? It takes me really long, and that's why it's good. That's why it's good. Hell yeah. Some of these motherfuckers crank it out. And those two are real quiet now. Mm-hmm. And what did you think? It's obviously going to be. I'm taking my time to make an instant classic, and you know what? You know what you guys are doing right now? You're echoing the big capitalism of the music industry thing that's coming in right now. My haters are real quiet right now. A year. A solo project.
35:06And then you guys are like, I love Keith. All right. So you feel justified. You feel justified in your little five years. You said, I earned this shit. Yeah. No. I mean, we tour really hard. But we were giving the public like three years of touring during that. You know what I mean? I know.
35:24Jason Stewart:Instagram followers were eating the whole time too. Oh, they were tanking. I think it's a normal amount of time. And I think because you made this amazing record with a lot of thought put into it, string arrangements, all that stuff, it's a perfect amount of time. Also, you're very young. You're opening a home. She ain't that young anymore. She ain't that young anymore, Jason. Yo, that's true. I barely get ID'd anymore. When she started popping, she was really young. But you got to remember time has passed, TJ. That's the thing. She ain't 18 anymore. The thing is, you guys can't see it through the screen, but up close, my skid looks old.
36:01Jason Stewart:I may be giving 14 to 17 on Zoom, but see me IRL, I look very old. Are you feeling old? How's your body holding up? Awful. I think everybody who's been touring in Snail Mill the whole time is creaky and sad and jaded and angry. When we all get together, none of us barely, we don't even really talk. seeing it from like a another person's perspective like the new bandmates coming in like i'm sure it's like oh so we did some replacements or just additions well uh there's an addition but the our guitar player who joined us on the dinosaur junior tour and now is like with us again he was our guitar player in 2017 like one of my best friends in high school and then he wanted to go to college so i was like go to college then and then we had like all these we just had a bunch of guitar players already until we were finally like needed one and then we were like obviously it's you friend but like just make sure you uh make sure you want to do this did this hold on did homeboy get a degree yeah in what i don't know exactly guitar okay so he's back on the road oh it's okay so it's a pointless degree but it makes him feel good i get that i get that right sure you know you know did you finish high school yeah oh yeah but um like barely um well because i I was already kind of like, I missed like an unholy amount of days.
37:18And the principal definitely just thought it was cool. So he let me graduate for sure. I wasn't failing, but I definitely exceeded by far the amount of days that you're allowed to miss and still graduate. Okay. And I just want to be clear. During this 30 minutes we've been on the phone, you're drinking a coffee of a vape and a Red Bull? Yes. Well, this is weed. That's weed. Yeah. Okay. Okay, so the thing with that, this is, if talking about aging, some of the things you're doing now, the combinations at this clip that you're going, it could. You know what's lame about you guys? Please. You guys get to like a certain point where it's like all about health and like wellness.
37:55And then all of a sudden, like you just forget what it was like to have fun. And then you get sick in everybody's ass about like exercise. No, I've never had fun. I want to be very clear. I've never had fun. Even when I was a drug addict, even now, I've never had fun.
38:08Jason Stewart:and also don't say you guys i get high every day baby that's my boy that's my friend he doesn't make it look as manic as you do but he tries awesome yeah i mean that's awesome that's great we're all god's creatures man bathing in his life this is one of the best conversations of my life goddamn right actually speaking of musical instruments i saw a somebody tweeted a reddit question and I decided to save it for you. It's from the r slash ask transgender. And the question that it asks is why do all, why do you all have jazz masters or jaguars? I just noticed when I see a guitar in the background of a trans woman's picture, it's always a jazz master or a jaguar.
38:51Jason Stewart:You better speak for your community. Um, I'm not transgender. i know you're not but i feel like you're you're near and dear to the jazz master space you know north carolina yeah you're more representative of the guitar styles in this in this example i think it's a real like gen i think it's like the gen z guitar yeah like i didn't realize that and who's to know if i maybe even influenced it a little i yeah i mean a big reason why i brought it up on your episode and not Adam Goldberg's. Okay, so you are, what are you playing right now and what color is it? Pink. Pink Stratocaster. I got a pink Stratocaster.
