How To Turn TikTok Videos Into Big Sales

0:00If you're going to start something off as a hobby, you really have nothing to lose after. You have to just look at it as you're starting this from like actual passion and actual love and desire. Hello and welcome to Shopify Masters, your companion for starting and building a business. I'm Shuang Esther Shan. Many of us picked up a new hobby during the lockdowns of COVID-19. For Jacob Winter, he discovered that he wasn't only good at making tuft rugs, but people loved watching him create his designs on TikTok. So what started out as a viral obsession with rug making has turned into a full-blown business called Mush Studios.

0:42Jacob and his team at Mush Studios are challenging conventional designs by creating playful rugs in fluid abstract shapes. The results are standout pieces of decor that's easily recognizable as a mush rug. Since launching in 2020, Mush Studios have collaborated with luxury retailers like Essence and brands like Frankie's Bikinis. Jacob is here to share how the team transitioned their viral success to sales, built partnership with major brands, and scaled their production. Jacob, welcome to the show. Thank you so much for having me. Thanks for being here. So I don't think I was going to start off a show like this, but we have to go back to the lockdowns of COVID where all of us had some sort of new hobby.

1:29And for you, it was tufting rugs. When did you realize that this hobby was something that you wanted to build a business around? So I was going to college in Manhattan. I'm from Long Island, not too far away. So once we were kind of kicked out because of COVID, I was at home just graduating, extremely bored and nervous. So I decided to figure out what type of therapeutic hobby I could have that kind of gets all of my creative juices out. I took weeks and weeks to just like study the art of rug making because there's so many ways to do it. I would say the most popular one right now is tufting, which is the process that I would go through.

2:17It looks like a weird laser gun almost style. And once I kind of committed to ordering every single thing possible to create a rug, which is many, many things. I'm the type of person that's, if I'm going to do something, I need to do it to the extreme. So once I saved all of my dollars and pennies, I ordered all of the belongings, I practiced, I figured it out. I would say it took over two weeks just to not make a rip and a hole in the cloth to make a rug, which is like the most confusing part. I definitely was buying the wrong materials at the time, so it definitely makes sense now. Looking back at it, I was obsessed with the form of rug making I decided to document it not for other people necessarily but more so for myself I love a good evolution of anything just seeing like how you start and then looking back at it within a year or two once I made the video I was like I'm gonna post it on TikTok it'll also be like some form of hobby as well of editing it and creating some type of just like vibe, ASMR feel of just every step, but in less than 30 seconds, which is the type of videos I like.

3:43Once I posted it, it did honestly really, really great. The feedback was amazing. I don't necessarily think it was because of me, but more so because the form of rug making was so new at the time that everyone was just like, what is this guy doing in this garage on Long Island? Like, It basically was making like a painting, but with yarn, but a huge machine gun, like tattooing into the fabric. Once I saw that people were actually interested, it obviously got me super excited. So I was like, okay, onto the next project. I need to see what else I can do, see what else I can create. Kind of just like play with all fields of just like aesthetics with rug making.

4:26So I decided to just continually make videos. and thankfully just within that first year we like generated 23 million views so I was creating maybe just like things that my friends were telling me I think I made like a few baby shower rugs from my cousins and my friends so not necessarily my style but I started pushing out designs that I truly believed in that I would want in my house and just like it was just 100 % me and when I did that and people were responding great to it, just like anything that has supply and demand, you can make something out of it. So we thought it would be a great time to just take things more serious.

5:10I love it. I think what's so interesting when you mention about the early days when you were making these carpets, it was more like what friends wanted. So maybe someone would be like, oh, make a shape of a pizza, make a shape of sneakers. but your style is so unique and to your point when someone looks at a rug from mush they will know that this is a mush rug so can you describe what your aesthetic is with mush because i feel like it's something that our listeners haven't seen before yeah so when we were first starting before we kind of did a huge rebrand. We were releasing rugs on a drop basis.

