How To Build a Loyal Community on Instagram

0:00And I think people can tell when a small business owner or anyone on social media is tired, you know, and it feels like they're just going for the sake of going and I won't do that. Hi, I'm Shuang Esther Shan, and you're listening to Shopify Masters, your companion for launching and growing your business. So to build up a loyal community, you have to immerse yourself within the network of potential customers. For Ali Osterholtz, she's been able to connect to tens and thousands of artists with her business, Explorer Knits. It's a line of naturally hand-dyed yarn and fibers known for its unique colorways and limited drops that are sold out each month.

0:42Explore Knits also connects to knitters and nature lovers by donating a portion of profits to the National Park Foundation. Allie is joining me today to chat all about her customer acquisition strategies and how she's created a successful give-back model. Allie, welcome to the show. Thank you. Thank you. I'm really happy to be here. I mean, I think for any sort of craft, especially knitting, the first step is going to your local craft store, buying some supplies and testing things out. But for you, you actually found a path to creating your own yarn and fibers. How did that even happen? You know, I honestly kind of just stumbled into it by accident.

1:27I didn't really know this world existed until about eight years ago. And, you know, I was like you described, I went to my local craft store, bought a bunch of yarn, and I used to sell knitwear, actually. And that was that was the world I knew. I didn't know that there was this possibility where I could be creating something myself and working and playing with color on wool instead of with yarn that's already created and honestly it just it actually came to me as a Christmas gift um the some bare wool and a stock pot literally imagine just a giant vat for making soup I just played around with it and and fell in love with it completely um having that creative control over I guess in a step in reverse for yarn and in making and creating has just been really cool and a really cool slow fashion thing that I've fallen in love with.

2:23So, yeah.

2:29So it sounds like initially you were taking orders for knitting different pieces for customers and then you do this pivot to actually making the yarn and testing out with colors. And that's what kind of all of the community of artists really fell in love with. How did you go about turning that into a business? Yeah, honestly, I hope my advisor's not listening, but I started this business while I was in grad school. And if you've been before, a lot of people I'm sure can relate. There's not always a lot of money to be had during that time of life. And so I started the business, you know, as a creative outlet and something just for fun.

3:09I needed something that was outside of that science brain and feeding my creative needs, you know, and I was selling knitwear and I was doing well. And it was weird because I didn't think it would be more than, you know, my friends and family buying things for me, the occasional scarf or sweater. And I guess as I learned more about that world, I fell more in love with it and craved to be a part of it in a bigger way. And so what went from an Etsy shop where I was selling 10, 15 hats a month turned into me having a Shopify website and building my own brand and finding out what building a brand means to the best of my knowledge.

3:50And yeah, it was something where I loved it enough that I decided to leave the world of the STEM community and path to a PhD and becoming a professor in the science world. That is the path I imagined for myself my whole life. and the creative freedom was just something I was so enthralled with and couldn't get away from. And the community, for whatever reason, seems to love what we create. And so I've been very fortunate to remain here and continuing to learn. Yeah. I mean, we definitely won't tell your advisors about your thought process for becoming a full-time business owner, but for a lot of our listeners, they go to school part-time, full-time, work full-time.

4:34So tell us, how did you manage this side hustle and actually grow the business to something that's sustainable? Tried to keep myself in check for, you know, responsibilities I had already committed to, right? I wasn't going to throw away my graduate degree. I worked so hard to get there and I worked so hard while I was in it. That came first for me, right? Like the responsibilities, the things I agree to. I didn't want to lose sight of those things. I consider myself a romantic, right? And I just fell into this world of fiber and thought, oh, like, this is so cool. It's so creative. I feel so excited.

5:08But keep yourself in check and pay attention to what you were here for. But the longer I did it, and the more I worked at it, the more I felt pulled towards that in comparison to what I was already working on and felt like I'd never had a chance to take the business full time and it's people out there listening it is a terrifying thought to take that leap right you never know what's going to happen and I had been slowly working on this thing and watching it grow organically over a couple of years while I was in my master's program and just really felt like you know I'll never forgive myself if I don't do this I love it so much I'm so excited about it I will kick myself for the rest of my life if I don't see what happens

5:58if it doesn't work it's fine I have this background I have other things I can do there's other opportunities out there for me but this is I I've never felt so excited about something like this before and you know it just felt natural after after years of just thinking about what if you know? Yeah. It's that invisible pull, that intangible calling that you kind of have to answer. So was there actually a financial goal or a milestone that you wanted to reach before you were taking the business full time? I should say yes. Really, while I was doing this part-time, while I was still in school, I had that small income, right?

