Want to Patent Your Product?

0:00I realized everything about building a product is collaborative. It's not just you saying, here, take this, do it. It's like, no, you need to be in it with them. Hey, how's it going? I'm Shuang Esther Shan, and welcome to Shopify Masters, your companion for starting and scaling a business. Picture this, a college student walking the streets of Charleston, heels in hand, tired of picking between comfort or style. Instead of accepting this as reality, Cassidy Kalk decided to fix it. She spent nearly three years teaching herself shoemaking online before creating her own patenting shoe that would fold and be tucked away.

0:44She launched her brand Kindred Label in 2022, proving that the best business ideas start with a personal problem and a healthy dose of stubbornness. Cassidy, welcome to the show. Thank you so much for having me. So, so excited to hear all about your story because I love it when a business idea comes out of a personal need. And I feel like the solution you found was not only fashionable, but there was a lot of engineering that went into it. So tell us about all the things behind the scenes that went into the first prototype that you were happy with. Yeah. So honestly, the idea came out of necessity, kind of like you're saying.

1:31And it really came about by me wearing heels and wanting a better alternative, especially when my feet started to hurt. And so everything on the market was kind of throwaway. It was pretty cheap, just not something that was, in my opinion, fashionable to wear. And so I kind of had that aha moment of, you know what, I think I can make something that is higher quality, more luxe, and more sustainable. So that kind of bled into my first sample that I made. And so the idea behind it was everything on the market folded more on a seam. So the sole itself just kind of folded in half. And that's what kind of made it very cheap.

2:10And so I was like, oh, you know, what if I put something metal inside the shoes, cut them open, and they could fold on this metal hinge. And so that kind of propelled me into my first prototype. I ordered a pair of sandals off Amazon and I just started song away at them with a bread knife. Looking back, very dangerous. I do not recommend. But from there, I went to Michael's, I got different craft materials, and I just started building this first prototype and just to kind of give a visualization of like the first idea that I had.

2:47And I think when someone notices a problem, they might attempt to create something and maybe they give up along the way, but you were so dedicated. You spent hours on YouTube University and you actually really was hands-on with that. So I guess like how crucial was it for you to actually understand the technical knowledge behind behind making this prototype possible? I will say that was one of the most important things to building Kindred. I had zero knowledge of the shoe industry. I had a, just a degree in business, so it was nothing design based, nothing like that. And so when I had the idea for a shoe, I'm very big on DIY, hands-on building things, learning new skills.

3:35And so for me, I was like, shoes. Well, okay, it's fashion. Maybe I can kind of get into it. Little did I know that shoes are a more difficult craft to get into, but I really leaned in heavy to YouTube. There is so many, so many resources online, whether it was Reddit forums, different leather forums, but I really learned how to cobble and make shoes from YouTube, which is kind of crazy to look back can think. But being hands-on with the product, in my opinion, was the most crucial part of this because had I not been making samples myself, there's no way I could have translated the engineering side of our concept to the manufacturing side.

4:23And what was it like being someone with a business background, but you were self-taught, you still had the knowledge of how shoemaking was working. How was that process speaking to manufacturers and getting your ideas across? I will say that something that's super important, which I will say we didn't do in the beginning, is going to the factory with a very clear vision of what you want. So when we first started, I had made that really just simple prototype, cutting up the shoe, putting metal rods in. And our very first introduction to manufacturing was we sent off the shoe to a manufacturer in China.

5:04And this is when, again, we were still trying to figure out the concept, but we wanted to get a little bit more knowledge about manufacturing. And so I sent them the prototype and they sent back the exact shoe. Horrible. I mean, it did not work. It was terrible. And that was our first introduction of, okay, you need to be pretty solid in what you want to manufacture. But it's also important to know too, that finding a manufacturer who's willing to develop with you and kind of get dirty in the process is the best manufacturing partner for you. In the beginning, we had interviewed about five different factories.

5:41For some of them, the concept was a little too, it was a little too out there in the beginning. You know, they weren't maybe didn't have the resources to help develop, but then we did find one smaller family-owned factory in Portugal. And we ended up going with him because he absolutely loved the challenge. He was like, I get the product, I get the concept, and I'm willing to help you take your engineer prototype and turn it into an actual functioning shoe. So that was really important to find that partner. And I think that's amazing, right? Because you're also learning about those manufacturing relationships as you are chatting with different partners.

6:19And I think it's cool that you found someone who's not only able to just produce, but they were also willing to innovate alongside with you. 100%. And I won't lie, it was a very intimidating process. I mean, I had never had any sort of experience with factories, let alone building a product. So that whole beginning stage was very nerve wracking. But you just have to really believe in the product you're making and you will find that right partner along the way. It might take some time, but you will find them. Yeah. And I think going through that iterative process, the production process, did that also help you to understand the importance of getting your design patent and also going through that process as well?