5:54And within those drops, there was, I would say like 10 to 15 different styles of rugs, but all had relatively the same energy and the same feel, but colors would be different. The shapes would be different, but there would still be this organic energy to each rug. And right off the bat, instead of saying, would you want rug number blank or if there's a title that was kind of crazy we just kind of label them all as just a mush rug kind of giving that like adjective of mush and that feel and that sensory element of what mush could be just within any rug that we have because I do love when people kind of group an entire like aesthetic to a word or to a brand I think it's like a very powerful tool to be able to strive for.

6:48So when we were really trying to do that, we also were only putting out designs and colorways that we personally would want. We felt like we were missing this like otherworldly, very like unconventional, not that serious type of of aesthetic within rugs. I would say since rugs have been so traditional and so cultural, which we totally respect, there are also a lot of people that really just wanted just something that they've never seen before. At that time, I don't think I've ever seen a wobbly rug. I would say wobbly rugs are probably a lot more popular now, just with everyone kind of really liking that aesthetic as a whole for home decor.

7:37We saw definitely like a huge open field and just a lot to play around with when it came to this wobbly aesthetic and this amorphic amoeba-like energy that you can have just from a rug. So when we were figuring out our rebrand, we kind of were just like really keen on just describing ourselves as otherworldly comfort. We want to take something that's so traditional, let's say like a rectangular rug, and then making it otherworldly by having a droopy spill on top of it that you kind of would do as a child. That's one of our rugs now, which is called the oops rug, which kind of translates to like, oops, I spilled a glass of fruit punch on my rug.

8:26Understanding that you don't, you obviously don't want to come out with something that is too different from who you are. I don't think we would ever come out with a traditional rectangular rug and call it a day. We understand that people come to us for something that's a little bit more exciting or a little bit out of the box that we strive for. We want that. So we're just going to continuously push for that and just make everything as otherworldly as possible. You're challenging the conventions of like what a rug would be. So for our listeners, mush rugs, you'll never see them in rectangular or like conventional circular shapes.

9:05And I think that changing the aesthetic and having a unique identity with your designs, and it really helped you to transition out of being just a quote unquote TikTok business. What other business decisions have you made that allowed you to move away from TikTok content and be a standalone business? That's a really great question because at that time, it was something that my partner and I were really trying to figure out how to kind of step away from a singular platform like TikTok. And at that time, if you were extremely associated with the social media app, then you're considered more of a DIY, almost like fast fashion-y, like company association with it.

9:53So we realized that once we were outsourcing our rugs, we thought it'd be the best idea to kind of showcase how we were going to be as a brand, what we were going to do as a brand, how we were going to operate, what are like our day-to-day work life is as Mush Studios, instead of showcasing how to create one of our rugs or how to do what we do. So once we kind of made that decision, it definitely brought in new people. It brought in people that were actually just interested within the aesthetic and were interested in the product rather than the process of making the product. And then we obviously really focused on other apps like Instagram.

10:38It was definitely challenging. It took quite a bit of time. We also used that opportunity to ask our audience where they found us to see if what we were doing was working. And slowly we were recognizing that people were noticing us from either different articles that were coming out from like Architectural Digest or Clever. And then also noticing that the majority of people were following us from Instagram and found us through Instagram, which was more so what our rugs look like in a home. If you got our rugs, what is the aesthetic that we're achieving for? I guess the next step is, you know, initially the orders you had friends, family, maybe viewers from TikTok that noticed your content that had one-on-one orders.

11:26How did you then transition to build out your own online store and start fulfilling those orders. Once we decided to kind of step away from creating logos for friends, creating baby shower gifts or birthday gifts from friends, we first just started working on our first drop and what our first collection of rugs would look like. Once we were kind of showcasing them a little bit here and there on TikTok on how they were made, we were kind of getting the feedback of what was working and what wasn't working. So we weren't wasting any time or any money or resources with making any, I guess, quote unquote, unnecessary designs.