6:40And this was just extra and whatever. And I had been lucky enough up until the point where I decided to take the business full time that anytime we would launch something, we would sell out. And I still, to this day, do not understand how or why. And I just feel so lucky for it. It was what gave me the confidence to try. You know, it seems like people keep showing up for us, even if we are doing things on such a small scale compared to these other huge dyers in the industry. People seem to be excited about it. And I'm excited about it. Let's see what happens if we try to do a little more. Of course, I had goals, but it was more important to me to see, is this something that's actually tangible?

7:19Or have I been kidding myself, right? It seems to be going really well, but I'm doing it part time. And let's see what happens when I actually give it my all. Like really try and see if people show up. And I finished my thesis in May, moved to Colorado in June, and took the business full time and I was meeting goals within the month. And I know it's not like that for a lot of people. And there's a lot more work and stress and stuff that goes into it. And I will say I had my fair share of that, but I've been very fortunate to feel support at every stage of growth with the business so far. And that's been great.

7:56So you take Explorinits full time. Obviously, you need to build up the foundation of your own community. How did you approach social media, Instagram, and marketing? Things started to click for me once I started doing things I loved because it felt easy. It didn't feel like I was trying to convince people of something. I was genuinely as excited about it as it seemed. You know, I talked to you prior about the national parks and I started creating colorways inspired by that and all of the trips I've taken and all of, you know, the formative experiences I've had backpacking and camping and hiking and all of those things.

8:38And I think with a lot of art in any form that you have it that is presented to you, if you feel a personal connection to it, like it makes it so much easier to fall in love with. I mean, it's obvious, I guess, when I say it out loud, but people just found us because of my excitement about the national parks, my excitement about nature in general. And doing what I loved made the business a lot easier. When I started, I feel like I was so focused on creating colors that I thought people would want to see or that I was missing or whatever. And once I stopped thinking about everyone else and just thinking about what do I like?

9:22What do I want to translate from an experience I've had onto yarn? Like how do I see that working out? And if people like it, they'll show up. And if they don't, I'm still super excited about it. Because if I'm not excited about it, why am I even doing it? I guess that's just been my mindset from the start. People have asked for collections for this, that, and whatever. And I've just always done something that excites me. I won't say yes to projects unless I feel like I can genuinely put all of my heart into it and excitement into it and talk to people about it at length, you know, without feeling like I'm putting it on.

9:57I just, I can't, I'm not like that. And I never have been. And so that's always just been important. Well, I think you're a very valid customer profile, right? You are someone who loves knitting. So what you enjoy can also relate to what other people enjoy. And I do think there is a Venn diagram of knitters and crafters and nature lovers. So I think that partnership with national parks is like the perfect synergy. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So, I mean, I do believe having a connection, having stories and projects that you love really help with the business. How do you actually go about sharing that story on social media, crafting those Instagram posts to bring in the community?

10:45Yeah, I feel, at least when I started and still now as we continue to grow, I wonder, am I sharing too much? Is this what people really want to see from me? Or do I just show the color and that's it? But I, there was a period of time where I try that or I try to be more removed or less, I guess, less attached to everything I was sharing with everyone. And it's just, I can't do it. Like, it is just so natural to me to want to share a story. And hand-dyed yarn is a luxury item. It's not inexpensive. You buy a sweater's quantity is what we call like the yarn you need to make yourself a sweater from a craft store for the price of one skein that we sell.

11:27And so to me, there has to be reason behind everything I share or every time, everything I create for our customers, for them to feel like it was something that really was art that had so much put into it that it's worthy of investing in and caring about and wanting to make something with. Like the fact that people take something that I have created and put onto yarn and make something even better with it is just so surreal and so cool and makes me feel so excited that it is like this cycle of just fueling me. And so when I'm crafting a post or when I'm putting together a collection, I'm thinking all about all that for months.

12:08I think about when I want to launch a collection and what story I want to tell. I recently launched a collection inspired by a trip to Iceland. And I don't know the number of people that have been there before. My goal, I guess, in creating that, creating a collection of yarn inspired by that is that they see the yarn in it and it evokes the emotion or the feeling that I had when I was there. So I want to tell that story or where I looked at the sand on this beach in this little ice crystal and that's where I got this color and I want them to feel like they're walking through it with me and feeling that emotion and feeling that experience as I share my posts and captions and stories and everything about that.

12:59I think that advice is actually counterintuitive to a lot of social media advice you hear, ironically, on social media where it feels like it's so fast paced. People tell you to post every single day and they want you to just be casual and keep on posting. But your strategy is actually very long-term. It's very well thought out and you plan out these launches to coordinate with the stories that you've experienced. Have you given into some of this social media advice or have you changed the way that you approach marketing or social media nowadays? Not at all. not at all and of course I don't want to sound so old and jaded to the point where I I don't recognize trends and recognize what's working and what's not and of course we shift our business in that way like we start sharing reels we post our stories like we do the things that I see are important and that I feel excited about doing too it can get boring right to just only talk through photos and it's fun to express you know your business in a different way through video and all those other things, but I've never been good at taking that advice.