39:29Jason Stewart:You got the Jojo Siwa Squire? Oh, yeah. Dude. You guys see that? Jojo Siwa Squire. Yo, two thumbs all the way up. It's too fucking hard. This shit ain't made in Mexico, twin. This is America, baby. It's so cool that she's dating a regular guy now. Watching the JoJo journey has been empowering for all of us. I know. I hope she finds herself in a happy, peaceful place. Well, do you think... Now, I know you get some resentment for the fake munchers, so are you throwing that at JoJo or are you happy for her? Be honest with me. No, no, no. I actually don't think she's a fake muncher. How Long Gone is brought to you by Rocket Money.
40:08Our old buddies over at Rocket Money. Jason, I want my wallet to be on swole, not on GLP-1s. I need a thickiana. I need a Thiciana. The prices are going up everywhere, Jason. All these streaming services that I pay for to entertain myself, even though I hate what they're doing, they just keep costing me more money. The prices go up every month. I can't even keep up with how much I'm being robbed. That's why you need Rocket Money, because Rocket Money will go in, it'll scrub your shit, and find out where you're paying too much.
40:34Jason Stewart:Scrub me down. Yeah, Rocket Money, scrub me so good, and that's how I was able to afford a nice European vacation this weekend. Thank you, Rocket Money. Rocket Money is a personal finance app that helps you find and cancel unwanted subscriptions, monitors your spending, and helps lower your bills so you can grow your savings, get to spending, let Rocket Money help you reach your financial goals faster. Join rocketmoney.com slash how long. That is rocketmoney.com slash how long.
41:12Jason Stewart:r slash fake munchers if it doesn't exist let's create it now people are all saying it again people now people are really people are saying what i don't know this i don't know this about people are all just saying the same stuff and i wasn't talking about anyone i was talking about queer baiting and i'm like that is low-key just like you tell me actually i would love to know can you give me an example of a female queer baiter because that's something we get called a lot here. No. That's what Jason... No, you guys are female queerbaiters, dude. No, no, no, no. We're male. We're only... Yeah, we're queerbaiters who like females.
41:44Jason Stewart:What? Yeah, we're queerbaiters who like females. Good point, Jason. That's a big distinction to make. I'm trying to think of that. When we think of queerbaiters, I can think of plenty of actors. Billie Eilish is a female queerbaiter. Oh, Billie Eilish. Yeah, that's a good point. She seems really young, though, so I'm not sure. I don't think we should call her that. Okay, what's the age break-off to where you lose your queerbaiting immunity. That's a good question. Well, I feel like she's not doing it as much anymore, right? No, she's got a man. She's got a man. But she's not like, I could eat that girl for lunch anymore.
42:16She's not saying that anymore. She's not putting stuff out like that anymore. Maybe she was eating girls for lunch at that time. I don't know. She, I have infinite patience for. I'm like, let's see. You know what happens with these celebrity types? They're sucking blood behind the scenes. We don't know what they're doing. Oh, yeah. Adrenochrome? Sexually? Drug? I don't know what these people are doing. I don't know who they're, I don't know which Satan they're worshipping in Hollywood. You know, it's an... It's Baal. We all know about Baal,
42:45Jason Stewart:the demon underlord. Imagine if you lived in Hollywood. You'd be fucked up, boy. Oh my god. Imagine you on the wild in Silver Lake. Oh my goodness. I don't think I would ever do that. I hate being there. It makes me feel crazy. I don't trust you on the road either. I'm okay, but I don't trust myself on the road there. I was going to say, I think there's like a type of like girl in New York that when I try to be friends with her, it's like she doesn't she's not nice to me. You know what I mean? Like nice to me. I think I could like be understand how to like talk to like a like a popular, well-adjusted girl here.
43:19But the popular girls of L.A., like I really like I'm like, wow, I I can't really I can't hang with y 'all. I can't even I feel like I'm I feel even weirder when I'm there. I'm like, oof, I don't have the skills for this hang. So you're saying you can't catch up with your girlfriend over a matcha and an IV drip. That's not the life that you want.
43:41Jason Stewart:I don't have the skills for this hang is very well put. Because it's not like you guys are dumb or you guys are idiot. It's just like a different skill set of how people talk here. It's like girls that are mean there just take to me even less kindly than girls who are mean here. but sometimes here I think I have a little like weird girl charm just to be like any new friends any takers and then like when I'm in LA I'm like I feel like I like look like I have like shit all over my pants the way that people act around me I look like I stink and I like and I'm doing something offensive I'm like naked on the street being like talk to me talk to me people look at you like the guy who's trying to squeegee your window at a red light and you're just trying to go get a matcha like no thanks I don't have anything I don't have any change lady I'm sorry No, I'm sorry.