12:08So once we were doing that, we then focused just all of our energy onto that, all of our energy on showcasing on TikTok, showcasing on Instagram, and then simultaneously making a Shopify account and figuring out how it's gonna look because we were very focused on customization. So once we figured that all out, it kind of worked perfectly to release the website on my birthday in 2020. So we released it on my birthday and we had our first drop. We had nothing to lose if we felt like our new designs weren't going to be as extreme as we thought they may have been. We were okay with that. But at the end of the day, it was really fun to just create the entire vision of what Mush Studios is going to be and how it's going to start.

13:04And then once we launched, we saw great feedback. We saw that people were extremely interested. So we just kind of just focused all of our energy onto that and sadly had to say goodbye to birthday gifts. The birthday gift that you ended up having is a business that you crafted yourself. And I understand, you know, making all of the rugs yourself was extremely time consuming and it was not something that was sustainable when you had your site up and also mush became a full blown business. So tell us a little bit about how you went about looking for the right partners and also the right materials when you're outsourcing the production.

13:44Yeah, so Frankie, my business partner and I were literally breaking our backs making these rugs. We were obviously extremely grateful for it. But there is a time where we thought it would be worth putting our energy into expanding the company and creating new partnerships with wholesalers or just with really cool people that we want to work with. So pretty early on, I would say just a few months after we launched in 2020, we were researching and looking into every major country that has had a history of rug making. There are a lot, but I kind of just chose the top four, which were Turkey, India, China and Morocco.

14:31we took months upon months of just connecting and chatting and seeing what they were looking for as a partner what we were looking for we did multiple rounds of samples and we ended up with an amazing facility in India in the rug making capital of Badohi so it kind of worked out great Once we got that perfect partner, we were able to really create on a whole new scale because at that time we were really binded by just creating a tufted rug. We weren't able to make anything with new materials or new textures or just switching out the technique to a woven material. So it was the best decision we've ever made.

15:21It definitely took a lot of time, definitely took a lot of money and hours of our time because it's different time zones. But once we did that, it was amazing. I think anyone hearing this process, they might feel really intimidated because there might be time zone differences, language barriers. There's taxes, duties, logistics when it comes to working with someone who is abroad. How did you tackle that mentally as well? Because it was such a large feat while you still had to make carpets and run a business and figure out this next stage. Frankie and I kind of split up the tasks when we were searching for a new producer.

16:03We knew that one person couldn't just take it all on. So while I may have been figuring out how forwarding from India to New York works or how I'm going to understand all these new techniques to making rugs, because at that time was a really crucial part of just learning from them rather than figuring out all the legal works here. So it was, it was more so let's figure out how we can even get a rug produced. How can we get this product made? That was like kind of my first step. And then once that was kind of formulated and figured out between the two, we then worked on figuring out how to get an accountant that can help us, how we can know the laws when it comes to importing even just the material of cotton or wool or the custom rates of India versus China.

17:03It definitely is a lot. It can be extremely overwhelming, but I took one thing at a time. I thankfully had a brother that owns a business and I did learn a little bit of it in school, nothing crazy, but I definitely didn't allow that to overwhelm me with the stressful parts of operating a business when And things are being made outside of your country. I knew that there was no deadline for me. If it took an extra two months for me to make sure that the forwarding process of these rugs were legal and accurate and correct, then I took that time and made it work. I like that because it sounds like you were taking it one step at a time and approaching it very logically, which I think mirrors how you actually started this whole thing.

17:53Because you mentioned it was a hobby. You saved up all the money that you've earned. And then it was very approachable steps. It wasn't like step one. You wanted a giant exporting, importing partner. So yeah, share a little bit about just how step by step you funded the hobby turned business. Yeah, so I definitely was working a part time job as a full time student in the city. So I would say every dollar was going to just everyday needs there. So once I had to go back home for COVID, my little brother was stuck with online schooling. He is in special education, so he needed a little bit more time and a little bit more attention with each class that he wasn't able to receive from his teachers, which is understandable.