14:13This is the five tips that you need to follow to have the best, most successful marketing campaign, whatever. I just, I have never been that person. I've always gone with my gut. And you said like post a lot. It's surface level sometimes. And I feel like I am the exact opposite. I have no chill. If I'm showing you something, if I'm taking the time to talk about it, I am excited about it. You know, I want you to be excited about it. You're taking time to read my post and hear about my stuff. Like, let's, let's get into it. You know, I want you to know, feel my excitement. And I think it helps people feel excitement.

14:51Like, I don't want to support a business where I feel like they're just doing the thing to do the thing or to make the money. I want to support someone that I feel their heart behind it no matter what they're selling yarn or not it's it's important to me to see that love and that passion and that emotion and I may be projecting because that's how I run it but yeah yeah I mean to your point when you're just talking about the things you love in the way that you want it I feel like that's when connection happens you might not have reached every single human, but when you reach those individuals who knit, there is a real connection, which I think leads perfectly to my next question, which is you've actually not experimented much or at all with paid on social.

15:41It's all organic. It's all stories that you're telling, which is something really remarkable for businesses and also a business of your size. So I guess what are some tips you have for creating that organic content that doesn't need ad dollars behind? Don't force it, I guess, is my number one thing. I feel like there's a lot of pressure that we put on ourselves as business owners, but also that we see around each other in the industry to do more push and push and push. And I've been really good about checking myself and pushing myself to pause and do what feels right. And people have followed.

16:26I guess that's not a, there's no concrete answer, right? It's just that one of the biggest things for me, and I think a lot of people as our businesses continue to grow, they come to me with questions about how do you get people so engaged? How do you get people so excited? How do you get these likes? You know, my Instagram has gone quiet. I think it's important to be patient. And it's okay to be frustrated. It's okay to be annoyed like we all dealt with the annoyances of social media and especially running a business on social media but I think trying new things being open to trying new things and experimenting and just continue to have fun with it and your people will show up and I genuinely like that is the best advice I can give we have never you know relied on hashtags relied on real posts every day it's been we're talking about what we're excited about when we're ready for it and I've always been that way.

17:17It's when we had 5 ,000 followers, when we had 50 ,000 followers, I am still showing up in that same way. And I think people can tell when a small business owner or anyone on social media is tired, you know, and it feels like they're just going for the sake of going. And I just, I won't do that. I want to show up for myself and for my business and for my community in the best way that I can. And so, yeah. Thank you for that refreshing advice. And I think that even though counterintuitive. I feel like that's sometimes needed to get a hold of your own identity on social media. I like to take a moment to thank our listeners for tuning into the show.

17:58Wherever you're getting your podcasts, be sure to give Shopify Masters a follow and leave us a review so others can discover the show as well. Thank you so much. So yes, we talked a lot about also So the Venn diagram overlap of knitters and nature lovers and how Explore Knits has this built-in give back program, donating a portion of profits to the National Parks Foundation. Talk to us about how you were able to build a business model having a social impact and also profitable. It was funny. I was talking to my team the other day about a business opportunity where I'd go speak on how we got to where we were and tips and tricks and all those things and how I felt unqualified because I feel that I am really good at making unconventional business choices and going with my gut and following my intuition before looking at the numbers.

19:02And while that sounds risky and crazy and all of those things, I have always felt, I didn't necessarily grow up rich and didn't grow up with a lot you know we didn't grow up with a lot of money and so having money even if it's within a business has always felt odd and weird and and from the beginning when I was making a very small amounts of money um doing this part time I felt like I should be doing something with this I want to help in some way um what what matters to me. I've never had the means to do something in this way. I volunteer. I do all this other service stuff, but I've not had the financial means before to help or make a difference in that way.

19:47And with the national parks, since I started dyeing yarn, I've been donating every year to that foundation because I felt that I owe them so much. They are the reason the business took off. I've been to so many and backpack through so many and and I felt like it's changed who I am as a person because of those experiences out in the mountains and um they're like your muse in a way oh completely completely I just feel so at home when I'm there and I think a lot of people resonated with that when I when I started talking about donating money to the National Parks Foundation and so So over the years that the business has continued to grow, I have made sure that that grows with it and that we are continuing to make the impact that I hope to have and to try and truly make a difference in that way.