7:04Yeah, a hundred percent. I mean, one thing that you should always do when talking to factories or even just, it could be consultants, people that you're trying to gain more knowledge from is I would say, number one, like an NDA. So you want to protect yourself a little bit on the front end when you're just talking about your idea. But something we did pretty early on before we even went to a manufacturer was work on patents. So I would say about a year in, we had kind of talked to different consultants. I had the ideas in my head of what I wanted the mechanism to be for the fold. And from there, we kind of pivoted.

7:40We realized this is more of an engineering problem, not as much of a shoe problem, figuring out this folding mechanism. And so we started working with an engineering company. When we were getting pretty solid with our ideas and where we wanted this mechanism to go, we started to explore patents. And I will say that is such an important key to building a unique product. You could have the best idea in the world, but if people then go and rip it off, the one thing you can do on the front end is try to protect yourself. And so we ended up getting three patents on the shoe. I'll say each one took about two years to get.

8:15Wow. You go through this whole process. It's, you have your provisional patent where it kind of gives you some time to make changes to the mechanism or whatever your product is and resubmit those. And then once you're like, okay, this is it, you then submit it and it goes into all of these kind of checks with different patents and everything. And then you have to argue, Why is your patent different than other patents out there? So it's a long process, but it's one that I would say is completely worth it.

8:48Was it a hard decision to think about because it is a time investment, like you mentioned, it took over two years. It's also a financial investment. And for a lot of new founders, they might be really intimidated by the idea of just like contemplating that process. I will say, like most of building my business, ignorance is bliss. I really did not know how much time would go into it. We did know up front when the investment would be. And I'll say each patent's about$10 ,000. So I'll tell you right there. It's really important to get a good patent attorney, though, because someone that it's like patents are a whole nother language.

9:26It is this crazy like riddle of words. So you do want to have someone that is very good at writing these patents. I will say if it's a product that you're developing that you think is unique and you think you can grow it into something bigger, I would say it's worth the investment on the front end. Because once you don't have that, something comes out later, you'll wish you had it. Because Kindred is so special in its design, the patents were so crucial. As you mentioned, they cost$10 ,000 each. So that's a hefty financial investment. How were you able to fund that and also manage the different responsibilities of having different jobs in order to pursue this idea?

10:14Yeah. So since having the idea, I've always kind of worked while building Kindred. So that was something that, again, when I started, I had no idea how long it would take to develop a product. In my head, being naive, I thought, oh, maybe a year, maybe a year and a half, we'll be up and running. For us, it took a lot longer. It actually took four years. And we were developing right in during COVID time. Everything was slow. You couldn't travel. Everything was over Zoom. So that slowed down the process a lot. But during that, I just, I mean, I always kept working. So I was, whatever I was making, I was funneling it back into the business.

10:52I was doing things from even serving. then COVID hit and I started working with a local startup here in Charleston. So I was really deep into that. From there, always picking up, and I continue to this day, always picking up little side jobs here and there to kind of keep me going, keep the business going. And I also think it's important to always be kind of plugging yourself into other startups so you can see what they're doing, kind of take and choose what they're doing that works for them and maybe how you want to implement that in your own business. Yeah, love it. So you're not only being able to have different jobs, have the funds to invest in our business idea, but you're also learning from the startups as well.

11:31Any advice there when you are balancing different responsibilities while you're still trying to build a business? I mean, it was a lot of long nights, a lot of focus. I would find myself, which I do not recommend for everyone, but I did find myself working through the night a lot, especially during COVID. I mean, you weren't leaving your house. There wasn't much to do. So I just really dove like straight deep into building my business. And a lot of those nights were sleepless nights, building prototypes, learning how to build shoes, sitting there like in my living room at my like table, like my dining room table and just building shoes.

12:13And so the balance is hard. I will not say I've mastered it just yet, but it's finding that kind of balance between really diving into it, but also finding different releases throughout your life. So whether that's working out, reading, hanging out with friends, you can grind and grind and grind, but you just need to make sure that you don't burn out too quick. And that's a position that, I mean, I've almost found myself a few times being like, oh no, did I reach that burnout? And it's like, okay, take a step back, take a deep breath, and just, again, find those other releases in your life where then you can kind of recenter yourself on your business.

12:50Yeah. I mean, it's truly incredible because you had different jobs that you were keeping while investing in this idea. And you finally find the right patent lawyers to work on the three different patents. But it's also very surprising maybe to listeners to note that you actually had to work very hard to go through the different patents that they were filing. Yeah, talk to us about that process and why it was so important for you to be involved hands-on on that. Yeah, so one thing I will say about building a business, you really have to be hands-on in every single thing you're doing. Of course, you're hiring the experts.