18:45The teachers were just as overwhelmed as everyone else, I'd say even more. My mom was a full-time nurse, so during the day she was binded to go into work and be a nurse, so I kind of helped her. I wouldn't take too much money from her, but she would reward me with just a little bit of cash for being my little brother's tutor and making sure that he wasn't being pushed behind. So honestly, every dollar from tutoring him, I just put into just buying the resources for the tufting gun and for the fabric and the yarn and the board, because it definitely is a lot of money. definitely took many weeks to save up for it.

19:29And then honestly, after every rug sale that I received after that, I put straight into the business. I don't think I ever took a dollar at that time and bought something for myself because it really wasn't that much money. I don't even think I understood the process of making margins to make a profit. I was basically just making things and selling it because I was at that time still selling to my friends and my family to just say that I could make products. So once I was really making logos and kind of customizable pieces for people I may not have known through the internet and through TikTok, I just saved a portion of that for the next drop.

20:16Always figured out how to save money from that drop, like showcasing certain designs beforehand, making sure it worked for people. Once it just gradually grew and increased and I understood how to maybe save more money in certain aspects of the business, it helped us redirect that money into expanding to a studio for us to make our own rugs, expanding to maybe hire a friend that could help us back the rugs. And I would say that really was the biggest factor. And then I would say now, since we're a lot larger of a scale, Shopify capital actually helps a lot, which is crazy. We have done it a few times.

21:00If no one really knows about it, it's basically you ask for a certain amount of money or they give you a few options to choose from. There's a small fee like attached to it and then for each sale that you have you kind of give the percentage back to it's either 14 or like 15 i think my first time was at like 10 because it was a super small amount but that all gave us a huge jump into purchasing like a big bulk of rugs from our producers we had to respect their minimums that they had so there were times where we didn't feel like certain colors or sizes were going to meet that. So we had to put a lot of money all at once for those for those goods.

21:46But it was definitely worth it. And since that each each thing just makes you grow bigger and bigger. It's hard to see that once you put money into something, typically more money will come back. So good to hear about your experience with Shopify Capital. And to your point, you've really sustained the growth in a very manageable way and you were only reaching for that next chapter when you're ready for it. And very excited to chat about the other aspects of your business. I'm joined with Jacob Winter, the co-founder of Mush Studios. I hope you're enjoying our conversation. And if you haven't already, subscribe or follow Shopify Masters wherever you get your podcasts and leave us a review or feedback for the show.

22:30Thanks. So the other aspect of the business that I'm so excited to dig into is the fact that your branding and all the visual elements is so unique. So can you talk to us about how you make sure every aspect from branding to visual elements is so cohesive and it stays true to the identity that you build for mush well thank you for that compliment i appreciate that i actually went to school for marketing with a focus on branding so i had some great professors that were able to teach me what's important and what's key with starting a company and branding yourself but also branding your products what was a little different for starting mush compared to let's say like a project that i would have to do with school was it really was focused on Frankie and I, our lives, our personal lifestyles, what we thought was important within our culture and our interests.

23:30It was extremely easy doing it that way. We weren't working for another brand or another company. So every part of the brand down to the branding on the logo on the handwoven tag to the thank you cards to just the invoice sheets we have full control over it we were able to do whatever we wanted with it like what would i have wanted if i purchased this rug i think that this otherworldly aesthetic that we push out is something that's so new and so rare to find at times that I needed to ensure that that was implemented in every aspect of the company. One key thing that I think about now that we are a little bit more established than we were a few years ago is that the company needs to evolve.

24:29The brand needs to be elevated very, very fast, I would say, in the beginning, because it's not like we had an investor that could create 10 assets that we needed for the first three years. So we understood what we were going to be putting out most likely was going to change at a very fast pace, which is representative of who we are. And especially during a time of COVID, the lifestyle that we had was so different. It was changing every single day. We grew and we We made sure that the brand grew with that to continuously be elevated. And we had a specific customer in mind as well. So if we took ourselves out of that, who would we be in 10 years?