44:26I don't have anything.
44:26Jason Stewart:Oh, did you wet yourself again, young man? Okay, now, also since we've last talked to you, you've been in a pretty serious relationship for a little while. That's right. Obviously, we're big fans, but I just, you know, two rockers, does it get competitive? Not at all, which is actually pretty cool. I mean, Ita is really a person that I think is genuinely spiritual. ritual like the human stuff is a level above like the being good to people stuff is like a level above anybody else i've ever met like there's no jealousy it's like only support it's insane and i mean that i can like see it's been three years there's not even like there's not even a hint of weirdness and then i'm like you know i am so happy to be associated with mama at all i got obsessed with that band and then i was like wait anytime i don't know i love to see them I love Mama I think they're great They're fucking sick For listeners at home, Mama is the name of a band When you said that, you weren't just talking about I love Mama like your mother Mama I love my mama I don't know We're like all the bands We're all friends with all the members amongst each other You're a lot to deal with So I'm proud Take a look in the camera of your own camera Dude take a look in the camera of your own camera oh hey look i trust me my wife tells me i'm a lot to deal with every fucking day there's no i am a it takes an insane skill set to be my girlfriend i think i think you got to be like real patient and real willing to navy seal level shit yeah this is yeah to be boot up with them they train for this i'm not gonna hide that i'm crazy well you couldn't if you wanted to so that's part of the charm that's part of the charm That's right.
46:12But it's not like, you know, the way that I'm crazy is like, we don't fight really or anything. It's more like me just like being crazy and her being like really good at dealing with crazy people. Yeah, that's it. I mean, that's necessary.
46:25Jason Stewart:Your craziness is about as endearing as it gets, though. You know what I mean? Who can really be mad at you? Oh, thank you. Hey, hold on, Jason. We haven't seen behind closed doors. Yo, yo, wait, wait. You know what, though? You know what you can take a look at? How my staff has been the exact same the whole time I've been playing. Oh, you call them your staff. That makes it, yeah, I see. Well, wait, what do I say? Your team. Oh, my team, sorry. Are you talking about your security? All right, so you got two security. You've got your personal assistant. I'm thinking bandmates. I'm thinking crew.
46:55I'm thinking everybody who consistently works with me.
46:58Jason Stewart:TMs, guitar techs, drivers. You can't find real dirt because there ain't any. Because I'm awesome and nice to be around. No results found. Sorry. That's why it's a band. Who else is in an indie band with all their friends from high school and everybody's in great, still in a great place and we're all still having fun. It's just you and geese, basically. That's it, right? Yeah. They're having too much fun, those little freaks. Are they? I mean, it seems like, I think that there's, and this happened to you a little bit, but I think because the internet's gotten so crazy, I just think that the breakneck ascent to the top in like a month is not good for anybody.
47:36I don't know how any, that just seems very challenging, especially when it's like memes are half of it kind of yeah but but but try this on for size
47:45Jason Stewart:what i think the fact that they have had that quick rise but they didn't it's not because they had a breakout single i think just them overall has risen to success and everyone's like i got to see this band but they didn't have like i'm somber or i'm role model or i'm you know whatever and i've got the big song that they play on the radio actually great question jason all right Lindsay, gun to head, you gotta do a co-write collab. Somber or role model? I'm a role head. I'm on record as a role head. Who's gonna be more of a munch though? I think role model would be more... What do you think of Dakota Johnson?
48:23She's bad, right? Role model's a real eater. Oh, she's so beautiful. She's so beautiful. I saw her one time at something and I feel like I was mouth breathing really close to her face. She was talking about the Suspiria remake which is one of my favorite movies of all time. one of my few specific interests that I have. You know what I mean? I feel like she didn't know that I was trying to be part of the conversation. One of those, standing maybe two feet behind her, breathing on her neck. That's how Role Model pulled her, too. I think that's how Role pulled her, too.