13:30They're the expert in the field. but in order to really bring your vision to life, you need to put that vision in their head. It needs to be hands-on. One area, like you're saying, I did not expect to be so hands-on was with these patents. And so when we had kind of submitted all our ideas, whatever, and then we were going into our non-provisional patent, which they kind of put through all these like test ringers, whatever, and you talk to someone and they're like, okay, they bring it back your patent. They say, this is really similar to maybe these patents out there. And so as I was kind of looking through, I was like, oh crap, like what if we don't get this patent?

14:11And so I started dissecting every single patent in front of me. I think there was like five of them. And if you ever seen a patent, they're super, super long. So I just got out a highlighter. I started highlighting everything that they were writing in their patents. And then I started honestly on like just a notebook writing how everything about their patent was different than ours. And a lot of that came down to the language they were using. And so I only knew how to translate that language to the patent attorney because I'd taken the time to really deep dive into shoe manufacturing and the shoe language.

14:43So that was a big thing. It was time consuming, but it was 100 % worth it because our patents ended up going through. Yeah. And I think that's surprising, right? Because we would assume that if you hired a lawyer. You can trust them. They have the expertise. You can probably sit back. But actually, in reality, in order for your patents to go through, you have to be involved and actually share the wording and make sure that it's something that could actually be approved. Yeah, 100%. Wow. So were there other surprising elements that you didn't expect while you were going through any of the other process with starting this business?

15:23I would say a lot of it was very unexpected. I really had no idea what I was getting into when I started this. Like I said before, ignorance is less. I had no idea all the different parts that would go into building a product. So every single piece of the puzzle, it was always a learning experience. And I will say some things we did where I was like, you know what, this isn't working. I think a really big thing is no one went to pivot. So it was always, you'll kind of get this feeling where you're kind of feeling a little stuck. And it's not stuck as in, this isn't going to work, like it's time to quit, but it's stuck as in, okay, I'm at a stop sign.

16:01I got to pivot. I got to take left or right. We got to find a new path. And so the entire time going through it, we were always maybe on a course A, but I was always, always having a B, C, D, E, F, just all these other avenues to pivot to really quickly if something wasn't working. And unless you've built a product along the way, you're just, I mean, you're just a sponge. You're learning so, so much. So I will say the biggest thing was probably knowing when to pivot to an engineering company and knowing that what we were building was a little too complex in the beginning to take to a factory. So that was a big thing for us.

16:35That was a very pivotal moment in our development, working with this engineering company in Atlanta. and they got the vision right away. Again, it was COVID. So they were, you know, losing contracts and we kind of popped in right at the right time where they're like, oh, this is cool. This is interesting. Like we'd love to work on this. So that was nice getting a window into working with them. And then I would say, again, learning how to cobble so that I could take the engineering brain, put what they had built into a working shoe that I could then send to the factory. And then working with the factories, that's a whole nother thing that you have to learn, in the languages, even making like tech packs, spec sheets, learning the different leathers.

17:15I spent, gosh, like I don't even know how many hours, maybe 100 hours. I'm not kidding. Researching magnets, ordering magnets, hands-on, like putting them inside prototypes I was making and looking at the pull strength, materials for hinges. I mean, I researched like hundreds of different materials from like Kevlar, like just crazy materials that I had no idea about to finally they get to the ones that we needed. But again, I knew if I wasn't hands-on helping make these decisions that the factory wouldn't know what to do with this strange folding shoe concept. This is also a really good point in knowing how much you can educate yourself and when to bridge that gap in knowledge with experts.

18:01And it also seemed like you were also being a bridge between the engineering firm as well as the factory. So I think that's also a tough call to make, right? Especially as a new founder where, you know, this is something I need to invest in. This is the time I need to reach out to an expert. So I guess like how did you determine that at certain points you needed additional help and at certain points you needed to make that investment? Yeah, you know, it's hard to say. I don't want to say it's like a gut feeling, but you kind of know when you get to a point and it's again, and you're kind of like, oh, like, I feel like we're just moving on, going, going, like we're not seeing any results.

18:43So I don't know what it was about it, but I got this like aha moment. I go, oh my gosh, engineers. They, I mean, of course I'm like, they build products, they build things. They go, oh, duh, of course. Like let's consult one of those first. Let's see how far we can get there. Working with the factory. So we had got our very first, I'd say working prototype with the engineering company. It was really expensive. It was one shoe, crazy how long it took to make, but we got that and I was like, oh, perfect. We're good. Let's send this to the factory. So we send out photos. Once we had finalized our factory, we send them photos, everything.