25:14Who do I want to be in 10 years? Let me try to make sure that that customer is going to be interested in every single part of the brand. And I think a part of that growth is your ability to also partner with a lot of retailers like Essence and also other brands. So talk to us a little bit about selecting the right brands to partner with to make sure that those collabs are beneficial for both parties. I'm a strong believer in manifestation.

25:45So when we first started, Frankie was very keen on making sure that we have our goals as a brand listed. who do we want to be associated with what brands would we want to collaborate with and what retailers would we want to share our essence with so we had key retailers and key people that we definitely want to be associated with it was people that we looked up to our childhood it was brands that we would shop at or i would say for essence um be inspired to shop at so So once we really nailed down our branding, we rebranded in 2022. That was like our tipping point of once this is done, we are going to reach out to our dream retailers.

26:35There's no excuses. There's no holding us back. So we kind of just put ourselves out there. Thankfully for Essence, they actually reached out to us. So during a time where we were fighting for Essence to want to acknowledge us, by coincidence, they did it on their own. We didn't have to reach out to them. I think the universe works in very special ways when it comes to stuff like that. But for any other retailer, we have to make sure that we're aligned visually, how we view home decor and how we view how special it is to create an atmosphere that's yours. And another key point was ensuring that brands or retailers were very interested in investing with their partners.

27:28Since we were such a young brand, such a new company, they obviously are going to be taking risks. So once we did know and feel confident that these retailers will fight and will help and will invest into your brand. Our first collaboration, we were actually reached out from an interior designer based in LA. It was our first ever email from an interior designer too. so we were extremely excited about it. Luckily, it was for a swimwear company called Frankie's Bikinis and it was for two pop-ups. It was one at Fred Siegel and one at Bluestone Lane in Montauk. I was extremely excited about both, specifically about the Bluestone Lane in Montauk because that's where I'm from.

28:21So it was kind of full circle.

28:26and at that time we were also making the rugs ourselves so we had to to invest a lot of our time into ensuring that the material and just the sizing that they wanted was doable and the best of the ability one key thing i have found out is once you have a partnership it's important to just keep that partnership. There's always more projects that are to come or they tell someone else about you or a interior design firm sees your work that they published. There's just so many people that are intertwined that you just don't even know the capacity to it. So I would say, of course, just keep that partnership as long as you can.

29:17Show your excitement, show your investment within the product. They're typically a lot of work because you have to do something that's very exclusive, but that's kind of the most exciting part. So it kind of gives you that leeway of experimenting and trying new designs that can be maybe a foundation for your brand so early on. Amazing. And I think for yourself, it was a very weird time to even consider entering into business. And there's almost like some parallels to the current environment because people are concerned about inflation, recession. So would you have any advice for people who might have ideas, but they're a little bit intimidated in starting whichever passion or pursuing whichever endeavor that they want to do?

30:13At that time, I was definitely joining a hobby and starting a business at a really scary time when things were shut down and nothing was open and communication was at such an extreme. And I would say if you're going to start something off as a hobby, you really have nothing to lose after. You have to just look at it as you're starting this from actual passion and actual love and desire. So let's say you don't have your goals met by that year or whatever time frame you're giving yourself, just understand that it is a hobby. It is a passion. It is some form of artistry that you want to put out there and things just might take time.

31:00I could beat myself up for making things take longer than expected. But I ultimately knew that the universe already gave me this opportunity to just showcase my hobby right away. Everything was just a gain following from that no matter what. I wasn't too hard on myself with these goals. I wasn't too focused on money or numbers or how many people have my rugs. I was just generally just focused on the artistry of making rugs. And I know that there has been many exciting showrooms, retail stores, and also homes that you've seen mush pieces in. Are there any new places we can expect to see mush rugs in?