48:51Jason Stewart:Yeah, Role's like, I like movies, too, babe. I freaked it at her by accident, but she's so beautiful and talented. Who could blame you? Who wouldn't freak it around her? We all love her. I like, all right, roll or somber, gun to head. I will say, to me, it's the person, whoever writes role model songs for him is trying to make it sound like MJ Lenderman. And it's not close. It's not even close. See, I don't think it sounds like that at all, actually. I think it's like trying to take advantage of the alt country thing. Well, I think that's probably real, but I'm okay with that because that's the kind of music I like.
49:24I would rather music sound like that than the other stuff.
49:28Jason Stewart:Okay, what about, okay, next round, Dujo or Bleachers? Bleachers. Oh, hell no. Get the fuck out of here. You're not rolling with my boy, Dujo. I don't like when actors become musicians, but I think it's okay when musicians become actors. I remember when your ass had your little A24. Hey, shut the fuck up. I'm still trying to do more stuff. No, no, no, no. It's way harder to become a musician based on pure merit. It's way harder. All right, great. Yeah. Keanu has been trying for 30 years. He's been in the fucking Kia Asylum. That's what I'm saying. You can get famous from being an actor for being like - Keanu Asylum?
50:00for anything but you can't get straight you can't straight up like make waves in the world without a leg up if your songs are bad so i'm just like becoming a musician is way harder like heated rivalry is a bad show but they're still i liked it a-list stars of course you did you have to it's part of it's different okay gay people like that shit i i think dugeau's song is a smash but i also have never watched any i've never seen him act in anything that that's my problem sometimes I miss things completely, so I don't even really think of him as... I've never seen Stranger Things. I'm an adult. Yeah.
50:34I've seen one season of Stranger Things. He seems like a great actor. I don't know. I just... I have like a...
50:39Jason Stewart:Great actor. Keep him out of the booth is what you're saying, though. Well, I don't know. I don't know. Some part of me, just when I see an actor get band fame and then they're like, okay, now I'm a band person. Well, I don't know. Dude, we have the same PR person. What are we doing right now? What are we talking about? Well, it's cool. You know, the one thing about him that is interesting is that he basically paid for it and did it all himself with the money from acting which i have to say is is not where a lot of people would put their that's a lot of money he pulled 30 grand out of his 30 million and yeah got some studio time that's still still bro i mean i don't like i'd rather you do that than become a like a photographer or a fucking you know real estate investor yeah but how famous can you how far can you take that i mean don't we have enough whatever i'm not even my my i'm my guess is and this is probably true about a lot of people they wanted to be a musician originally the acting thing sort of happened and it becomes your whole life and then you're sort of like, well, this is what I actually want to do so I might as well try it now that I have eyeballs.
51:36But that's doing it the easy way is all I'm saying. Oh, okay. You want to talk about the easy way? Let's talk about Chapel Rhone's granddad then. How much time you got? You know what I mean? Oh, I just saw that. I just heard about it. But her songs are really good. Yeah, Dan Nigro is a good songwriter. I completely agree. I think she writes them with him. Yeah, and I write your songs with you too. I mean, you know, it's how it goes. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't think being upper middle class And a successful musician should be I don't think you should be vilified for that Because I know you didn't get out the mud You're not from the streets We are not from money I'm not saying money I'm saying that I'm saying what people think is rich now Is very skewed And they want their musicians to be homeless
52:17Jason Stewart:So your family's airport is small Like single engine planes only No man, my mom's a small business That's the a lingerie store. You don't know this? I did not know that. Your mom owns a lingerie store? No wonder you turned out to be a hoe. That's crazy. I know, right? From day one. Does it have a clever name? Oh, yeah. Come on. Bra la la. That is actually very sick. Yeah, I mean, I guess I don't it doesn't come up that much, but people Wait, hold on, hold on, hold on. Is your mom low-key a baddie, though? My mom's beautiful. I had a feeling. Right? You can't be an uggo and open a lingerie store.
52:51Ain't nobody buying. No! My mom is an amazing woman. Is your dad in the picture? Yeah, my dad's in the picture. He's an awesome guy. Are they married, though? Oh, yeah. Beautiful. Oh, so you come from a two-parent home. That's a privilege. That's a privilege. I found it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, we actually, like, just it's the fact, you know, I never I bought my guitars with money I worked for from my jobs. Alright, what's Snail's first job? Merriweather Post Pavilion. I worked as a event staff person for, like, three years. Like, so checking bags, like standing at gates and being like. But you got to see the show.