20:40And so we, for the first time, we just finished a three-year pledge to the foundation, which I never in a million years thought we would be able to do, and donating to a program called Park Ventures, which was created to kind of support a bunch of projects all over the U.S. that are focusing on representation and accessibility and equity and removing barriers to communities that haven't always had access to the national parks. And that is just something that's so important to me because those experiences have been so formative for me that I feel like everyone deserves to experience that. And if I can help in the tiniest way to contribute to that because of a yarn dyeing company, like, let's do it.

21:27Let's do it. Like, let's help. It feels really special and feels like I'm taking, you know, this creative business that's selling a product to another level that means more to me and is more impactful to me. It's never really been about making the money for me. It's like that I get to do this for a living. I get to create art for a living and help, you know, a foundation that's wanting to help people get to experience the outdoors. Like it just feels surreal. Like I've just stumbled into this magical life. I bet it's even more magical seeing someone use one of your yarns, create a piece, go to the national park and share a photo from that.

22:07I just bet that that's such a cool thing to see. Yes, it is so surreal. Like just one of my favorite things. It's what keeps me excited. You know, because we're selling a product. We're dyeing a lot of the same thing every day for months. And then I see that I see someone enjoying the outdoors with our yarn in a sweater they made with our yarn. It's just like, what is going on? What is happening? This is so cool. And it's so special. Yeah, yeah. A lot of our listeners might be in the same shoes. They might be a creative, never started a business before. What's your advice for getting comfortable and up to speed with the finance side of things.

22:50Be patient with yourself. It all comes, not naturally, I would say, but you will figure it out. It's not that deep, right? Like it is something that you can Google. It is something that you can, you know, take a couple hours of your time and figure out the bare bones of what you need to get started. Like don't let it be what scares you off and don't let it be what stops you from creating something that could be incredible. It is, of course, intimidating, especially like you said, I had no experience. I had a science background, which is basically useless in in running a business and, you know, lean on other people for help.

23:31There are so many you will find other people in your industry that you can trust and that you can talk to. And and I think what you'll find very quickly is that no one knows what they're doing.

23:44like no one has the perfect answer to everything and we're all just figuring it out you know there's there are people that can help you get to where you need to go and a lot of people are willing more willing to help than we realize i think

24:05asking for help and yeah figuring out some of that business stuff i think the other side to figure out is logistics, because I think you have so many different colorways, different drops, skews, and you have to understand when something needs to be replenished, when something needs to be created. How do you make sure, what are some tools or softwares you've used to make that side of the business a bit easier for yourself? Spreadsheets forever. I live on Google Sheets. I make a million lists. We have over time created so many systems and tweaked so many systems as we grow that have made things easier, right?

24:51It's hard because I think of past me and how overwhelmed I was feeling this pressure that everything had to be perfect and set up and, you know, pristine before I started. And it's just, that's just not realistic. You have to start working at something and realize what tools you need as you go that would make it easier for the next time. Like we launched collections, right? And they're three month periods. And we learn something new every time that would have helped us do better. And then we change it. I will make a million lists. I keep track of things. I set myself a million reminders. I have a team that helps me keep track of stuff.

25:27I delegate. If you have the opportunity to have someone on your team, learn how to, like you said, ask for help, take on what you need to and give the other work that is less important to others that could help take that off your shoulders. And another big part about Explorinits is the fact that it's limited drop and people really tune into the website when you do decide to have these drops. What advice do you have for founders who want to run their business maybe in this model? Prepare yourself for some angry people. No, no. For me, it was such an obvious choice. And when you start a business, obviously, there has to be some attention on making money, right?

26:17You have to keep being able to do this. And I think the limited drops, the limited release, it adds this exclusivity and this excitement and all that around that that has just happened naturally. But I think it's a thing that I would advise to a lot of other business owners, you know, make it curated. People want something that is special and unique, and it's not always going to be there. And for my sake, I never did that as an intention to keep people from being able to access our product. It's just, I am an artist, first and foremost. And I don't want to lose myself necessarily to the business side of things.

26:54And in reality, I want to do limited drops. I want to keep creating new things. I don't want to do the same thing forever. And I know myself and I know I will get bored with that. And so it helps me continue to feel excited about my business. And also I think shows people the passion and excitement behind it. You're not just putting things out there to put it out there. This is a collection I've thought about and I picked these pieces or this product or whatever just for this moment. Right. And I want to talk to you about this moment and spend energy on this. And I think it helps the creative or the business owner have more sanity over it.

27:31It's less overwhelming to me, right? I only, I put this energy in every few months. It's so hard to continue to stay excited if you have to do it all the time. And so, you know, putting all that energy effort in is great. It's exhausting, but then it happens. And then now you have a few months where you can work on this thing that you put so much effort into and then move on to the next exciting thing.