19:18And they were like, oh, you know, we get it, but how would you do this and this and this? So I was like, oh gosh, they, they get it. They want to be a part of it. they want to make it. But in that moment, I knew if I'm not hands-on making this alongside with them, I don't think this is going to happen. And I will say that was kind of intimidating for myself because again, I knew nothing about shoes. And I'm like, well, how am I going to tell a shoe manufacturer how to make shoes when I don't know how to make shoes, but they know how to make shoes. So that's kind of what really propelled me into YouTube University and learning everything I could about cobbling and shoes.

19:55One thing I did kind of early on just to kind of get my like foot in the door with that, I had signed up for this course. I'm pretty sure it was called like how to make shoes or like I can make shoes, something like so basic. And they sent me this really small box of tools and like the most basic, you know, entry-level tools. And there was a book on shoemaking. So I literally studied that like the Bible and I was like, okay, all the different parts of shoemaking. And then I was like, okay, you know, I think I can do this. The first thing I made was a pair of high heels just because that's what the book made.

20:28And then I go, okay, I understand a little bit about construction. So I was like, okay, let me try to make sandals.

20:35So I started making sandals. I mean, I went to like Lowe's and got like Dremel, like all these different machineries, like not shoemaking machines, but I somehow repurposed them for making shoes. And then again, I was just in lane magnets. I was doing all these things and sending those prototypes off because you get this gut feeling that if you don't step in and you don't clear up some of this confusion, it's not going to happen.

21:03And I realized, which I think is important, is that everything about building a product is collaborative. It's not just you saying, here, take this, do it. It's like, no, you need to be in it with them, working on it with them, problem solving, sourcing, suppliers, materials, everything. I think also, you know, we understand to fund the dream to keep going for four years, you were taking different jobs, but that's the financial side. But I think there's also the big emotional side of having this idea, really loving it, but you also had to motivate yourself to keep going for four years. So how was that side of things?

21:44I think for me, the hands-on side of building the business, so whether that was like making the samples, like even helping with the patents, all that stuff, kind of helped me stay motivated. So in the beginning, when we first started, it would kind of be sitting back, waiting to get an answer about this, about this, about this. And that can be very like tedious and can weigh on you heavy, just always waiting. So for me, the second I stepped in and really took on that role of helping to build the product, not just having the idea for the product, that really helped keep my focus. And I don't know how I did it, but I was just so, so determined to make this product come to life that the time would just pass on.

22:23I'm like, oh my gosh, it's been a year. Oh my gosh, it's been two years. Like you kind of like lose track of time a little bit. And then you like lift up your head and you're like, oh wow, we accomplished this. We got this. We got this. so I think a big thing is finding the little victories along the way um if you just only focus on you know the light at the end of the tunnel it can seem really long it could seem really daunting but if you take a moment to celebrate each little victory that you get like even getting our first prototype like that for me was such a huge victory like and I celebrated that and then I got back to work the next day um but I think it's just really celebrating those little moments so that you can use those as fuel to keep going.

23:02Yeah. Yeah. And four years is such a significant amount of time. Yeah. I was going to say you almost created Kindred University for yourself to go through all four years. So such a milestone. You were happy with prototypes. You had products that you were happy and willing to launch with. Talk to us about the launch event, because that's very fascinating where you also invested in an event with a list of attendees that are content creators. What was your approach there? Yes, I will say for a launch event, when we had like fully launched, we were kind of out in the world. I never did an event. I wouldn't recommend that for everyone.

23:43Something about it was like, I just want to do it, like push it into the world. And so we had been fully online for a couple months then. And we decided to do a actual launch event. So our one thong style was already out kind of in the world and selling. And then we had a new style called the Catherine. And so we were like, OK, we're going to do a launch event. We're going to invite all like our local influencers from Charleston, invite media. And so that was a really incredible event for us. It was kind of the launch of Kindred, also the launch of our new collection. It was really like serendipitous.

24:16I mean, it was really just seeing like after, like I was saying, those four years of all that grinding and working, having everyone come together to like celebrate the brand that I had built. So that was something that was really exciting for me. And I would say that kind of led into a lot of different media opportunities, which were amazing for us, as well as just getting the name out there and kind of getting kindred on the map. And any tips there for selecting the right guest to invite? And to your point, how do you have a butterfly effect from an event where it's not just the impact of those attendees, but you also get those media mentions afterwards?

24:56So with an event that kind of falls under marketing, marketing is a very collaborative effort for us. And we partnered with a local Charleston marketing agency. And so they were super huge and big in getting this launch event off the ground with us. and they were awesome about helping us select the right influencers to invite, the right media to invite. So I was super, super deep in development when it kind of switched that marketing side. I felt like a baby, like being thrown out to the wolves and I was like, marketing, like this is a whole nother beast I need to like figure out. So we quickly again, realized like I needed to grow in that field of the marketing and kind of get that education.