53:27Well, I got to have my back to the show and I got to see like fish and stuff. You know, like it was a great job. Everybody in high school wanted it.
53:34Jason Stewart:That's a great high school job. How many drugs did you confiscate? I very rarely. It's crazy. I was there for a minute. I worked some really crazy events. I very rarely ever found anything in anyone's bag. Someone next to me would be like, no machetes and like take it out of a bag. I witnessed crazy stuff get pulled out of people's bag. The craziest thing I think I ever saw was someone's big jar of homemade sangria. And then I was like, you can't. I'm sorry. And they threw it on the ground. And I was like, oh. Homemade sangria? Yeah. I bought a big jar of homemade sangria. Well, that's what it seemed to be.
54:08No, no. Sure. Then I worked at a seasonal job at Music and Arts, helping people fill out the paperwork for instrument rental season.
54:19Jason Stewart:You only had cool PBS indie cute jobs This is my parents have an NPR sticker On the back of the Cadillac No guys, you guys are misinterpreting What happened Well that's the worst thing People do actually think we're Nepo And it's just because we suck I'm joking, I'm not saying that at all No it just drives me I think we were the last true DIY band Hey let's not talk about the help like that I don't think DIY exists anymore like that I don't think you can get anywhere with it unless you use the algorithm to your advantage. Oh, I don't think you can just put out music that's good and get in a van and it's going to work out.
54:57Not anymore. No, I agree with you. I think that's completely a lost art. And that's why nobody wants to tour anymore. But we booked our first DIY tour. We took my dad's Nissan. And literally all of the shows we played were at people's houses and at the grossest places you've ever been. And then we slept on punk floors for so many years. How old were you? 16, 15? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But it was like truly a rise from people just being like, this rocks. So then I got to brag about it when it comes around. No, no, you earned the brag. I guess, though, I feel like you're a little bit of a prodigy, which helps you in general.
55:33Thanks. You know, I just think that there's, because I know a lot of people who did that exact same thing, and we ain't heard from them ever again. Well, no, it's because I'm good at writing songs. I've been working on that for my whole life, you know? I'm saying I think you knew at an early age is what I'm trying to say. I did, I did. But yeah, but I feel like a lot of it is just like getting out there and trying or it used to be.
55:53Jason Stewart:Yeah, because you see videos of like kids, little bedroom punk bands and their parents will hire like a social media team to come over and film their band practice with a drone. And that shit looks like it's, you know, good enough for MTV. I'm saying not a single connection before we already were like killing it. You know what I mean? No, I know. I know all of that. I think it's funny. I just think that the sort of goalposts constantly move now on what's acceptable and what's not. And to me, it's more like, how good are the songs? That's all I really, I don't care if your grandmother is a Rothschild.
56:26If the songs are good, the songs are good. Yeah, I mean, I guess I don't really either. Like, I love Chapel Rhone. I gotta say. I love Chapel Rhone too. I wish she wasn't so mean to my paparazzi homies, but her music is good. You got paparazzi homies? No, that's a joke. That's a joke. That's a joke. I believed you though. I would. I have homies everywhere. I'm an equal opportunity homie employer. I got them everywhere. Doesn't sound like a guy with a lot of homies to me.
56:47Jason Stewart:Does ACAB cover paparazzi too?
56:52Okay, fine. I'm a homie hopper. You're not a homie hopper. I'm a homie hopper. Fine, I'll say it. That's not what that, you know that's not what that means, right? Or am I behind on the joke? No, no, no. That was a joke on my part. I do know what a homie hopper means. I know what a homie hopper means. Yeah, right. Yeah, Chris.
57:11oh god how much all right so you're in new york are you doing are you playing something uh well we did fallon and now i'm just like in they got me locked in my cage doing my press till till um till i go home did you did you do what'd you do i saw the fallon i saw a clip you didn't get to go play twister with him or anything or do a shot of jameson in a line you just had to no she did she went ice skating yeah well that wasn't i just i wanted to do that that was promo i was just solo
57:35Jason Stewart:I was going to say, you had nice moves. Thank you. Yeah, I played hockey for so long. Oh, damn, you are gay. You were confident on the ice. Yeah. I mean, it was like my, I loved hockey so much. I wish that I had more excuses to get on ice as an adult. It had been like four years. Was that like a little Alyssa Lu bat signal? Just letting her know you can do a little turn? Yeah. Like a little shade in my voice? Yeah. Well, it's kind of crazy that ice skating and hockey are the cool thing now. because, to be honest, when I was in sixth grade and I used to go to the Friday night skate and it was always right after my hockey practice and I used to stink like shit.
58:14And many times people were like, are you a boy or a girl? But now, look, it's like everybody's like, the ice is so sexy. I'm like, okay. For the record, I don't think it is. See if you still feel that way when I get it.
58:27Jason Stewart:Well, when you come out with your goalie pads. Smell my Bauer pads and then come talk to me, queen. You're talking about your nasty bowers. Yeah, those are in the other room right now. They stink like shit. You didn't play. You weren't a goalie, at least, though, I hope. No, I was left wing. Okay, so you were on the attack. She's gay. She's not that gay. Yeah, I'm not defense or goalie. I'm not defense, guys. Well, you know what's crazy about being like a – I played on boys' teams like my entire life, but this one summer I went to this like all-girls Dartmouth or like it was like a yeah hockey camp there and all the girls there were like so outwardly homophobic seeming but so clearly gay it was really crazy to be around like did you hook up did you hook up though no no no no i feel like i was like 12 but it was like all the girls that were like my bad hey i didn't know i didn't know hey my bad i didn't know i don't do no gay shit i don't i my bad that's unless you want to that's my b that's my b i lost my set You look like the meme of the guy Where he hears bad news And then rips his headphones off in disgust It's like Alright so you're locked in the room But I thought I saw something Are you playing at Rough Trade or something?
59:40Oh yeah we have a Q &A at Rough Trade On album release day With me and Ita and Aaron from Momma I saw something on the calendar Because if you were going to play songs I was going to try to come But I've heard you talk for an hour today so I'm kind of good at all that. They don't make you play? What kind of shit is that? They want to sell some vinyl variants? No, we have to do Q... No, I think it's like signing type of thing. Oh, okay, okay, okay. I thought you might show up with a Martin and do a couple unplugged. You think I have a Mart? No. You don't do unplugged. You strike me as a small Fender amp plugging in.
1:00:15You do a little 12 string?
1:00:16Jason Stewart:You do a little 12 string ever? You guys... No, I don't have a 12 string. I have stuff that I can use. I have an acoustic... I don't know, yeah. I have some acoustic guitars, but they're Fenders. I have never bought a vintage acoustic guitar. Because Fender, you're on the Fender flow team, I assume. Yes. You get blood. All right, when are we getting the signature model? Dude, I'm going to do that so bad with the Red Jack. That would be so cool. Who's got one? I feel like they give them away to funny characters sometimes. I think there's like a Tom Morello one, like a Jay Mascus one, a Thurston Moore one.
1:00:49Those are all pretty legendary. Those are pretty good. Yeah, those are pretty good.
1:00:52Jason Stewart:There's also the Krungabin. Not Krungbin. Krungbin got one. Krungbin? Damn. Johnny Marr. Johnny Marr has one. The goat. Brad Paisley. Okay. Brad Paisley. Now we're cooking. That's cool. Now we're cooking. Wow, damn. Yeah, so maybe I actually can't get one. Did I tell you my story? I think I told the story on the podcast, but when we did the Wilco Festival, I saw Jay Mascus in a snorkel going to the, walking into the water. And it was the, we were like on the - Time to go swimming. Going in the artist's beach. And it was, I can't remember who was with me. we all just were it was unbelievable it was unbelievable he's awesome i was at the beach one of the coolest things i've ever seen one of the coolest things i've ever seen he's the he's he's awesome he's a big he's a big snail head he's the king i agree i agree yeah i met him for the first time at that fuji rock thing and then um like the first time we did that we did like that thing together and then yeah he's just a sick guy anytime i ever saw him after that i was like this is my friend and then like i ran into him on i ran into him on like my friend's family vacation oh i see you had a you had a social interaction you weren't expecting oh no i mean i was expecting it i knew he was going to be there but i uh it was he's just i've also spent some time on the beach with jim that's funny look he wasn't spending any time with me he was merely walking by but i i it was still a special thing to witness totally i could i can actually really i can really picture that for some reason there's some people in the world that i can only imagine like with a guitar in front of an amp kind of and he is one of those him doing anything else like the picture of him when he's buying the car yeah yeah i mean that that's that's one of the greatest pictures of all time like what do you do in buying a car and driving it that just feels wrong what are you gonna use that for man i just like hey how do you move through life if you're him like somebody should do all of that for you i don't yeah i don't know he's so yeah he's really sick he's really chill yeah he's very chill i can't imagine the two of you interacting but i would love to witness dude i yeah we got a vibe one of my favorite episodes of how long gone we've ever done was was jay masker well that's i didn't know that existed i'm gonna listen to that he he doesn't he doesn't know it existed either uh and it's that's the kind of why it's so great no like he doesn't really say anything until like 48 minutes into it and then he mentions that the small town that he lives in has nothing but awful restaurants and then the whole town turned on him and there There was like an article in the local newspaper.
1:03:13Jason Stewart:It was in the Boston Globe. Oh my God. Wait, you guys are stressing me out so much. Are you guys going to take some of the crazy shit out of this? You didn't say anything crazy. No, you guys said things that were crazy though. Exactly. That's on us. The thing that you told me to bleep, I'm going to bleep that. Okay. Are you upset because we have such a large global audience that we might, you know? No, it's just like hard to keep. No, no. I don't want to get in trouble. No, no. No, no. You're not going to get in trouble. No, no. We have your best interests in mind, Lindsay, of course. Don't worry.
1:03:41Yeah, we're heads.
1:03:42Jason Stewart:I swear. On my mama. Yeah, honestly, for some reason. Interest is but an effort. For some reason, I really have a deep, I really want you to, I have a real yearning for you to succeed. What if I said I feel the same way about you? I love that. Then how would you feel? I just, I really, for some reason. What if I said a sister was yearning too? Yo, but for real. No, I just, there's some, sometimes I see people, I meet someone and I'm like, you know what? they're so good i want them to win and sometimes they do and that's the chris curse the world people like you at the top yeah we need more snails at the top thank you guys and less other people that we won't name yeah i mean we but we do this for even for people who we don't like that much so imagine the care that we give you do you know how many guests we have that we don't like very much it's unbelievable you'd have to right there's got there's so many unpleasant people out there that you could that probably make like art that you could talk to you know what i mean Well, the worst is when it's somebody whose art you really like.
1:04:42And then they're a real bummer. And you're like, well, I'm still going to listen to your music or whatever. Yeah. No, I fully am like, I think it's like, you know, I think a lot of most people in the entertainment industry are bad people. And if you like their music, you like their music.
1:04:58Jason Stewart:Well, who are some of the artists that you're able to separate the artists from the art? Michael Jackson. I think he's, I actually think Michael Jackson, I think he's been freed of the charges, kind of. Kind of, yeah. I think the world has completely turned. Unfortunately, all my cancel white boys, it ain't ever going to happen. Still a little quiet for Ryan? It's a little quiet for Kozilek. You know what I mean? We got to keep him. Oh, man. There's a few. Chris is still nursing his wounds after Ariel Pink got taken down, too. Thank God. Thank God he's not one of my guys. Thank God. I mean, I love Ariel Pink's music.
1:05:33That's another thing I was going to say. That's a perfect example. It's so weird. I just never listened to it. It's weird. I never listened to it ever, really. I don't know how I missed it because I was definitely there.
1:05:43Jason Stewart:It'll be, I feel like in 50 years, it'll be how people say like Charles Manson's music was actually pretty good. Like it's going to be that kind of vibe. I know people who feel that way. I'm like, there are so much better folk music that sounds just like it. I've never explored Charles's catalog. Is it available on Tidal or Spotify or is it just kind of? I don't know. Is it? You can grab it on YouTube, but it's one of those things where you're like, I got like a couple seven seven inches i think it's pretty mid i think it's like it's better than you think it's going to be for sure a serial killer maybe i don't know totally but if you think about like what happened where they were like actually never mind like we're not going to sign you like i feel like all that could have i'll kill a bitch too like happened today just because it's like it's i get how he got where he got like with the people he got there with but like i still don't think it comes close to like anything else that was being made at that time that was like really good you So I'm like, I feel like I would drop him too.
1:06:37Cold stuff's fine. The music's just not there. I just think he's, yeah, I thought the music's a little bit mid. Well, most things are.
1:06:43Jason Stewart:You heard it here first. Manson's mid. I heard your little EP. It was all right. Charles. Charles Manson, 4.7 ass release. What do you think your pitchfork score is going to be? Dude, I'm scared about the way that everything has changed. I'm like, probably like. do you know which which writer has been assigned your album yet because i feel like that plays such a huge part but they've been they've been supportive of you in the past i i would assume totally i mean yeah i don't know i i'm i just didn't like i feel like that since snail mail last existed it's become a whole new world yeah i feel like i have no idea who's behind anything anymore and either way like they give you so they give you no insight as to how the thing with the score is gonna go and it totally could just be like a writer that's like oh i i fucking hate that girl i met her one time i was a fucking bitch yeah whatever you said on this whatever you said on this episode ain't gonna help you either probably whoever's writing it it's too late it's too late the review the album comes out tomorrow the other shit's done this shit has already been written you got the album cover tatted and you got it on a ring that part i have a necklace too that i made but it didn't i couldn't wear it today this high is this a is this a merch set like olivia rodrigo style you can get the fucking necklace no no i just make i love i love making jewelry and i also like have been working with clay a lot not defeating the allegation no no you're telling me you're throwing some you're throwing some pots on the and then putting them in the kiln are you doing one hitters bubblers what's going in the kiln no man i don't i don't know i don't i've never i haven't used like food safe clay i need to figure out how i could do but i've i've been messing with air dry clay for like uh two years and i like i've made during During almost all of the press I've done during this cycle, I've been doing it under the table.
1:08:25And I have tons and tons. I make little ashtrays for people as gifts. I made this big candelabra thing. It's crazy. And then I made this my first, for my girlfriend's birthday, I made this my first ever box. And it's a seashell, and it goes into a sand thing that it fits into. They're actually really pretty. That's cool. That's beautiful. That's cool that your relationship is so healthy that you can give a homemade gift and it doesn't get an eye roll. I got you a box, babe. Yeah, yeah, dude. But that was, I give the real gifts too. That's just a nice touch to remember. That one's from the heart and the hand.
1:08:59I feel like you're probably a good, you're willing to cop a little something for shorty. Oh, man, come on. The little cleafy, the little cleaf bracelet. The little bankly. I mean, the people that are close to us are all we have.
1:09:11Jason Stewart:Damn. So I do love to give gifts. It makes, it's, I would say, yeah, it's one of the, yeah. I do too. No, I agree. It makes me feel human. I'm glad that it's your love language. Generous assholes. Your people have told us that our time is up here on How Long Gone, but Lindsay, we can't have it go this long again. One of our favorite How Long Gone guests, the album is out today. This comes out tomorrow. The album is out today everywhere you stream. You're going to do Las Culturistas after this one? What's the next pod? I think this is the only pod I'm doing. Okay. So you got to talk to the failing Rolling Stone or something after this.
1:09:47Well, no, no, wait. I love Rolling Stone. I'm kidding. I'm kidding. I'm joking. No. We're doing like, I'm like, what even is after this? What even is after? Consequence.net. Okay. I think it's the fader. I think I'm doing the fader after this. Okay. Old school. All right. Yeah. Thank you for listening. Go stream. Go purchase the vinyl. Go get the tickets. Go do it all. Snail mail in stores now, baby. We love to see it. Thank you for joining us. And we'll see you all. We're going to come catch a show. We're going to come build. Okay, hit me up. I'll bring you a Red Bull 12-pack backstage. This flavor, this flavor.
1:10:23Full sugar. What flavor is that? Blue? Iced vanilla berry. What flavor is the vape?
1:10:29Jason Stewart:Just chronic? Strawberry. I don't even want to know what your insides are going through right now. All right, snail mail. Oh, dude, I'm fine. All right. Okay, we love you, Lindsay. Thank you. Good to see you. Love you guys. All right, good to see you. Wait, guys, guys. Yes. Is it done now? It's done.
1:10:58Oh God, thank you.
From the publisher
Listener favorite Lindsey Jordan, aka Snail Mail, returns to How Long Gone. Her new album, Ricochet, is out now.
We chat with her from the Matador offices about Matthew Williams to Oakley, the end of Taix, how she’s been outfitting her new home, the dark secret of her neck of the woods, string arrangements, trans guitars, how she handles the popular girls of Los Angeles, and how it’s been five years since her last record, and a whole new world of music out there.
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